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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Angus Reid poll on Scotland

SystemSystem Posts: 11,005
edited August 2013 in General

politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Angus Reid poll on Scotland

Note, the changes are from Angus Reid’s last poll on this topic, which was for The Mail on Sunday, the Sunday Express articles references the last poll conducted for the Sunday Express. The Mail on Sunday Poll details can be found here

Read the full story here


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  • Options
    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    David Vanegas @Bottom_To_Top
    Total 10GW wind turbine capacity returning 770MW (7.7% of capacity). 2.4% of Sunday afternoon electricity demand pic.twitter.com/CvzKCQmH84
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,954
    '“ MORE than half a million Scots would consider moving south of the Border or emigrating abroad if the country becomes independent.” I’m very dubious about these types of question, I’d suspect those planning to move, were most unlikely to ever vote for Scotland to become an independent country.'

    SCONs, Orange Orders, SDL, Kippers, Rangers season ticket holders and Michelle Mone? There may be a lot of crossover in those categories, mind.
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    YES!

    Now enough: Sell them to the French or some-such....
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,280
    edited August 2013

    '“ MORE than half a million Scots would consider moving south of the Border or emigrating abroad if the country becomes independent.” I’m very dubious about these types of question, I’d suspect those planning to move, were most unlikely to ever vote for Scotland to become an independent country.'

    SCONs, Orange Orders, SDL, Kippers, Rangers season ticket holders and Michelle Mone? There may be a lot of crossover in those categories, mind.

    Imagine being the diversity or equal opportunities officer for that lot!

    Edit: Shouldn't that be Kipper, singular?
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    FluffyThoughtsFluffyThoughts Posts: 2,420
    edited August 2013

    '“ MORE than half a million Scots would consider moving south of the Border or emigrating abroad if the country becomes independent.” I’m very dubious about these types of question, I’d suspect those planning to move, were most unlikely to ever vote for Scotland to become an independent country.'

    SCONs, Orange Orders, SDL, Kippers, Rangers season ticket holders and Michelle Mone? There may be a lot of crossover in those categories, mind.

    Feck me!

    Grumpy,

    Wipe-out your own kith-and-kin on political grounds? I thought you were a Scot: You are nae more than a lickle, bitter Oirish fule! I hope Wee-Eck loves you....

    :edited: So as not so scare-off SNat worth the effort.... Xxxx
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Oh FFS - I can't link to a tweet link now without it appearing as a picture - what is going on? When it appears as an unclickable link, I've always posted the linky as a direct URL - now it gets deleted.

    What are PBers supposed to do? Cut and paste the unclickable link into Google then search for it? This is silly. It worked fine until today.
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    This is what Balcombe is really about - my old social club - none of the Greenies are members and drink in the Half Moon instead.

    Balcombe Club @BalcombeClub
    #balcombe.. World Record BBq 3hrs and 35 mins to go @HelpforHeroes
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    Plato said:

    Oh FFS - I can't link to a tweet link now without it appearing as a picture - what is going on? When it appears as an unclickable link, I've always posted the linky as a direct URL - now it gets deleted.

    What are PBers supposed to do? Cut and paste the unclickable link into Google then search for it? This is silly. It worked fine until today.

    As stated on the previous thread, we're looking to resolve this.

    The advice to you was to copy the text from within the tweet, as you did with the first comment on this thread.
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,954
    edited August 2013


    Edit: Shouldn't that be Kipper, singular?

    I swear every Scottish cabbie I've had to drunkenly converse with over the last few years has been a Kipper, so that should be knocking them into three figures at least. Given their previous political tendencies, I see that as a victory for progressiveness.
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    Edit: Shouldn't that be Kipper, singular?

    I swear every Scottish cabbie I've had to drunkenly converse with over the last couple of years has been a Kipper, so that should be knocking them into three figures at least. Given their previous political tendencies, I see that as a victory for progressiveness.
    I'm in Edinburgh next month for four days, I shall be using the local cabbies a lot, so I'll hopefully be able to get a decent sample size, with past vote recall and publish the findings.

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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    edited August 2013
    Unbelievable Claims on Twitter Part 94

    UK Greens @UKGreens
    The crowd are now booing the drivers for destroying the planet #GoGaia #Greenpeace #F1

    I hope this is a parody account!
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    :betting-post:

    England at 12-1 at BillyKnoll. Cannae log in....
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,444
    England were 100 with Betfair yesterday. They're back down to 15 now:

    http://www.betfair.com/exchange/cricket/market?id=1.109859001
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,444
    I was a big fan of Plato's cat photos and videos. A pity if we can't seem them from now on.
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724

    Plato said:

    Oh FFS - I can't link to a tweet link now without it appearing as a picture - what is going on? When it appears as an unclickable link, I've always posted the linky as a direct URL - now it gets deleted.

    What are PBers supposed to do? Cut and paste the unclickable link into Google then search for it? This is silly. It worked fine until today.

    As stated on the previous thread, we're looking to resolve this.

    The advice to you was to copy the text from within the tweet, as you did with the first comment on this thread.
    But that doesn't work if there's an embedded pix that its talking about and meaningless without it.
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Andy_JS said:

    I was a big fan of Plato's cat photos and videos. A pity if we can't seem them from now on.

    I was told these are banned by OGH.
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,954

    Feck me!

    Grumpy,

    Wipe-out your own kith-and-kin on political grounds? I thought you were a Scot: You are nae more than a lickle, bitter Oirish fule! I hope Wee-Eck loves you....

    :edited: So as not so scare-off SNat worth the effort.... Xxxx

    Hey, I'm happy for them to stay, their choice.
    Michelle Mone can feck off though.

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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,444
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724

    Labour Press Team @labourpress
    Labour's Shadow Foreign Secretary @DAlexanderMP commenting on the latest developments regarding the UN's (cont) tl.gd/n_1rm3h5b

    I keep seeing these 1/X tweets from Labour - haven't they twigged the whole 140 character message yet?
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,280
    edited August 2013

    Feck me!

    Grumpy,

    Wipe-out your own kith-and-kin on political grounds? I thought you were a Scot: You are nae more than a lickle, bitter Oirish fule! I hope Wee-Eck loves you....

    :edited: So as not so scare-off SNat worth the effort.... Xxxx

    Hey, I'm happy for them to stay, their choice.
    Michelle Mone can feck off though.

    Really?

    I mean, unless there's another Michelle Mone, I wouldn't be telling Michelle Mone to feck off, even if she told me she thinks Ed Miliband is the greatest politician ever.

    I know she said she'd emigrate in 2007, but come on, be forgiving.
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,444
    "Tensions boiled over at the election rally of Germany’s anti-euro party Alternative fuer Deutschland (AfD), when far-left activists attacked the leader on Saturday.

    Bernd Lucke was pushed to the ground in the northern city of Bremen and one campaign worker was attacked with a knife.

    It is the latest in a string of scuffles between the far-left and the party which is calling for the return of the deutsche mark."


    http://www.euronews.com/2013/08/25/leader-of-german-anti-euro-party-attacked-at-election-rally/
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    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,880
    Plato said:

    Unbelievable Claims on Twitter Part 94

    UK Greens @UKGreens
    The crowd are now booing the drivers for destroying the planet #GoGaia #Greenpeace #F1

    I hope this is a parody account!

    It sounds like the crowd were booing Greenpeace, who were apparently on the roof a stand making a protest.

    Still, it would be a first if Greenpeace actually told the truth for once...
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    FluffyThoughtsFluffyThoughts Posts: 2,420
    edited August 2013
    Enough about Scots' underwear: Dem dah Ossies are vermints! Bats likes without them their wings gauddammint!
    1524:

    WICKET - Haddin c Prior b Broad 0 (Aus 50-3)
    :spitzz:
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,954
    edited August 2013


    I know she said she'd emigrate in 2007, but come on, be forgiving.

    And in 2011, and in 2014 if Yes wins the referendum, and that she'd leave the UK if the tax rate went up. The ghastly publicity seeker has had more farewells than Frank Sinatra.

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    The ghastly publicity seeker has had more farewells than Frank Sinatra.

    Unlike Wee-Eck (though there may yet still be some room for growth)....
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    fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,279
    Ahh, if a well known name supports the SNP and its Independence campaign they are a welcome celebrity/business endorsement. But if they don't, they morph into a ' ghastly publicity seeker'!


    I know she said she'd emigrate in 2007, but come on, be forgiving.

    And in 2011, and in 2014 if Yes wins the referendum, and that she'd leave the UK if the tax rate went up. The ghastly publicity seeker has had more farewells than Frank Sinatra.

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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Peace and harmony in the Labour ranks

    @JimSheridanMP
    Perhaps senior Labour colleagues problem with Ed is his proposal to end the 2job culture in politics & the threat to their external earnings
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    I see Labour are still struggling with the concept of 140 characters.

    Labour Press Team @labourpress
    (2/2) "...if the Gov are finally taking this issue seriously then that is to be welcomed. @YvetteCooperMP
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    richardDoddrichardDodd Posts: 5,472
    Plato .. I think they are struggling with saying anything meaningful if that's all Yvette can muster..
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    Y0kelY0kel Posts: 2,307
    Syria, two quick takes:

    -Syrian government this afternoon said it has reached agreement to allow UN inspectors to the area subject to the alleged chemical weapons attack.

    -US officials say there is little doubt there was a chemical weapons attack carried out by Assad forces.

    These two developments may turn out to be rather inter-linked. I reported last night that the Iranians were saying Syria would say yes to a UN inspection which has been borne out. Problem was that given maybe another day to arrange the practicalities (bear in mind it is a hot zone) there may not be much soil or air evidence.

    Based on Syrian chemical weapon stocks that the West is aware of, the likelihood is that chemical choice was of a non-persistent variety, ie designed to enable ones troops to go into the zone a short time afterwards without a constant need to don a noddy suit. Combined with the possibility of a mixing operation of more and less deadly chemicals and the fact (as reported here) that the Assad forces spent the time after the attack shelling and bombing the place definitive identification might get a touch difficult.

    As a result the US, who have the intelligence ok and are making very different signals with the kind of 'little doubt' pronouncements than they did with previous alleged attacks, might find itself in a bind, or indeed have a way out of taking any action.





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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,444
    Australian captain Michael Clarke is being very clever at the moment IMO because he knows that if he sets England 225 off 45 overs and they block them out the crowd would be extremely angry with the England side and they wouldn't want to end an Ashes series like that. So in a way he's going to force them to go for the runs.
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    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    I'm not sure what the 2% "won't vote" figure is supposed to mean. Because there surely isn't going to be a 98% turnout in the referendum.
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    If you click that link to the "detailed" tables, there is no break-down by how respondents voted in 2011. According to BPC rules, the polling firm must publish those tables if such findings are published by the client.
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,954
    fitalass said:

    Ahh, if a well known name supports the SNP and its Independence campaign they are a welcome celebrity/business endorsement. But if they don't, they morph into a ' ghastly publicity seeker'!

    As long as the BetterNo campaign depends on the likes of Mone for a celebrity/business endorsement, I'm entirely content.
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    Stuart_DicksonStuart_Dickson Posts: 3,557
    edited August 2013
    - "30 per cent of Labour voters at the last Scottish Parliament election are set to back independence, along with 22 per cent of Lib Dem supporters."
    How reliable can that Lib Dem figure be if the total number of respondents was only 549? They might have interviewed as few as 10 people who voted SLD in 2011 (we cannot know without the full data tables), so the MoE could be so vast as to be pretty meaningless.

    That said, 30% of SLab voters and 22% of SLD voters feels about right, although I'd guess that it might be as high as 40% SLab and a bit lower SLD, perhaps 15%.
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    :Cricket:

    Australia CCC are morphing into Wigan-Boy JCC.* Do they lack the guts of their fore-fathers...?

    * If they try to play like a "national" team then some "lay-the-draw" folk may cheer up...!
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    NextNext Posts: 826
    antifrank said:

    I'm not sure what the 2% "won't vote" figure is supposed to mean. Because there surely isn't going to be a 98% turnout in the referendum.

    Probably 2% who KNOW they won't vote, even now.

    As opposed to the 40% (?) who just won't bother on the day.
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    Ladbrokes - Yes percentage:

    Under 38% 5/6
    Over 38% 5/6

    This poll today points to a 42% Yes vote.
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    Next said:

    antifrank said:

    I'm not sure what the 2% "won't vote" figure is supposed to mean. Because there surely isn't going to be a 98% turnout in the referendum.

    Probably 2% who KNOW they won't vote, even now.

    As opposed to the 40% (?) who just won't bother on the day.
    Well, if you take the respondents who gave a Yes or No response to this poll, turnout would be 81%. Which is the level of the Good Friday Agreement referendum.

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    AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    edited August 2013
    Andy_JS said:

    Australian captain Michael Clarke is being very clever at the moment IMO because he knows that if he sets England 225 off 45 overs and they block them out the crowd would be extremely angry with the England side and they wouldn't want to end an Ashes series like that. So in a way he's going to force them to go for the runs.

    227 runs to make in 44 overs. That's 5.2 runs per over, almost a run a ball.

    If I were Cooke I would send Pietersen and Bell out to open and close down the run chase if there is an early wicket.

    That way you please the crowd and save the match.
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    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    @Stuart_Dickson You can get 8/11 on turnover being more than 64% with Paddy Power.
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    '“ MORE than half a million Scots would consider moving south of the Border or emigrating abroad if the country becomes independent.” I’m very dubious about these types of question, I’d suspect those planning to move, were most unlikely to ever vote for Scotland to become an independent country.'

    SCONs, Orange Orders, SDL, Kippers, Rangers season ticket holders and Michelle Mone? There may be a lot of crossover in those categories, mind.

    LOL


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    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Given how many Scots have personal experience of living in England, the response to the hypothetical question about emigration may not be all that far-fetched.
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    antifrank said:

    @Stuart_Dickson You can get 8/11 on turnover being more than 64% with Paddy Power.

    I'm already on antifrank.

    I got the max stake with PP in June for 64%+, at 11/10.

    Do you wanna know what the max stake was? £15.74. Yepp, what a bunch of bad losers they are. Clearly not chuffed with their 2011 pay outs.
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    Ishmael_XIshmael_X Posts: 3,664

    fitalass said:

    Ahh, if a well known name supports the SNP and its Independence campaign they are a welcome celebrity/business endorsement. But if they don't, they morph into a ' ghastly publicity seeker'!

    As long as the BetterNo campaign depends on the likes of Mone for a celebrity/business endorsement, I'm entirely content.
    No arguing with that, the party backed by Europe's biggest lottery winners inevitably occupies the moral high ground.

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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,444
    England have already got a twentieth of the runs required after a few minutes...
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    antifrank said:

    Given how many Scots have personal experience of living in England, the response to the hypothetical question about emigration may not be all that far-fetched.

    I don't see that finding in the published tables either.

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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,444
    England were 100/1 with Betfair yesterday.

    They're now 5/1.
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    The max stake PP allowed me on the Yes vote percentage was £41.28. I got 5/6 on the Yes vote being 34.5%+. That was back in June.

    Since then they have adjusted up their +/- level to 38.5%. Still the same price, 5/6.
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    fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,279
    Daily Mail - Prince Andrew and Sarah Ferguson 'are back together' 17 years after divorce amid claims they are thinking of marriage

    Crathie Parish Church was the venue for Princess Ann's second marriage to Commander Timothy Laurence, and it turned out to be perfect for this far more low key Royal Family wedding. I must admit that I always thought that it was the long absences that Fergie endured from Andrew during his Naval career that was most responsible for their marriage breakdown. Prince Andrew and Fergie have always remained close as parents and friends, so this clear sign that Fergie is now being quietly accepted back into the Royal fold at Balmoral might also be due to the fact their daughters could be looking to get engaged/married in the near future. I doubt either of their daughters would countenance their father sitting anywhere other than in the front row at Fergie's side alongside the Royal Grandparents after walking them up the aisle to give them away.

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    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,319
    tim said:

    "48% of Brits want to get out of the UK
    Shock Sun survey shows almost half are ready to emigrate overseas"

    "FOUR million Bulgarians want to move to Britain when migration rules are relaxed next year."

    Perhaps a swap could be arranged? Bulgaria certainly has better weather and beaches...

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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,954
    Ishmael_X said:


    No arguing with that, the party backed by Europe's biggest lottery winners inevitably occupies the moral high ground.

    I don't see anything particularly immoral about being backed by money from lottery winners; as contributors they don't seem to be doing it for publicity, influence or personal advancement. It certainly occupies a lofty mountain ledge compared to having a former employer of Arkan as your biggest funder.
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    Scrapheap_as_wasScrapheap_as_was Posts: 10,059
    edited August 2013
    Spurs missing Bale shocker....

    repeat ad nauseum 2013/14
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    Apparently there was also an Alistair Darling question in this poll. That too is missing from the published tables. Only 27% said that they trusted what Darling had to say on Scotland's constitutional future. However, I'll wait till I see the full data before drawing too much from that.

    What are Angus Reid playing at, only publishing tiny bits of the data?
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,444
    edited August 2013
    48% of Brits want to emigrate, but only if they can move to a large detached house in the suburbs of Sydney within easy reach of the beach.
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    Y0kelY0kel Posts: 2,307
    Syria: Inevitability?

    The US response to the Syrian government approval for access to the site of the alleged chemical weapons is that its 'too late'. Technically this is bang on.

    In the world of diplomacy that you would assume this is a statement that

    a) a response has been decided and its going ahead and/or

    b) its designed to sweat the Syrians and their allies into some kind of concession. Though there is no reported indication of an offer on the table, the US has been in direct contact with the Syrians at a very high level and may have come up with a price for the regime to pay if it wants to avoid a strike.

    Combined with the amount of open US activity going on Option B is perfectly possible but you get the impression from the media that its Option A. Certainly the US has decided on its response and its multi faceted.
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    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    800,000 Scots already live elsewhere in the UK. For that matter, over 400,000 people in England and Wales were born in the Republic of Ireland. Many more Scots now resident in Scotland again will have spent time in the past living and working in England and Wales.

    Migrating within the British isles is something that is easy to do and for which there has been a long history. While it's possible that the poll response on this occasion is as reliable as Brits saying that they'd like to emigrate, this isn't a question where respondents generally have no knowledge of the pros and cons.

    Of course, an independent Scotland might also attract some current emigrants back (if pb is any guide, some of the most enthusiastic Scots nats are enthusing from some distance from the motherland). We do not even have unreliable polling on this, however.
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,937
    antifrank - I doubt the likes of Sir Sean Connery are going to move back permanently from St Tropez or California to Scotland however much they may enthuse about independence
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,937
    edited August 2013
    Latest Newspoll in Oz has it 53-47 to the Coalition, Morgan has it 52.5- 47.5 to the Coalition. (51.5-48.5 on respondent allocated).
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    edited August 2013
    antifrank said:



    Migrating within the British isles is something that is easy to do and for which there has been a long history. While it's possible that the poll response on this occasion is as reliable as Brits saying that they'd like to emigrate, this isn't a question where respondents generally have no knowledge of the pros and cons.

    I'd add, given the shared language, customs and cultural history as well as the geographical proximity and reasonably good transport communications, that the prospect of moving to England is less intimidating than moving to a further flung locale
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,937
    edited August 2013
    Sir Sean presently lives in the Bahamas, he has said he will only return to Scotland if it becomes independent, he might spend the odd summer in a castle he has bought by a Loch, but the idea he will move back permanently is extremely unlikely
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    'Cyber attack lasted months'
    Email accounts linked to the Yes Scotland campaign have been hacked for several months, sources close to an investigation into unauthorised access believe.

    Thousands of emails are thought to have been vulnerable during the cyber attack which continued until late on Wednesday evening, after the campaign team thought their system was again secure.

    It has also emerged that the Yes campaign, which has been working with digital forensic police, is conducting a full security sweep of its Glasgow headquarters which is expected to look for electronic listening devices.

    Informed sources say the evidence uncovered since police and BT were called in to investigate the possibility of email hacking suggests illegal activity on a large scale may have occurred.

    “It looks like this person could have been lurking in the background for several months," said a source close to the inquiry.
    http://www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto/news/uk_news/scotland/article1304931.ece
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    My wife is from Glasgow, and she still has family there, so over the years I've made many visits.

    I have never seen Scotland except when it is raining. We would drive across the border and up the A74, and inevitably within a few minutes either side of the border it would start to rain, and would not stop until our return to England.

    My impression of Scotland still frustrates her, but she consoles herself these days with the much warmer and far cheaper lifestyle of the southeastern US.
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    stodgestodge Posts: 12,822
    Andy_JS said:

    48% of Brits want to emigrate, but only if they can move to a large detached house in the suburbs of Sydney within easy reach of the beach.

    There's nothing wrong with aspiring to live somewhere "better" be it a bigger house or somewhere with more sunshine and less rain. For others, "better" simply means "anywhere else" and as much as we may be concerned about four million Bulgarians wanting to come and live in the UK, that is as much a comment on life in Bulgaria as it is about the promise of life in the UK or France or Germany.

    For the British, the lure of a better climate is a big draw but I suspect you'd find a good proportion of those who head off to foreign parts don't make it and want to come back. Uprooting away from family and friends and moving to a different place which you may think is just like the UK but isn't (Australia, Canada and New Zealand being good examples) can lead to huge social and domestic problems for families.

    Integrating into a different society and culture isn't easy - making new friends isn't always easy. The same is true for those who come here and I suspect they aren't coming for the climate. For them, the aspiration of a better life may simply mean a place where your Government isn't trying to kill you because you come from the "wrong" tribe or religion.
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,444
    stodge said:

    Andy_JS said:

    48% of Brits want to emigrate, but only if they can move to a large detached house in the suburbs of Sydney within easy reach of the beach.

    There's nothing wrong with aspiring to live somewhere "better" be it a bigger house or somewhere with more sunshine and less rain. For others, "better" simply means "anywhere else" and as much as we may be concerned about four million Bulgarians wanting to come and live in the UK, that is as much a comment on life in Bulgaria as it is about the promise of life in the UK or France or Germany.

    For the British, the lure of a better climate is a big draw but I suspect you'd find a good proportion of those who head off to foreign parts don't make it and want to come back. Uprooting away from family and friends and moving to a different place which you may think is just like the UK but isn't (Australia, Canada and New Zealand being good examples) can lead to huge social and domestic problems for families.

    Integrating into a different society and culture isn't easy - making new friends isn't always easy. The same is true for those who come here and I suspect they aren't coming for the climate. For them, the aspiration of a better life may simply mean a place where your Government isn't trying to kill you because you come from the "wrong" tribe or religion.
    I wasn't sneering at people who have that ambition, just pointing out that when people say they want to emigrate it isn't just an abstract idea which is what it sounds like in the poll.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,964
    Good evening, everyone.

    The race was red, and less exciting than I expected, but still had its moments. Plus, it was very useful for highlighting relative pace on a track festooned with high speed corners:
    http://enormo-haddock.blogspot.co.uk/2013/08/belgium-post-race-analysis.html
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    stodgestodge Posts: 12,822
    Andy_JS said:



    I wasn't sneering at people who have that ambition, just pointing out that when people say they want to emigrate it isn't just an abstract idea which is what it sounds like in the poll.

    I wasn't suggesting that you were sneering at it at all, my friend. My point is that for a lot of people and, I would argue, in all societies and cultures, the aspiration to live in and the belief that there is somewhere better "just over the hill" is a core facet of human nature. It compels us to strive to improve ourselves and our families and without that belief we would stagnate.

    The reality of migration is often very different to the fantasy. The British may assume that large parts of the world (and let's not beat about the proverbial, we mean the former English-speaking Dominions) will be easy places in which to assimilate but the truth is very different. Canada, Australia and New Zealand are no longer, if they ever were, slices of England transported across the seas.

    In any case, moving away from all you know and have ever known to a strange new place with new and confusing ways is daunting at any time even if the language is no barrier. For much of history, the vast majority of humans stayed within a tightly-defined area and never travelled very far except under duress.


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    ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 4,964
    Y0kel said:

    Syria: Inevitability?

    The US response to the Syrian government approval for access to the site of the alleged chemical weapons is that its 'too late'. Technically this is bang on.

    In the world of diplomacy that you would assume this is a statement that

    a) a response has been decided and its going ahead and/or

    b) its designed to sweat the Syrians and their allies into some kind of concession. Though there is no reported indication of an offer on the table, the US has been in direct contact with the Syrians at a very high level and may have come up with a price for the regime to pay if it wants to avoid a strike.

    Combined with the amount of open US activity going on Option B is perfectly possible but you get the impression from the media that its Option A. Certainly the US has decided on its response and its multi faceted.

    This for me recalls the lead up to action in Libya. Obama's modus operandi is to have a good long think before he commits to action, but commit he does. I suspect that cruise missile strikes to take out missile defences and air force will be on their way soon. And if so, it will finally be good night to Assad, though the future of Syria is not necessarily going to get any better.

    But I think the USA and the West are thinking of the precedent. That is they don't want any future autocrats to think that when in real danger of losing power, the solution is to launch gas attacks upon the rebels
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    ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 4,964
    While I'm in the business of making predictions, it's beginning to look like 4-0 in the Ashes after all!
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,444
    Did anyone put a tenner on England at 100/1 yesterday with Betfair?
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,444
    stodge said:

    Andy_JS said:



    I wasn't sneering at people who have that ambition, just pointing out that when people say they want to emigrate it isn't just an abstract idea which is what it sounds like in the poll.

    I wasn't suggesting that you were sneering at it at all, my friend. My point is that for a lot of people and, I would argue, in all societies and cultures, the aspiration to live in and the belief that there is somewhere better "just over the hill" is a core facet of human nature. It compels us to strive to improve ourselves and our families and without that belief we would stagnate.

    The reality of migration is often very different to the fantasy. The British may assume that large parts of the world (and let's not beat about the proverbial, we mean the former English-speaking Dominions) will be easy places in which to assimilate but the truth is very different. Canada, Australia and New Zealand are no longer, if they ever were, slices of England transported across the seas.

    In any case, moving away from all you know and have ever known to a strange new place with new and confusing ways is daunting at any time even if the language is no barrier. For much of history, the vast majority of humans stayed within a tightly-defined area and never travelled very far except under duress.


    Actually it was me who thought the comment seemed a bit sneering after I posted it which I didn't intend.
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    The British emigrate. It's in our DNA. Always has been. From country to town. From home to abroad.

    How many overs left at the Oval?
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    stodgestodge Posts: 12,822
    Win lose or draw, a very sporting declaration by the Australians in an attempt to create a finish.

    I can only imagine the reaction from some on here had Cook done the same and the roles been reversed.

    With the Series and the Ashes not at stake, Clarke could afford to be generous. In another situation, I doubt any captain would have been so well-disposed.
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    Ishmael_XIshmael_X Posts: 3,664

    The British emigrate. It's in our DNA. Always has been. From country to town. From home to abroad.

    How many overs left at the Oval?

    13 and a bit
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    Is everyone listening to the cricket? There have been no postings at all for almost an hour.
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    stodge said:

    Win lose or draw, a very sporting declaration by the Australians in an attempt to create a finish.

    I can only imagine the reaction from some on here had Cook done the same and the roles been reversed.

    With the Series and the Ashes not at stake, Clarke could afford to be generous. In another situation, I doubt any captain would have been so well-disposed.

    The Aussies lost any good will they might have had by trying to force the issue on light.

    A terrible end to a test match.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,964
    Mr. Tyndall, I'm not, but have been absent most of the day (due to F1 and eyes going a bit fuzzy).
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    Cheating fugging Aussies.

    Of course when England bowled 11 overs an hour on Thursday that was fine, we did reap what we sowed.
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,444
    Absolute disgrace. The jobsworth ICC based in Dubai ought to hang its head in shame.
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,444
    edited August 2013
    Feeling absolutely sick. Put £5 on England yesterday with Betfair at 100/1.

    Did it because I suspected Michael Clarke might set England an enticing target.
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    SchardsSchards Posts: 210
    That is so typical of cricket's ability to shoot itself in the foot. Very hard to convince anyone who doesn't follow cricket obsessively that that was the right thing to do.

    Not a total waste of time from England's point of view, they finish the series with some momentum which had been lost earlier in this test
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    SchardsSchards Posts: 210
    There's going to be some booing at this presentation ceromony
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    OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 9,143
    Andy_JS said:

    Absolute disgrace. The jobsworth ICC based in Dubai ought to hang its head in shame.

    The ICC only changed the rule because so many people complained about batsmen going off for light pretty much all the time.

    If England had been 8 or 9 wickets down, what would be fair then?
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,964
    I'm not a cricketing sort of fellow, but why is the ICC based in Dubai?
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,444
    From now on Test cricket in England MUST start at 10:30 am.
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,280
    edited August 2013

    I'm not a cricketing sort of fellow, but why is the ICC based in Dubai?

    For tax reasons they moved to Dubai, they used to be based in London
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    Andy_JS said:

    From now on Test cricket in England MUST start at 10:30 am.

    We tried that a decade ago, early morning dew made it a bowler's dream.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,964
    Mr. Eagles, cheers for the answer. I suppose there's no room left in Monaco, what with all the F1 drivers :p
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    OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 9,143

    I'm not a cricketing sort of fellow, but why is the ICC based in Dubai?

    For tax reasons, they used to be based in London
    I think you change the meaning of that sentence if you use a ; in place of the ,
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    Mr. Eagles, cheers for the answer. I suppose there's no room left in Monaco, what with all the F1 drivers :p

    Plus they speak French there, so a double reason not to based in Monaco
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    Simon Wilde ‏@swildecricket 1m

    England have now gone 13 Test matches without defeat, equalling their best run since 1971
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    We're also back to being number 2 in the World Rankings
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,444
    edited August 2013

    Andy_JS said:

    From now on Test cricket in England MUST start at 10:30 am.

    We tried that a decade ago, early morning dew made it a bowler's dream.
    Maybe from the middle of July onwards then. I can understand the problem with dew early in the season but of course the light situation is better at that time of year.
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    OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 9,143
    Andy_JS said:

    From now on Test cricket in England MUST start at 10:30 am.

    The other thing you could do would be to have a reserve day, and play it as a 450 over game over up to six days.
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    SMukeshSMukesh Posts: 1,650
    @AndyJS

    Sorry mate...If it`s any consolation,there`s a chap on TMS who put £10 at 175:1 this morning who`s now probably crying into his handkerchief.
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,444
    edited August 2013

    I'm not a cricketing sort of fellow, but why is the ICC based in Dubai?

    To placate the subcontinental teams who thought it was too Anglo-central before.

    It was also because of them that neutral umpires were brought in, completely unnecessarily in my view.
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    Andy_JS said:

    Absolute disgrace. The jobsworth ICC based in Dubai ought to hang its head in shame.

    The ICC only changed the rule because so many people complained about batsmen going off for light pretty much all the time.

    If England had been 8 or 9 wickets down, what would be fair then?
    It makes no difference it would still have not been right. The old rule was perfectly good with the umpires offering the light when it had reached a certain level and then the batsmen (the ones having to face 90 MPH+ deliveries) deciding if they wanted to continue. Of course it was gamed on occasion as so much of cricket is gamed but that is all part and parcel of cricket. This situation was a complete farce.

    I can only assume from your comment that you are not a cricket fan and do not know that we applaud a century and cheer the rafters down on a double century no matter whether the batsman is English or Australian.
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    Andy_JS said:

    Andy_JS said:

    From now on Test cricket in England MUST start at 10:30 am.

    We tried that a decade ago, early morning dew made it a bowler's dream.
    Maybe from the middle of July onwards then. I can understand the problem with dew early in the season but of course the light situation is better at that time of year.
    Remember some tests in England are played in September, the dew there is a problem at 10.30

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    Cheating fugging Aussies.

    Of course when England bowled 11 overs an hour on Thursday that was fine, we did reap what we sowed.

    Nope that was atrocious as well. True cricket fans dislike that sort of gamesmanship no matter who does it.
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    Actually the ICC did have offices in Monaco before they moved to Dubai
This discussion has been closed.