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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Matthew Shadsy of Ladbrokes on the WH2020 betting phenomenon o

SystemSystem Posts: 11,019
edited March 2019 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Matthew Shadsy of Ladbrokes on the WH2020 betting phenomenon of Andrew Yang

The 2020 US Presidential Market is gathering steam right now with most of the top-tier Democratic possibles having announced their candidature. Just waiting on Joe Biden who has recently become favourite for the nomination at Ladbrokes. No doubt his price will drop a little further if and when he announces, but the bigger impact on the overall market would be if he says no.

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    Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 4,600
    Goodness, could this be.....?
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    Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 4,600

    Goodness, could this be.....?

    First!
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    Thanks Shadsy.


    Thanks to Mr Meeks for mentioning Yang the other day.
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    With apologies FPT:

    it doesnt seem to have struck JS and ASDA that screaming about price increases post Brexit while simultaneously claiming there will be price decreases in the post Brexit world may be somewhat inconsistent.

    Likewise if both supermarkets claim they will be stretched to maintain their supply chains next month why on earth would we want to add the turmoil of a supply chain reorganisation in to the mix.

    But then Greg Clark is easily duped.

    There will be substantial food price rises whether we Brexit or not. Several reasons: the entire industry has largely tied itself in knots trying to second guess events. Vast amounts of cash is tied up in stored stock, ingredients and packaging all stockpiled as a hedge against disruption. All that costs money. The massive change to ordering patterns has genuinely loaded costs onto producers who have had to work flat out to fulfill enhanced orders.

    Even if Brexit is significantly delayed next week costs have been incurred (albeit not as big an increase as we'd see if we crash out). We've also seen cost loading and cash flow strains on businesses not resilient enough to cope (and yes, I count the likes of Asda and JS in this as they are not remotely profitable enough for their stock exchange overlords).

    So price rises are inevitable. Brexit has cost the industry a lot and we haven't left yet. And for the few lucky sods not directly hit by costs? They'll go for price anyway as its a free hit if everyone else is doing so.
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,209
    Go Pete Bettigieg! Good to see Shadys following my tip of two weeks ago!!! :smiley:
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,209
    I'm on Mayor Pete at 270.
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited March 2019
    Yang's problem is although he identifies a genuine issue coming down the tracks, his solutions are totally unrealistic. UBI is the most "sensible" of them and that would cost trillions and require a giant shake-up. Once you get past that, he policies start to get real nutty, real quickly.

    He has been touring all the "intellectual dark web" podcasts, JRE, Sam Harris, Freakonomics, and he always starts off well, sounds plausible, but after 30mins it all goes downhill.

    I imagine if he ever gains any real traction, the inner machine of the DNC will rip him apart in favour of their chosen candidates.
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    US politician Devin Nunes sues Twitter over insults

    https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-47624326
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    TrèsDifficileTrèsDifficile Posts: 1,729

    Thanks Shadsy.


    Thanks to Mr Meeks for mentioning Yang the other day.

    Have you seen the Paddy Power Cantona BrexitBunker ad?

    And what do you think of your anti-Brexit, Irish and French allies saying that the bunker will keep you "as happy as David Cameron with a pig"?

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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,298

    With apologies FPT:

    it doesnt seem to have struck JS and ASDA that screaming about price increases post Brexit while simultaneously claiming there will be price decreases in the post Brexit world may be somewhat inconsistent.

    Likewise if both supermarkets claim they will be stretched to maintain their supply chains next month why on earth would we want to add the turmoil of a supply chain reorganisation in to the mix.

    But then Greg Clark is easily duped.

    There will be substantial food price rises whether we Brexit or not. Several reasons: the entire industry has largely tied itself in knots trying to second guess events. Vast amounts of cash is tied up in stored stock, ingredients and packaging all stockpiled as a hedge against disruption. All that costs money. The massive change to ordering patterns has genuinely loaded costs onto producers who have had to work flat out to fulfill enhanced orders.

    Even if Brexit is significantly delayed next week costs have been incurred (albeit not as big an increase as we'd see if we crash out). We've also seen cost loading and cash flow strains on businesses not resilient enough to cope (and yes, I count the likes of Asda and JS in this as they are not remotely profitable enough for their stock exchange overlords).

    So price rises are inevitable. Brexit has cost the industry a lot and we haven't left yet. And for the few lucky sods not directly hit by costs? They'll go for price anyway as its a free hit if everyone else is doing so.
    As of a couple of weeks ago a grain merchant friend of mine said that no vessels of wheat had been traded for post March 29th delivery. Push the supposed exit date back and I can't see how things will work out to say nothing of carry costs.
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,415
    edited March 2019

    Thanks Shadsy.


    Thanks to Mr Meeks for mentioning Yang the other day.

    Have you seen the Paddy Power Cantona BrexitBunker ad?

    And what do you think of your anti-Brexit, Irish and French allies saying that the bunker will keep you "as happy as David Cameron with a pig"?

    I am shocked the famously publicity shy Paddy Power would do such a thing.

    They didn’t use to be like this before they merged with Betfair.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,926

    Yang's problem is although he identifies a genuine issue coming down the tracks, his solutions are totally unrealistic. UBI is the most "sensible" of them and that would cost trillions and require a giant shake-up. Once you get past that, he policies start to get real nutty, real quickly.

    He has been touring all the "intellectual dark web" podcasts, JRE, Sam Harris, Freakonomics, and he always starts off well, sounds plausible, but after 30mins it all goes downhill.

    I imagine if he ever gains any real traction, the inner machine of the DNC will rip him apart in favour of their chosen candidates.

    Yeah but YANGGANG2020 Yes I'm laying him too, but should be a fun ride..
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    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,815
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285

    Thanks Shadsy.


    Thanks to Mr Meeks for mentioning Yang the other day.

    Have you seen the Paddy Power Cantona BrexitBunker ad?

    And what do you think of your anti-Brexit, Irish and French allies saying that the bunker will keep you "as happy as David Cameron with a pig"?

    Made me chuckle,

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2OsF-tmGpQ
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    TrèsDifficileTrèsDifficile Posts: 1,729

    Thanks Shadsy.


    Thanks to Mr Meeks for mentioning Yang the other day.

    Have you seen the Paddy Power Cantona BrexitBunker ad?

    And what do you think of your anti-Brexit, Irish and French allies saying that the bunker will keep you "as happy as David Cameron with a pig"?

    Made me chuckle,

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2OsF-tmGpQ
    I do like his Maybot dance!
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,209
    https://twitter.com/David_K_Clark/status/1108017116865691649

    Really late to this. Some of us started in the autumn.
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited March 2019
    You have to give it to them, Paddy Power advertising department is top-notch.

    Remember when they got Farage to do a pro Europe one for the Ryder cup. Ryan Giggs brother doing one last month was also very funny.

    I did notice that Piers Morgan's Ryder cup one didn't get many view though, no idea why.
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,584

    Thanks Shadsy.


    Thanks to Mr Meeks for mentioning Yang the other day.

    For those of us already short Gabbard, it presented something of a free hit (in Betfair cashflow terms).
    Her candidacy continues to mystify.
    https://www.politico.com/story/2019/03/19/tulsi-gabbard-2020-campaign-1225758
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    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,203

    Go Pete Bettigieg! Good to see Shadys following my tip of two weeks ago!!! :smiley:

    I tipped him way before you!! It was my son who put me onto him.
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    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Great final line.

    I'm not a Yang man (does that make me a Yin?). He looks like this year's profitable lay to me.
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,115
    Brexit has certainly highlighted many things in this country that have needed fixing for a long time.
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,115
    Cyclefree said:

    Go Pete Bettigieg! Good to see Shadys following my tip of two weeks ago!!! :smiley:

    I tipped him way before you!! It was my son who put me onto him.
    I remember.....
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    Apparently, the nutters who have broken in the AG office aren't there because of Brexit,

    the protesters are conspiracy theorist group ‘Fighting For Justice’, sometimes known as ‘Justice For Our Boys’ who are often heard shouting outside Parliament. They have broken into the Attorney General’s office to demand an apology.

    https://order-order.com/2019/03/19/conspiracy-theorists-break-attorney-generals-office/
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited March 2019
    I can't see any boxed wine there....must be all just out of shot.
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,754

    I can't see any boxed wine there....must be all just out of shot.
    he keeps it next to the canned pineapple for pizza night
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,983
    Good afternoon, everyone.

    FPT: Mr. F, congrats. What's the start of the period you'll be covering?
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    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340

    I can't see any boxed wine there....must be all just out of shot.
    he keeps it next to the canned pineapple for pizza night
    My local pub does a great Hawaiian pizza. It calls it "the Debatable".
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    ralphmalphralphmalph Posts: 2,201
    Scott_P said:
    Peter bone on SKY saying this 9 months is not an extension of article 50, but a 9 month period where the EU's no deal contingency "mini deals" come into place. i.e the planes flying, financial services, etc.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,926
    In seriousness, the main effect of Yang is that it makes Trump look absolubtely old hat. MAGA is SO 2016 now, it's all about Yang Gang 2020 in the crucial meme primary. It won't make much difference (And Yang doesn't win because of this), but Trump needs every advantage he can get. It destroys buzz and sucks oxygen from him.

    In short Yang is terrible news for Trump.
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,584

    Scott_P said:
    Peter bone on SKY saying this 9 months is not an extension of article 50, but a 9 month period where the EU's no deal contingency "mini deals" come into place. i.e the planes flying, financial services, etc.
    I can see the debate over an extension is going to go well...
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    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Pulpstar said:

    In seriousness, the main effect of Yang is that it makes Trump look absolubtely old hat. MAGA is SO 2016 now, it's all about Yang Gang 2020 in the crucial meme primary. It won't make much difference (And Yang doesn't win because of this), but Trump needs every advantage he can get. It destroys buzz and sucks oxygen from him.

    In short Yang is terrible news for Trump.

    I'd agree. It makes him look like last year's man.
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    TOPPING said:

    As of a couple of weeks ago a grain merchant friend of mine said that no vessels of wheat had been traded for post March 29th delivery. Push the supposed exit date back and I can't see how things will work out to say nothing of carry costs.

    We're in the market for various bulk cereals. With the exception of one provider who is clearly prepped and sees a big opportunity for distress business, the rest can't guarantee delivery dates or prices. On anything, as delivery dates are now into April.

    As an industry we've been warning for a good while (and I've reported so on here) as to the chaos and risk of catastrophe. I've sat in reception of two of our biggest supermarket chains over the last few weeks and heard sales people discussing various vary large food conglomerates struggling for supply of some specific ingredient or other. Remember that you only need to run out of one thing in a recipe or part of its packaging to not be able to supply that product. And what does short supply plus a spike in demand do to prices...?

    If this government had set out to methodically cripple the food supply as a policy, it couldn't have been any more effective than reality has been.

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    EndillionEndillion Posts: 4,976

    Pulpstar said:

    In seriousness, the main effect of Yang is that it makes Trump look absolubtely old hat. MAGA is SO 2016 now, it's all about Yang Gang 2020 in the crucial meme primary. It won't make much difference (And Yang doesn't win because of this), but Trump needs every advantage he can get. It destroys buzz and sucks oxygen from him.

    In short Yang is terrible news for Trump.

    I'd agree. It makes him look like last year's man.
    Not sure about that. Trump still has a year plus to watch and come up with something new, while all his potential opponents slug it out amongst themselves. He can test his strategies by sniping at whichever challengers he fancies/thinks look dangerous, and whoever wins the Democrat primary might already have used up their best ideas preaching to the choir (the increasing left-wing Democrat caucus) and have to come up with a completely new set of tactics for the swing voters they face in November.

    Assuming, of course, Trump doesn't face a serious challenger in his own Primary season.
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    I see Gove's effectively been what I've been saying, No Deal does NOT honour the referendum result.

    A minister told me: "Andrea was sitting there with a face like thunder. She went bonkers.

    "She said she’d been on the phone to 40 ERGers [Tory Brexiter MPs] over the weekend and they are not moving. Her objection to the Cabinet was NOT about being ‘Remainers’ but about this being a Cabinet that won’t deliver on no-deal.

    "Which Gove said at last cabinet was not what he campaigned for as former chairman of Vote Leave,” and leaves Leadsom stranded (my source says Leadsom is “very much in a minority”).

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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,983
    Mr. Pioneers, if she seeks a long delay then the year from the failed no confidence challenge will have elapsed and a fresh one can be mounted.
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,584

    Pulpstar said:

    In seriousness, the main effect of Yang is that it makes Trump look absolubtely old hat. MAGA is SO 2016 now, it's all about Yang Gang 2020 in the crucial meme primary. It won't make much difference (And Yang doesn't win because of this), but Trump needs every advantage he can get. It destroys buzz and sucks oxygen from him.

    In short Yang is terrible news for Trump.

    I'd agree. It makes him look like last year's man.
    Worse still, it makes him appear borderline sane...
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    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,605
    What mechanism do they propose? she is safe until Dec, surely?
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    CiceroCicero Posts: 2,216
    Two weeks out from Brexit and the Conservative chaos continues unabated. This catastrophic policy has undermined trust in every basic institution of our country. Parliament is derided, the civil service condemned, the Union more brittle than ever, the economy holding its breath.

    The irresponsible press has a field day whipping up hatred against judges, business people, entrepreneurs and any other person who questions the insanely damaging course we are currently following.

    I simply do not understand why the Conservatives, far from facing absolute annihilation, are actually ahead in most polls.

    When I speak to Conservatives I simply get a sense of utter despair: "We cannot go on like this". They are right, we can't. May is an inflexible dud as PM, BoJo a shallow sham, Rees Mogg a sinister crook. etc etc.

    I guess all those "citizens of Nowhere" seem to have become citizens of Ireland.
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,584
    Endillion said:

    Pulpstar said:

    In seriousness, the main effect of Yang is that it makes Trump look absolubtely old hat. MAGA is SO 2016 now, it's all about Yang Gang 2020 in the crucial meme primary. It won't make much difference (And Yang doesn't win because of this), but Trump needs every advantage he can get. It destroys buzz and sucks oxygen from him.

    In short Yang is terrible news for Trump.

    I'd agree. It makes him look like last year's man.
    Not sure about that. Trump still has a year plus to watch and come up with something new, while all his potential opponents slug it out amongst themselves. He can test his strategies by sniping at whichever challengers he fancies/thinks look dangerous, and whoever wins the Democrat primary might already have used up their best ideas preaching to the choir (the increasing left-wing Democrat caucus) and have to come up with a completely new set of tactics for the swing voters they face in November.

    Assuming, of course, Trump doesn't face a serious challenger in his own Primary season.
    Or impeachment.

    In any event, he seems to be spending most of his time being goaded by George Conway, rather than honing his 'strategies'.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,983
    Dr. Foxy, they could all resign the Conservative whip. Which isn't so much a nuclear option as a Death Star option.
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    TrèsDifficileTrèsDifficile Posts: 1,729
    Just had a sponsored advert from Right To Vote appear on Facebook, telling me that 60% of people in my constituency want a second referendum so I ought to support one.

    I looked at their page and the average figures for each constituency barely count as a subsample - their poll asked the question of 14,046 adults across 632 constituencies. That's 22.22 people per constituency.
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited March 2019
    EU government websites infested with third-party adtech scripts

    Ironic as it may be, EU websites might not be compliant with the EU's own data protection rules.

    https://www.zdnet.com/article/eu-government-websites-are-infested-with-third-party-trackers/
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    Peter bone on SKY saying this 9 months is not an extension of article 50, but a 9 month period where the EU's no deal contingency "mini deals" come into place. i.e the planes flying, financial services, etc.

    Yebbut, he's an idiot...
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    I see Gove's effectively been what I've been saying, No Deal does NOT honour the referendum result.

    A minister told me: "Andrea was sitting there with a face like thunder. She went bonkers.

    "She said she’d been on the phone to 40 ERGers [Tory Brexiter MPs] over the weekend and they are not moving. Her objection to the Cabinet was NOT about being ‘Remainers’ but about this being a Cabinet that won’t deliver on no-deal.

    "Which Gove said at last cabinet was not what he campaigned for as former chairman of Vote Leave,” and leaves Leadsom stranded (my source says Leadsom is “very much in a minority”).

    What a blessed relief that even May beat Leadsom in the leadership contest.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,926
    edited March 2019
    Foxy said:

    What mechanism do they propose? she is safe until Dec, surely?
    If there's a majority to oust her then there is a majority to change the 1922 rules.
    There may not be enough to change the 1922 rules though.
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    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,605

    I see Gove's effectively been what I've been saying, No Deal does NOT honour the referendum result.

    A minister told me: "Andrea was sitting there with a face like thunder. She went bonkers.

    "She said she’d been on the phone to 40 ERGers [Tory Brexiter MPs] over the weekend and they are not moving. Her objection to the Cabinet was NOT about being ‘Remainers’ but about this being a Cabinet that won’t deliver on no-deal.

    "Which Gove said at last cabinet was not what he campaigned for as former chairman of Vote Leave,” and leaves Leadsom stranded (my source says Leadsom is “very much in a minority”).

    What a blessed relief that even May beat Leadsom in the leadership contest.
    She is good value for next Leader IMO.
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    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,203
    Call that stockpiling. Pah! That's a normal supply in our house.
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    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,985

    US politician Devin Nunes sues Twitter over insults

    https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-47624326

    He's mostly angry about a Twitter account called "Devin Nunes' Mom" which mercilessly takes the piss out of him.

    I think he needs a safe space.
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    Foxy said:

    I see Gove's effectively been what I've been saying, No Deal does NOT honour the referendum result.

    A minister told me: "Andrea was sitting there with a face like thunder. She went bonkers.

    "She said she’d been on the phone to 40 ERGers [Tory Brexiter MPs] over the weekend and they are not moving. Her objection to the Cabinet was NOT about being ‘Remainers’ but about this being a Cabinet that won’t deliver on no-deal.

    "Which Gove said at last cabinet was not what he campaigned for as former chairman of Vote Leave,” and leaves Leadsom stranded (my source says Leadsom is “very much in a minority”).

    What a blessed relief that even May beat Leadsom in the leadership contest.
    She is good value for next Leader IMO.
    Which would mean the end of the Tory party.
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    Scott_P said:

    Peter bone on SKY saying this 9 months is not an extension of article 50, but a 9 month period where the EU's no deal contingency "mini deals" come into place. i.e the planes flying, financial services, etc.

    Yebbut, he's an idiot...
    My wife and I listened to him and groaned in despair at his lack of political understanding of the forces against his and ERG view of a wasteland brexit
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    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,985
    edited March 2019
    TOPPING said:

    With apologies FPT:

    it doesnt seem to have struck JS and ASDA that screaming about price increases post Brexit while simultaneously claiming there will be price decreases in the post Brexit world may be somewhat inconsistent.

    Likewise if both supermarkets claim they will be stretched to maintain their supply chains next month why on earth would we want to add the turmoil of a supply chain reorganisation in to the mix.

    But then Greg Clark is easily duped.

    There will be substantial food price rises whether we Brexit or not. Several reasons: the entire industry has largely tied itself in knots trying to second guess events. Vast amounts of cash is tied up in stored stock, ingredients and packaging all stockpiled as a hedge against disruption. All that costs money. The massive change to ordering patterns has genuinely loaded costs onto producers who have had to work flat out to fulfill enhanced orders.

    Even if Brexit is significantly delayed next week costs have been incurred (albeit not as big an increase as we'd see if we crash out). We've also seen cost loading and cash flow strains on businesses not resilient enough to cope (and yes, I count the likes of Asda and JS in this as they are not remotely profitable enough for their stock exchange overlords).

    So price rises are inevitable. Brexit has cost the industry a lot and we haven't left yet. And for the few lucky sods not directly hit by costs? They'll go for price anyway as its a free hit if everyone else is doing so.
    As of a couple of weeks ago a grain merchant friend of mine said that no vessels of wheat had been traded for post March 29th delivery. Push the supposed exit date back and I can't see how things will work out to say nothing of carry costs.
    With all due respect, that's bullsh1t. The dry bulk (to the UK) market has gone a bit - err - illiquid, and costs have risen, but the idea that there are no ships coming after the 29th is ridiculous.
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    Pulpstar said:

    Foxy said:

    What mechanism do they propose? she is safe until Dec, surely?
    If there's a majority to oust her then there is a majority to change the 1922 rules.
    There may not be enough to change the 1922 rules though.
    Indeed. But as the crash Brexit / delayed Brexit* shockwave blasts away whats left of Tory unity I can see at least some people continuing to support leaving her in office for fear of the alternative.

    Do do have to wonder about Shame. At which point does her self awareness, self pride and supposed concern for party and country kick in and make her decide to stop? At one end of the spectrum we have Estelle Morris, who harshly self assessed her own performance as Education Secretary and not only quit the post but quit politics. At the other end we have May. Brazen doesn't cover it.

    *delete as appropriate
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    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Foxy said:

    What mechanism do they propose? she is safe until Dec, surely?
    Presumably a Parliamentary vote of no confidence.
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    Pulpstar said:

    Foxy said:

    What mechanism do they propose? she is safe until Dec, surely?
    If there's a majority to oust her then there is a majority to change the 1922 rules.
    There may not be enough to change the 1922 rules though.
    There is nowhere near a majority wanting to replace TM
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    Foxy said:

    I see Gove's effectively been what I've been saying, No Deal does NOT honour the referendum result.

    A minister told me: "Andrea was sitting there with a face like thunder. She went bonkers.

    "She said she’d been on the phone to 40 ERGers [Tory Brexiter MPs] over the weekend and they are not moving. Her objection to the Cabinet was NOT about being ‘Remainers’ but about this being a Cabinet that won’t deliver on no-deal.

    "Which Gove said at last cabinet was not what he campaigned for as former chairman of Vote Leave,” and leaves Leadsom stranded (my source says Leadsom is “very much in a minority”).

    What a blessed relief that even May beat Leadsom in the leadership contest.
    She is good value for next Leader IMO.
    I have been quite impressed with her recently
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    Foxy said:

    What mechanism do they propose? she is safe until Dec, surely?
    Haven't we been through this before (I think David Herdson did a piece on it?). In theory, yes but the 1922 Committee can change the rules which they would do if it looked like she needed to go.
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    Harris_TweedHarris_Tweed Posts: 1,300
    Barnier restating "no faffing delay" policy.. setting out what TM's letter needs to include.
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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,836
    Cicero said:

    Two weeks out from Brexit and the Conservative chaos continues unabated. This catastrophic policy has undermined trust in every basic institution of our country. Parliament is derided, the civil service condemned, the Union more brittle than ever, the economy holding its breath.

    The irresponsible press has a field day whipping up hatred against judges, business people, entrepreneurs and any other person who questions the insanely damaging course we are currently following.

    I simply do not understand why the Conservatives, far from facing absolute annihilation, are actually ahead in most polls.

    When I speak to Conservatives I simply get a sense of utter despair: "We cannot go on like this". They are right, we can't. May is an inflexible dud as PM, BoJo a shallow sham, Rees Mogg a sinister crook. etc etc.

    I guess all those "citizens of Nowhere" seem to have become citizens of Ireland.

    The reason why Conservative support is where it is is that 45% + favour Brexit, lots of people don't like Corbyn, and there is full employment.
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    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,203

    Pulpstar said:

    Foxy said:

    What mechanism do they propose? she is safe until Dec, surely?
    If there's a majority to oust her then there is a majority to change the 1922 rules.
    There may not be enough to change the 1922 rules though.
    Indeed. But as the crash Brexit / delayed Brexit* shockwave blasts away whats left of Tory unity I can see at least some people continuing to support leaving her in office for fear of the alternative.

    Do do have to wonder about Shame. At which point does her self awareness, self pride and supposed concern for party and country kick in and make her decide to stop? At one end of the spectrum we have Estelle Morris, who harshly self assessed her own performance as Education Secretary and not only quit the post but quit politics. At the other end we have May. Brazen doesn't cover it.

    *delete as appropriate
    The current definition of Shame (as set out here - http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2017/11/06/the-pb-cynics-dictionary-especially-complied-for-the-times/):-

    "Shame: No known contemporary definition. Last heard of in the 1960’s."

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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,836
    So, that would last about a fortnight?
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    148grss148grss Posts: 3,679
    Sean_F said:

    Cicero said:

    Two weeks out from Brexit and the Conservative chaos continues unabated. This catastrophic policy has undermined trust in every basic institution of our country. Parliament is derided, the civil service condemned, the Union more brittle than ever, the economy holding its breath.

    The irresponsible press has a field day whipping up hatred against judges, business people, entrepreneurs and any other person who questions the insanely damaging course we are currently following.

    I simply do not understand why the Conservatives, far from facing absolute annihilation, are actually ahead in most polls.

    When I speak to Conservatives I simply get a sense of utter despair: "We cannot go on like this". They are right, we can't. May is an inflexible dud as PM, BoJo a shallow sham, Rees Mogg a sinister crook. etc etc.

    I guess all those "citizens of Nowhere" seem to have become citizens of Ireland.

    The reason why Conservative support is where it is is that 45% + favour Brexit, lots of people don't like Corbyn, and there is full employment.
    I found this article at the time interesting, I wonder if it is still the case.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/unemployment-in-the-uk-is-now-so-low-its-in-danger-of-exposing-the-lie-used-to-create-the-numbers-2017-7?r=US&IR=T
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    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,203

    Foxy said:

    I see Gove's effectively been what I've been saying, No Deal does NOT honour the referendum result.

    A minister told me: "Andrea was sitting there with a face like thunder. She went bonkers.

    "She said she’d been on the phone to 40 ERGers [Tory Brexiter MPs] over the weekend and they are not moving. Her objection to the Cabinet was NOT about being ‘Remainers’ but about this being a Cabinet that won’t deliver on no-deal.

    "Which Gove said at last cabinet was not what he campaigned for as former chairman of Vote Leave,” and leaves Leadsom stranded (my source says Leadsom is “very much in a minority”).

    What a blessed relief that even May beat Leadsom in the leadership contest.
    She is good value for next Leader IMO.
    Which would mean the end of the Tory party.
    Frankly, given how it is currently behaving, hard to see why that is not a good thing.
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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,836
    148grss said:

    Sean_F said:

    Cicero said:

    Two weeks out from Brexit and the Conservative chaos continues unabated. This catastrophic policy has undermined trust in every basic institution of our country. Parliament is derided, the civil service condemned, the Union more brittle than ever, the economy holding its breath.

    The irresponsible press has a field day whipping up hatred against judges, business people, entrepreneurs and any other person who questions the insanely damaging course we are currently following.

    I simply do not understand why the Conservatives, far from facing absolute annihilation, are actually ahead in most polls.

    When I speak to Conservatives I simply get a sense of utter despair: "We cannot go on like this". They are right, we can't. May is an inflexible dud as PM, BoJo a shallow sham, Rees Mogg a sinister crook. etc etc.

    I guess all those "citizens of Nowhere" seem to have become citizens of Ireland.

    The reason why Conservative support is where it is is that 45% + favour Brexit, lots of people don't like Corbyn, and there is full employment.
    I found this article at the time interesting, I wonder if it is still the case.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/unemployment-in-the-uk-is-now-so-low-its-in-danger-of-exposing-the-lie-used-to-create-the-numbers-2017-7?r=US&IR=T
    The Claimant Count is pretty meaningless as a definition of unemployment, but the ILO figures (which is the ONS headline figure) is generally considered accurate. Saying that anyone who is not currently employed is therefore unemployed is very misleading.

    And, as it happens, real wages have started going up again.
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    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,289
    edited March 2019
    I hope the EU grants an extension to the 30th June and that is it. No further discussion or negotiation

    That should focus minds
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,983
    Miss Cyclefree, because it might enable Corbyn as PM.

    Incompetence isn't good. Incompetence plus a spike in anti-Semitism, plus the scourge of socialism is worse by far.
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    _Anazina__Anazina_ Posts: 1,810

    I see Gove's effectively been what I've been saying, No Deal does NOT honour the referendum result.

    A minister told me: "Andrea was sitting there with a face like thunder. She went bonkers.

    "She said she’d been on the phone to 40 ERGers [Tory Brexiter MPs] over the weekend and they are not moving. Her objection to the Cabinet was NOT about being ‘Remainers’ but about this being a Cabinet that won’t deliver on no-deal.

    "Which Gove said at last cabinet was not what he campaigned for as former chairman of Vote Leave,” and leaves Leadsom stranded (my source says Leadsom is “very much in a minority”).

    Andrea Leadsom to believe she spoke for the country.

    But, she speaks only for the ERG.
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    _Anazina__Anazina_ Posts: 1,810

    I hope the EU grants an extension to the 30th June and that is it. No further discussion or negotiation

    That should focus minds


    A delay of, let's say, 50 or so years would be preferable for anyone who is trying to make a hill of beans in this crazy world.
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    Scott_P said:
    schrodingers WA....
  • Options
    Barnier

    The deal is the only possible basis for orderly UK exit

    There must be a purpose for the extension hinting at GE or referendum
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,754
    rcs1000 said:

    TOPPING said:

    With apologies FPT:

    it doesnt seem to have struck JS and ASDA that screaming about price increases post Brexit while simultaneously claiming there will be price decreases in the post Brexit world may be somewhat inconsistent.

    Likewise if both supermarkets claim they will be stretched to maintain their supply chains next month why on earth would we want to add the turmoil of a supply chain reorganisation in to the mix.

    But then Greg Clark is easily duped.

    There will be substantial food price rises whether we Brexit or not. Several reasons: the entire industry has largely tied itself in knots trying to second guess events. Vast amounts of cash is tied up in stored stock, ingredients and packaging all stockpiled as a hedge against disruption. All that costs money. The massive change to ordering patterns has genuinely loaded costs onto producers who have had to work flat out to fulfill enhanced orders.

    Even if Brexit is significantly delayed next week costs have been incurred (albeit not as big an increase as we'd see if we crash out). We've also seen cost loading and cash flow strains on businesses not resilient enough to cope (and yes, I count the likes of Asda and JS in this as they are not remotely profitable enough for their stock exchange overlords).

    So price rises are inevitable. Brexit has cost the industry a lot and we haven't left yet. And for the few lucky sods not directly hit by costs? They'll go for price anyway as its a free hit if everyone else is doing so.
    As of a couple of weeks ago a grain merchant friend of mine said that no vessels of wheat had been traded for post March 29th delivery. Push the supposed exit date back and I can't see how things will work out to say nothing of carry costs.
    With all due respect, that's bullsh1t. The dry bulk (to the UK) market has gone a bit - err - illiquid, and costs have risen, but the idea that there are no ships coming after the 29th is ridiculous.
    pah young Smithson, you have emigrated to the colonies and have forfeited the right to comment :-)

    desist or Ill send you a picture of a bus
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    That's what I've been saying. A long extension is an admission of failure, the Cabinet must tell her to go.
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    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,203

    Miss Cyclefree, because it might enable Corbyn as PM.

    Incompetence isn't good. Incompetence plus a spike in anti-Semitism, plus the scourge of socialism is worse by far.

    Of course. But the way the Tories are behaving is making a Corbyn government ever more likely. So best to get a new sensible party of the centre right - as well as a better one on the left.

    The Tories are enabling an illiberal political culture to grow. They do not deserve to be forgiven for that.
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,754
    Sean_F said:

    148grss said:

    Sean_F said:

    Cicero said:

    Two weeks out from Brexit and the Conservative chaos continues unabated. This catastrophic policy has undermined trust in every basic institution of our country. Parliament is derided, the civil service condemned, the Union more brittle than ever, the economy holding its breath.

    The irresponsible press has a field day whipping up hatred against judges, business people, entrepreneurs and any other person who questions the insanely damaging course we are currently following.

    I simply do not understand why the Conservatives, far from facing absolute annihilation, are actually ahead in most polls.

    When I speak to Conservatives I simply get a sense of utter despair: "We cannot go on like this". They are right, we can't. May is an inflexible dud as PM, BoJo a shallow sham, Rees Mogg a sinister crook. etc etc.

    I guess all those "citizens of Nowhere" seem to have become citizens of Ireland.

    The reason why Conservative support is where it is is that 45% + favour Brexit, lots of people don't like Corbyn, and there is full employment.
    I found this article at the time interesting, I wonder if it is still the case.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/unemployment-in-the-uk-is-now-so-low-its-in-danger-of-exposing-the-lie-used-to-create-the-numbers-2017-7?r=US&IR=T
    The Claimant Count is pretty meaningless as a definition of unemployment, but the ILO figures (which is the ONS headline figure) is generally considered accurate. Saying that anyone who is not currently employed is therefore unemployed is very misleading.

    And, as it happens, real wages have started going up again.
    real wages have started going up again

    Its good to see at least one Remainer threat come true
  • Options
    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    I hope the EU grants an extension to the 30th June and that is it. No further discussion or negotiation

    That should focus minds

    Are you prepared to accept no deal on 30th June if it doesn't focus minds?
  • Options
    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,203
    _Anazina_ said:

    I see Gove's effectively been what I've been saying, No Deal does NOT honour the referendum result.

    A minister told me: "Andrea was sitting there with a face like thunder. She went bonkers.

    "She said she’d been on the phone to 40 ERGers [Tory Brexiter MPs] over the weekend and they are not moving. Her objection to the Cabinet was NOT about being ‘Remainers’ but about this being a Cabinet that won’t deliver on no-deal.

    "Which Gove said at last cabinet was not what he campaigned for as former chairman of Vote Leave,” and leaves Leadsom stranded (my source says Leadsom is “very much in a minority”).

    Andrea Leadsom to believe she spoke for the country.

    But, she speaks only for the ERG.
    Andrea Leadsom can't even speak accurately about her own career let alone anything else.
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    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,605

    Sean_F said:

    148grss said:

    Sean_F said:

    Cicero said:

    Two weeks out from Brexit and the Conservative chaos continues unabated. This catastrophic policy has undermined trust in every basic institution of our country. Parliament is derided, the civil service condemned, the Union more brittle than ever, the economy holding its breath.

    The irresponsible press has a field day whipping up hatred against judges, business people, entrepreneurs and any other person who questions the insanely damaging course we are currently following.

    I simply do not understand why the Conservatives, far from facing absolute annihilation, are actually ahead in most polls.

    When I speak to Conservatives I simply get a sense of utter despair: "We cannot go on like this". They are right, we can't. May is an inflexible dud as PM, BoJo a shallow sham, Rees Mogg a sinister crook. etc etc.

    I guess all those "citizens of Nowhere" seem to have become citizens of Ireland.

    The reason why Conservative support is where it is is that 45% + favour Brexit, lots of people don't like Corbyn, and there is full employment.
    I found this article at the time interesting, I wonder if it is still the case.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/unemployment-in-the-uk-is-now-so-low-its-in-danger-of-exposing-the-lie-used-to-create-the-numbers-2017-7?r=US&IR=T
    The Claimant Count is pretty meaningless as a definition of unemployment, but the ILO figures (which is the ONS headline figure) is generally considered accurate. Saying that anyone who is not currently employed is therefore unemployed is very misleading.

    And, as it happens, real wages have started going up again.
    real wages have started going up again

    Its good to see at least one Remainer threat come true
    https://twitter.com/ToryFibs/status/1107942175722168321?s=19
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    I have no doubt the EU are now in control of the UKs destiny and Barnier, it has to be said is on top of his brief

    ERG have not only lost their dream they have trashed our image abroad

    Remaining in the EU would be humilating and embarrassing and I still hope TM gets her deal through.

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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,926
    EU closing off the "Lets have an extension to faf around" door May was hoping to get through
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    TrèsDifficileTrèsDifficile Posts: 1,729
    Surely that's not all of it? Let me know if you run out, I might have a bottle or two to spare..

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    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340

    Surely that's not all of it? Let me know if you run out, I might have a bottle or two to spare..

    Nice collection!

    No, it's not all of it. But I can't match yours.
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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,836
    Pulpstar said:

    EU closing off the "Lets have an extension to faf around" door May was hoping to get through

    Good. TBF, most of the Commons wants to faff around. I think they should be denied the opportunity.
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    I hope the EU grants an extension to the 30th June and that is it. No further discussion or negotiation

    That should focus minds

    Are you prepared to accept no deal on 30th June if it doesn't focus minds?
    If the HOC cannot come to its senses by then they all deserve to be sacked. No deal is a collective failure of our political class and they will not be forgiven
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    FensterFenster Posts: 2,115
    Foxy said:

    Sean_F said:

    148grss said:

    Sean_F said:

    Cicero said:

    Two weeks out from Brexit and the Conservative chaos continues unabated. This catastrophic policy has undermined trust in every basic institution of our country. Parliament is derided, the civil service condemned, the Union more brittle than ever, the economy holding its breath.

    The irresponsible press has a field day whipping up hatred against judges, business people, entrepreneurs and any other person who questions the insanely damaging course we are currently following.

    I simply do not understand why the Conservatives, far from facing absolute annihilation, are actually ahead in most polls.

    When I speak to Conservatives I simply get a sense of utter despair: "We cannot go on like this". They are right, we can't. May is an inflexible dud as PM, BoJo a shallow sham, Rees Mogg a sinister crook. etc etc.

    I guess all those "citizens of Nowhere" seem to have become citizens of Ireland.

    The reason why Conservative support is where it is is that 45% + favour Brexit, lots of people don't like Corbyn, and there is full employment.
    I found this article at the time interesting, I wonder if it is still the case.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/unemployment-in-the-uk-is-now-so-low-its-in-danger-of-exposing-the-lie-used-to-create-the-numbers-2017-7?r=US&IR=T
    The Claimant Count is pretty meaningless as a definition of unemployment, but the ILO figures (which is the ONS headline figure) is generally considered accurate. Saying that anyone who is not currently employed is therefore unemployed is very misleading.

    And, as it happens, real wages have started going up again.
    real wages have started going up again

    Its good to see at least one Remainer threat come true
    https://twitter.com/ToryFibs/status/1107942175722168321?s=19
    "Dr" Eoin Clarke's account!

    What about unreal wages?
  • Options
    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Foxy said:

    Sean_F said:

    148grss said:

    Sean_F said:

    Cicero said:

    Two weeks out from Brexit and the Conservative chaos continues unabated. This catastrophic policy has undermined trust in every basic institution of our country. Parliament is derided, the civil service condemned, the Union more brittle than ever, the economy holding its breath.

    The irresponsible press has a field day whipping up hatred against judges, business people, entrepreneurs and any other person who questions the insanely damaging course we are currently following.

    I simply do not understand why the Conservatives, far from facing absolute annihilation, are actually ahead in most polls.

    When I speak to Conservatives I simply get a sense of utter despair: "We cannot go on like this". They are right, we can't. May is an inflexible dud as PM, BoJo a shallow sham, Rees Mogg a sinister crook. etc etc.

    I guess all those "citizens of Nowhere" seem to have become citizens of Ireland.

    The reason why Conservative support is where it is is that 45% + favour Brexit, lots of people don't like Corbyn, and there is full employment.
    I found this article at the time interesting, I wonder if it is still the case.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/unemployment-in-the-uk-is-now-so-low-its-in-danger-of-exposing-the-lie-used-to-create-the-numbers-2017-7?r=US&IR=T
    The Claimant Count is pretty meaningless as a definition of unemployment, but the ILO figures (which is the ONS headline figure) is generally considered accurate. Saying that anyone who is not currently employed is therefore unemployed is very misleading.

    And, as it happens, real wages have started going up again.
    real wages have started going up again

    Its good to see at least one Remainer threat come true
    https://twitter.com/ToryFibs/status/1107942175722168321?s=19
    Anyone who quotes 2008 figures are themselves disingenous. 2008 was peak bubble, why should we compare with that?
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    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820
    Foxy said:
    Yes, well there was a little matter of a humongous world financial crash, the worst since at least the 1930s, which happened under the previous Labour government and was made particularly bad for the UK because the Labour government had dismantled supervision of our banking system. Choosing a start point at the top of the unsustainable boom, just before the crash, is a rather, how shall I put it, 'selective' view of the figures.
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    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,993
    edited March 2019

    I have no doubt the EU are now in control of the UKs destiny and Barnier, it has to be said is on top of his brief

    ERG have not only lost their dream they have trashed our image abroad

    Remaining in the EU would be humilating and embarrassing and I still hope TM gets her deal through.

    Didn't you get the memo? We shouldn't be embarrassed by this mess because, well, reasons. ;)

    The leavers have turned their beloved Great Britain into Little Britain.

    (Which as well as being an unfunny TV comedy, is also a place on the Grand Union Canal near Cowley Peachy Junction. So Little Britain is on the way to the Slough of despond ...)
This discussion has been closed.