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  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,084

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    They do not want British MEPs. We do not want British MEPs. So I imagine a way will be found that results in no British MEPs. Not sure how though - other than the obvious of passing the WA.

    Already ruled out by the ECJ. You are either a member will full rights or you are a third country

    In the absence of the WDA and with an extended A50 we are a full member

    Otherwise the new EU Parliament will not be able to legally pass laws or function
    And the legal steps to start the election campaign have already been taken so unless the WA is agreed in the very near future (rather a small possibility I think) we are going to elect MEPs on 23rd May.
    Predict the lowest turnout in a UKwide election ever?

    Who is going to bother to turn out to vote for MEPs in vast regions like the South East and North West with little local connection and the country having already voted to Leave the EU anyway other than diehard Remainers for TIG and diehard Leavers for the Brexit Party to make a point
    I predict it will be the highest turnout in any European election we’ve had.
    +1

    Apart from anything else it will benefit from all these trailers.
  • isamisam Posts: 40,731
    edited April 2019
    "I dont't write this stuff, I just type it out" after making a very accusatory statement... has to be a "Centrist"
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408

    kinabalu said:

    They do not want British MEPs. We do not want British MEPs. So I imagine a way will be found that results in no British MEPs. Not sure how though - other than the obvious of passing the WA.

    Already ruled out by the ECJ. You are either a member will full rights or you are a third country

    In the absence of the WDA and with an extended A50 we are a full member

    Otherwise the new EU Parliament will not be able to legally pass laws or function
    And the legal steps to start the election campaign have already been taken so unless the WA is agreed in the very near future (rather a small possibility I think) we are going to elect MEPs on 23rd May.
    I think if we do that then it really is over. We'll still be there 5 years from now.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,749
    edited April 2019
    Given the way the Brexichosis has been going, ol' Julia will be blaming HMQ next.

    https://twitter.com/brianmoore666/status/1115588232954118144
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,232
    As a result of Brexit's cancellation, Brendan is rather cross:

    These Orwellian euphemisms are simply a disguise for what the political elite’s war on No Deal represents – a war on Brexit. When you hear MPs saying ‘We have to prevent No Deal’, what they really mean is: ‘We have to prevent Brexit.’ And preventing Brexit of course means preventing democracy, disenfranchising millions, overturning 100 years of a democratic contract that defined modern Britain. This is the end of an era.

    https://www.spiked-online.com/2019/04/04/the-war-on-no-deal-is-a-war-on-democracy/
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,281
    Charles said:

    Be careful

    Wouldn’t May announce her resignation but stay in place until a successor appointed? Is that “immediate”?
    Good grief! It has come to something when the weak link in a Revoke + May Resigns double is May resigns!
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408

    Scott_P said:
    Yup, just as I thought. The conditions are everything now, and the ERG are relishing their child-throwing-balloons disruption powers as usual.
    They're like the DUP, except the DUP at least believe in the Union.
  • RecidivistRecidivist Posts: 4,679
    I may have underestimated leavers. They have come up with a fiendish and near foolproof plan.

    https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/brexit-blackout-protest-strike-on-facebook-1-5983822
  • anothernickanothernick Posts: 3,547
    kle4 said:

    kinabalu said:

    They do not want British MEPs. We do not want British MEPs. So I imagine a way will be found that results in no British MEPs. Not sure how though - other than the obvious of passing the WA.

    Already ruled out by the ECJ. You are either a member will full rights or you are a third country

    In the absence of the WDA and with an extended A50 we are a full member

    Otherwise the new EU Parliament will not be able to legally pass laws or function
    And the legal steps to start the election campaign have already been taken so unless the WA is agreed in the very near future (rather a small possibility I think) we are going to elect MEPs on 23rd May.
    I think if we do that then it really is over. We'll still be there 5 years from now.
    Yes - I think there is now a greater than 50% chance that Brexit will never happen. There will be continued A50 extensions, the issue will slip down the political agenda and eventually it will be formally revoked.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    HYUFD said:
    I'm sure that informal lunch wont be tense in the slightest. Is Corbyn a cricket fan? He and May could bond discussing the new season and how backbenchers are annoying twits.
  • The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is adamant that Brexit cannot be delayed beyond December 2019, and will ask the other 26 EU leaders to impose compliance checks on the UK every three months during any extension, Alberto Nardello reports in a story for BuzzFeed.

    BuzzFeed News reported on Monday that the EU will expect the UK to meet “enhanced sincere cooperation” terms in an attempt to allay fears that if May’s successor is a hardline Brexiteer, they will be unable to disrupt the EU’s decision-making on budgets and other key issues. Brussels will reserve the right to end the extension period early, in agreement with the UK, in the event of non-compliance with this duty.

    But Macron will ask his European counterparts to go even further, the diplomatic sources explained.

    In addition to seeking a commitment from the UK that it will not disrupt the EU’s working, he wants the delay to be structured around quarterly checkpoints to confirm the extension, with the possibility of terminating early — in June or September — if the UK is found to not be respecting its commitments.

    Macron also wants to deny the UK the right to appoint a commissioner to the next European Commission.
  • dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786
    Scott_P said:
    Swap Gibraltar for Ceuta and Melila and Norn for French Guiana.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,765
    isam said:

    "I dont't write this stuff, I just type it out" after making a very accusatory statement... has to be a "Centrist"
    Yes. Tom Peck is as bad on one side of the argument as Mark Francois is on the other.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,281

    I may have underestimated leavers. They have come up with a fiendish and near foolproof plan.

    https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/brexit-blackout-protest-strike-on-facebook-1-5983822

    Millions of over 65s stay at home and do nothing all day - that'll bring the country to its knees!
  • dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786
    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:
    I'm sure that informal lunch wont be tense in the slightest. Is Corbyn a cricket fan? He and May could bond discussing the new season and how backbenchers are annoying twits.
    May and Corbyn not attending
  • RecidivistRecidivist Posts: 4,679

    I may have underestimated leavers. They have come up with a fiendish and near foolproof plan.

    https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/brexit-blackout-protest-strike-on-facebook-1-5983822

    Millions of over 65s stay at home and do nothing all day - that'll bring the country to its knees!
    I'm scheduling my trips to the post office for strike days already.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408

    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:
    I'm sure that informal lunch wont be tense in the slightest. Is Corbyn a cricket fan? He and May could bond discussing the new season and how backbenchers are annoying twits.
    May and Corbyn not attending
    Shame. I guess what they want is pretty irrelevant anyway.
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,232
    Scott_P said:
    I'm actually quite fearful. In the kind of atmosphere that is being whipped up someone might do something very silly.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,281

    I may have underestimated leavers. They have come up with a fiendish and near foolproof plan.

    https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/brexit-blackout-protest-strike-on-facebook-1-5983822

    Millions of over 65s stay at home and do nothing all day - that'll bring the country to its knees!
    I'm scheduling my trips to the post office for strike days already.
    Will they schedule one for May 23rd I wonder?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,019

    The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is adamant that Brexit cannot be delayed beyond December 2019, and will ask the other 26 EU leaders to impose compliance checks on the UK every three months during any extension, Alberto Nardello reports in a story for BuzzFeed.

    BuzzFeed News reported on Monday that the EU will expect the UK to meet “enhanced sincere cooperation” terms in an attempt to allay fears that if May’s successor is a hardline Brexiteer, they will be unable to disrupt the EU’s decision-making on budgets and other key issues. Brussels will reserve the right to end the extension period early, in agreement with the UK, in the event of non-compliance with this duty.

    But Macron will ask his European counterparts to go even further, the diplomatic sources explained.

    In addition to seeking a commitment from the UK that it will not disrupt the EU’s working, he wants the delay to be structured around quarterly checkpoints to confirm the extension, with the possibility of terminating early — in June or September — if the UK is found to not be respecting its commitments.

    Macron also wants to deny the UK the right to appoint a commissioner to the next European Commission.

    That almost makes me want to revoke and Remain, just to piss off the French.
  • AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    edited April 2019
    Welsh Labour re-selection process for the 2021 Welsh Assembly elections have now been concluded.

    Carwyn Jones had already confirmed his retirement in 2021.

    All other sitting constituency AMs submitted themselves for re-selection.
    They all won the trigger ballot.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,019
    Sean_F said:

    isam said:

    "I dont't write this stuff, I just type it out" after making a very accusatory statement... has to be a "Centrist"
    Yes. Tom Peck is as bad on one side of the argument as Mark Francois is on the other.

    When it comes down to it, I think Mark Francois basically only cares about his ego.

    As a gentleman of short stature a more astute PM than Theresa May would have worked this out a long time ago.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,697
    Pulpstar said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Scott_P said:
    Oh god! That's not "Two Brians - No Sense" Willets AND Matt Hancock in the same room together is it????

    #Disaster

    :D
    Willetts has probably done more for poisoning the Tories well with younger voters than anyone else.
    All they need is Letwin to drop by and they'll have the hat-trick. :D
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,281

    The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is adamant that Brexit cannot be delayed beyond December 2019, and will ask the other 26 EU leaders to impose compliance checks on the UK every three months during any extension, Alberto Nardello reports in a story for BuzzFeed.

    BuzzFeed News reported on Monday that the EU will expect the UK to meet “enhanced sincere cooperation” terms in an attempt to allay fears that if May’s successor is a hardline Brexiteer, they will be unable to disrupt the EU’s decision-making on budgets and other key issues. Brussels will reserve the right to end the extension period early, in agreement with the UK, in the event of non-compliance with this duty.

    But Macron will ask his European counterparts to go even further, the diplomatic sources explained.

    In addition to seeking a commitment from the UK that it will not disrupt the EU’s working, he wants the delay to be structured around quarterly checkpoints to confirm the extension, with the possibility of terminating early — in June or September — if the UK is found to not be respecting its commitments.

    Macron also wants to deny the UK the right to appoint a commissioner to the next European Commission.

    That almost makes me want to revoke and Remain, just to piss off the French.
    Welcome to the sane side :smile:
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,084

    The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is adamant that Brexit cannot be delayed beyond December 2019, and will ask the other 26 EU leaders to impose compliance checks on the UK every three months during any extension, Alberto Nardello reports in a story for BuzzFeed.

    BuzzFeed News reported on Monday that the EU will expect the UK to meet “enhanced sincere cooperation” terms in an attempt to allay fears that if May’s successor is a hardline Brexiteer, they will be unable to disrupt the EU’s decision-making on budgets and other key issues. Brussels will reserve the right to end the extension period early, in agreement with the UK, in the event of non-compliance with this duty.

    But Macron will ask his European counterparts to go even further, the diplomatic sources explained.

    In addition to seeking a commitment from the UK that it will not disrupt the EU’s working, he wants the delay to be structured around quarterly checkpoints to confirm the extension, with the possibility of terminating early — in June or September — if the UK is found to not be respecting its commitments.

    Macron also wants to deny the UK the right to appoint a commissioner to the next European Commission.

    That almost makes me want to revoke and Remain, just to piss off the French.
    We knew you'd get there in the end. I can send you one of my spare flags if you like?
  • notme2notme2 Posts: 1,006

    Scott_P said:
    I'm actually quite fearful. In the kind of atmosphere that is being whipped up someone might do something very silly.
    Like trying to revoke a decision to leave the EU.
  • dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786

    The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is adamant that Brexit cannot be delayed beyond December 2019, and will ask the other 26 EU leaders to impose compliance checks on the UK every three months during any extension, Alberto Nardello reports in a story for BuzzFeed.

    BuzzFeed News reported on Monday that the EU will expect the UK to meet “enhanced sincere cooperation” terms in an attempt to allay fears that if May’s successor is a hardline Brexiteer, they will be unable to disrupt the EU’s decision-making on budgets and other key issues. Brussels will reserve the right to end the extension period early, in agreement with the UK, in the event of non-compliance with this duty.

    But Macron will ask his European counterparts to go even further, the diplomatic sources explained.

    In addition to seeking a commitment from the UK that it will not disrupt the EU’s working, he wants the delay to be structured around quarterly checkpoints to confirm the extension, with the possibility of terminating early — in June or September — if the UK is found to not be respecting its commitments.

    Macron also wants to deny the UK the right to appoint a commissioner to the next European Commission.

    That almost makes me want to revoke and Remain, just to piss off the French.
    If we are members we appoint a commissioner. If he doesn't like it, offer us something. French twat
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,019

    Scott_P said:
    Swap Gibraltar for Ceuta and Melila and Norn for French Guiana.

    How do I vote to get Hong Kong back?
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,697
    HYUFD said:
    Con team = Remain, Remain, Leave, Remain, God Knows and er... Remain.

    Remainers meeting Remainers to work out how to stop Brexit?
  • stodgestodge Posts: 12,745
    notme2 said:


    "Ms Smith is one of hundreds of residents placed at Terminus House" you mean she's in emergency/temporary accommodation. What does she expect, a penthouse suite? Some people FFS.

    There, in a nutshell, is the problem of the centre-right. It isn't just enough to survive - we are a rich country and we should be asking ourselves how we can help the MS Smiths move beyond where we are to where they aspire to be.

    Not everyone who has fallen on hard times is a "scrounger" - many suffer from addiction or mental health problems. We also know how difficult it can be for ex-servicemen and ex-offenders to re-integrate into society. All of this should be our priority - tackling addiction and mental health issues, providing not just a measure of survival but genuine help for people to get back on their feet.

    In addition, we need to take a long hard look at how the elderly are treated in society. They aren't just Tory-voting fodder. What is it going to be like to be 80 or 90 years old in Britain in 2030?
  • eristdooferistdoof Posts: 4,861

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:
    Thanks - the use of Property Guardians is emerging as one of the real scandals of our time. The theory of providing cheap accommodation for key workers has been around for years and being able to quickly convert office blocks and unused public buildings into effectively dormitories for NHS workers to live nearer where they work isn't without merit but as always Government has simply allowed the private sector the latitude - insufficient regulation has as we always see led to exploitation.

    "Ms Smith is one of hundreds of residents placed at Terminus House" you mean she's in emergency/temporary accommodation. What does she expect, a penthouse suite? Some people FFS.
    She's been there fore a year...

    Presumably there are a shortage of places available.

    Presumably she needs to get a grip of her own destiny and leave. People are not spectators in their own lives. Learned helplessness behaviour. Much of which has now been shaken out of the system.
    If you are opposed to the idea of the state housing people I think you should come out and say it.
    Do you mean the inhabitants of 10 Downing Street?
  • isamisam Posts: 40,731

    Sean_F said:

    isam said:

    "I dont't write this stuff, I just type it out" after making a very accusatory statement... has to be a "Centrist"
    Yes. Tom Peck is as bad on one side of the argument as Mark Francois is on the other.

    When it comes down to it, I think Mark Francois basically only cares about his ego.

    As a gentleman of short stature a more astute PM than Theresa May would have worked this out a long time ago.
    https://twitter.com/David_Cameron/status/597789209286574080
  • notme2notme2 Posts: 1,006
    edited April 2019

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:
    Thanks - the use of Property Guardians is emerging as one of the real scandals of our time. The theory of providing cheap accommodation for key workers has been around for years and being able to quickly convert office blocks and unused public buildings into effectively dormitories for NHS workers to live nearer where they work isn't without merit but as always Government has simply allowed the private sector the latitude - insufficient regulation has as we always see led to exploitation.

    "Ms Smith is one of hundreds of residents placed at Terminus House" you mean she's in emergency/temporary accommodation. What does she expect, a penthouse suite? Some people FFS.
    She's been there fore a year...

    Presumably there are a shortage of places available.

    Presumably she needs to get a grip of her own destiny and leave. People are not spectators in their own lives. Learned helplessness behaviour. Much of which has now been shaken out of the system.
    If you are opposed to the idea of the state housing people I think you should come out and say it.

    I'm opposed to the state housing people except in emergency situations. No real problem with social housing through not for profits and housing associations. This is about learnt feebleness.

    "they've housed me somewhere really crap because i got evicted/ didnt pay the rent. I'm still here waiting for them lot to do something about it".
  • dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786

    Scott_P said:
    Swap Gibraltar for Ceuta and Melila and Norn for French Guiana.

    How do I vote to get Hong Kong back?
    Just accuse the PRC of reneging on the agreement to maintain democratic rule until 2047 and declare the return to Chinese rule invalid. Invade.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,019

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    They do not want British MEPs. We do not want British MEPs. So I imagine a way will be found that results in no British MEPs. Not sure how though - other than the obvious of passing the WA.

    Already ruled out by the ECJ. You are either a member will full rights or you are a third country

    In the absence of the WDA and with an extended A50 we are a full member

    Otherwise the new EU Parliament will not be able to legally pass laws or function
    And the legal steps to start the election campaign have already been taken so unless the WA is agreed in the very near future (rather a small possibility I think) we are going to elect MEPs on 23rd May.
    Predict the lowest turnout in a UKwide election ever?

    Who is going to bother to turn out to vote for MEPs in vast regions like the South East and North West with little local connection and the country having already voted to Leave the EU anyway other than diehard Remainers for TIG and diehard Leavers for the Brexit Party to make a point
    I predict it will be the highest turnout in any European election we’ve had.
    I think you could be right, and have bet accordingly.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340

    The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is adamant that Brexit cannot be delayed beyond December 2019, and will ask the other 26 EU leaders to impose compliance checks on the UK every three months during any extension, Alberto Nardello reports in a story for BuzzFeed.

    BuzzFeed News reported on Monday that the EU will expect the UK to meet “enhanced sincere cooperation” terms in an attempt to allay fears that if May’s successor is a hardline Brexiteer, they will be unable to disrupt the EU’s decision-making on budgets and other key issues. Brussels will reserve the right to end the extension period early, in agreement with the UK, in the event of non-compliance with this duty.

    But Macron will ask his European counterparts to go even further, the diplomatic sources explained.

    In addition to seeking a commitment from the UK that it will not disrupt the EU’s working, he wants the delay to be structured around quarterly checkpoints to confirm the extension, with the possibility of terminating early — in June or September — if the UK is found to not be respecting its commitments.

    Macron also wants to deny the UK the right to appoint a commissioner to the next European Commission.

    That almost makes me want to revoke and Remain, just to piss off the French.
    If we are members we appoint a commissioner. If he doesn't like it, offer us something. French twat
    Erm, look at it from the EU's perspective. They've negotiated a deal with the British government. The deal has been on the table for months. Having voted to leave, the UK is now not wanting to leave just yet. This would really mess up the EU's structures, especially as the UK claims still to want to leave, but not yet.

    If I were on the EU side, I too would be fed up at the idea that Britain should get both an extension and to upend the EU's institutions.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,749

    Scott_P said:
    Swap Gibraltar for Ceuta and Melila and Norn for French Guiana.

    How do I vote to get Hong Kong back?
    Not a vote per se..

    https://twitter.com/HistoryInPics/status/380108169898627072
  • TOPPING said:

    OK so who can remember the process for invoking Article 50? MV? Simple majority?

    And of course can you do it twice?

    Debatable whether it needs a HoC vote, though it would be advisable of course. May was given the power to invoke A50 IIRC, nothing to say she had to, and nothing to prevent her from issuing an executive order to do so imo.

    As I say, it would be advisable to get a HoC vote so she will no doubt do that... Oh :disappointed:
    It has to comply with UK constitutional requirements but even talking about TM revoking is in another world
    Uhuh? That is written down where precisely?

    I really rate most of your posts Big_G but like all of us you fall foul of sometimes believing what you wish to be the case, is in fact the case. Your view on the impossibility of the HoC approving EU elections is an example (they didn't need to approve them).

    Still, I respect your opinion and accept you may be right on Revoke... I just don't think that legally you are (IMHO).
    The ECJ said the decision to revoke has to be made in line with the country's 'own national constitution requirements' whatever they may be and that is quoted in the Independent of the 8th January 2019

    As far as the EU elections are concerned I was correct in saying it needed legislation only that the part of the legislation needed had not expired being tied up in the HOC, so fortunate in that respect
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340

    Sean_F said:

    isam said:

    "I dont't write this stuff, I just type it out" after making a very accusatory statement... has to be a "Centrist"
    Yes. Tom Peck is as bad on one side of the argument as Mark Francois is on the other.

    When it comes down to it, I think Mark Francois basically only cares about his ego.

    As a gentleman of short stature a more astute PM than Theresa May would have worked this out a long time ago.
    Get him a box to stand on then.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is adamant that Brexit cannot be delayed beyond December 2019, and will ask the other 26 EU leaders to impose compliance checks on the UK every three months during any extension, Alberto Nardello reports in a story for BuzzFeed.

    BuzzFeed News reported on Monday that the EU will expect the UK to meet “enhanced sincere cooperation” terms in an attempt to allay fears that if May’s successor is a hardline Brexiteer, they will be unable to disrupt the EU’s decision-making on budgets and other key issues. Brussels will reserve the right to end the extension period early, in agreement with the UK, in the event of non-compliance with this duty.

    But Macron will ask his European counterparts to go even further, the diplomatic sources explained.

    In addition to seeking a commitment from the UK that it will not disrupt the EU’s working, he wants the delay to be structured around quarterly checkpoints to confirm the extension, with the possibility of terminating early — in June or September — if the UK is found to not be respecting its commitments.

    Macron also wants to deny the UK the right to appoint a commissioner to the next European Commission.

    That almost makes me want to revoke and Remain, just to piss off the French.
    If we are members we appoint a commissioner. If he doesn't like it, offer us something. French twat
    Erm, look at it from the EU's perspective. They've negotiated a deal with the British government. The deal has been on the table for months. Having voted to leave, the UK is now not wanting to leave just yet. This would really mess up the EU's structures, especially as the UK claims still to want to leave, but not yet.

    If I were on the EU side, I too would be fed up at the idea that Britain should get both an extension and to upend the EU's institutions.
    Bit dim of the EU to expect that their sh1t sandwich would be swallowed by the Uk parliament - they are just as naive as Mrs May.

  • dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786

    The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is adamant that Brexit cannot be delayed beyond December 2019, and will ask the other 26 EU leaders to impose compliance checks on the UK every three months during any extension, Alberto Nardello reports in a story for BuzzFeed.

    BuzzFeed News reported on Monday that the EU will expect the UK to meet “enhanced sincere cooperation” terms in an attempt to allay fears that if May’s successor is a hardline Brexiteer, they will be unable to disrupt the EU’s decision-making on budgets and other key issues. Brussels will reserve the right to end the extension period early, in agreement with the UK, in the event of non-compliance with this duty.

    But Macron will ask his European counterparts to go even further, the diplomatic sources explained.

    In addition to seeking a commitment from the UK that it will not disrupt the EU’s working, he wants the delay to be structured around quarterly checkpoints to confirm the extension, with the possibility of terminating early — in June or September — if the UK is found to not be respecting its commitments.

    Macron also wants to deny the UK the right to appoint a commissioner to the next European Commission.

    That almost makes me want to revoke and Remain, just to piss off the French.
    If we are members we appoint a commissioner. If he doesn't like it, offer us something. French twat
    Erm, look at it from the EU's perspective. They've negotiated a deal with the British government. The deal has been on the table for months. Having voted to leave, the UK is now not wanting to leave just yet. This would really mess up the EU's structures, especially as the UK claims still to want to leave, but not yet.

    If I were on the EU side, I too would be fed up at the idea that Britain should get both an extension and to upend the EU's institutions.
    Then deny an extension. All this 'let's punish Britain' idiocy will result in tears. Say no more delay, stay or go, but we aren't hanging about waiting. It's not rocket science but the EU are spineless
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,019
    Pulpstar said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Scott_P said:
    Oh god! That's not "Two Brians - No Sense" Willets AND Matt Hancock in the same room together is it????

    #Disaster

    :D
    Willetts has probably done more for poisoning the Tories well with younger voters than anyone else.
    I met him once.

    Obviously clever but rather rude too with zero beside manner: talking to members and activists (as I attempted to do after his speech) seemed to fill him with horror.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,281
    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:
    Thanks - the use of Property Guardians is emerging as one of the real scandals of our time. The theory of providing cheap accommodation for key workers has been around for years and being able to quickly convert office blocks and unused public buildings into effectively dormitories for NHS workers to live nearer where they work isn't without merit but as always Government has simply allowed the private sector the latitude - insufficient regulation has as we always see led to exploitation.

    "Ms Smith is one of hundreds of residents placed at Terminus House" you mean she's in emergency/temporary accommodation. What does she expect, a penthouse suite? Some people FFS.
    She's been there fore a year...

    Presumably there are a shortage of places available.

    Presumably she needs to get a grip of her own destiny and leave. People are not spectators in their own lives. Learned helplessness behaviour. Much of which has now been shaken out of the system.
    If you are opposed to the idea of the state housing people I think you should come out and say it.

    I'm opposed to the state housing people except in emergency situations. No real problem with social housing through not for profits and housing associations. This is about learnt feebleness.

    "they've housed me somewhere really crap because i got evicted/ didnt pay the rent. I'm still here waiting for them lot to do something about it".
    You're all heart @notme2.

    I hope you never fall on hard times.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 38,851

    The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is adamant that Brexit cannot be delayed beyond December 2019, and will ask the other 26 EU leaders to impose compliance checks on the UK every three months during any extension, Alberto Nardello reports in a story for BuzzFeed.

    BuzzFeed News reported on Monday that the EU will expect the UK to meet “enhanced sincere cooperation” terms in an attempt to allay fears that if May’s successor is a hardline Brexiteer, they will be unable to disrupt the EU’s decision-making on budgets and other key issues. Brussels will reserve the right to end the extension period early, in agreement with the UK, in the event of non-compliance with this duty.

    But Macron will ask his European counterparts to go even further, the diplomatic sources explained.

    In addition to seeking a commitment from the UK that it will not disrupt the EU’s working, he wants the delay to be structured around quarterly checkpoints to confirm the extension, with the possibility of terminating early — in June or September — if the UK is found to not be respecting its commitments.

    Macron also wants to deny the UK the right to appoint a commissioner to the next European Commission.

    Regular inspections to check if we are in compliance with our undertakings. Yes, that sounds eminently sensible, but the effectiveness of any inspections will depend very much on who is doing them.

    Hans Blix is probably not an option. He's 90 years old now.
  • isamisam Posts: 40,731

    The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is adamant that Brexit cannot be delayed beyond December 2019, and will ask the other 26 EU leaders to impose compliance checks on the UK every three months during any extension, Alberto Nardello reports in a story for BuzzFeed.

    BuzzFeed News reported on Monday that the EU will expect the UK to meet “enhanced sincere cooperation” terms in an attempt to allay fears that if May’s successor is a hardline Brexiteer, they will be unable to disrupt the EU’s decision-making on budgets and other key issues. Brussels will reserve the right to end the extension period early, in agreement with the UK, in the event of non-compliance with this duty.

    But Macron will ask his European counterparts to go even further, the diplomatic sources explained.

    In addition to seeking a commitment from the UK that it will not disrupt the EU’s working, he wants the delay to be structured around quarterly checkpoints to confirm the extension, with the possibility of terminating early — in June or September — if the UK is found to not be respecting its commitments.

    Macron also wants to deny the UK the right to appoint a commissioner to the next European Commission.

    That almost makes me want to revoke and Remain, just to piss off the French.
    If we are members we appoint a commissioner. If he doesn't like it, offer us something. French twat
    Erm, look at it from the EU's perspective. They've negotiated a deal with the British government. The deal has been on the table for months. Having voted to leave, the UK is now not wanting to leave just yet. This would really mess up the EU's structures, especially as the UK claims still to want to leave, but not yet.

    If I were on the EU side, I too would be fed up at the idea that Britain should get both an extension and to upend the EU's institutions.
    I think this is the confusion. The UK who voted to Leave aren't the UK not wanting to leave just yet.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340

    The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is adamant that Brexit cannot be delayed beyond December 2019, and will ask the other 26 EU leaders to impose compliance checks on the UK every three months during any extension, Alberto Nardello reports in a story for BuzzFeed.

    BuzzFeed News reported on Monday that the EU will expect the UK to meet “enhanced sincere cooperation” terms in an attempt to allay fears that if May’s successor is a hardline Brexiteer, they will be unable to disrupt the EU’s decision-making on budgets and other key issues. Brussels will reserve the right to end the extension period early, in agreement with the UK, in the event of non-compliance with this duty.

    But Macron will ask his European counterparts to go even further, the diplomatic sources explained.

    In addition to seeking a commitment from the UK that it will not disrupt the EU’s working, he wants the delay to be structured around quarterly checkpoints to confirm the extension, with the possibility of terminating early — in June or September — if the UK is found to not be respecting its commitments.

    Macron also wants to deny the UK the right to appoint a commissioner to the next European Commission.

    That almost makes me want to revoke and Remain, just to piss off the French.
    If we are members we appoint a commissioner. If he doesn't like it, offer us something. French twat
    Erm, look at it from the EU's perspective. They've negotiated a deal with the British government. The deal has been on the table for months. Having voted to leave, the UK is now not wanting to leave just yet. This would really mess up the EU's structures, especially as the UK claims still to want to leave, but not yet.

    If I were on the EU side, I too would be fed up at the idea that Britain should get both an extension and to upend the EU's institutions.
    Then deny an extension. All this 'let's punish Britain' idiocy will result in tears. Say no more delay, stay or go, but we aren't hanging about waiting. It's not rocket science but the EU are spineless
    Britain clearly is hanging around waiting.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,136
    Do the treaties allow the British to not send a Commissioner or do they have to appoint one and give him the newly-created shed portfolio?
  • notme2notme2 Posts: 1,006
    stodge said:

    notme2 said:


    "Ms Smith is one of hundreds of residents placed at Terminus House" you mean she's in emergency/temporary accommodation. What does she expect, a penthouse suite? Some people FFS.

    There, in a nutshell, is the problem of the centre-right. It isn't just enough to survive - we are a rich country and we should be asking ourselves how we can help the MS Smiths move beyond where we are to where they aspire to be.

    Not everyone who has fallen on hard times is a "scrounger" - many suffer from addiction or mental health problems. We also know how difficult it can be for ex-servicemen and ex-offenders to re-integrate into society. All of this should be our priority - tackling addiction and mental health issues, providing not just a measure of survival but genuine help for people to get back on their feet.

    In addition, we need to take a long hard look at how the elderly are treated in society. They aren't just Tory-voting fodder. What is it going to be like to be 80 or 90 years old in Britain in 2030?
    There is almost certainly a long and very expensive story behind this of an army of people trying to help her. Some people need to be accountable for their bad decisions.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,019

    Sean_F said:

    isam said:

    "I dont't write this stuff, I just type it out" after making a very accusatory statement... has to be a "Centrist"
    Yes. Tom Peck is as bad on one side of the argument as Mark Francois is on the other.

    When it comes down to it, I think Mark Francois basically only cares about his ego.

    As a gentleman of short stature a more astute PM than Theresa May would have worked this out a long time ago.
    Get him a box to stand on then.
    He needed to be charmed and flattered and given a small win he could shout about on that soapbox.

    It’s not facts that will convince him.
  • dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786

    The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is adamant that Brexit cannot be delayed beyond December 2019, and will ask the other 26 EU leaders to impose compliance checks on the UK every three months during any extension, Alberto Nardello reports in a story for BuzzFeed.

    BuzzFeed News reported on Monday that the EU will expect the UK to meet “enhanced sincere cooperation” terms in an attempt to allay fears that if May’s successor is a hardline Brexiteer, they will be unable to disrupt the EU’s decision-making on budgets and other key issues. Brussels will reserve the right to end the extension period early, in agreement with the UK, in the event of non-compliance with this duty.

    But Macron will ask his European counterparts to go even further, the diplomatic sources explained.

    In addition to seeking a commitment from the UK that it will not disrupt the EU’s working, he wants the delay to be structured around quarterly checkpoints to confirm the extension, with the possibility of terminating early — in June or September — if the UK is found to not be respecting its commitments.

    Macron also wants to deny the UK the right to appoint a commissioner to the next European Commission.

    That almost makes me want to revoke and Remain, just to piss off the French.
    If we are members we appoint a commissioner. If he doesn't like it, offer us something. French twat
    Erm, look at it from the EU's perspective. They've negotiated a deal with the British government. The deal has been on the table for months. Having voted to leave, the UK is now not wanting to leave just yet. This would really mess up the EU's structures, especially as the UK claims still to want to leave, but not yet.

    If I were on the EU side, I too would be fed up at the idea that Britain should get both an extension and to upend the EU's institutions.
    Then deny an extension. All this 'let's punish Britain' idiocy will result in tears. Say no more delay, stay or go, but we aren't hanging about waiting. It's not rocket science but the EU are spineless
    Britain clearly is hanging around waiting.
    So they refuse an extension. But they are frit
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Scott_P said:
    It's at moments like this that you understand how Gavin Williamson became a Cabinet minister.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340

    Sean_F said:

    isam said:

    "I dont't write this stuff, I just type it out" after making a very accusatory statement... has to be a "Centrist"
    Yes. Tom Peck is as bad on one side of the argument as Mark Francois is on the other.

    When it comes down to it, I think Mark Francois basically only cares about his ego.

    As a gentleman of short stature a more astute PM than Theresa May would have worked this out a long time ago.
    Get him a box to stand on then.
    He needed to be charmed and flattered and given a small win he could shout about on that soapbox.

    It’s not facts that will convince him.
    I was hoping that the height adjustment might shut him up, not encourage him to speak more. Haven't we heard more than enough from him now?
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is adamant that Brexit cannot be delayed beyond December 2019, and will ask the other 26 EU leaders to impose compliance checks on the UK every three months during any extension, Alberto Nardello reports in a story for BuzzFeed.

    BuzzFeed News reported on Monday that the EU will expect the UK to meet “enhanced sincere cooperation” terms in an attempt to allay fears that if May’s successor is a hardline Brexiteer, they will be unable to disrupt the EU’s decision-making on budgets and other key issues. Brussels will reserve the right to end the extension period early, in agreement with the UK, in the event of non-compliance with this duty.

    But Macron will ask his European counterparts to go even further, the diplomatic sources explained.

    In addition to seeking a commitment from the UK that it will not disrupt the EU’s working, he wants the delay to be structured around quarterly checkpoints to confirm the extension, with the possibility of terminating early — in June or September — if the UK is found to not be respecting its commitments.

    Macron also wants to deny the UK the right to appoint a commissioner to the next European Commission.

    That almost makes me want to revoke and Remain, just to piss off the French.
    If we are members we appoint a commissioner. If he doesn't like it, offer us something. French twat
    Erm, look at it from the EU's perspective. They've negotiated a deal with the British government. The deal has been on the table for months. Having voted to leave, the UK is now not wanting to leave just yet. This would really mess up the EU's structures, especially as the UK claims still to want to leave, but not yet.

    If I were on the EU side, I too would be fed up at the idea that Britain should get both an extension and to upend the EU's institutions.
    Then deny an extension. All this 'let's punish Britain' idiocy will result in tears. Say no more delay, stay or go, but we aren't hanging about waiting. It's not rocket science but the EU are spineless
    Britain clearly is hanging around waiting.
    So they refuse an extension. But they are frit
    How was Brexit for you Grandad ?

    Well us remainers lost - but I retweeted some amusing tweets about the ERG..
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,019

    Scott_P said:
    Swap Gibraltar for Ceuta and Melila and Norn for French Guiana.

    How do I vote to get Hong Kong back?
    Just accuse the PRC of reneging on the agreement to maintain democratic rule until 2047 and declare the return to Chinese rule invalid. Invade.

    Nice.
  • notme2notme2 Posts: 1,006

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:
    Thanks - the use of Property Guardians is emerging as one of the real scandals of our time. The theory of providing cheap accommodation for key workers has been around for years and being able to quickly convert office blocks and unused public buildings into effectively dormitories for NHS workers to live nearer where they work isn't without merit but as always Government has simply allowed the private sector the latitude - insufficient regulation has as we always see led to exploitation.

    "Ms Smith is one of hundreds of residents placed at Terminus House" you mean she's in emergency/temporary accommodation. What does she expect, a penthouse suite? Some people FFS.
    She's been there fore a year...

    Presumably there are a shortage of places available.

    Presumably she needs to get a grip of her own destiny and leave. People are not spectators in their own lives. Learned helplessness behaviour. Much of which has now been shaken out of the system.
    If you are opposed to the idea of the state housing people I think you should come out and say it.

    I'm opposed to the state housing people except in emergency situations. No real problem with social housing through not for profits and housing associations. This is about learnt feebleness.

    "they've housed me somewhere really crap because i got evicted/ didnt pay the rent. I'm still here waiting for them lot to do something about it".
    You're all heart @notme2.

    I hope you never fall on hard times.
    Again, this isnt about hard times, its about learnt feebleness. There will be a series of interventions and assistance before she has got to this stage.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,019
    IanB2 said:

    The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is adamant that Brexit cannot be delayed beyond December 2019, and will ask the other 26 EU leaders to impose compliance checks on the UK every three months during any extension, Alberto Nardello reports in a story for BuzzFeed.

    BuzzFeed News reported on Monday that the EU will expect the UK to meet “enhanced sincere cooperation” terms in an attempt to allay fears that if May’s successor is a hardline Brexiteer, they will be unable to disrupt the EU’s decision-making on budgets and other key issues. Brussels will reserve the right to end the extension period early, in agreement with the UK, in the event of non-compliance with this duty.

    But Macron will ask his European counterparts to go even further, the diplomatic sources explained.

    In addition to seeking a commitment from the UK that it will not disrupt the EU’s working, he wants the delay to be structured around quarterly checkpoints to confirm the extension, with the possibility of terminating early — in June or September — if the UK is found to not be respecting its commitments.

    Macron also wants to deny the UK the right to appoint a commissioner to the next European Commission.

    That almost makes me want to revoke and Remain, just to piss off the French.
    We knew you'd get there in the end. I can send you one of my spare flags if you like?
    I don’t do flags unless it has a Union Jack in it.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,749
    TGOHF said:

    The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is adamant that Brexit cannot be delayed beyond December 2019, and will ask the other 26 EU leaders to impose compliance checks on the UK every three months during any extension, Alberto Nardello reports in a story for BuzzFeed.

    BuzzFeed News reported on Monday that the EU will expect the UK to meet “enhanced sincere cooperation” terms in an attempt to allay fears that if May’s successor is a hardline Brexiteer, they will be unable to disrupt the EU’s decision-making on budgets and other key issues. Brussels will reserve the right to end the extension period early, in agreement with the UK, in the event of non-compliance with this duty.

    But Macron will ask his European counterparts to go even further, the diplomatic sources explained.

    In addition to seeking a commitment from the UK that it will not disrupt the EU’s working, he wants the delay to be structured around quarterly checkpoints to confirm the extension, with the possibility of terminating early — in June or September — if the UK is found to not be respecting its commitments.

    Macron also wants to deny the UK the right to appoint a commissioner to the next European Commission.

    That almost makes me want to revoke and Remain, just to piss off the French.
    If we are members we appoint a commissioner. If he doesn't like it, offer us something. French twat
    Erm, look at it from the EU's perspective. They've negotiated a deal with the British government. The deal has been on the table for months. Having voted to leave, the UK is now not wanting to leave just yet. This would really mess up the EU's structures, especially as the UK claims still to want to leave, but not yet.

    If I were on the EU side, I too would be fed up at the idea that Britain should get both an extension and to upend the EU's institutions.
    Then deny an extension. All this 'let's punish Britain' idiocy will result in tears. Say no more delay, stay or go, but we aren't hanging about waiting. It's not rocket science but the EU are spineless
    Britain clearly is hanging around waiting.
    So they refuse an extension. But they are frit
    How was Brexit for you Grandad ?

    Well us remainers lost - but I retweeted some amusing tweets about the ERG..
    Or 'Us remainers won - AND I retweeted some amusing tweets about the ERG'.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842

    Scott_P said:
    It's at moments like this that you understand how Gavin Williamson became a Cabinet minister.
    Have the Tories run out of viable ministers yet ?

    5 posts or so to fill now is it
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,575

    Scott_P said:
    Swap Gibraltar for Ceuta and Melila and Norn for French Guiana.

    How do I vote to get Hong Kong back?
    Just accuse the PRC of reneging on the agreement to maintain democratic rule until 2047 and declare the return to Chinese rule invalid. Invade.
    Don't give Williamson ideas.
  • AndrewAndrew Posts: 2,900
    GIN1138 said:


    Remainers meeting Remainers to work out how to stop Brexit?


    Sensible remainers working out how to sensibly leave.

    Meanwhile loony ERGers are doing everything they can to block Brexit.
  • dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786
    edited April 2019

    Scott_P said:
    Swap Gibraltar for Ceuta and Melila and Norn for French Guiana.

    How do I vote to get Hong Kong back?
    Just accuse the PRC of reneging on the agreement to maintain democratic rule until 2047 and declare the return to Chinese rule invalid. Invade.

    Nice.
    Revoking Bruneis 1984 independence on the basis of their homophobia is also clearly required.
    We will have the map pink in no time
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 8,480
    edited April 2019
    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:
    Thanks - the use of Property Guardians is emerging as one of the real scandals of our time. The theory of providing cheap accommodation for key workers has been around for years and being able to quickly convert office blocks and unused public buildings into effectively dormitories for NHS workers to live nearer where they work isn't without merit but as always Government has simply allowed the private sector the latitude - insufficient regulation has as we always see led to exploitation.

    "Ms Smith is one of hundreds of residents placed at Terminus House" you mean she's in emergency/temporary accommodation. What does she expect, a penthouse suite? Some people FFS.
    She's been there fore a year...

    Presumably there are a shortage of places available.

    Presumably she needs to get a grip of her own destiny and leave. People are not spectators in their own lives. Learned helplessness behaviour. Much of which has now been shaken out of the system.
    If you are opposed to the idea of the state housing people I think you should come out and say it.

    I'm opposed to the state housing people except in emergency situations. No real problem with social housing through not for profits and housing associations. This is about learnt feebleness.

    "they've housed me somewhere really crap because i got evicted/ didnt pay the rent. I'm still here waiting for them lot to do something about it".
    You're all heart @notme2.

    I hope you never fall on hard times.
    Again, this isnt about hard times, its about learnt feebleness. There will be a series of interventions and assistance before she has got to this stage.
    A crlcial feebleness that has grown in Britain in the last 30 years is a feebleness of both empathy and community spirit. Assumptions of 'scroungers' and the weakness of community support networks are in fact connected.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,749
    Pulpstar said:

    Scott_P said:
    It's at moments like this that you understand how Gavin Williamson became a Cabinet minister.
    Have the Tories run out of viable ministers yet ?

    5 posts or so to fill now is it
    On the evidence they ran out of viable ministers some time ago.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,758

    Do the treaties allow the British to not send a Commissioner or do they have to appoint one and give him the newly-created shed portfolio?

    I am 99% sure if we are still members we will have to have a commissioner.

    Which is another good reason for them to not grant an extension.
  • notme2notme2 Posts: 1,006

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:
    Thanks - the use of Property Guardians is emerging as one of the real scandals of our time. The theory of providing cheap accommodation for key workers has been around for years and being able to quickly convert office blocks and unused public buildings into effectively dormitories for NHS workers to live nearer where they work isn't without merit but as always Government has simply allowed the private sector the latitude - insufficient regulation has as we always see led to exploitation.

    "Ms Smith is one of hundreds of residents placed at Terminus House" you mean she's in emergency/temporary accommodation. What does she expect, a penthouse suite? Some people FFS.
    She's been there fore a year...

    Presumably there are a shortage of places available.

    Presumably she needs to get a grip of her own destiny and leave. People are not spectators in their own lives. Learned helplessness behaviour. Much of which has now been shaken out of the system.
    If you are opposed to the idea of the state housing people I think you should come out and say it.

    I'm opposed to the state housing people except in emergency situations. No real problem with social housing through not for profits and housing associations. This is about learnt feebleness.

    "they've housed me somewhere really crap because i got evicted/ didnt pay the rent. I'm still here waiting for them lot to do something about it".
    You're all heart @notme2.

    I hope you never fall on hard times.
    Again, this isnt about hard times, its about learnt feebleness. There will be a series of interventions and assistance before she has got to this stage.
    A key feebleness that has grown in Britain in the last 30 years is a feebleness of both empathy and community spirit. Assumptions of 'scroungers' and the weakness of community support networks are in fact connected.
    Homelessness is substantially lower now than it was thirty years ago.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,281

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:
    Thanks - the use of Property Guardians is emerging as one of the real scandals of our time. The theory of providing cheap accommodation for key workers has been around for years and being able to quickly convert office blocks and unused public buildings into effectively dormitories for NHS workers to live nearer where they work isn't without merit but as always Government has simply allowed the private sector the latitude - insufficient regulation has as we always see led to exploitation.

    "Ms Smith is one of hundreds of residents placed at Terminus House" you mean she's in emergency/temporary accommodation. What does she expect, a penthouse suite? Some people FFS.
    She's been there fore a year...

    Presumably there are a shortage of places available.

    Presumably she needs to get a grip of her own destiny and leave. People are not spectators in their own lives. Learned helplessness behaviour. Much of which has now been shaken out of the system.
    If you are opposed to the idea of the state housing people I think you should come out and say it.

    I'm opposed to the state housing people except in emergency situations. No real problem with social housing through not for profits and housing associations. This is about learnt feebleness.

    "they've housed me somewhere really crap because i got evicted/ didnt pay the rent. I'm still here waiting for them lot to do something about it".
    You're all heart @notme2.

    I hope you never fall on hard times.
    Again, this isnt about hard times, its about learnt feebleness. There will be a series of interventions and assistance before she has got to this stage.
    An important feebleness that has grown in Britain in the last 30 years is a feebleness of both empathy and community spirit. Assumptions of 'scroungers' and the weakness of community support networks are in fact connected.
    @notme2's views are at the extreme right.

    No one condones benefit faudsters but in my experience most people acknowldge the state needs to help people in genuine need.
  • notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:
    Thanks - the use of Property Guardians is emerging as one of the real scandals of our time. The theory of providing cheap accommodation for key workers has been around for years and being able to quickly convert office blocks and unused public buildings into effectively dormitories for NHS workers to live nearer where they work isn't without merit but as always Government has simply allowed the private sector the latitude - insufficient regulation has as we always see led to exploitation.

    "Ms Smith is one of hundreds of residents placed at Terminus House" you mean she's in emergency/temporary accommodation. What does she expect, a penthouse suite? Some people FFS.
    She's been there fore a year...

    Presumably there are a shortage of places available.

    Presumably she needs to get a grip of her own destiny and leave. People are not spectators in their own lives. Learned helplessness behaviour. Much of which has now been shaken out of the system.
    If you are opposed to the idea of the state housing people I think you should come out and say it.

    I'm opposed to the state housing people except in emergency situations. No real problem with social housing through not for profits and housing associations. This is about learnt feebleness.

    "they've housed me somewhere really crap because i got evicted/ didnt pay the rent. I'm still here waiting for them lot to do something about it".
    You're all heart @notme2.

    I hope you never fall on hard times.
    Again, this isnt about hard times, its about learnt feebleness. There will be a series of interventions and assistance before she has got to this stage.
    A key feebleness that has grown in Britain in the last 30 years is a feebleness of both empathy and community spirit. Assumptions of 'scroungers' and the weakness of community support networks are in fact connected.
    Homelessness is substantially lower now than it was thirty years ago.
    Homelessness has been rising dramatically, all over the country in the last 2-3 years. I've seen it with my own eyes.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    "Britain split down the middle over preference for no deal or no Brexit, Telegraph poll reveals"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/04/08/exclusive-britons-split-middle-no-deal-no-brexit-telegraph-poll/
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,281
    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:
    Thanks - the use of Property Guardians is emerging as one of the real scandals of our time. The theory of providing cheap accommodation for key workers has been around for years and being able to quickly convert office blocks and unused public buildings into effectively dormitories for NHS workers to live nearer where they work isn't without merit but as always Government has simply allowed the private sector the latitude - insufficient regulation has as we always see led to exploitation.

    "Ms Smith is one of hundreds of residents placed at Terminus House" you mean she's in emergency/temporary accommodation. What does she expect, a penthouse suite? Some people FFS.
    She's been there fore a year...

    Presumably there are a shortage of places available.

    Presumably she needs to get a grip of her own destiny and leave. People are not spectators in their own lives. Learned helplessness behaviour. Much of which has now been shaken out of the system.
    If you are opposed to the idea of the state housing people I think you should come out and say it.

    I'm opposed to the state housing people except in emergency situations. No real problem with social housing through not for profits and housing associations. This is about learnt feebleness.

    "they've housed me somewhere really crap because i got evicted/ didnt pay the rent. I'm still here waiting for them lot to do something about it".
    You're all heart @notme2.

    I hope you never fall on hard times.
    Again, this isnt about hard times, its about learnt feebleness. There will be a series of interventions and assistance before she has got to this stage.
    A key feebleness that has grown in Britain in the last 30 years is a feebleness of both empathy and community spirit. Assumptions of 'scroungers' and the weakness of community support networks are in fact connected.
    Homelessness is substantially lower now than it was thirty years ago.
    ... so we should rein in the state and get homelessness back to 1980s levels?
  • dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:
    Thanks - the use of Property Guardians is emerging as one of the real scandals of our time. The theory of providing cheap accommodation for key workers has been around for years and being able to quickly convert office blocks and unused public buildings into effectively dormitories for NHS workers to live nearer where they work isn't without merit but as always Government has simply allowed the private sector the latitude - insufficient regulation has as we always see led to exploitation.

    "Ms Smith is one of hundreds of residents placed at Terminus House" you mean she's in emergency/temporary accommodation. What does she expect, a penthouse suite? Some people FFS.
    She's been there fore a year...

    Presumably there are a shortage of places available.

    Presumably she needs to get a grip of her own destiny and leave. People are not spectators in their own lives. Learned helplessness behaviour. Much of which has now been shaken out of the system.
    If you are opposed to the idea of the state housing people I think you should come out and say it.

    I'm opposed to the state housing people except in emergency situations. No real problem with social housing through not for profits and housing associations. This is about learnt feebleness.

    "they've housed me somewhere really crap because i got evicted/ didnt pay the rent. I'm still here waiting for them lot to do something about it".
    You're all heart @notme2.

    I hope you never fall on hard times.
    Again, this isnt about hard times, its about learnt feebleness. There will be a series of interventions and assistance before she has got to this stage.
    A crlcial feebleness that has grown in Britain in the last 30 years is a feebleness of both empathy and community spirit. Assumptions of 'scroungers' and the weakness of community support networks are in fact connected.
    It's insane, the benefit fraud cost is a tiny tiny fraction of corporate tax avoidance but it's easier to hate on the poor having the audacity to heat their homes and eat meat from farm animals rather than rats and the like
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408

    The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is adamant that Brexit cannot be delayed beyond December 2019, and will ask the other 26 EU leaders to impose compliance checks on the UK every three months during any extension, Alberto Nardello reports in a story for BuzzFeed.

    BuzzFeed News reported on Monday that the EU will expect the UK to meet “enhanced sincere cooperation” terms in an attempt to allay fears that if May’s successor is a hardline Brexiteer, they will be unable to disrupt the EU’s decision-making on budgets and other key issues. Brussels will reserve the right to end the extension period early, in agreement with the UK, in the event of non-compliance with this duty.

    But Macron will ask his European counterparts to go even further, the diplomatic sources explained.

    In addition to seeking a commitment from the UK that it will not disrupt the EU’s working, he wants the delay to be structured around quarterly checkpoints to confirm the extension, with the possibility of terminating early — in June or September — if the UK is found to not be respecting its commitments.

    Macron also wants to deny the UK the right to appoint a commissioner to the next European Commission.

    That almost makes me want to revoke and Remain, just to piss off the French.
    If we are members we appoint a commissioner. If he doesn't like it, offer us something. French twat
    Erm, look at it from the EU's perspective. They've negotiated a deal with the British government. The deal has been on the table for months. Having voted to leave, the UK is now not wanting to leave just yet. This would really mess up the EU's structures, especially as the UK claims still to want to leave, but not yet.

    If I were on the EU side, I too would be fed up at the idea that Britain should get both an extension and to upend the EU's institutions.
    Being fed up is understandable. But if we are in they have obligations too.
  • eristdooferistdoof Posts: 4,861

    IanB2 said:

    The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is adamant that Brexit cannot be delayed beyond December 2019, and will ask the other 26 EU leaders to impose compliance checks on the UK every three months during any extension, Alberto Nardello reports in a story for BuzzFeed.

    BuzzFeed News reported on Monday that the EU will expect the UK to meet “enhanced sincere cooperation” terms in an attempt to allay fears that if May’s successor is a hardline Brexiteer, they will be unable to disrupt the EU’s decision-making on budgets and other key issues. Brussels will reserve the right to end the extension period early, in agreement with the UK, in the event of non-compliance with this duty.

    But Macron will ask his European counterparts to go even further, the diplomatic sources explained.

    In addition to seeking a commitment from the UK that it will not disrupt the EU’s working, he wants the delay to be structured around quarterly checkpoints to confirm the extension, with the possibility of terminating early — in June or September — if the UK is found to not be respecting its commitments.

    Macron also wants to deny the UK the right to appoint a commissioner to the next European Commission.

    That almost makes me want to revoke and Remain, just to piss off the French.
    We knew you'd get there in the end. I can send you one of my spare flags if you like?
    I don’t do flags unless it has a Union Jack in it.
    So you "do" the Hawaiian flag then.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820

    Homelessness has been rising dramatically, all over the country in the last 2-3 years. I've seen it with my own eyes.

    Whilst not disagreeing with you, I wonder if you mean that you've seen an increase in rough sleeping in the last 2-3 years? Not the same thing as homelessness, and a very important distinction.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,281
    AndyJS said:

    "Britain split down the middle over preference for no deal or no Brexit, Telegraph poll reveals"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/04/08/exclusive-britons-split-middle-no-deal-no-brexit-telegraph-poll/

    Ha!

    38% No Deal - 40% Revoke is 'split down the middle'; 52% Leave - 48% Remain is 'the will of the people'.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408

    Pulpstar said:

    Scott_P said:
    It's at moments like this that you understand how Gavin Williamson became a Cabinet minister.
    Have the Tories run out of viable ministers yet ?

    5 posts or so to fill now is it
    On the evidence they ran out of viable ministers some time ago.
    As is often the case with these things if faced with such a difficulty the solution is to lower standards . Be afraid.
  • eristdooferistdoof Posts: 4,861
    TGOHF said:

    The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is adamant that Brexit cannot be delayed beyond December 2019, and will ask the other 26 EU leaders to impose compliance checks on the UK every three months during any extension, Alberto Nardello reports in a story for BuzzFeed.

    BuzzFeed News reported on Monday that the EU will expect the UK to meet “enhanced sincere cooperation” terms in an attempt to allay fears that if May’s successor is a hardline Brexiteer, they will be unable to disrupt the EU’s decision-making on budgets and other key issues. Brussels will reserve the right to end the extension period early, in agreement with the UK, in the event of non-compliance with this duty.

    But Macron will ask his European counterparts to go even further, the diplomatic sources explained.

    In addition to seeking a commitment from the UK that it will not disrupt the EU’s working, he wants the delay to be structured around quarterly checkpoints to confirm the extension, with the possibility of terminating early — in June or September — if the UK is found to not be respecting its commitments.

    Macron also wants to deny the UK the right to appoint a commissioner to the next European Commission.

    That almost makes me want to revoke and Remain, just to piss off the French.
    If we are members we appoint a commissioner. If he doesn't like it, offer us something. French twat
    Erm, look at it from the EU's perspective. They've negotiated a deal with the British government. The deal has been on the table for months. Having voted to leave, the UK is now not wanting to leave just yet. This would really mess up the EU's structures, especially as the UK claims still to want to leave, but not yet.

    If I were on the EU side, I too would be fed up at the idea that Britain should get both an extension and to upend the EU's institutions.
    Then deny an extension. All this 'let's punish Britain' idiocy will result in tears. Say no more delay, stay or go, but we aren't hanging about waiting. It's not rocket science but the EU are spineless
    Britain clearly is hanging around waiting.
    So they refuse an extension. But they are frit
    How was Brexit for you Grandad ?
    It left me no option but to give up my British Citizenship.
  • notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:
    Thanks - the use of Property Guardians is emerging as one of the real scandals of our time. The theory of providing cheap accommodation for key workers has been around for years and being able to quickly convert office blocks and unused public buildings into effectively dormitories for NHS workers to live nearer where they work isn't without merit but as always Government has simply allowed the private sector the latitude - insufficient regulation has as we always see led to exploitation.

    "Ms Smith is one of hundreds of residents placed at Terminus House" you mean she's in emergency/temporary accommodation. What does she expect, a penthouse suite? Some people FFS.
    She's been there fore a year...

    Presumably there are a shortage of places available.

    Presumably she needs to get a grip of her own destiny and leave. People are not spectators in their own lives. Learned helplessness behaviour. Much of which has now been shaken out of the system.
    If you are opposed to the idea of the state housing people I think you should come out and say it.

    I'm opposed to the state housing people except in emergency situations. No real problem with social housing through not for profits and housing associations. This is about learnt feebleness.

    "they've housed me somewhere really crap because i got evicted/ didnt pay the rent. I'm still here waiting for them lot to do something about it".
    You're all heart @notme2.

    I hope you never fall on hard times.
    Again, this isnt about hard times, its about learnt feebleness. There will be a series of interventions and assistance before she has got to this stage.
    A key feebleness that has grown in Britain in the last 30 years is a feebleness of both empathy and community spirit. Assumptions of 'scroungers' and the weakness of community support networks are in fact connected.
    Homelessness is substantially lower now than it was thirty years ago.
    Homelessness has been rising dramatically, all over the country in the last 2-3 years. I've seen it with my own eyes.
    It's unmissable, and for more than just 2 or 3 years.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,575
    Sean_F said:

    Pulpstar said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Scott_P said:
    Oh god! That's not "Two Brians - No Sense" Willets AND Matt Hancock in the same room together is it????

    #Disaster

    :D
    Willetts has probably done more for poisoning the Tories well with younger voters than anyone else.
    "I'm David Willetts and I'm here to help you" are words that will strike fear into the heart of any Conservative activist.
    And either bemusement or utter indifference elsewhere.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,765

    AndyJS said:

    "Britain split down the middle over preference for no deal or no Brexit, Telegraph poll reveals"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/04/08/exclusive-britons-split-middle-no-deal-no-brexit-telegraph-poll/

    Ha!

    38% No Deal - 40% Revoke is 'split down the middle'; 52% Leave - 48% Remain is 'the will of the people'.
    Looking at polls as a whole, that seems about right. If you force people to extremes, they break 50/50 Revoke./No Deal.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    Scott_P said:
    Yes, it's totally the cabinet preventing us from leaving the EU. If not for them parliament would totally take us out.
  • dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:
    Thanks - the use of Property Guardians is emerging as one of the real scandals of our time. The theory of providing cheap accommodation for key workers has been around for years and being able to quickly convert office blocks and unused public buildings into effectively dormitories for NHS workers to live nearer where they work isn't without merit but as always Government has simply allowed the private sector the latitude - insufficient regulation has as we always see led to exploitation.

    "Ms Smith is one of hundreds of residents placed at Terminus House" you mean she's in emergency/temporary accommodation. What does she expect, a penthouse suite? Some people FFS.
    She's been there fore a year...

    Presumably there are a shortage of places available.

    Presumably she needs to get a grip of her own destiny and leave. People are not spectators in their own lives. Learned helplessness behaviour. Much of which has now been shaken out of the system.
    If you are opposed to the idea of the state housing people I think you should come out and say it.

    I'm opposed to the state housing people except in emergency situations. No real problem with social housing through not for profits and housing associations. This is about learnt feebleness.

    "they've housed me somewhere really crap because i got evicted/ didnt pay the rent. I'm still here waiting for them lot to do something about it".
    You're all heart @notme2.

    I hope you never fall on hard times.
    Again, this isnt about hard times, its about learnt feebleness. There will be a series of interventions and assistance before she has got to this stage.
    A key feebleness that has grown in Britain in the last 30 years is a feebleness of both empathy and community spirit. Assumptions of 'scroungers' and the weakness of community support networks are in fact connected.
    Homelessness is substantially lower now than it was thirty years ago.
    Homelessness has been rising dramatically, all over the country in the last 2-3 years. I've seen it with my own eyes.
    It's unmissable, and for more than just 2 or 3 years.
    Yep. The numbers in Norwich city centre are on the up and up
  • notme2notme2 Posts: 1,006

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:
    Thanks - the use of Property Guardians is emerging as one of the real scandals of our time. The theory of providing cheap accommodation for key workers has been around for years and being able to quickly convert office blocks and unused public buildings into effectively dormitories for NHS workers to live nearer where they work isn't without merit but as always Government has simply allowed the private sector the latitude - insufficient regulation has as we always see led to exploitation.

    "Ms Smith is one of hundreds of residents placed at Terminus House" you mean she's in emergency/temporary accommodation. What does she expect, a penthouse suite? Some people FFS.
    She's been there fore a year...

    Presumably there are a shortage of places available.

    Presumably she needs to get a grip of her own destiny and leave. People are not spectators in their own lives. Learned helplessness behaviour. Much of which has now been shaken out of the system.
    If you are opposed to the idea of the state housing people I think you should come out and say it.

    I'm opposed to the state housing people except in emergency situations. No real problem with social housing through not for profits and housing associations. This is about learnt feebleness.

    "they've housed me somewhere really crap because i got evicted/ didnt pay the rent. I'm still here waiting for them lot to do something about it".
    You're all heart @notme2.

    I hope you never fall on hard times.
    Again, this isnt about hard times, its about learnt feebleness. There will be a series of interventions and assistance before she has got to this stage.
    A key feebleness that has grown in Britain in the last 30 years is a feebleness of both empathy and community spirit. Assumptions of 'scroungers' and the weakness of community support networks are in fact connected.
    Homelessness is substantially lower now than it was thirty years ago.
    Homelessness has been rising dramatically, all over the country in the last 2-3 years. I've seen it with my own eyes.
    and lower than at any point under labour before the crash.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,765
    kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    Yes, it's totally the cabinet preventing us from leaving the EU. If not for them parliament would totally take us out.
    An honest MP would deliver on his manifesto commitment.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 8,480
    edited April 2019
    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:
    Thanks - the use of Property Guardians is emerging as one of the real scandals of our time. The theory of providing cheap accommodation for key workers has been around for years and being able to quickly convert office blocks and unused public buildings into effectively dormitories for NHS workers to live nearer where they work isn't without merit but as always Government has simply allowed the private sector the latitude - insufficient regulation has as we always see led to exploitation.

    "Ms Smith is one of hundreds of residents placed at Terminus House" you mean she's in emergency/temporary accommodation. What does she expect, a penthouse suite? Some people FFS.
    She's been there fore a year...

    Presumably there are a shortage of places available.

    Presumably she needs to get a grip of her own destiny and leave. People are not spectators in their own lives. Learned helplessness behaviour. Much of which has now been shaken out of the system.
    If you are opposed to the idea of the state housing people I think you should come out and say it.

    I'm opposed to the state housing people except in emergency situations. No real problem with social housing through not for profits and housing associations. This is about learnt feebleness.

    "they've housed me somewhere really crap because i got evicted/ didnt pay the rent. I'm still here waiting for them lot to do something about it".
    You're all heart @notme2.

    I hope you never fall on hard times.
    Again, this isnt about hard times, its about learnt feebleness. There will be a series of interventions and assistance before she has got to this stage.
    A key feebleness that has grown in Britain in the last 30 years is a feebleness of both empathy and community spirit. Assumptions of 'scroungers' and the weakness of community support networks are in fact connected.
    Homelessness is substantially lower now than it was thirty years ago.
    Homelessness has been rising dramatically, all over the country in the last 2-3 years. I've seen it with my own eyes.
    and lower than at any point under labour before the crash.
    That's not my local experience, or many others'.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 30,846

    AndyJS said:

    "Britain split down the middle over preference for no deal or no Brexit, Telegraph poll reveals"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/04/08/exclusive-britons-split-middle-no-deal-no-brexit-telegraph-poll/

    Ha!

    38% No Deal - 40% Revoke is 'split down the middle'; 52% Leave - 48% Remain is 'the will of the people'.
    Polls are meaningless. We have known that for years now. All the more so when the decision is apparently so close.
  • notme2notme2 Posts: 1,006
    I absolutely guarantee she is still only in temporary accommodation because she has repeatedly refused offers of rehousing, and is holding out for a nice flat somewhere, not the equiv of what she had. Though it sounds very shoddy to house her where she couldnt use a bathroom.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,281
    edited April 2019
    Sean_F said:

    AndyJS said:

    "Britain split down the middle over preference for no deal or no Brexit, Telegraph poll reveals"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/04/08/exclusive-britons-split-middle-no-deal-no-brexit-telegraph-poll/

    Ha!

    38% No Deal - 40% Revoke is 'split down the middle'; 52% Leave - 48% Remain is 'the will of the people'.
    Looking at polls as a whole, that seems about right. If you force people to extremes, they break 50/50 Revoke./No Deal.
    Indeed. This, even as a Remainer, is why I supported May's deal as the best compromise for a split country. But the ERG and DUP pissed that chance down the toilet.

    So now we will inevitably irritate up to 50%* of the population... and I suspect that will be the Leavers.

    The only way out that avoids a long and damaging split is a PV on May's deal versus Remain, which I think May's Deal would win. Leavers spouting on about how the masses will rise should take their chance, prove their judgement, and campaign for a PV.

    (*Up to because in all honesty I doubt more than 10-20% are much bothered either way.)
  • notme2notme2 Posts: 1,006

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    notme2 said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:
    Thanks - the use of Property Guardians is emerging as one of the real scandals of our time. Thsee led to exploitation.

    "Ms Smith is one of hundreds of residents placed at Terminus House" you mean she's in emergency/temporary accommodation. What does she expect, a penthouse suite? Some people FFS.
    She's been there fore a year...

    Presumably there are a shortage of places available.

    Presumably she needs to get a grip of her own destiny and leave. People are not spectators in their own lives. Learned helplessness behaviour. Much of which has now been shaken out of the system.
    If you are opposed to the idea of the state housing people I think you should come out and say it.

    I'm opposed to the state housing people except in emergency situations. No real problem with social housing through not for profits and housing associations. This is about learnt feebleness.

    "they've housed me somewhere really crap because i got evicted/ didnt pay the rent. I'm still here waiting for them lot to do something about it".
    You're all heart @notme2.

    I hope you never fall on hard times.
    Again, this isnt about hard times, its about learnt feebleness. There will be a series of interventions and assistance before she has got to this stage.
    A key feebleness that has grown in Britain in the last 30 years is a feebleness of both empathy and community spirit. Assumptions of 'scroungers' and the weakness of community support networks are in fact connected.
    Homelessness is substantially lower now than it was thirty years ago.
    Homelessness has been rising dramatically, all over the country in the last 2-3 years. I've seen it with my own eyes.
    It's unmissable, and for more than just 2 or 3 years.
    Yep. The numbers in Norwich city centre are on the up and up
    30 rough sleeping is a lot. There will be a complex set of reasons, possible ineligibility (code word for foreigners who should be deported), councils are now much much better then they were in preventing homelessness. It is not a service that has been reduced over the last decade.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 4,502
    I think the sad conclusion to all this is that a section of MPs are utterly deranged and are being followed like sheep by a section of the public who are equally deranged .

  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 50,772
    The official figures on homelessness don't show any surge at all: https://www.homeless.org.uk/facts/homelessness-in-numbers/statutory-homelessness

    Overall applications are down slightly over the last 5 years, accepted applications are up slightly. It is a disappointingly static picture given addressing this was supposed to be a priority but a surge it isn't.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,281
    notme2 said:

    I absolutely guarantee she is still only in temporary accommodation because she has repeatedly refused offers of rehousing, and is holding out for a nice flat somewhere, not the equiv of what she had. Though it sounds very shoddy to house her where she couldnt use a bathroom.
    Her fault for choosing to be disabled, maybe??
  • notme2notme2 Posts: 1,006

    Homelessness has been rising dramatically, all over the country in the last 2-3 years. I've seen it with my own eyes.

    Whilst not disagreeing with you, I wonder if you mean that you've seen an increase in rough sleeping in the last 2-3 years? Not the same thing as homelessness, and a very important distinction.
    Quite. rough sleeping is a subset of homelessness and the increase is largely non British people. Not sure what the solution is.
This discussion has been closed.