> @Sunil_Prasannan said: > On putting "boll" into a google search "bollocks to brexit" comes up first in the suggested searches ahead of various bollywood searches and a bollinger > > No, "Bollywood news" comes up first, "Bollocks to Brexit" only 5th!
Google will order based on what it knows about you, which is probably a frighteningly large amount. Perhaps you have previously shown more interest in Bollywood than in Brexit? For me "Bollocks to Brexit" comes up first, ahead of Bollywood, but then Google presumably knows I am a militant Remainer.
I voted Brexit Party in the Eastern region today. The Conservatives were stated as "conservative and Unionist" which had a nice retro feel. Presume it is the same across the UK and intended to keep the single Blue MEP north of the border.
Tye Chanhe UK box looked very empty and spoke volumes about their level of competence. Hilarious that these so superior politicians like Soubs and Chukka are so flaming useless at running a party.🤣
But... you're a canvasser for the Conservative party!
> Credit where it is due, the Lib Dems are crushing CHUKa's TIGgers on the remain side of the great Brexit debate.
>
> What on earth are Chukas mob playing at? It was always a strange idea to think that standing on a platform of keeping all the things the public dislike from the first 16 years of the century and calling it ‘Change’ was going to work, but not putting up candidates in two by elections since they formed is totally bizarre.
>
> Soubry booed from start to finish on QT last night, preaching being civil while branding Farage racist, some change.
>
> If I didn’t dislike them so much I’d feel sorry for them
Perhaps you didn't notice Farage's boorishness? I suspect most TV viewers did.
I thought Farage was extremely poor. I tuned in specifically to see him. I don't like his views but he is usually entertaining. The biggest turn off was that he was clearly very much on message and looking to create soundbites, and so didn't even want to talk about anything other than Brexit.
"The EU has already said that if Britain left without the current WA, the same issues: money, NI and citizens would be the same as under the WA i.e. we take what they offer or nothing."
Well the argument is, surely, that in such a situation with no time limit to the negotiation and if the UK had already taken the hit of being suddenly out in the cold and was recovering, the EU would be in a weaker position.
You're very certain that that's complete rubbish, and fair enough. I still don't see deceit in the argument though, which was the claim you originally made that I contested.
I'm also not convinced in the slightest that stupidity and ignorance reside on only one side. I also feel that anger is a confounding emotion, and when driving one's expression it reduces the force of one's argument. I enjoy your comments (and headers) less when I can sense the rage.
> @viewcode said: > I voted Brexit Party in the Eastern region today. The Conservatives were stated as "conservative and Unionist" which had a nice retro feel. Presume it is the same across the UK and intended to keep the single Blue MEP north of the border. > > > > Tye Chanhe UK box looked very empty and spoke volumes about their level of competence. Hilarious that these so superior politicians like Soubs and Chukka are so flaming useless at running a party.🤣 > > But... you're a canvasser for the Conservative party!
> @OnlyLivingBoy said: > > @Sunil_Prasannan said: > > On putting "boll" into a google search "bollocks to brexit" comes up first in the suggested searches ahead of various bollywood searches and a bollinger > > > > No, "Bollywood news" comes up first, "Bollocks to Brexit" only 5th! > > Google will order based on what it knows about you, which is probably a frighteningly large amount. Perhaps you have previously shown more interest in Bollywood than in Brexit? For me "Bollocks to Brexit" comes up first, ahead of Bollywood, but then Google presumably knows I am a militant Remainer.
I get bollocks ahead of Bollywood. However top of the list is a PB thread. Clearly we all talk a load of bollocks.
> Credit where it is due, the Lib Dems are crushing CHUKa's TIGgers on the remain side of the great Brexit debate.
>
> What on earth are Chukas mob playing at? It was always a strange idea to think that standing on a platform of keeping all the things the public dislike from the first 16 years of the century and calling it ‘Change’ was going to work, but not putting up candidates in two by elections since they formed is totally bizarre.
>
> Soubry booed from start to finish on QT last night, preaching being civil while branding Farage racist, some change.
>
> If I didn’t dislike them so much I’d feel sorry for them
Perhaps you didn't notice Farage's boorishness? I suspect most TV viewers did.
I thought Farage was extremely poor. I tuned in specifically to see him. I don't like his views but he is usually entertaining. The biggest turn off was that he was clearly very much on message and looking to create soundbites, and so didn't even want to talk about anything other than Brexit.
Given that he is leading a party called the “Brexit Party” for the upcoming EU elections , why on earth would he talk about anything other than Brexit?
This is the moment a climate change protester tried to superglue himself to the doors of City Hall - but was stumped because they kept opening before he could get there.
University research fellow Dr Larch Maxey tried several times to approach the automatic doors of the headquarters of Bristol City Council, after covering his hands with superglue, but gave up when he couldn’t get to the doors fast enough before they opened.
> @RightChuck said: > @Cyclefree > > "The EU has already said that if Britain left without the current WA, the same issues: money, NI and citizens would be the same as under the WA i.e. we take what they offer or nothing." > > Well the argument is, surely, that in such a situation with no time limit to the negotiation and if the UK had already taken the hit of being suddenly out in the cold and was recovering, the EU would be in a weaker position. > > You're very certain that that's complete rubbish, and fair enough. I still don't see deceit in the argument though, which was the claim you originally made that I contested. > > I'm also not convinced in the slightest that stupidity and ignorance reside on only one side. I also feel that anger is a confounding emotion, and when driving one's expression it reduces the force of one's argument. I enjoy your comments (and headers) less when I can sense the rage. > > Gtg. Have a good day.
> Credit where it is due, the Lib Dems are crushing CHUKa's TIGgers on the remain side of the great Brexit debate.
>
> What on earth are Chukas mob playing at? It was always a strange idea to think that standing on a platform of keeping all the things the public dislike from the first 16 years of the century and calling it ‘Change’ was going to work, but not putting up candidates in two by elections since they formed is totally bizarre.
>
> Soubry booed from start to finish on QT last night, preaching being civil while branding Farage racist, some change.
>
> If I didn’t dislike them so much I’d feel sorry for them
Perhaps you didn't notice Farage's boorishness? I suspect most TV viewers did.
I thought Farage was extremely poor. I tuned in specifically to see him. I don't like his views but he is usually entertaining. The biggest turn off was that he was clearly very much on message and looking to create soundbites, and so didn't even want to talk about anything other than Brexit.
Given that he is leading a party called the “Brexit Party” for the upcoming EU elections , why on earth would he talk about anything other than Brexit?
I get the tactics. But I think it was a mistake. People warm to Farage because you can't predict what he is going to say, he has an answer to everything and seems sincere. He didn't do any of that last night.
*When I say people I mean me. But I am a person, so it seems a fair inference.
> Credit where it is due, the Lib Dems are crushing CHUKa's TIGgers on the remain side of the great Brexit debate.
>
> What on earth are Chukas mob playing at? It was always a strange idea to think that standing on a platform of keeping all the things the public dislike from the first 16 years of the century and calling it ‘Change’ was going to work, but not putting up candidates in two by elections since they formed is totally bizarre.
>
> Soubry booed from start to finish on QT last night, preaching being civil while branding Farage racist, some change.
>
> If I didn’t dislike them so much I’d feel sorry for them
Perhaps you didn't notice Farage's boorishness? I suspect most TV viewers did.
I thought Farage was extremely poor. I tuned in specifically to see him. I don't like his views but he is usually entertaining. The biggest turn off was that he was clearly very much on message and looking to create soundbites, and so didn't even want to talk about anything other than Brexit.
> @RobD said: > > @isam said: > > > Credit where it is due, the Lib Dems are crushing CHUKa's TIGgers on the remain side of the great Brexit debate. > > > > > > What on earth are Chukas mob playing at? It was always a strange idea to think that standing on a platform of keeping all the things the public dislike from the first 16 years of the century and calling it ‘Change’ was going to work, but not putting up candidates in two by elections since they formed is totally bizarre. > > > > > > Soubry booed from start to finish on QT last night, preaching being civil while branding Farage racist, some change. > > > > > > If I didn’t dislike them so much I’d feel sorry for them > > > > Perhaps you didn't notice Farage's boorishness? I suspect most TV viewers did. > > I thought Farage was extremely poor. I tuned in specifically to see him. I don't like his views but he is usually entertaining. The biggest turn off was that he was clearly very much on message and looking to create soundbites, and so didn't even want to talk about anything other than Brexit. > > Given that he is leading a party called the “Brexit Party” for the upcoming EU elections , why on earth would he talk about anything other than Brexit?
By that logic Change UK should be trumpeting their success in persuading Hammond to retain the 1p and 2p coins.
This is the moment a climate change protester tried to superglue himself to the doors of City Hall - but was stumped because they kept opening before he could get there.
University research fellow Dr Larch Maxey tried several times to approach the automatic doors of the headquarters of Bristol City Council, after covering his hands with superglue, but gave up when he couldn’t get to the doors fast enough before they opened.
Safe > 3% above cut off Marginal (win) < 3% above cut off Miss out: between 6% and cut off (is approx 3% below) No hope: less than 6%
Lab candidate 1: safe in all 4 polls Brexit 1: 4 x safe Lab 2: 4 safe Con 1: 3 safe, 1 marginal CUK1: 3 safe, 1 no hope (very fishy that NOBODY in 144 people named CUK in the Opinium Gina Miller poll) LD1: 2 safe, 2 marginal Brex2: 3 marginal, 1 miss out Green: 2 marginal, 2 miss out Lab3: 2 marginal, 2 miss out Con2: 1 marginal, 2 miss out, 1 no hope LD2: 1 marginal, 3 no hope Lab4: 4 miss out CUK2: 3 miss out, 1 no hope
Two of the polls return 2 Remain candidates with Green missing out, two polls return 3 Remains.
In each of the polls returning 2 Remainers extra Green votes are the lowest swing way to convert the third Remainer and remove either Brex2 or Con2
In each of the polls returning 3 Remainers, extra LD tactical voting is a low swing way of letting in Lab3 in place of Green, but would take a large swing to convert an extra LD.
Thus I am set against 'tactical' voting between Remain parties in London, but if you are genuinely eenie-meenie about it, the Greens look a little more in need.
> @RobD said: > This is the moment a climate change protester tried to superglue himself to the doors of City Hall - but was stumped because they kept opening before he could get there. > > > > University research fellow Dr Larch Maxey tried several times to approach the automatic doors of the headquarters of Bristol City Council, after covering his hands with superglue, but gave up when he couldn’t get to the doors fast enough before they opened. > > > > https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/news/bristol-news/moment-activist-tried-superglue-himself-2850010.amp > > > > Kids at the university of plymouth should ask for a discount if this is the calibre of individual they employ. > > Just cordon off the area and use another entrance. Or are they relying on the police to release them?
I would have thought it would be better if it stuck and all that happened as he was sent back and forth as people acitvated the door.
> @Cyclefree said: > > @RightChuck said: > > @Cyclefree > > > > "The EU has already said that if Britain left without the current WA, the same issues: money, NI and citizens would be the same as under the WA i.e. we take what they offer or nothing." > > > > Well the argument is, surely, that in such a situation with no time limit to the negotiation and if the UK had already taken the hit of being suddenly out in the cold and was recovering, the EU would be in a weaker position. > > > > You're very certain that that's complete rubbish, and fair enough. I still don't see deceit in the argument though, which was the claim you originally made that I contested. > > > > I'm also not convinced in the slightest that stupidity and ignorance reside on only one side. I also feel that anger is a confounding emotion, and when driving one's expression it reduces the force of one's argument. I enjoy your comments (and headers) less when I can sense the rage. > > > > Gtg. Have a good day. > >
Something up with Vanilla.
Agree: stupidity and ignorance reside all over the place.
I tend to think that the whole process since June 2016 has been a process of Britain slowly realising that it does not have a strong hand at all and people raging at this.
There is no positive argument being made - either for Brexit or for Remaining. It is now all about damage limitation.
And we still have no sensible or indeed any European strategy.
Labour weighs up delisting UK firms if they fail to fight climate change
UK companies failing to tackle climate change would be delisted from the London Stock Exchange under radical plans for greening the economy being drawn up by Labour.
John McDonnell, the shadow chancellor, said he would consider changing the law if necessary to force UK-listed firms to take adequate steps to fight the “climate emergency” facing the planet
> > Credit where it is due, the Lib Dems are crushing CHUKa's TIGgers on the remain side of the great Brexit debate.
>
> >
>
> > What on earth are Chukas mob playing at? It was always a strange idea to think that standing on a platform of keeping all the things the public dislike from the first 16 years of the century and calling it ‘Change’ was going to work, but not putting up candidates in two by elections since they formed is totally bizarre.
>
> >
>
> > Soubry booed from start to finish on QT last night, preaching being civil while branding Farage racist, some change.
>
> >
>
> > If I didn’t dislike them so much I’d feel sorry for them
>
>
>
> Perhaps you didn't notice Farage's boorishness? I suspect most TV viewers did.
>
> I thought Farage was extremely poor. I tuned in specifically to see him. I don't like his views but he is usually entertaining. The biggest turn off was that he was clearly very much on message and looking to create soundbites, and so didn't even want to talk about anything other than Brexit.
>
> Given that he is leading a party called the “Brexit Party” for the upcoming EU elections , why on earth would he talk about anything other than Brexit?
By that logic Change UK should be trumpeting their success in persuading Hammond to retain the 1p and 2p coins.
> @SandyRentool said: > > @OnlyLivingBoy said: > > > @Sunil_Prasannan said: > > > On putting "boll" into a google search "bollocks to brexit" comes up first in the suggested searches ahead of various bollywood searches and a bollinger > > > > > > No, "Bollywood news" comes up first, "Bollocks to Brexit" only 5th! > > > > Google will order based on what it knows about you, which is probably a frighteningly large amount. Perhaps you have previously shown more interest in Bollywood than in Brexit? For me "Bollocks to Brexit" comes up first, ahead of Bollywood, but then Google presumably knows I am a militant Remainer. > > I get bollocks ahead of Bollywood. However top of the list is a PB thread. Clearly we all talk a load of bollocks.
> @logical_song said: > > @SandyRentool said: > > > @OnlyLivingBoy said: > > > > @Sunil_Prasannan said: > > > > On putting "boll" into a google search "bollocks to brexit" comes up first in the suggested searches ahead of various bollywood searches and a bollinger > > > > > > > > No, "Bollywood news" comes up first, "Bollocks to Brexit" only 5th! > > > > > > Google will order based on what it knows about you, which is probably a frighteningly large amount. Perhaps you have previously shown more interest in Bollywood than in Brexit? For me "Bollocks to Brexit" comes up first, ahead of Bollywood, but then Google presumably knows I am a militant Remainer. > > > > I get bollocks ahead of Bollywood. However top of the list is a PB thread. Clearly we all talk a load of bollocks. > > Comes No 1 for me. > https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/staggers/2019/05/why-liberal-democrats-bollocks-brexit-slogan-stroke-genius
I get info on some table tennis player called tim boll...one of the few sports i have bugger all interest in.
> @Theuniondivvie said: > > @viewcode said: > > I voted Brexit Party in the Eastern region today. The Conservatives were stated as "conservative and Unionist" which had a nice retro feel. Presume it is the same across the UK and intended to keep the single Blue MEP north of the border. > > > > > > > > Tye Chanhe UK box looked very empty and spoke volumes about their level of competence. Hilarious that these so superior politicians like Soubs and Chukka are so flaming useless at running a party.🤣 > > > > But... you're a canvasser for the Conservative party! > > Concanvasser con.
EX canvasser I'm afraid under the current regime. This is worse than Major bu some distance. I would change the moniker to reflect that if I knew how!
I certainly hope not to have "conned" anyone Divie. Just being straight. Straw in the wind but I have 4 'political' friends who I have a pint with regularly who are solid Tories (3 Leave 1 Remain). 3 are voting Brexit Party.
> @Concanvasser said: > EX canvasser I'm afraid under the current regime. This is worse than Major bu some distance. I would change the moniker to reflect that if I knew how! > > I certainly hope not to have "conned" anyone Divie. Just being straight. Straw in the wind but I have 4 'political' friends who I have a pint with regularly who are solid Tories (3 Leave 1 Remain). 3 are voting Brexit Party.
1. I am really pissed off (apparently this sort of language is ok now) that we have not yet left the EU. Although there is plenty of blame to go around I think May has to take the lion's share because she is, however notionally, in charge. I am not minded to vote for her or her party in light of this major incompetence and failure.
2. I have always accepted that the relatively close nature of the vote plus traditional British pragmatism meant that we we should have a relatively soft Brexit with a continuing close trading relationship with the EU and several areas of bilateral cooperation. In my view May's deal achieves as much of this as can be done at the moment since the EU refused to talk about a lot of things until we had actually left. In short I support her deal.
3. This (along with a long list of other things tbh) gives me a problem with the Brexit Party because they don't support the deal. Voting for them is voting for a no deal Brexit. See 2.
It is the failure of 1. that is requiring these elections to take place at all. I frankly think the Tories should be punished for that and have little doubt that they will be. Bigly. Most of that punishment is going to come as a reward for the Brexit party. Although that gives a clear message it is not a message I actually agree with. I am torn between voting Tory to support the deal and not voting at all in protest. I don't have anyone in this election, which I did not want, that I actively want to vote for.
> @DavidL said: > So here's the state of play at L Towers.
I think a good way to ensure that May's deal is eventually signed (because it's probably as good as it gets) is to vote for the Brexit party. A big margin for the Brexit party will send a pretty strong message to those in Westminster. That, and the arrow....
> @DavidL said: > > 2. I have always accepted that the relatively close nature of the vote plus traditional British pragmatism meant that we we should have a relatively soft Brexit with a continuing close trading relationship with the EU and several areas of bilateral cooperation. > > I don't have anyone in this election, which I did not want, that I actively want to vote for.
It sounds like you should vote Labour to support a job-first Brexit with a strong single market deal.
> @RobD said: > > @DavidL said: > > So here's the state of play at L Towers. > > > I think a good way to ensure that May's deal is eventually signed (because it's probably as good as it gets) is to vote for the Brexit party. A big margin for the Brexit party will send a pretty strong message to those in Westminster. That, and the arrow....
Surely a vote for the Tories would be better if you want Mrs May's deal. A vote for BP will encourage the ERG to continues blocking it.
> @logical_song said: > > @RobD said: > > > @DavidL said: > > > So here's the state of play at L Towers. > > > > > > I think a good way to ensure that May's deal is eventually signed (because it's probably as good as it gets) is to vote for the Brexit party. A big margin for the Brexit party will send a pretty strong message to those in Westminster. That, and the arrow.... > > Surely a vote for the Tories would be better if you want Mrs May's deal. A vote for BP will encourage the ERG to continues blocking it.
I'm resigned to the fact that there will always be ERG holdouts. It needs Labour MPs to pass at this point.
> @Nigelb said: > Trump and Farage are both libertarians, which is the opposite of fascism. > > Libertarians don't generally impose massive tariffs, or appoint judges who are in favour of banning abortion. > > Though Trump is in favour of at least one individual being free from any legal constraints, I suppose....
Nor are they usually in favour of restrictive government controls on immigration.
Perhaps Farage & Trump are libertarians in the way Carl Benjamin is a classical liberal.
> @DavidL said: > So here's the state of play at L Towers. > > 1. I am really pissed off (apparently this sort of language is ok now) that we have not yet left the EU. Although there is plenty of blame to go around I think May has to take the lion's share because she is, however notionally, in charge. I am not minded to vote for her or her party in light of this major incompetence and failure. > > 2. I have always accepted that the relatively close nature of the vote plus traditional British pragmatism meant that we we should have a relatively soft Brexit with a continuing close trading relationship with the EU and several areas of bilateral cooperation. In my view May's deal achieves as much of this as can be done at the moment since the EU refused to talk about a lot of things until we had actually left. In short I support her deal. > > 3. This (along with a long list of other things tbh) gives me a problem with the Brexit Party because they don't support the deal. Voting for them is voting for a no deal Brexit. See 2. > > It is the failure of 1. that is requiring these elections to take place at all. I frankly think the Tories should be punished for that and have little doubt that they will be. Bigly. Most of that punishment is going to come as a reward for the Brexit party. Although that gives a clear message it is not a message I actually agree with. I am torn between voting Tory to support the deal and not voting at all in protest. I don't have anyone in this election, which I did not want, that I actively want to vote for.
> @williamglenn said: > > @DavidL said: > > > > 2. I have always accepted that the relatively close nature of the vote plus traditional British pragmatism meant that we we should have a relatively soft Brexit with a continuing close trading relationship with the EU and several areas of bilateral cooperation. > > > > I don't have anyone in this election, which I did not want, that I actively want to vote for. > > It sounds like you should vote Labour to support a job-first Brexit with a strong single market deal.
William, I really cannot work out what Labour's position is from day to day but at the moment they seem to be having a dalliance with the PV hypocrisy which would in my view be absolutely disastrous for our country. So no.
I think a Customs Union is a stupid idea which will not be in our long term interests but if that is what it takes to get Brexit over the line I could live with that.
> @RobD said: > > @DavidL said: > > So here's the state of play at L Towers. > > > I think a good way to ensure that May's deal is eventually signed (because it's probably as good as it gets) is to vote for the Brexit party. A big margin for the Brexit party will send a pretty strong message to those in Westminster. That, and the arrow....
But that message will be (I expect them to win) that May's deal should be rejected and we should go for a no deal. How does May's deal continue on life support if the Tories get <10% of the vote?
> @DavidL said: > So here's the state of play at L Towers. > > 1. I am really pissed off (apparently this sort of language is ok now) that we have not yet left the EU. Although there is plenty of blame to go around I think May has to take the lion's share because she is, however notionally, in charge. I am not minded to vote for her or her party in light of this major incompetence and failure. > > 2. I have always accepted that the relatively close nature of the vote plus traditional British pragmatism meant that we we should have a relatively soft Brexit with a continuing close trading relationship with the EU and several areas of bilateral cooperation. In my view May's deal achieves as much of this as can be done at the moment since the EU refused to talk about a lot of things until we had actually left. In short I support her deal. > > 3. This (along with a long list of other things tbh) gives me a problem with the Brexit Party because they don't support the deal. Voting for them is voting for a no deal Brexit. See 2. > > It is the failure of 1. that is requiring these elections to take place at all. I frankly think the Tories should be punished for that and have little doubt that they will be. Bigly. Most of that punishment is going to come as a reward for the Brexit party. Although that gives a clear message it is not a message I actually agree with. I am torn between voting Tory to support the deal and not voting at all in protest. I don't have anyone in this election, which I did not want, that I actively want to vote for.
> @rottenborough said: > Not bothered reading the story, but what a headline: > > Telegraph: "How a 10-day fast at a gut health clinic convinced me to end my marriage"
I remember when the telegraph was a serious newspaper.
> @Theuniondivvie said: > > @DavidL said: > > So here's the state of play at L Towers. > > > > 1. I am really pissed off (apparently this sort of language is ok now) that we have not yet left the EU. Although there is plenty of blame to go around I think May has to take the lion's share because she is, however notionally, in charge. I am not minded to vote for her or her party in light of this major incompetence and failure. > > > > 2. I have always accepted that the relatively close nature of the vote plus traditional British pragmatism meant that we we should have a relatively soft Brexit with a continuing close trading relationship with the EU and several areas of bilateral cooperation. In my view May's deal achieves as much of this as can be done at the moment since the EU refused to talk about a lot of things until we had actually left. In short I support her deal. > > > > 3. This (along with a long list of other things tbh) gives me a problem with the Brexit Party because they don't support the deal. Voting for them is voting for a no deal Brexit. See 2. > > > > It is the failure of 1. that is requiring these elections to take place at all. I frankly think the Tories should be punished for that and have little doubt that they will be. Bigly. Most of that punishment is going to come as a reward for the Brexit party. Although that gives a clear message it is not a message I actually agree with. I am torn between voting Tory to support the deal and not voting at all in protest. I don't have anyone in this election, which I did not want, that I actively want to vote for. > > Vote Willie, give in to your vestigial SDP urges.
I think not, even although Fred McIntosh, number 2 on their list, is a friend of mine and a jolly decent chap.
Trump and Farage are both libertarians, which is the opposite of fascism.
Libertarians don't generally impose massive tariffs, or appoint judges who are in favour of banning abortion.
Though Trump is in favour of at least one individual being free from any legal constraints, I suppose....
Perfectly possible and sensible for a libertarian to oppose abortion generally as an interference with the autonomy of a person as yet unborn, therefore requiring particular protection. It all depends on your understanding of the nature of a person, which neither science nor religion can definitively resolve. But an abortion averse libertarian approach is by no means irrational. It isn't common or popular - but neither is libertarianism.
> 1. I am really pissed off (apparently this sort of language is ok now) that we have not yet left the EU. Although there is plenty of blame to go around I think May has to take the lion's share because she is, however notionally, in charge. I am not minded to vote for her or her party in light of this major incompetence and failure.
>
> 2. I have always accepted that the relatively close nature of the vote plus traditional British pragmatism meant that we we should have a relatively soft Brexit with a continuing close trading relationship with the EU and several areas of bilateral cooperation. In my view May's deal achieves as much of this as can be done at the moment since the EU refused to talk about a lot of things until we had actually left. In short I support her deal.
>
> 3. This (along with a long list of other things tbh) gives me a problem with the Brexit Party because they don't support the deal. Voting for them is voting for a no deal Brexit. See 2.
>
> It is the failure of 1. that is requiring these elections to take place at all. I frankly think the Tories should be punished for that and have little doubt that they will be. Bigly. Most of that punishment is going to come as a reward for the Brexit party. Although that gives a clear message it is not a message I actually agree with. I am torn between voting Tory to support the deal and not voting at all in protest. I don't have anyone in this election, which I did not want, that I actively want to vote for.
Labour?
Labour would make some sort of sense, as their attitude to Brexit is every bit as confused as David appears to be about whom to vote for.
It’s hard to overstate the bad blood created by the rancorous 2016 fight. Clinton barely edged out Sanders by three-tenths of a percentage point, 49.9 percent to 49.6 percent, on caucus night, leading to a subsequent round of county and district conventions that, in many cases, devolved into shouting matches between the Clinton and Sanders factions. A fist fight broke out in one county; in another, activists dug through trash cans to make sure evidence of their turnout weren’t destroyed.
“It was just hell,” said Bagniewski, who was not yet county chair in 2016, describing the convention he attended. “Worst day of my life.”
Party leaders say the Clinton-Sanders divisions ran so deep, it depressed the Democratic general election turnout in Iowa, contributing to Trump’s 10-point romp after Barack Obama twice carried the state.
“To get the reputation that you’re helping serve this up to Trump again – it’s a deathwish,” Bagniewski said....
Similar to when professional psychologists were diagnosing him with mental disorders without actually interacting with him personally. Very unprofessional.
Well I'm not getting paid TBF.
Observed symptoms -
Bombastic in the extreme. Sees himself as the answer to all problems. Demands personal loyalty uber alles. Openly frustrated with checks & balances. Loves to deal direct with other 'Strongmen'. Fetishizes 'winning'. Tries to keep power in the family.
It's enough to make the Trump 'wannabe fascist' diagnosis IMO.
And I didn't even bother mentioning some of the more minor but nevertheless telling things such as his penchant for dressing up in military uniform and marching around the West Wing making oddly disturbing noises.
All those getting excited about the LD slogan on Brexit have obviously never travelled on a train to and from Waterloo where a couple of companies (one is Pimlico Plumbers) have for many months had billboards proclaiming:
"Bollocks to Brexit; It's not a Done Deal".
Those getting a fit of the vapours over the language obviously never owned a Sex Pistols album and I suspect anyone who claims the language is going to put them off voting LD weren't going to vote LD anyway.
As others have said, it puts the Party in the game in campaigning terms and morale was given a huge boost by last week's local election results.
I don't photograph well, although it tends to be in a more 'he looks like a murderer' than 'he looks awkward' sort of way, so I feel some sympathy for Hancock. But he trips the lightweight-o-meter.
Mind you, so did Burnham. I was right, of course, but he'd still be miles better than the incumbent.
But that message will be (I expect them to win) that May's deal should be rejected and we should go for a no deal. How does May's deal continue on life support if the Tories get <10% of the vote?
HYUFD is of the view Labour MPs in LEAVE constituencies will panic if the BP does well and run off to support the WA to get Brexit over the line in the hoping of denting support for Farage.
Maybe - it's the only route I can see to get the WA passed from where we are. No WA equals no Brexit equals May remains in Downing Street.
All those getting excited about the LD slogan on Brexit have obviously never travelled on a train to and from Waterloo where a couple of companies (one is Pimlico Plumbers) have for many months had billboards proclaiming:
"Bollocks to Brexit; It's not a Done Deal".
Those getting a fit of the vapours over the language obviously never owned a Sex Pistols album and I suspect anyone who claims the language is going to put them off voting LD weren't going to vote LD anyway.
As others have said, it puts the Party in the game in campaigning terms and morale was given a huge boost by last week's local election results.
I think we expect different things from Political Parties than bands who were the 1976 equivalent of the UKIP rape joke candidate
> @FrancisUrquhart said: > > @rottenborough said: > > Not bothered reading the story, but what a headline: > > > > Telegraph: "How a 10-day fast at a gut health clinic convinced me to end my marriage" > > I remember when the telegraph was a serious newspaper.
It is yet another casualty of Brexit. It is now a broadsheet version of the Daily Express, run by Brexit obsessed 20-something spotty Toryboys who have moulded themselves in the ridiculous "young fogey" image of Simon Heffer.
> @Theuniondivvie said: > > @Nigelb said: > > Trump and Farage are both libertarians, which is the opposite of fascism. > > > > Libertarians don't generally impose massive tariffs, or appoint judges who are in favour of banning abortion. > > > > Though Trump is in favour of at least one individual being free from any legal constraints, I suppose.... > > > Nor are they usually in favour of restrictive government controls on immigration. > > Perhaps Farage & Trump are libertarians in the way Carl Benjamin is a classical liberal.
Yep. Trump and Farage are both a long way from being Libertarians. Although Farage's views on immigration would probably put him in the Hoppean Libertarian camp.
The fellow behind him in the lairy strides looks like he has the weirdest Afro.. but on closer inspection it's someone sitting behind him's hair I think
> @kinabalu said: > Similar to when professional psychologists were diagnosing him with mental disorders without actually interacting with him personally. Very unprofessional. > > Well I'm not getting paid TBF. > > Observed symptoms - > > Bombastic in the extreme. > Sees himself as the answer to all problems. > Demands personal loyalty uber alles. > Openly frustrated with checks & balances. > Loves to deal direct with other 'Strongmen'. > Fetishizes 'winning'. > Tries to keep power in the family. > > It's enough to make the Trump 'wannabe fascist' diagnosis IMO. > > And I didn't even bother mentioning some of the more minor but nevertheless telling things such as his penchant for dressing up in military uniform and marching around the West Wing making oddly disturbing noises.
It is why he is such good friends with his British counterpart, and fellow Putin admirer, Mr Farridge.
I think we expect different things from Political Parties than bands who were the 1976 equivalent of the UKIP rape joke candidate
Okay, not sure what you mean by that. Are you offended by the word, offended by a political party using the word or offended by the LDs using the word or offended by the notion that in some mysterious way it is undermining democracy.
> @stodge said: > Afternoon all > > All those getting excited about the LD slogan on Brexit have obviously never travelled on a train to and from Waterloo where a couple of companies (one is Pimlico Plumbers) have for many months had billboards proclaiming: > > "Bollocks to Brexit; It's not a Done Deal". > > Those getting a fit of the vapours over the language obviously never owned a Sex Pistols album and I suspect anyone who claims the language is going to put them off voting LD weren't going to vote LD anyway. > > As others have said, it puts the Party in the game in campaigning terms and morale was given a huge boost by last week's local election results.
> > Trump and Farage are both libertarians, which is the opposite of fascism.
> >
> > Libertarians don't generally impose massive tariffs, or appoint judges who are in favour of banning abortion.
> >
> > Though Trump is in favour of at least one individual being free from any legal constraints, I suppose....
>
>
> Nor are they usually in favour of restrictive government controls on immigration.
>
> Perhaps Farage & Trump are libertarians in the way Carl Benjamin is a classical liberal.
Yep. Trump and Farage are both a long way from being Libertarians. Although Farage's views on immigration would probably put him in the Hoppean Libertarian camp.
Discussion of what constitutes a libertarian invariably runs into the no true Scotsman fallacy, but Trump is about as much of a libertarian as I am Scottish.
I think we expect different things from Political Parties than bands who were the 1976 equivalent of the UKIP rape joke candidate
Okay, not sure what you mean by that. Are you offended by the word, offended by a political party using the word or offended by the LDs using the word or offended by the notion that in some mysterious way it is undermining democracy.
I am not offended by any of it, I swear far too much myself, I just think it should be beneath a serious political party to use slogans like that, and feels more contrived than genuinely angry.
> @AndyJS said: > Trump and Farage are both libertarians, which is the opposite of fascism.
You are clearly confused over fascism and libertarianism. Trump and Farage are most definitely not the latter, even the right wing US variety. Whether they are the former is open to debate, but both meet most of the criteria from writer and philosopher Umberto Eco discussed in my earlier post. It would also be very unusual for someone that does not hold fascist tendencies to be sympathetic to Putin, as Farage clearly is.
A vote for Farage is definitely a vote for fascist "values", and the foreign policy agenda of Putin.
> @stodge said: > Afternoon all > > All those getting excited about the LD slogan on Brexit have obviously never travelled on a train to and from Waterloo where a couple of companies (one is Pimlico Plumbers) have for many months had billboards proclaiming: > > "Bollocks to Brexit; It's not a Done Deal". > > Those getting a fit of the vapours over the language obviously never owned a Sex Pistols album and I suspect anyone who claims the language is going to put them off voting LD weren't going to vote LD anyway. > > As others have said, it puts the Party in the game in campaigning terms and morale was given a huge boost by last week's local election results.
I don't think anyone has a problem with the word "bollocks" - the question is whether it's wise for a serious political party to be using it. Not only because politics in 2019 hardly needs to be any more bathetic than it already is, but also because Remainers have built up quite a positive image of the EU in the past three years, probably shifting the country marginally into the Remain camp, so reverting to negative campaigning seems counter-productive.
> @isam said: > I think we expect different things from Political Parties than bands who were the 1976 equivalent of the UKIP rape joke candidate > > Okay, not sure what you mean by that. Are you offended by the word, offended by a political party using the word or offended by the LDs using the word or offended by the notion that in some mysterious way it is undermining democracy. > > > > I am not offended by any of it, I swear far too much myself, I just think it should be beneath a serious political party to use slogans like that, and feels more contrived than genuinely angry.
I think it should be beneath any politician to come out with the divisive hate filled crap that Farage comes out with. That is far more worthy of your opprobrium.
> @Nigelb said: > > @Theuniondivvie said: > > > > @Nigelb said: > > > > Trump and Farage are both libertarians, which is the opposite of fascism. > > > > > > > > Libertarians don't generally impose massive tariffs, or appoint judges who are in favour of banning abortion. > > > > > > > > Though Trump is in favour of at least one individual being free from any legal constraints, I suppose.... > > > > > > > > > Nor are they usually in favour of restrictive government controls on immigration. > > > > > > Perhaps Farage & Trump are libertarians in the way Carl Benjamin is a classical liberal. > > > > Yep. Trump and Farage are both a long way from being Libertarians. Although Farage's views on immigration would probably put him in the Hoppean Libertarian camp. > > Discussion of what constitutes a libertarian invariably runs into the no true Scotsman fallacy, but Trump is about as much of a libertarian as I am Scottish.
Can’t believe some of the faux outrage over Bollocks to Brexit.
Bizarely we live in strange times where some Leavers spout treason and betrayal against some who disagree with Brexit and yet this slogan seems to have caused such outrage .
Which is more likely to lead to unintended bad consequences?
Bollocks to Brexit is quite flippant and lighthearted but sums up in a nutshell the thoughts of many on the Remain side ,the fact it’s been talked about across the net means the Lib Dems have got exactly the reaction they had hoped for .
Remainers certainly don’t need to be lectured to by Leavers over this slogan , the Leave side have used some incendiary and divisive language for the last 3 years . Their right wing press supporters have dished out enemies of the people and sought to inflame the situation by questioning the patriotism of those who disagree with Brexit.
So good on the Lib Dems for taking a bit of a chance , I think it’s a gamble that will pay off .
I think we expect different things from Political Parties than bands who were the 1976 equivalent of the UKIP rape joke candidate
Okay, not sure what you mean by that. Are you offended by the word, offended by a political party using the word or offended by the LDs using the word or offended by the notion that in some mysterious way it is undermining democracy.
I am not offended by any of it, I swear far too much myself, I just think it should be beneath a serious political party to use slogans like that, and feels more contrived than genuinely angry.
Heaven forfend a political party should use a contrivance.
Is Hope sure it's the same one? He has since said that the party had received other large donations. Wouldn't surprise me if this announcement was to cover for the first.
> > > Trump and Farage are both libertarians, which is the opposite of fascism.
>
> > >
>
> > > Libertarians don't generally impose massive tariffs, or appoint judges who are in favour of banning abortion.
>
> > >
>
> > > Though Trump is in favour of at least one individual being free from any legal constraints, I suppose....
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > Nor are they usually in favour of restrictive government controls on immigration.
>
> >
>
> > Perhaps Farage & Trump are libertarians in the way Carl Benjamin is a classical liberal.
>
>
>
> Yep. Trump and Farage are both a long way from being Libertarians. Although Farage's views on immigration would probably put him in the Hoppean Libertarian camp.
>
> Discussion of what constitutes a libertarian invariably runs into the no true Scotsman fallacy, but Trump is about as much of a libertarian as I am Scottish.
> I think we expect different things from Political Parties than bands who were the 1976 equivalent of the UKIP rape joke candidate
>
> Okay, not sure what you mean by that. Are you offended by the word, offended by a political party using the word or offended by the LDs using the word or offended by the notion that in some mysterious way it is undermining democracy.
>
>
>
> I am not offended by any of it, I swear far too much myself, I just think it should be beneath a serious political party to use slogans like that, and feels more contrived than genuinely angry.
I think it should be beneath any politician to come out with the divisive hate filled crap that Farage comes out with. That is far more worthy of your opprobrium.
Are we allowed to think for ourselves or do you have a guidebook to instruct us how to feel?
Comments
> On putting "boll" into a google search "bollocks to brexit" comes up first in the suggested searches ahead of various bollywood searches and a bollinger
>
> No, "Bollywood news" comes up first, "Bollocks to Brexit" only 5th!
Google will order based on what it knows about you, which is probably a frighteningly large amount. Perhaps you have previously shown more interest in Bollywood than in Brexit? For me "Bollocks to Brexit" comes up first, ahead of Bollywood, but then Google presumably knows I am a militant Remainer.
> Brexit has put Sindy off for 30 years - check the polling.
The most recent one you mean?
24–26 Apr 2019 YouGov/The Times 1,029
Yes - 44%
No -45%
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-47949665
Julie Girling today: "I was not and am not a Change UK MEP. I sit in the European Parliament as an independent."
https://twitter.com/adampayne26/status/1126846773153206272
"The EU has already said that if Britain left without the current WA, the same issues: money, NI and citizens would be the same as under the WA i.e. we take what they offer or nothing."
Well the argument is, surely, that in such a situation with no time limit to the negotiation and if the UK had already taken the hit of being suddenly out in the cold and was recovering, the EU would be in a weaker position.
You're very certain that that's complete rubbish, and fair enough. I still don't see deceit in the argument though, which was the claim you originally made that I contested.
I'm also not convinced in the slightest that stupidity and ignorance reside on only one side. I also feel that anger is a confounding emotion, and when driving one's expression it reduces the force of one's argument. I enjoy your comments (and headers) less when I can sense the rage.
Gtg. Have a good day.
> I voted Brexit Party in the Eastern region today. The Conservatives were stated as "conservative and Unionist" which had a nice retro feel. Presume it is the same across the UK and intended to keep the single Blue MEP north of the border.
>
>
>
> Tye Chanhe UK box looked very empty and spoke volumes about their level of competence. Hilarious that these so superior politicians like Soubs and Chukka are so flaming useless at running a party.🤣
>
> But... you're a canvasser for the Conservative party!
Concanvasser con.
> > @Sunil_Prasannan said:
> > On putting "boll" into a google search "bollocks to brexit" comes up first in the suggested searches ahead of various bollywood searches and a bollinger
> >
> > No, "Bollywood news" comes up first, "Bollocks to Brexit" only 5th!
>
> Google will order based on what it knows about you, which is probably a frighteningly large amount. Perhaps you have previously shown more interest in Bollywood than in Brexit? For me "Bollocks to Brexit" comes up first, ahead of Bollywood, but then Google presumably knows I am a militant Remainer.
I get bollocks ahead of Bollywood. However top of the list is a PB thread. Clearly we all talk a load of bollocks.
University research fellow Dr Larch Maxey tried several times to approach the automatic doors of the headquarters of Bristol City Council, after covering his hands with superglue, but gave up when he couldn’t get to the doors fast enough before they opened.
https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/news/bristol-news/moment-activist-tried-superglue-himself-2850010.amp
Kids at the university of plymouth should ask for a discount if this is the calibre of individual they employ.
> The most recent one you mean?
>
> 24–26 Apr 2019 YouGov/The Times 1,029
> Yes - 44%
> No -45%
> Amazing given how badly it is all going
And 'it' hasn't even happened yet.
> @Cyclefree
>
> "The EU has already said that if Britain left without the current WA, the same issues: money, NI and citizens would be the same as under the WA i.e. we take what they offer or nothing."
>
> Well the argument is, surely, that in such a situation with no time limit to the negotiation and if the UK had already taken the hit of being suddenly out in the cold and was recovering, the EU would be in a weaker position.
>
> You're very certain that that's complete rubbish, and fair enough. I still don't see deceit in the argument though, which was the claim you originally made that I contested.
>
> I'm also not convinced in the slightest that stupidity and ignorance reside on only one side. I also feel that anger is a confounding emotion, and when driving one's expression it reduces the force of one's argument. I enjoy your comments (and headers) less when I can sense the rage.
>
> Gtg. Have a good day.
*When I say people I mean me. But I am a person, so it seems a fair inference.
> > @isam said:
>
> > Credit where it is due, the Lib Dems are crushing CHUKa's TIGgers on the remain side of the great Brexit debate.
>
> >
>
> > What on earth are Chukas mob playing at? It was always a strange idea to think that standing on a platform of keeping all the things the public dislike from the first 16 years of the century and calling it ‘Change’ was going to work, but not putting up candidates in two by elections since they formed is totally bizarre.
>
> >
>
> > Soubry booed from start to finish on QT last night, preaching being civil while branding Farage racist, some change.
>
> >
>
> > If I didn’t dislike them so much I’d feel sorry for them
>
>
>
> Perhaps you didn't notice Farage's boorishness? I suspect most TV viewers did.
>
> I thought Farage was extremely poor. I tuned in specifically to see him. I don't like his views but he is usually entertaining. The biggest turn off was that he was clearly very much on message and looking to create soundbites, and so didn't even want to talk about anything other than Brexit.
>
> Given that he is leading a party called the “Brexit Party” for the upcoming EU elections , why on earth would he talk about anything other than Brexit?
By that logic Change UK should be trumpeting their success in persuading Hammond to retain the 1p and 2p coins.
Safe > 3% above cut off
Marginal (win) < 3% above cut off
Miss out: between 6% and cut off (is approx 3% below)
No hope: less than 6%
Lab candidate 1: safe in all 4 polls
Brexit 1: 4 x safe
Lab 2: 4 safe
Con 1: 3 safe, 1 marginal
CUK1: 3 safe, 1 no hope (very fishy that NOBODY in 144 people named CUK in the Opinium Gina Miller poll)
LD1: 2 safe, 2 marginal
Brex2: 3 marginal, 1 miss out
Green: 2 marginal, 2 miss out
Lab3: 2 marginal, 2 miss out
Con2: 1 marginal, 2 miss out, 1 no hope
LD2: 1 marginal, 3 no hope
Lab4: 4 miss out
CUK2: 3 miss out, 1 no hope
Two of the polls return 2 Remain candidates with Green missing out, two polls return 3 Remains.
In each of the polls returning 2 Remainers extra Green votes are the lowest swing way to convert the third Remainer and remove either Brex2 or Con2
In each of the polls returning 3 Remainers, extra LD tactical voting is a low swing way of letting in Lab3 in place of Green, but would take a large swing to convert an extra LD.
Thus I am set against 'tactical' voting between Remain parties in London, but if you are genuinely eenie-meenie about it, the Greens look a little more in need.
> This is the moment a climate change protester tried to superglue himself to the doors of City Hall - but was stumped because they kept opening before he could get there.
>
>
>
> University research fellow Dr Larch Maxey tried several times to approach the automatic doors of the headquarters of Bristol City Council, after covering his hands with superglue, but gave up when he couldn’t get to the doors fast enough before they opened.
>
>
>
> https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/news/bristol-news/moment-activist-tried-superglue-himself-2850010.amp
>
>
>
> Kids at the university of plymouth should ask for a discount if this is the calibre of individual they employ.
>
> Just cordon off the area and use another entrance. Or are they relying on the police to release them?
I would have thought it would be better if it stuck and all that happened as he was sent back and forth as people acitvated the door.
> > @RightChuck said:
> > @Cyclefree
> >
> > "The EU has already said that if Britain left without the current WA, the same issues: money, NI and citizens would be the same as under the WA i.e. we take what they offer or nothing."
> >
> > Well the argument is, surely, that in such a situation with no time limit to the negotiation and if the UK had already taken the hit of being suddenly out in the cold and was recovering, the EU would be in a weaker position.
> >
> > You're very certain that that's complete rubbish, and fair enough. I still don't see deceit in the argument though, which was the claim you originally made that I contested.
> >
> > I'm also not convinced in the slightest that stupidity and ignorance reside on only one side. I also feel that anger is a confounding emotion, and when driving one's expression it reduces the force of one's argument. I enjoy your comments (and headers) less when I can sense the rage.
> >
> > Gtg. Have a good day.
>
>
Something up with Vanilla.
Agree: stupidity and ignorance reside all over the place.
I tend to think that the whole process since June 2016 has been a process of Britain slowly realising that it does not have a strong hand at all and people raging at this.
There is no positive argument being made - either for Brexit or for Remaining. It is now all about damage limitation.
And we still have no sensible or indeed any European strategy.
What a mess.
Anyway you have a good day too.
UK companies failing to tackle climate change would be delisted from the London Stock Exchange under radical plans for greening the economy being drawn up by Labour.
John McDonnell, the shadow chancellor, said he would consider changing the law if necessary to force UK-listed firms to take adequate steps to fight the “climate emergency” facing the planet
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/may/10/labour-delist-uk-firms-failing-to-fight-climate-change-john-mcdonnell
> > @OnlyLivingBoy said:
> > > @Sunil_Prasannan said:
> > > On putting "boll" into a google search "bollocks to brexit" comes up first in the suggested searches ahead of various bollywood searches and a bollinger
> > >
> > > No, "Bollywood news" comes up first, "Bollocks to Brexit" only 5th!
> >
> > Google will order based on what it knows about you, which is probably a frighteningly large amount. Perhaps you have previously shown more interest in Bollywood than in Brexit? For me "Bollocks to Brexit" comes up first, ahead of Bollywood, but then Google presumably knows I am a militant Remainer.
>
> I get bollocks ahead of Bollywood. However top of the list is a PB thread. Clearly we all talk a load of bollocks.
Comes No 1 for me.
https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/staggers/2019/05/why-liberal-democrats-bollocks-brexit-slogan-stroke-genius
> https://twitter.com/GuitarMoog/status/1126815733265174529
>
>
>
> Something about a piss up and a brewery comes to mind. The leave side, on the other hand....
Well they are Nationalist parties - and both have historical links to Fascist parties in mainland Europe.
> https://twitter.com/GuitarMoog/status/1126815733265174529
Regional leaflets? There can't be many places where you could vote for both the SNP and Plaid Cymru.
> > @SandyRentool said:
> > > @OnlyLivingBoy said:
> > > > @Sunil_Prasannan said:
> > > > On putting "boll" into a google search "bollocks to brexit" comes up first in the suggested searches ahead of various bollywood searches and a bollinger
> > > >
> > > > No, "Bollywood news" comes up first, "Bollocks to Brexit" only 5th!
> > >
> > > Google will order based on what it knows about you, which is probably a frighteningly large amount. Perhaps you have previously shown more interest in Bollywood than in Brexit? For me "Bollocks to Brexit" comes up first, ahead of Bollywood, but then Google presumably knows I am a militant Remainer.
> >
> > I get bollocks ahead of Bollywood. However top of the list is a PB thread. Clearly we all talk a load of bollocks.
>
> Comes No 1 for me.
> https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/staggers/2019/05/why-liberal-democrats-bollocks-brexit-slogan-stroke-genius
I get info on some table tennis player called tim boll...one of the few sports i have bugger all interest in.
https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/brexit/2019/05/10/when-a-tactical-vote-may-not-work-the-complex-choice-facing-remainers-in-the-ep-elections/
>
> Yeah, might be England only.
Apparently it is. The bigger issue is that they declare that Labour "passes the People's Vote test".
> > @viewcode said:
> > I voted Brexit Party in the Eastern region today. The Conservatives were stated as "conservative and Unionist" which had a nice retro feel. Presume it is the same across the UK and intended to keep the single Blue MEP north of the border.
> >
> >
> >
> > Tye Chanhe UK box looked very empty and spoke volumes about their level of competence. Hilarious that these so superior politicians like Soubs and Chukka are so flaming useless at running a party.🤣
> >
> > But... you're a canvasser for the Conservative party!
>
> Concanvasser con.
EX canvasser I'm afraid under the current regime. This is worse than Major bu some distance. I would change the moniker to reflect that if I knew how!
I certainly hope not to have "conned" anyone Divie. Just being straight. Straw in the wind but I have 4 'political' friends who I have a pint with regularly who are solid Tories (3 Leave 1 Remain). 3 are voting Brexit Party.
https://twitter.com/TomHall/status/1126856533298466817
> EX canvasser I'm afraid under the current regime. This is worse than Major bu some distance. I would change the moniker to reflect that if I knew how!
>
> I certainly hope not to have "conned" anyone Divie. Just being straight. Straw in the wind but I have 4 'political' friends who I have a pint with regularly who are solid Tories (3 Leave 1 Remain). 3 are voting Brexit Party.
It was a joke, chill.
1. I am really pissed off (apparently this sort of language is ok now) that we have not yet left the EU. Although there is plenty of blame to go around I think May has to take the lion's share because she is, however notionally, in charge. I am not minded to vote for her or her party in light of this major incompetence and failure.
2. I have always accepted that the relatively close nature of the vote plus traditional British pragmatism meant that we we should have a relatively soft Brexit with a continuing close trading relationship with the EU and several areas of bilateral cooperation. In my view May's deal achieves as much of this as can be done at the moment since the EU refused to talk about a lot of things until we had actually left. In short I support her deal.
3. This (along with a long list of other things tbh) gives me a problem with the Brexit Party because they don't support the deal. Voting for them is voting for a no deal Brexit. See 2.
It is the failure of 1. that is requiring these elections to take place at all. I frankly think the Tories should be punished for that and have little doubt that they will be. Bigly. Most of that punishment is going to come as a reward for the Brexit party. Although that gives a clear message it is not a message I actually agree with. I am torn between voting Tory to support the deal and not voting at all in protest. I don't have anyone in this election, which I did not want, that I actively want to vote for.
Though Trump is in favour of at least one individual being free from any legal constraints, I suppose....
> So here's the state of play at L Towers.
I think a good way to ensure that May's deal is eventually signed (because it's probably as good as it gets) is to vote for the Brexit party. A big margin for the Brexit party will send a pretty strong message to those in Westminster. That, and the arrow....
>
> 2. I have always accepted that the relatively close nature of the vote plus traditional British pragmatism meant that we we should have a relatively soft Brexit with a continuing close trading relationship with the EU and several areas of bilateral cooperation.
>
> I don't have anyone in this election, which I did not want, that I actively want to vote for.
It sounds like you should vote Labour to support a job-first Brexit with a strong single market deal.
> > @DavidL said:
> > So here's the state of play at L Towers.
>
>
> I think a good way to ensure that May's deal is eventually signed (because it's probably as good as it gets) is to vote for the Brexit party. A big margin for the Brexit party will send a pretty strong message to those in Westminster. That, and the arrow....
Surely a vote for the Tories would be better if you want Mrs May's deal. A vote for BP will encourage the ERG to continues blocking it.
> > @RobD said:
> > > @DavidL said:
> > > So here's the state of play at L Towers.
> >
> >
> > I think a good way to ensure that May's deal is eventually signed (because it's probably as good as it gets) is to vote for the Brexit party. A big margin for the Brexit party will send a pretty strong message to those in Westminster. That, and the arrow....
>
> Surely a vote for the Tories would be better if you want Mrs May's deal. A vote for BP will encourage the ERG to continues blocking it.
I'm resigned to the fact that there will always be ERG holdouts. It needs Labour MPs to pass at this point.
> Trump and Farage are both libertarians, which is the opposite of fascism.
>
> Libertarians don't generally impose massive tariffs, or appoint judges who are in favour of banning abortion.
>
> Though Trump is in favour of at least one individual being free from any legal constraints, I suppose....
Nor are they usually in favour of restrictive government controls on immigration.
Perhaps Farage & Trump are libertarians in the way Carl Benjamin is a classical liberal.
> So here's the state of play at L Towers.
>
> 1. I am really pissed off (apparently this sort of language is ok now) that we have not yet left the EU. Although there is plenty of blame to go around I think May has to take the lion's share because she is, however notionally, in charge. I am not minded to vote for her or her party in light of this major incompetence and failure.
>
> 2. I have always accepted that the relatively close nature of the vote plus traditional British pragmatism meant that we we should have a relatively soft Brexit with a continuing close trading relationship with the EU and several areas of bilateral cooperation. In my view May's deal achieves as much of this as can be done at the moment since the EU refused to talk about a lot of things until we had actually left. In short I support her deal.
>
> 3. This (along with a long list of other things tbh) gives me a problem with the Brexit Party because they don't support the deal. Voting for them is voting for a no deal Brexit. See 2.
>
> It is the failure of 1. that is requiring these elections to take place at all. I frankly think the Tories should be punished for that and have little doubt that they will be. Bigly. Most of that punishment is going to come as a reward for the Brexit party. Although that gives a clear message it is not a message I actually agree with. I am torn between voting Tory to support the deal and not voting at all in protest. I don't have anyone in this election, which I did not want, that I actively want to vote for.
Labour?
> > @DavidL said:
> >
> > 2. I have always accepted that the relatively close nature of the vote plus traditional British pragmatism meant that we we should have a relatively soft Brexit with a continuing close trading relationship with the EU and several areas of bilateral cooperation.
> >
> > I don't have anyone in this election, which I did not want, that I actively want to vote for.
>
> It sounds like you should vote Labour to support a job-first Brexit with a strong single market deal.
William, I really cannot work out what Labour's position is from day to day but at the moment they seem to be having a dalliance with the PV hypocrisy which would in my view be absolutely disastrous for our country. So no.
I think a Customs Union is a stupid idea which will not be in our long term interests but if that is what it takes to get Brexit over the line I could live with that.
Telegraph: "How a 10-day fast at a gut health clinic convinced me to end my marriage"
> > @DavidL said:
> > So here's the state of play at L Towers.
>
>
> I think a good way to ensure that May's deal is eventually signed (because it's probably as good as it gets) is to vote for the Brexit party. A big margin for the Brexit party will send a pretty strong message to those in Westminster. That, and the arrow....
But that message will be (I expect them to win) that May's deal should be rejected and we should go for a no deal. How does May's deal continue on life support if the Tories get <10% of the vote?
> So here's the state of play at L Towers.
>
> 1. I am really pissed off (apparently this sort of language is ok now) that we have not yet left the EU. Although there is plenty of blame to go around I think May has to take the lion's share because she is, however notionally, in charge. I am not minded to vote for her or her party in light of this major incompetence and failure.
>
> 2. I have always accepted that the relatively close nature of the vote plus traditional British pragmatism meant that we we should have a relatively soft Brexit with a continuing close trading relationship with the EU and several areas of bilateral cooperation. In my view May's deal achieves as much of this as can be done at the moment since the EU refused to talk about a lot of things until we had actually left. In short I support her deal.
>
> 3. This (along with a long list of other things tbh) gives me a problem with the Brexit Party because they don't support the deal. Voting for them is voting for a no deal Brexit. See 2.
>
> It is the failure of 1. that is requiring these elections to take place at all. I frankly think the Tories should be punished for that and have little doubt that they will be. Bigly. Most of that punishment is going to come as a reward for the Brexit party. Although that gives a clear message it is not a message I actually agree with. I am torn between voting Tory to support the deal and not voting at all in protest. I don't have anyone in this election, which I did not want, that I actively want to vote for.
Vote Willie, give in to your vestigial SDP urges.
> Not bothered reading the story, but what a headline:
>
> Telegraph: "How a 10-day fast at a gut health clinic convinced me to end my marriage"
I remember when the telegraph was a serious newspaper.
> > @DavidL said:
> > So here's the state of play at L Towers.
> >
> > 1. I am really pissed off (apparently this sort of language is ok now) that we have not yet left the EU. Although there is plenty of blame to go around I think May has to take the lion's share because she is, however notionally, in charge. I am not minded to vote for her or her party in light of this major incompetence and failure.
> >
> > 2. I have always accepted that the relatively close nature of the vote plus traditional British pragmatism meant that we we should have a relatively soft Brexit with a continuing close trading relationship with the EU and several areas of bilateral cooperation. In my view May's deal achieves as much of this as can be done at the moment since the EU refused to talk about a lot of things until we had actually left. In short I support her deal.
> >
> > 3. This (along with a long list of other things tbh) gives me a problem with the Brexit Party because they don't support the deal. Voting for them is voting for a no deal Brexit. See 2.
> >
> > It is the failure of 1. that is requiring these elections to take place at all. I frankly think the Tories should be punished for that and have little doubt that they will be. Bigly. Most of that punishment is going to come as a reward for the Brexit party. Although that gives a clear message it is not a message I actually agree with. I am torn between voting Tory to support the deal and not voting at all in protest. I don't have anyone in this election, which I did not want, that I actively want to vote for.
>
> Vote Willie, give in to your vestigial SDP urges.
I think not, even although Fred McIntosh, number 2 on their list, is a friend of mine and a jolly decent chap.
https://edition.cnn.com/2019/05/09/politics/2020-democrats-ranking-biden-bernie-sanders-beto-orourke-kamala-harris/index.html
https://www.politico.com/story/2019/05/10/2016-ghosts-1315854
It’s hard to overstate the bad blood created by the rancorous 2016 fight. Clinton barely edged out Sanders by three-tenths of a percentage point, 49.9 percent to 49.6 percent, on caucus night, leading to a subsequent round of county and district conventions that, in many cases, devolved into shouting matches between the Clinton and Sanders factions. A fist fight broke out in one county; in another, activists dug through trash cans to make sure evidence of their turnout weren’t destroyed.
“It was just hell,” said Bagniewski, who was not yet county chair in 2016, describing the convention he attended. “Worst day of my life.”
Party leaders say the Clinton-Sanders divisions ran so deep, it depressed the Democratic general election turnout in Iowa, contributing to Trump’s 10-point romp after Barack Obama twice carried the state.
“To get the reputation that you’re helping serve this up to Trump again – it’s a deathwish,” Bagniewski said....
https://twitter.com/ShippersUnbound/status/1126860643544465409
Observed symptoms -
Bombastic in the extreme.
Sees himself as the answer to all problems.
Demands personal loyalty uber alles.
Openly frustrated with checks & balances.
Loves to deal direct with other 'Strongmen'.
Fetishizes 'winning'.
Tries to keep power in the family.
It's enough to make the Trump 'wannabe fascist' diagnosis IMO.
And I didn't even bother mentioning some of the more minor but nevertheless telling things such as his penchant for dressing up in military uniform and marching around the West Wing making oddly disturbing noises.
https://twitter.com/TheDailyShow/status/1126307771685720064?s=19
All those getting excited about the LD slogan on Brexit have obviously never travelled on a train to and from Waterloo where a couple of companies (one is Pimlico Plumbers) have for many months had billboards proclaiming:
"Bollocks to Brexit; It's not a Done Deal".
Those getting a fit of the vapours over the language obviously never owned a Sex Pistols album and I suspect anyone who claims the language is going to put them off voting LD weren't going to vote LD anyway.
As others have said, it puts the Party in the game in campaigning terms and morale was given a huge boost by last week's local election results.
Mind you, so did Burnham. I was right, of course, but he'd still be miles better than the incumbent.
Maybe - it's the only route I can see to get the WA passed from where we are. No WA equals no Brexit equals May remains in Downing Street.
> https://twitter.com/blairmcdougall/status/1126845526283096068
Whereas your Royal Family name is the name of your first pet combined with the name of your favourite actor from the Star Wars franchise.
> > @rottenborough said:
> > Not bothered reading the story, but what a headline:
> >
> > Telegraph: "How a 10-day fast at a gut health clinic convinced me to end my marriage"
>
> I remember when the telegraph was a serious newspaper.
It is yet another casualty of Brexit. It is now a broadsheet version of the Daily Express, run by Brexit obsessed 20-something spotty Toryboys who have moulded themselves in the ridiculous "young fogey" image of Simon Heffer.
> > @Nigelb said:
> > Trump and Farage are both libertarians, which is the opposite of fascism.
> >
> > Libertarians don't generally impose massive tariffs, or appoint judges who are in favour of banning abortion.
> >
> > Though Trump is in favour of at least one individual being free from any legal constraints, I suppose....
>
>
> Nor are they usually in favour of restrictive government controls on immigration.
>
> Perhaps Farage & Trump are libertarians in the way Carl Benjamin is a classical liberal.
Yep. Trump and Farage are both a long way from being Libertarians. Although Farage's views on immigration would probably put him in the Hoppean Libertarian camp.
The fellow behind him in the lairy strides looks like he has the weirdest Afro.. but on closer inspection it's someone sitting behind him's hair I think
> Similar to when professional psychologists were diagnosing him with mental disorders without actually interacting with him personally. Very unprofessional.
>
> Well I'm not getting paid TBF.
>
> Observed symptoms -
>
> Bombastic in the extreme.
> Sees himself as the answer to all problems.
> Demands personal loyalty uber alles.
> Openly frustrated with checks & balances.
> Loves to deal direct with other 'Strongmen'.
> Fetishizes 'winning'.
> Tries to keep power in the family.
>
> It's enough to make the Trump 'wannabe fascist' diagnosis IMO.
>
> And I didn't even bother mentioning some of the more minor but nevertheless telling things such as his penchant for dressing up in military uniform and marching around the West Wing making oddly disturbing noises.
It is why he is such good friends with his British counterpart, and fellow Putin admirer, Mr Farridge.
> I think we have a replacement for ridiculously self conscious posed pics Gavin.
>
> https://twitter.com/ShippersUnbound/status/1126860643544465409
..and appearing on tonight's edition of "I am a lightweight get me out here..."
> Afternoon all
>
> All those getting excited about the LD slogan on Brexit have obviously never travelled on a train to and from Waterloo where a couple of companies (one is Pimlico Plumbers) have for many months had billboards proclaiming:
>
> "Bollocks to Brexit; It's not a Done Deal".
>
> Those getting a fit of the vapours over the language obviously never owned a Sex Pistols album and I suspect anyone who claims the language is going to put them off voting LD weren't going to vote LD anyway.
>
> As others have said, it puts the Party in the game in campaigning terms and morale was given a huge boost by last week's local election results.
Yes, Pimlico Plumbers, I believe.
https://inews.co.uk/opinion/comment/i-put-a-bollocks-to-brexit-sign-on-top-of-my-london-headquarters-this-is-why-i-wont-be-taking-it-down/
> Trump and Farage are both libertarians, which is the opposite of fascism.
You are clearly confused over fascism and libertarianism. Trump and Farage are most definitely not the latter, even the right wing US variety. Whether they are the former is open to debate, but both meet most of the criteria from writer and philosopher Umberto Eco discussed in my earlier post. It would also be very unusual for someone that does not hold fascist tendencies to be sympathetic to Putin, as Farage clearly is.
A vote for Farage is definitely a vote for fascist "values", and the foreign policy agenda of Putin.
http://www.openculture.com/2016/11/umberto-eco-makes-a-list-of-the-14-common-features-of-fascism.html?fbclid=IwAR1i4--82rNveTGJcjYrTb_7R41swQqGqxXU2StsSzQs-csWnY6W_Y7HvmE
> Afternoon all
>
> All those getting excited about the LD slogan on Brexit have obviously never travelled on a train to and from Waterloo where a couple of companies (one is Pimlico Plumbers) have for many months had billboards proclaiming:
>
> "Bollocks to Brexit; It's not a Done Deal".
>
> Those getting a fit of the vapours over the language obviously never owned a Sex Pistols album and I suspect anyone who claims the language is going to put them off voting LD weren't going to vote LD anyway.
>
> As others have said, it puts the Party in the game in campaigning terms and morale was given a huge boost by last week's local election results.
I don't think anyone has a problem with the word "bollocks" - the question is whether it's wise for a serious political party to be using it. Not only because politics in 2019 hardly needs to be any more bathetic than it already is, but also because Remainers have built up quite a positive image of the EU in the past three years, probably shifting the country marginally into the Remain camp, so reverting to negative campaigning seems counter-productive.
> I think we expect different things from Political Parties than bands who were the 1976 equivalent of the UKIP rape joke candidate
>
> Okay, not sure what you mean by that. Are you offended by the word, offended by a political party using the word or offended by the LDs using the word or offended by the notion that in some mysterious way it is undermining democracy.
>
>
>
> I am not offended by any of it, I swear far too much myself, I just think it should be beneath a serious political party to use slogans like that, and feels more contrived than genuinely angry.
I think it should be beneath any politician to come out with the divisive hate filled crap that Farage comes out with. That is far more worthy of your opprobrium.
> > @Theuniondivvie said:
>
> > > @Nigelb said:
>
> > > Trump and Farage are both libertarians, which is the opposite of fascism.
>
> > >
>
> > > Libertarians don't generally impose massive tariffs, or appoint judges who are in favour of banning abortion.
>
> > >
>
> > > Though Trump is in favour of at least one individual being free from any legal constraints, I suppose....
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > Nor are they usually in favour of restrictive government controls on immigration.
>
> >
>
> > Perhaps Farage & Trump are libertarians in the way Carl Benjamin is a classical liberal.
>
>
>
> Yep. Trump and Farage are both a long way from being Libertarians. Although Farage's views on immigration would probably put him in the Hoppean Libertarian camp.
>
> Discussion of what constitutes a libertarian invariably runs into the no true Scotsman fallacy, but Trump is about as much of a libertarian as I am Scottish.
Agreed.
Bizarely we live in strange times where some Leavers spout treason and betrayal against some who disagree with Brexit and yet this slogan seems to have caused such outrage .
Which is more likely to lead to unintended bad consequences?
Bollocks to Brexit is quite flippant and lighthearted but sums up in a nutshell the thoughts of many on the Remain side ,the fact it’s been talked about across the net means the Lib Dems have got exactly the reaction they had hoped for .
Remainers certainly don’t need to be lectured to by Leavers over this slogan , the Leave side have used some incendiary and divisive language for the last 3 years . Their right wing press supporters have dished out enemies of the people and sought to inflame the situation by questioning the patriotism of those who disagree with Brexit.
So good on the Lib Dems for taking a bit of a chance , I think it’s a gamble that will pay off .
> https://twitter.com/christopherhope/status/1126879166966771713
How does a "proper Conservative" party equate to totally wrecking the british economy with a WTO exit?
> > @Scott_P said:
> > https://twitter.com/christopherhope/status/1126879166966771713
>
> How does a "proper Conservative" party equate to totally wrecking the british economy with a WTO exit?
Because the Tories are now the party of fuck business and as long as people can wank off over their blue passports then job done .
> https://twitter.com/christopherhope/status/1126879166966771713
The Brexit Party is surely finished with this news.
> Who are the LDs?
The Lib Dems are the ones who took hundreds of seats off the Conservatives earlier this month.
Do try to keep up, Mr Owls!