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  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,590
    > @Icarus said:
    > To all pbers thinking of laying Boris. “ How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?” Sherlock Holmes All the others look pretty close to impossible.

    Apart from Leadsom.
    Who is a different kind of improbable, and likely less unpalatable to some (Mr. Nabavi, for example).
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,548

    Mr. Richard, quite a lot of reporting, back when it was higher on the agenda, of HS2 up here was about people annoyed it wouldn't be going to their town/city.

    I do wonder if HS2 will end up going London to Birmingham and then they'll stop.

    Well, if you want it to go further north than get behind the project. Criticising it for stupid reasons will just hinder the wider project.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,044
    kle4 said:

    Morning all,



    On topic:



    "The Tories’ next leader must stop taking Brexit Party voters for granted, and beg them, on bended knees, to return."



    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/05/15/tories-deluded-think-brexit-party-cant-supplant/

    Or they could deliver Brexit and see if all BP supporters think the same as Farage or not. Some will, but all?
    The author seems to be arguing that there is now a significant chunk of previous Tory supporters so radicalised by all this nonsense, that only a total and utter No Deal crash out will now suffice.

    It is possible that Boris will deliver that, but even if he wants to, how does he get it through the Commons? Will need another GE, when all bets are off.

    If there is a GE and Farage splits the Right sufficiently to allow Corbyn into Downing street, then it will get really interesting (in the Chinese way). Will Tories complete collapse? Will they do a deal with Farage? Would Farage even agree to deals?

    The Telegraph guy is probably right: there is far too much complacency within Tory party.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 24,968
    > @Morris_Dancer said:
    > Mr. Richard, quite a lot of reporting, back when it was higher on the agenda, of HS2 up here was about people annoyed it wouldn't be going to their town/city.
    >
    > I do wonder if HS2 will end up going London to Birmingham and then they'll stop.

    I remember many years ago a PBer suggesting that was the plan.
  • ah009ah009 Posts: 436
    > @rottenborough said:
    > Next GE main message from Tories: "Vote for Boris, or Corbyn wins".

    I imagine the reverse of that will also be effective. But I have a hunch Corbyn won't be Labour leader by then.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,684

    Mr. Richard, quite a lot of reporting, back when it was higher on the agenda, of HS2 up here was about people annoyed it wouldn't be going to their town/city.

    I do wonder if HS2 will end up going London to Birmingham and then they'll stop.

    Just another London vanity project sucking all the cash out of the north of the country so some twats can get there 10 minutes quicker.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614

    Icarus said:

    To all pbers thinking of laying Boris. “ How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?” Sherlock Holmes All the others look pretty close to impossible.

    The sheer number of Leavers looking to enter the field tells you how unpopular Boris Johnson is even among MPs who you would think would be supportive. I think he's going to have a huge battle to get to the last two.
    As he realised last time, deciding not to bother rather than be seen as beaten.

    I’m struggling to see how the situation doesn’t play out pretty much the same again for him next time.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,590

    > @tlg86 said:

    > https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-48284105

    >

    > It suggested lowering the speed of HS2 or placing its terminal in west London rather than Euston would save money.

    >

    > No, just no. If we are going to have this railway line it needs to go into central London. Terminating it at OOC would be utterly stupid.



    The importance of the report is that it gives the next PM justification for cancelling HS2 in order to spend money on transport in the North and Midlands. Where there by coincidence happen to be many marginal constituencies.



    ' It said the first phase of the project offered "little benefit" to northern cities, despite them being in most need of better rail infrastructure.



    And it said the second phase, which would improve journey times between Leeds and Sheffield, risked never going ahead because of spending overruns. '



    HS2 supporters should have demanded that construction start in the North and work southwards.

    Funny you should say that...
    https://www.parliament.uk/business/committees/committees-a-z/lords-select/economic-affairs-committee/news-parliament-2017/hs2--report-launch/
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    F1: small movements on the market for Monaco (winner). Verstappen down from 5.5 to 5, Leclerc from 19 to 17 (although that one might just be the boost effect...).

    If you got some pennies to spend, ahem, still think Perez, Sainz, and Ricciardo each way at enormo-odds is worth a very small stake.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    Sandpit said:

    Icarus said:

    To all pbers thinking of laying Boris. “ How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?” Sherlock Holmes All the others look pretty close to impossible.

    The sheer number of Leavers looking to enter the field tells you how unpopular Boris Johnson is even among MPs who you would think would be supportive. I think he's going to have a huge battle to get to the last two.
    As he realised last time, deciding not to bother rather than be seen as beaten.

    I’m struggling to see how the situation doesn’t play out pretty much the same again for him next time.
    A few weeks back there were reports more mps were backing him now, even some who had been anti him. I guess we shall soon see if that was just his own team being optimistic or not .
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,590
    malcolmg said:

    Radio audiences are up, especially news stations as we approach (or not) Brexit.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-48279612



    Those who questioned Chris Evans' pay packet should note he has more than doubled Virgin Radio's audience. Otoh, Radio 2 is only slightly down.

    Is it up from 5 to 10 as his mum and pals listen.
    Unaccountably, his pals appear to number somewhere around a million.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,044

    Mr. Richard, quite a lot of reporting, back when it was higher on the agenda, of HS2 up here was about people annoyed it wouldn't be going to their town/city.

    I do wonder if HS2 will end up going London to Birmingham and then they'll stop.

    Depressingly likely. Even if the first bit actually gets built (and is now likely to be a victim of this summer's leadership contest), the 2nd bit will fail victim to the likely recession that is well due.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. Jessop, I haven't criticised the problem.

    I found the argument someone made here (perhaps you?) about the need for extra capacity (and if that's required, it might as well be high speed), quite persuasive.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 49,963
    > @TOPPING said:
    > How dare you question Maverick. Don't you know he is notorious - for buzzing the tower?
    >
    > We know that when anything khaki happens you have an uncanny skill to be simultaneously both first into your armchair and under the table.

    Yeah, under the table. In Yemen, Colombia, Equatorial Guinea, Somalia, Algeria (mid-civil war), Cambodia (whilst the "KR" were still active), Republic of Congo etc etc.....

    You?
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,074

    > @Cyclefree said:



    > Gove, Gauke, Gibb and Stewart strike me as intelligent and thoughtful. Gove has failings, as you note. The other three have made good speeches or given thoughtful interviews. Doesn’t mean they will be good PMs mind. I like Rudd.

    >

    > The others range from the so-so-ish to the arrogant, the liars and the unspeakable. Very few of them have really been tested in senior positions. They strike me as junior Ministers prematurely elevated to Cabinet level

    >

    > Ken Clarke would wipe the floor, even at his age, with all of them.



    I agree abnout Ken. In general, even as an opponent, I think people somewhat underestimate the personal qualities of many of the Tories. The one I know best from my day job is Gove, who is definitely intelligent and thoughtful, and also rarely says anything without weighing up whether he actually means it, which on the whole is a good thing (compare with Boris, say).



    But it's a great article, and worthy of updating for a national paper when the contest officially starts. Which on May's record so far will probably be in about two years' time.

    LoL!

    You make a good point about the personal qualities. And the same point could probably be made abut Labour politicians too. But those personal qualities are not necessarily sufficient for leadership.

    There just seems to me to be a lack of weight and gravitas in most of these politicians. A few have the capacity to develop. But it is far too soon for many of them and the more senior ones have other flaws.

  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,684
    Sandpit said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    .

    A number of people keep asking, “where do you draw the line?”

    We now know the answer to that: when you kick-up a sufficiently large stink about something on social media.

    It’s a terribly unjust way to make policy and employment decisions, and effectively amounts to virtual mob rule by whoever can shout the loudest, but that’s the world we now live in.
    I'm not on Twitter and haven't been closely following it, but is that what happened in the case of the Jeremy Kyle show? I got the impression that ITV pulled the show without much external pressure. Was there a Twitter campaign against it?

    It does make me wonder exactly what happened in this sad case. The JK has always prided itself on its aftercare (whether rightly or not) - I wonder if that system failed badly?

    I daresay the inquest will tell us more.
    It’s quite amazing that this sort of incident hasn’t happened before, so they must have had a reasonable amount of counselling in place for those who had appeared. One hopes that this support continues as the show gets cancelled, for those who have been involved in previous episodes.

    The last time I remember something like this occurring on a TV show was way back in 1986, when Noel Edmonds’ The Late, Late, Breakfast Show was binned after a stunt went wrong and a member of the public involved in the stunt was killed.
    If they are stupid enough to want to go on these pathetic shows for losers then they are responsible for their own actions. Going on a shit TV show only highlights the problems they already have. No sympathy whatsoever.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408

    kle4 said:

    Morning all,



    On topic:



    "The Tories’ next leader must stop taking Brexit Party voters for granted, and beg them, on bended knees, to return."



    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/05/15/tories-deluded-think-brexit-party-cant-supplant/

    Or they could deliver Brexit and see if all BP supporters think the same as Farage or not. Some will, but all?
    The author seems to be arguing that there is now a significant chunk of previous Tory supporters so radicalised by all this nonsense, that only a total and utter No Deal crash out will now suffice.

    It is possible that Boris will deliver that, but even if he wants to, how does he get it through the Commons? Will need another GE, when all bets are off.

    If there is a GE and Farage splits the Right sufficiently to allow Corbyn into Downing street, then it will get really interesting (in the Chinese way). Will Tories complete collapse? Will they do a deal with Farage? Would Farage even agree to deals?

    The Telegraph guy is probably right: there is far too much complacency within Tory party.
    Many tory mps seem to be cowards who already want to capitulate to Farage so I think they would definitely seek a deal if he split the right and Corbyn got in.

    As you note only no deal please many of them and getting it is hard. The only path given a GE is so uncertain, would appear to be just do nothing and hope that Macron vetoes an extension if parliament forcedms a request for one .
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    edited May 2019
    Excellent article - a typo?

    <i><b>Priti Patel</b> – steely and fluent former Cabinet minister, a vehement Leaver, most famous for being in favour of capital punishment and being sacked for devising her own foreign policy then lying about that. A possibility in the same <s>vein</s> <b>vain</b> as Esther McVey if she chooses to run. (24/1)</i>

    Truly a cavalcade of wit & beauty!
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,590


    HS2 supporters should have demanded that construction start in the North and work southwards.

    That would just have been another way of killing the project, given the rationale and need behind it.

    "What, you're spending billions avoiding the area with the biggest problems the project is designed to fix? It's a white elephant!"
    What do you make of the Lords committee report ?

    "The Committee finds that the Government has made little progress in answering the questions raised in its 2015 inquiry. In the 2015 Economics of High Speed 2 report they stated that there was a strong case for improving regional rail links in the north, but the Government had failed to consider whether such a scheme was a better investment than HS2.

    The new inquiry heard evidence that Northern Powerhouse Rail—a programme of northern rail infrastructure improvements—will deliver greater benefits to northern cities. The Committee recommends that the northern section of HS2—the second phase of the project—should be combined with Northern Powerhouse Rail and treated as one programme, allowing for investment to be prioritised where it is most needed. They recommend that the funding for the Northern Powerhouse Rail Programme should be ringfenced and brought forward where possible.

    The Committee finds evidence that the costs of HS2 appear to be out of control. Sir Terry Morgan, former Chairman of HS2 and Crossrail, told the Committee that "nobody knows" what the final cost will be. The Committee is concerned that if the costs of the London-Birmingham section overrun, the northern sections may not be built.

    The Committee’s new report concludes that a new method of appraisal is required. An appraisal method that took more account of the transformative benefits of new infrastructure would be less sensitive to small changes in journey time.

    HS2 is being designed to operate initially at 360 kilometres per hour, faster than any other train in the world. The new report re-emphasises the 2015 recommendation that the Government should assess properly the cost saving that could be made by lowering the speed.

     Another recommendation the Committee made in 2015 was for a full assessment of the cost saving of terminating HS2 at Old Oak Common in west London, which will connect to central London by Crossrail, rather than Euston, which would require expensive tunnelling. Committee concludes that the redevelopment of Euston should be removed from the scope of the first phase of the project and an assessment carried out as to whether Old Oak Common could operate as the terminus for the full line..."
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 24,968
    > @rottenborough said:
    > Mr. Richard, quite a lot of reporting, back when it was higher on the agenda, of HS2 up here was about people annoyed it wouldn't be going to their town/city.
    >
    > I do wonder if HS2 will end up going London to Birmingham and then they'll stop.
    >
    > Depressingly likely. Even if the first bit actually gets built (and is now likely to be a victim of this summer's leadership contest), the 2nd bit will fail victim to the likely recession that is well due.

    I'm surprised at the complacency of HS2 supporters who have no shown any interest in the importance of construction actually beginning and especially getting construction started in the North.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,684
    edited May 2019
    Nigelb said:

    malcolmg said:

    Radio audiences are up, especially news stations as we approach (or not) Brexit.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-48279612



    Those who questioned Chris Evans' pay packet should note he has more than doubled Virgin Radio's audience. Otoh, Radio 2 is only slightly down.

    Is it up from 5 to 10 as his mum and pals listen.
    Unaccountably, his pals appear to number somewhere around a million.
    Perhaps his Mum is popular.
    PS: what did the million morons listen to before the switch
  • eristdooferistdoof Posts: 4,861
    > @Icarus said:
    > To all pbers thinking of laying Boris. “ How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?” Sherlock Holmes All the others look pretty close to impossible.

    You do realise that Sherlock Holmes is fictional?
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,684
    eristdoof said:

    > @Icarus said:

    > To all pbers thinking of laying Boris. “ How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?” Sherlock Holmes All the others look pretty close to impossible.



    You do realise that Sherlock Holmes is fictional?

    Next you will be trying to tell us Santa is as well
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 2,182
    Boris and even Rees Mogg may not hold their seats on current polling.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 47,789
    edited May 2019
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    kle4 said:

    Sandpit said:

    Icarus said:

    To all pbers thinking of laying Boris. “ How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?” Sherlock Holmes All the others look pretty close to impossible.

    The sheer number of Leavers looking to enter the field tells you how unpopular Boris Johnson is even among MPs who you would think would be supportive. I think he's going to have a huge battle to get to the last two.
    As he realised last time, deciding not to bother rather than be seen as beaten.

    I’m struggling to see how the situation doesn’t play out pretty much the same again for him next time.
    A few weeks back there were reports more mps were backing him now, even some who had been anti him. I guess we shall soon see if that was just his own team being optimistic or not .
    Indeed so. At some point, and with most of the field promising to leave the EU quickly, the MPs will start actually looking at the political record of the candidates. At that point Boris will start struggling, his performance in high office leaving a lot to be desired (and at least two Britons locked up in foreign prisons).

    The next PM is going to have to be a details person with a record of delivering change, someone who sees moving away from the EU as an opportunity but is pragmatic enough to understand there are a lot of paths to cross on the way. I’d go for Gove or Hunt personally.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,559
    > @malcolmg said:
    > > @Icarus said:
    >
    > > To all pbers thinking of laying Boris. “ How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?” Sherlock Holmes All the others look pretty close to impossible.
    >
    >
    >
    > You do realise that Sherlock Holmes is fictional?
    >
    > Next you will be trying to tell us Santa is as well

    WTF !

    youve seriously ruined Christmas for me malc
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,756
    edited May 2019
    > @Dura_Ace said:
    > S/Lt (Acting) Mordaunt, RNR is definitely on maneuvers. In her RUSI speech yesterday she indulged in some mild nationalist frottage over the FSS ship build and announced, to general bafflement, a new 'National Carrier Strategy' which apparently consists of, er, having two carriers with one available for use.


    I guess that's a major strategic advance from none available for use.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,559
    > @another_richard said:
    > > @rottenborough said:
    > > Mr. Richard, quite a lot of reporting, back when it was higher on the agenda, of HS2 up here was about people annoyed it wouldn't be going to their town/city.
    > >
    > > I do wonder if HS2 will end up going London to Birmingham and then they'll stop.
    > >
    > > Depressingly likely. Even if the first bit actually gets built (and is now likely to be a victim of this summer's leadership contest), the 2nd bit will fail victim to the likely recession that is well due.
    >
    > I'm surprised at the complacency of HS2 supporters who have no shown any interest in the importance of construction actually beginning and especially getting construction started in the North.

    lots of cushy consultancy but no actial product
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 12,884
    Sandpit said:


    Don’t the brass hats always offer up RAFAT towards the top of the list for cuts? It’s as if they’re daring the minister to be the one who takes the flak for killing the most visible thing the RAF do to most of the public - The Red Arrows.

    The problem is that they are on borrowed time as they fly the Hawk T1 the successor variants of which went out of production in 1997 (RAAF Hawk 127). Canopies are the limiting factor; once the current stock of spares have been consumed then that is the end of RAF T1 ops. The RAF only have 23 T2s in the forward fleet so they won't be assigning 9 of those to RAFAT2. Some unluckly SoS is going to have to announce it's over sooner or later.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. Cicero, it'd be very on trend for current politics if Boris became PM, won the next election, and lost his own seat.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    edited May 2019
    eristdoof said:

    > @Icarus said:

    > To all pbers thinking of laying Boris. “ How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?” Sherlock Holmes All the others look pretty close to impossible.



    You do realise that Sherlock Holmes is fictional?

    The character said it, how else would you quote it? Quoting the author (I actually don't know if thst phrase was in the original stories) would just look weird. Or do you have an objection to pearls of wisdom from the fictional?
  • RecidivistRecidivist Posts: 4,679

    https://twitter.com/YvetteHenson/status/1128763013220245507

    Sums up the CUK project, top down with no real ground support.

    Be positive. They've got the makings of a very convincing Abba tribute band there.
  • eristdooferistdoof Posts: 4,861
    > @kle4 said:
    > > @Icarus said:
    >
    > > To all pbers thinking of laying Boris. “ How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?” Sherlock Holmes All the others look pretty close to impossible.
    >
    >
    >
    > You do realise that Sherlock Holmes is fictional?
    >
    > The character said it, how else would you quote it? Quoting the author (I actually don't know if thst phrase was in the original stories) would just look weird. Or do you have an objection to pearls of wisdom from the fictional?

    It is a good sentence in the context of crime fiction. It is though logically wrong. When you have eliminated the impossible, there usually remains very many things which are still possible and one of those is the truth.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 48,928


    HS2 supporters should have demanded that construction start in the North and work southwards.

    That would just have been another way of killing the project, given the rationale and need behind it.

    "What, you're spending billions avoiding the area with the biggest problems the project is designed to fix? It's a white elephant!"
    Crossrail hasn't even opened yet! Which century will see HS2 open? :lol:
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,548
    Nigelb said:


    What do you make of the Lords committee report ?

    (Snip)

    The new inquiry heard evidence that Northern Powerhouse Rail—a programme of northern rail infrastructure improvements—will deliver greater benefits to northern cities. The Committee recommends that the northern section of HS2—the second phase of the project—should be combined with Northern Powerhouse Rail and treated as one programme, allowing for investment to be prioritised where it is most needed. They recommend that the funding for the Northern Powerhouse Rail Programme should be ringfenced and brought forward where possible.

    The Committee finds evidence that the costs of HS2 appear to be out of control. Sir Terry Morgan, former Chairman of HS2 and Crossrail, told the Committee that "nobody knows" what the final cost will be. The Committee is concerned that if the costs of the London-Birmingham section overrun, the northern sections may not be built.

    The Committee’s new report concludes that a new method of appraisal is required. An appraisal method that took more account of the transformative benefits of new infrastructure would be less sensitive to small changes in journey time.

    HS2 is being designed to operate initially at 360 kilometres per hour, faster than any other train in the world. The new report re-emphasises the 2015 recommendation that the Government should assess properly the cost saving that could be made by lowering the speed.

     Another recommendation the Committee made in 2015 was for a full assessment of the cost saving of terminating HS2 at Old Oak Common in west London, which will connect to central London by Crossrail, rather than Euston, which would require expensive tunnelling. Committee concludes that the redevelopment of Euston should be removed from the scope of the first phase of the project and an assessment carried out as to whether Old Oak Common could operate as the terminus for the full line..."

    It's an interesting analysis, but also flawed IMO - as if it's designed to come up with the answer it does. Some rambling comments:

    Ending the line at OOC is madness, and the proposal alone is enough to throw into doubt the reason behind the report. Doing this would kill the project.

    AIUI the HS2 speed quote is wrong. Operating speed is designed to be 360km/h mas, and 320km/h usual. That 'usual' speed is 200MPH, the same speed that many HS trains do, and several go faster in Spain, Italy and China. It's also futureproof: countries are designing new lines to those sorts of speeds.

    Northern Powerhouse Rail and HS2 should not be seen as competitors, but as coherent parts of an entire planned system. Do both.

    I could go on. And on. And on... ;)
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,684

    > @malcolmg said:

    > > @Icarus said:

    >

    > > To all pbers thinking of laying Boris. “ How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?” Sherlock Holmes All the others look pretty close to impossible.

    >

    >

    >

    > You do realise that Sherlock Holmes is fictional?

    >

    > Next you will be trying to tell us Santa is as well



    WTF !



    youve seriously ruined Christmas for me malc

    😇
  • RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    edited May 2019
    > @JosiasJessop said:
    > > @TheJezziah said:
    > > https://twitter.com/jewdas/status/1128751173023031296
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > > The good thing about being a massive cynic about many of Corbyn's critics is this is absolutely no surprise...
    >
    > I'll criticise Pollard for that: but the article he links to makes some (IMO) bad points and some good ones. Perhaps you should read it?
    >
    > The good thing about being a massive cynic about those who have turned Corbyn into a cult is that their reaction is absolutely no surprise ...

    Pollard is a clown. Everyone knows that. This though is funny,,,,,

    Trump pardons billionaire friend Conrad Black who wrote a (very flattering) book about him-

    because he's worth it....

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-pardons-billionaire-friend-conrad-black-who-wrote-book-about-him/2019/05/15/b494b208-7771-11e9-bd25-c989555e7766_story.html?utm_term=.e8a7ab74dfac
  • RecidivistRecidivist Posts: 4,679
    malcolmg said:

    Nigelb said:

    malcolmg said:

    Radio audiences are up, especially news stations as we approach (or not) Brexit.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-48279612



    Those who questioned Chris Evans' pay packet should note he has more than doubled Virgin Radio's audience. Otoh, Radio 2 is only slightly down.

    Is it up from 5 to 10 as his mum and pals listen.
    Unaccountably, his pals appear to number somewhere around a million.
    Perhaps his Mum is popular.
    PS: what did the million morons listen to before the switch
    They spent all day on Political Betting.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    eristdoof said:

    > @kle4 said:

    > > @Icarus said:

    >

    > > To all pbers thinking of laying Boris. “ How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?” Sherlock Holmes All the others look pretty close to impossible.

    >

    >

    >

    > You do realise that Sherlock Holmes is fictional?

    >

    > The character said it, how else would you quote it? Quoting the author (I actually don't know if thst phrase was in the original stories) would just look weird. Or do you have an objection to pearls of wisdom from the fictional?



    It is a good sentence in the context of crime fiction. It is though logically wrong. When you have eliminated the impossible, there usually remains very many things which are still possible and one of those is the truth.

    Many a pearl of wisdom is not perfect of course, or not always applicable. I read some pretty awful crime/spy book whose name I don't recall whose big repeated line was 'forget the evidence' or something similar.
  • RecidivistRecidivist Posts: 4,679

    Mr. Cicero, it'd be very on trend for current politics if Boris became PM, won the next election, and lost his own seat.

    That one gets funnier the more I think about it.
  • ah009ah009 Posts: 436
    > @DavidL said:
    My guess is SNP 3, BP 1, Tory 1 and Lib Dem 1 with the Greens and Labour coming close to taking 1 off the SNP but not quite making it. Not good for Corbyn if that is what happens.

    What numbers do you see that will bring that about? SNP 40%, TBP and Tory combined over 26%, Lab and Green both on about 10%?

    Doesn't "feel" right to me.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,684

    > @another_richard said:

    > > @rottenborough said:

    > > Mr. Richard, quite a lot of reporting, back when it was higher on the agenda, of HS2 up here was about people annoyed it wouldn't be going to their town/city.

    > >

    > > I do wonder if HS2 will end up going London to Birmingham and then they'll stop.

    > >

    > > Depressingly likely. Even if the first bit actually gets built (and is now likely to be a victim of this summer's leadership contest), the 2nd bit will fail victim to the likely recession that is well due.

    >

    > I'm surprised at the complacency of HS2 supporters who have no shown any interest in the importance of construction actually beginning and especially getting construction started in the North.



    lots of cushy consultancy but no actial product

    Exactly Alan, it is a Klondyke for the sharks, they are filling their boots and it will end up canned with billions in the pockets of the London crooks pals pockets.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 24,968
    > @JosiasJessop said:
    > HS2 supporters should have demanded that construction start in the North and work southwards.
    >
    > That would just have been another way of killing the project, given the rationale and need behind it.
    >
    > "What, you're spending billions avoiding the area with the biggest problems the project is designed to fix? It's a white elephant!"

    I thought the rationale was that HS2 would help the North.

    Are you actually saying its another London based project.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,684
    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:


    Don’t the brass hats always offer up RAFAT towards the top of the list for cuts? It’s as if they’re daring the minister to be the one who takes the flak for killing the most visible thing the RAF do to most of the public - The Red Arrows.

    The problem is that they are on borrowed time as they fly the Hawk T1 the successor variants of which went out of production in 1997 (RAAF Hawk 127). Canopies are the limiting factor; once the current stock of spares have been consumed then that is the end of RAF T1 ops. The RAF only have 23 T2s in the forward fleet so they won't be assigning 9 of those to RAFAT2. Some unluckly SoS is going to have to announce it's over sooner or later.
    Can they not change to some other plane, what is the limitation.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 48,928
    kle4 said:

    eristdoof said:

    > @Icarus said:

    > To all pbers thinking of laying Boris. “ How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?” Sherlock Holmes All the others look pretty close to impossible.



    You do realise that Sherlock Holmes is fictional?

    The character said it, how else would you quote it? Quoting the author (I actually don't know if thst phrase was in the original stories) would just look weird. Or do you have an objection to pearls of wisdom from the fictional?
    "It's not what you know - it's what you can prove!" - Alonzo Harris.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    edited May 2019
    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:


    Don’t the brass hats always offer up RAFAT towards the top of the list for cuts? It’s as if they’re daring the minister to be the one who takes the flak for killing the most visible thing the RAF do to most of the public - The Red Arrows.

    The problem is that they are on borrowed time as they fly the Hawk T1 the successor variants of which went out of production in 1997 (RAAF Hawk 127). Canopies are the limiting factor; once the current stock of spares have been consumed then that is the end of RAF T1 ops. The RAF only have 23 T2s in the forward fleet so they won't be assigning 9 of those to RAFAT2. Some unluckly SoS is going to have to announce it's over sooner or later.
    Is the SoS not more likely to buy a dozen more of the T2, getting a good price from BAe subsidised by the profits on the Saudi order?

    In the grand scheme of military spending, £300m or so isn’t a lot of money over 20 years - and probably better value than most of the marketing the MoD does.

    Oh, and don’t underestimate the public sympathy and goodwill for the Reds. It’s massive.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 40,950
    edited May 2019

    Yeah, under the table. In Yemen, Colombia, Equatorial Guinea, Somalia, Algeria (mid-civil war), Cambodia (whilst the "KR" were still active), Republic of Congo etc etc.....
    You?

    That's some willy, walt.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 24,968
    > @Alanbrooke said:
    > > @another_richard said:
    > > > @rottenborough said:
    > > > Mr. Richard, quite a lot of reporting, back when it was higher on the agenda, of HS2 up here was about people annoyed it wouldn't be going to their town/city.
    > > >
    > > > I do wonder if HS2 will end up going London to Birmingham and then they'll stop.
    > > >
    > > > Depressingly likely. Even if the first bit actually gets built (and is now likely to be a victim of this summer's leadership contest), the 2nd bit will fail victim to the likely recession that is well due.
    > >
    > > I'm surprised at the complacency of HS2 supporters who have no shown any interest in the importance of construction actually beginning and especially getting construction started in the North.
    >
    > lots of cushy consultancy but no actial product

    It all adds to GDP.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. Topping, seems rather unreasonable for a poster to be criticised as an armchair general, then criticised for pointing out he isn't...
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 49,963
    edited May 2019
    > @TOPPING said:
    > Yeah, under the table. In Yemen, Colombia, Equatorial Guinea, Somalia, Algeria (mid-civil war), Cambodia (whilst the "KR" were still active), Republic of Congo etc etc.....
    > You?
    >
    > That's some willy, walt.

    Uh-huh.

    Take a pace back, or I might take your eye out....
  • RecidivistRecidivist Posts: 4,679
    This is worrying for democracy, but also means the polls are probably overstating the Lib Dems for the Euros. It turns out that non-UK EU citizens will only have a vote in the European elections if they were aware that they had to reregister for them.

    https://twitter.com/mvonschantz/status/1128673134218043394
  • Rexel56Rexel56 Posts: 807
    malcolmg said:

    Nigelb said:

    malcolmg said:

    Radio audiences are up, especially news stations as we approach (or not) Brexit.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-48279612



    Those who questioned Chris Evans' pay packet should note he has more than doubled Virgin Radio's audience. Otoh, Radio 2 is only slightly down.

    Is it up from 5 to 10 as his mum and pals listen.
    Unaccountably, his pals appear to number somewhere around a million.
    Perhaps his Mum is popular.
    PS: what did the million morons listen to before the switch
    Perhaps his Mum is just delighted that they have radio in the afterlife...
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    > @Recidivist said:
    > Radio audiences are up, especially news stations as we approach (or not) Brexit.
    >
    > https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-48279612
    >
    >
    >
    > Those who questioned Chris Evans' pay packet should note he has more than doubled Virgin Radio's audience. Otoh, Radio 2 is only slightly down.
    >
    > Is it up from 5 to 10 as his mum and pals listen.
    >
    > Unaccountably, his pals appear to number somewhere around a million.
    >
    > Perhaps his Mum is popular.
    > PS: what did the million morons listen to before the switch
    >
    > They spent all day on Political Betting.

    It should be easy to measure the worth of radio presenters. Audience figures are published, and comparisons can be made with peers on rival stations, with predecessors and with holiday stand-ins. It ought to be a meritocracy.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. Recidivist, useful information, and your conclusion, which might be slightly broadened to include the Greens, seems likely. If very few non-UK EU citizens are registered, and I don't know what the stats are, that'll hit the yellows.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 40,950
    edited May 2019

    Mr. Topping, seems rather unreasonable for a poster to be criticised as an armchair general, then criticised for pointing out he isn't...

    Morris if we had as many combat operatives as claim they were combat operatives there wouldn't be anyone left to man the naafi.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 47,789
    > @Recidivist said:
    > This is worrying for democracy, but also means the polls are probably overstating the Lib Dems for the Euros. It turns out that non-UK EU citizens will only have a vote in the European elections if they were aware that they had to reregister for them.
    >
    > https://twitter.com/mvonschantz/status/1128673134218043394

    Despite problems like that, I think the number of people registering will have exceeded previous elections so the participation rate of EU citizens should still be up.
  • not_on_firenot_on_fire Posts: 4,340
    > @DecrepitJohnL said:
    > > @Recidivist said:
    > > Radio audiences are up, especially news stations as we approach (or not) Brexit.
    > >
    > > https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-48279612
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > > Those who questioned Chris Evans' pay packet should note he has more than doubled Virgin Radio's audience. Otoh, Radio 2 is only slightly down.
    > >
    > > Is it up from 5 to 10 as his mum and pals listen.
    > >
    > > Unaccountably, his pals appear to number somewhere around a million.
    > >
    > > Perhaps his Mum is popular.
    > > PS: what did the million morons listen to before the switch
    > >
    > > They spent all day on Political Betting.
    >
    > It should be easy to measure the worth of radio presenters. Audience figures are published, and comparisons can be made with peers on rival stations, with predecessors and with holiday stand-ins. It ought to be a meritocracy.

    Your "meritocratic" approach would conclude that serious speech radio should be discontinued in favour of more pop music.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 12,884
    malcolmg said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:


    Don’t the brass hats always offer up RAFAT towards the top of the list for cuts? It’s as if they’re daring the minister to be the one who takes the flak for killing the most visible thing the RAF do to most of the public - The Red Arrows.

    The problem is that they are on borrowed time as they fly the Hawk T1 the successor variants of which went out of production in 1997 (RAAF Hawk 127). Canopies are the limiting factor; once the current stock of spares have been consumed then that is the end of RAF T1 ops. The RAF only have 23 T2s in the forward fleet so they won't be assigning 9 of those to RAFAT2. Some unluckly SoS is going to have to announce it's over sooner or later.
    Can they not change to some other plane, what is the limitation.
    Money.

    The RAF doesn't have anything else suitable. All of the training fleet is now owned and operated by external suppliers via the MFTS PFI.
  • not_on_firenot_on_fire Posts: 4,340
    Why is Chris Grayling allowed anywhere near the levers of Government?

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48288433

    "The decision to renationalise offender supervision will be seen as an admission by the government that Chris Grayling's flagship reforms have failed.

    He [Grayling] went ahead in 2014 despite numerous warnings about the considerable risks of splitting probation services between different providers and introducing a method of payment-by-results.

    Probation unions and criminal justice experts urged him to at least pilot the new approach, so problems could be identified and rectified. But Mr Grayling went for quick, wholesale change.

    He wanted the contracts with the private companies firmly in place before the 2015 general election so the system couldn't be undone if there was a change of government."
  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    Grretings from Menorca.. overheard in a bar in s'algar.. 4 ex pats plotting to sign up to the brexit party at £25 a pop.
  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    ...ex pats ahoikdnt get a vote on anything imho.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,812

    ...ex pats ahoikdnt get a vote on anything imho.

    Why don’t they vote in Spain?
  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    > @Gardenwalker said:
    > ...ex pats ahoikdnt get a vote on anything imho.
    >
    > Why don’t they vote in Spain?

    Quite so..
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,044
    https://twitter.com/ChristianJMay/status/1128917425410465792

    That'll be the pensions companies she is referring to.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 12,884
    Sandpit said:


    good price from BAe

    Haha. Good one.

  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    > @not_on_fire said:
    > > @DecrepitJohnL said:
    > > > @Recidivist said:
    > > > Radio audiences are up, especially news stations as we approach (or not) Brexit.
    > > >
    > > > https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-48279612
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > > Those who questioned Chris Evans' pay packet should note he has more than doubled Virgin Radio's audience. Otoh, Radio 2 is only slightly down.
    > > >
    > > > Is it up from 5 to 10 as his mum and pals listen.
    > > >
    > > > Unaccountably, his pals appear to number somewhere around a million.
    > > >
    > > > Perhaps his Mum is popular.
    > > > PS: what did the million morons listen to before the switch
    > > >
    > > > They spent all day on Political Betting.
    > >
    > > It should be easy to measure the worth of radio presenters. Audience figures are published, and comparisons can be made with peers on rival stations, with predecessors and with holiday stand-ins. It ought to be a meritocracy.
    >
    > Your "meritocratic" approach would conclude that serious speech radio should be discontinued in favour of more pop music.

    No it would not. Nor would it conclude that radio stations should broadcast their breakfast shows (which invariably garner the highest audiences) 24 hours a day. It does mean that stations can and do compare different news and current affairs presenters in similar slots and even on the same programme.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614

    Grretings from Menorca.. overheard in a bar in s'algar.. 4 ex pats plotting to sign up to the brexit party at £25 a pop.

    They’ll probably get turned down as actual members unless they’ve got a U.K. address and bank account. I let my (Con) membership lapse once I moved abroad properly, parties don’t want the hassle of a scandal involving foreign money.

    What they should have done is get registered to vote, but it’s too late now for the EU elections.
  • ralphmalphralphmalph Posts: 2,201
    > @Recidivist said:
    > This is worrying for democracy, but also means the polls are probably overstating the Lib Dems for the Euros. It turns out that non-UK EU citizens will only have a vote in the European elections if they were aware that they had to reregister for them.
    >
    > https://twitter.com/mvonschantz/status/1128673134218043394

    If you read the twitter thread the author has stated that the council has informed him that this has always been the case for EU elections. Seeing as the chap has been in the UK 26 years as he states he must have re-registered every time to vote.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 24,968
    > @rottenborough said:
    > https://twitter.com/ChristianJMay/status/1128917425410465792
    >
    > That'll be the pensions companies she is referring to.
    >
    >

    Current levels of wealth creation is insufficient to keep increasing current wealth consumption.

    So future wealth consumption will have to be stolen to pay for current wealth consumption.

    Tapping into wealth in pension funds will be deemed an easier way to do so than tapping into wealth in housing equity.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 24,968
    > @not_on_fire said:
    > Why is Chris Grayling allowed anywhere near the levers of Government?
    >
    > https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48288433
    >
    > "The decision to renationalise offender supervision will be seen as an admission by the government that Chris Grayling's flagship reforms have failed.
    >
    > He [Grayling] went ahead in 2014 despite numerous warnings about the considerable risks of splitting probation services between different providers and introducing a method of payment-by-results.
    >
    > Probation unions and criminal justice experts urged him to at least pilot the new approach, so problems could be identified and rectified. But Mr Grayling went for quick, wholesale change.
    >
    > He wanted the contracts with the private companies firmly in place before the 2015 general election so the system couldn't be undone if there was a change of government."

    Aside from Grayling's usual incompetence it shows the idiocy of thinking that future governments cannot reverse current policies.

    And they are most likely to reverse policies which have been hurriedly and incompetently implemented.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,590
    eristdoof said:

    > @kle4 said:

    > > @Icarus said:

    >

    > > To all pbers thinking of laying Boris. “ How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?” Sherlock Holmes All the others look pretty close to impossible.

    >

    >

    >

    > You do realise that Sherlock Holmes is fictional?

    >

    > The character said it, how else would you quote it? Quoting the author (I actually don't know if thst phrase was in the original stories) would just look weird. Or do you have an objection to pearls of wisdom from the fictional?



    It is a good sentence in the context of crime fiction. It is though logically wrong. When you have eliminated the impossible, there usually remains very many things which are still possible and one of those is the truth.

    In the context of a leadership election, it's not logically wrong.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 12,884





    That'll be the pensions companies she is referring to.
    My father recently supplied the following searing political analysis while watching RLB on TV:

    "I wouldn't like to see her tackle a forkful of chips."
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,074
    ah009 said:

    > @JosiasJessop said:

    >



    I am in a position to throw stones, having never voted either for Labour or the Conservatives





    Frankly, anybody who responds to either case by redirecting to the other is engaged in tribalist whataboutery and is more interested in scoring points than righting a wrong.



    I agree with you on the whataboutery response which does little to advance any sort of debate. As someone who has written a thread header on why the Tories should deal with anti-Muslim prejudice seriously (see here - http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2019/03/08/what-might-the-tories-learn-from-labour/) I hope you will think I am not trying to score points.

    But there are three serious problems which arise with this proposed definition which do not arise with the IHRA definition:-

    1. It confuses - perhaps deliberately - hatred of people who are Muslims with criticism of Islam, a belief system. That is extremely dangerous in a free society. No belief system should be protected from criticism. It would be as wrong to say that Catholicism should be exempt from criticism or the beliefs of Quakers or Hindus. Any religion, any belief system, is a choice. That choice should be open to criticism. Indeed, the fact that apostasy in Islam is - in the eyes of some Muslims - justification for death of the apostate is precisely the sort of thing that should be open to criticism. This definition could be used to stop that. The IHRA definition does not prevent criticism of the religion of Judaism. This definition is an attack on the freedom of though and speech of us all.

    2. It in effect imposes a Muslim blasphemy law on everyone. No. Just no. There should be no blasphemy laws. The IHRA definition does not do this for Judaism.

    3. It inhibits the fight against terrorism inspired by Islam or Islamist ideology. The criticisms of the police and security services should be taken very seriously. There are a number of Islamist groups which seek to prevent scrutiny of their actions by wrapping themselves up in the cloak of victims . This definition makes it easier to do this and thereby risks the security of us all.

    PART TWO TO FOLLOW



  • houndtanghoundtang Posts: 450
    I don't think Steve Baker should be completely written off. If he managed to get the ERG vote behind him maybe he could scrape through. He could then win a membership vote

    Of course the MPs might immediately no confidence him ..
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,074
    PART TWO

    Defining prejudice against a particular group while not inhibiting freedom of thought, speech or the fight against terrorism is a very difficult task indeed. This definition is utterly inadequate in this regard. On the whole I don’t think that one’s membership of a particular faith should be a protected characteristic. Unlike race or sex it is something one can change. Our choices are - and should be - open to criticism.

    Imagine what the reaction would be if, following the vicious attacks on Catholic churches in Sri Lanka or the murder of a Catholic priest in France while giving Communion, Catholics came up with a definition of Catholicophobia that prevented any criticism of its attitude to gay people or its record on clerical child abuse or the treatment of unmarried mothers in Ireland. We’d be up in arms - and rightly so.

    How a political party ensures that its members do not use insulting language against Muslims in the way that we have seen some people do is a hard task - and one that needs to be addressed. But no group is or should be beyond criticism. The IHRA definition does not stop Jews being criticised nor does it stop criticism of Israel.

    Criticism is not the same as prejudice. Blurring this crucial distinction is what this proposed definition does and why it is the wrong answer.


  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 49,963
    > @TOPPING said:
    > Mr. Topping, seems rather unreasonable for a poster to be criticised as an armchair general, then criticised for pointing out he isn't...
    >
    > Morris if we had as many combat operatives as claim they were combat operatives there wouldn't be anyone left to man the naafi.

    I've never claimed to be a "combat operative". Just employed those who were to stop me being kidnapped or killed.

    But then answering a different point to the one made is your SOP.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,719
    > @williamglenn said:
    > Poll ramping alert.
    >
    > https://twitter.com/roger_scully/status/1128936756215197696

    Brexit Party ahead in Wales?
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 40,950

    But then answering a different point to the one made is your SOP.

    So you have been on operations in "Yemen, Colombia, Equatorial Guinea, Somalia, Algeria (mid-civil war), Cambodia (whilst the "KR" were still active), Republic of Congo etc etc".

    That is some CV and if true I see your comment about the SLR = a long vs presumably your PW.

    Or have I got this wrong? What were you doing there?
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,548

    > @JosiasJessop said:

    > HS2 supporters should have demanded that construction start in the North and work southwards.

    >

    > That would just have been another way of killing the project, given the rationale and need behind it.

    >

    > "What, you're spending billions avoiding the area with the biggest problems the project is designed to fix? It's a white elephant!"



    I thought the rationale was that HS2 would help the North.



    Are you actually saying its another London based project.

    No. You might not have noticed, but Birmingham is not London, and neither are Leeds or Manchester - yet alone the places further north that will be serviced by the classic-compatible trains.

    However, the main need for HS2 is to increase capacity, and the biggest bottleneck is between London and Birmingham. The phase 2 extensions further north have much less of a rationale without that first phase.

    Again, the whole 'start in the north' argument is another one designed to kill the project.

    Another reason not to start in the north is Northern Powerhouse Rail: the delay will allow the two projects to (hopefully!) meld together as a system, rather than disparate entities.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 47,789
    > @HYUFD said:
    >
    > Brexit Party ahead in Wales?

    UKIP almost won in 2014 so it wouldn't be surprising.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,074
    edited May 2019
    I find it troubling that the Electoral Commission allowed this. Aren’t there meant to be rules governing this?
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 12,884
    It's a pretty strong logo even if they did just nick it off Hillary.

    I've always been very partial to the Samajwadi Party logo. I wish they did merch.


  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 40,950
    Cyclefree said:

    I find it troubling that the Electoral Commission allowed this. Aren’t there meant to be rules governing this?

    Not at all the Electoral Commission obviously realises that those who are going to vote Brexit Party are challenged in several ways and need all the help they can get. Otherwise, having looked at the ballot paper most of them would likely have no idea what to do next. This is a helpful hint and only fair, under the circs.
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 2,182
    > @Morris_Dancer said:
    > Mr. Cicero, it'd be very on trend for current politics if Boris became PM, won the next election, and lost his own seat.

    The electorate might well be in the mood for a whoopie cushion result like that :-)
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,704
    > @williamglenn said:
    > https://twitter.com/trevorbmbagency/status/1128244202117185536

    Like it or not, thats a f**king masterstroke of logo design...
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,725
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,124
    > @williamglenn said:
    > > @Recidivist said:
    > > This is worrying for democracy, but also means the polls are probably overstating the Lib Dems for the Euros. It turns out that non-UK EU citizens will only have a vote in the European elections if they were aware that they had to reregister for them.
    > >
    > > https://twitter.com/mvonschantz/status/1128673134218043394
    >
    > Despite problems like that, I think the number of people registering will have exceeded previous elections so the participation rate of EU citizens should still be up.

    I had to register in Spain. The man must be an idiot.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 24,968
    > @JosiasJessop said:
    > > @JosiasJessop said:
    >
    > > HS2 supporters should have demanded that construction start in the North and work southwards.
    >
    > >
    >
    > > That would just have been another way of killing the project, given the rationale and need behind it.
    >
    > >
    >
    > > "What, you're spending billions avoiding the area with the biggest problems the project is designed to fix? It's a white elephant!"
    >
    >
    >
    > I thought the rationale was that HS2 would help the North.
    >
    >
    >
    > Are you actually saying its another London based project.
    >
    > No. You might not have noticed, but Birmingham is not London, and neither are Leeds or Manchester - yet alone the places further north that will be serviced by the classic-compatible trains.
    >
    > However, the main need for HS2 is to increase capacity, and the biggest bottleneck is between London and Birmingham. The phase 2 extensions further north have much less of a rationale without that first phase.
    >
    > Again, the whole 'start in the north' argument is another one designed to kill the project.
    >
    > Another reason not to start in the north is Northern Powerhouse Rail: the delay will allow the two projects to (hopefully!) meld together as a system, rather than disparate entities.

    Good of you to confirm that HS2 was always about London.
  • ah009ah009 Posts: 436
    > @Cyclefree said:
    > I hope you will think I am not trying to score points.

    Far from it. Your post was very good. And a refreshing contrast with those who, instead of engaging with the substance of the issue, just attack the "other" side. More of this!
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,756
    edited May 2019
    > @Dura_Ace said:
    > https://twitter.com/trevorbmbagency/status/1128244202117185536
    >
    >
    >
    > It's a pretty strong logo even if they did just nick it off Hillary.
    >
    > I've always been very partial to the Samajwadi Party logo. I wish they did merch.


    A fixie (cool) or Sturmey Archer (not so cool)?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,719
    > @williamglenn said:
    > > @HYUFD said:
    > >
    > > Brexit Party ahead in Wales?
    >
    > UKIP almost won in 2014 so it wouldn't be surprising.

    Labour still narrowly won in 2014 in Wales though, if the Brexit Party lead in Wales in the European Parliament elections that will be confirmation they are now doing even better than UKIP did in 2014
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,548

    > @JosiasJessop said:

    > > @JosiasJessop said:

    >

    > > HS2 supporters should have demanded that construction start in the North and work southwards.

    >

    > >

    >

    > > That would just have been another way of killing the project, given the rationale and need behind it.

    >

    > >

    >

    > > "What, you're spending billions avoiding the area with the biggest problems the project is designed to fix? It's a white elephant!"

    >

    >

    >

    > I thought the rationale was that HS2 would help the North.

    >

    >

    >

    > Are you actually saying its another London based project.

    >

    > No. You might not have noticed, but Birmingham is not London, and neither are Leeds or Manchester - yet alone the places further north that will be serviced by the classic-compatible trains.

    >

    > However, the main need for HS2 is to increase capacity, and the biggest bottleneck is between London and Birmingham. The phase 2 extensions further north have much less of a rationale without that first phase.

    >

    > Again, the whole 'start in the north' argument is another one designed to kill the project.

    >

    > Another reason not to start in the north is Northern Powerhouse Rail: the delay will allow the two projects to (hopefully!) meld together as a system, rather than disparate entities.



    Good of you to confirm that HS2 was always about London.

    I really cannot see how you make that conclusion from what I've written.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,719
    > @williamglenn said:
    > https://twitter.com/trevorbmbagency/status/1128244202117185536

    Comparing the Brexit Party's PR and marketing this campaign to CUK's is like comparing the Ritz to a travelodge
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 12,884

    > @Dura_Ace said:

    >



    >

    >

    >

    > It's a pretty strong logo even if they did just nick it off Hillary.

    >

    > I've always been very partial to the Samajwadi Party logo. I wish they did merch.





    A fixie (cool) or Sturmey Archer (not so cool)?
    I presume it's a traditional Indian brand like a Hero so it'll have a single speed freewheel. Sturmey Archer are owned by Sunrace now so the products are much better quality but no cooler.
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