> I make an impassioned appeal for language not to be treated with such cavalier disdain in the furtherance of Conservative partisanship.
I'd take Trump over Corbyn any day. Call it Tory bigotry if you will, but I have thought long and hard about antisemitism and have decided that I am opposed to it.
You obviously prefer your racism to be more inclusive.
> @Charles said: > Rory Stewart doing a John Major in Hyde Park. I doubt he’ll get anywhere but he is one of the few who is bothering to engage with the voters for real - not in expensively produced videos. He deserves considerable credit for that. > > I think he’s playing a long game
He might get a surprise 15-20 votes or so in the first round, if he's lucky.
If Boris does make the final two (clearly) I could easily see the other candidate pulling out - with encouragement - on the basis that Boris would have won the members vote easily anyway (polling) and the country need certainty on the next PM asap.
> @kle4 said: > > @nico67 said: > > Just ditch the membership vote as Bozo looks like a shoe in. > > > > Let’s quickly get to the final chapter of the SS Brexit hitting the iceberg . Sadly we won’t be able to laugh and deride the USA for voting in Trump anymore . > > > > The next UK PM will be just another serial liar and charlatan . The UKs descent from outward looking respected nation to global laughing stock will be complete . > > > > If Scotland has any sense they should get out quickly and not be dragged into the same cesspit as the rest of the UK. > ------------------------------------------- > Give the laughing stock thing a rest would you? People are obsessed with being embarrassed as a nation, which funnily enough is itself just embarrassing. If people think a nation is a laughing stock purely because of its leader or temporary politics well first of all that does not speak well of them, and for another will quickly pass when things change in future so while no one wants to be laughed at, it should not be so concerning that people cry great big crocodile tears about it constantly. Why not threaten to emigrate if Boris is PM while you're at it, it's part of the usual blather people pull with such embarrassment talk, whether it's about Tories or Corbyn or whoever.
A country's reputation matters. Part of Britain's USP has been its essential political stability, good governance, pragmatism and basic competence. It is putting that at risk and that risks jobs, investment, and our ability to use what soft power we have. If you are not taken seriously because your leadership is viewed with dismay or pity or contempt then that does have an impact.
Look at Italy and Berlusconi (or frankly any of its leaders since De Gasperi). Look at France in the 1950s before De Gaulle came back and pulled it out of its troubles.
If we were having an intelligent if challenging conversation about our European strategy, that would be one thing. It might be difficult and messy but it would look grown up and intelligent. But we're not. We're retreating into a fantasy world where we overstate our own importance and see anyone not doing what we want as being part of some malicious conspiracy against us.
I remember working in Brussels when Thatcher had started changing people's perception of Britain. It was a revelation to see how she had changed how people looked at Britain. They didn't necessarily like her but they respected her and what she was trying to do.
Does anyone in their right mind really think that Boris or any of the others, to the extent they're known, are respected? Does anyone think that anyone understands what they're trying to do - other than to get themselves out of the hole they've created?
> @Casino_Royale said: > > @Charles said: > > Rory Stewart doing a John Major in Hyde Park. I doubt he’ll get anywhere but he is one of the few who is bothering to engage with the voters for real - not in expensively produced videos. He deserves considerable credit for that. > > > > I think he’s playing a long game > > He might get a surprise 15-20 votes or so in the first round, if he's lucky.
It would be funny if the parliamentary party contrived to put him on the ballot, Corbyn style, and he beat Boris.
> @Casino_Royale said: > On topic, I'm not taking this bet. > > If Boris does make the final two (clearly) I could easily see the other candidate pulling out - with encouragement - on the basis that Boris would have won the members vote easily anyway (polling) and the country need certainty on the next PM asap.
Oh great. Another coronation. Just like the previous one. And that went so well, didn't it.
Is there anyone in the Tory party with a brain? Anyone??
> @kle4 said: > > @Cyclefree said: > > > @rottenborough said: > > > Nice graphics. > > > > > > If only this wasn't a horse race, but one of the most important political events in our lifetimes... > > > > > > https://twitter.com/326Pols/status/1135622318171066374 > > > > And of that list of numpties only one is out talking to people. > > > > Boris is spending money on professional videos and making himself seem inevitable like Brown. > > > > Raab is utterly repellent: there is something really quite sinister and dishonest about him. > > > > Sajid Javid is just hopeless; Hancock - nice boy, would be polite to your Mum and likes horses but does not have a clue what to do. > > > > Malthouse, Harper, Cleverly, Gmiyah: who? > > > > McVey: no, just no. > > > > Leadsom: overrated. > > > > Stewart: his plan is too late given where we are and what his party is now like. He's interesting and thoughtful but probably in the wrong party. Maybe next time. > > > > No-one has any idea how to sort Brexit in the time available. And with rare exceptions they seem to care more about themselves or their party than the country or the people in it. > > > > Honestly, what is the point of politics at the moment? They're all intent on driving us down a cul de sac leading to a cliff. > > > > ------------------------------------- > You forgot Hunt. Which says it all. > > As for politics, serious stuff is on hold for a couple of months. Perhaps we will even see Lab join the hunt for a new leader if BXP win Peterborough, which they might as well since the summer will be taken up with Tory and LD leadership contests, and bugger all actual progress. > > We're literally wasting another 2 months, avoiding doing anything about Brexit while we talk about what we would all like to do if only things would happen as we want, which they won't. > > It's almost artistic in how much it embodies the concept of futility.
I forgot Gove as well. Makes no difference. Neither of them have a clue.
> @kle4 said: > > @Cyclefree said: > > > @rottenborough said: > > > Nice graphics. > > > > > > If only this wasn't a horse race, but one of the most important political events in our lifetimes... > > > > > > https://twitter.com/326Pols/status/1135622318171066374 > > > > And of that list of numpties only one is out talking to people. > > > > Boris is spending money on professional videos and making himself seem inevitable like Brown. > > > > Raab is utterly repellent: there is something really quite sinister and dishonest about him. > > > > Sajid Javid is just hopeless; Hancock - nice boy, would be polite to your Mum and likes horses but does not have a clue what to do. > > > > Malthouse, Harper, Cleverly, Gmiyah: who? > > > > McVey: no, just no. > > > > Leadsom: overrated. > > > > Stewart: his plan is too late given where we are and what his party is now like. He's interesting and thoughtful but probably in the wrong party. Maybe next time. > > > > No-one has any idea how to sort Brexit in the time available. And with rare exceptions they seem to care more about themselves or their party than the country or the people in it. > > > > Honestly, what is the point of politics at the moment? They're all intent on driving us down a cul de sac leading to a cliff. > > > > ------------------------------------- > You forgot Hunt. Which says it all. > > As for politics, serious stuff is on hold for a couple of months. Perhaps we will even see Lab join the hunt for a new leader if BXP win Peterborough, which they might as well since the summer will be taken up with Tory and LD leadership contests, and bugger all actual progress. > > We're literally wasting another 2 months, avoiding doing anything about Brexit while we talk about what we would all like to do if only things would happen as we want, which they won't. > > It's almost artistic in how much it embodies the concept of futility.
Glad to see Cleverly getting as many votes as Leadsom.
Before the electoral update, a quick horse racing update. I hope those who followed my Oaks and Derby tips kept the faith after MAQSAD patently didn't stay on Friday. My each way wager on MADHMOON returned a nice little profit which put me ahead over the two races.
On to the latest Danish poll news with the election on Wednesday. Voxmeter's daily poll shows a huge lead for the centre-left bloc with nearly 60% of the vote which equates to 108 seats in the Folketing leaving just 67 fort the centre-right.
I have to say that looks a big outlier -Norstat shows a 55-45 lead in vote share for the centre-left which is more in common with what we've seen in other polls. A third poll for "Greens" (don't know it that is the Party or a polling organisation) has the race tightening to 53-47.
If it means anything (and it may not), Norstat's poll has the field work done yesterday so may be the most accurate.
Just a word on the French approval numbers which have seen a doubling (from 20 to 40%) of positive approval for Yannick Jadot, leader of the French Greens, who enjoyed a strong result in the European elections coming in third behind En Marche and the National Front with 13% of the vote.
Off topic. I apologies for posting a Guido link but he's sharing gossip that the CHUK group will split after a meeting tomorrow.
Does anyone know if CHUK MPs joining the Lib Dems would be eligible to stand for LD leader?
Would seem a bit harsh on others given you have to join the party by the end of this week just to have a vote in the contest. And hustings already started.
From their constitution:
"(a) Nominations must be of a Member of the Parliamentary Party in the House of Commons, who must be proposed by at least ten percent of other members of the Parliamentary Party in the House of Commons and supported by 200 members in aggregate in not less than 20 Local Parties (including, for this purpose, the Specified Associated Organisations representing youth and/or students). (b) Nominations from the Parliamentary Party shall not include the candidate themselves. (c) A nominator may not subscribe to more nomination papers than there are vacancies in the election being held.(d) Nominations must be accompanied by the written consent of the candidate.(e) All the forms set out in this regulation may be submitted via email. (f) After acquiring the necessary nominations for candidacy, each candidate may nominatean agent for their campaign. A candidate who fails to nominate an agent will be deemed their own agent. "
I never did check to see if there was a market on which CUK MP would defect from it first though, which is a shame. Defect once and it is easy to do it again, especially when you only have one policy, which another party shares.
But no shame to them nevertheless - what they did was tough and brave.
> No, Corbyn is a disgusting anti-Semite who supports dictators like Maduro.
What I'm wondering is why so many people are so quick to deflect criticism of US President Donald Trump by banging on about UK Leader of the Opposition Jeremy Corbyn.
A country's reputation matters. Part of Britain's USP has been its essential political stability, good governance, pragmatism and basic competence. It is putting that at risk and that risks jobs, investment, and our ability to use what soft power we have. If you are not taken seriously because your leadership is viewed with dismay or pity or contempt then that does have an impact.
Look at Italy and Berlusconi (or frankly any of its leaders since De Gasperi). Look at France in the 1950s before De Gaulle came back and pulled it out of its troubles.
If we were having an intelligent if challenging conversation about our European strategy, that would be one thing. It might be difficult and messy but it would look grown up and intelligent. But we're not. We're retreating into a fantasy world where we overstate our own importance and see anyone not doing what we want as being part of some malicious conspiracy against us.
I remember working in Brussels when Thatcher had started changing people's perception of Britain. It was a revelation to see how she had changed how people looked at Britain. They didn't necessarily like her but they respected her and what she was trying to do.
Does anyone in their right mind really think that Boris or any of the others, to the extent they're known, are respected? Does anyone think that anyone understands what they're trying to do - other than to get themselves out of the hole they've created?
I did not say reputation did not matter. I said no one wants to be laughed at precisely because it does matter to some degree. But I'm sorry, when people are constantly going on and on and on and on about how much of a laughing stock we are and how embarrassed every must be about this, it is just overblown. Something can have some relevance and still be massively overdone, and the unintended thrust of many peoples' lamentations is that nations should only ever do what others want them to do. It also massively overstates how as you note we can be pulled out of such things. Sure, you don't want to be in that state to begin with, but a bit of perspective would no go amiss. I use this next term knowing it is usually used from right to left but I think it applies very well to both sides (the Tory candidates are doing it now on no deal), and that is it is virute signalling - which also does not mean the thing being signalled is false or should not be signalled all. But people often seem to compete to show how much they can say how embarrassed we must all be.
I'll be plenty embarrassed by Boris, believe you me, and regretful of my part leading to his rise, but a competition to show how ashamed we all are of ourselves is not merely worrying about reputation, it's wallowing.
I forgot Gove as well. Makes no difference. Neither of them have a clue.
Very few are honest about the options that are open to them - they cannot if they are to win - and fewer still have a plan on what to do next that addresses the issues, and fewer than that have a realistic plan.
It's going to be a very strange summer. The Tories might get sub 10% in Peterborough, and expect them to go even more nuts if that happens - a knighthood to Farage as quickly as possible as they try to pay obeisance without looking like it is obeisance.
> Rory Stewart doing a John Major in Hyde Park. I doubt he’ll get anywhere but he is one of the few who is bothering to engage with the voters for real - not in expensively produced videos. He deserves considerable credit for that.
>
> I think he’s playing a long game
He might get a surprise 15-20 votes or so in the first round, if he's lucky.
I'm sure he would be thrilled with that amount. As a no hoper it's a decent enough chunk.
> Rory Stewart doing a John Major in Hyde Park. I doubt he’ll get anywhere but he is one of the few who is bothering to engage with the voters for real - not in expensively produced videos. He deserves considerable credit for that.
>
> I think he’s playing a long game
He might get a surprise 15-20 votes or so in the first round, if he's lucky.
I'm sure he would be thrilled with that amount. As a no hoper it's a decent enough chunk.
Rory Stewart would make a good Home Secretary IMO.
> Rory Stewart doing a John Major in Hyde Park. I doubt he’ll get anywhere but he is one of the few who is bothering to engage with the voters for real - not in expensively produced videos. He deserves considerable credit for that.
>
> I think he’s playing a long game
He might get a surprise 15-20 votes or so in the first round, if he's lucky.
I'm sure he would be thrilled with that amount. As a no hoper it's a decent enough chunk.
Rory Stewart would make a good Home Secretary IMO.
But even if chosen could he serve under a no dealer? And anyone who claims they are going for a new deal and if not we leave anyway is a no dealer in disguise, and that is most of them.
> > Just ditch the membership vote as Bozo looks like a shoe in.
> >
> > Let’s quickly get to the final chapter of the SS Brexit hitting the iceberg . Sadly we won’t be able to laugh and deride the USA for voting in Trump anymore .
> >
> > The next UK PM will be just another serial liar and charlatan . The UKs descent from outward looking respected nation to global laughing stock will be complete .
> >
> > If Scotland has any sense they should get out quickly and not be dragged into the same cesspit as the rest of the UK.
> -------------------------------------------
> Give the
A country's reputation matters. Part of Britain's USP has been its essential political stability, good governance, pragmatism and basic competence. It is putting that at risk and that risks jobs, investment, and our ability to use what soft power we have. If you are not taken seriously because your leadership is viewed with dismay or pity or contempt then that does have an impact.
Look at Italy and Berlusconi (or frankly any of its leaders since De Gasperi). Look at France in the 1950s before De Gaulle came back and pulled it out of its troubles.
If we were having an intelligent if challenging conversation about our European strategy, that would be one thing. It might be difficult and messy but it would look grown up and intelligent. But we're not. We're retreating into a fantasy world where we overstate our own importance and see anyone not doing what we want as being part of some malicious conspiracy against us.
I remember working in Brussels when Thatcher had started changing people's perception of Britain. It was a revelation to see how she had changed how people looked at Britain. They didn't necessarily like her but they respected her and what she was trying to do.
Does anyone in their right mind really think that Boris or any of the others, to the extent they're known, are respected? Does anyone think that anyone understands what they're trying to do - other than to get themselves out of the hole they've created?
The nation is always a laughing stock, to people who disagree with the government of the day.
> > Just ditch the membership vote as Bozo looks like a shoe in.
> >
> > Let’s quickly get to the final chapter of the SS Brexit hitting the iceberg . Sadly we won’t be able to laugh and deride the USA for voting in Trump anymore .
> >
> > The next UK PM will be just another serial liar and charlatan . The UKs descent from outward looking respected nation to global laughing stock will be complete .
> >
> > If Scotland has any sense they should get out quickly and not be dragged into the same cesspit as the rest of the UK.
> -------------------------------------------
> Give the
A country's reputation matters. Part of Britain's USP has been its essential political stability, good governance, pragmatism and basic competence. It is putting that at risk and that risks jobs, investment, and our ability to use what soft power we have. If you are not taken seriously because your leadership is viewed with dismay or pity or contempt then that does have an impact.
Look at Italy and Berlusconi (or frankly any of its leaders since De Gasperi). Look at France in the 1950s before De Gaulle came back and pulled it out of its troubles.
If we were having an intelligent if challenging conversation about our European strategy, that would be one thing. It might be difficult and messy but it would look grown up and intelligent. But we're not. We're retreating into a fantasy world where we overstate our own importance and see anyone not doing what we want as being part of some malicious conspiracy against us.
I remember working in Brussels when Thatcher had started changing people's perception of Britain. It was a revelation to see how she had changed how people looked at Britain. They didn't necessarily like her but they respected her and what she was trying to do.
Does anyone in their right mind really think that Boris or any of the others, to the extent they're known, are respected? Does anyone think that anyone understands what they're trying to do - other than to get themselves out of the hole they've created?
The nation is always a laughing stock, to people who disagree with the government of the day.
That’s tosh.
I never thought the UK was a laughing stock even under many Tory governments which I fundamentally disagreed with.
I find it difficult enough to understand why Tory members would want Bozo as leader, but MPs? WTF? These people are meant to have some degree of intelligence and common sense, how can they be seduced by a bullshitting, blustering buffoon?
I think the Libdem vs Brexit party ad is probably targeted quite specifically, or else they are trying different things out with the Facebook algorithm.
I wonder whether Boris supporters might engage in tactical voting if they think they already have the 105 votes in order to go through to the members' ballot. If they do, they could organise for excess votes to go to the candidate they think is least likely to challenge Boris with the members.
The kind of people annoyed at Corbyn for attending a Trump protest are generally going to be the kind of people who don't like Corbyn anyway. I can't see it doing him any harm.
I'd be surprised if support for Trump among Labour voters is anything higher than low single figures (guessing at least one or two though) you possibly have some people in the UK like Susan Sarandon who threatened (at some point I think) to vote for Trump over Hillary but actually supporting/liking Trump is a very minority sport among Labour voters.
I think he'd do better among Tory voters but I think there would be plenty who wouldn't like him, Brexit Party voters would be his best group at a guess.
I find it difficult enough to understand why Tory members would want Bozo as leader, but MPs? WTF? These people are meant to have some degree of intelligence and common sense, how can they be seduced by a bullshitting, blustering buffoon?
The easy answer is they do not have have such degrees of intellect or common sense, but I think the simplest answer is that they have not been seduced, they are desperate. Boris is popular with the Members, able to get away with not being a true Brexiteer for some reason, and even though it was many years ago in a very different environment, the memory of his London wins is enough to make them think he might be able to save them if they no deal. I know Tories who deeply dislike him but back him - they truly are putting party before country.
I think the Libdem vs Brexit party ad is probably targeted quite specifically, or else they are trying different things out with the Facebook algorithm.
Just checked, that's their most funded Peterborough FB ad (they also have an anti-Corbyn one but they've spent a lot less on it)
I wonder whether Boris supporters might engage in tactical voting if they think they already have the 105 votes in order to go through to the members' ballot. If they do, they could organise for excess votes to go to the candidate they think is least likely to challenge Boris with the members.
Isn't that the same mistake that ended up with Labour being led by Corbyn?
The guy who wants to get rid of workers rights , and wants to turn the UK into a capitalists fantasy !
I know. The abuse of language is becoming endemic. We just shrug it off now. It's the new normal.
At least back in the day (pre 2016) the terms bandied around had some sort of real world meaning.
"Trickle Down Economics", for example, the Reagan era theory of choice, the phrase summed up exactly what it was truly all about. Stuff 'trickling down' from rich people onto the poor.
Donald Trump is apparently being served steamed filet of halibut to start, complemented by a watercress mousse, asparagus spears and a chervil sauce.
Then new season Windsor lamb with herb stuffing, spring vegetables and a port sauce, followed by strawberry sable with a helping of lemon verbena cream for dessert.
I'm sure he'd have been happier with a large Big Mac and fries!
The guy who wants to get rid of workers rights , and wants to turn the UK into a capitalists fantasy !
Very much the Arbeit Macht Frei candidate!
I know you suggest earlier meanings, but 99.9% of people likely think of it relating to concentration camps.... It really isn't a good look to keep referring to it.
No need to reduce the field early then, just votes closer together, very sensible. Though I see the plan is to cull if they have less than 10, presumably so 4 rounds is all they need.
Also means May should make it to July and get her three year commemorative badge.
Boris's campaign looked pretty well planned out to me. It's proceeding on the basis that if he gets to the final two he wins the members vote by default, so he's spending little time with the public and almost all of it behind the scenes wining, dining and wooing MPs one by one, and releasing a few more each day to keep momentum up, thereby pressuring the others.
> Rory Stewart doing a John Major in Hyde Park. I doubt he’ll get anywhere but he is one of the few who is bothering to engage with the voters for real - not in expensively produced videos. He deserves considerable credit for that.
>
> I think he’s playing a long game
He might get a surprise 15-20 votes or so in the first round, if he's lucky.
I'm sure he would be thrilled with that amount. As a no hoper it's a decent enough chunk.
Rory Stewart would make a good Home Secretary IMO.
No. Give him a role that he understands. Environment would be a good fit.
Boris's campaign looked pretty well planned out to me. It's proceeding on the basis that if he gets to the final two he wins the members vote by default, so he's spending little time with the public and almost all of it behind the scenes wining, dining and wooing MPs one by one, and releasing a few more each day to keep momentum up, thereby pressuring the others.
The kind of people annoyed at Corbyn for attending a Trump protest are generally going to be the kind of people who don't like Corbyn anyway. I can't see it doing him any harm.
I'd be surprised if support for Trump among Labour voters is anything higher than low single figures (guessing at least one or two though) you possibly have some people in the UK like Susan Sarandon who threatened (at some point I think) to vote for Trump over Hillary but actually supporting/liking Trump is a very minority sport among Labour voters.
I think he'd do better among Tory voters but I think there would be plenty who wouldn't like him, Brexit Party voters would be his best group at a guess.
YouGov in May had 30% of Leave voters saying they would have voted for Trump and 37% for Hillary Clinton, far closer than voters as a whole who would have voted for Hillary over Trump 54% to 16% (Tory voters split 29% for Trump and 44% for Hillary).
66% of Leave voters thought the State visit should go ahead and 60% thought he should meet the Queen, compared to 46% and 41% respectively of voters as a whole
"Birmingham LGBT row parents vow to continue school protests
Protesters against LGBT teaching at a Birmingham primary school have vowed to continue their opposition despite being banned from gathering outside the gates."
"Birmingham LGBT row parents vow to continue school protests
Protesters against LGBT teaching at a Birmingham primary school have vowed to continue their opposition despite being banned from gathering outside the gates."
We've got another week just to decide if people want to run? For fuck's sake.
Another funny thing to happen, given this timetable only applies because of May's announced departure date as party leader, would be if she 'forgets' to do so and leaves it over the weekend.
Through their arrogance in assuming they would flourish simply because of who they were, without doing any work on what they stood for or how to achieve it, in a sense they never left the Labour and Tory parties at all.
A super trouper, in fact. The lights are gonna find her...
Triggers me to end the evening with a joke that I have made up and depending on my mood think is either quite good or utterly crap and borderline childish.
Sweden, mid July, and Agnetha Faltskog just cannot sleep. It's 1 am and she still can't get off. To sleep. Perhaps because, this being Scandanavia, and it being high summer, it's broad daylight outside. The sun is out for god's sake!
So nothing for it, she gets up and goes out for a walk. It's actually quite hot!
Boris's campaign looked pretty well planned out to me. It's proceeding on the basis that if he gets to the final two he wins the members vote by default, so he's spending little time with the public and almost all of it behind the scenes wining, dining and wooing MPs one by one, and releasing a few more each day to keep momentum up, thereby pressuring the others.
Boris's campaign looked pretty well planned out to me. It's proceeding on the basis that if he gets to the final two he wins the members vote by default, so he's spending little time with the public and almost all of it behind the scenes wining, dining and wooing MPs one by one, and releasing a few more each day to keep momentum up, thereby pressuring the others.
He must be getting good advice.
Oh wow.
Hallelujia! Commenting is fixed.
Which is ironic, as we're changing system after I move house next week.
Ultimately there remains only one way to stop Boris becoming PM: the majority of both the moderate and hardline wings of the party unite around an alternative candidate each.
Hunt and Gove look to be neck-and-neck to be the leading moderate (loosely defined as anyone who isn't currently threatening to leave with no deal on 31 October). I expect one of them will reach the final two, but not both. Gove is probably the most sensible choice: someone who had a prominent role as a leaver in the referendum campaign, but who seems to remain somewhat anchored to reality. I cannot see any qualities from Hunt that make him any better suited to the task at hand than May, other than by virtue of having not yet failed at it.
The only question is whether the hard Brexit wing will unite around a candidate they can trust more than Boris (surely a low bar...)? Given that the two front-runners either have the electoral appeal of Ian Duncan Smith or have previously managed to lose in a two-horse race against the formidable campaigner that is Theresa May, I can understand why they are searching around for anyone or their dog to take up the mantle.
Comments
> Rory Stewart doing a John Major in Hyde Park. I doubt he’ll get anywhere but he is one of the few who is bothering to engage with the voters for real - not in expensively produced videos. He deserves considerable credit for that.
>
> I think he’s playing a long game
He might get a surprise 15-20 votes or so in the first round, if he's lucky.
> can we all agree the Queen is a bloody trooper dealing with all this?
Yes
If Boris does make the final two (clearly) I could easily see the other candidate pulling out - with encouragement - on the basis that Boris would have won the members vote easily anyway (polling) and the country need certainty on the next PM asap.
> can we all agree the Queen is a bloody trooper dealing with all this?
And a trouper, too.
> > @nico67 said:
> > Just ditch the membership vote as Bozo looks like a shoe in.
> >
> > Let’s quickly get to the final chapter of the SS Brexit hitting the iceberg . Sadly we won’t be able to laugh and deride the USA for voting in Trump anymore .
> >
> > The next UK PM will be just another serial liar and charlatan . The UKs descent from outward looking respected nation to global laughing stock will be complete .
> >
> > If Scotland has any sense they should get out quickly and not be dragged into the same cesspit as the rest of the UK.
> -------------------------------------------
> Give the laughing stock thing a rest would you? People are obsessed with being embarrassed as a nation, which funnily enough is itself just embarrassing. If people think a nation is a laughing stock purely because of its leader or temporary politics well first of all that does not speak well of them, and for another will quickly pass when things change in future so while no one wants to be laughed at, it should not be so concerning that people cry great big crocodile tears about it constantly. Why not threaten to emigrate if Boris is PM while you're at it, it's part of the usual blather people pull with such embarrassment talk, whether it's about Tories or Corbyn or whoever.
A country's reputation matters. Part of Britain's USP has been its essential political stability, good governance, pragmatism and basic competence. It is putting that at risk and that risks jobs, investment, and our ability to use what soft power we have. If you are not taken seriously because your leadership is viewed with dismay or pity or contempt then that does have an impact.
Look at Italy and Berlusconi (or frankly any of its leaders since De Gasperi). Look at France in the 1950s before De Gaulle came back and pulled it out of its troubles.
If we were having an intelligent if challenging conversation about our European strategy, that would be one thing. It might be difficult and messy but it would look grown up and intelligent. But we're not. We're retreating into a fantasy world where we overstate our own importance and see anyone not doing what we want as being part of some malicious conspiracy against us.
I remember working in Brussels when Thatcher had started changing people's perception of Britain. It was a revelation to see how she had changed how people looked at Britain. They didn't necessarily like her but they respected her and what she was trying to do.
Does anyone in their right mind really think that Boris or any of the others, to the extent they're known, are respected? Does anyone think that anyone understands what they're trying to do - other than to get themselves out of the hole they've created?
> > @Charles said:
> > Rory Stewart doing a John Major in Hyde Park. I doubt he’ll get anywhere but he is one of the few who is bothering to engage with the voters for real - not in expensively produced videos. He deserves considerable credit for that.
> >
> > I think he’s playing a long game
>
> He might get a surprise 15-20 votes or so in the first round, if he's lucky.
It would be funny if the parliamentary party contrived to put him on the ballot, Corbyn style, and he beat Boris.
> On topic, I'm not taking this bet.
>
> If Boris does make the final two (clearly) I could easily see the other candidate pulling out - with encouragement - on the basis that Boris would have won the members vote easily anyway (polling) and the country need certainty on the next PM asap.
Oh great. Another coronation. Just like the previous one. And that went so well, didn't it.
Is there anyone in the Tory party with a brain? Anyone??
> > @Cyclefree said:
> > > @rottenborough said:
> > > Nice graphics.
> > >
> > > If only this wasn't a horse race, but one of the most important political events in our lifetimes...
> > >
> > > https://twitter.com/326Pols/status/1135622318171066374
> >
> > And of that list of numpties only one is out talking to people.
> >
> > Boris is spending money on professional videos and making himself seem inevitable like Brown.
> >
> > Raab is utterly repellent: there is something really quite sinister and dishonest about him.
> >
> > Sajid Javid is just hopeless; Hancock - nice boy, would be polite to your Mum and likes horses but does not have a clue what to do.
> >
> > Malthouse, Harper, Cleverly, Gmiyah: who?
> >
> > McVey: no, just no.
> >
> > Leadsom: overrated.
> >
> > Stewart: his plan is too late given where we are and what his party is now like. He's interesting and thoughtful but probably in the wrong party. Maybe next time.
> >
> > No-one has any idea how to sort Brexit in the time available. And with rare exceptions they seem to care more about themselves or their party than the country or the people in it.
> >
> > Honestly, what is the point of politics at the moment? They're all intent on driving us down a cul de sac leading to a cliff.
> >
>
> -------------------------------------
> You forgot Hunt. Which says it all.
>
> As for politics, serious stuff is on hold for a couple of months. Perhaps we will even see Lab join the hunt for a new leader if BXP win Peterborough, which they might as well since the summer will be taken up with Tory and LD leadership contests, and bugger all actual progress.
>
> We're literally wasting another 2 months, avoiding doing anything about Brexit while we talk about what we would all like to do if only things would happen as we want, which they won't.
>
> It's almost artistic in how much it embodies the concept of futility.
I forgot Gove as well. Makes no difference. Neither of them have a clue.
> can we all agree the Queen is a bloody trooper dealing with all this?
Yes. A national figure who we will truly miss when she passes. I suspect that the advise she gives her PMs is probably some of the best they receive.
> What's happening with Sir Graham Brady's campaign ?
He's waiting to see how many letters he gets.....
A veiled reference to things like the UN, NATO and of course the EU.
Does anyone know if CHUK MPs joining the Lib Dems would be eligible to stand for LD leader?
Edit: Sorry but link didnt work - https://order-order.com/2019/06/03/chuk-mps-break-meeting-tomorrow/
> > @Cyclefree said:
> > > @rottenborough said:
> > > Nice graphics.
> > >
> > > If only this wasn't a horse race, but one of the most important political events in our lifetimes...
> > >
> > > https://twitter.com/326Pols/status/1135622318171066374
> >
> > And of that list of numpties only one is out talking to people.
> >
> > Boris is spending money on professional videos and making himself seem inevitable like Brown.
> >
> > Raab is utterly repellent: there is something really quite sinister and dishonest about him.
> >
> > Sajid Javid is just hopeless; Hancock - nice boy, would be polite to your Mum and likes horses but does not have a clue what to do.
> >
> > Malthouse, Harper, Cleverly, Gmiyah: who?
> >
> > McVey: no, just no.
> >
> > Leadsom: overrated.
> >
> > Stewart: his plan is too late given where we are and what his party is now like. He's interesting and thoughtful but probably in the wrong party. Maybe next time.
> >
> > No-one has any idea how to sort Brexit in the time available. And with rare exceptions they seem to care more about themselves or their party than the country or the people in it.
> >
> > Honestly, what is the point of politics at the moment? They're all intent on driving us down a cul de sac leading to a cliff.
> >
>
> -------------------------------------
> You forgot Hunt. Which says it all.
>
> As for politics, serious stuff is on hold for a couple of months. Perhaps we will even see Lab join the hunt for a new leader if BXP win Peterborough, which they might as well since the summer will be taken up with Tory and LD leadership contests, and bugger all actual progress.
>
> We're literally wasting another 2 months, avoiding doing anything about Brexit while we talk about what we would all like to do if only things would happen as we want, which they won't.
>
> It's almost artistic in how much it embodies the concept of futility.
Glad to see Cleverly getting as many votes as Leadsom.
On to the latest Danish poll news with the election on Wednesday. Voxmeter's daily poll shows a huge lead for the centre-left bloc with nearly 60% of the vote which equates to 108 seats in the Folketing leaving just 67 fort the centre-right.
I have to say that looks a big outlier -Norstat shows a 55-45 lead in vote share for the centre-left which is more in common with what we've seen in other polls. A third poll for "Greens" (don't know it that is the Party or a polling organisation) has the race tightening to 53-47.
If it means anything (and it may not), Norstat's poll has the field work done yesterday so may be the most accurate.
Just a word on the French approval numbers which have seen a doubling (from 20 to 40%) of positive approval for Yannick Jadot, leader of the French Greens, who enjoyed a strong result in the European elections coming in third behind En Marche and the National Front with 13% of the vote.
From their constitution:
"(a) Nominations must be of a Member of the Parliamentary Party in the House of Commons, who must be proposed by at least ten percent of other members of the Parliamentary Party in the House of Commons and supported by 200 members in aggregate in not less than 20 Local Parties (including, for this purpose, the Specified Associated Organisations representing youth and/or students).
(b) Nominations from the Parliamentary Party shall not include the candidate themselves. (c) A nominator may not subscribe to more nomination papers than there are vacancies in the election being held.(d) Nominations must be accompanied by the written consent of the candidate.(e) All the forms set out in this regulation may be submitted via email. (f) After acquiring the necessary nominations for candidacy, each candidate may nominatean agent for their campaign. A candidate who fails to nominate an agent will be deemed their own agent. "
I never did check to see if there was a market on which CUK MP would defect from it first though, which is a shame. Defect once and it is easy to do it again, especially when you only have one policy, which another party shares.
But no shame to them nevertheless - what they did was tough and brave.
> No, Corbyn is a disgusting anti-Semite who supports dictators like Maduro.
What I'm wondering is why so many people are so quick to deflect criticism of US President Donald Trump by banging on about UK Leader of the Opposition Jeremy Corbyn.
Piers Morgan, OK, it's money - but the others?
https://twitter.com/peston/status/1135634721239687170?s=21
A few weeks ago, they were getting in the way and it was "f**k business"
I'll be plenty embarrassed by Boris, believe you me, and regretful of my part leading to his rise, but a competition to show how ashamed we all are of ourselves is not merely worrying about reputation, it's wallowing.
>
> Give it a rest.
Of course. Good advice.
And by all means carry on being repulsed by Corbyn and being relatively relaxed about Trump.
It takes all sorts.
It's going to be a very strange summer. The Tories might get sub 10% in Peterborough, and expect them to go even more nuts if that happens - a knighthood to Farage as quickly as possible as they try to pay obeisance without looking like it is obeisance.
All of which Trump has tried to undermine .
https://twitter.com/DavidTCDavies/status/1135620699224190977
https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1135646693557510144
I never thought the UK was a laughing stock even under many Tory governments which I fundamentally disagreed with.
1) Brexit
2) Lib Dems
3) Labour
4) Tories
suits the Brexit party best.
The guy who wants to get rid of workers rights , and wants to turn the UK into a capitalists fantasy !
Smart. Genetics or media training?
.
Has there been polling on it?
I'd be surprised if support for Trump among Labour voters is anything higher than low single figures (guessing at least one or two though) you possibly have some people in the UK like Susan Sarandon who threatened (at some point I think) to vote for Trump over Hillary but actually supporting/liking Trump is a very minority sport among Labour voters.
I think he'd do better among Tory voters but I think there would be plenty who wouldn't like him, Brexit Party voters would be his best group at a guess.
Which makes it an entirely reasonable statement rather than the polemic you suggest
At least back in the day (pre 2016) the terms bandied around had some sort of real world meaning.
"Trickle Down Economics", for example, the Reagan era theory of choice, the phrase summed up exactly what it was truly all about. Stuff 'trickling down' from rich people onto the poor.
Nothing but empty soundbites these days.
Then new season Windsor lamb with herb stuffing, spring vegetables and a port sauce, followed by strawberry sable with a helping of lemon verbena cream for dessert.
I'm sure he'd have been happier with a large Big Mac and fries!
Also means May should make it to July and get her three year commemorative badge.
Rough translation: You know he's a vulgar prick, we know he's a vulgar prick, but a gal's gotta do what a gal's gotta do.
He must be getting good advice.
Pro Remain Tories despise him and that will help the Lib Dems where they’re in second place .
In the Midlands and the nw the Muslim population are enough to swing quite a few marginals .
In London the Tories could be close to being wiped out.
The media are desperate for him to win as they see a lot of drama and controversy ahead so lots of material to work with .
66% of Leave voters thought the State visit should go ahead and 60% thought he should meet the Queen, compared to 46% and 41% respectively of voters as a whole
https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/psse08hgpj/YouGov - Trump state visit 190520.pdf
Protesters against LGBT teaching at a Birmingham primary school have vowed to continue their opposition despite being banned from gathering outside the gates."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-england-birmingham-48504900/birmingham-lgbt-row-parents-vow-to-continue-school-protests
Sweden, mid July, and Agnetha Faltskog just cannot sleep. It's 1 am and she still can't get off. To sleep. Perhaps because, this being Scandanavia, and it being high summer, it's broad daylight outside. The sun is out for god's sake!
So nothing for it, she gets up and goes out for a walk. It's actually quite hot!
Starts singing ...
"Gimme Gimme Gimme a Tan after Midnight."
Love it!
https://twitter.com/s8mb/status/1135609888992878593
Which is ironic, as we're changing system after I move house next week.
Hunt and Gove look to be neck-and-neck to be the leading moderate (loosely defined as anyone who isn't currently threatening to leave with no deal on 31 October). I expect one of them will reach the final two, but not both. Gove is probably the most sensible choice: someone who had a prominent role as a leaver in the referendum campaign, but who seems to remain somewhat anchored to reality. I cannot see any qualities from Hunt that make him any better suited to the task at hand than May, other than by virtue of having not yet failed at it.
The only question is whether the hard Brexit wing will unite around a candidate they can trust more than Boris (surely a low bar...)? Given that the two front-runners either have the electoral appeal of Ian Duncan Smith or have previously managed to lose in a two-horse race against the formidable campaigner that is Theresa May, I can understand why they are searching around for anyone or their dog to take up the mantle.