If true, 2019 looks unlikely. Once you get past 31 October, no one is going to thank you for a Christmas election. And no one seems to have noticed that with prorogation November is almost impossible to hit.
Which does rather beg the question - will be be facing exactly the same situation in January?
And January 2021, and...
Johnson’s entire strategy has been based on getting an election before 31st October. What’s he going to do if he doesn’t get one?
There'll be an election after 31st. Corbyn though will have his Pyrrhic Victory insofar Johnson will have failed to take us out of the EU by that date.
Johnson won't have failed. Johnson will be on the side of the people while the smug politicians think they know better than what the public decided and are obstructing Brexit and obstructing an election.
How? The public wants a deal. It’s up to BoJo to get one now. Chop chop. Believe in Britain.
Parliament is sabotaging Britain's ability to get a deal though, didn't you hear?
The thing is, what possible deal could Boris do at the summit if he went in with a majority and the threat of No Deal? The only one is the original WA with the NI-backstop, and if it came a couple of days after the election he could get away with selling it as a negotiating triumph, for a while.
What would happen if the entire Cabinet resigned. Boris went to the Queen and said I'm resigning but I'm unable to recommend any other person who you could call to be PM?
Would the Queen then insist that politicans sort themselves out with an election?
Just for info: Labour has set a deadline of this Friday for all applications for the remaining seats needing candidates. They've short-circuited all the reselection stuff in the interest of being battle-ready.
Just for info: Labour has set a deadline of this Friday for all applications for the remaining seats needing candidates. They've short-circuited all the reselection stuff in the interest of being battle-ready.
If true, 2019 looks unlikely. Once you get past 31 October, no one is going to thank you for a Christmas election. And no one seems to have noticed that with prorogation November is almost impossible to hit.
Which does rather beg the question - will be be facing exactly the same situation in January?
And January 2021, and...
Johnson’s entire strategy has been based on getting an election before 31st October. What’s he going to do if he doesn’t get one?
Ask the Queen to refuse royal assent to the anti No Deal Bill and dissolve Parliament using the royal prerogative for a general election mid October to let the voters decide on Brexit before October 31st.
The FTPA explicitly allows the Queen still to dissolve Parliament and call a general election at her whim under its Supplementary Provisions
Citation? News to me.
'6 Supplementary provisions (1) This Act does not affect Her Majesty’s power to prorogue Parliament.'
'(7) If a parliamentary general election is to take place as provided for by subsection (1) or (3), the polling day for the election is to be the day appointed by Her Majesty by proclamation on the recommendation of the Prime Minister'
The Queen can refuse to assent to the extension Bill and prorogue Parliament past October 31st at the PM's request while requiring a general election and dissolution before she summons Parliament again
So just to be clear - parliament will be prorogued immediately after a Queens Speech? It’s a view I suppose. Johnson can’t try the prorogation card because he’s already played it.
No, that is on the cards trust me
About as on the cards as re-partitioning NI. Not going to happen.
If true, 2019 looks unlikely. Once you get past 31 October, no one is going to thank you for a Christmas election. And no one seems to have noticed that with prorogation November is almost impossible to hit.
Which does rather beg the question - will be be facing exactly the same situation in January?
And January 2021, and...
Johnson’s entire strategy has been based on getting an election before 31st October. What’s he going to do if he doesn’t get one?
Ask the Queen to refuse royal assent to the anti No Deal Bill and dissolve Parliament using the royal prerogative for a general election mid October to let the voters decide on Brexit before October 31st.
The FTPA explicitly allows the Queen still to dissolve Parliament and call a general election at her whim under its Supplementary Provisions
Citation? News to me.
'6 Supplementary provisions (1) This Act does not affect Her Majesty’s power to prorogue Parliament.'
'(7) If a parliamentary general election is to take place as provided for by subsection (1) or (3), the polling day for the election is to be the day appointed by Her Majesty by proclamation on the recommendation of the Prime Minister'
The Queen can refuse to assent to the extension Bill and prorogue Parliament past October 31st at the PM's request while requiring a general election and dissolution before she summons Parliament again
So just to be clear - parliament will be prorogued immediately after a Queens Speech? It’s a view I suppose. Johnson can’t try the prorogation card because he’s already played it.
No, that is on the cards trust me
You have a record of being right recently. As a soft Republican, anti -Tory, who is past caring about Brexit, all I can say is "BRING IT ON". That is my dream scenario.
If true, 2019 looks unlikely. Once you get past 31 October, no one is going to thank you for a Christmas election. And no one seems to have noticed that with prorogation November is almost impossible to hit.
Which does rather beg the question - will be be facing exactly the same situation in January?
And January 2021, and...
Johnson’s entire strategy has been based on getting an election before 31st October. What’s he going to do if he doesn’t get one?
Ask the Queen to refuse royal assent to the anti No Deal Bill and dissolve Parliament using the royal prerogative for a general election mid October to let the voters decide on Brexit before October 31st.
The FTPA explicitly allows the Queen still to dissolve Parliament and call a general election at her whim under its Supplementary Provisions
I’lll save this one for a rainy day.
There’s one knocking about from Mortimer that might be worth putting in the fridge too.
What would happen if the entire Cabinet resigned. Boris went to the Queen and said I'm resigning but I'm unable to recommend any other person who you could call to be PM?
Would the Queen then insist that politicans sort themselves out with an election?
What would happen if the entire Cabinet resigned. Boris went to the Queen and said I'm resigning but I'm unable to recommend any other person who you could call to be PM?
Would the Queen then insist that politicans sort themselves out with an election?
I think the 14 day process would still happen, and - essentially - if someone came forward and said "300 people will back me in a vote of confidence and another 40 will abstain", then she'd have to let said person try.
Just for info: Labour has set a deadline of this Friday for all applications for the remaining seats needing candidates. They've short-circuited all the reselection stuff in the interest of being battle-ready.
If true, 2019 looks unlikely. Once you get past 31 October, no one is going to thank you for a Christmas election. And no one seems to have noticed that with prorogation November is almost impossible to hit.
Which does rather beg the question - will be be facing exactly the same situation in January?
And January 2021, and...
Johnson’s entire strategy has been based on getting an election before 31st October. What’s he going to do if he doesn’t get one?
Ask the Queen to refuse royal assent to the anti No Deal Bill and dissolve Parliament using the royal prerogative for a general election mid October to let the voters decide on Brexit before October 31st.
The FTPA explicitly allows the Queen still to dissolve Parliament and call a general election at her whim under its Supplementary Provisions
Citation? News to me.
'6 Supplementary provisions (1) This Act does not affect Her Majesty’s power to prorogue Parliament.'
'(7) If a parliamentary general election is to take place as provided for by subsection (1) or (3), the polling day for the election is to be the day appointed by Her Majesty by proclamation on the recommendation of the Prime Minister'
The Queen can refuse to assent to the extension Bill and prorogue Parliament past October 31st at the PM's request while requiring a general election and dissolution before she summons Parliament again
No she can't.
Yes she can, all within the royal prerogative powers the executive branch can use
Which probably means that CCHQ will have to divert resources from other seats, which, the Tories could have used to target Labour seats or defence against LD/SNP. A campaign has finite resources and you can only spend a pound once or have an individual in one place at a time. Independents turning safe seats into marginals is a really clever move by Boris and co! I wonder if they wargamed that as well?
I think the likes of Grieve and the two Hammonds would stand decent chances. I recall all are in Remain seats - presumably the official Tory candidates will be hardcore Leaver europhobes, to comply with Boris’ purge parameters?
Rory Stewart too. He seems well liked on his patch.
That is a very interesting example.
Given the huge Conservative vote, it would take a remarkable personal following to win it as an independent candidate (possibly aided by the LDs standing aside for him, as Swinson has hinted at, should the local party agree). On the other hand, it’s quite possible he gets the whip restored, given the current unrest in the party.
I use it only cos he is in the neighbouring Constituency to mine, and because it shares some similarities. The Tories in the rural North are an unideological , practical, down-to-earth bunch, rarely wealthy either. Their vote is traditional, but not automatic. It is also a long way from Westminster, indeed, a fair way from anywhere. If the LDs stand aside, I reckon he'd be a shoo in.
I didn’t say he can’t win, or even that it would be highly unlikely - just that it would be fairly remarkable if he did.
Would have echoes of the Blaenau Gwent independent from New Labour days.
What would happen if the entire Cabinet resigned. Boris went to the Queen and said I'm resigning but I'm unable to recommend any other person who you could call to be PM?
Would the Queen then insist that politicans sort themselves out with an election?
That's easy. One Jeremy Corbyn becomes PM.
I thought the outgoing PM had to tell HMQ who the incoming PM would be?
You can't just have anyone rock up at Buck House (with or without a taxi) and tell HMQ they're going to be PM?
What would happen if the entire Cabinet resigned. Boris went to the Queen and said I'm resigning but I'm unable to recommend any other person who you could call to be PM?
Would the Queen then insist that politicans sort themselves out with an election?
The idea that anyone will care whether Labour votes for an election today or in a few days' or weeks' time is for the birds. It's actually a very strong position for them: they have an incontrovertible argument that no election can take place until the imminent threat of a No Deal catastrophe has been averted, they have a superb political point that Boris can't be trusted, and they'll be in good shape if they can campaign on having saved the country from an ideological chlorinated-chicken Tory No Deal Brexit.
Yours is a more sophisticated analysis than mine earlier, which was to your first point only: simply that the idea Labour will sustain damage in an election campaign for having in the less recent past voted against an election, when in the more recent past they voted for an election, is faintly absurd.
Just for info: Labour has set a deadline of this Friday for all applications for the remaining seats needing candidates. They've short-circuited all the reselection stuff in the interest of being battle-ready.
If true, 2019 looks unlikely. Once you get past 31 October, no one is going to thank you for a Christmas election. And no one seems to have noticed that with prorogation November is almost impossible to hit.
Which does rather beg the question - will be be facing exactly the same situation in January?
And January 2021, and...
Johnson’s entire strategy has been based on getting an election before 31st October. What’s he going to do if he doesn’t get one?
Ask the Queen to refuse royal assent to the anti No Deal Bill and dissolve Parliament using the royal prerogative for a general election mid October to let the voters decide on Brexit before October 31st.
The FTPA explicitly allows the Queen still to dissolve Parliament and call a general election at her whim under its Supplementary Provisions
Citation? News to me.
'6 Supplementary provisions (1) This Act does not affect Her Majesty’s power to prorogue Parliament.'
'(7) If a parliamentary general election is to take place as provided for by subsection (1) or (3), the polling day for the election is to be the day appointed by Her Majesty by proclamation on the recommendation of the Prime Minister'
The Queen can refuse to assent to the extension Bill and prorogue Parliament past October 31st at the PM's request while requiring a general election and dissolution before she summons Parliament again
So just to be.
No, that is on the cards trust me
You have a record of being right recently. As a soft Republican, anti -Tory, who is past caring about Brexit, all I can say is "BRING IT ON". That is my dream scenario.
You may think so but it is actually the scenario most likely to force a general election and give a Tory majority for Brexit.
It also does the monarchy no harm at all supporting letting voters decide what this useless Parliament cannot in a general election (plus voters by a 20% margin backed proroguing Parliament with Survation last weekend)
I wonder if Cummings is wargaming or drinking again right now? I know where my money is
Maybe he's wargaming AND drinking? Some people can multitask.
And all without spilling a drop on the Number 10 sofas. What a guy - this is really one in the eye for the many, many people who say Dominic is a charmless, vicious drunk who's advice has strangled his boss' premiership at birth.
Can the government bring back the early GE motion as soon as Royal Assent is given or are there procedural restrictions on repeating a vote you just lost?
I wonder if Cummings is wargaming or drinking again right now? I know where my money is
Maybe he's wargaming AND drinking? Some people can multitask.
And all without spilling a drop on the Number 10 sofas. What a guy - this is really one in the eye for the many, many people who say Dominic is a charmless, vicious drunk who's advice has strangled his boss' premiership at birth.
His boss now has a 10% poll lead in the latest poll, after May extended the Tories were 3rd
Just for info: Labour has set a deadline of this Friday for all applications for the remaining seats needing candidates. They've short-circuited all the reselection stuff in the interest of being battle-ready.
O' Mara...Onasanya...
yep. That is what happens in rushed elections.
I quite fancy a Christmas election. It will be a novelty.
What would happen if the entire Cabinet resigned. Boris went to the Queen and said I'm resigning but I'm unable to recommend any other person who you could call to be PM?
Would the Queen then insist that politicans sort themselves out with an election?
I think the 14 day process would still happen, and - essentially - if someone came forward and said "300 people will back me in a vote of confidence and another 40 will abstain", then she'd have to let said person try.
I remmeber reading that Edward VII and King George V were much more "involved" in basically telling politicians what to do for example in the 1910 crisis and during the depression/formation of the national government.
Ramsay Mcdonald stayed to lead the national government (but was basically a Conservative govenment with a Labour leader) partly at the behest of King George V and indeed Ramsay and George had quite a deep personal friendship in the end.
Obviously HMQ has taken a very "hands off" role during her reign but then again we've never seen a crisis quite like this during her reign I don't think.
I just wonder whether its getting to the point where she's going to have to do something...
What would happen if the entire Cabinet resigned. Boris went to the Queen and said I'm resigning but I'm unable to recommend any other person who you could call to be PM?
Would the Queen then insist that politicans sort themselves out with an election?
That's easy. One Jeremy Corbyn becomes PM.
He doesn't as Swinson would veto him
She would? Boris and Cummings seem to be having remarkable powers of healing and unification.
I wonder if Cummings is wargaming or drinking again right now? I know where my money is
Maybe he's wargaming AND drinking? Some people can multitask.
And all without spilling a drop on the Number 10 sofas. What a guy - this is really one in the eye for the many, many people who say Dominic is a charmless, vicious drunk who's advice has strangled his boss' premiership at birth.
I imagine before Johnson moved in the staff moved the good sofas into storage.
Can the government bring back the early GE motion as soon as Royal Assent is given or are there procedural restrictions on repeating a vote you just lost?
Considering Corbyn said he'd vote for it if the other bill has Assent, Bercow would be rather obnoxious to rule it out of order.
Be like saying Corbyn is out of order bringing forth a new VoNC.
If with prorogation November is almost impossible to hit.
Which does rather beg the question - will be be facing exactly the same situation in January?
And January 2021, and...
Johnson’s entire strategy has been based on getting an election before 31st October. What’s he going to do if he doesn’t get one?
The FTPA explicitly allows the Queen still to dissolve Parliament and call a general election at her whim under its Supplementary Provisions
Citation? News to me.
'6 Supplementary provisions (1) This Act does not affect Her Majesty’s power to prorogue Parliament.'
'(7) If a parliamentary general election is to take place as provided for by subsection (1) or (3), the polling day for the election is to be the day appointed by Her Majesty by proclamation on the recommendation of the Prime Minister'
The Queen can refuse to assent to the extension Bill and prorogue Parliament past October 31st at the PM's request while requiring a general election and dissolution before she summons Parliament again
No she can't.
Yes she can, all within the royal prerogative powers the executive branch can use
Has she joined the new Conservative Party ?
HYUFD doesn’t seem to realise that half the “rumours” being spread about concerning what Johnson might do to ensure Brexit were actually only raised to try and engineer what he wanted - a pre Brexit election. He doesn’t actually have any intention of actually doing them. The problem he’s got is that he’s now in a position where he can’t get his election because the opposition actually believed the rumours (eg. Setting an election date post Oct 31st, which I don’t think was ever the plan). HYUFD also doesn’t get that Johnson’s burning desire is not to deliver Brexit, except to the extent that he thinks he will be finished politically if he doesn’t. He’s just dug himself into so many holes that virtually every scenario is now one he doesn’t want.
What would happen if the entire Cabinet resigned. Boris went to the Queen and said I'm resigning but I'm unable to recommend any other person who you could call to be PM?
Would the Queen then insist that politicans sort themselves out with an election?
I think the 14 day process would still happen, and - essentially - if someone came forward and said "300 people will back me in a vote of confidence and another 40 will abstain", then she'd have to let said person try.
I remmeber reading that Edward VII and King George V were much more "involved" in basically telling politicians what to do for example in the 1910 crisis and during the depression/formation of the national government.
Ramsay Mcdonald stayed to lead the national government (but was basically a Conservative govenment with a Labour leader) partly at the behest of King George V and indeed Ramsay and George had quite a deep personal friendship in the end.
Obviously HMQ has taken a very "hands off" role during her reign but then again we've never seen a crisis quite like this I don't think.
I just wonder whether its getting to the point where she's going to have to do something...
It is quite remarkable to think that in the aftermath of the 1931 General Election Stanley Baldwin's Conservatives won 470 seats and an absolute majority of the vote . . . and we had a Labour PM.
If true, 2019 looks unlikely. Once you get past 31 October, no one is going to thank you for a Christmas election. And no one seems to have noticed that with prorogation November is almost impossible to hit.
Which does rather beg the question - will be be facing exactly the same situation in January?
And January 2021, and...
Johnson’s entire strategy has been based on getting an election before 31st October. What’s he going to do if he doesn’t get one?
This must explain all the 'Jezza is frit', 'Jezza is chicken' stuff that Cummings has ordered the eurosceptic press to run with tonight. They think they've failed to secure the pre No deal GE and are now managing the narrative so that this fact now reflects badly on Jezza. But it feels thin - it's not as if everyone you speak to was hitherto gagging for a general election to be called.
Without action chicken photos and crying grit will get a bit wearing. If there is no election what, in practice, is Johnson going to do?
From next week Jezza can just shrug. "I would be happy to vote for an election, but Parliament is prorogued at the orders of Johnson." I am happy to have a vote on it when we have reconvened and dealt with emergency matters.
BoZo is hoist by his own prorogation. His master startegist seems to be the General Burnside of British politics.
Indeed. He needs only to resist an election until Monday evening (I think?), after which he can safely say “bring it on”, safe in the knowledge there cannot be an election until November.
Can Boris get HM to unprorogue? (I've rather forgotten why Boris prorogued in the first place.)
Ludicrously, as it seems now, to stop parliament blocking No Deal.
I wonder if Cummings is wargaming or drinking again right now? I know where my money is
Maybe he's wargaming AND drinking? Some people can multitask.
And all without spilling a drop on the Number 10 sofas. What a guy - this is really one in the eye for the many, many people who say Dominic is a charmless, vicious drunk who's advice has strangled his boss' premiership at birth.
His boss now has a 10% poll lead in the latest poll, after May extended the Tories were 3rd
Well, let's see how well that serves him at the General Election on 15th October.
Oh, there isn't going to be one. There isn't going to be Brexit on 31st. He's got a -43 majority. He's lost all his Parliamentary votes.
You apparently think this is all in the Cummings plan. I pity you for that.
What would happen if the entire Cabinet resigned. Boris went to the Queen and said I'm resigning but I'm unable to recommend any other person who you could call to be PM?
Would the Queen then insist that politicans sort themselves out with an election?
I think the 14 day process would still happen, and - essentially - if someone came forward and said "300 people will back me in a vote of confidence and another 40 will abstain", then she'd have to let said person try.
I remmeber reading that Edward VII and King George V were much more "involved" in basically telling politicians what to do for example in the 1910 crisis and during the depression/formation of the national government.
Ramsay Mcdonald stayed to lead the national government (but was basically a Conservative govenment with a Labour leader) partly at the behest of King George V and indeed Ramsay and George had quite a deep personal friendship in the end.
Obviously HMQ has taken a very "hands off" role during her reign but then again we've never seen a crisis quite like this I don't think.
I just wonder whether its getting to the point where she's going to have to do something...
It is quite remarkable to think that in the aftermath of the 1931 General Election Stanley Baldwin's Conservatives won 470 seats and an absolute majority of the vote . . . and we had a Labour PM.
That was mainly at the behest of King George I believe?
If true, 2019 looks unlikely. Once you get past 31 October, no one is going to thank you for a Christmas election. And no one seems to have noticed that with prorogation November is almost impossible to hit.
Which does rather beg the question - will be be facing exactly the same situation in January?
And January 2021, and...
Johnson’s entire strategy has been based on getting an election before 31st October. What’s he going to do if he doesn’t get one?
There'll be an election after 31st. Corbyn though will have his Pyrrhic Victory insofar Johnson will have failed to take us out of the EU by that date.
Johnson won't have failed. Johnson will be on the side of the people while the smug politicians think they know better than what the public decided and are obstructing Brexit and obstructing an election.
How? The public wants a deal. It’s up to BoJo to get one now. Chop chop. Believe in Britain.
Parliament is sabotaging Britain's ability to get a deal though, didn't you hear?
The thing is, what possible deal could Boris do at the summit if he went in with a majority and the threat of No Deal? The only one is the original WA with the NI-backstop, and if it came a couple of days after the election he could get away with selling it as a negotiating triumph, for a while.
Drop the backstop, kick the can on Ireland, agree everything else and pledge to work in good faith to sort out Ireland in the transition period.
"Cummings has been described by David Cameron as a ‘career psychopath’ and by Rachel Johnson, sister of Boris, in similar terms. I urge you to read in full Pat Kane’s assessment, in which he calls Cummings an “intellectually committed chaos-merchant” and reports on his mission to subject all aspects of human behaviour (health, education, all public services) to the capricious and/or sadistic whims of the market. This may not suit everyone, but Cummings believes most of us to be a waste of education, as cognitive ability is primarily related to genes."
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
If true, 2019 looks unlikely. Once you get past 31 October, no one is going to thank you for a Christmas election. And no one seems to have noticed that with prorogation November is almost impossible to hit.
Which does rather beg the question - will be be facing exactly the same situation in January?
And January 2021, and...
Johnson’s entire strategy has been based on getting an election before 31st October. What’s he going to do if he doesn’t get one?
There'll be an election after 31st. Corbyn though will have his Pyrrhic Victory insofar Johnson will have failed to take us out of the EU by that date.
Johnson won't have failed. Johnson will be on the side of the people while the smug politicians think they know better than what the public decided and are obstructing Brexit and obstructing an election.
How? The public wants a deal. It’s up to BoJo to get one now. Chop chop. Believe in Britain.
Parliament is sabotaging Britain's ability to get a deal though, didn't you hear?
The thing is, what possible deal could Boris do at the summit if he went in with a majority and the threat of No Deal? The only one is the original WA with the NI-backstop, and if it came a couple of days after the election he could get away with selling it as a negotiating triumph, for a while.
Drop the backstop, kick the can on Ireland, agree everything else and pledge to work in good faith to sort out Ireland in the transition period.
Job done.
The EU wouldn't agree to it, and there wouldn't be any substantive negotiations on it in that forum. The only possibility is to revert to the previous draft of the backstop, and call it something else - "all island economic zone" or some such.
If true, 2019 looks unlikely. Once you get past 31 October, no one is going to thank you for a Christmas election. And no one seems to have noticed that with prorogation November is almost impossible to hit.
Which does rather beg the question - will be be facing exactly the same situation in January?
And January 2021, and...
Johnson’s entire strategy has been based on getting an election before 31st October. What’s he going to do if he doesn’t get one?
There'll be an election after 31st. Corbyn though will have his Pyrrhic Victory insofar Johnson will have failed to take us out of the EU by that date.
Johnson won't have failed. Johnson will be on the side of the people while the smug politicians think they know better than what the public decided and are obstructing Brexit and obstructing an election.
How? The public wants a deal. It’s up to BoJo to get one now. Chop chop. Believe in Britain.
Parliament is sabotaging Britain's ability to get a deal though, didn't you hear?
The thing is, what possible deal could Boris do at the summit if he went in with a majority and the threat of No Deal? The only one is the original WA with the NI-backstop, and if it came a couple of days after the election he could get away with selling it as a negotiating triumph, for a while.
Drop the backstop, kick the can on Ireland, agree everything else and pledge to work in good faith to sort out Ireland in the transition period.
Job done.
The obvious and totally ignored option is to tell Ireland to fix it or fuck off. I suppose that's your suggestion too.
If true, 2019 looks unlikely. Once you get past 31 October, no one is going to thank you for a Christmas election. And no one seems to have noticed that with prorogation November is almost impossible to hit.
Which does rather beg the question - will be be facing exactly the same situation in January?
And January 2021, and...
Johnson’s entire strategy has been based on getting an election before 31st October. What’s he going to do if he doesn’t get one?
There'll be an election after 31st. Corbyn though will have his Pyrrhic Victory insofar Johnson will have failed to take us out of the EU by that date.
Johnson won't have failed. Johnson will be on the side of the people while the smug politicians think they know better than what the public decided and are obstructing Brexit and obstructing an election.
How? The public wants a deal. It’s up to BoJo to get one now. Chop chop. Believe in Britain.
Parliament is sabotaging Britain's ability to get a deal though, didn't you hear?
The thing is, what possible deal could Boris do at the summit if he went in with a majority and the threat of No Deal? The only one is the original WA with the NI-backstop, and if it came a couple of days after the election he could get away with selling it as a negotiating triumph, for a while.
Drop the backstop, kick the can on Ireland, agree everything else and pledge to work in good faith to sort out Ireland in the transition period.
Job done.
The obvious and totally ignored option is to tell Ireland to fix it or fuck off
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Bit silly of Johnson to withdraw the whip and destroy his majority for no reason.
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Why would they look dumb? They tried their best. Cant win every battle.
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Lord True has contrived to make Amendment 2G (9) last 50 minutes. A good innings for this one.
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Isn't there a way of stopping these delaying tactics?
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Isn't there a way of stopping these delaying tactics?
They are voting on amendments to a very motion to stop the filibuster.
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Isn't there a way of stopping these delaying tactics?
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Isn't there a way of stopping these delaying tactics?
IIRC the HoL has less rules on the duration of the speeches of peers.
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Why would they look dumb? They tried their best. Cant win every battle.
Yet you think that Boris will look dumb if he tries his best but gets thwarted by Remain MPs?
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Isn't there a way of stopping these delaying tactics?
The filibuster has a long standing tradition in many places. Is the term not derived from America usage?
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Bit silly of Johnson to withdraw the whip and destroy his majority for no reason.
May never handed him a majority. With Peterborough lost and B&R likely to be lost and at least one Tory choosing their moment to defect, he was always a minority Govt.
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Isn't there a way of stopping these delaying tactics?
Yes, the motion that's being filibustered would do that if they can get through the filibuster first.
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Why would they look dumb? They tried their best. Cant win every battle.
Yet you think that Boris will look dumb if he tries his best but gets thwarted by Remain MPs?
But he hasn’t tried anything. He has not proposed anything to the EU.
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Isn't there a way of stopping these delaying tactics?
Only by a vote. Which, as I understand it, can be filibustered!
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Isn't there a way of stopping these delaying tactics?
IIRC the HoL has less rules on the duration of the speeches of peers.
I believe there is no foreclosure unless a speaker drops dead mid filibuster. Our parliamentary rules make the playground look sophisticated viz Speaker
If true, 2019 looks unlikely. Once you get past 31 October, no one is going to thank you for a Christmas election. And no one seems to have noticed that with prorogation November is almost impossible to hit.
Which does rather beg the question - will be be facing exactly the same situation in January?
And January 2021, and...
Johnson’s entire strategy has been based on getting an election before 31st October. What’s he going to do if he doesn’t get one?
There'll be an election after 31st. Corbyn though will have his Pyrrhic Victory insofar Johnson will have failed to take us out of the EU by that date.
Johnson won't have failed. Johnson will be on the side of the people while the smug politicians think they know better than what the public decided and are obstructing Brexit and obstructing an election.
How? The public wants a deal. It’s up to BoJo to get one now. Chop chop. Believe in Britain.
Parliament is sabotaging Britain's ability to get a deal though, didn't you hear?
The thing is, what possible deal could Boris do at the summit if he went in with a majority and the threat of No Deal? The only one is the original WA with the NI-backstop, and if it came a couple of days after the election he could get away with selling it as a negotiating triumph, for a while.
Drop the backstop, kick the can on Ireland, agree everything else and pledge to work in good faith to sort out Ireland in the transition period.
Job done.
The EU wouldn't agree to it, and there wouldn't be any substantive negotiations on it in that forum. The only possibility is to revert to the previous draft of the backstop, and call it something else - "all island economic zone" or some such.
The EU could agree to it if the alternative is no deal.
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Isn't there a way of stopping these delaying tactics?
Only by a vote. Which, as I understand it, can be filibustered!
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Isn't there a way of stopping these delaying tactics?
IIRC the HoL has less rules on the duration of the speeches of peers.
I believe there is no foreclosure unless a speaker drops dead mid filibuster.
And given the agre of some of their Lordships that's not totally impossible.
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Why would they look dumb? They tried their best. Cant win every battle.
Yet you think that Boris will look dumb if he tries his best but gets thwarted by Remain MPs?
But he hasn’t tried anything. He has not proposed anything to the EU.
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Why would they look dumb? They tried their best. Cant win every battle.
Yet you think that Boris will look dumb if he tries his best but gets thwarted by Remain MPs?
But he hasn’t tried anything. He has not proposed anything to the EU.
The papers weirdly have two same headlines. The Boris press going for Corbyn, hypocrite and chicken. The remain press use “Boris cornered” rather a lot.
My personal view is 1. I agree with pedley, the optics of blocking no deal and the election might not look good for the opposition party’s, but only amongst leavers, remainers probably loving Boris, as seant would say, strong up hog tied and naked. 2. Corbyn is wide open to the partisan chicken attack, but surely those of us politics aficionado on PB would think worse of him if he passed on the gift of being able to kettle his opponent? If you support Boris you must be spitting teeth, but what would you really think of a LOTO who passed on this opportunity? 3. But the main thing from the week, that trumps all other optics and perhaps reverberates forever, the decision to throw from the Conservative party people who define conservatism in this country, thrown out after the only rebel vote in lives for some of them, by an awkward squad who used rebelling as a weapon over and over. If the local associations can’t back these MPs because all they care about Is brexit, then something is clearly and dangerously broken.
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Isn't there a way of stopping these delaying tactics?
IIRC the HoL has less rules on the duration of the speeches of peers.
I believe there is no foreclosure unless a speaker drops dead mid filibuster.
And given the agre of some of their Lordships that's not totally impossible.
And that they have loads of shillings for the meter
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Why would they look dumb? They tried their best. Cant win every battle.
Yet you think that Boris will look dumb if he tries his best but gets thwarted by Remain MPs?
But he hasn’t tried anything. He has not proposed anything to the EU.
He has, the WA minus the backstop
To which they have asked him to propose what he wants to replace the backstop with.
The papers weirdly have two same headlines. The Boris press going for Corbyn, hypocrite and chicken. The remain press use “Boris cornered” rather a lot.
My personal view is 1. I agree with pedley, the optics of blocking no deal and the election might not look good for the opposition party’s, but only amongst leavers, remainers probably loving Boris, as seant would say, strong up hog tied and naked. 2. Corbyn is wide open to the partisan chicken attack, but surely those of us politics aficionado on PB would think worse of him if he passed on the gift of being able to kettle his opponent? If you support Boris you must be spitting teeth, but what would you really think of a LOTO who passed on this opportunity? 3. But the main thing from the week, that trumps all other optics and perhaps reverberates forever, the decision to throw from the Conservative party people who define conservatism in this country, thrown out after the only rebel vote in lives for some of them, by an awkward squad who used rebelling as a weapon over and over. If the local associations can’t back these MPs because all they care about Is brexit, then something is clearly and dangerously broken.
The hoi poloi won't see it like that - that's bubble talk
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Why would they look dumb? They tried their best. Cant win every battle.
Yet you think that Boris will look dumb if he tries his best but gets thwarted by Remain MPs?
But he hasn’t tried anything. He has not proposed anything to the EU.
He has, the WA minus the backstop
To which they have asked him to propose what he wants to replace the backstop with.
We’re still waiting.
We're too early to say nothing.
There is no need for anything to replace the backstop.
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Why would they look dumb? They tried their best. Cant win every battle.
Yet you think that Boris will look dumb if he tries his best but gets thwarted by Remain MPs?
But he hasn’t tried anything. He has not proposed anything to the EU.
He has, the WA minus the backstop
To which they have asked him to propose what he wants to replace the backstop with.
We’re still waiting.
We're too early to say nothing.
There is no need for anything to replace the backstop.
The EU beg to differ. They are not going to capitulate.
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Why would they look dumb? They tried their best. Cant win every battle.
Yet you think that Boris will look dumb if he tries his best but gets thwarted by Remain MPs?
But he hasn’t tried anything. He has not proposed anything to the EU.
He has, the WA minus the backstop
Er, he explicitly acknowledged to Merkel that he accepts there needs to be an alternative to the backstop. Remember how grateful he was that she gave him 30 days?
If true, 2019 looks unlikely. Once you get past 31 October, no one is going to thank you for a Christmas election. And no one seems to have noticed that with prorogation November is almost impossible to hit.
Which does rather beg the question - will be be facing exactly the same situation in January?
And January 2021, and...
Johnson’s entire strategy has been based on getting an election before 31st October. What’s he going to do if he doesn’t get one?
There'll be an election after 31st. Corbyn though will have his Pyrrhic Victory insofar Johnson will have failed to take us out of the EU by that date.
Johnson won't have failed. Johnson will be on the side of the people while the smug politicians think they know better than what the public decided and are obstructing Brexit and obstructing an election.
How? The public wants a deal. It’s up to BoJo to get one now. Chop chop. Believe in Britain.
Parliament is sabotaging Britain's ability to get a deal though, didn't you hear?
The thing is, what possible deal could Boris do at the summit if he went in with a majority and the threat of No Deal? The only one is the original WA with the NI-backstop, and if it came a couple of days after the election he could get away with selling it as a negotiating triumph, for a while.
Drop the backstop, kick the can on Ireland, agree everything else and pledge to work in good faith to sort out Ireland in the transition period.
Job done.
The EU wouldn't agree to it, and there wouldn't be any substantive negotiations on it in that forum. The only possibility is to revert to the previous draft of the backstop, and call it something else - "all island economic zone" or some such.
The EU could agree to it if the alternative is no deal.
They wouldn't, and even if they did, it isn't something that could be negotiated in a Council meeting. It would need an extension and further negotiation.
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Why would they look dumb? They tried their best. Cant win every battle.
Yet you think that Boris will look dumb if he tries his best but gets thwarted by Remain MPs?
But he hasn’t tried anything. He has not proposed anything to the EU.
He has, the WA minus the backstop
Er, he explicitly acknowledged to Merkel that he accepts there needs to be an alternative to the backstop. Remember how grateful he was that she gave him 30 days?
He's very polite to ladies, especially when anyone's watching
If the filibuster works - how dumb are the forces of Remain going to look? And especially, those Tory MPs who have lost their jobs for a Bill that ran into the sands...
Why would they look dumb? They tried their best. Cant win every battle.
Yet you think that Boris will look dumb if he tries his best but gets thwarted by Remain MPs?
But he hasn’t tried anything. He has not proposed anything to the EU.
He has, the WA minus the backstop
To which they have asked him to propose what he wants to replace the backstop with.
We’re still waiting.
We're too early to say nothing.
There is no need for anything to replace the backstop.
The EU beg to differ. They are not going to capitulate.
Parliament has voted it down 3 times - why would they want a nation to accept something the people’s parliament voted down ?
They need to be more inventive if they want a deal.
Comments
Would the Queen then insist that politicans sort themselves out with an election?
That is my dream scenario.
www.michaelfallon.org.uk/?p=2598
Corbyn won the first ward branch vote in Islington North
St Peters branch voted unanimously to reselect Thornberry
A ward backed Campbell in Tynemouth
McGovern won the first ward branch that voted in Wirral South yesterday
A ward branch in City of Chester also voted...but I don't know the outcome
You can't just have anyone rock up at Buck House (with or without a taxi) and tell HMQ they're going to be PM?
Yours is a more sophisticated analysis than mine earlier, which was to your first point only: simply that the idea Labour will sustain damage in an election campaign for having in the less recent past voted against an election, when in the more recent past they voted for an election, is faintly absurd.
No deal hasn’t been prevented at all. Boris gets to set up an election nov 1st, he then no deals us after Christmas?.
It also does the monarchy no harm at all supporting letting voters decide what this useless Parliament cannot in a general election (plus voters by a 20% margin backed proroguing Parliament with Survation last weekend)
https://parliamentlive.tv/Event/Index/3ee21ab2-8e9e-4ea5-aa0c-ee785b88212c
Not all Blairites as such but centre-left and old right etc —- but your general point is correct.
I quite fancy a Christmas election. It will be a novelty.
Ramsay Mcdonald stayed to lead the national government (but was basically a Conservative govenment with a Labour leader) partly at the behest of King George V and indeed Ramsay and George had quite a deep personal friendship in the end.
Obviously HMQ has taken a very "hands off" role during her reign but then again we've never seen a crisis quite like this during her reign I don't think.
I just wonder whether its getting to the point where she's going to have to do something...
Be like saying Corbyn is out of order bringing forth a new VoNC.
"Dominic Cummings found in contempt of parliament"
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/mar/27/commons-report-rules-dominic-cummings-in-contempt-of-parliament
Oh, there isn't going to be one. There isn't going to be Brexit on 31st. He's got a -43 majority. He's lost all his Parliamentary votes.
You apparently think this is all in the Cummings plan. I pity you for that.
Job done.
http://www.katoikos.eu/dialogue/the-ideological-psychopaths-behind-trump-putin-and-brexit.html
Why would they look dumb? They tried their best. Cant win every battle.
I do remember the adoration with which the Lords were held by the #FBPE lot on twitter till recently.
Exquisite......
My personal view is
1. I agree with pedley, the optics of blocking no deal and the election might not look good for the opposition party’s, but only amongst leavers, remainers probably loving Boris, as seant would say, strong up hog tied and naked.
2. Corbyn is wide open to the partisan chicken attack, but surely those of us politics aficionado on PB would think worse of him if he passed on the gift of being able to kettle his opponent? If you support Boris you must be spitting teeth, but what would you really think of a LOTO who passed on this opportunity?
3. But the main thing from the week, that trumps all other optics and perhaps reverberates forever, the decision to throw from the Conservative party people who define conservatism in this country, thrown out after the only rebel vote in lives for some of them, by an awkward squad who used rebelling as a weapon over and over. If the local associations can’t back these MPs because all they care about Is brexit, then something is clearly and dangerously broken.
We’re still waiting.
There is no need for anything to replace the backstop.
They need to be more inventive if they want a deal.