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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Johnson’s taking a big gamble avoiding Andrew Neil

SystemSystem Posts: 11,002
edited December 2019 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Johnson’s taking a big gamble avoiding Andrew Neil

“It is not too late. We have an interview prepared. Oven-ready, as Mr Johnson likes to say”

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • Brutal but entirely deserved. A liar, a coward and a cheat.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,287
    TYPO CONTINUE
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,287
    and no it will not.
  • Today's news: Jeremy Corbyn leads a party of virulent antisemites.

    Also: Boris can't be bothered to do an interview.

    Big frickin' deal! :sunglasses:
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901
    That AN clip is utterly damning, who in their right mind can give that man the keys to no 10.

    People here may hate Corbyn, but clearly any Tory majority is not a risk worth taking and those that can't stomach either have to find a way to force a hung parliament.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,841
    Agree to do it 6.30am on Thursday 12th December
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,841
    Jonathan said:

    That AN clip is utterly damning, who in their right mind can give that man the keys to no 10.

    People here may hate Corbyn, but clearly any Tory majority is not a risk worth taking and those that can't stomach either have to find a way to force a hung parliament.

    I think he should do it tbf but I'm sorry Andrew Neil isn't the only interviewer in the country.
  • If Boris the Coward gets smashed all over the media - and it will - this will play really badly for the Tories. I'm here at the Stockton South hustings and the Tory candidate is a no show and has been empty chaired to boos. And no, it's not a stacked Labour audience there are a LOT of Brexiteers here
  • eekeek Posts: 24,797
    Jonathan said:

    That AN clip is utterly damning, who in their right mind can give that man the keys to no 10.

    People here may hate Corbyn, but clearly any Tory majority is not a risk worth taking and those that can't stomach either have to find a way to force a hung parliament.

    Anyone else here ever had dealings with Boris?

  • Jonathan said:

    That AN clip is utterly damning, who in their right mind can give that man the keys to no 10.

    People here may hate Corbyn, but clearly any Tory majority is not a risk worth taking and those that can't stomach either have to find a way to force a hung parliament.

    Only in your dreams.

    p.s. Only 6 full campaigning days remain until polling day.
  • Andrew Neil is good, but he is not God!
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901
    BluerBlue said:

    Jonathan said:

    That AN clip is utterly damning, who in their right mind can give that man the keys to no 10.

    People here may hate Corbyn, but clearly any Tory majority is not a risk worth taking and those that can't stomach either have to find a way to force a hung parliament.

    Only in your dreams.

    p.s. Only 6 full campaigning days remain until polling day.
    Yes, the future for our country is bleak. Cheers.
  • Johnson is a liar and he is a coward. The election campaign has demonstrated that. No-one can say they have not been warned.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    Neil has a big big ego, it was a bad move to piss him off.

    It's a very effective clip - it summarises a lot of the key problems with Boris in a fair style (since he wants Boris to answer the questions) withotu rebuttal, and without pretending Boris is obliged to attend. Clips don't make a campaign, and as has been noted the turnaround from people who hate Neil who will circulate it will be be very amusing, but it is a good video for Labour to circulate as widely as they can. People who don't like them might still trust Neil.
  • BluerBlue said:

    Today's news: Jeremy Corbyn leads a party of virulent antisemites.

    Also: Boris can't be bothered to do an interview.

    Big frickin' deal! :sunglasses:

    Neil will expose him as a lying cheating racist. Your continuous arse kissing smears are like listening to Jim Davidson after he's had 8 pints down the Charlton Townhouse.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,697
    edited December 2019
    Neil's a puffed up windbag and his face will be a picture next week when Boris STILL gets a majority and he's shown to utterly, utterly insignificant.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    Jonathan said:

    That AN clip is utterly damning, who in their right mind can give that man the keys to no 10.

    People here may hate Corbyn, but clearly any Tory majority is not a risk worth taking and those that can't stomach either have to find a way to force a hung parliament.

    I don't think the parts of that sentence naturally fit together. A hung parliament means Corbyn running things, at least temporarily, we do have to stomach one of them.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,697
    edited December 2019
    I bet the vast majority of viewers were sitting at home thinking for gods sake shut the **** up and lets get on with Eastenders. :D
  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,279
    Have to agree, its not a good look after the other party Leaders took part in the Andrew Neil interviews. Having been interviewed by Andrew Neil during the Conservative Leadership contest, why is Boris now risking this becoming a big story in the final week of the GE campaign?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    edited December 2019
    GIN1138 said:

    Neil's a puffed up windbag and his face will be a picture next week when Boris STILL gets a majority and he's shown to utterly, utterly insignificant.

    That strikes me as an overreaction. People seem pretty certain Neil is still a Tory supporter, so he will presumably be perfectly content if Boris wins and won't mind that his clip did not prevent it.

    It is perfecrtly possible that he, and others, might be irritated or outraged by specific things Boris has done or said but on a personal level still want them to win. To pretend anyone who says anything critical - or in this case, merely raise the questions that would be put to someone - means they are out to get that person, is acting like a Corbynite.
  • BluerBlue said:

    Today's news: Jeremy Corbyn leads a party of virulent antisemites.

    Also: Boris can't be bothered to do an interview.

    Big frickin' deal! :sunglasses:

    Neil will expose him as a lying cheating racist. Your continuous arse kissing smears are like listening to Jim Davidson after he's had 8 pints down the Charlton Townhouse.
    I can see you feel the election's going very well for you! :lol:
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 49,959
    BluerBlue said:

    Jonathan said:

    That AN clip is utterly damning, who in their right mind can give that man the keys to no 10.

    People here may hate Corbyn, but clearly any Tory majority is not a risk worth taking and those that can't stomach either have to find a way to force a hung parliament.

    Only in your dreams.

    p.s. Only 6 full campaigning days remain until polling day.
    So many postals in already.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901
    edited December 2019
    kle4 said:

    Jonathan said:

    That AN clip is utterly damning, who in their right mind can give that man the keys to no 10.

    People here may hate Corbyn, but clearly any Tory majority is not a risk worth taking and those that can't stomach either have to find a way to force a hung parliament.

    I don't think the parts of that sentence naturally fit together. A hung parliament means Corbyn running things, at least temporarily, we do have to stomach one of them.
    With a majority Boris is unconstrained and dangerous. A hung parliament puts a brake on whoever is in no10. Since a Boris majority is now odds on, the saner of us need to move to block that Tory majority. But it is probably too late.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    Jonathan said:

    kle4 said:

    Jonathan said:

    That AN clip is utterly damning, who in their right mind can give that man the keys to no 10.

    People here may hate Corbyn, but clearly any Tory majority is not a risk worth taking and those that can't stomach either have to find a way to force a hung parliament.

    I don't think the parts of that sentence naturally fit together. A hung parliament means Corbyn running things, at least temporarily, we do have to stomach one of them.
    With a majority Boris is unconstrained and dangerous. A hung parliament puts a break whoever is in no10. Since a Boris majority is now odds on, the saner of us need to move to block that Tory majority. But it is probably too late.
    I'm doing my part, but its about weighing risks, not that a hung parliament avoids any.
  • fitalass said:

    Have to agree, its not a good look after the other party Leaders took part in the Andrew Neil interviews. Having been interviewed by Andrew Neil during the Conservative Leadership contest, why is Boris now risking this becoming a big story in the final week of the GE campaign?

    Hubris and arrogance. The Tories think they've won. They think they don't need to submit to scrutiny because LOOK CORBYN! Yet cowardice is not a happy image for a leading politician to have, especially in the final week. Running away from scrutiny.

    He'll have to do it. And be made to look stupid for avoiding it.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    BluerBlue said:

    Today's news: Jeremy Corbyn leads a party of virulent antisemites.

    Also: Boris can't be bothered to do an interview.

    Big frickin' deal! :sunglasses:

    Which one is new news, and appeals to media types a lot?
  • BluerBlue said:

    BluerBlue said:

    Today's news: Jeremy Corbyn leads a party of virulent antisemites.

    Also: Boris can't be bothered to do an interview.

    Big frickin' deal! :sunglasses:

    Neil will expose him as a lying cheating racist. Your continuous arse kissing smears are like listening to Jim Davidson after he's had 8 pints down the Charlton Townhouse.
    I can see you feel the election's going very well for you! :lol:
    Yep.. Watching through the exit polls last night someone posted made me realise elections often have this effect on me. I just really cannot believe people actually believe Bojo. YouGov forget the key question: would you buy a used car off this man? Surely nobody would yet they believe the bullshit he comes out with. Astonishing
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901
    kle4 said:

    Jonathan said:

    kle4 said:

    Jonathan said:

    That AN clip is utterly damning, who in their right mind can give that man the keys to no 10.

    People here may hate Corbyn, but clearly any Tory majority is not a risk worth taking and those that can't stomach either have to find a way to force a hung parliament.

    I don't think the parts of that sentence naturally fit together. A hung parliament means Corbyn running things, at least temporarily, we do have to stomach one of them.
    With a majority Boris is unconstrained and dangerous. A hung parliament puts a break whoever is in no10. Since a Boris majority is now odds on, the saner of us need to move to block that Tory majority. But it is probably too late.
    I'm doing my part, but its about weighing risks, not that a hung parliament avoids any.
    We need to get that Tory lead down to below 2% by polling day. It won't happen. But that is what needs to happen if we are to avoid being totally screwed.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 12,745
    GIN1138 said:

    Neil's a puffed up windbag and his face will be a picture next week when Boris STILL gets a majority and he's shown to utterly, utterly insignificant.

    Indeed - Boris Johnson isn't obliged to do the Neil interview but he does aspire to continue to be Prime Minister and he is therefore entitled to scrutiny and question particularly on some of the pledges and commitments he and his Party have made.

    By seeking to evade or avoid such scrutiny, it only raises the thought he has something to hide or doesn't have confidence in the pledges that have thrown like confetti by his campaign.

    It's perfectly reasonable for him to be asked about his options if he doesn't win a majority or can't get a trade deal with the EU by the end of next year. The more he evades the more those of us who think he is looking to leave without a trade deal on 31/12/20 will be re-enforced in our view.
  • GIN1138 said:

    Neil's a puffed up windbag and his face will be a picture next week when Boris STILL gets a majority and he's shown to utterly, utterly insignificant.

    Johnson’s cowardice and lies will not stop him getting a majority because of who he is up against. But they also reveal the contempt in which he holds the electorate. That does not bode well for him or, much more important, the country.

  • TudorRoseTudorRose Posts: 1,662
    FPT
    Of course, Boris now knows the questions he will face. If he thinks he can prepare answers for them then my guess is he will do the interview on Wednesday. The TV/radio media won't be able to cover it on Thursday.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,697
    edited December 2019
    kle4 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Neil's a puffed up windbag and his face will be a picture next week when Boris STILL gets a majority and he's shown to utterly, utterly insignificant.

    That strikes me as an overreaction. People seem pretty certain Neil is still a Tory supporter, so he will presumably be perfectly content if Boris wins and won't mind that his clip did not prevent it.

    It is perfecrtly possible that he, and others, might be irritated or outraged by specific things Boris has done or said but on a personal level still want them to win. To pretend anyone who says anything critical - or in this case, merely raise the questions that would be put to someone - means they are out to get that person, is acting like a Corbynite.
    Well to be fair I was VERY unimpressed with the way Neil treated Jezza and said as much on here at the time so at least I'm consistent. ;)

    For me Neil sums up everything that's wrong with the media class... They think THEY are the story and this great democratic process we call a general election is all about them.

    I'm sure elections were not like this before 2010 and the debates.

    EDIT: And I would say Boris's campaign has been poor because even he hasn't really got out and about and actually met the voters in market towns and cities like politicians used to do back in the day.

    I think we've certainly lost something with our elections.
  • BluerBlueBluerBlue Posts: 521
    edited December 2019
    fitalass said:

    Have to agree, its not a good look after the other party Leaders took part in the Andrew Neil interviews. Having been interviewed by Andrew Neil during the Conservative Leadership contest, why is Boris now risking this becoming a big story in the final week of the GE campaign?

    If a Westminster Bubble story becomes a big deal in the final week - which it probably won't since Boris will debate Corbyn head-to-head tomorrow night - then that's a week in which Labour's huge bribes are not the story. As I pointed out last week, and still strongly believe, this is a dead cat designed to keep running.

    Not a single vote will change because Boris wasn't interviewed by Andrew Neil.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,841
    TudorRose said:

    FPT
    Of course, Boris now knows the questions he will face. If he thinks he can prepare answers for them then my guess is he will do the interview on Wednesday. The TV/radio media won't be able to cover it on Thursday.

    He will do it Monday, way too late for it to affect anything by then
  • I don't think Boris can do the interview now. It would look like he's been bullied into it.

    There will be a price for not doing it though. It will be more than just the 'chicken' thing. He's kind of confirming that the trust thing is a real issue and for those not already committed to his cause, or against it, it will register.

    Strikes me as being a kind of parallel to Corbyn's AS problem. If there's nothing in it, why hasn't it been disposed of? If Johnson is trustworthy, he'd surely want to put the matter beyond doubt to the doubters.

    He really cannot complain if those doubters now draw their own conclusions from his no show.

  • I would have prefered Boris had done the AN interview but AN action tonight has probably finished any hope of it as a PM cannot be seen to be bullied by the media

    Boris should have done it when it was scheduled but he has the perfect opportunity tomorrow night to address it if asked as he is on BBC after all in one of the two big debates of the campaign

  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    Jonathan said:

    kle4 said:

    Jonathan said:

    kle4 said:

    Jonathan said:

    That AN clip is utterly damning, who in their right mind can give that man the keys to no 10.

    People here may hate Corbyn, but clearly any Tory majority is not a risk worth taking and those that can't stomach either have to find a way to force a hung parliament.

    I don't think the parts of that sentence naturally fit together. A hung parliament means Corbyn running things, at least temporarily, we do have to stomach one of them.
    With a majority Boris is unconstrained and dangerous. A hung parliament puts a break whoever is in no10. Since a Boris majority is now odds on, the saner of us need to move to block that Tory majority. But it is probably too late.
    I'm doing my part, but its about weighing risks, not that a hung parliament avoids any.
    We need to get that Tory lead down to below 2% by polling day. It won't happen. But that is what needs to happen if we are to avoid being totally screwed.
    4-6 would be enough, especially if the pollsters are wrong again.
    TudorRose said:

    FPT
    Of course, Boris now knows the questions he will face. If he thinks he can prepare answers for them then my guess is he will do the interview on Wednesday. The TV/radio media won't be able to cover it on Thursday.

    I imagine he could guess what the questions would be about anyway, it'sthe followups that might get you in these situations. But really hearing them without Boris even attempting an answer because he is not there, plays very badly.

    But I doubt many who are not on LD and Labour mailing lists and twitter feeds will see it.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408

    Johnson is a liar and he is a coward. The election campaign has demonstrated that. No-one can say they have not been warned.

    He's also arrogant, don't forget that.
  • isamisam Posts: 40,731
    edited December 2019
    Won't make any difference

    Has anyone here actually spent a few days without seeking any political news? I mean avoiding the tv news, this website and twitter? Whenever I do so, it amazes me how little you hear of it, and how these supposedly pivotal moments are actually just hooks for anoraks to hang their narratives on after the event
  • TBH, I don't think any normal person will care a toss what interviews Boris does or doesn't do.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,841
    Dont forget the other side of the coin. Those people who think 'aye, canny lad '
  • fitalass said:

    Have to agree, its not a good look after the other party Leaders took part in the Andrew Neil interviews. Having been interviewed by Andrew Neil during the Conservative Leadership contest, why is Boris now risking this becoming a big story in the final week of the GE campaign?

    Hubris and arrogance. The Tories think they've won. They think they don't need to submit to scrutiny because LOOK CORBYN! Yet cowardice is not a happy image for a leading politician to have, especially in the final week. Running away from scrutiny.

    He'll have to do it. And be made to look stupid for avoiding it.
    This conservative does not think it is won but I do think AN action tonight has ended any chance of Boris appearing on his programme
  • TBH, I don't think any normal person will care a toss what interviews Boris does or doesn't do.

    100% correct. But a number of Twitter activists will drive themselves into a state of nervous exhaustion and apoplexy as a result, so that's something, I guess.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901

    TBH, I don't think any normal person will care a toss what interviews Boris does or doesn't do.

    Do you care?
  • melcfmelcf Posts: 166
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/election-2019-50663879/general-election-2019-how-do-grimsby-s-food-bank-users-want-to-vote
    In Grimsby, Tories message, No Bread, eat Brexit
    After shafting them for 9.5 years. Please give us another 5, to finish the job
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408

    TBH, I don't think any normal person will care a toss what interviews Boris does or doesn't do.

    Probably not. Speaks to Boris well though.

    And as it is a common retort, Neil being a pompous arse doesn't matter either way.
  • kle4 said:

    Johnson is a liar and he is a coward. The election campaign has demonstrated that. No-one can say they have not been warned.

    He's also arrogant, don't forget that.
    Yes, a liar, a coward, arrogant AND an adulterer....don't forget that.
  • OT I don’t think this will matter because Boris has done other debates and interviews. The thing that really hurt May was that she didn’t do any debates.

    Should it matter? Probably. I think it reflects badly on the BBC too that they didn’t get all leaders committed before they started the series of interviews.
  • isam said:

    Won't make any difference

    Has anyone here actually spent a few days without seeking any political news? I mean avoiding the tv news, this website and twitter? Whenever I do so, it amazes me how little you hear of it, and how these supposedly pivotal events are actually just hooks for anoraks to hang their narratives on afterward

    Yep, I agree. It will make no difference at all to the election result. But it will help to shape longer-term perceptions of Johnson that he will find very difficult to combat if he fails to deliver on the promises he has made. The silly thing is he would have won easily without the lies and the cowardice. They have not been necessary. That does indicate they are a big part of what he is.

  • melcfmelcf Posts: 166
    Boris, the big girls blouse
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,841

    kle4 said:

    Johnson is a liar and he is a coward. The election campaign has demonstrated that. No-one can say they have not been warned.

    He's also arrogant, don't forget that.
    Yes, a liar, a coward, arrogant AND an adulterer....don't forget that.
    Burn the witch
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901

    kle4 said:

    Johnson is a liar and he is a coward. The election campaign has demonstrated that. No-one can say they have not been warned.

    He's also arrogant, don't forget that.
    Yes, a liar, a coward, arrogant AND an adulterer....don't forget that.
    A Prime Minister happy to act unlawfully when things don't go well for him, let's not forget that either.
  • Jonathan said:

    TBH, I don't think any normal person will care a toss what interviews Boris does or doesn't do.

    Do you care?
    No. I care about lots of other things, most particularly the bonkers pledge not to extend the transition. But then, I'm not a typical voter.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 24,587
    edited December 2019
    BluerBlue said:

    Jonathan said:

    That AN clip is utterly damning, who in their right mind can give that man the keys to no 10.

    People here may hate Corbyn, but clearly any Tory majority is not a risk worth taking and those that can't stomach either have to find a way to force a hung parliament.

    Only in your dreams.

    p.s. Only 6 full campaigning days remain until polling day.
    What is the point of your rudeness? Jonathan made a sensible point which will doubtless be debated by interested parties on both sides.

    I am not sure how old you are, but your immature trolling is best confined to the schoolyard.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 38,851
    It was really good that Neil did this. "Boris" will not be doing the interview - even more certain now - but a price has been paid. The monologue was powerful and will go viral. It will not change many votes, nor would an interview, including Corbyn's poor one, but the point is that fairness has been restored. That is the important thing. Issue is now closed as far as I'm concerned.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,841
    edited December 2019
    I'd love if Boris went on and was just utterly dismissive of Neil's abilities.
    'I'm surprised someone as supposedly terrifying as you would ask such an inane question Andrew'
  • stodgestodge Posts: 12,745
    Evening all :)

    I've long thought this election was never going to be a contest and I confidently expect the Conservatives to win a decent majority next week.

    There'll be plenty of epitaphs, obituaries and blame to throw around but in truth there was very little to stop a Conservative majority once May resigned and the ComRes poll on June 11th showed Johnson alone of her potential successors winning a majority. Indeed, it may be the final figures don't vary far from the second ComRes poll during the leadership campaign.

    Why?

    Johnson has been able to yoke the bulk of the LEAVE vote to his side - assuming 75% of the 48% LEAVE vote, that's 36% of the total vote in his pocket. Had the Conservatives picked someone else (Hunt), Farage would have been much stronger and we wouldn't have seen the BXP implosion.

    However, 36% doesn't get you over the line - what gets the majority is the other component of the Conservative voting coalition - the 16% of REMAIN voters so let's call that another 8%.

    Who are they? Again, two overlapping groups - one is those who, for all they backed REMAIN in 2016, believe the result of the referendum needs to be enacted in the spirit of democracy. In addition, there are those who are terrified of the prospect of a Corbyn Government and even if not really Conservatives and wary of Johnson, see him as a much more palatable alternative to the Islington Marxist.

    These three groups exist now but only for now - once Brexit is enacted and assuming Corbyn is gone the Conservatives will then need a new voting bloc and that will be the result of how Johnson and his Party comport themselves in Government in the next five years.

    In 2024, they will have a record to defend and commitments on which they can and rightly will be judged. I suspect after 14 years in Government and facing a new and hopefully more centrist opposition, the next GE will be much more interesting.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901
    edited December 2019

    Jonathan said:

    TBH, I don't think any normal person will care a toss what interviews Boris does or doesn't do.

    Do you care?
    No. I care about lots of other things, most particularly the bonkers pledge not to extend the transition. But then, I'm not a typical voter.
    The hard exit looks nailed on if he gets a majority, that we have to stop. This must really hurt as a long-term Tory.
  • So am I miles behind here? I'm confused why Grimsby is so thought to be a Tory success when the fishing rights are not covered in Boris's deal. Any reason for this?
  • "4-6 would be enough, especially if the pollsters are wrong again."

    In a 2017 way but not a 2015 way, of course.
  • Jonathan said:

    kle4 said:

    Johnson is a liar and he is a coward. The election campaign has demonstrated that. No-one can say they have not been warned.

    He's also arrogant, don't forget that.
    Yes, a liar, a coward, arrogant AND an adulterer....don't forget that.
    A Prime Minister happy to act unlawfully when things don't go well for him, let's not forget that either.
    I can understand your anger and frustration as you see remain slipping away but have you ever thought that if labour had had a sensible leader who was pro remain and a sensible lib dem leader who did not commit the biggest mistake of the election in revoke that Boris may not have been the end result
  • kle4 said:

    Johnson is a liar and he is a coward. The election campaign has demonstrated that. No-one can say they have not been warned.

    He's also arrogant, don't forget that.
    Yes, a liar, a coward, arrogant AND an adulterer....don't forget that.
    I don’t care too much that he’s an adulterer, lots of our most successful leaders have been. I do have a strong dislike of the man though and I’m not sure, if he wins a full 5 years, we’ll enjoy the ride that much.

    Boris is very lucky he’s facing Corbyn’s Labour. If we had a decent opposition he really wouldn’t be getting my vote.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,697

    GIN1138 said:

    Neil's a puffed up windbag and his face will be a picture next week when Boris STILL gets a majority and he's shown to utterly, utterly insignificant.

    Johnson’s cowardice and lies will not stop him getting a majority because of who he is up against. But they also reveal the contempt in which he holds the electorate. That does not bode well for him or, much more important, the country.

    Well then the electorate can throw him out next time and do so with relish. :D
  • Given his opponent, Johnson did not have to lie and run away from scrutiny to win this election. That he has done both anyway shows they are integral to who he is. He lies and hides because he cannot do anything else. He is a liar and a coward.
  • GIN1138 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Neil's a puffed up windbag and his face will be a picture next week when Boris STILL gets a majority and he's shown to utterly, utterly insignificant.

    Johnson’s cowardice and lies will not stop him getting a majority because of who he is up against. But they also reveal the contempt in which he holds the electorate. That does not bode well for him or, much more important, the country.

    Well then the electorate can throw him out next time and do so with relish. :D

    I suspect that is exactly what will happen.

  • Jonathan said:

    Jonathan said:

    TBH, I don't think any normal person will care a toss what interviews Boris does or doesn't do.

    Do you care?
    No. I care about lots of other things, most particularly the bonkers pledge not to extend the transition. But then, I'm not a typical voter.
    The hard exit looks nailed on if he gets a majority, that we have to stop. This must really hurt as a long-term Tory.
    Not sure it"s nailed on, but I agree it's a risk, and one I"m not prepared to take. So I'm not voting for it.
  • GideonWiseGideonWise Posts: 1,123
    Andrew Neil is a good journalist but is buying into his own hype a little bit too much. You can see that by just following him on twitter and seeing how he consistently retweets comments from people praising... Andrew Neil. He's one journalist, a good and well researched one, amongst many.

    But you can't help but think the desperation to get Johnson on is because Neil wants a gotcha moment. In other words, it's more about further boosting brand Neil than any true discussion with Johnson.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 49,959

    OT I don’t think this will matter because Boris has done other debates and interviews. The thing that really hurt May was that she didn’t do any debates.

    Should it matter? Probably. I think it reflects badly on the BBC too that they didn’t get all leaders committed before they started the series of interviews.

    Amateur hour by the BBC debates team - any one leader interview should have been contingent on all the others agreeing.

    Amateur hour by the Labour team managing Corbyn - they have exposed their leader to a level of scrutiny not required of the PM.

    And amateur hour by Andrew Neil. He's played his cards and shown he is out to "get" the PM - whether he gets to interview him or not, h's gone for "the clip". Not smart. He wil now never get to interview Boris as PM - ever - is my guess. He showed he is no more professional than Andrew Marr.
  • So am I miles behind here? I'm confused why Grimsby is so thought to be a Tory success when the fishing rights are not covered in Boris's deal. Any reason for this?

    Yes, voter ignorance.
  • Neil's thing is irrelevant. Just like Brexit, the vast majority just want the election done. The whole political class isn't much liked, another week of them is just boring.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 24,587
    edited December 2019

    kle4 said:

    Johnson is a liar and he is a coward. The election campaign has demonstrated that. No-one can say they have not been warned.

    He's also arrogant, don't forget that.
    Yes, a liar, a coward, arrogant AND an adulterer....don't forget that.
    The two items from Johnson's past which would have killed any other politician's career are the financial issues surrounding Ms Arcuri and most importantly the Darius Guppy affair which is pretty much consigned to history.

    If I had conspired with a friend to assault a Sun journalist I would have likely as not been charged and convicted of 'conspiracy'. It hasn't hindered Johnson's ascent of the greasy pole one iota.
  • isamisam Posts: 40,731
    edited December 2019

    isam said:

    Won't make any difference

    Has anyone here actually spent a few days without seeking any political news? I mean avoiding the tv news, this website and twitter? Whenever I do so, it amazes me how little you hear of it, and how these supposedly pivotal events are actually just hooks for anoraks to hang their narratives on afterward

    Yep, I agree. It will make no difference at all to the election result. But it will help to shape longer-term perceptions of Johnson that he will find very difficult to combat if he fails to deliver on the promises he has made. The silly thing is he would have won easily without the lies and the cowardice. They have not been necessary. That does indicate they are a big part of what he is.

    I reckon most of the people who take any notice are so entrenched in their view, thanks to the relentless name calling and accusations of isms etc from their opponents, that the politicans they favour can pretty much so what they like now.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408

    "4-6 would be enough, especially if the pollsters are wrong again."

    In a 2017 way but not a 2015 way, of course.

    Fair point.
  • Andrew Neil is a good journalist but is buying into his own hype a little bit too much. You can see that by just following him on twitter and seeing how he consistently retweets comments from people praising... Andrew Neil. He's one journalist, a good and well researched one, amongst many.

    But you can't help but think the desperation to get Johnson on is because Neil wants a gotcha moment. In other words, it's more about further boosting brand Neil than any true discussion with Johnson.

    Andrew Neill is going to get a lot of praise from the same people who’ve been calling him a Tory shill over the years. Amusing.
  • Jonathan said:

    Jonathan said:

    TBH, I don't think any normal person will care a toss what interviews Boris does or doesn't do.

    Do you care?
    No. I care about lots of other things, most particularly the bonkers pledge not to extend the transition. But then, I'm not a typical voter.
    The hard exit looks nailed on if he gets a majority, that we have to stop. This must really hurt as a long-term Tory.
    Not sure it"s nailed on, but I agree it's a risk, and one I"m not prepared to take. So I'm not voting for it.

    Don’t tell me you’re voting LibDem!!?? If so, we’d be voting for the same party. That is not something either of us would have expected even a year ago!!

  • kle4 said:

    Johnson is a liar and he is a coward. The election campaign has demonstrated that. No-one can say they have not been warned.

    He's also arrogant, don't forget that.
    Yes, a liar, a coward, arrogant AND an adulterer....don't forget that.
    I don’t care too much that he’s an adulterer, lots of our most successful leaders have been. I do have a strong dislike of the man though and I’m not sure, if he wins a full 5 years, we’ll enjoy the ride that much.

    Boris is very lucky he’s facing Corbyn’s Labour. If we had a decent opposition he really wouldn’t be getting my vote.
    And the problem with the AN appeal is that Boris has been in front of the media all week with the terrorist attack, NATO and today at a factory in Derbyshire. Furthermore he is doing the final debate v Corbyn on the BBC tomorrow.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 49,959
    stodge said:

    Evening all :)

    I've long thought this election was never going to be a contest and I confidently expect the Conservatives to win a decent majority next week.

    There'll be plenty of epitaphs, obituaries and blame to throw around but in truth there was very little to stop a Conservative majority once May resigned and the ComRes poll on June 11th showed Johnson alone of her potential successors winning a majority. Indeed, it may be the final figures don't vary far from the second ComRes poll during the leadership campaign.

    Why?

    Johnson has been able to yoke the bulk of the LEAVE vote to his side - assuming 75% of the 48% LEAVE vote, that's 36% of the total vote in his pocket. Had the Conservatives picked someone else (Hunt), Farage would have been much stronger and we wouldn't have seen the BXP implosion.

    However, 36% doesn't get you over the line - what gets the majority is the other component of the Conservative voting coalition - the 16% of REMAIN voters so let's call that another 8%.

    Who are they? Again, two overlapping groups - one is those who, for all they backed REMAIN in 2016, believe the result of the referendum needs to be enacted in the spirit of democracy. In addition, there are those who are terrified of the prospect of a Corbyn Government and even if not really Conservatives and wary of Johnson, see him as a much more palatable alternative to the Islington Marxist.

    These three groups exist now but only for now - once Brexit is enacted and assuming Corbyn is gone the Conservatives will then need a new voting bloc and that will be the result of how Johnson and his Party comport themselves in Government in the next five years.

    In 2024, they will have a record to defend and commitments on which they can and rightly will be judged. I suspect after 14 years in Government and facing a new and hopefully more centrist opposition, the next GE will be much more interesting.

    That should be 75% of the 52% Leave vote..... That's 39% in his pocket.
  • BluerBlue said:

    Today's news: Jeremy Corbyn leads a party of virulent antisemites.

    Also: Boris can't be bothered to do an interview.

    Big frickin' deal! :sunglasses:

    Neil will expose him as a lying cheating racist. Your continuous arse kissing smears are like listening to Jim Davidson after he's had 8 pints down the Charlton Townhouse.
    Next you will be telling us Corbyn is not a racist.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,841
    'Of course I'll let you interview me Andrew, I'm keen to let the lesser BBC interviewers have their day in the sun'
  • dodradedodrade Posts: 595
    TudorRose said:

    FPT
    Of course, Boris now knows the questions he will face. If he thinks he can prepare answers for them then my guess is he will do the interview on Wednesday. The TV/radio media won't be able to cover it on Thursday.

    I was a bit surprised by that. As good as Neil is though is he really likely to come up with something every other journalist (and Phillip Schofield) has somehow missed?

    And of course it's bound to come up tomorrow night again.
  • kle4 said:

    Johnson is a liar and he is a coward. The election campaign has demonstrated that. No-one can say they have not been warned.

    He's also arrogant, don't forget that.
    Yes, a liar, a coward, arrogant AND an adulterer....don't forget that.
    The two items from Johnson's past which would have killed any other politician's career are the financial issues surrounding Ms Arcuri and most importantly the Darius Guppy affair which is pretty much consigned to history.

    If I had conspired with a friend to assault a Sun journalist I would have likely as not been charged and convicted of 'conspiracy'. It hasn't hindered Johnson's ascent of the greasy pole one iota.

    Running away from his responsibilities as a father and cheating on his wife as she underwent treatment for cancer would usually be dealbreakers, too.

  • XtrainXtrain Posts: 337
    Jonathan said:

    kle4 said:

    Jonathan said:

    That AN clip is utterly damning, who in their right mind can give that man the keys to no 10.

    People here may hate Corbyn, but clearly any Tory majority is not a risk worth taking and those that can't stomach either have to find a way to force a hung parliament.

    the saner of us need to move to block that Tory majority.

    As opposed to voting for him you mean which you were considering.
    FFS is this Playschool?
  • stodgestodge Posts: 12,745



    I can understand your anger and frustration as you see remain slipping away but have you ever thought that if labour had had a sensible leader who was pro remain and a sensible lib dem leader who did not commit the biggest mistake of the election in revoke that Boris may not have been the end result

    With respect, the LD policy to revoke only if they won a majority wasn't and isn't a mistake. The problem remains the one those trying to stop Brexit have faced all the way since June 2016 and that is not only were those who voted LEAVE opposed but a sizeable minority of those voting REMAIN wanted, in the spirit of democratic fairness, to see the referendum result enacted. That notion of democratic legitimacy has been like an anchor to the pro-REMAIN groups.

    There is no way to "Stop Brexit" that makes any logical sense but let's get a proper Brexit which works for the country rather than the nonsense dished up by both May and now Johnson.

    As I've said before, a cleverer opposition would have supported May's WA and then ensured the resulting political and trade deal was as close as possible to retaining EU membership. Between them, Labour, the LDs and SNP had the votes to ensure BINO which wouldn't have pleased everyone but would have satisfied the 2016 result.

    My fear is empowered by a working majority, Johnson and his loyal sheep will march us out without a trade Deal at the end of next year which, as I recall, was something to which you were vehemently opposed.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 49,959
    Found a lass today who as a kid was a manic leafletter for Labour. Mother was a Labour councillor in East London, grandfather a Labour mayor. Only ever voted Labour.

    Until this time.

    Reason? Corbyn.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 48,922
    edited December 2019
    Neil was a vocal and enthusiastic proponent of British military involvement in Afghanistan, deriding those who opposed the war as "wimps with no will to fight", while labelling The Guardian as The Daily Terrorist and the New Statesman as the New Taliban for publishing dissenting opinions about the wisdom of British military involvement.
    [..]
    Neil was an early advocate of the 2003 invasion of Iraq, describing the case for war and regime change advanced by Tony Blair and George W. Bush as "convincing" and "masterful".
    [..]
    Neil rejects the scientific consensus on climate change, has frequently misrepresented the science of climate change on his BBC programmes, and has frequently invited non-scientists and climate change deniers to debate climate change on his BBC programmes.
    [..]
    During Neil's time as editor, The Sunday Times backed a campaign to prove that HIV was not a cause of AIDS. In 1990, The Sunday Times serialised a book by an American conservative who rejected the scientific consensus on the causes of AIDS and argued that AIDS could not spread to heterosexuals.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Neil
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901

    Jonathan said:

    kle4 said:

    Johnson is a liar and he is a coward. The election campaign has demonstrated that. No-one can say they have not been warned.

    He's also arrogant, don't forget that.
    Yes, a liar, a coward, arrogant AND an adulterer....don't forget that.
    A Prime Minister happy to act unlawfully when things don't go well for him, let's not forget that either.
    I can understand your anger and frustration as you see remain slipping away but have you ever thought that if labour had had a sensible leader who was pro remain and a sensible lib dem leader who did not commit the biggest mistake of the election in revoke that Boris may not have been the end result
    You read me so very wrong. I really don't care about Remain. I care about the damage your man will do. He is not a safe pair of hands and unfit to be PM.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 12,745



    That should be 75% of the 52% Leave vote..... That's 39% in his pocket.

    No, the CURRENT numbers suggest 52-48 in favour of REMAIN so I'm starting from there rather than the June 2016 result.

    People do change their minds - perhaps one day you won't be a Tory.
  • Jonathan said:

    Jonathan said:

    kle4 said:

    Johnson is a liar and he is a coward. The election campaign has demonstrated that. No-one can say they have not been warned.

    He's also arrogant, don't forget that.
    Yes, a liar, a coward, arrogant AND an adulterer....don't forget that.
    A Prime Minister happy to act unlawfully when things don't go well for him, let's not forget that either.
    I can understand your anger and frustration as you see remain slipping away but have you ever thought that if labour had had a sensible leader who was pro remain and a sensible lib dem leader who did not commit the biggest mistake of the election in revoke that Boris may not have been the end result
    You read me so very wrong. I really don't care about Remain. I care about the damage your man will do. He is not a safe pair of hands and unfit to be PM.
    But who is
  • melcfmelcf Posts: 166

    So am I miles behind here? I'm confused why Grimsby is so thought to be a Tory success when the fishing rights are not covered in Boris's deal. Any reason for this?

    Cos their just to thick to think
  • GideonWiseGideonWise Posts: 1,123
    dodrade said:

    TudorRose said:

    FPT
    Of course, Boris now knows the questions he will face. If he thinks he can prepare answers for them then my guess is he will do the interview on Wednesday. The TV/radio media won't be able to cover it on Thursday.

    I was a bit surprised by that. As good as Neil is though is he really likely to come up with something every other journalist (and Phillip Schofield) has somehow missed?

    And of course it's bound to come up tomorrow night again.
    From the Tory leadership interviews between Johnson and Neil I can remember GATT24 and how it was reported that Neil knew this particular obscure detail. I don't remember anything else.

    I think that goes to the crux as to the purpose of these interviews.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 49,959
    edited December 2019

    kle4 said:

    Johnson is a liar and he is a coward. The election campaign has demonstrated that. No-one can say they have not been warned.

    He's also arrogant, don't forget that.
    Yes, a liar, a coward, arrogant AND an adulterer....don't forget that.
    The two items from Johnson's past which would have killed any other politician's career are the financial issues surrounding Ms Arcuri and most importantly the Darius Guppy affair which is pretty much consigned to history.

    If I had conspired with a friend to assault a Sun journalist I would have likely as not been charged and convicted of 'conspiracy'. It hasn't hindered Johnson's ascent of the greasy pole one iota.

    Running away from his responsibilities as a father and cheating on his wife as she underwent treatment for cancer would usually be dealbreakers, too.

    I understand their marriage had broken down and divorce proceeding were underway before the cancer was diagnosed. Boris may be a cad, but you don't help your case by overegging.
  • isam said:

    Won't make any difference

    Has anyone here actually spent a few days without seeking any political news? I mean avoiding the tv news, this website and twitter? Whenever I do so, it amazes me how little you hear of it, and how these supposedly pivotal events are actually just hooks for anoraks to hang their narratives on afterward

    Yep, I agree. It will make no difference at all to the election result. But it will help to shape longer-term perceptions of Johnson that he will find very difficult to combat if he fails to deliver on the promises he has made. The silly thing is he would have won easily without the lies and the cowardice. They have not been necessary. That does indicate they are a big part of what he is.

    I agree the direct effect of this will be negligible (or at least easily containable). Not enough people will share and see it, and few would be converted if they did.

    But I think the secondhand corrosion of BJ’s reputation can’t be written off as “longer term”. If this is prominently covered and commented on in the big papers and TV bulletins, or discussion of it (as opposed to actual views) goes viral, it will at least move the narrative away from Corbyn’s flakiness and on to his.

    Probably not a game changer, but the sort of thing which could have a bearing if the wind blows the right way.

    Out of interest, how do PBers feel about the legitimacy of Neil’s monologue? I’m a bit surprised the BBC went that far given its normal timidity in calling out politicians (especially at election time). But I’m glad they did given the weaponisation of these appearances (or lack thereof).
  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    Posted this too late on previous thread I hope anyone who hasn’t had their children vaccinated against MMR is taking bot of the news from Samoa.
  • EndillionEndillion Posts: 4,960
    This is unutterably absurd, verging on the surreal. I have followed the last four or five elections at least, moderately closely. I have never watched Andrew Neil interview a party leader, or even been that aware it was a thing that happened. When did this ritual become such an integral part of the campaign?

    If the BBC only allowed interviews with Corbyn/Swinson, the Conservatives could rightly complain this was allowing unequal airtime, and demand their own segment. Ie, exposure is meant to be a positive for your electoral chances. That people are outraged that Johnson and the Tories will be receiving less airtime than their rivals is a clear indication that something has gone horribly wrong somewhere in terms of how these interviews are being conducted. And/or those people have totally lost perspective.

    Effectively the argument boils down to, "it isn't fair that Johnson won't walk blindfolded down a banana peel strewn corridor, like the rest of us agreed to".
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901

    Jonathan said:

    Jonathan said:

    kle4 said:

    Johnson is a liar and he is a coward. The election campaign has demonstrated that. No-one can say they have not been warned.

    He's also arrogant, don't forget that.
    Yes, a liar, a coward, arrogant AND an adulterer....don't forget that.
    A Prime Minister happy to act unlawfully when things don't go well for him, let's not forget that either.
    I can understand your anger and frustration as you see remain slipping away but have you ever thought that if labour had had a sensible leader who was pro remain and a sensible lib dem leader who did not commit the biggest mistake of the election in revoke that Boris may not have been the end result
    You read me so very wrong. I really don't care about Remain. I care about the damage your man will do. He is not a safe pair of hands and unfit to be PM.
    But who is
    If you don't think either of them is fit, then the solution is to limit their power. Since one will have to be PM, you can vote to deny them a majority.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    Jonathan said:

    Jonathan said:

    kle4 said:

    Johnson is a liar and he is a coward. The election campaign has demonstrated that. No-one can say they have not been warned.

    He's also arrogant, don't forget that.
    Yes, a liar, a coward, arrogant AND an adulterer....don't forget that.
    A Prime Minister happy to act unlawfully when things don't go well for him, let's not forget that either.
    I can understand your anger and frustration as you see remain slipping away but have you ever thought that if labour had had a sensible leader who was pro remain and a sensible lib dem leader who did not commit the biggest mistake of the election in revoke that Boris may not have been the end result
    You read me so very wrong. I really don't care about Remain. I care about the damage your man will do. He is not a safe pair of hands and unfit to be PM.
    Yet you would be ok with Corbyn?

    Go figure
  • funkhauserfunkhauser Posts: 325
    edited December 2019
    isam said:

    Won't make any difference

    Has anyone here actually spent a few days without seeking any political news? I mean avoiding the tv news, this website and twitter? Whenever I do so, it amazes me how little you hear of it, and how these supposedly pivotal moments are actually just hooks for anoraks to hang their narratives on after the event


    Spot on,people are already bored with it & focused on Christmas, as you say only anoraks,the twitter mob & those don't get out in the real world get excited about it.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,841
    melcf said:

    So am I miles behind here? I'm confused why Grimsby is so thought to be a Tory success when the fishing rights are not covered in Boris's deal. Any reason for this?

    Cos their just to thick to think
    Yes the voters are Thickos for not agreeing with you and your racist leader
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,004
    edited December 2019
    stodge said:



    I can understand your anger and frustration as you see remain slipping away but have you ever thought that if labour had had a sensible leader who was pro remain and a sensible lib dem leader who did not commit the biggest mistake of the election in revoke that Boris may not have been the end result

    With respect, the LD policy to revoke only if they won a majority wasn't and isn't a mistake. The problem remains the one those trying to stop Brexit have faced all the way since June 2016 and that is not only were those who voted LEAVE opposed but a sizeable minority of those voting REMAIN wanted, in the spirit of democratic fairness, to see the referendum result enacted. That notion of democratic legitimacy has been like an anchor to the pro-REMAIN groups.

    There is no way to "Stop Brexit" that makes any logical sense but let's get a proper Brexit which works for the country rather than the nonsense dished up by both May and now Johnson.

    As I've said before, a cleverer opposition would have supported May's WA and then ensured the resulting political and trade deal was as close as possible to retaining EU membership. Between them, Labour, the LDs and SNP had the votes to ensure BINO which wouldn't have pleased everyone but would have satisfied the 2016 result.

    My fear is empowered by a working majority, Johnson and his loyal sheep will march us out without a trade Deal at the end of next year which, as I recall, was something to which you were vehemently opposed.
    I was in favour of TM deal if you recall

    And if Boris has a good majority I expect him to compromise with the EU

    Of course I do not support no deal but I expect Boris is the only person able to sqhare the issue for me

    If he takes us out on a no deal that will not be acceptable to me
This discussion has been closed.