It terms of affordability I think that food is as cheap as it has ever been in my lifetime. With some clever shopping (getting the bargains at Tescos etc) it is amazing how much food you can get for £10. You can buy a 2kg bag of pasta for less than a quid and a tin of tomatoes for 20pence. You couldn't do that 20 years ago even allowing for inflation. I could easily feed a family of 4 for a week for £10. Everyday tescos sell stuff that is going out of date for 10pence or less. I regularly go and see what bargains I can get.
The term poverty is definitely relative
LOL, you must be eating pig swill at those prices. Also eating sacks of pasta and such like is what makes the poor people fat. Crap diet by having to buy cheap muck. If you had said £10 a day I may have believed it.
Come to Tescos at Bursledon in Hampshire at 8 tonight. They have all sorts of bargains on all their produce from meat to vegetables to bread. You can fill your freezer up for less than a fiver. It just takes a little bit of clever shopping.
I just used the pasta as an example.
Currystar, good on you but no thanks, I am fortunate enough to never have to look at the price of food I just pick what I want.
I guess it varies. I get the impression that some Conservatives do genuinely care, and want the best for all in society. Then I see other opinions online, where it come across that those who are D/E are written off, because they either vote Labour, or most likely are not engaged with politics at all - and that middle class, CD2Es, WVMs are all that matter.
I think regardless for you wishes to eliminate poverty and create good jobs for all, a dispassionate review of those on welfare will find, alongside all the deserving cases, a good smattering of people gaming the system. We should not ignore that either.
BBC vox pop: as always mixed bag (to be impartial) but included one person saying he looks like an "old man" and another saying he looks like an "assistant librarian".
And the GE is 5 years away.
I think even if he does very well that age is going to be a critical factor in whether it is tenable for him to be leader at the GE.
Jeremy is 66 now, so he will be at least 70 in 2020. Cameron is I think 48 now, and Osborne only 45. Politicians have certainly been getting younger in recent history and Corbyn stands out as an exception to the ranks of 40-somethings in senior positions with all parties.
On austerity and mobile phones - I suppose it depends. The vast majority of people in this country are unlikely to be affected by austerity, and it'll be those most dependent on state services - those who suffer from mental illness for example - who are affected by austerity. In particular, those who vote Conservative are highly unlikely to see any kind of austerity, because they're unlikely to know people going through severe hardship. Therefore it's easy to conclude, in a consumerism driven society, seeing everyone with all their gadgets out in public to conclude austerity doesn't exist. ...... .
Why do you assume that people who vote Conservative are not aware of the problems of those with mental illness? This affects people in all classes.
All sorts of people may be affected by unemployment, illness, crime etc. It does not follow that because you vote Tory you aren't affected. It may be that you vote that way because you think that they are more likely than the other lot to help resolve the problems.
When I was writing about those going through severe hardship I was thinking of those going through financial problems as well as suffering mental illness. And while on an individual basis your second point may be true, generally most of those in the D/E class/the poorest in society do not vote Conservative. I can't say whether those who vote Conservative really believe voting such will help those most vulnerable - I'm simply saying that there are those out there who are affected by austerity.
I don't deny that there are people who are affected and we should be doing our level best to help them. I don't like, though, the lazy assumption that some make that if you vote Conservative you don't care about helping the worst off in society. No political party has a monopoly on virtue.
It is however clear when you look at some of the other responses that you are engaged in a dialog of the deaf. No matter how good or virtuous your arguments I am afraid there are many activists and loud voices who simply see no reason why benefits should not continue to eclipse the level of wages most workers receive and who are expected to provide the revenue to pay for them. You will always be without virtue to them. eg ''Field's analysis is that the public's attitude towards welfare is that you should get out what you put in. The trouble is that when Labour was in power it did the opposite. Gordon Brown used means-testing to spray £30bn on tax credits as a subsidy for poor families. The idea that one hardworking breadwinner would think it fair that his lower-paid neighbour received state cash for free to top up his pay packet, was, in Field's view, "why the policy failed" '' (Guardian 2013)
"I grew up in rationing. My mother ate bread and dripping (meat fat) for at least two meals a week so my brother and I could eat. (I like dripping)
Dripping, particularly from grilled pork chops, was my mother's favorite - quite heavily salted. Lemon rinds with salt was another of her favorites.
I still think of her each time I mop up the best bits of dripping from a roast chicken with a piece of bread."
I think dripping is a darn sight better for you that hydrogenated oils (transfats), which should have been banished by law 30 yrs ago. I'm no expert, but I wouldn't be surprised to hear that transfats have contributed to ill health and deaths to a degree rivalling the motor car.
must be the only fat then, plenty more needing banning methinks.
The latest dietary consensus is moving away from the food pyramid where fat=bad to a more nuanced understanding based on calorie balance. Healthy fats sate hunger for longer than other foods; high carb diets cause major problems with blood sugar and insulin resistance.
But by far the biggest problem in the US is the fall off in levels of physical activity.
Fat is the elixer of life. So much energy concentrated energy. If people were generally going hungry in this country, lard would be the solution. The reality is that it is the 'poorest' parts of our society who are the fattest, because we have essentially solved hunger, what we have now is ignorance. A total lack of understanding how to buy and use staple foods in a cost effective way.
Dont buy a portion of chips for you and the kids, buy a 25lb bag of potatoes for less than a £5 and feed them for two weeks.
On austerity and mobile phones - I suppose it depends. The vast majority of people in this country are unlikely to be affected by austerity, and it'll be those most dependent on state services - those who suffer from mental illness for example - who are affected by austerity. In particular, those who vote Conservative are highly unlikely to see any kind of austerity, because they're unlikely to know people going through severve hardship. Therefore it's easy to conclude, in a consumerism driven society, seeing everyone with all their gadgets out in public to conclude austerity doesn't exist. For some, it is a very real experience.
Why do you think that only people dependent on the state suffer from real hardship? There are an awful lot of people with cars jobs and mortgages that struggle to pay the bills and get through to the next pay day and for whom holidays and luxuries (booze, meals out etc.) are beyond reach.
BIB: I wouldn't say that qualifies as real hardship. It's not a big deal if you can't pay for holidays and luxuries. I'm thinking of people struggling to even pay for basic things like food, electricity etc.
Did you actually read my post: which part of, "Struggle to pay the bills and get through to the next pay day" do you think not qualifies as real hardship? Is it perhaps that people who struggle to pay for food and the basics from their earnings,as opposed to living on state support, are somehow not genuinely hard-up?
That is genuine hardship. But I've also seen on this site, opinions will suggest those in their positions should simply cut down on their out-goings e.g. the car.
Then maybe it would be a good idea to engage with what people say, rather than project onto them views which you think they might hold.
I guess it varies. I get the impression that some Conservatives do genuinely care, and want the best for all in society. Then I see other opinions online, where it come across that those who are D/E are written off, because they either vote Labour, or most likely are not engaged with politics at all - and that middle class, CD2Es, WVMs are all that matter.
I think regardless for you wishes to eliminate poverty and create good jobs for all, a dispassionate review of those on welfare will find, alongside all the deserving cases, a good smattering of people gaming the system. We should not ignore that either.
I don't deny there are those gaming the system. However, I do dislike - what especially seems to be a media campaign - to portray, and imply that nearly everyone on the dole is gaming the system and shaming those who happen to experience the misfortune of being unemployed.
It terms of affordability I think that food is as cheap as it has ever been in my lifetime. With some clever shopping (getting the bargains at Tescos etc) it is amazing how much food you can get for £10. You can buy a 2kg bag of pasta for less than a quid and a tin of tomatoes for 20pence. You couldn't do that 20 years ago even allowing for inflation. I could easily feed a family of 4 for a week for £10. Everyday tescos sell stuff that is going out of date for 10pence or less. I regularly go and see what bargains I can get.
The term poverty is definitely relative
LOL, you must be eating pig swill at those prices. Also eating sacks of pasta and such like is what makes the poor people fat. Crap diet by having to buy cheap muck. If you had said £10 a day I may have believed it.
Come to Tescos at Bursledon in Hampshire at 8 tonight. They have all sorts of bargains on all their produce from meat to vegetables to bread. You can fill your freezer up for less than a fiver. It just takes a little bit of clever shopping.
I just used the pasta as an example.
Currystar, good on you but no thanks, I am fortunate enough to never have to look at the price of food I just pick what I want. I was being witty in my riposte to you , or at least trying to be.
My long held suspicion that you don't have even one single drop of Scottish blood has been confirmed by that revelation of your shopping habits.
On austerity and mobile phones - I suppose it depends. The vast majority of people in this country are unlikely to be affected by austerity, and it'll be those most dependent on state services - those who suffer from mental illness for example - who are affected by austerity. In particular, those who vote Conservative are highly unlikely to see any kind of austerity, because they're unlikely to know people going through severve hardship. Therefore it's easy to conclude, in a consumerism driven society, seeing everyone with all their gadgets out in public to conclude austerity doesn't exist. For some, it is a very real experience.
Why do you think that only people dependent on the state suffer from real hardship? There are an awful lot of people with cars jobs and mortgages that struggle to pay the bills and get through to the next pay day and for whom holidays and luxuries (booze, meals out etc.) are beyond reach.
BIB: I wouldn't say that qualifies as real hardship. It's not a big deal if you can't pay for holidays and luxuries. I'm thinking of people struggling to even pay for basic things like food, electricity etc.
Did you actually read my post: which part of, "Struggle to pay the bills and get through to the next pay day" do you think not qualifies as real hardship? Is it perhaps that people who struggle to pay for food and the basics from their earnings,as opposed to living on state support, are somehow not genuinely hard-up?
That is genuine hardship. But I've also seen on this site, opinions will suggest those in their positions should simply cut down on their out-goings e.g. the car.
Then maybe it would be a good idea to engage with what people say, rather than project onto them views which you think they might hold.
I have engaged with what those people have said, specifically in one incident on the issue of welfare - and my judgement was pretty much the correct one.
I guess it varies. I get the impression that some Conservatives do genuinely care, and want the best for all in society. Then I see other opinions online, where it come across that those who are D/E are written off, because they either vote Labour, or most likely are not engaged with politics at all - and that middle class, CD2Es, WVMs are all that matter.
I'm sure there are both Conservatives who do care and Conservatives who don't.
The poor vote Conservative because they don't want to be poor and see the Conservatives as the party of aspiration. Simple message - work hard, we will let you keep more of your money and you can decide how to enrich yourself and your family (if you have one).
Interestingly, during the good times, the wealthy were less Conservative since they were secure in their wealth and wanted the State to spread it more to others hence you saw the dreadful 2001 result in the south for the Conservatives in affluent seats.
The onset of the global downturn led to insecurity among the wealthy and they rallied back to the Conservatives as the guarantors of wealth so the Tories are both the party for those who have wealth and those who want wealth (in very simple terms).
For those who see it in different terms e.g: I want my community and its services to be improved and I'm not bothered about my own circumstances, you have Labour and the LDs.
It terms of affordability I think that food is as cheap as it has ever been in my lifetime. With some clever shopping (getting the bargains at Tescos etc) it is amazing how much food you can get for £10. You can buy a 2kg bag of pasta for less than a quid and a tin of tomatoes for 20pence. You couldn't do that 20 years ago even allowing for inflation. I could easily feed a family of 4 for a week for £10. Everyday tescos sell stuff that is going out of date for 10pence or less. I regularly go and see what bargains I can get.
The term poverty is definitely relative
LOL, you must be eating pig swill at those prices. Also eating sacks of pasta and such like is what makes the poor people fat. Crap diet by having to buy cheap muck. If you had said £10 a day I may have believed it.
Come to Tescos at Bursledon in Hampshire at 8 tonight. They have all sorts of bargains on all their produce from meat to vegetables to bread. You can fill your freezer up for less than a fiver. It just takes a little bit of clever shopping.
I just used the pasta as an example.
Currystar, good on you but no thanks, I am fortunate enough to never have to look at the price of food I just pick what I want.
What a mug.
Bit of green cheese there Watford, not very edifying, you too could be like that if you worked as hard as me.
It terms of affordability I think that food is as cheap as it has ever been in my lifetime. With some clever shopping (getting the bargains at Tescos etc) it is amazing how much food you can get for £10. You can buy a 2kg bag of pasta for less than a quid and a tin of tomatoes for 20pence. You couldn't do that 20 years ago even allowing for inflation. I could easily feed a family of 4 for a week for £10. Everyday tescos sell stuff that is going out of date for 10pence or less. I regularly go and see what bargains I can get.
The term poverty is definitely relative
LOL, you must be eating pig swill at those prices. Also eating sacks of pasta and such like is what makes the poor people fat. Crap diet by having to buy cheap muck. If you had said £10 a day I may have believed it.
Come to Tescos at Bursledon in Hampshire at 8 tonight. They have all sorts of bargains on all their produce from meat to vegetables to bread. You can fill your freezer up for less than a fiver. It just takes a little bit of clever shopping.
I just used the pasta as an example.
Currystar, good on you but no thanks, I am fortunate enough to never have to look at the price of food I just pick what I want. I was being witty in my riposte to you , or at least trying to be.
My long held suspicion that you don't have even one single drop of Scottish blood has been confirmed by that revelation of your shopping habits.
On the ball as ever Monica, can always trust you to be miles out.
It terms of affordability I think that food is as cheap as it has ever been in my lifetime. With some clever shopping (getting the bargains at Tescos etc) it is amazing how much food you can get for £10. You can buy a 2kg bag of pasta for less than a quid and a tin of tomatoes for 20pence. You couldn't do that 20 years ago even allowing for inflation. I could easily feed a family of 4 for a week for £10. Everyday tescos sell stuff that is going out of date for 10pence or less. I regularly go and see what bargains I can get.
The term poverty is definitely relative
LOL, you must be eating pig swill at those prices. Also eating sacks of pasta and such like is what makes the poor people fat. Crap diet by having to buy cheap muck. If you had said £10 a day I may have believed it.
Come to Tescos at Bursledon in Hampshire at 8 tonight. They have all sorts of bargains on all their produce from meat to vegetables to bread. You can fill your freezer up for less than a fiver. It just takes a little bit of clever shopping. I just used the pasta as an example.
Currystar, good on you but no thanks, I am fortunate enough to never have to look at the price of food I just pick what I want.
Coming belatedly to the PMQ party I'm sure people enjoyed, having just seen it, it felt a little gimicky from Corbyn, but not overly so, it worked well enough for what it was. Not sure about the long term, but not an approach with no positives.
@taffys As someone who has had her fair share of issues and had counselling on the NHS, my experience has been a positive one with them. But in regards to mental illness a series of governments and the NHS have still yet to get it right.
That's in part because it's hidden, it's not fashionable (like some other illnesses), the children are teenagers and not cutely sympathetic, the people suffering from it can be scary, people often feel ashamed to admit to it and there can be a tendency for others to dismiss it or assume that people just need to "buck up".
In the past people were often hidden away and when the care in the community policy was adopted, it was starved of resources and mental illness was linked with schizophrenics committing crimes (like the Zito murder). Not many votes in channelling NHS money in that direction when there were so many other more popular causes.
So the current change of mood and action is much to be welcomed.
It terms of affordability I think that food is as cheap as it has ever been in my lifetime. With some clever shopping (getting the bargains at Tescos etc) it is amazing how much food you can get for £10. You can buy a 2kg bag of pasta for less than a quid and a tin of tomatoes for 20pence. You couldn't do that 20 years ago even allowing for inflation. I could easily feed a family of 4 for a week for £10. Everyday tescos sell stuff that is going out of date for 10pence or less. I regularly go and see what bargains I can get.
The term poverty is definitely relative
LOL, you must be eating pig swill at those prices. Also eating sacks of pasta and such like is what makes the poor people fat. Crap diet by having to buy cheap muck. If you had said £10 a day I may have believed it.
Come to Tescos at Bursledon in Hampshire at 8 tonight. They have all sorts of bargains on all their produce from meat to vegetables to bread. You can fill your freezer up for less than a fiver. It just takes a little bit of clever shopping. I just used the pasta as an example.
Currystar, good on you but no thanks, I am fortunate enough to never have to look at the price of food I just pick what I want.
What a mug.
You are certainly right there.
the cockroaches have been summonsed. Losers flooding from under their rocks.
It terms of affordability I think that food is as cheap as it has ever been in my lifetime. With some clever shopping (getting the bargains at Tescos etc) it is amazing how much food you can get for £10. You can buy a 2kg bag of pasta for less than a quid and a tin of tomatoes for 20pence. You couldn't do that 20 years ago even allowing for inflation. I could easily feed a family of 4 for a week for £10. Everyday tescos sell stuff that is going out of date for 10pence or less. I regularly go and see what bargains I can get. The term poverty is definitely relative
Quite, and there are also now large numbers of people employed by the 'poverty industry', who fear for their jobs and are prone to increasingly hyperbolic language to defend themselves. See Labour today tying themselves in knots about people being able to claim 23 grand a year in welfare for a good example. There is almost no poverty in the UK, if you define poverty as being able to feed and clothe yourself and your family, rather than being stuck with an iPhone 5 when everyone else has a shiny new iPhone 6.
On another topic, it looks like Cameron is being vindicated as the 'refugee' crisis steps up a notch or two this evening. Surely Merkel's political head could be called for if the situation continues to escalate?
There is definitely a poverty industry. Homelessness in my town has never been lower, its about 70% of what it was six years ago, in fact in an entire 12 month period 65 people were accepted. Thats out of a population of about 115,000, which in itself has grown 10% in the last decade.
But you wouldnt have thought so. We now have about 1/2 a dozen organisations providing 'homelessness' services, at least three of them are directly commissioned services from local government and national government. I worked out that, if you included all the charities and public bodies the staff involved in homelessness is actually greater than the number of homeless people.
"I grew up in rationing. My mother ate bread and dripping (meat fat) for at least two meals a week so my brother and I could eat. (I like dripping)
Dripping, particularly from grilled pork chops, was my mother's favorite - quite heavily salted. Lemon rinds with salt was another of her favorites.
I still think of her each time I mop up the best bits of dripping from a roast chicken with a piece of bread."
I think dripping is a darn sight better for you that hydrogenated oils (transfats), which should have been banished by law 30 yrs ago. I'm no expert, but I wouldn't be surprised to hear that transfats have contributed to ill health and deaths to a degree rivalling the motor car.
must be the only fat then, plenty more needing banning methinks.
The latest dietary consensus is moving away from the food pyramid where fat=bad to a more nuanced understanding based on calorie balance. Healthy fats sate hunger for longer than other foods; high carb diets cause major problems with blood sugar and insulin resistance.
But by far the biggest problem in the US is the fall off in levels of physical activity.
Fat is the elixer of life. So much energy concentrated energy. If people were generally going hungry in this country, lard would be the solution. The reality is that it is the 'poorest' parts of our society who are the fattest, because we have essentially solved hunger, what we have now is ignorance. A total lack of understanding how to buy and use staple foods in a cost effective way.
Dont buy a portion of chips for you and the kids, buy a 25lb bag of potatoes for less than a £5 and feed them for two weeks.
A great source of potassium, manganese, iron and copper, not to mention fibre and Vitamins B6 and C.
The first in particularly important now that the wisdom is that it is not sodium levels that are bad, but more the when the sodium potassium balance is too out of whack.
@taffys As someone who has had her fair share of issues and had counselling on the NHS, my experience has been a positive one with them. But in regards to mental illness a series of governments and the NHS have still yet to get it right.
"I grew up in rationing. My mother ate bread and dripping (meat fat) for at least two meals a week so my brother and I could eat. (I like dripping)
Dripping, particularly from grilled pork chops, was my mother's favorite - quite heavily salted. Lemon rinds with salt was another of her favorites.
I still think of her each time I mop up the best bits of dripping from a roast chicken with a piece of bread."
I think dripping is a darn sight better for you that hydrogenated oils (transfats), which should have been banished by law 30 yrs ago. I'm no expert, but I wouldn't be surprised to hear that transfats have contributed to ill health and deaths to a degree rivalling the motor car.
must be the only fat then, plenty more needing banning methinks.
The latest dietary consensus is moving away from the food pyramid where fat=bad to a more nuanced understanding based on calorie balance. Healthy fats sate hunger for longer than other foods; high carb diets cause major problems with blood sugar and insulin resistance.
But by far the biggest problem in the US is the fall off in levels of physical activity.
This is true. The calorie count in the average diet is surprisingly similar to 50 years ago, the reason for obesity is predominantly inactivity. Get enough exercise and you will be thin whatever you eat.
I guess it varies. I get the impression that some Conservatives do genuinely care, and want the best for all in society. Then I see other opinions online, where it come across that those who are D/E are written off, because they either vote Labour, or most likely are not engaged with politics at all - and that middle class, CD2Es, WVMs are all that matter.
I think regardless for you wishes to eliminate poverty and create good jobs for all, a dispassionate review of those on welfare will find, alongside all the deserving cases, a good smattering of people gaming the system. We should not ignore that either.
I don't deny there are those gaming the system. However, I do dislike - what especially seems to be a media campaign - to portray, and imply that nearly everyone on the dole is gaming the system and shaming those who happen to experience the misfortune of being unemployed.
@taffys As someone who has had her fair share of issues and had counselling on the NHS, my experience has been a positive one with them. But in regards to mental illness a series of governments and the NHS have still yet to get it right.
That's in part because it's hidden, it's not fashionable (like some other illnesses), the children are teenagers and not cutely sympathetic, the people suffering from it can be scary, people often feel ashamed to admit to it and there can be a tendency for others to dismiss it or assume that people just need to "buck up".
In the past people were often hidden away and when the care in the community policy was adopted, it was starved of resources and mental illness was linked with schizophrenics committing crimes (like the Zito murder). Not many votes in channelling NHS money in that direction when there were so many other more popular causes.
So the current change of mood and action is much to be welcomed.
There is an absolute belief in CBT as the best therapy for a whole range of mental health conditions - and that is utterly skewing the system by limiting options for those for whom CBT really doesn't work.
Add into this the rise of the very questionable Mindfulness and you have a mental health system that is very much not fit for purpose.
Particularly when you have GPs who refuse to prescribe certain drugs because they are too expensive (even though you have been told by a consultant that they are what you need)
The whole thing is broken. Very broken.
(And yes, I do have very personal experience of this)
From the Speccy Nick Cohen piece - this is rather good.
Lansbury had been greeted with a rendition of For He’s a Jolly Good Fellow – for the Labour party has always been more sentimental than a Hallmark card-makers convention. He was committed to peace with Germany, he cried. ‘I am ready to stand as the early Christians die and say, this is our faith, and if necessary, this is where we will die.’
The conference loved it. But Bevin had had enough. He took to the stage and boomed:
People have been on this platform talking about the destruction of capitalism. The middle classes are not doing too badly under capitalism and fascism. The only thing that is being wiped out is the trade union movement. It is we who are being wiped out and will be wiped out if fascism comes here.
He turned to Lansbury and accused him of dithering in the face of tyranny: ‘hawking your conscience around from body to body asking to be told what to do with it.’
The conference erupted. Poor old Virginia Woolf burst into tears. But Lansbury was finished. Bevin was upholding a principle too many on the left have forgotten: your comrades should be the victims of fascism in the 1930s and the victims of the reactionary and the far right today. You do not, in other words, appear on Iranian TV, as Corbyn does, without speaking out in defence of the women gays, and ethnic and religious minorities the theocracy
It terms of affordability I think that food is as cheap as it has ever been in my lifetime. With some clever shopping (getting the bargains at Tescos etc) it is amazing how much food you can get for £10. You can buy a 2kg bag of pasta for less than a quid and a tin of tomatoes for 20pence. You couldn't do that 20 years ago even allowing for inflation. I could easily feed a family of 4 for a week for £10. Everyday tescos sell stuff that is going out of date for 10pence or less. I regularly go and see what bargains I can get.
The term poverty is definitely relative
LOL, you must be eating pig swill at those prices. Also eating sacks of pasta and such like is what makes the poor people fat. Crap diet by having to buy cheap muck. If you had said £10 a day I may have believed it.
Come to Tescos at Bursledon in Hampshire at 8 tonight. They have all sorts of bargains on all their produce from meat to vegetables to bread. You can fill your freezer up for less than a fiver. It just takes a little bit of clever shopping.
I just used the pasta as an example.
Currystar, good on you but no thanks, I am fortunate enough to never have to look at the price of food I just pick what I want.
What a mug.
Bit of green cheese there Watford, not very edifying, you too could be like that if you worked as hard as me.
@taffys As someone who has had her fair share of issues and had counselling on the NHS, my experience has been a positive one with them. But in regards to mental illness a series of governments and the NHS have still yet to get it right.
That's in part because it's hidden, it's not fashionable (like some other illnesses), the children are teenagers and not cutely sympathetic, the people suffering from it can be scary, people often feel ashamed to admit to it and there can be a tendency for others to dismiss it or assume that people just need to "buck up".
In the past people were often hidden away and when the care in the community policy was adopted, it was starved of resources and mental illness was linked with schizophrenics committing crimes (like the Zito murder). Not many votes in channelling NHS money in that direction when there were so many other more popular causes.
So the current change of mood and action is much to be welcomed.
I confess, as someone who has no mental illnesses (yet), i do find it hard to empathise, i am shocked at what seem to be perpetual neurosis by pretty much all my female friends and female family members though (it has been pointed out, when i pointed this out, that is was the common denominator. What does that say?). My grandma was confined to a mental institution for as long as I remember. She would come home for periods, and go back. My grandfather also, ended up there for a period of time, like many other people of his generation who experienced the most soul destroying of horrors in Burma during the war.
What I found shocking was a recent report compiled by and on behalf of a local very popular youth service that has a city wide reach. It said that on asking young people what was their biggest concern, they responded 'mental health'.
"I grew up in rationing. My mother ate bread and dripping (meat fat) for at least two meals a week so my brother and I could eat. (I like dripping)
Dripping, particularly from grilled pork chops, was my mother's favorite - quite heavily salted. Lemon rinds with salt was another of her favorites.
I still think of her each time I mop up the best bits of dripping from a roast chicken with a piece of bread."
I think dripping is a darn sight better for you that hydrogenated oils (transfats), which should have been banished by law 30 yrs ago. I'm no expert, but I wouldn't be surprised to hear that transfats have contributed to ill health and deaths to a degree rivalling the motor car.
must be the only fat then, plenty more needing banning methinks.
The latest dietary consensus is moving away from the food pyramid where fat=bad to a more nuanced understanding based on calorie balance. Healthy fats sate hunger for longer than other foods; high carb diets cause major problems with blood sugar and insulin resistance.
But by far the biggest problem in the US is the fall off in levels of physical activity.
Agree, but the bad part is all the processed muck that people eat and the extras that are shovelled into it by manufacturer's. If you buy fresh produce and cook it yourself then you know what you are getting. Easy to say given I never cook anything but I very seldom have processed food almost always fresh cooked.
Ha! We agree on something! In addition to cooking nearly all our meals from basic ingredients and making our own yogurt and pasta, I also try to grow as much of my own food as possible. Tastes so much better than the supermarket, harvested-before-ripe versions.
We are also privileged enough to get all our meat direct from local farms.
How you make it affordable for the masses, though, is a tough one. My average meal cooked from basic, locally-sourced ingredients (without even going 'organic') probably costs twice or thrice the amount per head as would a meal at McD or KFC.
@oxfordsimon I'd agree with you on that. I started counselling on the NHS when I was 10 (and it came to a natural end when I was 17), and they really do sell CBT as something which will be like a magic wand and solve all of your problems. Thankfully, things still worked out for me.
@Cyclefree I find it very sad that our society finds it difficult to sympathise with teenagers, and people who do sometimes come across as a bit scary. It does appear though, that society today in general, is far more sympathetic to the issue of mental illness than previously. I wonder what triggered that?
It terms of affordability I think that food is as cheap as it has ever been in my lifetime. With some clever shopping (getting the bargains at Tescos etc) it is amazing how much food you can get for £10. You can buy a 2kg bag of pasta for less than a quid and a tin of tomatoes for 20pence. You couldn't do that 20 years ago even allowing for inflation. I could easily feed a family of 4 for a week for £10. Everyday tescos sell stuff that is going out of date for 10pence or less. I regularly go and see what bargains I can get.
The term poverty is definitely relative
LOL, you must be eating pig swill at those prices. Also eating sacks of pasta and such like is what makes the poor people fat. Crap diet by having to buy cheap muck. If you had said £10 a day I may have believed it.
Come to Tescos at Bursledon in Hampshire at 8 tonight. They have all sorts of bargains on all their produce from meat to vegetables to bread. You can fill your freezer up for less than a fiver. It just takes a little bit of clever shopping.
I just used the pasta as an example.
Currystar, good on you but no thanks, I am fortunate enough to never have to look at the price of food I just pick what I want.
What a mug.
Bit of green cheese there Watford, not very edifying, you too could be like that if you worked as hard as me.
'green cheese'?
ENVY , jealousy you thick halfwitted turnip. Get an education.
On austerity and mobile phones - I suppose it depends. The vast majority of people in this country are unlikely to be affected by austerity, and it'll be those most dependent on state services - those who suffer from mental illness for example - who are affected by austerity. In particular, those who vote Conservative are highly unlikely to see any kind of austerity, because they're unlikely to know people going through severve hardship. Therefore it's easy to conclude, in a consumerism driven society, seeing everyone with all their gadgets out in public to conclude austerity doesn't exist. For some, it is a very real experience.
"it'll be those most dependent on state services - those who suffer from mental illness for example - who are affected by austerity."
That's a rather one-dimensional and crass depiction of mental illness.
I don't quite get how my statement is one-dimensional or crass. Explain?
Is everyone with mental illness dependent on state services, or indeed affected by austerity? No. In fact, I'd argue that the majority of mental illness never get touched by state services, because they remain hidden.
People suffering from mental illness - even at an extreme level - can remain functioning in society so friends, family and colleagues do not know they are suffering. And when state services do get involved, even with the best of intentions and financing, they can make the situation for an individual worse.
Regular readers for more than a couple of years standing may be able to guess why this sort of thing annoys me so much.
It annoys me too - and for much the same reasons. My close family is touched by it and until you experience it you can have no idea at the effect it can and does have. The Lib Dems deserve every kudos going for their work on it, I hope the Tories stick with it and I am prepared to praise Corbyn if he really means what he says on this topic. This issue goes beyond party politics.
NHS spending 2009 - £109bn NHS spending 2016 - £138bn We can talk about the issue if mental health all we want, but there is no reason this should be political or somehow related to the bogus and politicised issue of so called 'austerity'.
@taffys As someone who has had her fair share of issues and had counselling on the NHS, my experience has been a positive one with them. But in regards to mental illness a series of governments and the NHS have still yet to get it right.
That's in part because it's hidden, it's not fashionable (like some other illnesses), the children are teenagers and not cutely sympathetic, the people suffering from it can be scary, people often feel ashamed to admit to it and there can be a tendency for others to dismiss it or assume that people just need to "buck up".
In the past people were often hidden away and when the care in the community policy was adopted, it was starved of resources and mental illness was linked with schizophrenics committing crimes (like the Zito murder). Not many votes in channelling NHS money in that direction when there were so many other more popular causes.
So the current change of mood and action is much to be welcomed.
We have a schizophrenic daughter. She was diagnosed about 17 years ago...She is classified as unemployable so on benefits. She lives at home. If she did not, she would be dead by now. The NHS care systems are grossly under-resourched and over-stretched..
I pity others in similar positions without family support.
Mr. Notme, there's a drive to pathologise every quirk. And people are more emotive/willing to admit problems (or suffer hypochondria) than in the past, due to a greater willingness to talk and the stiff upper lip falling out of fashion.
I do think that, generally, it's good to talk but don't discount the stiff upper lip entirely.
A study found that of women (taking part) suffering PMS, diaries revealed that over 90% actually weren't. Of course, being a man and raising this can provoke some ire, but there we are. [I would've used a different example, but it's a while since I was at university and that one stuck in my mind].
Self-reporting is notoriously unreliable for self-diagnosis [it's when your mum ticks all but 2 symptoms of psychopathology on your behalf that you need to worry ].
It terms of affordability I think that food is as cheap as it has ever been in my lifetime. With some clever shopping (getting the bargains at Tescos etc) it is amazing how much food you can get for £10. You can buy a 2kg bag of pasta for less than a quid and a tin of tomatoes for 20pence. You couldn't do that 20 years ago even allowing for inflation. I could easily feed a family of 4 for a week for £10. Everyday tescos sell stuff that is going out of date for 10pence or less. I regularly go and see what bargains I can get.
The term poverty is definitely relative
LOL, you must be eating pig swill at those prices. Also eating sacks of pasta and such like is what makes the poor people fat. Crap diet by having to buy cheap muck. If you had said £10 a day I may have believed it.
Come to Tescos at Bursledon in Hampshire at 8 tonight. They have all sorts of bargains on all their produce from meat to vegetables to bread. You can fill your freezer up for less than a fiver. It just takes a little bit of clever shopping.
I just used the pasta as an example.
Currystar, good on you but no thanks, I am fortunate enough to never have to look at the price of food I just pick what I want.
What a mug.
Bit of green cheese there Watford, not very edifying, you too could be like that if you worked as hard as me.
'green cheese'?
ENVY , jealousy you thick halfwitted turnip. Get an education.
@taffys As someone who has had her fair share of issues and had counselling on the NHS, my experience has been a positive one with them. But in regards to mental illness a series of governments and the NHS have still yet to get it right.
That's in part because it's hidden, it's not fashionable (like some other illnesses), the children are teenagers and not cutely sympathetic, the people suffering from it can be scary, people often feel ashamed to admit to it and there can be a tendency for others to dismiss it or assume that people just need to "buck up".
In the past people were often hidden away and when the care in the community policy was adopted, it was starved of resources and mental illness was linked with schizophrenics committing crimes (like the Zito murder). Not many votes in channelling NHS money in that direction when there were so many other more popular causes.
So the current change of mood and action is much to be welcomed.
There is an absolute belief in CBT as the best therapy for a whole range of mental health conditions - and that is utterly skewing the system by limiting options for those for whom CBT really doesn't work.
Add into this the rise of the very questionable Mindfulness and you have a mental health system that is very much not fit for purpose.
Particularly when you have GPs who refuse to prescribe certain drugs because they are too expensive (even though you have been told by a consultant that they are what you need)
The whole thing is broken. Very broken.
(And yes, I do have very personal experience of this)
I'm glad that you've raised the issue of the questionable Mindfulness. That seems to me to be a fad. CBT has its place but only for certain conditions and drugs can really help. I am lucky in that our GP is very good on this and very alive to the problems that such illnesses can create for carers. But it is a lottery and if you can't pay for help and the NHS services where you live are rubbish, you're in real trouble.
Coming belatedly to the PMQ party I'm sure people enjoyed, having just seen it, it felt a little gimicky from Corbyn, but not overly so, it worked well enough for what it was. Not sure about the long term, but not an approach with no positives.
Just boring and really it lets David Cameron showcase his policies without counter
I guess it varies. I get the impression that some Conservatives do genuinely care, and want the best for all in society. Then I see other opinions online, where it come across that those who are D/E are written off, because they either vote Labour, or most likely are not engaged with politics at all - and that middle class, CD2Es, WVMs are all that matter.
I think regardless for you wishes to eliminate poverty and create good jobs for all, a dispassionate review of those on welfare will find, alongside all the deserving cases, a good smattering of people gaming the system. We should not ignore that either.
I don't deny there are those gaming the system. However, I do dislike - what especially seems to be a media campaign - to portray, and imply that nearly everyone on the dole is gaming the system and shaming those who happen to experience the misfortune of being unemployed.
The responsibility to those who are pro-welfare, then, is surely to demonstrate to those making that point that such anomalies are exceptional, rather than systemic. And to do something about it. Incidentally, statistics are not going to be work in proving this. Impressions are not broke by statistics.
Incidentally, I wonder if the majority of people have a bigger problem with the fact that it is possible to 'earn' more (i.e. The full benefits cap) on benefits than some working families cope on, remembering that the benefits cap is nett whilst take home pay is not. This strikes many as unfair - not least because those families may be paying taxes to subsidise those who appear better off doing little or nothing. The tax credit bill is similar - why should those working 40 hours subside those working 16.
Thankfully, welfare reforms will probably soon make the above point moot. Good job, GO.
From the Speccy Nick Cohen piece - this is rather good.
Lansbury had been greeted with a rendition of For He’s a Jolly Good Fellow – for the Labour party has always been more sentimental than a Hallmark card-makers convention. He was committed to peace with Germany, he cried. ‘I am ready to stand as the early Christians die and say, this is our faith, and if necessary, this is where we will die.’
The conference loved it. But Bevin had had enough. He took to the stage and boomed:
People have been on this platform talking about the destruction of capitalism. The middle classes are not doing too badly under capitalism and fascism. The only thing that is being wiped out is the trade union movement. It is we who are being wiped out and will be wiped out if fascism comes here.
He turned to Lansbury and accused him of dithering in the face of tyranny: ‘hawking your conscience around from body to body asking to be told what to do with it.’
The conference erupted. Poor old Virginia Woolf burst into tears. But Lansbury was finished. Bevin was upholding a principle too many on the left have forgotten: your comrades should be the victims of fascism in the 1930s and the victims of the reactionary and the far right today. You do not, in other words, appear on Iranian TV, as Corbyn does, without speaking out in defence of the women gays, and ethnic and religious minorities the theocracy
The owner of the Jacobinism Blog wrote this in 2013 saying much the same thing:-
"The laissez-faire approach to liberty in these circumstances is an act, not of principle, but of moral cowardice. Like the pacifist whose only concern is keeping his own hands free of blood, the liberal only concerned with his own reputation for tolerance ends up complicit in the crimes he ignores."
"I grew up in rationing. My mother ate bread and dripping (meat fat) for at least two meals a week so my brother and I could eat. (I like dripping)
Dripping, particularly from grilled pork chops, was my mother's favorite - quite heavily salted. Lemon rinds with salt was another of her favorites.
I still think of her each time I mop up the best bits of dripping from a roast chicken with a piece of bread."
I think dripping is a darn sight better for you that hydrogenated oils (transfats), which should have been banished by law 30 yrs ago. I'm no expert, but I wouldn't be surprised to hear that transfats have contributed to ill health and deaths to a degree rivalling the motor car.
must be the only fat then, plenty more needing banning methinks.
The latest dietary consensus is moving away from the food pyramid where fat=bad to a more nuanced understanding based on calorie balance. Healthy fats sate hunger for longer than other foods; high carb diets cause major problems with blood sugar and insulin resistance.
But by far the biggest problem in the US is the fall off in levels of physical activity.
Agree, but the bad part is all the processed muck that people eat and the extras that are shovelled into it by manufacturer's. If you buy fresh produce and cook it yourself then you know what you are getting. Easy to say given I never cook anything but I very seldom have processed food almost always fresh cooked.
Ha! We agree on something! In addition to cooking nearly all our meals from basic ingredients and making our own yogurt and pasta, I also try to grow as much of my own food as possible. Tastes so much better than the supermarket, harvested-before-ripe versions.
We are also privileged enough to get all our meat direct from local farms.
How you make it affordable for the masses, though, is a tough one. My average meal cooked from basic, locally-sourced ingredients (without even going 'organic') probably costs twice or thrice the amount per head as would a meal at McD or KFC.
Yes I am the same , we use best produce possible , organics if possible on vegetables and fruit and especially chicken. Good meat that is hung 28 days etc and as you say it is expensive , however if you are buying chickens , meat etc for pennies you just know they are crap. My wife does all cooking I just enjoy it.
I'm glad that you've raised the issue of the questionable Mindfulness. That seems to me to be a fad. CBT has its place but only for certain conditions and drugs can really help. I am lucky in that our GP is very good on this and very alive to the problems that such illnesses can create for carers. But it is a lottery and if you can't pay for help and the NHS services where you live are rubbish, you're in real trouble.
Oxford is very much a centre for Mindfulness - and I find it all rather sinister.
You are lucky having a good GP. I have given up on mine. And the NHS in general. I don't have any resources and so have spent a number of years with next to no support at all.
It is very dispiriting to feel that you have nowhere to turn.
@taffys As someone who has had her fair share of issues and had counselling on the NHS, my experience has been a positive one with them. But in regards to mental illness a series of governments and the NHS have still yet to get it right.
That's in part because it's hidden, it's not fashionable (like some other illnesses), the children are teenagers and not cutely sympathetic, the people suffering from it can be scary, people often feel ashamed to admit to it and there can be a tendency for others to dismiss it or assume that people just need to "buck up".
In the past people were often hidden away and when the care in the community policy was adopted, it was starved of resources and mental illness was linked with schizophrenics committing crimes (like the Zito murder). Not many votes in channelling NHS money in that direction when there were so many other more popular causes.
So the current change of mood and action is much to be welcomed.
We have a schizophrenic daughter. She was diagnosed about 17 years ago...She is classified as unemployable so on benefits. She lives at home. If she did not, she would be dead by now. The NHS care systems are grossly under-resourched and over-stretched..
I pity others in similar positions without family support.
It does sound as if she is very fortunate to have you as parents.
It terms of affordability I think that food is as cheap as it has ever been in my lifetime. With some clever shopping (getting the bargains at Tescos etc) it is amazing how much food you can get for £10. You can buy a 2kg bag of pasta for less than a quid and a tin of tomatoes for 20pence. You couldn't do that 20 years ago even allowing for inflation. I could easily feed a family of 4 for a week for £10. Everyday tescos sell stuff that is going out of date for 10pence or less. I regularly go and see what bargains I can get.
The term poverty is definitely relative
LOL, you must be eating pig swill at those prices. Also eating sacks of pasta and such like is what makes the poor people fat. Crap diet by having to buy cheap muck. If you had said £10 a day I may have believed it.
Come to Tescos at Bursledon in Hampshire at 8 tonight. They have all sorts of bargains on all their produce from meat to vegetables to bread. You can fill your freezer up for less than a fiver. It just takes a little bit of clever shopping.
I just used the pasta as an example.
Currystar, good on you but no thanks, I am fortunate enough to never have to look at the price of food I just pick what I want.
What a mug.
Bit of green cheese there Watford, not very edifying, you too could be like that if you worked as hard as me.
'green cheese'?
ENVY , jealousy you thick halfwitted turnip. Get an education.
Which is it envy or jealousy ?
Both and probably lashings of other things as well.
Mr. Notme, there's a drive to pathologise every quirk. And people are more emotive/willing to admit problems (or suffer hypochondria) than in the past, due to a greater willingness to talk and the stiff upper lip falling out of fashion.
I do think that, generally, it's good to talk but don't discount the stiff upper lip entirely.
A study found that of women (taking part) suffering PMS, diaries revealed that over 90% actually weren't. Of course, being a man and raising this can provoke some ire, but there we are. [I would've used a different example, but it's a while since I was at university and that one stuck in my mind].
Self-reporting is notoriously unreliable for self-diagnosis [it's when your mum ticks all but 2 symptoms of psychopathology on your behalf that you need to worry ].
I favour talking about issues (a nephew committed suicide in June, and his father had no idea he was having problems, so this is a raw issue at the moment for the family). However, talking should be for a purpose, particularly to reconcile oneself to the harsh reality and prepare oneself to move on in good shape. However, all too often, therapy devolves into an exercise in wallowing in self-pity, which I suspect some therapists encourage as it ensures a good income stream.
@taffys As someone who has had her fair share of issues and had counselling on the NHS, my experience has been a positive one with them. But in regards to mental illness a series of governments and the NHS have still yet to get it right.
That's in part because it's hidden, it's not fashionable (like some other illnesses), the children are teenagers and not cutely sympathetic, the people suffering from it can be scary, people often feel ashamed to admit to it and there can be a tendency for others to dismiss it or assume that people just need to "buck up".
In the past people were often hidden away and when the care in the community policy was adopted, it was starved of resources and mental illness was linked with schizophrenics committing crimes (like the Zito murder). Not many votes in channelling NHS money in that direction when there were so many other more popular causes.
So the current change of mood and action is much to be welcomed.
We have a schizophrenic daughter. She was diagnosed about 17 years ago...She is classified as unemployable so on benefits. She lives at home. If she did not, she would be dead by now. The NHS care systems are grossly under-resourched and over-stretched..
I pity others in similar positions without family support.
Not pleasant at all, I have a nephew with it and as you say treatment is very patchy to say the least.
@taffys As someone who has had her fair share of issues and had counselling on the NHS, my experience has been a positive one with them. But in regards to mental illness a series of governments and the NHS have still yet to get it right.
That's in part because it's hidden, it's not fashionable (like some other illnesses), the children are teenagers and not cutely sympathetic, the people suffering from it can be scary, people often feel ashamed to admit to it and there can be a tendency for others to dismiss it or assume that people just need to "buck up".
In the past people were often hidden away and when the care in the community policy was adopted, it was starved of resources and mental illness was linked with schizophrenics committing crimes (like the Zito murder). Not many votes in channelling NHS money in that direction when there were so many other more popular causes.
So the current change of mood and action is much to be welcomed.
We have a schizophrenic daughter. She was diagnosed about 17 years ago...She is classified as unemployable so on benefits. She lives at home. If she did not, she would be dead by now. The NHS care systems are grossly under-resourched and over-stretched..
I pity others in similar positions without family support.
I have a relative who has bi-polar disorder. I've found the NHS mental health service to be appalling. The police (who we've had to call out on occasions) are actually far more professional in their approach than the NHS staff.
@taffys As someone who has had her fair share of issues and had counselling on the NHS, my experience has been a positive one with them. But in regards to mental illness a series of governments and the NHS have still yet to get it right.
That's in part because it's hidden, it's not fashionable (like some other illnesses), the children are teenagers and not cutely sympathetic, the people suffering from it can be scary, people often feel ashamed to admit to it and there can be a tendency for others to dismiss it or assume that people just need to "buck up".
In the past people were often hidden away and when the care in the community policy was adopted, it was starved of resources and mental illness was linked with schizophrenics committing crimes (like the Zito murder). Not many votes in channelling NHS money in that direction when there were so many other more popular causes.
So the current change of mood and action is much to be welcomed.
I confess, as someone who has no mental illnesses (yet), i do find it hard to empathise, i am shocked at what seem to be perpetual neurosis by pretty much all my female friends and female family members though (it has been pointed out, when i pointed this out, that is was the common denominator. What does that say?). My grandma was confined to a mental institution for as long as I remember. She would come home for periods, and go back. My grandfather also, ended up there for a period of time, like many other people of his generation who experienced the most soul destroying of horrors in Burma during the war.
What I found shocking was a recent report compiled by and on behalf of a local very popular youth service that has a city wide reach. It said that on asking young people what was their biggest concern, they responded 'mental health'.
Mr Notme: it is hard to empathise until you experience it. But when you see someone you love suffering so much that they are harming themselves and/or others and/or suicidal you realise that this is as much an illness as someone with TB or a broken leg and needing proper diagnosis and treatment.
Mr. Notme, there's a drive to pathologise every quirk. And people are more emotive/willing to admit problems (or suffer hypochondria) than in the past, due to a greater willingness to talk and the stiff upper lip falling out of fashion.
I do think that, generally, it's good to talk but don't discount the stiff upper lip entirely.
A study found that of women (taking part) suffering PMS, diaries revealed that over 90% actually weren't. Of course, being a man and raising this can provoke some ire, but there we are. [I would've used a different example, but it's a while since I was at university and that one stuck in my mind].
Self-reporting is notoriously unreliable for self-diagnosis [it's when your mum ticks all but 2 symptoms of psychopathology on your behalf that you need to worry ].
I favour talking about issues (a nephew committed suicide in June, and his father had no idea he was having problems, so this is a raw issue at the moment for the family). However, talking should be for a purpose, particularly to reconcile oneself to the harsh reality and prepare oneself to move on in good shape. However, all too often, therapy devolves into an exercise in wallowing in self-pity, which I suspect some therapists encourage as it ensures a good income stream.
Commiserations MT, must be devastating for a family.
@Mortimer I don't really see why there is a responsibility for those that are pro-welfare to prove that everyone is not gaming the situation. The anti-welfare side has hardly proved that everyone on welfare is gaming the situation after all - rather there argument appears to be supported by a series of anecdotal cases. As for welfare, YouGov surprisingly found the public to be split on the issue of 12bn welfare cuts: https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/06/27/public-split-camerons-welfare-cuts/ And found a slight majority for protecting tax credits for the low paid.
@oxfordsimon I'd agree with you on that. I started counselling on the NHS when I was 10 (and it came to a natural end when I was 17), and they really do sell CBT as something which will be like a magic wand and solve all of your problems. Thankfully, things still worked out for me.
@Cyclefree I find it very sad that our society finds it difficult to sympathise with teenagers, and people who do sometimes come across as a bit scary. It does appear though, that society today in general, is far more sympathetic to the issue of mental illness than previously. I wonder what triggered that?
In properly conducted trials CBT beats most other psychotherapy hands down. It is not so popular with patients as other talking therapies though. In part it is because it seems so mechanical and people generally do like rooting around in their past for the reasons that they have become unwell. Indeed there have been studies thay have shown psychoanalysis to be completely ineffective.
I have some (professional) experience of both in my early career. Psychiatry done well is expensive and time consuming. A further problem is recruitment. British doctors rarely go into the speciality and 93% of those taking postgraduate exams in Psychiatry trained overseas. This does not matter too much in some specialities (a broken femur is the same the world over) but psychiatric disease is heavily rooted in the social and cultural millieu so harder for foreign doctors to do well.
Theodore Dalrymple's essays on life as a psychiatrist in Birmingham are quite eye opening!
I guess it varies. I get the impression that some Conservatives do genuinely care, and want the best for all in society. Then I see other opinions online, where it come across that those who are D/E are written off, because they either vote Labour, or most likely are not engaged with politics at all - and that middle class, CD2Es, WVMs are all that matter.
I think regardless for you wishes to eliminate poverty and create good jobs for all, a dispassionate review of those on welfare will find, alongside all the deserving cases, a good smattering of people gaming the system. We should not ignore that either.
I don't deny there are those gaming the system. However, I do dislike - what especially seems to be a media campaign - to portray, and imply that nearly everyone on the dole is gaming the system and shaming those who happen to experience the misfortune of being unemployed.
It's the lack of empathy that gets me. It's as if there are some on the right who simply can't comprehend what it would be like to be in someone elses shoes - *why can't they just get a job, they must be lazy*
Scratch under the surface of the long-term unemployed and there are a myriad of issues - sexuality, relationships, self-esteem, brain injuries, mental health - and all the things that we now diagnose in children (aspergers, autism etc) - stuff that's there, but not seen. not acknowledged, not labelled.
They can't cope with the job in the amazon warehouse? pft, they must be lazy.
Mr. Notme, there's a drive to pathologise every quirk. And people are more emotive/willing to admit problems (or suffer hypochondria) than in the past, due to a greater willingness to talk and the stiff upper lip falling out of fashion.
I do think that, generally, it's good to talk but don't discount the stiff upper lip entirely.
A study found that of women (taking part) suffering PMS, diaries revealed that over 90% actually weren't. Of course, being a man and raising this can provoke some ire, but there we are. [I would've used a different example, but it's a while since I was at university and that one stuck in my mind].
Self-reporting is notoriously unreliable for self-diagnosis [it's when your mum ticks all but 2 symptoms of psychopathology on your behalf that you need to worry ].
I think it's the carers who have the stiff upper lip, these days. The families bear the brunt because that's what families do. But there is a cost - and I'm not talking about the financial cost.
Coming belatedly to the PMQ party I'm sure people enjoyed, having just seen it, it felt a little gimicky from Corbyn, but not overly so, it worked well enough for what it was. Not sure about the long term, but not an approach with no positives.
Just boring and really it lets David Cameron showcase his policies without counter
Hence why I think it would work better as an occasional thing rather than every time. He can make the point about democratizing the event, whatever that means, while still getting in a series of focused questions of his own when he feels the situation warrants it.
@taffys As someone who has had her fair share of issues and had counselling on the NHS, my experience has been a positive one with them. But in regards to mental illness a series of governments and the NHS have still yet to get it right.
That's in part because it's hidden, it's not fashionable (like some other illnesses), the children are teenagers and not cutely sympathetic, the people suffering from it can be scary, people often feel ashamed to admit to it and there can be a tendency for others to dismiss it or assume that people just need to "buck up".
In the past people were often hidden away and when the care in the community policy was adopted, it was starved of resources and mental illness was linked with schizophrenics committing crimes (like the Zito murder). Not many votes in channelling NHS money in that direction when there were so many other more popular causes.
So the current change of mood and action is much to be welcomed.
We have a schizophrenic daughter. She was diagnosed about 17 years ago...She is classified as unemployable so on benefits. She lives at home. If she did not, she would be dead by now. The NHS care systems are grossly under-resourched and over-stretched..
I pity others in similar positions without family support.
Channel 4 news are even worse than the BBC in reporting the invasion of Hungary.
"A sinister twist in what is really just a bit of a blockage in the pipeline".
This reporting is absolutely abhorrent and disgraceful. All it will do - by refusing to take (and other countries back) much harder action to drive the invaders back to Syria - is lead to many more Central European and Balkan countries electing hard right governments.
I'm glad that you've raised the issue of the questionable Mindfulness. That seems to me to be a fad. CBT has its place but only for certain conditions and drugs can really help. I am lucky in that our GP is very good on this and very alive to the problems that such illnesses can create for carers. But it is a lottery and if you can't pay for help and the NHS services where you live are rubbish, you're in real trouble.
Oxford is very much a centre for Mindfulness - and I find it all rather sinister.
You are lucky having a good GP. I have given up on mine. And the NHS in general. I don't have any resources and so have spent a number of years with next to no support at all.
It is very dispiriting to feel that you have nowhere to turn.
I am so sorry to hear that. I wish there was something that I could say or do that would make things better. It feels inadequate to say that you have my sympathy. But I will say it anyway. You do.
@taffys As someone who has had her fair share of issues and had counselling on the NHS, my experience has been a positive one with them. But in regards to mental illness a series of governments and the NHS have still yet to get it right.
That's in part because it's hidden, it's not fashionable (like some other illnesses), the children are teenagers and not cutely sympathetic, the people suffering from it can be scary, people often feel ashamed to admit to it and there can be a tendency for others to dismiss it or assume that people just need to "buck up".
In the past people were often hidden away and when the care in the community policy was adopted, it was starved of resources and mental illness was linked with schizophrenics committing crimes (like the Zito murder). Not many votes in channelling NHS money in that direction when there were so many other more popular causes.
So the current change of mood and action is much to be welcomed.
We have a schizophrenic daughter. She was diagnosed about 17 years ago...She is classified as unemployable so on benefits. She lives at home. If she did not, she would be dead by now. The NHS care systems are grossly under-resourched and over-stretched..
I pity others in similar positions without family support.
I am so sorry to hear that.
Me too. While these conditions are difficult for loving families to cope with they can be near impossible for those without. Not everything about the old asylums was bad, sometimes they were too institutional, but they were a place of safety.
I guess it varies. I get the impression that some Conservatives do genuinely care, and want the best for all in society. Then I see other opinions online, where it come across that those who are D/E are written off, because they either vote Labour, or most likely are not engaged with politics at all - and that middle class, CD2Es, WVMs are all that matter.
I think regardless for you wishes to eliminate poverty and create good jobs for all, a dispassionate review of those on welfare will find, alongside all the deserving cases, a good smattering of people gaming the system. We should not ignore that either.
I don't deny there are those gaming the system. However, I do dislike - what especially seems to be a media campaign - to portray, and imply that nearly everyone on the dole is gaming the system and shaming those who happen to experience the misfortune of being unemployed.
It's the lack of empathy that gets me. It's as if there are some on the right who simply can't comprehend what it would be like to be in someone elses shoes - *why can't they just get a job, they must be lazy*
Scratch under the surface of the long-term unemployed and there are a myriad of issues - sexuality, relationships, self-esteem, brain injuries, mental health - and all the things that we now diagnose in children (aspergers, autism etc) - stuff that's there, but not seen. not acknowledged, not labelled.
They can't cope with the job in the amazon warehouse? pft, they must be lazy.
They can have an existential crisis on their own time. Life can be tough for all of us. Many people leave their homes at 7:30 in the morning and dont get back to 7:30 at night. Why should they have sympathy for people scratching themselves at home all day because of self esteem issues?
All it will do - by refusing to take (and other countries back) much harder action to drive the invaders back to Syria - is lead to many more Central European and Balkan countries electing hard right governments.
Germany could be going that way very, very soon.
I think, Dair, that you underestimate the latent folk memories in Germany of a certain small, dark-haired Austrian with a stupid 'tache. Remember, only the Soviet Union lost more lives in WWII than the Germans.
@Mortimer I don't really see why there is a responsibility for those that are pro-welfare to prove that everyone is not gaming the situation. The anti-welfare side has hardly proved that everyone on welfare is gaming the situation after all - rather there argument appears to be supported by a series of anecdotal cases. As for welfare, YouGov surprisingly found the public to be split on the issue of 12bn welfare cuts: https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/06/27/public-split-camerons-welfare-cuts/ And found a slight majority for protecting tax credits for the low paid.
Though voters also back capping out of work and child benefits in that poll and housing benefit for under 25s
On the subject of PMQs, I don't recall Cameron setting the world on fire in his first outing against Tony Blair and I'd love to know how Margaret Thatcher fared on her first (it was of course twice a week before then) outing against Harold Wilson back in 1975.
I'm glad that you've raised the issue of the questionable Mindfulness. That seems to me to be a fad. CBT has its place but only for certain conditions and drugs can really help. I am lucky in that our GP is very good on this and very alive to the problems that such illnesses can create for carers. But it is a lottery and if you can't pay for help and the NHS services where you live are rubbish, you're in real trouble.
Oxford is very much a centre for Mindfulness - and I find it all rather sinister.
You are lucky having a good GP. I have given up on mine. And the NHS in general. I don't have any resources and so have spent a number of years with next to no support at all.
It is very dispiriting to feel that you have nowhere to turn.
I am so sorry to hear that. I wish there was something that I could say or do that would make things better. It feels inadequate to say that you have my sympathy. But I will say it anyway. You do.
@Mortimer I don't really see why there is a responsibility for those that are pro-welfare to prove that everyone is not gaming the situation. The anti-welfare side has hardly proved that everyone on welfare is gaming the situation after all - rather there argument appears to be supported by a series of anecdotal cases. As for welfare, YouGov surprisingly found the public to be split on the issue of 12bn welfare cuts: https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/06/27/public-split-camerons-welfare-cuts/ And found a slight majority for protecting tax credits for the low paid.
If you're the opposition and you want to change perceptions, then the responsibility is yours. Everything else is whinging. I'm not subscribing to the view of benefits - but just elucidating it.
@Mortimer I don't really see why there is a responsibility for those that are pro-welfare to prove that everyone is not gaming the situation. The anti-welfare side has hardly proved that everyone on welfare is gaming the situation after all - rather there argument appears to be supported by a series of anecdotal cases. As for welfare, YouGov surprisingly found the public to be split on the issue of 12bn welfare cuts: https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/06/27/public-split-camerons-welfare-cuts/ And found a slight majority for protecting tax credits for the low paid.
If you're the opposition and you want to change perceptions, then the responsibility is yours. Everything else is whinging. I'm not subscribing to the view of benefits - but just elucidating it.
And what I'm saying is that the perception shouldn't be there in the first place.
@Mortimer I don't really see why there is a responsibility for those that are pro-welfare to prove that everyone is not gaming the situation. The anti-welfare side has hardly proved that everyone on welfare is gaming the situation after all - rather there argument appears to be supported by a series of anecdotal cases. As for welfare, YouGov surprisingly found the public to be split on the issue of 12bn welfare cuts: https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/06/27/public-split-camerons-welfare-cuts/ And found a slight majority for protecting tax credits for the low paid.
Though voters also back capping out of work and child benefits in that poll and housing benefit for under 25s
Yes, it does appear to vary depending on what group they are asked about.
@Mortimer I don't really see why there is a responsibility for those that are pro-welfare to prove that everyone is not gaming the situation. The anti-welfare side has hardly proved that everyone on welfare is gaming the situation after all - rather there argument appears to be supported by a series of anecdotal cases. As for welfare, YouGov surprisingly found the public to be split on the issue of 12bn welfare cuts: https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/06/27/public-split-camerons-welfare-cuts/ And found a slight majority for protecting tax credits for the low paid.
If you're the opposition and you want to change perceptions, then the responsibility is yours. Everything else is whinging. I'm not subscribing to the view of benefits - but just elucidating it.
And what I'm saying is that the perception shouldn't be there in the first place.
Doesn't win elections, does it. If something exists, wishing doesn't make it disappear.
HYUFD you were right on Abbott! I had to laugh when I saw that he'd been ousted on the news!
Yes, I did expect it to wait a few more months, but ultimately it was his continued poor polling which did for him with Turnbull a more popular, Cameron like replacement. Abbott was 'distraught' yesterday according to the Times, and I expect will be doing a Rudd on the backbenches for a while
@Mortimer I don't really see why there is a responsibility for those that are pro-welfare to prove that everyone is not gaming the situation. The anti-welfare side has hardly proved that everyone on welfare is gaming the situation after all - rather there argument appears to be supported by a series of anecdotal cases. As for welfare, YouGov surprisingly found the public to be split on the issue of 12bn welfare cuts: https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/06/27/public-split-camerons-welfare-cuts/ And found a slight majority for protecting tax credits for the low paid.
Though voters also back capping out of work and child benefits in that poll and housing benefit for under 25s
Yes, it does appear to vary depending on what group they are asked about.
Indeed, though clear support for pensioners benefits and a narrow majority for keeping tax credits
One of Glasgow Councils "jobs for the boys" schemes - City Building is now being referred to Police for investigation on corruption issues. Given some of the allegations laid at the feet of Glasgow Council and it's Labour hierarchy, this could well be the tip of a very, very black iceberg.
It might even be as bad for Labour in Glasgow as a similar scandal proved for the Liberal;s in Edinburgh, Liberals which seemed immune even from the debacle of their Trams Fiasco but were finally consumed when the widespread corruption of their council was exposed.
All it will do - by refusing to take (and other countries back) much harder action to drive the invaders back to Syria - is lead to many more Central European and Balkan countries electing hard right governments.
Germany could be going that way very, very soon.
I think, Dair, that you underestimate the latent folk memories in Germany of a certain small, dark-haired Austrian with a stupid 'tache. Remember, only the Soviet Union lost more lives in WWII than the Germans.
At least, I hope you do.
I understand the politcal mentality of the German Shame but this is becoming more of a generational issue and Merkel has walked into this problem. However outside of Germany, there will be growing support for following Hungary's example and installing hard right governments.
The West has no way to go. While it maintains the doctrine of the fundamental sanctity of individual human lives, it cannot deal with this sort of issue.
On another topic, it looks like Cameron is being vindicated as the 'refugee' crisis steps up a notch or two this evening. Surely Merkel's political head could be called for if the situation continues to escalate?
Yesterday's slight dip in a poll which I reported seems to have been a blip - two more show her back on top. http://www.wahlrecht.de/umfragen/
Very good to see the intelligent discussion of mental health here, and sympathies to Oxford Simon and others who have been unlucky in their treatment. My own experience with a close relative was that it was unpredictably mixed. One psychiatrist was really effective with advice and a helpful CBT course which produced a marked visible improvement, but when he retired the patient felt abandoned, and his successor was hopelessly passive, her conclusion after the first two chats being, "It's very difficult, but come back in a year and tell me how you're getting on". This was to someone who had had a lifetime of intermittent illness, sometimes leading to a failure to recognise relatives and an inability to speak. My advice for what it's worth is to keep trying - change GP as needed, ask for further referrals: you will I hope strike lucky.
Where the system seemed to me not to work at all in the 90s was non-suicidal emergency. When the patient woke with a panic attack, the choices were A&E (and perhaps sitting in a crowded room with drunks is really a grim option if you're in a crisis) or a call back a few hours later from a GP via (as it was then) NHS Direct. Notts later introduced a crisis help team, basically Samaritans for non-suicides with the option of backup visits and medical care. At that stage, the family issue had eased, so I don't know how it worked out, but it sounded good.
I do understand notme's scepticism and it's courageous to admit it, but honestly I would rather have a serious physical illness than the debilitating horror of serious mental illness. It bears no relationship whatever to the sort of "feeling a bit down" that any of us may experience.
All it will do - by refusing to take (and other countries back) much harder action to drive the invaders back to Syria - is lead to many more Central European and Balkan countries electing hard right governments.
Germany could be going that way very, very soon.
I think, Dair, that you underestimate the latent folk memories in Germany of a certain small, dark-haired Austrian with a stupid 'tache. Remember, only the Soviet Union lost more lives in WWII than the Germans.
At least, I hope you do.
What struck me during my studies of interwar Europe was that the voting majority tended to support liberalism until it failed; and then supported the right wing party able to restore order. The desire for lawfulness was particularly marked in Germany. I'm not sufficiently well informed about German culture today; but judging by the response to Greek disorder, I am slightly perplexed as to how Merkel's migrant stance is being supported by the public. Has the order-syndrome declined? Or is the worry over demographics trumping it?
@taffys As someone who has had her fair share of issues and had counselling on the NHS, my experience has been a positive one with them. But in regards to mental illness a series of governments and the NHS have still yet to get it right.
That's in part because it's hidden, it's not fashionable (like some other illnesses), the children are teenagers and not cutely sympathetic, the people suffering from it can be scary, people often feel ashamed to admit to it and there can be a tendency for others to dismiss it or assume that people just need to "buck up".
In the past people were often hidden away and when the care in the community policy was adopted, it was starved of resources and mental illness was linked with schizophrenics committing crimes (like the Zito murder). Not many votes in channelling NHS money in that direction when there were so many other more popular causes.
So the current change of mood and action is much to be welcomed.
We have a schizophrenic daughter. She was diagnosed about 17 years ago...She is classified as unemployable so on benefits. She lives at home. If she did not, she would be dead by now. The NHS care systems are grossly under-resourched and over-stretched..
I pity others in similar positions without family support.
I am so sorry to hear that.
Thnaks.
But like many things in life, you adapt and cope...No point in complaining - it just makes you miserable and achieves nothing.. But it does limit what you can do.
Question is whether the mainstream media start to calling much of Corbyn`s base and support what is - emotional fascism full of hatred for their enemies.If Britain was ever going to get a fascist govt it was always going to come from the fascist left not the right as for decades the establishment have looked to stigmatise any `angry` right wing citizen as fascist and as such most smart careerist fascists were never going to join right wing parties as their career would be heavily handicapped.The fascist left have been given a soft ride ever since the end of the cold war
All it will do - by refusing to take (and other countries back) much harder action to drive the invaders back to Syria - is lead to many more Central European and Balkan countries electing hard right governments.
Germany could be going that way very, very soon.
I think, Dair, that you underestimate the latent folk memories in Germany of a certain small, dark-haired Austrian with a stupid 'tache. Remember, only the Soviet Union lost more lives in WWII than the Germans.
At least, I hope you do.
I understand the politcal mentality of the German Shame but this is becoming more of a generational issue and Merkel has walked into this problem. However outside of Germany, there will be growing support for following Hungary's example and installing hard right governments.
The West has no way to go. While it maintains the doctrine of the fundamental sanctity of individual human lives, it cannot deal with this sort of issue.
Austria is much more likely. The Freedom Party has been leading in most recent polls and one had them on 31%
"Like so many other Instagram models, this model is not actually a model or fitness instructor or herbal tea sales person or any of the other million jobs they claim to work. Nope. This Instagram model is an escort. A very high priced escort. Like many of the escorts on the site, she takes a lot of photos. Things people have bought her or holding cash she was paid. Most of the time they say they earned it themselves with some kind of #blessed hashtag, but no one is buying it.
John McDonnell, when he is not musing about assassinating Margaret Thatcher or overthrowing capitalism, is a fan of the men in balaclavas. Bobby Sands, the Provo gun-runner who died on hunger strike in 1981, is a particular favourite.
This gave Cameron another opportunity to play the statesman, claiming the moral high ground and slapping down Corbyn’s fringe politics without breathing the man’s name: "My view is simple: the terrorism we faced was wrong. It was unjustifiable. The death and the killing was wrong. It was never justified, and people who seek to justify it should be ashamed of themselves."
The Tories know they must pull their punches on Corbyn. Make it about Labour. How far Labour has strayed from the mainstream. How Labour is out of touch with the British people. Avoid personal attacks; you don’t want to look like you’re battering a pensioner and draw public sympathy for him. Above all, the object is to keep Corbyn in the job until the next election. He is the most extreme leader in the history of the Labour Party. Play this right and the Conservatives could bury their opponents in a bigger landslide than Mrs T's 1983 avalanche.
Can I confidently make a prediction. By March next year, Schengen will be fully "open" again.
Happy to take the other side of that if you fancy a wager, Robert - providing the text is changed to in March, rather than by....
£10 to charity of choice?
One thing to bear in mind is that winter is coming and that will surely slow the flow of migrants (if they have any sense). If European leaders had any sense they would use the winter months to strengthen all the exterior borders of the Schengen zone. More likely they will think crisis over and then it will all start up again next year
All those of you discussing the minimum cost of food per week may wish to consider that the limiting factor is not just cost but weight...
To explain. I can carry about 25kgs unaided for about a mile. If it goes over that then you have to get a car, and the cost of that (car+insurance+petrol+maintenance) is about £2500pa. This is a genuine problem, and careful planning is necessary for the carless. Eggs are good and light, tins of beans are spectacularly cheap tho' heavy, out-of-town supermarkets are cheap but impossible to get to, eight-til-lates are local but expensive...if you're in a contemplative mood, it's an interesting problem in optimising within constraints.
I think, Dair, that you underestimate the latent folk memories in Germany of a certain small, dark-haired Austrian with a stupid 'tache. Remember, only the Soviet Union lost more lives in WWII than the Germans.
All those of you discussing the minimum cost of food per week may wish to consider that the limiting factor is not just cost but weight...
To explain. I can carry about 25kgs unaided for about a mile. If it goes over that then you have to get a car, and the cost of that (car+insurance+petrol+maintenance) is about £2500pa. This is a genuine problem, and careful planning is necessary for the carless. Eggs are good and light, tins of beans are spectacularly cheap tho' heavy, out-of-town supermarkets are cheap but impossible to get to, eight-til-lates are local but expensive...if you're in a contemplative mood, it's an interesting problem in optimising within constraints.
round here, they use taxis. Far cheaper than owning a car...
Question is whether the mainstream media start to calling much of Corbyn`s base and support what is - emotional fascism full of hatred for their enemies.If Britain was ever going to get a fascist govt it was always going to come from the fascist left not the right as for decades the establishment have looked to stigmatise any `angry` right wing citizen as fascist and as such most smart careerist fascists were never going to join right wing parties as their career would be heavily handicapped.The fascist left have been given a soft ride ever since the end of the cold war
Comments
eg
''Field's analysis is that the public's attitude towards welfare is that you should get out what you put in. The trouble is that when Labour was in power it did the opposite. Gordon Brown used means-testing to spray £30bn on tax credits as a subsidy for poor families. The idea that one hardworking breadwinner would think it fair that his lower-paid neighbour received state cash for free to top up his pay packet, was, in Field's view, "why the policy failed" ''
(Guardian 2013)
Dont buy a portion of chips for you and the kids, buy a 25lb bag of potatoes for less than a £5 and feed them for two weeks.
The poor vote Conservative because they don't want to be poor and see the Conservatives as the party of aspiration. Simple message - work hard, we will let you keep more of your money and you can decide how to enrich yourself and your family (if you have one).
Interestingly, during the good times, the wealthy were less Conservative since they were secure in their wealth and wanted the State to spread it more to others hence you saw the dreadful 2001 result in the south for the Conservatives in affluent seats.
The onset of the global downturn led to insecurity among the wealthy and they rallied back to the Conservatives as the guarantors of wealth so the Tories are both the party for those who have wealth and those who want wealth (in very simple terms).
For those who see it in different terms e.g: I want my community and its services to be improved and I'm not bothered about my own circumstances, you have Labour and the LDs.
http://www.kraxon.com/zodiac-eclipse-demon-hunting/
Free short story serial, with the full list [to-date] up here, oldest at the bottom:
http://www.kraxon.com/category/zodiac-eclipse/
Coming belatedly to the PMQ party I'm sure people enjoyed, having just seen it, it felt a little gimicky from Corbyn, but not overly so, it worked well enough for what it was. Not sure about the long term, but not an approach with no positives.
In the past people were often hidden away and when the care in the community policy was adopted, it was starved of resources and mental illness was linked with schizophrenics committing crimes (like the Zito murder). Not many votes in channelling NHS money in that direction when there were so many other more popular causes.
So the current change of mood and action is much to be welcomed.
But you wouldnt have thought so. We now have about 1/2 a dozen organisations providing 'homelessness' services, at least three of them are directly commissioned services from local government and national government. I worked out that, if you included all the charities and public bodies the staff involved in homelessness is actually greater than the number of homeless people.
The first in particularly important now that the wisdom is that it is not sodium levels that are bad, but more the when the sodium potassium balance is too out of whack.
We agree on that.
Add into this the rise of the very questionable Mindfulness and you have a mental health system that is very much not fit for purpose.
Particularly when you have GPs who refuse to prescribe certain drugs because they are too expensive (even though you have been told by a consultant that they are what you need)
The whole thing is broken. Very broken.
(And yes, I do have very personal experience of this)
What I found shocking was a recent report compiled by and on behalf of a local very popular youth service that has a city wide reach. It said that on asking young people what was their biggest concern, they responded 'mental health'.
May also be why Farage could fear winning the EU referendum more than losing it, although UKIP has recently taken on immigration as its core topic.
We are also privileged enough to get all our meat direct from local farms.
How you make it affordable for the masses, though, is a tough one. My average meal cooked from basic, locally-sourced ingredients (without even going 'organic') probably costs twice or thrice the amount per head as would a meal at McD or KFC.
@Cyclefree I find it very sad that our society finds it difficult to sympathise with teenagers, and people who do sometimes come across as a bit scary. It does appear though, that society today in general, is far more sympathetic to the issue of mental illness than previously. I wonder what triggered that?
NHS spending 2016 - £138bn
We can talk about the issue if mental health all we want, but there is no reason this should be political or somehow related to the bogus and politicised issue of so called 'austerity'.
We have a schizophrenic daughter. She was diagnosed about 17 years ago...She is classified as unemployable so on benefits. She lives at home. If she did not, she would be dead by now. The NHS care systems are grossly under-resourched and over-stretched..
I pity others in similar positions without family support.
I do think that, generally, it's good to talk but don't discount the stiff upper lip entirely.
A study found that of women (taking part) suffering PMS, diaries revealed that over 90% actually weren't. Of course, being a man and raising this can provoke some ire, but there we are. [I would've used a different example, but it's a while since I was at university and that one stuck in my mind].
Self-reporting is notoriously unreliable for self-diagnosis [it's when your mum ticks all but 2 symptoms of psychopathology on your behalf that you need to worry
Incidentally, I wonder if the majority of people have a bigger problem with the fact that it is possible to 'earn' more (i.e. The full benefits cap) on benefits than some working families cope on, remembering that the benefits cap is nett whilst take home pay is not. This strikes many as unfair - not least because those families may be paying taxes to subsidise those who appear better off doing little or nothing. The tax credit bill is similar - why should those working 40 hours subside those working 16.
Thankfully, welfare reforms will probably soon make the above point moot. Good job, GO.
"The laissez-faire approach to liberty in these circumstances is an act, not of principle, but of moral cowardice. Like the pacifist whose only concern is keeping his own hands free of blood, the liberal only concerned with his own reputation for tolerance ends up complicit in the crimes he ignores."
You are lucky having a good GP. I have given up on mine. And the NHS in general. I don't have any resources and so have spent a number of years with next to no support at all.
It is very dispiriting to feel that you have nowhere to turn.
I have some (professional) experience of both in my early career. Psychiatry done well is expensive and time consuming. A further problem is recruitment. British doctors rarely go into the speciality and 93% of those taking postgraduate exams in Psychiatry trained overseas. This does not matter too much in some specialities (a broken femur is the same the world over) but psychiatric disease is heavily rooted in the social and cultural millieu so harder for foreign doctors to do well.
Theodore Dalrymple's essays on life as a psychiatrist in Birmingham are quite eye opening!
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/books/7938779/Spoilt-Rotten-by-Theodore-Dalrymple-review.html
Scratch under the surface of the long-term unemployed and there are a myriad of issues - sexuality, relationships, self-esteem, brain injuries, mental health - and all the things that we now diagnose in children (aspergers, autism etc) - stuff that's there, but not seen. not acknowledged, not labelled.
They can't cope with the job in the amazon warehouse? pft, they must be lazy.
"A sinister twist in what is really just a bit of a blockage in the pipeline".
This reporting is absolutely abhorrent and disgraceful. All it will do - by refusing to take (and other countries back) much harder action to drive the invaders back to Syria - is lead to many more Central European and Balkan countries electing hard right governments.
Germany could be going that way very, very soon.
http://blogs.crikey.com.au/pollbludger/2015/09/16/reachtel-50-50/
http://www.wbur.org/2015/09/16/wbur-poll-new-hampshire-september
At least, I hope you do.
Not from anything untowards happening to the SNP, no loss of popularity or support there.
But from a scandal that could be about to consume her internal opponents in SLAB's ongoing Civil War.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-34268271
One of Glasgow Councils "jobs for the boys" schemes - City Building is now being referred to Police for investigation on corruption issues. Given some of the allegations laid at the feet of Glasgow Council and it's Labour hierarchy, this could well be the tip of a very, very black iceberg.
It might even be as bad for Labour in Glasgow as a similar scandal proved for the Liberal;s in Edinburgh, Liberals which seemed immune even from the debacle of their Trams Fiasco but were finally consumed when the widespread corruption of their council was exposed.
The West has no way to go. While it maintains the doctrine of the fundamental sanctity of individual human lives, it cannot deal with this sort of issue.
'Germany could be going that way very, very soon.'
It's OK when Germany unilaterally scraps Schengen & closes their borders but not OK for Hungary to do the same.
http://www.wahlrecht.de/umfragen/
Very good to see the intelligent discussion of mental health here, and sympathies to Oxford Simon and others who have been unlucky in their treatment. My own experience with a close relative was that it was unpredictably mixed. One psychiatrist was really effective with advice and a helpful CBT course which produced a marked visible improvement, but when he retired the patient felt abandoned, and his successor was hopelessly passive, her conclusion after the first two chats being, "It's very difficult, but come back in a year and tell me how you're getting on". This was to someone who had had a lifetime of intermittent illness, sometimes leading to a failure to recognise relatives and an inability to speak. My advice for what it's worth is to keep trying - change GP as needed, ask for further referrals: you will I hope strike lucky.
Where the system seemed to me not to work at all in the 90s was non-suicidal emergency. When the patient woke with a panic attack, the choices were A&E (and perhaps sitting in a crowded room with drunks is really a grim option if you're in a crisis) or a call back a few hours later from a GP via (as it was then) NHS Direct. Notts later introduced a crisis help team, basically Samaritans for non-suicides with the option of backup visits and medical care. At that stage, the family issue had eased, so I don't know how it worked out, but it sounded good.
I do understand notme's scepticism and it's courageous to admit it, but honestly I would rather have a serious physical illness than the debilitating horror of serious mental illness. It bears no relationship whatever to the sort of "feeling a bit down" that any of us may experience.
But like many things in life, you adapt and cope...No point in complaining - it just makes you miserable and achieves nothing.. But it does limit what you can do.
£10 to charity of choice?
'I would love to be a fly on the wall in Angela Merkel's office. What an appallying mess.'
Unbelievable shambles with Merkel of course blaming & threatening everyone else
http://www.crazydaysandnights.net/2015/09/todays-blind-items-instagram-blackmail.html
Wonder who this could be referring to?
To explain. I can carry about 25kgs unaided for about a mile. If it goes over that then you have to get a car, and the cost of that (car+insurance+petrol+maintenance) is about £2500pa. This is a genuine problem, and careful planning is necessary for the carless. Eggs are good and light, tins of beans are spectacularly cheap tho' heavy, out-of-town supermarkets are cheap but impossible to get to, eight-til-lates are local but expensive...if you're in a contemplative mood, it's an interesting problem in optimising within constraints.
@JasonGroves1: Corbyn day four: 'I'm not resigning...'
Jeremy Corbyn is Big Brother and I claim my £5.