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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The US Presidential Election: David Herdson’s guide to anal

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    isamisam Posts: 40,901

    isam said:

    I never really look at match odds markets in football, but did this week and think Everton and West Ham look nice bets

    Is that to win?
    Yeah... Don't go mad I am just trying out a new little system... But West Ham have won at Arsenal, Liverpool and Man City and are 3/1 to win at Palace who don't traditionally have a good home record
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,855
    I think it's fair to say that watching a whole load of maiden overs in a hot and sunny stadium is not exactly Mrs. Sandpit's perfect idea of a day out. Oh well, maybe I should have introduced her to the shorter forms of the game first!
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,970
    Betting Post

    Backed New Zealand, Australia and South Africa to all win by 10 points or more at 4.5, with Ladbrokes.
  • Options
    isam said:

    isam said:

    I never really look at match odds markets in football, but did this week and think Everton and West Ham look nice bets

    Is that to win?
    Yeah... Don't go mad I am just trying out a new little system... But West Ham have won at Arsenal, Liverpool and Man City and are 3/1 to win at Palace who don't traditionally have a good home record
    Don't worry, I only ever bet small stakes.
    Cheers Sam

  • Options
    Interesting piece from Dan the Man in the Telegraph on what our negotiating stance should be
    http://t.co/DUZSAKbwTA
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    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,855

    Interesting piece from Dan the Man in the Telegraph on what our negotiating stance should be
    http://t.co/DUZSAKbwTA

    That seems reasonable, pretty much what we signed up to back in 1973.
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,951

    Betting Post

    Backed New Zealand, Australia and South Africa to all win by 10 points or more at 4.5, with Ladbrokes.

    Australia should beat Scotland. France historically beat New Zealand in World Cup quarter finals though and Wales will fancy their chances against South Africa. I have bets on them both
  • Options
    isam said:

    isam said:

    I never really look at match odds markets in football, but did this week and think Everton and West Ham look nice bets

    Is that to win?
    Yeah... Don't go mad I am just trying out a new little system... But West Ham have won at Arsenal, Liverpool and Man City and are 3/1 to win at Palace who don't traditionally have a good home record
    Agree Sam, Everton and West Ham are too long.

    I had a look at Division 1 and for the life of me I cannot understand why Bury are 1.95 draw no bet
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,970
    Mr. HYUFD, not convinced by France. Historically, England do well at World Cups.

    Wales scraped a victory against England, which wasn't that impressive. South Africa have been a bit off but I think they stand a decent chance of the winning margin.

    It wouldn't be a staggering result if France or Wales won, but I'd be a little surprised. If Scotland win, I'd be shocked [and, money aside, delighted].

    Anyway, we shall soon see.
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,970
    edited October 2015
    Mr. Dair, Hardman seems to be sound.

    Edited extra bit: got to say I approve of the rugby, which appears specifically scheduled to avoid clashing with Homeland.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,901

    isam said:

    isam said:

    I never really look at match odds markets in football, but did this week and think Everton and West Ham look nice bets

    Is that to win?
    Yeah... Don't go mad I am just trying out a new little system... But West Ham have won at Arsenal, Liverpool and Man City and are 3/1 to win at Palace who don't traditionally have a good home record
    Agree Sam, Everton and West Ham are too long.

    I had a look at Division 1 and for the life of me I cannot understand why Bury are 1.95 draw no bet
    Cool.. I also backed the draw in WBA vs Sunderland, and Leicester at Southampton

    My mate does both teams to score betting and I thought YES in Spurs and Everton matches, NO in west brom
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,951

    Mr. HYUFD, not convinced by France. Historically, England do well at World Cups.

    Wales scraped a victory against England, which wasn't that impressive. South Africa have been a bit off but I think they stand a decent chance of the winning margin.

    It wouldn't be a staggering result if France or Wales won, but I'd be a little surprised. If Scotland win, I'd be shocked [and, money aside, delighted].

    Anyway, we shall soon see.

    France play best as underdogs with nothing to lose and New Zealand seem to be like rabbits in the headlights against France at this stage which was where the French beat them in 1999 and 2007. Remember too New Zealand's win over France in the 2011 final was not by much. The All Blacks are strong favourites but we shall see.

    South Africa lost to Japan and are the weakest of the Southern Hemisphere three
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,970
    Mr. HYUFD, my main concern with New Zealand is the turn-over rate which appears high.

    South Africa are the weakest of the three major SH teams, but Wales are roughly on a par with England.
  • Options
    David Herdson

    Just another question if I may please ( I posted at 9.04 below):

    Do you know why first Caucus at Iowa and first Primary at New Hampshire are later this time round?

    Surely Iowa was Dec 2011 and NH Jan 2012?

    Thank you
  • Options
    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    Soon as I saw her on QT I knew something wasn't right.

    She fooled Mike though.
    To be fair, she may well just be poorly informed as to how the changes would affect her. The Tax Credit system is famously complex. Shroud waving over cuts often makes people fear the worst.
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    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,855
    Did anyone get why that wasn't a wicket, when the DRS on the big screen showed he was out?
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,161

    Another cracker by DavidH - it's a very good guide.

    I'd add

    11. The US media likes change and drama, just like our media. Be prepared for the position to change radically, as one or another story is blown up as the new highlight. We are more than 3 months away from a single votes being cast. In betting terms, that means don't stake the house on anyone right now.

    With regard to Biden, the general view has been that he's had a family tragedy and he needs to be cut some slack to decide in his own time. But I wonder if the chronic indecision is not starting to do real damage to his prospects. It's not so much that it's taking him forever to decide, as that a series of "he will decide by..." deadlines have slid by without a decision. He might be best off saying that at present that for all the familiar reasons he doesn't feel able to plunge himself into the primary battle. That leaves open the possibility that if Clinton implodes he could be the rescue candidate for the Democrats.

    Top pollster Zogby tells US newspaper that Biden has to decide this weekend:

    http://www.bostonherald.com/news_opinion/us_politics/2015/10/pollster_biden_must_make_up_his_mind_this_weekend
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    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    isam said:

    I never really look at match odds markets in football, but did this week and think Everton and West Ham look nice bets

    Leicester to win ;-)

    Trust in the tinkerman, he will beat Soton away and 5.1 on Betfair.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,661
    Watching HIGNFY, Sadiq Khan is a bit lacking in charisma, even when making a potentially funny quip. I assume Goldsmith will probably be on at some point, and we'll see if he's any better in that sense. Not that charisma is the be all and end all, but still, very cold performance.

    PS _ I hope someone knows the answers to peterelectionfollowr's questions, as I have no the slightest idea and they seem pretty intriguing.
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,581
    isam said:

    isam said:

    isam said:

    I never really look at match odds markets in football, but did this week and think Everton and West Ham look nice bets

    Is that to win?
    Yeah... Don't go mad I am just trying out a new little system... But West Ham have won at Arsenal, Liverpool and Man City and are 3/1 to win at Palace who don't traditionally have a good home record
    Agree Sam, Everton and West Ham are too long.

    I had a look at Division 1 and for the life of me I cannot understand why Bury are 1.95 draw no bet
    Cool.. I also backed the draw in WBA vs Sunderland, and Leicester at Southampton

    My mate does both teams to score betting and I thought YES in Spurs and Everton matches, NO in west brom
    Big Sam has usually done well in his first game at a new club. I wouldn't be surprised if the Mackems get their first win.
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,951

    David Herdson

    Just another question if I may please ( I posted at 9.04 below):

    Do you know why first Caucus at Iowa and first Primary at New Hampshire are later this time round?

    Surely Iowa was Dec 2011 and NH Jan 2012?

    Thank you

    Iowa and NH were in January 2012
  • Options
    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,581
    kle4 said:

    Watching HIGNFY, Sadiq Khan is a bit lacking in charisma, even when making a potentially funny quip. I assume Goldsmith will probably be on at some point, and we'll see if he's any better in that sense. Not that charisma is the be all and end all, but still, very cold performance.

    PS _ I hope someone knows the answers to peterelectionfollowr's questions, as I have no the slightest idea and they seem pretty intriguing.

    My other half was very unimpressed by Sadiq, and picked up on his habit of poking his tongue out of the corner of his mouth.

    Not a vote winning performance.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,951

    Another cracker by DavidH - it's a very good guide.

    I'd add

    11. The US media likes change and drama, just like our media. Be prepared for the position to change radically, as one or another story is blown up as the new highlight. We are more than 3 months away from a single votes being cast. In betting terms, that means don't stake the house on anyone right now.

    With regard to Biden, the general view has been that he's had a family tragedy and he needs to be cut some slack to decide in his own time. But I wonder if the chronic indecision is not starting to do real damage to his prospects. It's not so much that it's taking him forever to decide, as that a series of "he will decide by..." deadlines have slid by without a decision. He might be best off saying that at present that for all the familiar reasons he doesn't feel able to plunge himself into the primary battle. That leaves open the possibility that if Clinton implodes he could be the rescue candidate for the Democrats.

    Top pollster Zogby tells US newspaper that Biden has to decide this weekend:

    http://www.bostonherald.com/news_opinion/us_politics/2015/10/pollster_biden_must_make_up_his_mind_this_weekend
    Theoretically he could decide only at the convention if Hillary won most delegates but was forced to pull out just before due to charges over her emails and her delegates switched to Biden
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    I am slight surprised that no one has posted this yet, as it is very relevant (!). I guess @rcs1000 must still be on his flight...

    https://xkcd.com/1122/
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,951
    edited October 2015

    Mr. HYUFD, my main concern with New Zealand is the turn-over rate which appears high.

    South Africa are the weakest of the three major SH teams, but Wales are roughly on a par with England.

    New Zealand are certainly not infallible and England narrowly lost to South Africa when they last played while Wales narrowly beat England
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,951
    kle4 said:

    Watching HIGNFY, Sadiq Khan is a bit lacking in charisma, even when making a potentially funny quip. I assume Goldsmith will probably be on at some point, and we'll see if he's any better in that sense. Not that charisma is the be all and end all, but still, very cold performance.

    PS _ I hope someone knows the answers to peterelectionfollowr's questions, as I have no the slightest idea and they seem pretty intriguing.

    Goldsmith is better looking than Boris but less charismatic and sharp. Khan is not charismatic but is ruthless
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,661
    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    Watching HIGNFY, Sadiq Khan is a bit lacking in charisma, even when making a potentially funny quip. I assume Goldsmith will probably be on at some point, and we'll see if he's any better in that sense. Not that charisma is the be all and end all, but still, very cold performance.

    PS _ I hope someone knows the answers to peterelectionfollowr's questions, as I have no the slightest idea and they seem pretty intriguing.

    Goldsmith is better looking than Boris but less charismatic and sharp. Khan is not charismatic but is ruthless
    London going for a dull mayor after the first four terms I guess. Unless they go crazy and elect Galloway I suppose.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,901

    isam said:

    I never really look at match odds markets in football, but did this week and think Everton and West Ham look nice bets

    Leicester to win ;-)

    Trust in the tinkerman, he will beat Soton away and 5.1 on Betfair.
    Yeah I've backed that

    I did a lucky 15! Oldskool!
  • Options
    Nigel4England and isam

    I follow lower league football as well as politics. I fancy Rochdale to bounce back from 2 defeats for draw at Bury. In my opinion 4 possible draws at Southampton, Birmingham, Bury and Scunthorpe.
  • Options
    david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,419

    May I aska few questions on US elections please which I do follow but still need further guidance please.

    1. Do both major parties now consider make up of votes in Electoral College fair or is it perhaps slightly biased to Democrats? Was last change to EC 2012?
    2. Do Republicans still consider Precinct (constituency) boundaries favour Democrats for the General Election also in November 2016?
    3.Approximately how many primaries are Winner Takes All. I know key one is California.
    4. Does each state set its own rules for the state legislature and governors elections and timing or are they also in November of years with even number?

    Thanking you

    1. The EC allocations change according to the US census, though not directly due to the +2 each state receives. I don't know whether the parties consider it fair but there's no meaningful effort something that's Constitutionally defined. The winner-take-all aspect of virtually all states is probably less 'fair' but again, neither party in any state seems much inclined to change it.

    2. I doubt it. The Republicans have done well out of the current congressional districts, winning a comfortable majority in the House in 2012 on fewer votes than the Democrats.

    3. The best resource here is (IMO) The Green Papers. To be honest, I've not been through the schedules (the details differ between Dem and Rep), with enough thoroughness yet. I usually create a spreadsheet with the relevant details on but haven't got round to it yet. California will probably not be that key though. The race is usually over by the time it gets there and there'll probably only be one candidate standing by that point.

    4. Yes, they set their own rules. Election day nearly always coincides with the November Tuesday rule, though there are some run-off elections held later, and not all states hold all elections in even-numbered years.

    David Herdson

    Just another question if I may please ( I posted at 9.04 below):

    Do you know why first Caucus at Iowa and first Primary at New Hampshire are later this time round?

    Surely Iowa was Dec 2011 and NH Jan 2012?

    Thank you

    There's always a push between the party organisations, which don't like the primaries and caucuses too early, and the states, some of which like to up their prominence by moving earlier in the schedule. As Iowa and NH jealously guard their 'first in the nation' role, that can - and has - pushed them earlier and earlier. I've not followed the process this time but presumably there's been less (or none) of that kind of queue-jumping this time round, allowing a later start.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,901

    Nigel4England and isam

    I follow lower league football as well as politics. I fancy Rochdale to bounce back from 2 defeats for draw at Bury. In my opinion 4 possible draws at Southampton, Birmingham, Bury and Scunthorpe.

    Cheers
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,951
    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    Watching HIGNFY, Sadiq Khan is a bit lacking in charisma, even when making a potentially funny quip. I assume Goldsmith will probably be on at some point, and we'll see if he's any better in that sense. Not that charisma is the be all and end all, but still, very cold performance.

    PS _ I hope someone knows the answers to peterelectionfollowr's questions, as I have no the slightest idea and they seem pretty intriguing.

    Goldsmith is better looking than Boris but less charismatic and sharp. Khan is not charismatic but is ruthless
    London going for a dull mayor after the first four terms I guess. Unless they go crazy and elect Galloway I suppose.
    Indeed a narrow win for Khan is my best bet helped by the fact London is probably the most pro Corbyn region in the country
  • Options
    david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,419

    Another cracker by DavidH - it's a very good guide.

    I'd add

    11. The US media likes change and drama, just like our media. Be prepared for the position to change radically, as one or another story is blown up as the new highlight. We are more than 3 months away from a single votes being cast. In betting terms, that means don't stake the house on anyone right now.

    With regard to Biden, the general view has been that he's had a family tragedy and he needs to be cut some slack to decide in his own time. But I wonder if the chronic indecision is not starting to do real damage to his prospects. It's not so much that it's taking him forever to decide, as that a series of "he will decide by..." deadlines have slid by without a decision. He might be best off saying that at present that for all the familiar reasons he doesn't feel able to plunge himself into the primary battle. That leaves open the possibility that if Clinton implodes he could be the rescue candidate for the Democrats.

    Top pollster Zogby tells US newspaper that Biden has to decide this weekend:

    http://www.bostonherald.com/news_opinion/us_politics/2015/10/pollster_biden_must_make_up_his_mind_this_weekend
    Biden won't run.

    Or perhaps, Biden will only run if Hillary pulls out or is so seriously damaged that the party turns to him anyway. The only person who can defeat Hillary is herself at the moment and while the e-mail issue may blow up again, it seems that Sanders doesn't intend to make much of it and no-one else is in the game. All of which means I really can't see Hillary falling and hence Biden won't run. I don't honestly think he really wants it and if he did run it'd be more out of duty than anything else.
  • Options
    david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,419
    HYUFD said:

    David Herdson

    Just another question if I may please ( I posted at 9.04 below):

    Do you know why first Caucus at Iowa and first Primary at New Hampshire are later this time round?

    Surely Iowa was Dec 2011 and NH Jan 2012?

    Thank you

    Iowa and NH were in January 2012
    There was a possibility that Iowa would end up in 2011 when Michigan (I think?) was playing silly beggars (which would have meant that Iowa would have ended up with no delegates as a consequence!), but in the end some kind of sanity prevailed.
  • Options
    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    kle4 said:

    Watching HIGNFY, Sadiq Khan is a bit lacking in charisma, even when making a potentially funny quip. I assume Goldsmith will probably be on at some point, and we'll see if he's any better in that sense. Not that charisma is the be all and end all, but still, very cold performance.

    PS _ I hope someone knows the answers to peterelectionfollowr's questions, as I have no the slightest idea and they seem pretty intriguing.

    Sadiq Khan was looking quite embarrassed by the shambolic week in Labour. HIGNFY is worth watching this week for the first question alone, even for those who are not fans. Derision from the BBC is not what new Labour leaders usually get. The Corbyn/McDonnell carcrash is just too irresistable even for leftwing comedians.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,951

    May I aska few questions on US elections please which I do follow but still need further guidance please.

    1. Do both major parties now consider make up of votes in Electoral College fair or is it perhaps slightly biased to Democrats? Was last change to EC 2012?
    2. Do Republicans still consider Precinct (constituency) boundaries favour Democrats for the General Election also in November 2016?
    3.Approximately how many primaries are Winner Takes All. I know key one is California.
    4. Does each state set its own rules for the state legislature and governors elections and timing or are they also in November of years with even number?

    Thanking you

    1. The EC allocations change according to the US census, though not directly due to the +2 each state receives. I don't know whether the parties consider it fair but there's no meaningful effort something that's Constitutionally defined. The winner-take-all aspect of virtually all states is probably less 'fair' but again, neither party in any state seems much inclined to change it.

    2. I doubt it. The Republicans have done well out of the current congressional districts, winning a comfortable majority in the House in 2012 on fewer votes than the Democrats.

    3. The best resource here is (IMO) The Green Papers. To be honest, I've not been through the schedules (the details differ between Dem and Rep), with enough thoroughness yet. I usually create a spreadsheet with the relevant details on but haven't got round to it yet. California will probably not be that key though. The race is usually over by the time it gets there and there'll probably only be one candidate standing by that point.

    4. Yes, they set their own rules. Election day nearly always coincides with the November Tuesday rule, though there are some run-off elections held later, and not all states hold all elections in even-numbered years.

    David Herdson

    Just another question if I may please ( I posted at 9.04 below):

    Do you know why first Caucus at Iowa and first Primary at New Hampshire are later this time round?

    Surely Iowa was Dec 2011 and NH Jan 2012?

    Thank you

    There's always a push between the party organisations, which don't like the primaries and caucuses too early, and the states, some of which like to up their prominence by moving earlier in the schedule. As Iowa and NH jealously guard their 'first in the nation' role, that can - and has - pushed them earlier and earlier. I've not followed the process this time but presumably there's been less (or none) of that kind of queue-jumping this time round, allowing a later start.
    GOP states holding primaries and caucuses pre March 2016 must award delegates by PR after by WTA or PR
  • Options
    David Herdson


    Thank you for your help.

  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,951

    May I aska few questions on US elections please which I do follow but still need further guidance please.

    1. Do both major parties now consider make up of votes in Electoral College fair or is it perhaps slightly biased to Democrats? Was last change to EC 2012?
    2. Do Republicans still consider Precinct (constituency) boundaries favour Democrats for the General Election also in November 2016?
    3.Approximately how many primaries are Winner Takes All. I know key one is California.
    4. Does each state set its own rules for the state legislature and governors elections and timing or are they also in November of years with even number?

    Thanking you

    1. The EC allocations change according to the US census, though not directly due to the +2 each state receives. I don't know whether the parties consider it fair but there's no meaningful effort something that's Constitutionally defined. The winner-take-all aspect of virtually all states is probably less 'fair' but again, neither party in any state seems much inclined to change it.

    2. I doubt it. The Republicans have done well out of the current congressional districts, winning a comfortable majority in the House in 2012 on fewer votes than the Democrats.

    3. The best resource here is (IMO) The Green Papers. To be honest, I've not been through the schedules (the details differ between Dem and Rep), with enough thoroughness yet. I usually create a spreadsheet with the relevant details on but haven't got round to it yet. California will probably not be that key though. The race is usually over by the time it gets there and there'll probably only be one candidate standing by that point.

    4. Yes, they set their own rules. Election day nearly always coincides with the November Tuesday rule, though there are some run-off elections held later, and not all states hold all elections in even-numbered years.

    David Herdson

    Just another question if I may please ( I posted at 9.04 below):

    Do you know why first Caucus at Iowa and first Primary at New Hampshire are later this time round?

    Surely Iowa was Dec 2011 and NH Jan 2012?

    Thank you

    There's always a push between the party organisations, which don't like the primaries and caucuses too early, and the states, some of which like to up their prominence by moving earlier in the schedule. As Iowa and NH jealously guard their 'first in the nation' role, that can - and has - pushed them earlier and earlier. I've not followed the process this time but presumably there's been less (or none) of that kind of queue-jumping this time round, allowing a later start.
    The GOP have said that no primaries or caucuses in 2016 can take place earlier than February
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,855
    Right, can't be bothered with the cricket any more. It's a draw do we all agree?
    Heading out of the sun to find a bar showing Spurs v Liverpool!
  • Options

    Nigel4England and isam

    I follow lower league football as well as politics. I fancy Rochdale to bounce back from 2 defeats for draw at Bury. In my opinion 4 possible draws at Southampton, Birmingham, Bury and Scunthorpe.

    Thanks Peter, I think it may be a draw at Bury as well, but 1.95 DNB is big in my opinion.

    I like backing draws, French Ligue 2 is a happy hunting ground
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,280
    Conservatives on 102 seats and Liberals on 106 with 49 seats too close to call:

    http://www.electionprediction.org/2015_fed/index.php

    Today's Canadian Election Watch has the two neck and neck - Liberals at 129 and Conservatives at 128:

    http://cdnelectionwatch.blogspot.ca/

    Liberals have drifted slightly on Betfair to 1.18 but Conservatives still a bit of value at 5.0 IMHO

    Probably only 20 seats in it either way.
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,951

    HYUFD said:

    David Herdson

    Just another question if I may please ( I posted at 9.04 below):

    Do you know why first Caucus at Iowa and first Primary at New Hampshire are later this time round?

    Surely Iowa was Dec 2011 and NH Jan 2012?

    Thank you

    Iowa and NH were in January 2012
    There was a possibility that Iowa would end up in 2011 when Michigan (I think?) was playing silly beggars (which would have meant that Iowa would have ended up with no delegates as a consequence!), but in the end some kind of sanity prevailed.
    Indeed
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,951
    edited October 2015

    Conservatives on 102 seats and Liberals on 106 with 49 seats too close to call:

    http://www.electionprediction.org/2015_fed/index.php

    Today's Canadian Election Watch has the two neck and neck - Liberals at 129 and Conservatives at 128:

    http://cdnelectionwatch.blogspot.ca/

    Liberals have drifted slightly on Betfair to 1.18 but Conservatives still a bit of value at 5.0 IMHO

    Probably only 20 seats in it either way.

    CBC today projects Liberals 135, Tories 118, NDP 83

    Here are the latest polls over the last two days

    Nanos Liberals 37 Tories 31 NDP 23

    Leger Liberals 38 Tories 30 NDP 22

    Angus Reid Liberals 35 Tories 33 NDP 21

    Mainstreet Liberals 38 Tories 33 NDP 21
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    MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034
    Thanks, David, for an excellent article. As someone who has been on this site for 3 (coming up 4) US election cycles now, Number 1 on the list is the key. I've seen far too much extrapolation of British models onto the US system. As you say, it is 51 elections, and swing is not the measure - comparison district by district to last elections' results is how it's measured here.
  • Options
    MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    David Herdson

    Just another question if I may please ( I posted at 9.04 below):

    Do you know why first Caucus at Iowa and first Primary at New Hampshire are later this time round?

    Surely Iowa was Dec 2011 and NH Jan 2012?

    Thank you

    Iowa and NH were in January 2012
    There was a possibility that Iowa would end up in 2011 when Michigan (I think?) was playing silly beggars (which would have meant that Iowa would have ended up with no delegates as a consequence!), but in the end some kind of sanity prevailed.
    Indeed
    @PEF The reason is that it is not in the parties' interests to extend even further the primary process or to have it too early in relation to the actual election. Following the chaos in 2011 of other States trying to be more relevant in the nomination process by bidding to be first or at least very early, the two Parties sought to instill some discipline on the process. The GOP wanted a short, decisive primary process so that less money and time would be spent on attacking each other, and more of both would be available to attack the Dem nominee. I presume the same logic applies to the Dem process.

    Consequently, it was decided that States that go out of order would be heavily penalized by loss of delegates. States that go in order but opt for earlier in the process must, at least in the GOP race, allocate their delegates proportionally rather than winner takes all for the State.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,951
    MTimT said:

    Thanks, David, for an excellent article. As someone who has been on this site for 3 (coming up 4) US election cycles now, Number 1 on the list is the key. I've seen far too much extrapolation of British models onto the US system. As you say, it is 51 elections, and swing is not the measure - comparison district by district to last elections' results is how it's measured here.

    Only one candidate in the last 100 years has won the popular vote for the US presidency and failed to win the electoral college too, Al Gore and had he won just 500 more votes in Florida, the equivalent to the majority in a UK council by election, he would have won that too
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    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    HYUFD said:

    Conservatives on 102 seats and Liberals on 106 with 49 seats too close to call:

    http://www.electionprediction.org/2015_fed/index.php

    Today's Canadian Election Watch has the two neck and neck - Liberals at 129 and Conservatives at 128:

    http://cdnelectionwatch.blogspot.ca/

    Liberals have drifted slightly on Betfair to 1.18 but Conservatives still a bit of value at 5.0 IMHO

    Probably only 20 seats in it either way.

    CBC today projects Liberals 135, Tories 118, NDP 83

    Here are the latest polls over the last two days

    Nanos Liberals 37 Tories 31 NDP 23

    Leger Liberals 38 Tories 30 NDP 22

    Angus Reid Liberals 35 Tories 33 NDP 21

    Mainstreet Liberals 38 Tories 33 NDP 21
    From the betting point of view: are we going to get a further repeat of the shy Tories? Denmark, Israel, UK, Sindy ref....Canada?
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    MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034
    HYUFD said:


    GOP states holding primaries and caucuses pre March 2016 must award delegates by PR after by WTA or PR

    Not 'pre-March'. March 15 is the first date in the GOP race for winner takes all.
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    isamisam Posts: 40,901
    edited October 2015
    Sandpit said:

    Right, can't be bothered with the cricket any more. It's a draw do we all agree?
    Heading out of the sun to find a bar showing Spurs v Liverpool!

    Misbah gone, they're effectively 84-6! Get back in there
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    david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,419
    HYUFD said:

    MTimT said:

    Thanks, David, for an excellent article. As someone who has been on this site for 3 (coming up 4) US election cycles now, Number 1 on the list is the key. I've seen far too much extrapolation of British models onto the US system. As you say, it is 51 elections, and swing is not the measure - comparison district by district to last elections' results is how it's measured here.

    Only one candidate in the last 100 years has won the popular vote for the US presidency and failed to win the electoral college too, Al Gore and had he won just 500 more votes in Florida, the equivalent to the majority in a UK council by election, he would have won that too
    That's probably one example of history misleading. Until not long ago, there was a much more flexible electorate - the Electoral College landslides of 1964, 1972 and 1984 were on a scale almost inconceivable now. Many states, including huge ones like California, are pretty much written off before the campaign begins. Consequently, there can be a lot of votes in CA, NY and TX, to take but three, that go a long way in the national vote but have comparatively little impact in the ECV.

    Now you can argue - and to a large extent you'd be right to - that the swing in the shares in these states will still mirror the national swing and so the balance will be maintained. Quite probably. But campaigning and targeting is improving all the time and it a disproportionate swing in the key states is entirely possible.

    Also, by definition, it's only the close elections that can produce a reverse result and there aren't too many that land within, say 2%.
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    david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,419
    Ref the cricket, England can't do this, can they?
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    MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034
    isam said:

    Sandpit said:

    Right, can't be bothered with the cricket any more. It's a draw do we all agree?
    Heading out of the sun to find a bar showing Spurs v Liverpool!

    Misbah gone, they're effectively 84-6! Get back in there
    Now Riaz too. 7 down ...
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    MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034

    HYUFD said:

    MTimT said:

    Thanks, David, for an excellent article. As someone who has been on this site for 3 (coming up 4) US election cycles now, Number 1 on the list is the key. I've seen far too much extrapolation of British models onto the US system. As you say, it is 51 elections, and swing is not the measure - comparison district by district to last elections' results is how it's measured here.

    Only one candidate in the last 100 years has won the popular vote for the US presidency and failed to win the electoral college too, Al Gore and had he won just 500 more votes in Florida, the equivalent to the majority in a UK council by election, he would have won that too
    That's probably one example of history misleading. Until not long ago, there was a much more flexible electorate - the Electoral College landslides of 1964, 1972 and 1984 were on a scale almost inconceivable now. Many states, including huge ones like California, are pretty much written off before the campaign begins. Consequently, there can be a lot of votes in CA, NY and TX, to take but three, that go a long way in the national vote but have comparatively little impact in the ECV.

    Now you can argue - and to a large extent you'd be right to - that the swing in the shares in these states will still mirror the national swing and so the balance will be maintained. Quite probably. But campaigning and targeting is improving all the time and it a disproportionate swing in the key states is entirely possible.

    Also, by definition, it's only the close elections that can produce a reverse result and there aren't too many that land within, say 2%.
    David, indeed. I work a lot in safety. One of the problems is the low probability event. As they happen very infrequently, many organizations think that what they are doing is safe, because doing what they do has not resulted in the accident (yet). Using the metric of no accidents yet, they conclude that their process is safe. Sometimes using the wrong metric convinces you that you are right, even when in fact you are wrong.
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    MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034
    And make that 8. Babar for 1
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    david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,419
    MTimT said:

    isam said:

    Sandpit said:

    Right, can't be bothered with the cricket any more. It's a draw do we all agree?
    Heading out of the sun to find a bar showing Spurs v Liverpool!

    Misbah gone, they're effectively 84-6! Get back in there
    Now Riaz too. 7 down ...
    The draw now available at 1.22 . Seems top-side, despite Pakistan's current suicide tendency.
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    isamisam Posts: 40,901
    Wow they're all out!

    99 to win in 23 overs?

    Athens reckons light will go in about an hour...
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    isamisam Posts: 40,901
    isam said:

    Wow they're all out!

    99 to win in 23 overs?

    Athens reckons light will go in about an hour...

    19 overs apparently... England 4/5
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    MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034
    Wow! England set 99 to win. Who'da thunk?
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    isamisam Posts: 40,901
    edited October 2015
    MTimT said:

    Wow! England set 99 to win. Who'da thunk?

    Horrendous batting by Yusuf and Misbah... Wtf were they thinking?

    Throw in the dodgy run out... This isn't bent is it?
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    MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034
    Do you open with Stokes and Ali?
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    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,187
    isam said:

    MTimT said:

    Wow! England set 99 to win. Who'da thunk?

    Horrendous batting by Yusuf and Misbah... Wtf were they thinking?
    Makes you wonder, doesn't it?
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    maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,391
    Good pay-day for the Pakistan lads, or is that just what their fans tell themselves to excuse being a nation of bottle merchants? A shame we have to ask.
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    isamisam Posts: 40,901
    tlg86 said:

    isam said:

    MTimT said:

    Wow! England set 99 to win. Who'da thunk?

    Horrendous batting by Yusuf and Misbah... Wtf were they thinking?
    Makes you wonder, doesn't it?
    Our spinners just took 7 wickets in 2 sessions, I don't think knocking off 99 in 19 overs is going to be all that easy
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    isamisam Posts: 40,901
    maaarsh said:

    Good pay-day for the Pakistan lads, or is that just what their fans tell themselves to excuse being a nation of bottle merchants? A shame we have to ask.

    3 iffy dismissals
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    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,855
    Oh crap. I left early and missed the action. :(
    Ignore the overs, it will be dark in 50 minutes, was 17:40 last not when they came off.
    Can't see it myself but stranger things have happened.
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    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,187
    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    isam said:

    MTimT said:

    Wow! England set 99 to win. Who'da thunk?

    Horrendous batting by Yusuf and Misbah... Wtf were they thinking?
    Makes you wonder, doesn't it?
    Our spinners just took 7 wickets in 2 sessions, I don't think knocking off 99 in 19 overs is going to be all that easy
    You wouldn't need England to win to have made money today.
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    MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034
    MTimT said:

    Do you open with Stokes and Ali?

    Ali and Buttler. Not a bad guess.
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    maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,391
    What's the over/under - 10 overs?
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    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,607
    maaarsh said:

    Good pay-day for the Pakistan lads, or is that just what their fans tell themselves to excuse being a nation of bottle merchants? A shame we have to ask.

    That was my first thought as well. :/
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    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,855
    edited October 2015
    There's 40 mins of light left, and it will go dark very quickly. Can't happen, can it?

    If this happens I'm gonna feel like that Liverpool fan that left Istanbul at half time to miss the airport crowds :scream:
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    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,187
    The review is taking up time, should have walked.
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    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6697/sweden-collapse

    Sweden Close to Collapse.

    Serves them right!

    If the wave of migrants keeps coming, in 10-15 years, Swedes will be a minority in their own country. That there is, in fact, an exchange of populations going on, should be clear in any sober assessment.

    At a press conference October 9, Prime Minister Stefan Löfven said that Sweden is in a state of crisis. However, when asked to clarify what he meant by this, Löfven was unable to produce a single coherent sentence.
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    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    The end is nigh!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-34559706

    Wild dust storm rolls over US city of Phoenix
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    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,855
    edited October 2015
    Betfair is 1.9 v 2.1 in favour of the draw. Take your pick or even up your book. I'm on the draw, it will be dark in half an hour and the bowlers will be as slow as they can get away with being.
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    maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,391
    Left right combo is a mistake; every single costs 90 seconds.
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    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,855
    This would have been very different if we had declared overnight.
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    david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,419
    Sandpit said:

    Betfair is 1.9 v 2.1 in favour of the draw. Take your pick or even up your book. I'm on the draw, it will be dark in half an hour and the bowlers will be as slow as they can get away with being.

    There'll be a few people who backed the draw at 1.01 who'll be a bit nervous here! England also traded as high as 129/1.
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    DairDair Posts: 6,108
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    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,855
    Floodlights on now. Latest play in first four days was 17:37. 17 minutes to go on that basis.
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    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    Sandpit said:

    Floodlights on now. Latest play in first four days was 17:37. 17 minutes to go on that basis.

    Isn't the first option with the batting team, so that England and Wales can just flail it about knowing they can safely call it if they run out of wickets?
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    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,187
    Dair said:

    Sandpit said:

    Floodlights on now. Latest play in first four days was 17:37. 17 minutes to go on that basis.

    Isn't the first option with the batting team, so that England and Wales can just flail it about knowing they can safely call it if they run out of wickets?
    Not anymore. The umpires make the call and that's that.
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    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    tlg86 said:

    Dair said:

    Sandpit said:

    Floodlights on now. Latest play in first four days was 17:37. 17 minutes to go on that basis.

    Isn't the first option with the batting team, so that England and Wales can just flail it about knowing they can safely call it if they run out of wickets?
    Not anymore. The umpires make the call and that's that.
    So it will depend if whoever paid the Pakistani team also slipped an envelope to the Umps?
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    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,855
    edited October 2015
    Dair said:

    tlg86 said:

    Dair said:

    Sandpit said:

    Floodlights on now. Latest play in first four days was 17:37. 17 minutes to go on that basis.

    Isn't the first option with the batting team, so that England and Wales can just flail it about knowing they can safely call it if they run out of wickets?
    Not anymore. The umpires make the call and that's that.
    So it will depend if whoever paid the Pakistani team also slipped an envelope to the Umps?
    Unfortunately too many matches involving Pakistan still have somewhat unusual endings. Shame that it keeps being mentioned. Betfair have £16m on this match, I'm on for very small money compared to the ashes where we all knew both teams were going all out to win.

    Can't be more than a couple of overs to go now, it will be properly dark in 15 mins.
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    The_ApocalypseThe_Apocalypse Posts: 7,830
    edited October 2015
    Just seen the previous thread; this tax credits debate is getting messy.

    And SeanT is the reason why I wouldn't touch older men with a barge pole as far dating goes. Likely to be very right wing (and a bit scary with it as well).
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    david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,419
    Dair said:

    tlg86 said:

    Dair said:

    Sandpit said:

    Floodlights on now. Latest play in first four days was 17:37. 17 minutes to go on that basis.

    Isn't the first option with the batting team, so that England and Wales can just flail it about knowing they can safely call it if they run out of wickets?
    Not anymore. The umpires make the call and that's that.
    So it will depend if whoever paid the Pakistani team also slipped an envelope to the Umps?
    The good thing about Pakistan cheating by going so slowly now is that it means that they're not trying to lose.
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    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,187

    Dair said:

    tlg86 said:

    Dair said:

    Sandpit said:

    Floodlights on now. Latest play in first four days was 17:37. 17 minutes to go on that basis.

    Isn't the first option with the batting team, so that England and Wales can just flail it about knowing they can safely call it if they run out of wickets?
    Not anymore. The umpires make the call and that's that.
    So it will depend if whoever paid the Pakistani team also slipped an envelope to the Umps?
    The good thing about Pakistan cheating by going so slowly now is that it means that they're not trying to lose.
    Covering their tracks? Why bring on the quick when the spinners were doing alright?
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    MarkHopkinsMarkHopkins Posts: 5,584

    Just seen the previous thread; this tax credits debate is getting messy.

    And SeanT is the reason why I wouldn't touch older men with a barge pole as far dating goes. Likely to be very right wing (and a bit scary with it as well).


    Corbyn is an older man. And I'm reasonably certain he's not right wing.

    But is he scary?

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    richardDoddrichardDodd Posts: 5,472
    apocalypse...Thank heaven for older men...who are eternally grateful for being unattractive to young female dimwits..
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    david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,419
    tlg86 said:

    Dair said:

    tlg86 said:

    Dair said:

    Sandpit said:

    Floodlights on now. Latest play in first four days was 17:37. 17 minutes to go on that basis.

    Isn't the first option with the batting team, so that England and Wales can just flail it about knowing they can safely call it if they run out of wickets?
    Not anymore. The umpires make the call and that's that.
    So it will depend if whoever paid the Pakistani team also slipped an envelope to the Umps?
    The good thing about Pakistan cheating by going so slowly now is that it means that they're not trying to lose.
    Covering their tracks? Why bring on the quick when the spinners were doing alright?
    Presumably to encourage the umpire to call for light? Didn't work though.
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,951

    Just seen the previous thread; this tax credits debate is getting messy.

    And SeanT is the reason why I wouldn't touch older men with a barge pole as far dating goes. Likely to be very right wing (and a bit scary with it as well).

    SeanT is rich though as statistically older men are more likely to be and as Mrs Merton said to Debbie McGee 'what first attracted you to the millionaire Paul Daniels'
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    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,187

    tlg86 said:

    Dair said:

    tlg86 said:

    Dair said:

    Sandpit said:

    Floodlights on now. Latest play in first four days was 17:37. 17 minutes to go on that basis.

    Isn't the first option with the batting team, so that England and Wales can just flail it about knowing they can safely call it if they run out of wickets?
    Not anymore. The umpires make the call and that's that.
    So it will depend if whoever paid the Pakistani team also slipped an envelope to the Umps?
    The good thing about Pakistan cheating by going so slowly now is that it means that they're not trying to lose.
    Covering their tracks? Why bring on the quick when the spinners were doing alright?
    Presumably to encourage the umpire to call for light? Didn't work though.
    Fair point. As I said earlier, you don't need to throw a game of cricket to make money on it.
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    @richardDodd They aren't like that on the DM comments section. Or indeed, in my exprience of them in real life.

    Just seen the previous thread; this tax credits debate is getting messy.

    And SeanT is the reason why I wouldn't touch older men with a barge pole as far dating goes. Likely to be very right wing (and a bit scary with it as well).


    Corbyn is an older man. And I'm reasonably certain he's not right wing.

    But is he scary?

    Corbyn is a bit weird, and tbh some his ideas and who he is associated with, does make him scary in a way.
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    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,855
    TV cameras make it look much lighter than it actually is.
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    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,818

    Just seen the previous thread; this tax credits debate is getting messy.

    And SeanT is the reason why I wouldn't touch older men with a barge pole as far dating goes. Likely to be very right wing (and a bit scary with it as well).


    Corbyn is an older man. And I'm reasonably certain he's not right wing.

    But is he scary?

    Not as scary as SeanT for sure
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,951
    edited October 2015

    HYUFD said:

    Conservatives on 102 seats and Liberals on 106 with 49 seats too close to call:

    http://www.electionprediction.org/2015_fed/index.php

    Today's Canadian Election Watch has the two neck and neck - Liberals at 129 and Conservatives at 128:

    http://cdnelectionwatch.blogspot.ca/

    Liberals have drifted slightly on Betfair to 1.18 but Conservatives still a bit of value at 5.0 IMHO

    Probably only 20 seats in it either way.

    CBC today projects Liberals 135, Tories 118, NDP 83

    Here are the latest polls over the last two days

    Nanos Liberals 37 Tories 31 NDP 23

    Leger Liberals 38 Tories 30 NDP 22

    Angus Reid Liberals 35 Tories 33 NDP 21

    Mainstreet Liberals 38 Tories 33 NDP 21
    From the betting point of view: are we going to get a further repeat of the shy Tories? Denmark, Israel, UK, Sindy ref....Canada?
    Even if there was I expect Trudeau would still win. He now has a clear lead in the polls while final polls in the UK, Israel and Denmark had it tied. In Sindy final polls had No ahead. This election seems more JFK v Nixon or Obama v McCain or Rudd v Howard than Cameron v Ed Miliband or Netanyahu v Herzog

    In Greece in September or the US in 2012 there were arguably shy Syriza or Obama voters albeit both were incumbents
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    maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,391
    Poor final batting show. With 11 overs we should have got close enough to make it a much more awkward discussion for the umpires.
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,581
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Conservatives on 102 seats and Liberals on 106 with 49 seats too close to call:

    http://www.electionprediction.org/2015_fed/index.php

    Today's Canadian Election Watch has the two neck and neck - Liberals at 129 and Conservatives at 128:

    http://cdnelectionwatch.blogspot.ca/

    Liberals have drifted slightly on Betfair to 1.18 but Conservatives still a bit of value at 5.0 IMHO

    Probably only 20 seats in it either way.

    CBC today projects Liberals 135, Tories 118, NDP 83

    Here are the latest polls over the last two days

    Nanos Liberals 37 Tories 31 NDP 23

    Leger Liberals 38 Tories 30 NDP 22

    Angus Reid Liberals 35 Tories 33 NDP 21

    Mainstreet Liberals 38 Tories 33 NDP 21
    From the betting point of view: are we going to get a further repeat of the shy Tories? Denmark, Israel, UK, Sindy ref....Canada?
    Even if there was I expect Trudeau would still win. He now has a clear lead on the polls while final polls in the UK, Israel and Denmark had it tied. In Sindy final polls had No ahead. This election seems more JFK v Nixon or Obama v McCain or Rudd v Howard than Cameron v Ed Miliband or Netanyahu v Herzog
    I'm wondering if NDP supporters might vote tactically for the Libs to ensure that the Tories don't get most seats. The momentum appears to be with the Pretty Boy.
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    edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,141
    Good piece but I'm not convinced about the whole "51 elections" thing. I haven't done anything systematic on this but it seemed like the national polling + UNS was pretty good last time, whereas the state polling was all over the shop. And I remember in 2008 guys like RodCrosby and Nate Silver did pretty well projecting the state primaries by extrapolating demographics from the first few, so it doesn't really seem like they're all unique snowflakes.
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