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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Generally on days like this George Osborne improves his Bet

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    You missed "RAF pilots flying Sea Harriers in 1982" :smile:

    Were there any, Mr. Cooke? I didn't think so, but I am happy to be corrected. There were certainly RAF pilots driving the ground attack version of the aeroplane off the decks of Hermes and Invincible, but I am not aware that there were any driving the Sea Harriers, which were, of course, the aeroplanes which scored the kills. :)

    23 Argentine planes were downed air-to-air
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    I take it the rest of his response was dire as well?.

    In a word, Yes.
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,413



    They've done some, but sadly they seem keener to strike Kurdish targets. In this, they're very much like Russia, who seem keen to hit any anti-Assad forces aside from ISIL, who are mostly in the 'wrong' part of the country for their aims.

    How many times have Lebanon? Jordan?

    No, they are not like Russia in this, Russia never claimed to be solely hitting ISIS targets (for the 55th time). They have been asked by Syria in accordance with international law, to provide military assistance against an islamist insurgency, and this is what they are doing. They are working with such elements of the FSA as are willing to work with them.

    The Turks on the other hand are part of an 'Anti-ISIS Coalition' and are using this as a cloak to illegally fly into Syria and have a pop at their regional enemies, who are fighting ISIS. Along with the Saudis, Turkey's leadership seems determined for it to become the unnacceptable face of Muslim nationhood.
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    Can you just imagine Malcolm Tucker's reaction to this?
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    philiphphiliph Posts: 4,704

    philiph said:

    The Russians who follow me on facebook seem universally angry with Turkey (OK only a small sample of 12 or 15).

    From what I see I wouldn't be shocked if Russian citizens implement a voluntary and total ban on Turkish products. They are very Nationalistic and proud and protective of the Russian nation and heritage.

    I suspect that a quiet pullback over the Donbass, so Russian tourists could get to the EU a little easier would be good for both Russian holidaymakers and for the Greek tourist economy.
    And annoy the Turks far more than if they went to Spain or elsewhere
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    New Thread New Thread

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    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548



    You missed "RAF pilots flying Sea Harriers in 1982" :smile:

    Were there any, Mr. Cooke? I didn't think so, but I am happy to be corrected. There were certainly RAF pilots driving the ground attack version of the aeroplane off the decks of Hermes and Invincible, but I am not aware that there were any driving the Sea Harriers, which were, of course, the aeroplanes which scored the kills. :)

    23 Argentine planes were downed air-to-air
    The wikipedia page seems a littele ambiguous. Weren't some Argentinian planes shot down by SAM's rather than air to air?
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,917
    Pong said:

    The government has quietly announced that it is hitting students in the pocket, by not raising the threshold for repaying their loans.

    The BIS department says:

    To reduce government debt, the student loan repayment threshold for Plan 2 borrowers will be frozen until April 2021.

    Disgraceful - a commercial loan provider would never be allowed to retrospectively change terms like this.

    George Osborne has also stabbed Martin Lewis in the back bigtime.

    He was taken onboard by the government to sell (ahem, "educate") would be students about the new tuition fees in 2011.

    "Repeatedly during the process (and since) I asked for assurances of the continuation of the uprating from 2017, and was promised it directly – it formed a major part of the calculations and explanations I gave out. I was also promised there would be no retrospective changes for anyone under the 2012+ system."

    http://blog.moneysavingexpert.com/2015/01/09/a-deliberate-threat-to-the-government-u-turn-on-the-21000-student-loan-repayment-threshold-i-will-organise-mass-protest/?_ga=1.77753373.822395506.1447680360
    The 2012+ system looks to me pretty damned awful, 99 -> 11 cohort on much better terms.
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    Can you just imagine Malcolm Tucker's reaction to this?

    As requested...

    http://hipsterttoi.tumblr.com/post/34021386273
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    chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    edited November 2015

    chestnut said:

    Looking at the demographic intent on voting Corbyn, most of them weren't born when Mao was alive. It'll be culturally irrelevant to most of them, though obviously if you're 40+ it's different.

    Al Murray has been getting grief from those kind of idiots for daring to say that Mao wasn't the sort of person whose side he would take.
    Curiously enough, I had a conversation with Mrs Chestnut's prospective son-in-law the other day. He's not far short of thirty.

    It started with him talking about a young Lithuanian woman he works with having no idea who Abba and Michael Jackson were.

    At which point, the history and cultural effect of the Soviet bloc was discussed.

    Nearly 30, and he had virtually no concept of the fact that large chunks of Europe lived a bit like North Korea as recently as the 1980s.

    God knows what 'education,education,education' was doing when he was at school.
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    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,977



    They've done some, but sadly they seem keener to strike Kurdish targets. In this, they're very much like Russia, who seem keen to hit any anti-Assad forces aside from ISIL, who are mostly in the 'wrong' part of the country for their aims.

    How many times have Lebanon? Jordan?

    No, they are not like Russia in this, Russia never claimed to be solely hitting ISIS targets (for the 55th time). They have been asked by Syria in accordance with international law, to provide military assistance against an islamist insurgency, and this is what they are doing. They are working with such elements of the FSA as are willing to work with them.

    The Turks on the other hand are part of an 'Anti-ISIS Coalition' and are using this as a cloak to illegally fly into Syria and have a pop at their regional enemies, who are fighting ISIS. Along with the Saudis, Turkey's leadership seems determined for it to become the unnacceptable face of Muslim nationhood.
    If Russia are going after an Islamist insurgency, how come they've been hitting the Kurds and Turkmens more than ISIS? The answer is simple: they want to preserve Assad so their interests in the ME are preserved. If ISIS is a pretence for Turkey, it is also a pretence for Russia.

    And Russia's becoming the unacceptable face of nationhood, full stop. Georgia, Crimea, Ukraine, MH17, Litvinenko. The list goes on and on.
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    HurstLlamaHurstLlama Posts: 9,098



    You missed "RAF pilots flying Sea Harriers in 1982" :smile:

    Were there any, Mr. Cooke? I didn't think so, but I am happy to be corrected. There were certainly RAF pilots driving the ground attack version of the aeroplane off the decks of Hermes and Invincible, but I am not aware that there were any driving the Sea Harriers, which were, of course, the aeroplanes which scored the kills. :)

    23 Argentine planes were downed air-to-air



    You missed "RAF pilots flying Sea Harriers in 1982" :smile:

    Were there any, Mr. Cooke? I didn't think so, but I am happy to be corrected. There were certainly RAF pilots driving the ground attack version of the aeroplane off the decks of Hermes and Invincible, but I am not aware that there were any driving the Sea Harriers, which were, of course, the aeroplanes which scored the kills. :)

    23 Argentine planes were downed air-to-air
    Yes, I know Cap'n Doc, but by whom? I don't think the Crabs got a look in, because they were flying the ground attack aeroplanes.

    To be fair to the RAF, you can't win a fight unless you are in a fight and the RAF fighters haven't been in an air-to-air fight since 1945. No doubt this is because any enemy has not dared to come up against them, so fearsome is their reputation Or possibly because they have made every call about equipment and role wrong since, at least, 1945 and arguably since 1918.
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    Charles said:

    What twaddle. George is positioning himself in the centre for career purposes and to win votes for the Tories.

    20% leads coming up? The Tories must have judged that Corbyn is dug in well enough now.

    Corbyn is successfully moving the Conservatives to the Left.
    It's not twaddle. This budget is one that shows a shift in Conservative thinking to the left from that of 12 months ago badged under 'one nation'.

    Funnily enough, I see the objective of the Conservative Party as to advance the cause of Conservatism in this country. Not as a game of chess that aims to maximise the vote count for the blue team.

    I appreciate others, including Osborne, may think differently.
    But if you do a calculation whereby there is a range 0 [Blair] to 100 [true Kipper] on the "conservative scale" and a percentage of time (between 0% and 100%) when the Conservatives will be in government

    Logically the second outcome - Osborne's strategy - is better for the country if you believe in the Conservative ideal
    But you can play that argument both ways: not that I'm arguing for this but if Corbyn is as unelectable as everyone says he is then the Conservatives could move as far to the Right as they like and still win.

    So if you wanted to radically reshape the country to a Conservative vision, now's the time.
    Better in June 2020, with a 100-seat majority, surely? If you think there's still a big enough market for social conservatism, Corbyn has shown you the way. There's [probably] going to be an election for a 6+ year PM in 2019, between two candidates, likely George Osborne and someone a fair distance to his right. You'd have thought people would be falling over themselves to get into the electorate.
    The thing is I don't believe Osborne has some secret Conservative agenda that he's waiting to unleash as soon as his vote and parliamentary majority is big enough. He came of political age in the 1990s and is obsessed by the work of his idols who formed the New Labour project, together with their political tactical positioning obsessions.

    I will vote for the most credible sensible Conservative candidate for leader in 2019. That doesn't make me Philip Hollobone style ideologue. I recognise office is a necessary precursor to power, but i disagree with the current leadership's definition of the centre ground (unless it's an unrepresentative metropolitan socially-liberal middle-class one) and their political priorities.

    The argument that we have to pick an uber-moderniser or risk defeat to Labour is a false one IMHO.
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    You missed "RAF pilots flying Sea Harriers in 1982" :smile:

    Were there any, Mr. Cooke? I didn't think so, but I am happy to be corrected. There were certainly RAF pilots driving the ground attack version of the aeroplane off the decks of Hermes and Invincible, but I am not aware that there were any driving the Sea Harriers, which were, of course, the aeroplanes which scored the kills. :)

    23 Argentine planes were downed air-to-air
    The wikipedia page seems a littele ambiguous. Weren't some Argentinian planes shot down by SAM's rather than air to air?
    Air to air victories in that list, the one I posted:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post–World_War_II_air-to-air_combat_losses
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    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195

    https://www.rt.com/news/323431-saved-pilot-turkish-su24/

    Surviving Russian pilot flatly denies Turkey incursion. They did seem to take a while before interviewing him though - on balance this is what I would expect him to say, and I still think they may have nipped into Turkish airspace. Which of course wouldn't make Turkey's pre-meditated actions justifiable.

    And neither does it make Russia's actions in encroaching into Tirkish airspace again with a warplane entering from a warzone.

    It's quite simple. How do you think Russia would react if a plane had encroached their airspace for a similar reason?

    If you want to look at premeditation, the answer's Russia. They knew this would happen, and appear to have done f'all to avoid it.
    Is I recall the Russians did shoot down a U2 for an incursion into their airspace.

    Incidentally when did one military aircraft last shoot down another in the air? I recall that the RAF last did in 1945. Perhaps the Israelis in the Yom Kippur war?
    Lots of examples, such as

    Falklands war
    Israel vs Syria - for example 1982
    Gulf War 1
    Iran / iraq war

This discussion has been closed.