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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Those who actually vote are getting older and this has big

SystemSystem Posts: 11,017
edited February 2016 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Those who actually vote are getting older and this has big political implications

The chart above is from the Intergenerational Fairness Foundation (IF) a think tank researches fairness between generations. It believes “that, while increasing longevity is welcome, government policy must be fair to all generations – old, young or those to come.”

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • Options
    Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865
    First
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    Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865
    edited February 2016
    Sorry O/T so quick but it Looks like Mr Assange may be leaving the embassy tomorrow dependent on a UN committee meeting deciding if UK has infringed his rights by holding him in technical detention despite asylum being granted.

    Mmmmm.... I wonder what the outcome will be.
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    BromptonautBromptonaut Posts: 1,113
    If Cameron's deal affects the future operation of the EU how come it gets zero mention in the press outside the UK? http://mobile.lemonde.fr for example.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,917
    Moses_ said:

    Sorry O/T so quick but it Looks like Mr Assange may be leaving the embassy tomorrow dependent on a UN committee meeting deciding if UK has infringed his rights by holding him in technical detention despite asylum being granted.

    Mmmmm.... I wonder what the outcome will be.

    I reckon Britain half hopes they find in Assange's favour. How many millions a year do we spend on his policing ?
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    Sounds like common sense. People who bother to participate in politics have more say in politics.

    Mr. Moses, the UN's a crock of shit. I recall them bleating about the human rights of squatters at a farm (Dale Farm?) who had occupied it illegally for a decade.

    Is Saudi Arabia still chairing the human rights committee, or similar?
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    Mr. Pulpstar, none, the officers on duty watching the embassy were withdrawn a few months ago, I think.
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    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,959

    If Cameron's deal affects the future operation of the EU how come it gets zero mention in the press outside the UK? http://mobile.lemonde.fr for example.

    @SeanT posted a story from the Spanish press yesterday, saying the deal was terrible for Spain as its government/the EU had caved on everything.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,917

    Mr. Pulpstar, none, the officers on duty watching the embassy were withdrawn a few months ago, I think.

    Good !

    I couldn't give a monkeys either way then.
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    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,959

    Sounds like common sense. People who bother to participate in politics have more say in politics.

    Mr. Moses, the UN's a crock of shit. I recall them bleating about the human rights of squatters at a farm (Dale Farm?) who had occupied it illegally for a decade.

    Is Saudi Arabia still chairing the human rights committee, or similar?

    Quoth Enoch Powell:

    "It is conventional to refer to the United Nations in hushed tones of respect and awe, as if it were the repository of justice and equity, speaking almost with the voice of God if not yet acting with the power of God. It is no such thing. Despite the fair-seeming terminology of its charter and its declarations, the reality both of the Assembly and of the Security Council is a concourse of self-seeking nations, obeying their own prejudices and pursuing their own interests. They have not changed their individual natures by being aggregated with others in a system of bogus democracy."
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    Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865
    Pulpstar said:

    Moses_ said:

    Sorry O/T so quick but it Looks like Mr Assange may be leaving the embassy tomorrow dependent on a UN committee meeting deciding if UK has infringed his rights by holding him in technical detention despite asylum being granted.

    Mmmmm.... I wonder what the outcome will be.

    I reckon Britain half hopes they find in Assange's favour. How many millions a year do we spend on his policing ?
    Yes agree at least he will be gone.

    It's all the implications and repercussions of such a decision though and "compo" etc etc. There's always compo to be got.

    @mrmorris... Indeed a modern day League of Nations for what is has prevented
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    Morning all.

    ‘individual voter registration are exacerbating the age balance movement’

    Not sure what that even means, are there any examples for this.
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    Mr. Pulpstar, none, the officers on duty watching the embassy were withdrawn a few months ago, I think.

    It was a cushy number for them when they were there.
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    Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    edited February 2016
    He really nails the UN.

    There's some great background on the Security Council nonsense too. It's all political bollocks. But it matters because of the power that flows from historic fixes.
    rcs1000 said:

    Sounds like common sense. People who bother to participate in politics have more say in politics.

    Mr. Moses, the UN's a crock of shit. I recall them bleating about the human rights of squatters at a farm (Dale Farm?) who had occupied it illegally for a decade.

    Is Saudi Arabia still chairing the human rights committee, or similar?

    Quoth Enoch Powell:

    "It is conventional to refer to the United Nations in hushed tones of respect and awe, as if it were the repository of justice and equity, speaking almost with the voice of God if not yet acting with the power of God. It is no such thing. Despite the fair-seeming terminology of its charter and its declarations, the reality both of the Assembly and of the Security Council is a concourse of self-seeking nations, obeying their own prejudices and pursuing their own interests. They have not changed their individual natures by being aggregated with others in a system of bogus democracy."
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    Mr. StClare, presumably most of the fictional voters were young :p
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    rcs1000 said:

    Sounds like common sense. People who bother to participate in politics have more say in politics.

    Mr. Moses, the UN's a crock of shit. I recall them bleating about the human rights of squatters at a farm (Dale Farm?) who had occupied it illegally for a decade.

    Is Saudi Arabia still chairing the human rights committee, or similar?

    Quoth Enoch Powell:

    "It is conventional to refer to the United Nations in hushed tones of respect and awe, as if it were the repository of justice and equity, speaking almost with the voice of God if not yet acting with the power of God. It is no such thing. Despite the fair-seeming terminology of its charter and its declarations, the reality both of the Assembly and of the Security Council is a concourse of self-seeking nations, obeying their own prejudices and pursuing their own interests. They have not changed their individual natures by being aggregated with others in a system of bogus democracy."
    All :Peebies know that the voice of Enoch is the voice of God :o

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    BromptonautBromptonaut Posts: 1,113
    rcs1000 said:

    If Cameron's deal affects the future operation of the EU how come it gets zero mention in the press outside the UK? http://mobile.lemonde.fr for example.

    @SeanT posted a story from the Spanish press yesterday, saying the deal was terrible for Spain as its government/the EU had caved on everything.
    Way down the page on today's El Pais. Hardly setting the Continent on fire, is it?
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    FPT



    Immigration is only a factor in the Brexit referendum if Leave wants out of the EEA too.


    this is only true if voters actually read the question
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    richardDoddrichardDodd Posts: 5,472
    Surely the UN would be obliged to hand over Assange to Sweden for trial..or be seen to be protecting a potential criminal
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,986
    edited February 2016
    After opposing TTIP in the Commons yesterday and refusing to back the 'emergency brake' a Labour source has told the Times 'Jeremy is instinctively an Outer but he did a deal in September ' while a Labour MP said 'I am quite happy to leave this to David Cameron it is his referendum and he is quite good at selling it.' EU ref could see Labour backbenchers cheering on Cameron while Tory backbenchers find themselves unusually sympathetic to Corbyn
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,413

    Mr. Pulpstar, none, the officers on duty watching the embassy were withdrawn a few months ago, I think.

    I thought they were just put on a lower rotation.
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    Morning all.

    ‘individual voter registration are exacerbating the age balance movement’

    Not sure what that even means, are there any examples for this.

    It would not be surprising as it follows from younger people being more likely to move.
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    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,331
    I do wish the Mail would stop being so mealy-mouthed and say what they think...

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-3430870/DAILY-MAIL-COMMENT-speak-England.html
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited February 2016
    Moses_ said:

    Sorry O/T so quick but it Looks like Mr Assange may be leaving the embassy tomorrow dependent on a UN committee meeting deciding if UK has infringed his rights by holding him in technical detention despite asylum being granted.

    Mmmmm.... I wonder what the outcome will be.

    Somebody thinks they are above the law & I am not talking about Batwomen this time...

    Although After last night's documentary of her there surely has to be a police investigation..she admitted on camera to actions if a normally company director had been found doing would be in serious trouble.
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    Huzzah for oldies.
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    Always knew an English Parliament was a bad idea, now Tristram Hunt is in favour of it

    http://labourlist.org/2016/02/the-labour-party-has-a-problem-we-need-a-solution-to-the-english-question/
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Morning all.

    ‘individual voter registration are exacerbating the age balance movement’

    Not sure what that even means, are there any examples for this.

    It means kids these days are lazy sods who can't be bothered to get registered...
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    Innocent_AbroadInnocent_Abroad Posts: 3,294
    edited February 2016

    I do wish the Mail would stop being so mealy-mouthed and say what they think...

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-3430870/DAILY-MAIL-COMMENT-speak-England.html

    If the Daily Wail - or anyone else - thinks that we'll be able to "control" our borders by voting in a referendum, they need to wake and smell the coffee. Such control as we have comes from our island status.

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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Surely the UN would be obliged to hand over Assange to Sweden for trial..or be seen to be protecting a potential criminal

    They always have the "he hates America he must be good" get out of jail card
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited February 2016
    Charles said:

    Morning all.

    ‘individual voter registration are exacerbating the age balance movement’

    Not sure what that even means, are there any examples for this.

    It means kids these days are lazy sods who can't be bothered to get registered...
    I had to do it for ge2015. It took 2 mins online. It was totally painless & I was pleasantly surprised just how simple it was. If 18-24 year olds all.with their smartphones can't find those 2 mins I am not sure they will have spent any time thinking about the potential outcomes of using their vote.

    The new system is absolutely no barrier. Anybody who says otherwise is just lying & trying to push a myth.
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    Mr. Eagles, even a stopped clock is right twice a day.

    Mr. 1983, the story I read was, from memory, that they'd been withdrawn. Could be wrong, I'm not a policeman myself.
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    Pop quiz hot shots.

    Q: With which age segment does Corbyn do worst with ?

    A: The older voters

    Iff Corbyn leads Labour at the next election, Labour will feel like the Bulgars after the Battle of Kleidion
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    Charles said:

    Morning all.

    ‘individual voter registration are exacerbating the age balance movement’

    Not sure what that even means, are there any examples for this.

    It means kids these days are lazy sods who can't be bothered to get registered...
    I had to do it for ge2015. It took 2 mins online. It was totally painless & I was pleasantly surprised just how simple it was. If 18-24 year olds all.with their smartphones can't find those 2 mins I am not sure they will have spent any time thinking about the potential outcomes of using their vote.

    The new system is absolutely no barrier. Anybody who says otherwise is just lying & trying to push a myth.
    I think that is only true for able-bodied people.

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    stodgestodge Posts: 12,850
    Morning all :)

    The question isn't purely one of age but of life and life experiences. If it is those experiences which inform one's political outlook rather than simply the passing of years, it would be reasonable to suppose that as the average age of women having children rises and the age when people marry rises as well (as examples), the politics of youth and youthful experience would be extended as well.

    If voting Conservative is a sign of maturity and experience (and that's debatable), then if that maturity and experience is postponed presumably the voting is also postponed. I note for example the continuing anti-Conservative bulge in the 55-64 age group (those whose youth and formative years were under Margaret Thatcher) and I wonder if there will be a corresponding pro-Conservative bulge in the 35-44 age group (those who were young under Blair) and whether that will be perpetuated.

    If so, the premise of the article is invalid as the argument will be that the life experiences of your youth formulate your political outlook as you get older which is itself a shift away from "my parents voted Labour so I vote Labour" or whatever. As those whose politics was formed on a familial or cultural basis die off and those whose politics were formed differently come through I suspect we may see more dynamic voting patterns across the generations.

    On a complete tangent, I attended a Conference yesterday where the key note speaker was Matt Hancock. one of Osborne's acolytes and, one might conjecture, a possible for a senior Cabinet post in an Osborne-led Government. I've heard him speak before and found him engaging, thoughtful and intelligent. Yesterday he was almost incoherent, waffling and uncertain. Not sure if that was external factors but a deeply unimpressive performance.
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    RobDRobD Posts: 58,962
    edited February 2016

    Charles said:

    Morning all.

    ‘individual voter registration are exacerbating the age balance movement’

    Not sure what that even means, are there any examples for this.

    It means kids these days are lazy sods who can't be bothered to get registered...
    I had to do it for ge2015. It took 2 mins online. It was totally painless & I was pleasantly surprised just how simple it was. If 18-24 year olds all.with their smartphones can't find those 2 mins I am not sure they will have spent any time thinking about the potential outcomes of using their vote.

    The new system is absolutely no barrier. Anybody who says otherwise is just lying & trying to push a myth.
    I think that is only true for able-bodied people.

    Surely there are provisions in place for such people who are not?
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    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,973
    As I said a few weeks ago, I was taking part in my own form of "Dry January". I managed the entire month with no alcohol, crisps or Red Bull.

    So was I feeling healthier, wealthier and happier on February 1st after the month's abstinence? Was I heck.

    Instead I was rushed into hospital with meningitis.

    Be warned people: Dry January is dangerous!

    (I might have got correlation and causation confused in this post)
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    SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    edited February 2016

    Morning all.

    ‘individual voter registration are exacerbating the age balance movement’

    Not sure what that even means, are there any examples for this.

    It would not be surprising as it follows from younger people being more likely to move.
    Cheers Mr L – so, youngsters not bothering to register once mum and dad no longer do it for them. Which is odd for an on-line savvy generation, as registering has never been easier.
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    Mr. Abroad, can't most disabled people use the internet?

    I remember playing a MUD (old-fashioned text-based game) and chatted with a blind French guy who really liked it, because his software spoke what was said on-screen, so the text-based nature made it almost like an interactive audiobook.
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    stodgestodge Posts: 12,850

    Huzzah for oldies.

    Presumably you'll still be cheering them on when they vote LEAVE and your pal Dave has to eat humble pie with a large side portion of crow with egg on face to follow.

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    Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    I'm not sure I can bear to watch it on replay. It sounds simply appalling.

    Moses_ said:

    Sorry O/T so quick but it Looks like Mr Assange may be leaving the embassy tomorrow dependent on a UN committee meeting deciding if UK has infringed his rights by holding him in technical detention despite asylum being granted.

    Mmmmm.... I wonder what the outcome will be.

    Somebody thinks they are above the law & I am not talking about Batwomen this time...

    Although After last night's documentary of her there surely has to be a police investigation..she admitted on camera to actions if a normally company director had been found doing would be in serious trouble.
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,105

    Always knew an English Parliament was a bad idea, now Tristram Hunt is in favour of it

    http://labourlist.org/2016/02/the-labour-party-has-a-problem-we-need-a-solution-to-the-english-question/

    Labour has a Scottish problem, not an English problem. They need Scottish Independence to get back into Downing Street with a majority. Short of that, to have a chance of power again they will have to get the next best thing - an English Parliament. Which is a good enough reason to tell Hunt to bugger off....
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    Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    Argh! Hope you're okay

    As I said a few weeks ago, I was taking part in my own form of "Dry January". I managed the entire month with no alcohol, crisps or Red Bull.

    So was I feeling healthier, wealthier and happier on February 1st after the month's abstinence? Was I heck.

    Instead I was rushed into hospital with meningitis.

    Be warned people: Dry January is dangerous!

    (I might have got correlation and causation confused in this post)

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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,976
    edited February 2016
    F1: sounds like the engine token system will be scrapped in 2017.

    What's that mean? It sounds like unrestricted development. That could create potential for good value.

    Edited extra bit: hope you've recovered entirely, Mr. Jessop.
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    stodge said:

    Huzzah for oldies.

    Presumably you'll still be cheering them on when they vote LEAVE and your pal Dave has to eat humble pie with a large side portion of crow with egg on face to follow.

    Yes, that's democracy.
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    stodgestodge Posts: 12,850

    stodge said:

    Huzzah for oldies.

    Presumably you'll still be cheering them on when they vote LEAVE and your pal Dave has to eat humble pie with a large side portion of crow with egg on face to follow.

    Yes, that's democracy.
    And if they desert the Conservatives and vote UKIP in large numbers ?
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    Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    I'd suggest patronising disabled voters was rather insulting.

    Mr. Abroad, can't most disabled people use the internet?

    I remember playing a MUD (old-fashioned text-based game) and chatted with a blind French guy who really liked it, because his software spoke what was said on-screen, so the text-based nature made it almost like an interactive audiobook.

  • Options
    Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865

    As I said a few weeks ago, I was taking part in my own form of "Dry January". I managed the entire month with no alcohol, crisps or Red Bull.

    So was I feeling healthier, wealthier and happier on February 1st after the month's abstinence? Was I heck.

    Instead I was rushed into hospital with meningitis.

    Be warned people: Dry January is dangerous!

    (I might have got correlation and causation confused in this post)

    Wow.... That's not good but glad you are OK.

    Are you posting from the hospital bed not surrounded by Junior doctors :lol:
  • Options

    Argh! Hope you're okay

    As I said a few weeks ago, I was taking part in my own form of "Dry January". I managed the entire month with no alcohol, crisps or Red Bull.

    So was I feeling healthier, wealthier and happier on February 1st after the month's abstinence? Was I heck.

    Instead I was rushed into hospital with meningitis.

    Be warned people: Dry January is dangerous!

    (I might have got correlation and causation confused in this post)

    He's posting here. What does that tell you?

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    richardDoddrichardDodd Posts: 5,472
    Moses..only if he is lucky..
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    mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,139
    edited February 2016
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,105
    Charles said:

    Morning all.

    ‘individual voter registration are exacerbating the age balance movement’

    Not sure what that even means, are there any examples for this.

    It means kids these days are lazy sods who can't be bothered to get registered...
    When was this Golden Age when kids could be bothered to register? Was it when their parents did it for them?
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    stodge said:

    stodge said:

    Huzzah for oldies.

    Presumably you'll still be cheering them on when they vote LEAVE and your pal Dave has to eat humble pie with a large side portion of crow with egg on face to follow.

    Yes, that's democracy.
    And if they desert the Conservatives and vote UKIP in large numbers ?
    Again, that's democracy.
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    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,331
    stodge said:

    Morning all :)

    The question isn't purely one of age but of life and life experiences. If it is those experiences which inform one's political outlook rather than simply the passing of years, it would be reasonable to suppose that as the average age of women having children rises and the age when people marry rises as well (as examples), the politics of youth and youthful experience would be extended as well.

    If voting Conservative is a sign of maturity and experience (and that's debatable), then if that maturity and experience is postponed presumably the voting is also postponed. I note for example the continuing anti-Conservative bulge in the 55-64 age group (those whose youth and formative years were under Margaret Thatcher) and I wonder if there will be a corresponding pro-Conservative bulge in the 35-44 age group (those who were young under Blair) and whether that will be perpetuated.

    If so, the premise of the article is invalid as the argument will be that the life experiences of your youth formulate your political outlook as you get older which is itself a shift away from "my parents voted Labour so I vote Labour" or whatever. As those whose politics was formed on a familial or cultural basis die off and those whose politics were formed differently come through I suspect we may see more dynamic voting patterns across the generations.

    It's an interesting question - as we get older, do we follow the patterns of previous older generations, or import the views of our own? As a 60s/70s radical, I was a pragmatist for most of my adult life and have become more radical again as I get older (as some may have noticed) - basically I've got fed up with the meagre political pickings from pragmatism. My friends of the same generation have had the edges rubbed off and are on the whole less radical and more willing to concede that the party/way of thinking that they like isn't always right. Buyt I wouldn't say they've become more conservative, just less rigid.
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    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,973
    Moses_ said:

    As I said a few weeks ago, I was taking part in my own form of "Dry January". I managed the entire month with no alcohol, crisps or Red Bull.

    So was I feeling healthier, wealthier and happier on February 1st after the month's abstinence? Was I heck.

    Instead I was rushed into hospital with meningitis.

    Be warned people: Dry January is dangerous!

    (I might have got correlation and causation confused in this post)

    Wow.... That's not good but glad you are OK.

    Are you posting from the hospital bed not surrounded by Junior doctors :lol:
    Fortunately it's viral, not bacterial, so I got the 'right' sort of meningitis. But there are a few complications, partly due to one of two mistakes made by docs at the hospital. (Two mistakes in 42 hours stay isn't good). I'm at home; basically I couldn't wait to get out.

    I'm still very lightphobic, so I'm having to sit in a darkened room and can only look at a screen for a few minutes at a time before my head explodes. So you'll all be glad to hear I'll be reducing the number of posts I make. ;)
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    geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,150
    edited February 2016
    Older/younger voting patterns have been clear for a very long time, so too the consequences for elections. Nothing of substance added. What would have been interesting is an examination of the causes of this pattern.

    edit: I see Stodge making a useful attempt
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,105
    UN rules in Assange's favour - BBC
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    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,973

    Argh! Hope you're okay

    As I said a few weeks ago, I was taking part in my own form of "Dry January". I managed the entire month with no alcohol, crisps or Red Bull.

    So was I feeling healthier, wealthier and happier on February 1st after the month's abstinence? Was I heck.

    Instead I was rushed into hospital with meningitis.

    Be warned people: Dry January is dangerous!

    (I might have got correlation and causation confused in this post)

    He's posting here. What does that tell you?

    I have a very low boredom threshold. ;)
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    WandererWanderer Posts: 3,838

    Moses_ said:

    As I said a few weeks ago, I was taking part in my own form of "Dry January". I managed the entire month with no alcohol, crisps or Red Bull.

    So was I feeling healthier, wealthier and happier on February 1st after the month's abstinence? Was I heck.

    Instead I was rushed into hospital with meningitis.

    Be warned people: Dry January is dangerous!

    (I might have got correlation and causation confused in this post)

    Wow.... That's not good but glad you are OK.

    Are you posting from the hospital bed not surrounded by Junior doctors :lol:
    Fortunately it's viral, not bacterial, so I got the 'right' sort of meningitis. But there are a few complications, partly due to one of two mistakes made by docs at the hospital. (Two mistakes in 42 hours stay isn't good). I'm at home; basically I couldn't wait to get out.

    I'm still very lightphobic, so I'm having to sit in a darkened room and can only look at a screen for a few minutes at a time before my head explodes. So you'll all be glad to hear I'll be reducing the number of posts I make. ;)
    Sorry to hear that. Hope you're better soon.

    Abstinence never pays.
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    eekeek Posts: 24,965

    Charles said:

    Morning all.

    ‘individual voter registration are exacerbating the age balance movement’

    Not sure what that even means, are there any examples for this.

    It means kids these days are lazy sods who can't be bothered to get registered...
    I had to do it for ge2015. It took 2 mins online. It was totally painless & I was pleasantly surprised just how simple it was. If 18-24 year olds all.with their smartphones can't find those 2 mins I am not sure they will have spent any time thinking about the potential outcomes of using their vote.

    The new system is absolutely no barrier. Anybody who says otherwise is just lying & trying to push a myth.
    I think that is only true for able-bodied people.

    Nope. Its a modern open.gov website which is clear cut and supports most of the usability add-ons...

    The only information required is a postcode, name, date of birth and NI number so its not exactly difficult to fill in or get someone to fill in on your behalf.....
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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,830

    stodge said:

    Huzzah for oldies.

    Presumably you'll still be cheering them on when they vote LEAVE and your pal Dave has to eat humble pie with a large side portion of crow with egg on face to follow.

    Yes, that's democracy.
    My impression is that UKIP do a bit better among voters in late middle age than among voters aged 65+ , where commitment to the Conservatives is very strong.
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,105
    Surely, for some of us, our last words are going to be typed on pb.com? It might not necessarily be our aim - just the outcome of tapping away so much!
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    Always knew an English Parliament was a bad idea, now Tristram Hunt is in favour of it

    http://labourlist.org/2016/02/the-labour-party-has-a-problem-we-need-a-solution-to-the-english-question/

    To be fair, he's the closest there is in Labour to thinking about and understanding the problem they have.
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    SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    edited February 2016
    @JJ – poor old you, hope all’s well soon – the lengths people go to avoid parenting duty. :lol:
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    RobDRobD Posts: 58,962
    edited February 2016
    BBC say UN panel finds in Assange's favour. Looks like he's staying put! (or is it the other way around?)
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    Surely, for some of us, our last words are going to be typed on pb.com? It might not necessarily be our aim - just the outcome of tapping away so much!

    I want to die when I'm 100, and I want my girlfriend to be so upset, she cancels her 21st birthday party as a mark of respect.
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    Mr. D, there's a shock.
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    t

    Argh! Hope you're okay

    As I said a few weeks ago, I was taking part in my own form of "Dry January". I managed the entire month with no alcohol, crisps or Red Bull.

    So was I feeling healthier, wealthier and happier on February 1st after the month's abstinence? Was I heck.

    Instead I was rushed into hospital with meningitis.

    Be warned people: Dry January is dangerous!

    (I might have got correlation and causation confused in this post)

    He's posting here. What does that tell you?

    That he's still feverish?

    If only because, with the doctors on strike, these more room for the nurses around his bed ;)
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    I'm not surprised by the UN's idiocy, but will be interested to see the special means by which they explain trying to arrest a wanted man for deportation to that well-renowned bastion of tyranny Sweden is somehow illegal.
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    Sean_F said:

    stodge said:

    Huzzah for oldies.

    Presumably you'll still be cheering them on when they vote LEAVE and your pal Dave has to eat humble pie with a large side portion of crow with egg on face to follow.

    Yes, that's democracy.
    My impression is that UKIP do a bit better among voters in late middle age than among voters aged 65+ , where commitment to the Conservatives is very strong.
    Campaigning last year, I was struck how much loyalty the older generation has to the Tory party.

    Oddly this was the generation that voted Labour in 1974
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    Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    I'm shocked

    AFP
    #BREAKING Suspects in IS plot 'lived in refugee shelters': German police
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    I do wish the Mail would stop being so mealy-mouthed and say what they think...

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-3430870/DAILY-MAIL-COMMENT-speak-England.html

    It reads as if it has been produced by one of those computer headline generators. It makes sense only in the context of a circulation war with the Express.
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    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,974

    Moses_ said:

    As I said a few weeks ago, I was taking part in my own form of "Dry January". I managed the entire month with no alcohol, crisps or Red Bull.

    So was I feeling healthier, wealthier and happier on February 1st after the month's abstinence? Was I heck.

    Instead I was rushed into hospital with meningitis.

    Be warned people: Dry January is dangerous!

    (I might have got correlation and causation confused in this post)

    Wow.... That's not good but glad you are OK.

    Are you posting from the hospital bed not surrounded by Junior doctors :lol:
    Fortunately it's viral, not bacterial, so I got the 'right' sort of meningitis. But there are a few complications, partly due to one of two mistakes made by docs at the hospital. (Two mistakes in 42 hours stay isn't good). I'm at home; basically I couldn't wait to get out.

    I'm still very lightphobic, so I'm having to sit in a darkened room and can only look at a screen for a few minutes at a time before my head explodes. So you'll all be glad to hear I'll be reducing the number of posts I make. ;)
    Nasty, and not helped by your hospital experience. All the best.

    How dark can you get your screen and still read it?
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    stodgestodge Posts: 12,850


    Campaigning last year, I was struck how much loyalty the older generation has to the Tory party.

    Oddly this was the generation that voted Labour in 1974

    I think the key election was 1979 and for those who were early middle aged in the late 70s, the strikes and the Winter of Discontent had a huge psychological impact. If you were in your 30s or early 40s then you would be in your 70s/early 80s now (approximately). I think a considerable number were permanently turned off Labour by that experience.


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    runnymederunnymede Posts: 2,536
    '...Despite the fair-seeming terminology of its charter and its declarations...[it] is a concourse of self-seeking nations, obeying their own prejudices and pursuing their own interests. They have not changed their individual natures by being aggregated with others in a system of bogus democracy'

    Powell's comments apply equally to the EU.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,917

    Moses_ said:

    As I said a few weeks ago, I was taking part in my own form of "Dry January". I managed the entire month with no alcohol, crisps or Red Bull.

    So was I feeling healthier, wealthier and happier on February 1st after the month's abstinence? Was I heck.

    Instead I was rushed into hospital with meningitis.

    Be warned people: Dry January is dangerous!

    (I might have got correlation and causation confused in this post)

    Wow.... That's not good but glad you are OK.

    Are you posting from the hospital bed not surrounded by Junior doctors :lol:
    Fortunately it's viral, not bacterial, so I got the 'right' sort of meningitis. But there are a few complications, partly due to one of two mistakes made by docs at the hospital. (Two mistakes in 42 hours stay isn't good). I'm at home; basically I couldn't wait to get out.

    I'm still very lightphobic, so I'm having to sit in a darkened room and can only look at a screen for a few minutes at a time before my head explodes. So you'll all be glad to hear I'll be reducing the number of posts I make. ;)
    :+1: Glad to hear you're on the mend Mr Jessop.
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    stodge said:


    Campaigning last year, I was struck how much loyalty the older generation has to the Tory party.

    Oddly this was the generation that voted Labour in 1974

    I think the key election was 1979 and for those who were early middle aged in the late 70s, the strikes and the Winter of Discontent had a huge psychological impact. If you were in your 30s or early 40s then you would be in your 70s/early 80s now (approximately). I think a considerable number were permanently turned off Labour by that experience.


    Indeed. I think The Winter of Discontent might be the most important political event since the Second World War.

    Callaghan was leading in the polls, he might have held and won a 1978 general election or a 1979 general election.

    Thatcher would have been deposed and replaced by a Heathite. No Thatcherism in this country, there's a thought.
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    PongPong Posts: 4,693

    As I said a few weeks ago, I was taking part in my own form of "Dry January". I managed the entire month with no alcohol, crisps or Red Bull.

    So was I feeling healthier, wealthier and happier on February 1st after the month's abstinence? Was I heck.

    Instead I was rushed into hospital with meningitis.

    Be warned people: Dry January is dangerous!

    (I might have got correlation and causation confused in this post)

    eeek.

    Meningitis sucks. It left me on life support in my second year of uni.

    You may/may not be aware the meningitis trust (or whatever they've rebranded as) have a 24hr nurse-led helpline which I found particularly useful.

    Hope things get better for you soon.
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,105
    JJ, glad you are on the mend. Must have been a worrying time for your lady wife, so hope she is in a happier place now.
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    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901
    stodge said:


    Campaigning last year, I was struck how much loyalty the older generation has to the Tory party.

    Oddly this was the generation that voted Labour in 1974

    I think the key election was 1979 and for those who were early middle aged in the late 70s, the strikes and the Winter of Discontent had a huge psychological impact. If you were in your 30s or early 40s then you would be in your 70s/early 80s now (approximately). I think a considerable number were permanently turned off Labour by that experience.


    All generations react to the govt in power. I was firmly put off Tories by visiting my grandmother on a mattress on a hospital floor following heart attack in the late 80s.

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    Argh! Hope you're okay

    As I said a few weeks ago, I was taking part in my own form of "Dry January". I managed the entire month with no alcohol, crisps or Red Bull.

    So was I feeling healthier, wealthier and happier on February 1st after the month's abstinence? Was I heck.

    Instead I was rushed into hospital with meningitis.

    Be warned people: Dry January is dangerous!

    (I might have got correlation and causation confused in this post)

    He's posting here. What does that tell you?

    I have a very low boredom threshold. ;)
    Good to see that you're recovering JJ.
    My sister has had the same illness twice and it aint fun.
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    Some polling on migrants that may be of interest:
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-35470723
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    geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,150
    I've just noticed the horizontal axis on the thread header graph.
    What a load of tosh.
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    Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    Europe Elects
    UK: Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union or leave the European Union?, ICM poll

    Yes: 52% (+2)
    No: 48% (-2)
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    stodgestodge Posts: 12,850



    It's an interesting question - as we get older, do we follow the patterns of previous older generations, or import the views of our own? As a 60s/70s radical, I was a pragmatist for most of my adult life and have become more radical again as I get older (as some may have noticed) - basically I've got fed up with the meagre political pickings from pragmatism. My friends of the same generation have had the edges rubbed off and are on the whole less radical and more willing to concede that the party/way of thinking that they like isn't always right. But I wouldn't say they've become more conservative, just less rigid.

    I think familial and community/cultural influences are declining and receding but I'm also drawn to the adage "people like people like themselves". It's my experience individuals gravitate to similar individuals and form mutually-re-enforcing groups. Smokers tend to like to be with other smokers - the same is true of drinkers, gamblers, Tottenham supporters and the like.

    You can choose your friends, you can't choose your family or work colleagues. I have work colleagues who I respect and like professionally and can work with but with whom I could and would never discuss politics because I know their views are strongly divergent to mine.

    My circle of friends is more attuned to my politics (though as an LD I don't have much of a pool to choose from at the moment) in a non-party sense - broadly internationalist, pro-EU (with a couple of exceptions) mildly anti-Government.

    I suspect (though cannot confirm) for most PBers it's the same. We don't generally and frequently expose ourselves to views we don't support and prefer to like what we hear rather than have to argue every other sentence (tiring if nothing else). As one gets older, I suspect the appetite and desire for argument and debate wanes to some extent - with people we know we want to feel comfortable and relaxed so we move to people who make us feel that way.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,917
    I had a (reasonably) dry January.

    The only time I felt well was the one night out on the pop.
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    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,607
    Hmm, the more I think about it the more this Red Card system seems like a poor idea. Essentially it is going to turn into QMV to block laws. QMV has not worked out well for our agenda in the last 10 years, introducing a new type of QMV is probably not a good idea.
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    Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    edited February 2016
    Jan Bruck
    Police are handing out these flyers 'in case of sex. aussault: break away, scream, repel' #carnival #cologne https://t.co/adWqJTLB7N
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    runnymederunnymede Posts: 2,536
    Essentially it is going to turn into QMV to block laws.

    Yes like all the PM's package it is just a restatement of the current position. Essentially a parallel system to the one that already exists - there is zero gain for the UK (or any other dissenting nation) here.
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    I do wish the Mail would stop being so mealy-mouthed and say what they think...

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-3430870/DAILY-MAIL-COMMENT-speak-England.html

    It reads as if it has been produced by one of those computer headline generators. It makes sense only in the context of a circulation war with the Express.
    You are missing the politics of this: this is a direct appeal to Boris.
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    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,607
    Wow, Sharp are going to ignore the will of the Japanese government and go for the Foxconn offer! If this is true and not just a ploy to get INCJ to up their offer then finally it could show signs of reform in corporate Japan.
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    Europe Elects
    UK: Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union or leave the European Union?, ICM poll

    Yes: 52% (+2)
    No: 48% (-2)

    Why are they giving a Yes/No response to an Either/Or question?

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    I do wish the Mail would stop being so mealy-mouthed and say what they think...

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-3430870/DAILY-MAIL-COMMENT-speak-England.html

    It reads as if it has been produced by one of those computer headline generators. It makes sense only in the context of a circulation war with the Express.
    You are missing the politics of this: this is a direct appeal to Boris.
    Perhaps. It reads more like a typical incoherent Mail rant against the 21st century by an editor who fears that the referendum is already lost. Why would any ambitious politicians jump on that bandwagon?
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    The supplementary question must be: does today's 60 year old have the same concerns as a previous sixty year old, or more like a 55 year old did?
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    WandererWanderer Posts: 3,838
    stodge said:


    Campaigning last year, I was struck how much loyalty the older generation has to the Tory party.

    Oddly this was the generation that voted Labour in 1974

    I think the key election was 1979 and for those who were early middle aged in the late 70s, the strikes and the Winter of Discontent had a huge psychological impact. If you were in your 30s or early 40s then you would be in your 70s/early 80s now (approximately). I think a considerable number were permanently turned off Labour by that experience.


    And turned off Trades Unions especially, I think.
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    runnymederunnymede Posts: 2,536
    Perhaps. It reads more like a typical incoherent Mail rant against the 21st century by an editor who fears that the referendum is already lost. Why would any ambitious politicians jump on that bandwagon?

    Still 'on the fence' are you?
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    WandererWanderer Posts: 3,838

    Europe Elects
    UK: Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union or leave the European Union?, ICM poll

    Yes: 52% (+2)
    No: 48% (-2)

    Should be 100% yes given that phrasing?
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @iainmartin1: Imagine how much easier wld have been for Leave to unify if Farage had quit post-election + Suzanne Evans was now UKIP leader.
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    I do wish the Mail would stop being so mealy-mouthed and say what they think...

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-3430870/DAILY-MAIL-COMMENT-speak-England.html

    It reads as if it has been produced by one of those computer headline generators. It makes sense only in the context of a circulation war with the Express.
    You are missing the politics of this: this is a direct appeal to Boris.
    Perhaps. It reads more like a typical incoherent Mail rant against the 21st century by an editor who fears that the referendum is already lost. Why would any ambitious politicians jump on that bandwagon?
    Boris has an abject sense of his own destiny and sees himself as a modern Churchill figure. He is also not in the cabinet so doesn't have an excuse. He also has no obvious job to go to now May/Hammond are staying unless Cameron sacks one of the Leavers after the referendum, which would be fuel on the fire.

    The article is intended to shock or goad his ego into taking a stand.

    Not convinced it will work - but I think that's the intent. The Mail are furious with the Tories, and desperate.
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    Mr. P, quite. Farage sees himself as the sun around which Planet UKIP revolves.
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    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,607
    runnymede said:

    Essentially it is going to turn into QMV to block laws.

    Yes like all the PM's package it is just a restatement of the current position. Essentially a parallel system to the one that already exists - there is zero gain for the UK (or any other dissenting nation) here.

    Well, QMV is used to ram through things against the wishes of certain nations (and we are on the wrong end of it more often than not), the new Red Card will turn into a blocking force against progress. EUParl votes to reform CAP? Red Card from France and it's agriculture allies.
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    runnymede said:

    Perhaps. It reads more like a typical incoherent Mail rant against the 21st century by an editor who fears that the referendum is already lost. Why would any ambitious politicians jump on that bandwagon?

    Still 'on the fence' are you?

    I am able to distinguish between:

    1) what I want to happen (both options at the moment look like shit sandwiches); and

    2) what I expect to happen (a clear Remain victory, in part because few politicians of any note are going to touch the Leave camps with a bargepole)

    You might try the approach sometime, rather than post your colour-by-numbers insults about anyone who has the temerity to consider alternative viewpoints from your own.
This discussion has been closed.