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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Just one council by-election tonight – a CON defence in the midlands

Norton on Bromsgrove (caused by the death of the sitting Conservative councillor) Result of council at last election (2015): Conservatives 18, Labour 7, Independents 3, Wythall Ratepayers 3 (Conservative majority of 5) Result of ward at last election (2015): Conservative 943 (60%), Labour 467 (30%), Green 166 (11%) EU Referendum Result: REMAIN 26,252 (45%) LEAVE 32,563 (55%) on a turnout of 79% Candidates duly nominated: Michelle Baker (Green), Rory Shannon (Lab), Adrian Smart (UKIP), Michael Webb (Con) Weather at the close of poll: Clear, 1°C Estimate: Con HOLD Compiled by Harry Hayfield

Read the full story here

rcs1000

LD write-in gain?

Jonathan

Hmmm, a January by election. How exciting. Will the winner get 10% of the eligible vote?

John_M

This is very comprehensive (as usual) Harry, thanks.

nunu

One seat the Lib Dems won't gain!

tlg86

FPT:

tlg86 said:

stodge said:

Evening all

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-38634038

A little more background on the Surrey situation. The lack of funding means individuals don't have the budget to attend the Alzheimer's centres which have to close through lack of use.

Madness in its way....

My grandmother han Alzheimers. Woking Borough Council told us to sell her house and give them the money so that they could look after her. My parents said no and instead we moved in with her and my mum (a former nurse) looked after her.

Anyway, the Alzheimer's Society offered to look after her one day a week (or something like that) and so the bus picked her up to take her to the centre. Well, my grandmother was "very badly behaved" and so they told my parents that she wasn't welcome again, or as my mum put it, she'd been expelled. The incredulity from my parents was something to behold.

Alzheimer's is often portrayed in the heartbreaking way of people losing their memory. This is very sad, but what isn't talked about is how difficult it is to look after someone who has advanced Alzheimer's. It's remarkable how physically strong my grandmother became. Caring for someone like that is very challenging

Unfortunately the Alzheimer's Society were only interested in dealing with the easy cases where people would sit quietly and not cause them any trouble.

slade

There are also Town Council elections in Faversham and Knaresborough.

rcs1000

Sean_F said:

rcs1000 said:

Re Davos.

This is a fabulous time to go skiing in Davos. You drive to Klosters, leave the car in the station car park, and then ski the entire Klosters-Davos ski area, and there's barely a person on the slopes.

It's much, much more fun than a bunch of dreary presentations.

Surely people go to the Davos Summit to get pissed in lovely surroundings.

Sadly, that answer exposes you as someone who has never been to Davos.

It is, without doubt, one of the great eyesores of the Alps. A bunch of large hotels in an unattractive ski town. It is home to the WEF because it possesses lots of 5* Hotels and is very easy to police

foxinsoxuk

slade said:

There are also Town Council elections in Faversham and Knaresborough.

And Labour Candidate selection in Copeland.

MikeK

It's all coming apart:
https://twitter.com/WantEnglandBack/status/822150246625083393
The Lefty Liberal World Hegemony is ending in rancour.

Black_Rook

https://twitter.com/politicshome/status/822165483327586304

February 23rd "likely", according to thus-far unconfirmed rumours, for both Copeland and Stoke Central. Announcement possible as soon as tomorrow.

John_M

MikeK said:

It's all coming apart:
https://twitter.com/WantEnglandBack/status/822150246625083393
The Lefty Liberal World Hegemony is ending in rancour.

I don't think it is. His remarks are as much aimed at a domestic audience as anything else. The Project will trundle on regardless.

AnneJGP

MikeK said:

It's all coming apart:
https://twitter.com/WantEnglandBack/status/822150246625083393
The Lefty Liberal World Hegemony is ending in rancour.

I'm baffled by these reports, are they accurate? I thought that Brexit was going to remove the brake on the ever-closer-union project and enable the remaining willing participants to steam ahead.

So what has happened? It can't be anything to do with Brexit, really. Are commentators just reading their wishes into unconnected events?

(Good evening, everyone.)

williamglenn

https://twitter.com/albertonardelli/status/822173006151774208

MikeK

Obamas goodbye is almost ended.
https://twitter.com/Telegraph/status/822167676768415744

MaxPB

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/albertonardelli/status/822173006151774208

Lol, two has-beens.

Sean_F

rcs1000 said:

Sean_F said:

rcs1000 said:

Re Davos.

This is a fabulous time to go skiing in Davos. You drive to Klosters, leave the car in the station car park, and then ski the entire Klosters-Davos ski area, and there's barely a person on the slopes.

It's much, much more fun than a bunch of dreary presentations.

Surely people go to the Davos Summit to get pissed in lovely surroundings.

Sadly, that answer exposes you as someone who has never been to Davos.

It is, without doubt, one of the great eyesores of the Alps. A bunch of large hotels in an unattractive ski town. It is home to the WEF because it possesses lots of 5* Hotels and is very easy to police

I don't mix in such rarefied company. The only part of Switzerland I'm familiar with is the Ticino.

williamglenn

MaxPB said:

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/albertonardelli/status/822173006151774208

Lol, two has-beens.

Merkel is only just getting started.

MaxPB

williamglenn said:

MaxPB said:

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/albertonardelli/status/822173006151774208

Lol, two has-beens.

Merkel is only just getting started.

Lol, absolutely deluded.

Alanbrooke

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/albertonardelli/status/822173006151774208

ooh the people who helped cause Brexit have a chat

MaxPB

Sean_F said:

rcs1000 said:

Sean_F said:

rcs1000 said:

Re Davos.

This is a fabulous time to go skiing in Davos. You drive to Klosters, leave the car in the station car park, and then ski the entire Klosters-Davos ski area, and there's barely a person on the slopes.

It's much, much more fun than a bunch of dreary presentations.

Surely people go to the Davos Summit to get pissed in lovely surroundings.

Sadly, that answer exposes you as someone who has never been to Davos.

It is, without doubt, one of the great eyesores of the Alps. A bunch of large hotels in an unattractive ski town. It is home to the WEF because it possesses lots of 5* Hotels and is very easy to police

I don't mix in such rarefied company. The only part of Switzerland I'm familiar with is the Ticino.

Ticino is where I'd like to retire. Italy without Italians.

MikeK

Obama's still at it.................
https://twitter.com/CNNPolitics/status/822175530703323136

Alanbrooke

MikeK said:

Obama's still at it.................
https://twitter.com/CNNPolitics/status/822175530703323136

it's pathetic really

he's doing all the things he should have done years ago but hadnt the courage to do in front of the electorate

nunu

tlg86 said:

FPT:

tlg86 said:

stodge said:

Evening all

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-38634038

A little more background on the Surrey situation. The lack of funding means individuals don't have the budget to attend the Alzheimer's centres which have to close through lack of use.

Madness in its way....

My grandmother han Alzheimers. Woking Borough Council told us to sell her house and give them the money so that they could look after her. My parents said no and instead we moved in with her and my mum (a former nurse) looked after her.

Anyway, the Alzheimer's Society offered to look after her one day a week (or something like that) and so the bus picked her up to take her to the centre. Well, my grandmother was "very badly behaved" and so they told my parents that she wasn't welcome again, or as my mum put it, she'd been expelled. The incredulity from my parents was something to behold.

Alzheimer's is often portrayed in the heartbreaking way of people losing their memory. This is very sad, but what isn't talked about is how difficult it is to look after someone who has advanced Alzheimer's. It's remarkable how physically strong my grandmother became. Caring for someone like that is very challenging

Unfortunately the Alzheimer's Society were only interested in dealing with the easy cases where people would sit quietly and not cause them any trouble.

I'm so sorry to hear this story. So if you have worked your whole life and saved you have to give it all to the local government or you get no help. Right, sounds fair......

NewsTaker

Interesting hire by Times.
https://order-order.com/2017/01/19/montie-iain-martin-times/
"Montie Out, Iain Martin In at The Times"

williamglenn

NY Jets owner to be US ambassador to the UK.

The_Apocalypse

As if Obama is a 'hasbeen'. I think Obama, who leaves office with a 60% approval rating will a vocal in opposing the actions of Trump in the coming years. In recent interviews he's implied so. He could very well be more influential as a former President. And there's plently of ground to oppose Trump, with much of the way he's conducted his transition period opposed by Americans.

Meanwhile it's looking still pretty likely that Merkel will be German Chancellor after the German elections in September.

Charles

williamglenn said:

NY Jets owner to be US ambassador to the UK.

Flagged a while ago.

Woody's just about the only sane one in his extended family. Shame about the mess with his daughter though.

isam

.

justin124

Black_Rook said:

https://twitter.com/politicshome/status/822165483327586304

February 23rd "likely", according to thus-far unconfirmed rumours, for both Copeland and Stoke Central. Announcement possible as soon as tomorrow.

I don't quite see how that works. Polling Day for a Parliamentary By election can be between 21 and 27 working days following the issue of the writ. Given the Reed was not going to resign until 31st January , that would appear to rule out any Thursday before 2nd March. Perhaps Reed and Hunt have agreed to resign earlier!

logical_song

Black_Rook said:

https://twitter.com/politicshome/status/822165483327586304

February 23rd "likely", according to thus-far unconfirmed rumours, for both Copeland and Stoke Central. Announcement possible as soon as tomorrow.

Labour don't want to give any opponents time to build support, it makes sense.

OldKingCole

Alanbrooke said:

MikeK said:

Obama's still at it.................
https://twitter.com/CNNPolitics/status/822175530703323136

it's pathetic really

he's doing all the things he should have done years ago but hadnt the courage to do in front of the electorate

Does this include the last few in Guantanamo?

foxinsoxuk

The_Apocalypse said:

As if Obama is a 'hasbeen'. I think Obama, who leaves office with a 60% approval rating will a vocal in opposing the actions of Trump in the coming years. In recent interviews he's implied so. He could very well be more influential as a former President. And there's plently of ground to oppose Trump, with much of the way he's conducted his transition period opposed by Americans.

Meanwhile it's looking still pretty likely that Merkel will be German Chancellor after the German elections in September.

Not many politicians leave office with 60% approval.

Fairly nailed on that Trump will not!

DecrepitJohnL

MikeK said:

Obama's still at it.................
https://twitter.com/CNNPolitics/status/822175530703323136

It has taken me eight years to notice Obama wears his watch on his left wrist even though he is left-handed.

OldKingCole

nunu said:

tlg86 said:

FPT:

tlg86 said:

stodge said:

Evening all

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-38634038

A little more background on the Surrey situation. The lack of funding means individuals don't have the budget to attend the Alzheimer's centres which have to close through lack of use.

Madness in its way....

My grandmother han Alzheimers. Woking Borough Council told us to sell her house and give them the money so that they could look after her. My parents said no and instead we moved in with her and my mum (a former nurse) looked after her.

Anyway, the Alzheimer's Society offered to look after her one day a week (or something like that) and so the bus picked her up to take her to the centre. Well, my grandmother was "very badly behaved" and so they told my parents that she wasn't welcome again, or as my mum put it, she'd been expelled. The incredulity from my parents was something to behold.

Alzheimer's is often portrayed in the heartbreaking way of people losing their memory. This is very sad, but what isn't talked about is how difficult it is to look after someone who has advanced Alzheimer's. It's remarkable how physically strong my grandmother became. Caring for someone like that is very challenging

Unfortunately the Alzheimer's Society were only interested in dealing with the easy cases where people would sit quietly and not cause them any trouble.

I'm so sorry to hear this story. So if you have worked your whole life and saved you have to give it all to the local government or you get no help. Right, sounds fair......

This has been going on for years. I don't know if the law is still the same but when I fought such a decision it was possible to win non-contributory care.

MikeK

For Trump, the first duty:
https://twitter.com/CNNPolitics/status/822182002501832704

tlg86

nunu said:

tlg86 said:

FPT:

tlg86 said:

stodge said:

Evening all

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-38634038

A little more background on the Surrey situation. The lack of funding means individuals don't have the budget to attend the Alzheimer's centres which have to close through lack of use.

Madness in its way....

My grandmother han Alzheimers. Woking Borough Council told us to sell her house and give them the money so that they could look after her. My parents said no and instead we moved in with her and my mum (a former nurse) looked after her.

Anyway, the Alzheimer's Society offered to look after her one day a week (or something like that) and so the bus picked her up to take her to the centre. Well, my grandmother was "very badly behaved" and so they told my parents that she wasn't welcome again, or as my mum put it, she'd been expelled. The incredulity from my parents was something to behold.

Alzheimer's is often portrayed in the heartbreaking way of people losing their memory. This is very sad, but what isn't talked about is how difficult it is to look after someone who has advanced Alzheimer's. It's remarkable how physically strong my grandmother became. Caring for someone like that is very challenging

Unfortunately the Alzheimer's Society were only interested in dealing with the easy cases where people would sit quietly and not cause them any trouble.

I'm so sorry to hear this story. So if you have worked your whole life and saved you have to give it all to the local government or you get no help. Right, sounds fair......

To be fair, my grandmother did not work her whole life and her husband (born with a silver spoon in his mouth) didn't either. So don't feel too sorry for us. But I think the problem will be that most people calculate that they'll have to pay privately for their parents if they need care so it becomes a question of "how much should I care about the welfare of those who don't have the means to pay for themselves?"

AnneJGP

nunu said:

tlg86 said:

FPT:

tlg86 said:

stodge said:

Evening all

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-38634038

A little more background on the Surrey situation. The lack of funding means individuals don't have the budget to attend the Alzheimer's centres which have to close through lack of use.

Madness in its way....

My grandmother han Alzheimers. Woking Borough Council told us to sell her house and give them the money so that they could look after her. My parents said no and instead we moved in with her and my mum (a former nurse) looked after her.

Anyway, the Alzheimer's Society offered to look after her one day a week (or something like that) and so the bus picked her up to take her to the centre. Well, my grandmother was "very badly behaved" and so they told my parents that she wasn't welcome again, or as my mum put it, she'd been expelled. The incredulity from my parents was something to behold.

Alzheimer's is often portrayed in the heartbreaking way of people losing their memory. This is very sad, but what isn't talked about is how difficult it is to look after someone who has advanced Alzheimer's. It's remarkable how physically strong my grandmother became. Caring for someone like that is very challenging

Unfortunately the Alzheimer's Society were only interested in dealing with the easy cases where people would sit quietly and not cause them any trouble.

I'm so sorry to hear this story. So if you have worked your whole life and saved you have to give it all to the local government or you get no help. Right, sounds fair......

It's quite common for people to work hard & save & then use the money to their own advantage.

I've worked hard & saved. It seems perfectly reasonable to me that my assets should fund the care I need if & when I need it. Who else do you think should pay for me?

So other people don't/can't/won't work hard & don't/can't/won't save. Somebody else has to pay for their care, unless you're advocating euthanasia. OK, if the individual has no money the state ( = the taxpayer) steps in. That happens with funerals, too.

But why should taxpayers be expected to fund those who can pay?

another_richard

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/albertonardelli/status/822173006151774208

Final call must mean at the back of the queue.

Quite appropriate really - that's where German soldiers have been when its come to dying in American wars.

The_Apocalypse

foxinsoxuk said:

The_Apocalypse said:

As if Obama is a 'hasbeen'. I think Obama, who leaves office with a 60% approval rating will a vocal in opposing the actions of Trump in the coming years. In recent interviews he's implied so. He could very well be more influential as a former President. And there's plently of ground to oppose Trump, with much of the way he's conducted his transition period opposed by Americans.

Meanwhile it's looking still pretty likely that Merkel will be German Chancellor after the German elections in September.

Not many politicians leave office with 60% approval.

Fairly nailed on that Trump will not!

Trump's only on 40% now, and this is the 'honeymoon' period of the Presidency. Even George W. Bush, with all the controversy surrounding the 2000 election had a 60% approval rating at the start of his Presidency.

NewsTaker

tlg86 said:

nunu said:

tlg86 said:

FPT:

tlg86 said:

stodge said:

Evening all

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-38634038

A little more background on the Surrey situation. The lack of funding means individuals don't have the budget to attend the Alzheimer's centres which have to close through lack of use.

Madness in its way....

My grandmother han Alzheimers. Woking Borough Council told us to sell her house and give them the money so that they could look after her. My parents said no and instead we moved in with her and my mum (a former nurse) looked after her.

Anyway, the Alzheimer's Society offered to look after her one day a week (or something like that) and so the bus picked her up to take her to the centre. Well, my grandmother was "very badly behaved" and so they told my parents that she wasn't welcome again, or as my mum put it, she'd been expelled. The incredulity from my parents was something to behold.

Alzheimer's is often portrayed in the heartbreaking way of people losing their memory. This is very sad, but what isn't talked about is how difficult it is to look after someone who has advanced Alzheimer's. It's remarkable how physically strong my grandmother became. Caring for someone like that is very challenging

Unfortunately the Alzheimer's Society were only interested in dealing with the easy cases where people would sit quietly and not cause them any trouble.

I'm so sorry to hear this story. So if you have worked your whole life and saved you have to give it all to the local government or you get no help. Right, sounds fair......

To be fair, my grandmother did not work her whole life and her husband (born with a silver spoon in his mouth) didn't either. So don't feel too sorry for us. But I think the problem will be that most people calculate that they'll have to pay privately for their parents if they need care so it becomes a question of "how much should I care about the welfare of those who don't have the means to pay for themselves?"

One relatively easy way of removing half the house from the calculations is to have Will Trusts for each of the couple's share of the property. First to die then has their share in the Trust and has that share outside of the Care home calculation. Because of tax reasons usually best in the South for the couple to be married. Not perfect solution but works in most situations. 50% is better than 0%.

Charles

foxinsoxuk said:

The_Apocalypse said:

As if Obama is a 'hasbeen'. I think Obama, who leaves office with a 60% approval rating will a vocal in opposing the actions of Trump in the coming years. In recent interviews he's implied so. He could very well be more influential as a former President. And there's plently of ground to oppose Trump, with much of the way he's conducted his transition period opposed by Americans.

Meanwhile it's looking still pretty likely that Merkel will be German Chancellor after the German elections in September.

Not many politicians leave office with 60% approval.

Fairly nailed on that Trump will not!

Very discourteous. Legend has it that the Clintons took the light bulbs when they vacated the White House. But there is a strong convention that outgoing Presidents don't try to overshadow their succesors.

John_M

AnneJGP said:

nunu said:

tlg86 said:

FPT:

tlg86 said:

stodge said:

Evening all

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-38634038

A little more background on the Surrey situation. The lack of funding means individuals don't have the budget to attend the Alzheimer's centres which have to close through lack of use.

Madness in its way....

My grandmother han Alzheimers. Woking Borough Council told us to sell her house and give them the money so that they could look after her. My parents said no and instead we moved in with her and my mum (a former nurse) looked after her.

Anyway, the Alzheimer's Society offered to look after her one day a week (or something like that) and so the bus picked her up to take her to the centre. Well, my grandmother was "very badly behaved" and so they told my parents that she wasn't welcome again, or as my mum put it, she'd been expelled. The incredulity from my parents was something to behold.

Alzheimer's is often portrayed in the heartbreaking way of people losing their memory. This is very sad, but what isn't talked about is how difficult it is to look after someone who has advanced Alzheimer's. It's remarkable how physically strong my grandmother became. Caring for someone like that is very challenging

Unfortunately the Alzheimer's Society were only interested in dealing with the easy cases where people would sit quietly and not cause them any trouble.

I'm so sorry to hear this story. So if you have worked your whole life and saved you have to give it all to the local government or you get no help. Right, sounds fair......

It's quite common for people to work hard & save & then use the money to their own advantage.

I've worked hard & saved. It seems perfectly reasonable to me that my assets should fund the care I need if & when I need it. Who else do you think should pay for me?

So other people don't/can't/won't work hard & don't/can't/won't save. Somebody else has to pay for their care, unless you're advocating euthanasia. OK, if the individual has no money the state ( = the taxpayer) steps in. That happens with funerals, too.

But why should taxpayers be expected to fund those who can pay?

Hear hear! It might be galling to read about the feckless who make no provision for their retirement, but that doesn't mean that there should be universal social care. We're gearing up to care for my Mum (who's just turned 80), as it's our duty as a family (and if that sounds pompous, we love her too, so it's going to be a pleasure to reciprocate for the hard work she put in to raise us).

foxinsoxuk

another_richard said:

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/albertonardelli/status/822173006151774208

Final call must mean at the back of the queue.

Quite appropriate really - that's where German soldiers have been when its come to dying in American wars.

If we had listened to the Germans rather than the US Republicans, then there would have been far fewer British graves to visit.

Germany was right over the Middle East interventions, We were wrong.

FF43

John_M said:

MikeK said:

It's all coming apart:
https://twitter.com/WantEnglandBack/status/822150246625083393
The Lefty Liberal World Hegemony is ending in rancour.

I don't think it is. His remarks are as much aimed at a domestic audience as anything else. The Project will trundle on regardless.

Mark Rutte is correct. There is no appetite amongst EU leaders for a superstate and there probably never has been. Not one leader would support it. Maybe Mr Rutte broke a taboo in making the reality clear.

It also raises questions about whether a rules based non-superstate supranational entity is viable. But that's a different question.

OldKingCole

AnneJGP said:

nunu said:

tlg86 said:

FPT:

tlg86 said:

stodge said:

Evening all

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-38634038

A little more background on the Surrey situation. The lack of funding means individuals don't have the budget to attend the Alzheimer's centres which have to close through lack of use.

Madness in its way....

My grandmother han Alzheimers. Woking Borough Council told us to sell her house and give them the money so that they could look after her. My parents said no and instead we moved in with her and my mum (a former nurse) looked after her.

Anyway, the Alzheimer's Society offered to look after her one day a week (or something like that) and so the bus picked her up to take her to the centre. Well, my grandmother was "very badly behaved" and so they told my parents that she wasn't welcome again, or as my mum put it, she'd been expelled. The incredulity from my parents was something to behold.

Alzheimer's is often portrayed in the heartbreaking way of people losing their memory. This is very sad, but what isn't talked about is how difficult it is to look after someone who has advanced Alzheimer's. It's remarkable how physically strong my grandmother became. Caring for someone like that is very challenging

Unfortunately the Alzheimer's Society were only interested in dealing with the easy cases where people would sit quietly and not cause them any trouble.

I'm so sorry to hear this story. So if you have worked your whole life and saved you have to give it all to the local government or you get no help. Right, sounds fair......

It's quite common for people to work hard & save & then use the money to their own advantage.

I've worked hard & saved. It seems perfectly reasonable to me that my assets should fund the care I need if & when I need it. Who else do you think should pay for me?

So other people don't/can't/won't work hard & don't/can't/won't save. Somebody else has to pay for their care, unless you're advocating euthanasia. OK, if the individual has no money the state ( = the taxpayer) steps in. That happens with funerals, too.

But why should taxpayers be expected to fund those who can pay?

Why should Alzheimer's be treated differently from other illnesses?

peter_from_putney

DecrepitJohnL said:

MikeK said:

Obama's still at it.................
https://twitter.com/CNNPolitics/status/822175530703323136

It has taken me eight years to notice Obama wears his watch on his left wrist even though he is left-handed.

I thought most lefties did so, including yours truly.

Black_Rook

nunu said:

tlg86 said:

FPT:

tlg86 said:

stodge said:

Evening all

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-38634038

A little more background on the Surrey situation. The lack of funding means individuals don't have the budget to attend the Alzheimer's centres which have to close through lack of use.

Madness in its way....

My grandmother han Alzheimers. Woking Borough Council told us to sell her house and give them the money so that they could look after her. My parents said no and instead we moved in with her and my mum (a former nurse) looked after her.

Anyway, the Alzheimer's Society offered to look after her one day a week (or something like that) and so the bus picked her up to take her to the centre. Well, my grandmother was "very badly behaved" and so they told my parents that she wasn't welcome again, or as my mum put it, she'd been expelled. The incredulity from my parents was something to behold.

Alzheimer's is often portrayed in the heartbreaking way of people losing their memory. This is very sad, but what isn't talked about is how difficult it is to look after someone who has advanced Alzheimer's. It's remarkable how physically strong my grandmother became. Caring for someone like that is very challenging

Unfortunately the Alzheimer's Society were only interested in dealing with the easy cases where people would sit quietly and not cause them any trouble.

I'm so sorry to hear this story. So if you have worked your whole life and saved you have to give it all to the local government or you get no help. Right, sounds fair......

Whoever said life was fair?

You'd think National Insurance was supposed to deal with problems like this, but it doesn't work that way. It's just another tax - paid one day, spent the next.

"Free" elderly care would, in fact, be enormously dear to implement and require substantial tax hikes. Central Government clearly feels that it daren't tap working age people for the cost, and the suite of existing state retirement benefits - the inflation-proofed state pension, bus passes and the other bells and whistles that might be raided to help pay for care - are plainly sacrosanct, because the old vote reliably and vote Tory.

Thus central Government dumps the burden on local Government, and local Government can't win. It gets the blame for hiking taxes itself, and it gets the blame for old people ending up sat in their own wee if it doesn't.

Quite apart from dealing with Brexit, the country also needs an urgent and long-overdue conversation about what taxpayers are and are not willing to pay for. Chances of that happening: not very high, I fear.

NewsTaker

another_richard said:

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/albertonardelli/status/822173006151774208

Final call must mean at the back of the queue.

Quite appropriate really - that's where German soldiers have been when its come to dying in American wars.

It is odd that Obama thinks that the best friend to America in Europe was Merkel who barely spent half the 2% NATO defence spending target (1.19%). Must be a great guy to have split a restaurant bill up when he pays your share and his - or is that only if he is spending tax payers money?

DecrepitJohnL

MikeK said:

For Trump, the first duty:
https://twitter.com/CNNPolitics/status/822182002501832704

Trump is wearing a blue tie. (We can bet on what colour tie he wears for the inauguration speech tomorrow. I've backed red at 4/6 with Shadsy, as opposed to 4/11 at PP.)

philiph

John_M said:

AnneJGP said:

nunu said:

tlg86 said:

FPT:

tlg86 said:

stodge said:

Evening all

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-38634038

A little more background on the Surrey situation. The lack of funding means individuals don't have the budget to attend the Alzheimer's centres which have to close through lack of use.

Madness in its way....

My grandmother han Alzheimers. Woking Borough Council told us to sell her house and give them the money so that they could look after her. My parents said no and instead we moved in with her and my mum (a former nurse) looked after her.

Anyway, the Alzheimer's Society offered to look after her one day a week (or something like that) and so the bus picked her up to take her to the centre. Well, my grandmother was "very badly behaved" and so they told my parents that she wasn't welcome again, or as my mum put it, she'd been expelled. The incredulity from my parents was something to behold.

Alzheimer's is often portrayed in the heartbreaking way of people losing their memory. This is very sad, but what isn't talked about is how difficult it is to look after someone who has advanced Alzheimer's. It's remarkable how physically strong my grandmother became. Caring for someone like that is very challenging

Unfortunately the Alzheimer's Society were only interested in dealing with the easy cases where people would sit quietly and not cause them any trouble.

I'm so sorry to hear this story. So if you have worked your whole life and saved you have to give it all to the local government or you get no help. Right, sounds fair......

It's quite common for people to work hard & save & then use the money to their own advantage.

I've worked hard & saved. It seems perfectly reasonable to me that my assets should fund the care I need if & when I need it. Who else do you think should pay for me?

So other people don't/can't/won't work hard & don't/can't/won't save. Somebody else has to pay for their care, unless you're advocating euthanasia. OK, if the individual has no money the state ( = the taxpayer) steps in. That happens with funerals, too.

But why should taxpayers be expected to fund those who can pay?

Hear hear! It might be galling to read about the feckless who make no provision for their retirement, but that doesn't mean that there should be universal social care. We're gearing up to care for my Mum (who's just turned 80), as it's our duty as a family (and if that sounds pompous, we love her too, so it's going to be a pleasure to reciprocate for the hard work she put in to raise us).

We had my mother's 95 birthday ten days ago. She seems to be slowing down a bit now.

NewsTaker

AnneJGP said:

nunu said:

tlg86 said:

FPT:

tlg86 said:

stodge said:

Evening all

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-38634038

A little more background on the Surrey situation. The lack of funding means individuals don't have the budget to attend the Alzheimer's centres which have to close through lack of use.

Madness in its way....

My grandmother han Alzheimers. Woking Borough Council told us to sell her house and give them the money so that they could look after her. My parents said no and instead we moved in with her and my mum (a former nurse) looked after her.

Anyway, the Alzheimer's Society offered to look after her one day a week (or something like that) and so the bus picked her up to take her to the centre. Well, my grandmother was "very badly behaved" and so they told my parents that she wasn't welcome again, or as my mum put it, she'd been expelled. The incredulity from my parents was something to behold.

Alzheimer's is often portrayed in the heartbreaking way of people losing their memory. This is very sad, but what isn't talked about is how difficult it is to look after someone who has advanced Alzheimer's. It's remarkable how physically strong my grandmother became. Caring for someone like that is very challenging

Unfortunately the Alzheimer's Society were only interested in dealing with the easy cases where people would sit quietly and not cause them any trouble.

I'm so sorry to hear this story. So if you have worked your whole life and saved you have to give it all to the local government or you get no help. Right, sounds fair......

It's quite common for people to work hard & save & then use the money to their own advantage.
I've worked hard & saved. It seems perfectly reasonable to me that my assets should fund the care I need if & when I need it. Who else do you think should pay for me?
So other people don't/can't/won't work hard & don't/can't/won't save. Somebody else has to pay for their care, unless you're advocating euthanasia. OK, if the individual has no money the state ( = the taxpayer) steps in. That happens with funerals, too.
But why should taxpayers be expected to fund those who can pay?

The fairest way is to have a base level of care for all. Something such as a shared room, shared bathroom etc etc in a 3* basic Care Home costing £500 a week (south) and then anyone can top up to have better levels of accomodation. People needing full additiona; medical support (such as dementia) get that part free.

Theuniondivvie

MikeK said:

For Trump, the first duty:
https://twitter.com/CNNPolitics/status/822182002501832704

Couldn't he manage a deferment for that?

NewsTaker

John_M said:

AnneJGP said:

nunu said:

tlg86 said:

FPT:

tlg86 said:

stodge said:

Evening all

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-38634038

A little more background on the Surrey situation. The lack of funding means individuals don't have the budget to attend the Alzheimer's centres which have to close through lack of use.

Madness in its way....

My grandmother han Alzheimers. Woking Borough Council told us to sell her house and give them the money so that they could look after her. My parents said no and instead we moved in with her and my mum (a former nurse) looked after her.

Anyway, the Alzheimer's Society offered to look after her one day a week (or something like that) and so the bus picked her up to take her to the centre. Well, my grandmother was "very badly behaved" and so they told my parents that she wasn't welcome again, or as my mum put it, she'd been expelled. The incredulity from my parents was something to behold.

Alzheimer's is often portrayed in the heartbreaking way of people losing their memory. This is very sad, but what isn't talked about is how difficult it is to look after someone who has advanced Alzheimer's. It's remarkable how physically strong my grandmother became. Caring for someone like that is very challenging

Unfortunately the Alzheimer's Society were only interested in dealing with the easy cases where people would sit quietly and not cause them any trouble.

I'm so sorry to hear this story. So if you have worked your whole life and saved you have to give it all to the local government or you get no help. Right, sounds fair......

It's quite common for people to work hard & save & then use the money to their own advantage.

I've worked hard & saved. It seems perfectly reasonable to me that my assets should fund the care I need if & when I need it. Who else do you think should pay for me?

So other people don't/can't/won't work hard & don't/can't/won't save. Somebody else has to pay for their care, unless you're advocating euthanasia. OK, if the individual has no money the state ( = the taxpayer) steps in. That happens with funerals, too.

But why should taxpayers be expected to fund those who can pay?

Hear hear! It might be galling to read about the feckless who make no provision for their retirement, but that doesn't mean that there should be universal social care. We're gearing up to care for my Mum (who's just turned 80), as it's our duty as a family (and if that sounds pompous, we love her too, so it's going to be a pleasure to reciprocate for the hard work she put in to raise us).

You can buy (from IFAs) an anuity to cap the risk.

tlg86

John_M said:

Hear hear! It might be galling to read about the feckless who make no provision for their retirement, but that doesn't mean that there should be universal social care. We're gearing up to care for my Mum (who's just turned 80), as it's our duty as a family (and if that sounds pompous, we love her too, so it's going to be a pleasure to reciprocate for the hard work she put in to raise us).

I tend to agree. I think what concerns me about the Surrey referendum is that this is being framed in the context of elderly care. I suspect the money isn't just going to go on looking after the elderly. And while I'm slightly sympathetic to the feckless who make it to 70, I'm not sympathetic to those in their 20s and 30s who are happy for the state to look after them.

NewsTaker

tlg86 said:

John_M said:

Hear hear! It might be galling to read about the feckless who make no provision for their retirement, but that doesn't mean that there should be universal social care. We're gearing up to care for my Mum (who's just turned 80), as it's our duty as a family (and if that sounds pompous, we love her too, so it's going to be a pleasure to reciprocate for the hard work she put in to raise us).

I tend to agree. I think what concerns me about the Surrey referendum is that this is being framed in the context of elderly care. I suspect the money isn't just going to go on looking after the elderly. And while I'm slightly sympathetic to the feckless who make it to 70, I'm not sympathetic to those in their 20s and 30s who are happy for the state to look after them.

Could be a very hard sell in Surrey. Festering away is a whopping pay rise 3 years ago and a well remunerated head.
http://www.yourlocalguardian.co.uk/news/local/11207641.Shock_resignations_in_council_expenses_row/
http://www.surreycomet.co.uk/news/14351576.Surrey_County_Council_leader_paid_more_than_any_other_in_south_east_of_England_as_expenses_bill_soars/

isam

Dan Hodges upsetting wimmin on twitter...

isam

Own up, which one of you is Louis?

https://twitter.com/lfbarfe/status/822184586595672064

AnneJGP

OldKingCole said:

AnneJGP said:

nunu said:

tlg86 said:

FPT:

tlg86 said:

stodge said:

Evening all

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-38634038

A little more background on the Surrey situation. The lack of funding means individuals don't have the budget to attend the Alzheimer's centres which have to close through lack of use.

Madness in its way....

(snipped)

Alzheimer's is often portrayed in the heartbreaking way of people losing their memory. This is very sad, but what isn't talked about is how difficult it is to look after someone who has advanced Alzheimer's. It's remarkable how physically strong my grandmother became. Caring for someone like that is very challenging

Unfortunately the Alzheimer's Society were only interested in dealing with the easy cases where people would sit quietly and not cause them any trouble.

I'm so sorry to hear this story. So if you have worked your whole life and saved you have to give it all to the local government or you get no help. Right, sounds fair......

It's quite common for people to work hard & save & then use the money to their own advantage.

I've worked hard & saved. It seems perfectly reasonable to me that my assets should fund the care I need if & when I need it. Who else do you think should pay for me?

So other people don't/can't/won't work hard & don't/can't/won't save. Somebody else has to pay for their care, unless you're advocating euthanasia. OK, if the individual has no money the state ( = the taxpayer) steps in. That happens with funerals, too.

But why should taxpayers be expected to fund those who can pay?

Why should Alzheimer's be treated differently from other illnesses?

I'm not so sure that it is treated differently. In my experience, if you have any illness/accident that leads to a situation where you cannot care for yourself, you aren't going to live in hospital. You either go home with a so-called care package or you go to a Care Home.

It's the lack of provision of the two latter that leads to the well-known bed-blocking.

foxinsoxuk

tlg86 said:

John_M said:

Hear hear! It might be galling to read about the feckless who make no provision for their retirement, but that doesn't mean that there should be universal social care. We're gearing up to care for my Mum (who's just turned 80), as it's our duty as a family (and if that sounds pompous, we love her too, so it's going to be a pleasure to reciprocate for the hard work she put in to raise us).

I tend to agree. I think what concerns me about the Surrey referendum is that this is being framed in the context of elderly care. I suspect the money isn't just going to go on looking after the elderly. And while I'm slightly sympathetic to the feckless who make it to 70, I'm not sympathetic to those in their 20s and 30s who are happy for the state to look after them.

Ah those feckless WWC Britons, what will we do with the peasants now that they are in control?

MikeK

https://twitter.com/Cartoonsbyjosh/status/822067456055382017

another_richard

foxinsoxuk said:

another_richard said:

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/albertonardelli/status/822173006151774208

Final call must mean at the back of the queue.

Quite appropriate really - that's where German soldiers have been when its come to dying in American wars.

If we had listened to the Germans rather than the US Republicans, then there would have been far fewer British graves to visit.

Germany was right over the Middle East interventions, We were wrong.

Obama was all for intervention in Libya and Syria and for that matter your heroine Hillary also voted for the Iraq invasion.

There seems to be a pattern - the USA meddles in the Middle East and the Westminster establishment eagerly joins in.

tlg86

NewsTaker said:

tlg86 said:

John_M said:

Hear hear! It might be galling to read about the feckless who make no provision for their retirement, but that doesn't mean that there should be universal social care. We're gearing up to care for my Mum (who's just turned 80), as it's our duty as a family (and if that sounds pompous, we love her too, so it's going to be a pleasure to reciprocate for the hard work she put in to raise us).

I tend to agree. I think what concerns me about the Surrey referendum is that this is being framed in the context of elderly care. I suspect the money isn't just going to go on looking after the elderly. And while I'm slightly sympathetic to the feckless who make it to 70, I'm not sympathetic to those in their 20s and 30s who are happy for the state to look after them.

Could be a very hard sell in Surrey. Festering away is a whopping pay rise 3 years ago and a well remunerated head.
http://www.yourlocalguardian.co.uk/news/local/11207641.Shock_resignations_in_council_expenses_row/
http://www.surreycomet.co.uk/news/14351576.Surrey_County_Council_leader_paid_more_than_any_other_in_south_east_of_England_as_expenses_bill_soars/

I'd like to see Surrey go unitary, but when I suggested this to my dad he thinks Woking (and the other boroughs) should be unitary authorities and then abolish Surrey CC (but I doubt that would make much financial sense). One problem with Surrey CC, however, is that it's based in Kingston which isn't even in Surrey!

foxinsoxuk

another_richard said:

foxinsoxuk said:

another_richard said:

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/albertonardelli/status/822173006151774208

Final call must mean at the back of the queue.

Quite appropriate really - that's where German soldiers have been when its come to dying in American wars.

If we had listened to the Germans rather than the US Republicans, then there would have been far fewer British graves to visit.

Germany was right over the Middle East interventions, We were wrong.

Obama was all for intervention in Libya and Syria and for that matter your heroine Hillary also voted for the Iraq invasion.

There seems to be a pattern - the USA meddles in the Middle East and the Westminster establishment eagerly joins in.

Not my heroine! Check back on my posts, I have never supported the Middle East wars.

tyson

rcs1000 said:

Sean_F said:

rcs1000 said:

Re Davos.

This is a fabulous time to go skiing in Davos. You drive to Klosters, leave the car in the station car park, and then ski the entire Klosters-Davos ski area, and there's barely a person on the slopes.

It's much, much more fun than a bunch of dreary presentations.

Surely people go to the Davos Summit to get pissed in lovely surroundings.

Sadly, that answer exposes you as someone who has never been to Davos.

It is, without doubt, one of the great eyesores of the Alps. A bunch of large hotels in an unattractive ski town. It is home to the WEF because it possesses lots of 5* Hotels and is very easy to police

Quite....if you want to see the beautiful Alps, go to Italy. The Aosta Valley, or Madonna di Camipglio, the Val di Sol; Claviere maybe...wonderful historic hillside villages, great food and wine.

If you want to pay loads of money in new build monstrosities go to Switzerland.

BTW...Abruzzo....terrible tragedy.....

John_M

https://twitter.com/LabourCopeland/status/822192037881663488

AnneJGP

Black_Rook said:

nunu said:

tlg86 said:

FPT:

tlg86 said:

stodge said:

Evening all

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-38634038

(snipped).

(snipped)

Alzheimer's is often portrayed in the heartbreaking way of people losing their memory. This is very sad, but what isn't talked about is how difficult it is to look after someone who has advanced Alzheimer's. It's remarkable how physically strong my grandmother became. Caring for someone like that is very challenging

Unfortunately the Alzheimer's Society were only interested in dealing with the easy cases where people would sit quietly and not cause them any trouble.

I'm so sorry to hear this story. So if you have worked your whole life and saved you have to give it all to the local government or you get no help. Right, sounds fair......

Whoever said life was fair?

You'd think National Insurance was supposed to deal with problems like this, but it doesn't work that way. It's just another tax - paid one day, spent the next.

"Free" elderly care would, in fact, be enormously dear to implement and require substantial tax hikes. Central Government clearly feels that it daren't tap working age people for the cost, and the suite of existing state retirement benefits - the inflation-proofed state pension, bus passes and the other bells and whistles that might be raided to help pay for care - are plainly sacrosanct, because the old vote reliably and vote Tory.

Thus central Government dumps the burden on local Government, and local Government can't win. It gets the blame for hiking taxes itself, and it gets the blame for old people ending up sat in their own wee if it doesn't.

Quite apart from dealing with Brexit, the country also needs an urgent and long-overdue conversation about what taxpayers are and are not willing to pay for. Chances of that happening: not very high, I fear.

It seems quite likely that the combination of so many of the older age groups having voted to leave the EU and the apparent willingness to accept some financial downside in order to do so, will enable Mrs May to start pruning some of these benefits: bus passes, for example, surely could at least be restricted to one's own Council area; Winter Fuel Allowance surely could be restricted, at least by having to make the effort to apply for it.

tyson

MikeK said:

https://twitter.com/Cartoonsbyjosh/status/822067456055382017

When I see stuff like this the sooner humanity wipes itself out because of our greed and general unfitness to look after the planet for the benefit of future generations, the better...

Cockroaches are better custodians of our planet.....

foxinsoxuk

John_M said:

https://twitter.com/LabourCopeland/status/822192037881663488

A genuine local choice, will make an excellent MP.

NewsTaker

Denis Skinner ‏@BolsoverBeast 2h
if you lie down with dogs, you get up with fleas.
Tory controlled Surrey council to hold referendum on raising council tax by 15%.

SouthamObserver

foxinsoxuk said:

John_M said:

https://twitter.com/LabourCopeland/status/822192037881663488

A genuine local choice, will make an excellent MP.

Not the Momentum choice, apparently. A doctor. If elected she'd be the second one on the Labour benches.

OldKingCole

AnneJGP said:

OldKingCole said:

AnneJGP said:

nunu said:

tlg86 said:

FPT:

tlg86 said:

stodge said:

Evening all

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-38634038

A little more background on the Surrey situation. The lack of funding means individuals don't have the budget to attend the Alzheimer's centres which have to close through lack of use.

Madness in its way....

(snipped)

Alzheimer's is often portrayed in the heartbreaking way of people losing their memory. This is very sad, but what isn't talked about is how difficult it is to look after someone who has advanced Alzheimer's. It's remarkable how physically strong my grandmother became. Caring for someone like that is very challenging

Unfortunately the Alzheimer's Society were only interested in dealing with the easy cases where people would sit quietly and not cause them any trouble.

I'm so sorry to hear this story. So if you have worked your whole life and saved you have to give it all to the local government or you get no help. Right, sounds fair......

It's quite common for people to work hard & save & then use the money to their own advantage.

I've worked hard & saved. It seems perfectly reasonable to me that my assets should fund the care I need if & when I need it. Who else do you think should pay for me?

So other people don't/can't/won't work hard & don't/can't/won't save. Somebody else has to pay for their care, unless you're advocating euthanasia. OK, if the individual has no money the state ( = the taxpayer) steps in. That happens with funerals, too.

But why should taxpayers be expected to fund those who can pay?

Why should Alzheimer's be treated differently from other illnesses?

I'm not so sure that it is treated differently. In my experience, if you have any illness/accident that leads to a situation where you cannot care for yourself, you aren't going to live in hospital. You either go home with a so-called care package or you go to a Care Home.

It's the lack of provision of the two latter that leads to the well-known bed-blocking.

Do the results of the Coughlan Case no longer apply?

another_richard

foxinsoxuk said:

another_richard said:

foxinsoxuk said:

another_richard said:

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/albertonardelli/status/822173006151774208

Final call must mean at the back of the queue.

Quite appropriate really - that's where German soldiers have been when its come to dying in American wars.

If we had listened to the Germans rather than the US Republicans, then there would have been far fewer British graves to visit.

Germany was right over the Middle East interventions, We were wrong.

Obama was all for intervention in Libya and Syria and for that matter your heroine Hillary also voted for the Iraq invasion.

There seems to be a pattern - the USA meddles in the Middle East and the Westminster establishment eagerly joins in.

Not my heroine! Check back on my posts, I have never supported the Middle East wars.

You repeatedly said she would be an 'excellent President'.

Quite a niche viewpoint and so easily remembered.

Anyway returning to the original point the lapdog support of Blair, Brown and Cameron to America's wars achieved nothing for this country.

At least when Macmillan or Thatcher or Major backed the USA they got a little respect in return.

foxinsoxuk

SouthamObserver said:

foxinsoxuk said:

John_M said:

https://twitter.com/LabourCopeland/status/822192037881663488

A genuine local choice, will make an excellent MP.

Not the Momentum choice, apparently. A doctor. If elected she'd be the second one on the Labour benches.

Gill campaigned for Owen Smith. A bit of background on her style and roots.

http://www.rachelburgin.org.uk/how-we-beat-the-bnp-in-cumbria/

NewsTaker

The next Surrey County Council elections are also on 4 May 2017 and there must be a chance with the proposed 15% rise, of a change in the Conservative control. Local voting conservatives usually do not welcome tax increases. Will the conservative councillors split and oust the 70+ year old Leader?

foxinsoxuk

another_richard said:

foxinsoxuk said:

another_richard said:

foxinsoxuk said:

another_richard said:

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/albertonardelli/status/822173006151774208

Final call must mean at the back of the queue.

Quite appropriate really - that's where German soldiers have been when its come to dying in American wars.

If we had listened to the Germans rather than the US Republicans, then there would have been far fewer British graves to visit.

Germany was right over the Middle East interventions, We were wrong.

Obama was all for intervention in Libya and Syria and for that matter your heroine Hillary also voted for the Iraq invasion.

There seems to be a pattern - the USA meddles in the Middle East and the Westminster establishment eagerly joins in.

Not my heroine! Check back on my posts, I have never supported the Middle East wars.

You repeatedly said she would be an 'excellent President'.

Quite a niche viewpoint and so easily remembered.

Anyway returning to the original point the lapdog support of Blair, Brown and Cameron to America's wars achieved nothing for this country.

At least when Macmillan or Thatcher or Major backed the USA they got a little respect in return.

She would have been an excellent President. I doubt that I would have liked her foreign policy, but it would have been streets ahead of Trumps Putin arse kissing.

Sean_F

MaxPB said:

Sean_F said:

rcs1000 said:

Sean_F said:

rcs1000 said:

Re Davos.

This is a fabulous time to go skiing in Davos. You drive to Klosters, leave the car in the station car park, and then ski the entire Klosters-Davos ski area, and there's barely a person on the slopes.

It's much, much more fun than a bunch of dreary presentations.

Surely people go to the Davos Summit to get pissed in lovely surroundings.

Sadly, that answer exposes you as someone who has never been to Davos.

It is, without doubt, one of the great eyesores of the Alps. A bunch of large hotels in an unattractive ski town. It is home to the WEF because it possesses lots of 5* Hotels and is very easy to police

I don't mix in such rarefied company. The only part of Switzerland I'm familiar with is the Ticino.

Ticino is where I'd like to retire. Italy without Italians.

I would have agreed, until I stayed on the Istrian Coast.

There are places on Earth which are simply Heaven. South Hams, the Antrim Coast, Rutland, the Yorksire Dales, Istria, Ticino, Granada, Dubrovnik , Lake Maggiore, Capri, Prague, Venice, I'm sure you can add others.

Theuniondivvie

another_richard said:

foxinsoxuk said:

another_richard said:

foxinsoxuk said:

another_richard said:

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/albertonardelli/status/822173006151774208

Final call must mean at the back of the queue.

Quite appropriate really - that's where German soldiers have been when its come to dying in American wars.

If we had listened to the Germans rather than the US Republicans, then there would have been far fewer British graves to visit.

Germany was right over the Middle East interventions, We were wrong.

Obama was all for intervention in Libya and Syria and for that matter your heroine Hillary also voted for the Iraq invasion.

There seems to be a pattern - the USA meddles in the Middle East and the Westminster establishment eagerly joins in.

Not my heroine! Check back on my posts, I have never supported the Middle East wars.

Anyway returning to the original point the lapdog support of Blair, Brown and Cameron to America's wars achieved nothing for this country.

Don't forget IDS!
He may have been one of the less significant of the mutts, but he sure was the most willing to sit on any American warmonger's lap that was going.

justin124

SouthamObserver said:

foxinsoxuk said:

John_M said:

https://twitter.com/LabourCopeland/status/822192037881663488

A genuine local choice, will make an excellent MP.

Not the Momentum choice, apparently. A doctor. If elected she'd be the second one on the Labour benches.

A strong candidate I would have thought.

AnneJGP

OldKingCole said:

AnneJGP said:

OldKingCole said:

AnneJGP said:

nunu said:

tlg86 said:

FPT:

tlg86 said:

stodge said:

Evening all

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-38634038

A little more background on the Surrey situation. The lack of funding means individuals don't have the budget to attend the Alzheimer's centres which have to close through lack of use.

Madness in its way....

(snipped)

Alzheimer's is often portrayed in the heartbreaking way of people losing their memory. This is very sad, but what isn't talked about is how difficult it is to look after someone who has advanced Alzheimer's. It's remarkable how physically strong my grandmother became. Caring for someone like that is very challenging

Unfortunately the Alzheimer's Society were only interested in dealing with the easy cases where people would sit quietly and not cause them any trouble.

I'm so sorry to hear this story. So if you have worked your whole life and saved you have to give it all to the local government or you get no help. Right, sounds fair......

It's quite common for people to work hard & save & then use the money to their own advantage.

I've worked hard & saved. It seems perfectly reasonable to me that my assets should fund the care I need if & when I need it. Who else do you think should pay for me?

So other people don't/can't/won't work hard & don't/can't/won't save. Somebody else has to pay for their care, unless you're advocating euthanasia. OK, if the individual has no money the state ( = the taxpayer) steps in. That happens with funerals, too.

But why should taxpayers be expected to fund those who can pay?

Why should Alzheimer's be treated differently from other illnesses?

I'm not so sure that it is treated differently. In my experience, if you have any illness/accident that leads to a situation where you cannot care for yourself, you aren't going to live in hospital. You either go home with a so-called care package or you go to a Care Home.

It's the lack of provision of the two latter that leads to the well-known bed-blocking.

Do the results of the Coughlan Case no longer apply?

Haven't a clue. Only going by my own experience. If it was a legal ruling, then presumably Coughlin does still apply. Does it give Alzheimer's special status?

tyson

Sean_F said:

MaxPB said:

Sean_F said:

rcs1000 said:

Sean_F said:

rcs1000 said:

Re Davos.

This is a fabulous time to go skiing in Davos. You drive to Klosters, leave the car in the station car park, and then ski the entire Klosters-Davos ski area, and there's barely a person on the slopes.

It's much, much more fun than a bunch of dreary presentations.

Surely people go to the Davos Summit to get pissed in lovely surroundings.

Sadly, that answer exposes you as someone who has never been to Davos.

It is, without doubt, one of the great eyesores of the Alps. A bunch of large hotels in an unattractive ski town. It is home to the WEF because it possesses lots of 5* Hotels and is very easy to police

I don't mix in such rarefied company. The only part of Switzerland I'm familiar with is the Ticino.

Ticino is where I'd like to retire. Italy without Italians.

I would have agreed, until I stayed on the Istrian Coast.

There are places on Earth which are simply Heaven. South Hams, the Antrim Coast, Rutland, the Yorksire Dales, Istria, Ticino, Granada, Dubrovnik , Lake Maggiore, Capri, Prague, Venice, I'm sure you can add others.

Blackpool and Skelmersdale

Big_G_NorthWales

Sky just announced that Donald Trump has named the owner of an American football team as his ambassador to London.

Just how bad are Sky going to become when they don't even say who he is and as ambassador to London. Does London have it's own ambassador or is it the London media' mindset again ignoring the Country outside the M25

foxinsoxuk

Theuniondivvie said:

another_richard said:

foxinsoxuk said:

another_richard said:

foxinsoxuk said:

another_richard said:

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/albertonardelli/status/822173006151774208

Final call must mean at the back of the queue.

Quite appropriate really - that's where German soldiers have been when its come to dying in American wars.

If we had listened to the Germans rather than the US Republicans, then there would have been far fewer British graves to visit.

Germany was right over the Middle East interventions, We were wrong.

Obama was all for intervention in Libya and Syria and for that matter your heroine Hillary also voted for the Iraq invasion.

There seems to be a pattern - the USA meddles in the Middle East and the Westminster establishment eagerly joins in.

Not my heroine! Check back on my posts, I have never supported the Middle East wars.

Anyway returning to the original point the lapdog support of Blair, Brown and Cameron to America's wars achieved nothing for this country.

Don't forget IDS!
He may have been one of the less significant of the mutts, but he sure was the most willing to sit on any American warmonger's lap that was going.

Or Theresa May, who voted with Blair for the 2003 invasion:

https://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/10426/theresa_may/maidenhead/divisions?policy=1049

williamglenn

Theuniondivvie said:

another_richard said:

foxinsoxuk said:

another_richard said:

foxinsoxuk said:

another_richard said:

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/albertonardelli/status/822173006151774208

Final call must mean at the back of the queue.

Quite appropriate really - that's where German soldiers have been when its come to dying in American wars.

If we had listened to the Germans rather than the US Republicans, then there would have been far fewer British graves to visit.

Germany was right over the Middle East interventions, We were wrong.

Obama was all for intervention in Libya and Syria and for that matter your heroine Hillary also voted for the Iraq invasion.

There seems to be a pattern - the USA meddles in the Middle East and the Westminster establishment eagerly joins in.

Not my heroine! Check back on my posts, I have never supported the Middle East wars.

Anyway returning to the original point the lapdog support of Blair, Brown and Cameron to America's wars achieved nothing for this country.

Don't forget IDS!
He may have been one of the less significant of the mutts, but he sure was the most willing to sit on any American warmonger's lap that was going.

Lest we forget.

http://www.aei.org/publication/this-man-is-washingtons-candidate/

The Bush administration has given up on Tony Blair, and scarcely bothers to disguise its contempt for him. As US policymakers see it, Blair has betrayed them by going along with French anti-Nato machinations. Perle, soon to be named chairman of the Pentagon’s Defence Policy Board, recently described the UK’s stance on defence as ‘wishy-washy and ambivalent’. As such, Duncan Smith will be critical to the success of Washington’s agenda. And he knows this very well. He goes out of his way to reinforce US policymakers’ suspicions about Blair.

OldKingCole

AnneJGP said:

OldKingCole said:

AnneJGP said:

OldKingCole said:

AnneJGP said:

nunu said:

tlg86 said:

FPT:

tlg86 said:

stodge said:

Evening all

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-38634038

A little more background on the Surrey situation. The lack of funding means individuals don't have the budget to attend the Alzheimer's centres which have to close through lack of use.

Madness in its way....

(snipped)

Alzheimer's is often portrayed in the heartbreaking way of people losing their memory. This is very sad, but what isn't talked about is how difficult it is to look after someone who has advanced Alzheimer's. It's remarkable how physically strong my grandmother became. Caring for someone like that is very challenging

Unfortunately the Alzheimer's Society were only interested in dealing with the easy cases where people would sit quietly and not cause them any trouble.

I'm so sorry to hear this story. So if you have worked your whole life and saved you have to give it all to the local government or you get no help. Right, sounds fair......

It's quite common for people to work hard & save & then use the money to their own advantage.

I've worked hard & saved. It seems perfectly reasonable to me that my assets should fund the care I need if & when I need it. Who else do you think should pay for me?

So other people don't/can't/won't work hard & don't/can't/won't save. Somebody else has to pay for their care, unless you're advocating euthanasia. OK, if the individual has no money the state ( = the taxpayer) steps in. That happens with funerals, too.

But why should taxpayers be expected to fund those who can pay?

Why should Alzheimer's be treated differently from other illnesses?

I'm not so sure that it is treated differently. In my experience, if you have any illness/accident that leads to a situation where you cannot care for yourself, you aren't going to live in hospital. You either go home with a so-called care package or you go to a Care Home.

It's the lack of provision of the two latter that leads to the well-known bed-blocking.

Do the results of the Coughlan Case no longer apply?

Haven't a clue. Only going by my own experience. If it was a legal ruling, then presumably Coughlin does still apply. Does it give Alzheimer's special status?

No, no special status. Used it as the basis of a claim for support for my late father-in-law, and we won, but it was quite a while ago.

tyson

foxinsoxuk said:

another_richard said:

foxinsoxuk said:

another_richard said:

foxinsoxuk said:

another_richard said:

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/albertonardelli/status/822173006151774208

Final call must mean at the back of the queue.

Quite appropriate really - that's where German soldiers have been when its come to dying in American wars.

If we had listened to the Germans rather than the US Republicans, then there would have been far fewer British graves to visit.

Germany was right over the Middle East interventions, We were wrong.

Obama was all for intervention in Libya and Syria and for that matter your heroine Hillary also voted for the Iraq invasion.

There seems to be a pattern - the USA meddles in the Middle East and the Westminster establishment eagerly joins in.

Not my heroine! Check back on my posts, I have never supported the Middle East wars.

You repeatedly said she would be an 'excellent President'.

Quite a niche viewpoint and so easily remembered.

Anyway returning to the original point the lapdog support of Blair, Brown and Cameron to America's wars achieved nothing for this country.

At least when Macmillan or Thatcher or Major backed the USA they got a little respect in return.

She would have been an excellent President. I doubt that I would have liked her foreign policy, but it would have been streets ahead of Trumps Putin arse kissing.

Hillary would have been an excellent president...all that experience and know how.....

All by the by......

Tomorrow is a very dark day. Trump will shortly find that as much as he will like to be
a good president he has to struggle with his brain.....

tlg86

Backed Labour at 13/8 in Copeland, I think that looks a sensible choice of candidate.

Sean_F

The_Apocalypse said:

foxinsoxuk said:

The_Apocalypse said:

As if Obama is a 'hasbeen'. I think Obama, who leaves office with a 60% approval rating will a vocal in opposing the actions of Trump in the coming years. In recent interviews he's implied so. He could very well be more influential as a former President. And there's plently of ground to oppose Trump, with much of the way he's conducted his transition period opposed by Americans.

Meanwhile it's looking still pretty likely that Merkel will be German Chancellor after the German elections in September.

Not many politicians leave office with 60% approval.

Fairly nailed on that Trump will not!

Trump's only on 40% now, and this is the 'honeymoon' period of the Presidency. Even George W. Bush, with all the controversy surrounding the 2000 election had a 60% approval rating at the start of his Presidency.

Doesn't matter. Sean Trende has some excellent Articles on RCP. Rural/small/medium town America is shifting massively Republican, as big city America shifts Democratic. And that hurts the Democrats, as it puts the House and State Assemblies out of reach. It also hurts them in the Senate, as small rural States get the same representation as big urban States.

foxinsoxuk

tlg86 said:

Backed Labour at 13/8 in Copeland, I think that looks a sensible choice of candidate.

Early election, strong local candidate, pro nuclear, long track record of local service, active Christian, health campaigner.

Good value. Second doctor elected for Labour in a year methinks.

tyson

Sean_F said:

The_Apocalypse said:

foxinsoxuk said:

The_Apocalypse said:

As if Obama is a 'hasbeen'. I think Obama, who leaves office with a 60% approval rating will a vocal in opposing the actions of Trump in the coming years. In recent interviews he's implied so. He could very well be more influential as a former President. And there's plently of ground to oppose Trump, with much of the way he's conducted his transition period opposed by Americans.

Meanwhile it's looking still pretty likely that Merkel will be German Chancellor after the German elections in September.

Not many politicians leave office with 60% approval.

Fairly nailed on that Trump will not!

Trump's only on 40% now, and this is the 'honeymoon' period of the Presidency. Even George W. Bush, with all the controversy surrounding the 2000 election had a 60% approval rating at the start of his Presidency.

Doesn't matter. Sean Trende has some excellent Articles on RCP. Rural/small/medium town America is shifting massively Republican, as big city America shifts Democratic. And that hurts the Democrats, as it puts the House and State Assemblies out of reach. It also hurts them in the Senate, as small rural States get the same representation as big urban States.

And...your point is? A good thing, a bad thing?

Sean_F

tyson said:

Sean_F said:

MaxPB said:

Sean_F said:

rcs1000 said:

Sean_F said:

rcs1000 said:

Re Davos.

This is a fabulous time to go skiing in Davos. You drive to Klosters, leave the car in the station car park, and then ski the entire Klosters-Davos ski area, and there's barely a person on the slopes.

It's much, much more fun than a bunch of dreary presentations.

Surely people go to the Davos Summit to get pissed in lovely surroundings.

Sadly, that answer exposes you as someone who has never been to Davos.

It is, without doubt, one of the great eyesores of the Alps. A bunch of large hotels in an unattractive ski town. It is home to the WEF because it possesses lots of 5* Hotels and is very easy to police

I don't mix in such rarefied company. The only part of Switzerland I'm familiar with is the Ticino.

Ticino is where I'd like to retire. Italy without Italians.

I would have agreed, until I stayed on the Istrian Coast.

There are places on Earth which are simply Heaven. South Hams, the Antrim Coast, Rutland, the Yorksire Dales, Istria, Ticino, Granada, Dubrovnik , Lake Maggiore, Capri, Prague, Venice, I'm sure you can add others.

Blackpool and Skelmersdale

I'm not sure they'd be high on my list.

Sean_F

tyson said:

Sean_F said:

The_Apocalypse said:

foxinsoxuk said:

The_Apocalypse said:

As if Obama is a 'hasbeen'. I think Obama, who leaves office with a 60% approval rating will a vocal in opposing the actions of Trump in the coming years. In recent interviews he's implied so. He could very well be more influential as a former President. And there's plently of ground to oppose Trump, with much of the way he's conducted his transition period opposed by Americans.

Meanwhile it's looking still pretty likely that Merkel will be German Chancellor after the German elections in September.

Not many politicians leave office with 60% approval.

Fairly nailed on that Trump will not!

Trump's only on 40% now, and this is the 'honeymoon' period of the Presidency. Even George W. Bush, with all the controversy surrounding the 2000 election had a 60% approval rating at the start of his Presidency.

Doesn't matter. Sean Trende has some excellent Articles on RCP. Rural/small/medium town America is shifting massively Republican, as big city America shifts Democratic. And that hurts the Democrats, as it puts the House and State Assemblies out of reach. It also hurts them in the Senate, as small rural States get the same representation as big urban States.

And...your point is? A good thing, a bad thing?

My observation is that Trump's popularity won't matter much, unless the Democrats choose someone who can win voters in such places (as Bill Clinton could).

Big_G_NorthWales

foxinsoxuk said:

tlg86 said:

Backed Labour at 13/8 in Copeland, I think that looks a sensible choice of candidate.

Early election, strong local candidate, pro nuclear, long track record of local service, active Christian, health campaigner.

Good value. Second doctor elected for Labour in a year methinks.

Wasn't the conservative in Sleaford a doctor

foxinsoxuk

Big_G_NorthWales said:

foxinsoxuk said:

tlg86 said:

Backed Labour at 13/8 in Copeland, I think that looks a sensible choice of candidate.

Early election, strong local candidate, pro nuclear, long track record of local service, active Christian, health campaigner.

Good value. Second doctor elected for Labour in a year methinks.

Wasn't the conservative in Sleaford a doctor

I think so. Medical mafia taking over this year!

Another doctor planning to stand for Tories too.

http://www.bowgroup.org/policy/copeland-needs-real-conservative

tyson

foxinsoxuk said:

tlg86 said:

Backed Labour at 13/8 in Copeland, I think that looks a sensible choice of candidate.

Early election, strong local candidate, pro nuclear, long track record of local service, active Christian, health campaigner.

Good value. Second doctor elected for Labour in a year methinks.

Mostly good....but belief in supernatural, really archaic entities is a bit of a problem;

I can just about cope with modern religions like Scientology and Trekkies....but anything that comes before, Islam and even before, Christianity....a bit bonkers....

JonnyJimmy

There was, it seems, a fair bit of talk about political anagrams on the last thread which I missed.

Missing it won't stop me mentioning my two brilliant anagrams from the 2015 election..

Edward Miliband - weird amid bland

Scottish National Party - I train total sycophants

tyson

Sean_F said:

tyson said:

Sean_F said:

The_Apocalypse said:

foxinsoxuk said:

The_Apocalypse said:

As if Obama is a 'hasbeen'. I think Obama, who leaves office with a 60% approval rating will a vocal in opposing the actions of Trump in the coming years. In recent interviews he's implied so. He could very well be more influential as a former President. And there's plently of ground to oppose Trump, with much of the way he's conducted his transition period opposed by Americans.

Meanwhile it's looking still pretty likely that Merkel will be German Chancellor after the German elections in September.

Not many politicians leave office with 60% approval.

Fairly nailed on that Trump will not!

Trump's only on 40% now, and this is the 'honeymoon' period of the Presidency. Even George W. Bush, with all the controversy surrounding the 2000 election had a 60% approval rating at the start of his Presidency.

Doesn't matter. Sean Trende has some excellent Articles on RCP. Rural/small/medium town America is shifting massively Republican, as big city America shifts Democratic. And that hurts the Democrats, as it puts the House and State Assemblies out of reach. It also hurts them in the Senate, as small rural States get the same representation as big urban States.

And...your point is? A good thing, a bad thing?

My observation is that Trump's popularity won't matter much, unless the Democrats choose someone who can win voters in such places (as Bill Clinton could).

Fair point

JonnyJimmy

New entry for the Uxbridge English Dictionary:

Corbyn - Wow, throw it away

JonnyJimmy

JonnyJimmy said:

New entry for the Uxbridge English Dictionary:

Corbyn - Wow, throw it away

Country File - a friend of Donald

foxinsoxuk

tyson said:

foxinsoxuk said:

tlg86 said:

Backed Labour at 13/8 in Copeland, I think that looks a sensible choice of candidate.

Early election, strong local candidate, pro nuclear, long track record of local service, active Christian, health campaigner.

Good value. Second doctor elected for Labour in a year methinks.

Mostly good....but belief in supernatural, really archaic entities is a bit of a problem;

I can just about cope with modern religions like Scientology and Trekkies....but anything that comes before, Islam and even before, Christianity....a bit bonkers....

Quite a plus in Copeland, I would think.

The local tories don't seem to have noticed that she campaigned against Corbyn last summer:

http://www.cumbriacrack.com/2017/01/19/gillian-troughton-selected-labour-party-candidate-copeland-election/

tyson

Big_G_NorthWales said:

foxinsoxuk said:

tlg86 said:

Backed Labour at 13/8 in Copeland, I think that looks a sensible choice of candidate.

Early election, strong local candidate, pro nuclear, long track record of local service, active Christian, health campaigner.

Good value. Second doctor elected for Labour in a year methinks.

Wasn't the conservative in Sleaford a doctor

Big G

The best thing out of Sleaford are the Mods, the Sleaford Mods.....Fox will know them....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFz9EdygOtM

Please do not let your better half listen to them mind.....

Seriously, they are an excellent band, in the best traditions of challenging lefty protest music....

Austerity Dogs......I love it....