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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Labour’s problems go well beyond Corbyn – it’s just that they’

SystemSystem Posts: 11,009
edited April 2017 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Labour’s problems go well beyond Corbyn – it’s just that they’re not part of the main political conversation of the day

Jeremy Corbyn reacts angrily to a question from @PaulBrandITV about his leadership https://t.co/oxUZs7yWuj pic.twitter.com/9VD4gsXsZc

Read the full story here


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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited April 2017
    First, unlike Labour will ever be under Corbyn


    Yesterday was a cracking day for Labour....

    Keir Starmer apparently now also shadow minister for exit from UK

    Jezza claiming life expectancy falling, when it is rising

    Jezza arguing the nasty media lie about him

    Jezza's long time buddy not removed from the party for repeating claiming total BS about Hitler and the Jews...tough on antisemitism, tough on the causes of antisemtism...

    We are going to have to invent a new word for the GE campaign, because clusterf##k and omnishambles just won't do it justice.
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,230
    edited April 2017
    Woohoo. Second unlike Labour.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,579
    Third! Like SLAB.....
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,579
    Arf! The NATS poke fun at SCON needing to hire small rooms for meetings, then boast that Sturgeon was a 'sell out':

    http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-39489107
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    nunununu Posts: 6,024
    edited April 2017
    Moderator - Graphic image warning (dead people)

    twitter.com/Khanoisseur/status/849310028599357441/photo/1
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,579
    edited April 2017
    nunu said:

    twitter.com/Khanoisseur/status/849310028599357441/photo/1

    Would you mind editing that so the graphic images do not immediately display - and add an appropriate warning?

    Edit - I see your 6 minutes are up - MODS?
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    nunununu Posts: 6,024

    nunu said:

    twitter.com/Khanoisseur/status/849310028599357441/photo/1

    Would you mind editing that so the graphic images do not immediately display - and add an appropriate warning?

    Edit - I see your 6 minutes are up - MODS?
    6 mins?
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,579
    nunu said:

    nunu said:

    twitter.com/Khanoisseur/status/849310028599357441/photo/1

    Would you mind editing that so the graphic images do not immediately display - and add an appropriate warning?

    Edit - I see your 6 minutes are up - MODS?
    6 mins?
    You have 6 minutes to edit the post yourself, after that you can't.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,579
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/apr/04/syria-gas-attack-trump-us-foreign-policy?CMP=share_btn_tw

    Analysis of the Trump administration response to the Syrian gas attack:


  • Options
    surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549

    First, unlike Labour will ever be under Corbyn


    Yesterday was a cracking day for Labour....

    Keir Starmer apparently now also shadow minister for exit from UK

    Jezza claiming life expectancy falling, when it is rising

    Jezza arguing the nasty media lie about him

    Jezza's long time buddy not removed from the party for repeating claiming total BS about Hitler and the Jews...tough on antisemitism, tough on the causes of antisemtism...

    We are going to have to invent a new word for the GE campaign, because clusterf##k and omnishambles just won't do it justice.

    "Keir Starmer apparently now also shadow minister for exit from UK" -

    He has been that for sometime. Where have you been ?
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,230

    Third! Like SLAB.....

    On a good day....
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    rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,907

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/apr/04/syria-gas-attack-trump-us-foreign-policy?CMP=share_btn_tw

    Analysis of the Trump administration response to the Syrian gas attack:

    We have got years more of this....
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,579
    surbiton said:

    First, unlike Labour will ever be under Corbyn


    Yesterday was a cracking day for Labour....

    Keir Starmer apparently now also shadow minister for exit from UK

    Jezza claiming life expectancy falling, when it is rising

    Jezza arguing the nasty media lie about him

    Jezza's long time buddy not removed from the party for repeating claiming total BS about Hitler and the Jews...tough on antisemitism, tough on the causes of antisemtism...

    We are going to have to invent a new word for the GE campaign, because clusterf##k and omnishambles just won't do it justice.

    "Keir Starmer apparently now also shadow minister for exit from UK" -

    He has been that for sometime. Where have you been ?
    Really? I thought we were exiting the EU?
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    PBModeratorPBModerator Posts: 661
    Moderator Notice

    @nunu and all - please be careful when directly linking to graphic images like that on Twitter, their image filtering rules do not apply here, and the image is always displayed.

    Place the link within the HTML URL tags, or delete the http at the start of the address to prevent it being embedded. Most importantly, please add a warning to the top of your post so users know what they are letting themselves in for.
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    Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905
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    JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    Jacobite News Network Exclusive - Ken Livingstone has issued the following statement after addressing a meeting of the Zionists For Zyclon B Society :

    "Yesterdays gassing by the Israeli state of Syrian refugees clearly shows their utter disdain for the leadership of the Labour party under Jeremy Corbyn. Has the Jerusalem government not learnt anything from the voluntary experiments at Auschwitz, Belsen and Dachau where millions of Jewish holiday makers were killed by accident after slipping in the showers whilst members of the SS poured the wrong shower gel into the communal plumbing system. They should of course in line with Labour EU policy have employed Polish plumbers."
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    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,931
    surbiton said:

    First, unlike Labour will ever be under Corbyn


    Yesterday was a cracking day for Labour....

    Keir Starmer apparently now also shadow minister for exit from UK

    Jezza claiming life expectancy falling, when it is rising

    Jezza arguing the nasty media lie about him

    Jezza's long time buddy not removed from the party for repeating claiming total BS about Hitler and the Jews...tough on antisemitism, tough on the causes of antisemtism...

    We are going to have to invent a new word for the GE campaign, because clusterf##k and omnishambles just won't do it justice.

    "Keir Starmer apparently now also shadow minister for exit from UK" -

    He has been that for sometime. Where have you been ?
    Isn’t that Malc’s line?
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,280
    "There’s some merit in his complaint. Labour is saying things about a wide range of issues at the moment but the problem is nobody’s wanting to listen. "

    Exactly. Anyone who has a modicum of sympathy with Corbyn's position will agree with him that the MSM are to blame.
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,034
    Chris Deerin: England has gone mad

    https://capx.co/england-has-gone-mad/
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,754

    Chris Deerin: England has gone mad

    https://capx.co/england-has-gone-mad/

    Alan Brooke : William Glenn already is
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,579

    Chris Deerin: England has gone mad

    https://capx.co/england-has-gone-mad/

    Scotland too:

    “It’s a strange thing, starting to think that your homeland may be a bit dim”.....

    The general thrust of the piece was that a nation that had once been the cradle of the Enlightenment was in its modern-day guise much diminished, populated by unhinged, spittle-flecked conspiracy theorists who believed in secret oil fields, MI5 plots and rigged polls; and that its relentless, exhausting constitutional self-obsession squeezed out any debate about public policy that might make an actual difference to people’s lives.
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    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,322
    Betting post:
    The only French all-candidate debate is over and worth paying attention to. Melanchon won on performance and virtually tied on programme. Le Pen was 4th. The odds look wildly out of line: Debate report here:
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/apr/05/french-presidential-debate-macron-le-pen
    Polls here:
    https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/#/politics

    Macron: Poll 25 (and 60-40 in round 2), odds 1.73, my position +204
    Le Pen poll 25, odds 4.5, my position -216
    Melanchon poll 15.5, odds30, my position +180
    Fillon poll 17.5, odds 5.9, my position -23
    Hamon poll 10, odds 280, my position -9

    DYOR, but if I had the cash I'd bet Macron down to 1.5 and put another £10 on Melanchon as a trading bet - I think he should go down to 20 or so when a poll shows him ovrtaking Fillon. Fillon's odds are puzzlingly good and possibly there's Russian money there - if so, you may as well take their unwise dosh. Hamon could be laid but the silly lay price of 360 makes it unappealing - actually worse than Asselineau, whose poll rating is zero point 5 per cent.
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    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,138
    I am not entirely sure what Corbyn is complaining about. What Labour was doing yesterday was refusing to expel Livingston and it got plenty of coverage.

    But there really isn't much more to say on this. Surely 1 more month and this will be over.
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    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,855
    Morning. So how many of the Labour MPs emoting that enough was enough last night, are actually going to do something about it?

    A couple of Shadow Cabinet resignations really isn't going to cut it this time, the rot isn't going to stop until MPs start resigning from the party, even if they don't have it in them to cross the floor.

    If they want to go with the SDP2 option, they can have Anna Soubry as a free bonus MP - I'm sure Broxtowe Conservatives won't miss her too much.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,579
    Just a bonus!

    The North Sea oil and gas sector became a net drain on the UK’s public finances for the first time in 2016, Carbon Brief analysis shows.

    In total, the sector received £396m in 2016, net of tax payments. This is the first year that the North Sea industry has cost the exchequer more than it has contributed.


    https://www.carbonbrief.org/analysis-north-sea-industry-cost-uk-taxpayers-396m-2016?utm_content=buffer79abf&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,579
    rkrkrk said:

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/apr/04/syria-gas-attack-trump-us-foreign-policy?CMP=share_btn_tw

    Analysis of the Trump administration response to the Syrian gas attack:

    We have got years more of this....
    https://twitter.com/brianklaas/status/849414410305245184
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    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,931

    rkrkrk said:

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/apr/04/syria-gas-attack-trump-us-foreign-policy?CMP=share_btn_tw

    Analysis of the Trump administration response to the Syrian gas attack:

    We have got years more of this....
    https://twitter.com/brianklaas/status/849414410305245184
    Only three and three-quarters, hopefully.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,121

    rkrkrk said:

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/apr/04/syria-gas-attack-trump-us-foreign-policy?CMP=share_btn_tw

    Analysis of the Trump administration response to the Syrian gas attack:

    We have got years more of this....
    https://twitter.com/brianklaas/status/849414410305245184
    Only three and three-quarters, hopefully.
    Unless the Dims decide to run Hilary again.

    They might just be stupid enough to do it too.
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,280
    We seem to have an impressive number of French linguists on pb.com judging by how many were watching the debate yesterday.

    Or, is there a simpler subtitle option that makes it slightly more accessible and there are more philistines out there than at first I thought? ;-)
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    rkrkrk said:

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/apr/04/syria-gas-attack-trump-us-foreign-policy?CMP=share_btn_tw

    Analysis of the Trump administration response to the Syrian gas attack:

    We have got years more of this....
    https://twitter.com/brianklaas/status/849414410305245184
    I haven't read the statement but Pbama and Miliband deserve to be condemned for their behaviour over Syria.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,121
    edited April 2017

    "There’s some merit in his complaint. Labour is saying things about a wide range of issues at the moment but the problem is nobody’s wanting to listen. "

    Exactly. Anyone who has a modicum of sympathy with Corbyn's position will agree with him that the MSM are to blame.

    That may be just as well. Here are his policies:

    http://www.jeremyforlabour.com/policies

    I haven't read such a vacuous set of pointless cliches since the last time I read an op-ed piece by Tristram Hunt. Many of them differ from current Tory policy in name only (see that house building pledge). Even the policy on education is based on a complete misunderstanding of what's actually going on so would not cause any change in practice,

    Where he does have clearly different policies - e.g. on Trident - they tend to be, to put it mildly, controversial.

    I have long thought the real problem with Corbyn is not that he's basically nasty, although he is, or that he's intellectually deficient, although he's that too, or that his supporters appear to be suffering from some form of quasi-religious hysteria, although they are. What will kill him in an election campaign is that people won't vote for his policies. And there's nothing that he will do about it because he's kidding himself that when people know about them, they'll love him.
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    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,931
    ydoethur said:

    rkrkrk said:

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/apr/04/syria-gas-attack-trump-us-foreign-policy?CMP=share_btn_tw

    Analysis of the Trump administration response to the Syrian gas attack:

    We have got years more of this....
    https://twitter.com/brianklaas/status/849414410305245184
    Only three and three-quarters, hopefully.
    Unless the Dims decide to run Hilary again.

    They might just be stupid enough to do it too.
    Quos Deus vult perdere, prius dementat, eh? Od course, that’s God rather than ‘the gods’.
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    SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    Sandpit said:

    Morning. So how many of the Labour MPs emoting that enough was enough last night, are actually going to do something about it?

    A couple of Shadow Cabinet resignations really isn't going to cut it this time, the rot isn't going to stop until MPs start resigning from the party, even if they don't have it in them to cross the floor.

    If they want to go with the SDP2 option, they can have Anna Soubry as a free bonus MP - I'm sure Broxtowe Conservatives won't miss her too much.
    I doubt there is much chance of the fragrant Ms Soubry defecting.
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    MonksfieldMonksfield Posts: 2,202
    edited April 2017

    Chris Deerin: England has gone mad

    https://capx.co/england-has-gone-mad/

    Febrile is the word! I can feel a monkey hanging coming on somewhere....
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    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,818

    Chris Deerin: England has gone mad

    https://capx.co/england-has-gone-mad/

    Scotland too:

    “It’s a strange thing, starting to think that your homeland may be a bit dim”.....

    The general thrust of the piece was that a nation that had once been the cradle of the Enlightenment was in its modern-day guise much diminished, populated by unhinged, spittle-flecked conspiracy theorists who believed in secret oil fields, MI5 plots and rigged polls; and that its relentless, exhausting constitutional self-obsession squeezed out any debate about public policy that might make an actual difference to people’s lives.
    Good old Toom Tabard, never short of bile and hatred for Scotland. What a saddo.
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    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,818

    Just a bonus!

    The North Sea oil and gas sector became a net drain on the UK’s public finances for the first time in 2016, Carbon Brief analysis shows.

    In total, the sector received £396m in 2016, net of tax payments. This is the first year that the North Sea industry has cost the exchequer more than it has contributed.


    https://www.carbonbrief.org/analysis-north-sea-industry-cost-uk-taxpayers-396m-2016?utm_content=buffer79abf&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

    Long may it continue
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    SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    malcolmg said:

    Chris Deerin: England has gone mad

    https://capx.co/england-has-gone-mad/

    Scotland too:

    “It’s a strange thing, starting to think that your homeland may be a bit dim”.....

    The general thrust of the piece was that a nation that had once been the cradle of the Enlightenment was in its modern-day guise much diminished, populated by unhinged, spittle-flecked conspiracy theorists who believed in secret oil fields, MI5 plots and rigged polls; and that its relentless, exhausting constitutional self-obsession squeezed out any debate about public policy that might make an actual difference to people’s lives.
    Good old Toom Tabard, never short of bile and hatred for Scotland. What a saddo.

    Good old Malcy G, never short of bile and hatred for The UK/England
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,903
    edited April 2017

    We seem to have an impressive number of French linguists on pb.com judging by how many were watching the debate yesterday.

    Or, is there a simpler subtitle option that makes it slightly more accessible and there are more philistines out there than at first I thought? ;-)

    Body language, tone & the odd sentence. Poutou was an amusingly fast speaker.

    Melenchon has come in slightly at Macron's expense, which is fine as I have him as a slightly better result.

    Poutou -> Melenchon -> Macron -> Dupont Aignon (All +ve)
    ->
    Uncle Tom Cobley -> Hamon -> Asselineau -> Fillon / Le Pen (All -ve)

    is my results order now.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,121
    Malcolm

    Why have you got a photograph of Miss Marple as your new avatar?
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,579
    ydoethur said:

    Malcolm

    Why have you got a photograph of Miss Marple as your new avatar?

    It's Malcolm in drag! Clears the streets of Ayr on a Friday night....
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,579
    the Labour Party, the decaying tree under whose shadow nothing can grow.

    http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2017/04/progress-occur-labour-its-current-form-must-bow-out
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    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,818

    malcolmg said:

    Chris Deerin: England has gone mad

    https://capx.co/england-has-gone-mad/

    Scotland too:

    “It’s a strange thing, starting to think that your homeland may be a bit dim”.....

    The general thrust of the piece was that a nation that had once been the cradle of the Enlightenment was in its modern-day guise much diminished, populated by unhinged, spittle-flecked conspiracy theorists who believed in secret oil fields, MI5 plots and rigged polls; and that its relentless, exhausting constitutional self-obsession squeezed out any debate about public policy that might make an actual difference to people’s lives.
    Good old Toom Tabard, never short of bile and hatred for Scotland. What a saddo.

    Good old Malcy G, never short of bile and hatred for The UK/England
    I see as ever you are clueless and have nothing to say. Time for school little boy.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,971
    Good morning, my fellow jam enthusiasts.

    Not sure I agree Corbyn will toddle off. He might, but he's had plenty of opportunity so far.

    Maybe the PLP will try another challenge and a big hitter will actually tilt at the job.
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    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,818

    ydoethur said:

    Malcolm

    Why have you got a photograph of Miss Marple as your new avatar?

    It's Malcolm in drag! Clears the streets of Ayr on a Friday night....
    It is a tribute to you
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,818
    ydoethur said:

    Malcolm

    Why have you got a photograph of Miss Marple as your new avatar?

    It is Carlotta, she is my hero so I thought I would put her picture up in tribute.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,675
    His frustration is understandable but amounts to him throwing a wobbler because the media wontvreport enough in what he wants. He might suffer that more than some, but does he think the media reports everything the others want? No.

    Well we could talk about what labour is doing with Ken if you like, Jeremy?
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,675

    the Labour Party, the decaying tree under whose shadow nothing can grow.

    http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2017/04/progress-occur-labour-its-current-form-must-bow-out

    Hyperbole is alive and well I see.
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    SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    Morning all.

    Corbyn does not handle interviews well, that clip reminded me of Bilbo seeing the Ring again.
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    chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    edited April 2017

    EU wants to 'cherry pick':

    Diplomatic momentum is growing in Brussels for an interim trade deal with the U.K. that sets no tariffs on manufactured goods and food but restricts British services such as aviation and finance.

    http://www.politico.eu/article/eu-sketches-out-interim-uk-trade-deal-that-hits-services-hard/amp/

    You mean the Germans will still want to sell us BMWs? Surely not?

    That moment when they put this forward and Theresa says, "there can be no cherry picking of the UK single market" is going to be delicious.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,675
    DavidL said:

    I am not entirely sure what Corbyn is complaining about. What Labour was doing yesterday was refusing to expel Livingston and it got plenty of coverage.

    But there really isn't much more to say on this. Surely 1 more month and this will be over.

    An optimist I see. Expectations have been lowered massively, so it would be easy for theleadership to claim it was a good result, given the disloyal and the media. And I dont see why the cumulative weight would finally cause the membership to wake up.

    But one last time - corbyn, if the media obsesses over your leadership, it's still your fault because you're incapable of changing the narrative.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,579
    kle4 said:

    the Labour Party, the decaying tree under whose shadow nothing can grow.

    http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2017/04/progress-occur-labour-its-current-form-must-bow-out

    Hyperbole is alive and well I see.
    Well, the author did go to Fenpoly, so a little hysteria is to be expected.....

    http://www.hist.cam.ac.uk/directory/dwr12@cam.ac.uk
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    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,931
    edited April 2017
    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Chris Deerin: England has gone mad

    https://capx.co/england-has-gone-mad/

    Scotland too:

    “It’s a strange thing, starting to think that your homeland may be a bit dim”.....

    The general thrust of the piece was that a nation that had once been the cradle of the Enlightenment was in its modern-day guise much diminished, populated by unhinged, spittle-flecked conspiracy theorists who believed in secret oil fields, MI5 plots and rigged polls; and that its relentless, exhausting constitutional self-obsession squeezed out any debate about public policy that might make an actual difference to people’s lives.
    Good old Toom Tabard, never short of bile and hatred for Scotland. What a saddo.

    Good old Malcy G, never short of bile and hatred for The UK/England
    I see as ever you are clueless and have nothing to say. Time for school little boy.
    It’s the Easter break. Most places.
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    SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Chris Deerin: England has gone mad

    https://capx.co/england-has-gone-mad/

    Scotland too:

    “It’s a strange thing, starting to think that your homeland may be a bit dim”.....

    The general thrust of the piece was that a nation that had once been the cradle of the Enlightenment was in its modern-day guise much diminished, populated by unhinged, spittle-flecked conspiracy theorists who believed in secret oil fields, MI5 plots and rigged polls; and that its relentless, exhausting constitutional self-obsession squeezed out any debate about public policy that might make an actual difference to people’s lives.
    Good old Toom Tabard, never short of bile and hatred for Scotland. What a saddo.

    Good old Malcy G, never short of bile and hatred for The UK/England
    I see as ever you are clueless and have nothing to say. Time for school little boy.
    Its your standard playbook, anyone who posts contrary opinions to Malcy G gets abused or belittled..
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    Good morning, my fellow jam enthusiasts.

    Not sure I agree Corbyn will toddle off. He might, but he's had plenty of opportunity so far.

    Maybe the PLP will try another challenge and a big hitter will actually tilt at the job.

    Who the fuck would that be then Mr Wifflestick? I can't think of one.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,971
    Mr. Patrick, Labour big hitters, or jam enthusiasts?
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,163
    Morning all,

    Well, well, well, it seems Tony Blair was right to try every possible way to block Ken Livingtson from standing as a Labour London Mayor candidate.
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    Mr. Patrick, Labour big hitters, or jam enthusiasts?

    A very astute question MD. I was asking about Labour big hitters. As rare as hen's teeth and unicorn shit.
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    notmenotme Posts: 3,293
    kle4 said:

    the Labour Party, the decaying tree under whose shadow nothing can grow.

    http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2017/04/progress-occur-labour-its-current-form-must-bow-out

    Hyperbole is alive and well I see.
    24 hours to save the Labour Party?

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    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901
    edited April 2017
    I quite liked some of what Corbyn said yesterday. I have no problem with him getting angry. There is a lot to be angry about.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,675
    edited April 2017
    If Ken was suspended for bringing the party into disrepute by his remarks, even if his punishment was too light for his internal critics, then shouldn't he immediately be investigated again and expelled since he keeps now repeating those remarks?

    If not, then the party doesn't think his remarks bring the party into disrepute, they really are just punishing him for the initial furore it caused, like he claims.
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    Off topic: I note that that nice Mrs May has decided to not wear a headscarf whilst visiting the Wahhabists. Attagirl.
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,163
    Jonathan said:

    I quite liked some of what Corbyn said yesterday. I have no problem with him getting angry. There is a lot to be angry about.

    Him getting angry changes nothing. Him getting out of the way changes everything. He is without doubt a disaster for Labour. Nobody is listening to him or the party.

    As Jess Philips said yesterday:

    there is "nothing socialist about knowing that you were going to make the people you cared about the poorer".

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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,675
    Jonathan said:

    I quite liked some of what Corbyn said yesterday. I have no problem with him getting angry. There is a lot to be angry about.

    That may be so, and if this is to herald an aggressive new style, that'd be something. More likely though its just him having a whinge, like people not reporting parish council gains. Brexit and his leadership are why Labour are struggling to get into the news, its certainly not the case only the government case gets out there.
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    Jonathan said:

    I quite liked some of what Corbyn said yesterday. I have no problem with him getting angry. There is a lot to be angry about.

    Of all the things you are angry about which ones were not Gordon Brown's fault one way or other?
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    JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    malcolmg said:

    ydoethur said:

    Malcolm

    Why have you got a photograph of Miss Marple as your new avatar?

    It is Carlotta, she is my hero so I thought I would put her picture up in tribute.
    You're being a wee bit naughty Malcolm .. :smile:

    I think that avatar is of Margaret Rutherford as Professor Hatton-Jones in "Passport to Pimlico". Malcolm is making a subtle reference to his belief that England is a vassal state of Scotland and when England leaves the EU the newly formed Scottish/Burgundian nation will have to bail out the impoverished English with food parcels of haggis and Irn Bru.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,675
    edited April 2017
    Patrick said:

    Jonathan said:

    I quite liked some of what Corbyn said yesterday. I have no problem with him getting angry. There is a lot to be angry about.

    Of all the things you are angry about which ones were not Gordon Brown's fault one way or other?
    We're 7 years in to this government - even things that were his fault, this government should have a grip on or have solved by now. All parties blame their predessors in power, but personally I think the time period on that being reasonable has passed. And that's a reasonable expectation - its why we elect and reelect in 4-5 year terms, since we expect them to stand on their record after that time, even if the problems from the last lot were huge.
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,957
    The problem for Corbyn is that Ed Miliband had some excellent local election results in 2012 and 2013 making significant gains and beating the Tories in voteshare at both elections and he also frequently led the polls. Given Corbyn' s current polling he is likely to lose seats and voteshare to the Tories
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,675
    HYUFD said:

    The problem for Corbyn is that Ed Miliband had some excellent local election results in 2012 and 2013 making significant gains and beating the Tories in voteshare at both elections and he also frequently led the polls. Given Corbyn' s current polling he is likely to lose seats and voteshare to the Tories

    A mere detail of history, Corbynism is about the FUTURE!
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,957
    edited April 2017
    May suggests free movement will continue for an 'implementation phase' post Brexit, sensible perhaps but at last gives UKIP something to latch onto before the County council elections
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39498647
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    glwglw Posts: 9,549
    Hitler.

    As bad as the stuff Ken has said is, it's nowhere near as bad as the things his defenders are saying on Twitter. There appear to be a lot of deeply strange Labour supporters out there.
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    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,187
    kle4 said:

    DavidL said:

    I am not entirely sure what Corbyn is complaining about. What Labour was doing yesterday was refusing to expel Livingston and it got plenty of coverage.

    But there really isn't much more to say on this. Surely 1 more month and this will be over.

    An optimist I see. Expectations have been lowered massively, so it would be easy for theleadership to claim it was a good result, given the disloyal and the media. And I dont see why the cumulative weight would finally cause the membership to wake up.

    But one last time - corbyn, if the media obsesses over your leadership, it's still your fault because you're incapable of changing the narrative.
    Yes, I meant to say yesterday that I wonder if the pundits are being asked to moderate their predictions so that if Labour have a terrrrible night, the shock won't be limited by already low expectations.
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    JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    Sources are telling the JNN that Ken Livingstone is considering making a speech in Stamford Hill tonight entitled :

    A Final Solution To My Jewish Problem And The Labour Party.
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,163
    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:

    The problem for Corbyn is that Ed Miliband had some excellent local election results in 2012 and 2013 making significant gains and beating the Tories in voteshare at both elections and he also frequently led the polls. Given Corbyn' s current polling he is likely to lose seats and voteshare to the Tories

    A mere detail of history, Corbynism is about the FUTURE!
    Indeed he is: Tory party's future.
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    JackW said:

    You're being a wee bit naughty Malcolm .. :smile:

    I think that avatar is of Margaret Rutherford as Professor Hatton-Jones in "Passport to Pimlico". Malcolm is making a subtle reference to his belief that England is a vassal state of Scotland and when England leaves the EU the newly formed Scottish/Burgundian nation will have to bail out the impoverished English with food parcels of haggis and Irn Bru.

    Malcolm is channeling Alex Massie in yesterday's Times
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,034
    notme said:

    kle4 said:

    the Labour Party, the decaying tree under whose shadow nothing can grow.

    http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2017/04/progress-occur-labour-its-current-form-must-bow-out

    Hyperbole is alive and well I see.
    24 hours to save the Labour Party?
    From brutal Tory cuts?
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    [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    edited April 2017
    kle4 said:

    Patrick said:

    Jonathan said:

    I quite liked some of what Corbyn said yesterday. I have no problem with him getting angry. There is a lot to be angry about.

    Of all the things you are angry about which ones were not Gordon Brown's fault one way or other?
    We're 7 years in to this government - even things that were his fault, this government should have a grip on or have solved by now. All parties blame their predessors in power, but personally I think the time period on that being reasonable has passed. And that's a reasonable expectation - its why we elect and reelect in 4-5 year terms, since we expect them to stand on their record after that time, even if the problems from the last lot were huge.
    OK.
    How big should our deficit be right now and were you agitating during Osbnorne's time that 'austerity' wasn't being hard enough? Seems not. Is 7 years enough to eliminate a £160bn overspend? Are you advocating cuts now? Or are you a hypocrite?
    New Labour immigration and 'rub their noses in it'. What should the government do? Mount the Wayback machine and recast history? Brexit was Tony n Gordo's doing.
    The ugly truth is that when Labour do very occasionally get in to power they invariably cause a clusterfuck, and that the time needed to deliver on Project Unclusterfuck is a decade or more.
    Please can this country get itself a not clownishly incompetent centre left party.
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,976

    Chris Deerin: England has gone mad

    https://capx.co/england-has-gone-mad/

    And he's an instinctive Unionist.
    To modify the standard unbalanced union argument, d'ye stick with your own unhinged, spittle-flecked conspiracy theorists, or remain sat on by your much larger neighbour with (at least) 10 times as many, and some of them in government?
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,163
    JackW said:

    Sources are telling the JNN that Ken Livingstone is considering making a speech in Stamford Hill tonight entitled :

    A Final Solution To My Jewish Problem And The Labour Party.

    Surely he is flying out to Wannsee for the meeting?
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    rottenborough Posts: 9,035
    7:29AM
    Morning all,

    Well, well, well, it seems Tony Blair was right to try every possible way to block Ken Livingtson from standing as a Labour London Mayor candidate.

    Well he blocked him the first time then welcomed him back the second. Typical Blair, really, big on grandstanding, but then never quite following through. Anyway it is all his fault. He should never have let him back in. So what if Ken had won the second mayoral election, would that have significanly hurt Labour?
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,163
    May be not over:

    ((Dan Hodges)))‏Verified account @DPJHodges 1m1 minute ago
    More
    Understand statement Livingstone made going into the hearing, about Jewish collaborators, may not have been factored in by the inquiry.
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    notmenotme Posts: 3,293

    notme said:

    kle4 said:

    the Labour Party, the decaying tree under whose shadow nothing can grow.

    http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2017/04/progress-occur-labour-its-current-form-must-bow-out

    Hyperbole is alive and well I see.
    24 hours to save the Labour Party?
    From brutal Tory cuts?
    'Savage' is now the preferred adjective.
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    RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    edited April 2017
    I was shooting an ad with a female celebrity at Paddington station and in the course of a conversation she told me she was number 5 in the 'female celebrity list' which determined the worth of a particular person if you were going to use them in an ad. So had we used number 1 instead of 5 we'd have had to pay more or had we used number 10 we'd have had to pay less.

    I found this very funny but on reflection not surprising. Advertising is pretty scientific and with some smart market research it's not diffiicult to work out which celebrity is of most value to a product and for them to charge accordingly.

    So the idea that Corbyn became angry when someone at ITV questioned the wisdom of Labour using him to sell their message is a strange one. It's a question you would expect never to be far from his mind. The research is there for all to see. He might not like it but if his interest is in selling the Labour brand he'd surely understand why the question is being asked.

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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,957
    Verhofstadt suggests UK common rather than Napoleonic law as reason for Brexit
    https://mobile.twitter.com/DanielJHannan/status/849526582540738560
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    MortimerMortimer Posts: 13,936
    Jonathan said:

    I quite liked some of what Corbyn said yesterday. I have no problem with him getting angry. There is a lot to be angry about.

    Except his anger always seems to be directed at journos....

    Can't wait for a general election campaign. The best day would make Brown's worst look fabulous...
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    notmenotme Posts: 3,293
    tlg86 said:

    kle4 said:

    DavidL said:

    I am not entirely sure what Corbyn is complaining about. What Labour was doing yesterday was refusing to expel Livingston and it got plenty of coverage.

    But there really isn't much more to say on this. Surely 1 more month and this will be over.

    An optimist I see. Expectations have been lowered massively, so it would be easy for theleadership to claim it was a good result, given the disloyal and the media. And I dont see why the cumulative weight would finally cause the membership to wake up.

    But one last time - corbyn, if the media obsesses over your leadership, it's still your fault because you're incapable of changing the narrative.
    Yes, I meant to say yesterday that I wonder if the pundits are being asked to moderate their predictions so that if Labour have a terrrrible night, the shock won't be limited by already low expectations.

    The predictions were well off last year. I do remember Hague and IDS leading into local election which the narrative was "it's a bad night for the tories" yet getting exceptionally good results. We can't discount the possibility of labour holding its own in England and Wales.
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,163
    Mortimer said:

    Jonathan said:

    I quite liked some of what Corbyn said yesterday. I have no problem with him getting angry. There is a lot to be angry about.

    Except his anger always seems to be directed at journos....

    Can't wait for a general election campaign. The best day would make Brown's worst look fabulous...
    Indeed, I am beginning to wish May would cut and run this autumn and provide us with some top-level sport to lighten the gloom of the shortening days.
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,163
    ((Dan Hodges)))‏Verified account @DPJHodges 4m4 minutes ago
    More
    Also understand those comments could potentially form basis of new inquiry. Which would be ironic...
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    Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256

    Chris Deerin: England has gone mad

    https://capx.co/england-has-gone-mad/

    Good piece. Daniel Hannan has one worth reading as well

    https://capx.co/brexit-is-happening-so-lets-all-cheer-up-about-it/
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    glwglw Posts: 9,549
    HYUFD said:

    Verhofstadt suggests UK common rather than Napoleonic law as reason for Brexit
    https://mobile.twitter.com/DanielJHannan/status/849526582540738560

    I agree, it's one of the differences that make the UK less compatible with the EU.
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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,799
    Ken Livingstone latest:

    "The Holocaust was massively exaggerated by Zionist leaders."
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    glwglw Posts: 9,549
    Mortimer said:

    Jonathan said:

    I quite liked some of what Corbyn said yesterday. I have no problem with him getting angry. There is a lot to be angry about.

    Except his anger always seems to be directed at journos....

    Can't wait for a general election campaign. The best day would make Brown's worst look fabulous...
    Something like saying that "bigoted woman" and being caught on tape shortly after meeting the Queen.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,579
    glw said:

    HYUFD said:

    Verhofstadt suggests UK common rather than Napoleonic law as reason for Brexit
    https://mobile.twitter.com/DanielJHannan/status/849526582540738560

    I agree, it's one of the differences that make the UK less compatible with the EU.
    It was a point made by a distinguished Physics Professor - name escapes me - that with Parliament & the Common Law we've got pretty robust error correction systems - yes, governments and electorates can and will get it wrong - but the system reasonably swiftly corrects the error. The EU has no such mechanism - which ultimately leads to egregious uncorrected errors - which sadly often end up being resolved with violence...
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    JackWJackW Posts: 14,787

    JackW said:

    Sources are telling the JNN that Ken Livingstone is considering making a speech in Stamford Hill tonight entitled :

    A Final Solution To My Jewish Problem And The Labour Party.

    Surely he is flying out to Wannsee for the meeting?
    That's next week. Ken is meeting with members of the NHS - National Hamas Service - in a fraternal conference where the main proposals are the safety and health of Jews worldwide by ensuring they wear the Star of David Irving on their cloths. A cheery fashion statement in shades of yellow with a portrait of the famous historian of Jewish culture in the centre.

    Additionally Ken is to institute a Jewish Heath Trust with the first Josef Mengele Bursaries for the advancement of heathcare in Israeli railway stations. Passengers will be allocated to the left and right (mainly leftward) at their final destination for treatment for the devastating pre-existing Jewish condition - breathing.
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    CyanCyan Posts: 1,262
    "Who do you think was most convincing in the debate?" is a strange question to ask people, falling somewhere between "Who will you vote for?" and "Who do you think will win?" Post-debate media babblings about who won are at least as important as who said or didn't say what during the debate itself. Intellectually I would say that Macron did crap. He comes from near the Somme. And Le Pen's policies will mean war with whom exactly? Germany? Strange, then, how the pundits are drooling at talk of war between NATO - or what's left of it - and Russia, and Le Pen ain't so hot on NATO. But who said politics was about logic? It'll be interesting to see the polls on who people say they'll vote for.

    For the time being, it seems that Le Pen may have taken a hit.

    How does this look from Moscow? What will Fancy Bear do next?
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Sean_F said:

    Ken Livingstone latest:

    "The Holocaust was massively exaggerated by Zionist leaders."

    He seriously said that?

    Ken is David Irving and I claim my new threepenny bit.
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    YorkcityYorkcity Posts: 4,382
    Nigel Farage in a speech to EU parliament calls them the Mafia.Italian PM complains changes it to gangsters.
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,034

    glw said:

    HYUFD said:

    Verhofstadt suggests UK common rather than Napoleonic law as reason for Brexit
    https://mobile.twitter.com/DanielJHannan/status/849526582540738560

    I agree, it's one of the differences that make the UK less compatible with the EU.
    It was a point made by a distinguished Physics Professor - name escapes me - that with Parliament & the Common Law we've got pretty robust error correction systems - yes, governments and electorates can and will get it wrong - but the system reasonably swiftly corrects the error. The EU has no such mechanism - which ultimately leads to egregious uncorrected errors - which sadly often end up being resolved with violence...
    As the UK quite clearly suffers from serious errors that have been festering for decades and are politically impossible to correct, that argument only works in theory, not in practice.
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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,249

    Chris Deerin: England has gone mad

    https://capx.co/england-has-gone-mad/

    Good piece. Daniel Hannan has one worth reading as well

    https://capx.co/brexit-is-happening-so-lets-all-cheer-up-about-it/
    Can I be the first PB iconoclast to say that I don't rate Hannan too highly (he is of course competent and articulate) and that article does nothing to make me revise my opinion.

    What is he saying?
This discussion has been closed.