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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » There’s a case for saying that Johnson’s the best equipped to

SystemSystem Posts: 11,018
edited August 2017 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » There’s a case for saying that Johnson’s the best equipped to lead the Tories to Brexit and beyond

Whoever is the PM as we exit the EU will have a massive task on her/his hand selling the Brexit deal or other arrangement to the party and to the country as a whole.

Read the full story here


«13

Comments

  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,955
    First unlike Boris. Would be very surprised if he made the final two.
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,413
    No there isn't.
  • Options
    felixfelix Posts: 15,124
    A well argued piece but I'd be surprised if the party voted for him. personally I'd love to skip a generation - if the party had the courage to go for someone like Esther McVey they could motor again. Of course it won't happen.

    OT : I see the deranged Mr. Chapman is tweeting again quite unpleasantly. He really does come across as one arrogant POS! :)
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,955
    felix said:

    A well argued piece but I'd be surprised if the party voted for him. personally I'd love to skip a generation - if the party had the courage to go for someone like Esther McVey they could motor again. Of course it won't happen.

    OT : I see the deranged Mr. Chapman is tweeting again quite unpleasantly. He really does come across as one arrogant POS! :)

    Skip a generation? She's a year younger than Dave is.
  • Options
    Only Nixon could go to China?
  • Options
    Boris wouldn't get my vote even if he was up against Mark Reckless.

    Incidentally received my Tory member renewal 'card' and as usual it's fallen apart whilst removing it from the letter....
  • Options
    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,986
    edited August 2017
    I cannot see Boris taking over until the Brexit negotiations are over, May is likely to continue until then. After the Brexit negotiations are completed is another matter though. The next Tory leader will have to be a charismatic Leaver who can keep Leave voters from defecting to UKIP if there is seen to be any 'sell out' on the transition period while the fact Boris has also shown he can win over swing voters when his opponent is a left winger, as he twice did in London against Livingstone, also boosts his case of leading the party against Corbyn
  • Options
    Anyhoo the big news is the Hammond/Fox alliance.

    Hammond as PM and Fox as Chancellor by next July at the latest.
  • Options
    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,775
    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
  • Options
    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    dixiedean said:

    First unlike Boris. Would be very surprised if he made the final two.

    In order to be certain to make the final two, he needs to win the support of more than a third of the Tory MP's. I don't think that he can do that. I am not convinced that DD can either. JRM may well be able to do so, as could Rudd or Hammond. What is pretty nailed on is that the most Leaver of the candidates will win the final party vote.

    Though I have a very poor record on forecasting Tory leadership contests!
  • Options
    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Donald Trump at Auschwitz

    'I condemn the violence on both sides'
  • Options
    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,754
    yes, but not a strong one
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    Past his prime, won't happen.

    When he ferreted out of last leadership contest there were rumours, which I found credible, that someone had some serious beans to spill about him if he didn't step aside. That episode will be examined in great detail if he stands again.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,754
    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    better proscribe the SNP then
  • Options
    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,775
    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    Ok - that sounds reasonable, but I'm not sure I'm aware of 'Nazis' doing that.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,383
    edited August 2017
    Just what we need in these becalmed times.

    An abdication.

    The Queen is preparing to abdicate the throne and make Prince Charles the King, according to royal sources.

    Queen Elizabeth, 92, is alleged to have told her inner circle of plans to hang up her crown at the age of 95.


    Clarence House is making no comment about 'Plan Regency', which involves a piece of legislation called the Regency Act coming into force.

    "I have spoken to a number of high-ranking courtiers who made it clear that preparations for a transition are moving ahead at pace," royal commentator for the Daily Mail, Robert Jobson, said.

    "They have all confirmed that a Regency with Charles taking the lead is now, at the very least, a real possibility."


    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/queen-preparing-abdicate-throne-make-10980369

    As someone with Republican tendencies, Charles will do wonders for the Republican movement.
  • Options
    619619 Posts: 1,784
    .
    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    Ok - that sounds reasonable, but I'm not sure I'm aware of 'Nazis' doing that.
    The guy arrested had Nazi stuff on hsi facebook posts and went on previous Nazi rallies
  • Options
    felixfelix Posts: 15,124
    dixiedean said:

    felix said:

    A well argued piece but I'd be surprised if the party voted for him. personally I'd love to skip a generation - if the party had the courage to go for someone like Esther McVey they could motor again. Of course it won't happen.

    OT : I see the deranged Mr. Chapman is tweeting again quite unpleasantly. He really does come across as one arrogant POS! :)

    Skip a generation? She's a year younger than Dave is.
    OK but she is still pretty young compared to May. Also it's more a matter of style and tone than actual age.
  • Options
    619619 Posts: 1,784
    Just because you have a swastika tatto doesnt make you a bad person


    https://twitter.com/aravosis/status/896772219451396096
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,754
    619 said:

    .

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    Ok - that sounds reasonable, but I'm not sure I'm aware of 'Nazis' doing that.
    The guy arrested had Nazi stuff on hsi facebook posts and went on previous Nazi rallies
    Nazi goes to Nazi rallies shock
  • Options
    felixfelix Posts: 15,124
    edited August 2017
    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    1. To be pedantic lose the apostrophe you put in Nazis.
    2. Trump is talking in exactly the same mode as Corbyn about Venezuela - about which the left has nothing to say.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,955
    felix said:

    dixiedean said:

    felix said:

    A well argued piece but I'd be surprised if the party voted for him. personally I'd love to skip a generation - if the party had the courage to go for someone like Esther McVey they could motor again. Of course it won't happen.

    OT : I see the deranged Mr. Chapman is tweeting again quite unpleasantly. He really does come across as one arrogant POS! :)

    Skip a generation? She's a year younger than Dave is.
    OK but she is still pretty young compared to May. Also it's more a matter of style and tone than actual age.
    What are her qualifications? I know she is a Thatcherite who comes across well on TV (as TV professionals do).
  • Options
    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Donald Trump at Auschwitz

    'I condemn the violence on both sides'
    It is pretty astonishing that the Donald has a Jewish daughter, Son in Law and grandchildren, but is not willing to speak out about Nazi flag waving Trump supporters.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,754
    edited August 2017
    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    Ok - that sounds reasonable, but I'm not sure I'm aware of 'Nazis' doing that.
    well there are always the islamonazis driving cars in to people in the UK

    but we look over it, we let it pass by it's not the done thing to talk about it
  • Options
    felixfelix Posts: 15,124
    619 said:

    .

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    Ok - that sounds reasonable, but I'm not sure I'm aware of 'Nazis' doing that.
    The guy arrested had Nazi stuff on hsi facebook posts and went on previous Nazi rallies
    So he has been tried by his peers and convicted already has he? Wow! Justice is very quick over the pond.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,955
    felix said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    1. To be pedantic lose the apostrophe you put in Nazis.
    2. Trump is talking in exactly the same mode as Corbyn about Venezuela - about which the left has nothing to say.
    FEWER....
    However, Corbyn is not and never will be President of Venezuela. So that is not really comparable.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,754

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Donald Trump at Auschwitz

    'I condemn the violence on both sides'
    It is pretty astonishing that the Donald has a Jewish daughter, Son in Law and grandchildren, but is not willing to speak out about Nazi flag waving Trump supporters.
    are you now blaming the jews for it ?
  • Options
    dixiedean said:

    felix said:

    dixiedean said:

    felix said:

    A well argued piece but I'd be surprised if the party voted for him. personally I'd love to skip a generation - if the party had the courage to go for someone like Esther McVey they could motor again. Of course it won't happen.

    OT : I see the deranged Mr. Chapman is tweeting again quite unpleasantly. He really does come across as one arrogant POS! :)

    Skip a generation? She's a year younger than Dave is.
    OK but she is still pretty young compared to May. Also it's more a matter of style and tone than actual age.
    What are her qualifications? I know she is a Thatcherite who comes across well on TV (as TV professionals do).
    She would have made the cabinet in 2015 had she not lost her seat.

    She's far too socially illiberal for my tastes, but I could live with her as party leader.

    She'd eviscerate Corbyn and McDonnell, the latter of which she has form with.
  • Options
    felixfelix Posts: 15,124
    dixiedean said:

    felix said:

    dixiedean said:

    felix said:

    A well argued piece but I'd be surprised if the party voted for him. personally I'd love to skip a generation - if the party had the courage to go for someone like Esther McVey they could motor again. Of course it won't happen.

    OT : I see the deranged Mr. Chapman is tweeting again quite unpleasantly. He really does come across as one arrogant POS! :)

    Skip a generation? She's a year younger than Dave is.
    OK but she is still pretty young compared to May. Also it's more a matter of style and tone than actual age.
    What are her qualifications? I know she is a Thatcherite who comes across well on TV (as TV professionals do).
    I guess May was well qualified when she became leader. Need I say more.
  • Options
    619619 Posts: 1,784

    619 said:

    .

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    Ok - that sounds reasonable, but I'm not sure I'm aware of 'Nazis' doing that.
    The guy arrested had Nazi stuff on hsi facebook posts and went on previous Nazi rallies
    Nazi goes to Nazi rallies shock

    619 said:

    .

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    Ok - that sounds reasonable, but I'm not sure I'm aware of 'Nazis' doing that.
    The guy arrested had Nazi stuff on hsi facebook posts and went on previous Nazi rallies
    Nazi goes to Nazi rallies shock
    Um, its the other guy saying he wasnt a Nazi
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,754
    619 said:

    619 said:

    .

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    Ok - that sounds reasonable, but I'm not sure I'm aware of 'Nazis' doing that.
    The guy arrested had Nazi stuff on hsi facebook posts and went on previous Nazi rallies
    Nazi goes to Nazi rallies shock

    619 said:

    .

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    Ok - that sounds reasonable, but I'm not sure I'm aware of 'Nazis' doing that.
    The guy arrested had Nazi stuff on hsi facebook posts and went on previous Nazi rallies
    Nazi goes to Nazi rallies shock
    Um, its the other guy saying he wasnt a Nazi
    people tell these remarkable things called lies

    I see you think Nazis are incapable of it, but really they are
  • Options
    felixfelix Posts: 15,124
    dixiedean said:

    felix said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    1. To be pedantic lose the apostrophe you put in Nazis.
    2. Trump is talking in exactly the same mode as Corbyn about Venezuela - about which the left has nothing to say.
    FEWER....
    However, Corbyn is not and never will be President of Venezuela. So that is not really comparable.
    The 'less' reference was not me but nice try. It is totally comparableyou just would rather not see it.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,754
  • Options
    felix said:

    dixiedean said:

    felix said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    1. To be pedantic lose the apostrophe you put in Nazis.
    2. Trump is talking in exactly the same mode as Corbyn about Venezuela - about which the left has nothing to say.
    FEWER....
    However, Corbyn is not and never will be President of Venezuela. So that is not really comparable.
    The 'less' reference was not me but nice try. It is totally comparableyou just would rather not see it.
    If I was editing PB today, you would have got a thread entitled

    'Trump and Corbyn, two cheeks of the same arse'
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,607

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    Ok - that sounds reasonable, but I'm not sure I'm aware of 'Nazis' doing that.
    well there are always the islamonazis driving cars in to people in the UK

    but we look over it, we let it pass by it's not the done thing to talk about it
    Come now, those are cars and trucks of peace, culturally enlightening those people with Islamism.
  • Options
    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    Ok - that sounds reasonable, but I'm not sure I'm aware of 'Nazis' doing that.
    well there are always the islamonazis driving cars in to people in the UK

    but we look over it, we let it pass by it's not the done thing to talk about it
    Driving cars at Nazis however...

    https://youtu.be/ZTT1qUswYL0
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,917

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Donald Trump at Auschwitz

    'I condemn the violence on both sides'
    Jeremy Corbyn talking about a brutal dictatorship in Caracas....
  • Options
    619619 Posts: 1,784
  • Options
    Not that I've ever experienced it, but there's almost a religious fervour/devotion among many people when it comes to working for/knowing George Osborne
  • Options
    felixfelix Posts: 15,124
  • Options
    felixfelix Posts: 15,124

    felix said:

    dixiedean said:

    felix said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    1. To be pedantic lose the apostrophe you put in Nazis.
    2. Trump is talking in exactly the same mode as Corbyn about Venezuela - about which the left has nothing to say.
    FEWER....
    However, Corbyn is not and never will be President of Venezuela. So that is not really comparable.
    The 'less' reference was not me but nice try. It is totally comparableyou just would rather not see it.
    If I was editing PB today, you would have got a thread entitled

    'Trump and Corbyn, two cheeks of the same arse'
    Like!
  • Options
    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,974
    edited August 2017

    Just what we need in these becalmed times.

    An abdication.

    The Queen is preparing to abdicate the throne and make Prince Charles the King, according to royal sources.

    Queen Elizabeth, 92, is alleged to have told her inner circle of plans to hang up her crown at the age of 95.


    Clarence House is making no comment about 'Plan Regency', which involves a piece of legislation called the Regency Act coming into force.

    "I have spoken to a number of high-ranking courtiers who made it clear that preparations for a transition are moving ahead at pace," royal commentator for the Daily Mail, Robert Jobson, said.

    "They have all confirmed that a Regency with Charles taking the lead is now, at the very least, a real possibility."


    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/queen-preparing-abdicate-throne-make-10980369

    As someone with Republican tendencies, Charles will do wonders for the Republican movement.

    It's stll August. The silly season. I dread to think, though, what Private Eye will make of this.
    There is, of course, an opportunity for a betting market!
  • Options
    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,775

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    Ok - that sounds reasonable, but I'm not sure I'm aware of 'Nazis' doing that.
    well there are always the islamonazis driving cars in to people in the UK

    but we look over it, we let it pass by it's not the done thing to talk about it
    Bastard, bastard Homo Sapiens.. all of the bad things that have been done in history have been done by them!

    I want less of Mr Smith from 47 Artillery Crescent ramming people, but his actions are not to be held at the door of his Nazi (or otherwise) brethren.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,986

    Just what we need in these becalmed times.

    An abdication.

    The Queen is preparing to abdicate the throne and make Prince Charles the King, according to royal sources.

    Queen Elizabeth, 92, is alleged to have told her inner circle of plans to hang up her crown at the age of 95.


    Clarence House is making no comment about 'Plan Regency', which involves a piece of legislation called the Regency Act coming into force.

    "I have spoken to a number of high-ranking courtiers who made it clear that preparations for a transition are moving ahead at pace," royal commentator for the Daily Mail, Robert Jobson, said.

    "They have all confirmed that a Regency with Charles taking the lead is now, at the very least, a real possibility."


    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/queen-preparing-abdicate-throne-make-10980369

    As someone with Republican tendencies, Charles will do wonders for the Republican movement.

    The last Prince Regent, George IV, did not exactly set a good precedent but he only reigned for a few years as King. I cannot see Charles reigning for long given he is almost 70, he is Edward VII to his mother's Victoria, the future of the monarchy is William, Kate (plus kids) and Harry all of whom have the blood of Diana in them, probably the most world famous, popular, iconic and charismatic figure this country produced in the last half century. If Charles had been succeeded by the offspring of himself and Camilla Parker Bowles I could not see the monarchy lasting long, Diana for all the problems she brought the monarchy has ultimately saved it longer term
  • Options
    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Donald Trump at Auschwitz

    'I condemn the violence on both sides'
    It is pretty astonishing that the Donald has a Jewish daughter, Son in Law and grandchildren, but is not willing to speak out about Nazi flag waving Trump supporters.
    are you now blaming the jews for it ?
    I don't think Donald is Jewish, though he does have German heritage.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,754
    619 said:
    maybe you should stick a yellow star on the guy just so everyone else knows
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,955
    felix said:

    dixiedean said:

    felix said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    1. To be pedantic lose the apostrophe you put in Nazis.
    2. Trump is talking in exactly the same mode as Corbyn about Venezuela - about which the left has nothing to say.
    FEWER....
    However, Corbyn is not and never will be President of Venezuela. So that is not really comparable.
    The 'less' reference was not me but nice try. It is totally comparableyou just would rather not see it.
    It really isn't the same. Trump is employed to lead the USA. His words and actions carry weight in the USA. What Corbyn does or does not say makes the square root of bugger all difference to what happens in Venezuela.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,754
    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    Ok - that sounds reasonable, but I'm not sure I'm aware of 'Nazis' doing that.
    well there are always the islamonazis driving cars in to people in the UK

    but we look over it, we let it pass by it's not the done thing to talk about it
    Bastard, bastard Homo Sapiens.. all of the bad things that have been done in history have been done by them!

    I want less of Mr Smith from 47 Artillery Crescent ramming people, but his actions are not to be held at the door of his Nazi (or otherwise) brethren.
    And yet you vote Labour
  • Options
    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,189
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,754
    tlg86 said:
    typo in the last word I think
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,383
    edited August 2017
    What stupid, stupid parents.

    I mean, no responsible parent dresses a child that young in white, it's a disaster waiting to happen.

    https://twitter.com/TrueFactsStated/status/896785919553961984
  • Options
    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,775

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    Ok - that sounds reasonable, but I'm not sure I'm aware of 'Nazis' doing that.
    well there are always the islamonazis driving cars in to people in the UK

    but we look over it, we let it pass by it's not the done thing to talk about it
    Bastard, bastard Homo Sapiens.. all of the bad things that have been done in history have been done by them!

    I want less of Mr Smith from 47 Artillery Crescent ramming people, but his actions are not to be held at the door of his Nazi (or otherwise) brethren.
    And yet you vote Labour
    Oddly not though. I've had that opportunity perhaps 30 times in my 53 years, but I've always voted Conservative.
  • Options
    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,974

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Donald Trump at Auschwitz

    'I condemn the violence on both sides'
    It is pretty astonishing that the Donald has a Jewish daughter, Son in Law and grandchildren, but is not willing to speak out about Nazi flag waving Trump supporters.
    are you now blaming the jews for it ?
    I don't think Donald is Jewish, though he does have German heritage.
    His mother wasn't, which is the crucial test.
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,607
    I think he's gone off the reservation a bit. I wonder if he'll end up being sectioned once we leave, genuine question, not just being facetious. He seems utterly wedded to the EU, even more than his master.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,754
    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    Ok - that sounds reasonable, but I'm not sure I'm aware of 'Nazis' doing that.
    well there are always the islamonazis driving cars in to people in the UK

    but we look over it, we let it pass by it's not the done thing to talk about it
    Bastard, bastard Homo Sapiens.. all of the bad things that have been done in history have been done by them!

    I want less of Mr Smith from 47 Artillery Crescent ramming people, but his actions are not to be held at the door of his Nazi (or otherwise) brethren.
    And yet you vote Labour
    Oddly not though. I've had that opportunity perhaps 30 times in my 53 years, but I've always voted Conservative.
    that proves youre an evil bastard
  • Options
    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,775

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Omnium said:

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Evocative language. What do you want, and what is it that you think you might not get?
    I want less Nazi's ramming crowds of people.
    Ok - that sounds reasonable, but I'm not sure I'm aware of 'Nazis' doing that.
    well there are always the islamonazis driving cars in to people in the UK

    but we look over it, we let it pass by it's not the done thing to talk about it
    Bastard, bastard Homo Sapiens.. all of the bad things that have been done in history have been done by them!

    I want less of Mr Smith from 47 Artillery Crescent ramming people, but his actions are not to be held at the door of his Nazi (or otherwise) brethren.
    And yet you vote Labour
    Oddly not though. I've had that opportunity perhaps 30 times in my 53 years, but I've always voted Conservative.
    that proves youre an evil bastard
    Well, I'm not. Your last assumption's accuracy is rather letting you down.

    Life, you know - I try!
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,603
    So when does James Chapman take over as Political Editor at the London Evening Freesheet?
  • Options
    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,045

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Donald Trump at Auschwitz

    'I condemn the violence on both sides'
    It is pretty astonishing that the Donald has a Jewish daughter, Son in Law and grandchildren, but is not willing to speak out about Nazi flag waving Trump supporters.
    are you now blaming the jews for it ?
    I don't think Donald is Jewish, though he does have German heritage.
    His mother wasn't, which is the crucial test.
    There's a long standing legend about the Scots being one of the lost tribes of Israel..
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,056
    MaxPB said:

    I think he's gone off the reservation a bit. I wonder if he'll end up being sectioned once we leave, genuine question, not just being facetious. He seems utterly wedded to the EU, even more than his master.
    We're not going to leave the EU. This is Euroscepticism's last hurrah before its influence on our politics is extinguished.
  • Options
    The_ApocalypseThe_Apocalypse Posts: 7,830
    edited August 2017
    Agree with @foxinsoxuk from the previous thread we are heading for US style culture wars. Faisal Islam also mentioned this in a recent article on Sky News' website as well. Seeing reactions to what happened in Charlottesville on here only confirms my belief that's what we are heading to.

    Then again, PB may not be entirely representative.

    Here's the Fasial Islam article if anyone's interested: http://news.sky.com/story/sky-views-hacienda-generation-threat-to-tories-10977698
  • Options
    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,603
    If the Conservatives really want to 'skip a generation' then they need a leader born in the 1980s.

    There is one outstanding candidate, who has excelled on the front bench and in front of tricky media scrutiny.

    That person is....

    Chloe Smith
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,383
    edited August 2017

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Donald Trump at Auschwitz

    'I condemn the violence on both sides'
    It is pretty astonishing that the Donald has a Jewish daughter, Son in Law and grandchildren, but is not willing to speak out about Nazi flag waving Trump supporters.
    are you now blaming the jews for it ?
    I don't think Donald is Jewish, though he does have German heritage.
    His mother wasn't, which is the crucial test.
    There's a long standing legend about the Scots being one of the lost tribes of Israel..
    Well it would help answer that 'and did those feet in ancient time' question.
  • Options
    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,775
    Anyway the point of the previous comments was mainly to say that whatever ideas you might have and whatever beliefs you might have, there is no stigma whatsoever from the actions of others that happen to share that belief or set of ideas. None.
  • Options
    Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 12,994

    Agree with @foxinsoxuk from the previous thread we are heading for US style culture wars.

    I agree. The UK is now riven in a way I have never seen and I'm fucking fifty!

    I have no idea how the tensions are going to erupt but it's not going to be pleasant.
  • Options
    Re James Chapman: can't believe a former DM political editor is so europhile. I sympathise with a lot of what he's saying though, but bloody hell....
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,986
    edited August 2017

    MaxPB said:

    I think he's gone off the reservation a bit. I wonder if he'll end up being sectioned once we leave, genuine question, not just being facetious. He seems utterly wedded to the EU, even more than his master.
    We're not going to leave the EU. This is Euroscepticism's last hurrah before its influence on our politics is extinguished.
    We are, Article 50 has been invoked and even many Remainers now accept that. We may eventually rejoin the EEA/EFTA and have a Norway/Switzerland type relationship with the EU if we get a moderate Labour PM again but we are leaving the EU for good
  • Options
    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,974

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Donald Trump at Auschwitz

    'I condemn the violence on both sides'
    It is pretty astonishing that the Donald has a Jewish daughter, Son in Law and grandchildren, but is not willing to speak out about Nazi flag waving Trump supporters.
    are you now blaming the jews for it ?
    I don't think Donald is Jewish, though he does have German heritage.
    His mother wasn't, which is the crucial test.
    There's a long standing legend about the Scots being one of the lost tribes of Israel..
    Well it would help answer that 'and did those feet in ancient time' question.
    That refers to England's green and pleasant land. Malcolm will explain to you that England and Scotland are different.
    If you ask him nicely!
  • Options

    Alistair said:

    Literal. Actual. Self. Described. Nazis.

    "Both sides are bad m'kay"

    Donald Trump at Auschwitz

    'I condemn the violence on both sides'
    It is pretty astonishing that the Donald has a Jewish daughter, Son in Law and grandchildren, but is not willing to speak out about Nazi flag waving Trump supporters.
    are you now blaming the jews for it ?
    I don't think Donald is Jewish, though he does have German heritage.
    His mother wasn't, which is the crucial test.
    There's a long standing legend about the Scots being one of the lost tribes of Israel..
    Well it would help answer that 'and did those feet in ancient time' question.
    That refers to England's green and pleasant land. Malcolm will explain to you that England and Scotland are different.
    If you ask him nicely!
    Look, if Kevin Costner's Robin Hood can get to Dover to Nottingham via Hadrian's Wall, anything is possible.
  • Options
    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,189

    Agree with @foxinsoxuk from the previous thread we are heading for US style culture wars. Faisal Islam also mentioned this in a recent article on Sky News' website as well. Seeing reactions to what happened in Charlottesville on here only confirms my belief that's what we are heading to.

    Then again, PB may not be entirely representative.

    Here's the Fasial Islam article if anyone's interested: http://news.sky.com/story/sky-views-hacienda-generation-threat-to-tories-10977698

    To be fair I'm not sure anyone on here has condoned the murder or Trump's ridiculous comments. Most of the discussion on here was about the decision to take down the statue. Personally I don't agree with it but it's their town and their decision. Just as Charlie Hebdo weren't to blame for their own massacre (though I do think that publication is a bit twattish), the council in Charlottesville shouldn't be blamed for what's happened.
  • Options
    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,775

    So when does James Chapman take over as Political Editor at the London Evening Freesheet?

    We'll never hear from him ever again. It was a sounding exercise. Osborne really have to just get on with being an editor now. He may well find that many of his acquaintance cross streets to avoid him.
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    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,974
    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    I think he's gone off the reservation a bit. I wonder if he'll end up being sectioned once we leave, genuine question, not just being facetious. He seems utterly wedded to the EU, even more than his master.
    We're not going to leave the EU. This is Euroscepticism's last hurrah before its influence on our politics is extinguished.
    We are, Article 50 has been invoked and even many Remainers now accept that. We may eventually rejoin the EEA/EFTA and have a Norway/Switzerland type relationship with the EU if we get a moderate Labour PM again but we are leaving the EU for good
    Nearly right. We're leaving the EU but I very much it will be for good, and I'm certain it won't be for ever.
    I hope I'm still around to see the celebrations when we rejoin.
  • Options
    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,603
    619 said:
    Shall I post another link to The Redskins' 'Kick Over the Statues'?

    OK, so I won't, but I will burnish my lefty credentials by saying I went to one of their gigs when I was a student.
  • Options
    Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 12,994

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    I think he's gone off the reservation a bit. I wonder if he'll end up being sectioned once we leave, genuine question, not just being facetious. He seems utterly wedded to the EU, even more than his master.
    We're not going to leave the EU. This is Euroscepticism's last hurrah before its influence on our politics is extinguished.
    We are, Article 50 has been invoked and even many Remainers now accept that. We may eventually rejoin the EEA/EFTA and have a Norway/Switzerland type relationship with the EU if we get a moderate Labour PM again but we are leaving the EU for good
    Nearly right. We're leaving the EU but I very much it will be for good, and I'm certain it won't be for ever.
    I hope I'm still around to see the celebrations when we rejoin.
    20 years hence when most of the leavers will be have gone to the Great Daily Mail Comments Section in the Sky a rejoin referendum will pass easily.
  • Options
    Dura_Ace said:

    Agree with @foxinsoxuk from the previous thread we are heading for US style culture wars.

    I agree. The UK is now riven in a way I have never seen and I'm fucking fifty!

    I have no idea how the tensions are going to erupt but it's not going to be pleasant.
    Yep. Before I got involved with online political discussions I used to think differently. However, since that's happened I've gradually learned that the kind of shared values which I thought we all shared - or at least most of us - well, that's not the case at all.

    Despite his flaws, I am seeing more and more why Cameron's detoxification of the Conservative Party was necessary.

    I definitely am starting to feel a sense of us versus them, and I am understanding more as to why so many of my age group are getting caught up in it, even though I am still very anti-Corbyn.
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981

    Agree with @foxinsoxuk from the previous thread we are heading for US style culture wars. Faisal Islam also mentioned this in a recent article on Sky News' website as well. Seeing reactions to what happened in Charlottesville on here only confirms my belief that's what we are heading to.

    Then again, PB may not be entirely representative.

    Here's the Fasial Islam article if anyone's interested: http://news.sky.com/story/sky-views-hacienda-generation-threat-to-tories-10977698

    There's a lot of critique of the American zeitgeist going on from people who know no more about the American zeitgeist than I do. Billie Holiday recorded Strange Fruit in 1939, the "strange fruit" being the bodies of lynched black men hanging from Southern magnolia trees. It isn't the case that there was then a blissful interlude of general niceness and interracial harmony rudely terminated by the rise of Trumpery. This is just American business as usual, and the fear that it is now about to cross the Atlantic is overblown.

    I don't see what "reactions to what happened in Charlottesville on here" you mean, incidentally. You may be diagnosing thoughtcrime to a greater extent than the text will stand.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,191
    If the answer is Boris Johnson -

    the question was incorrectly premised.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,986
    edited August 2017

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    I think he's gone off the reservation a bit. I wonder if he'll end up being sectioned once we leave, genuine question, not just being facetious. He seems utterly wedded to the EU, even more than his master.
    We're not going to leave the EU. This is Euroscepticism's last hurrah before its influence on our politics is extinguished.
    We are, Article 50 has been invoked and even many Remainers now accept that. We may eventually rejoin the EEA/EFTA and have a Norway/Switzerland type relationship with the EU if we get a moderate Labour PM again but we are leaving the EU for good
    Nearly right. We're leaving the EU but I very much it will be for good, and I'm certain it won't be for ever.
    I hope I'm still around to see the celebrations when we rejoin.
    I actually think it is more likely Sweden, Denmark, Hungary, the Czech Republic and Poland eventually leave the EU and join EFTA than we ever rejoin the EU, on our departure the EU will become increasingly focused on the Eurozone making our rejoining almost an impossibility
  • Options
    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,974
    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    I think he's gone off the reservation a bit. I wonder if he'll end up being sectioned once we leave, genuine question, not just being facetious. He seems utterly wedded to the EU, even more than his master.
    We're not going to leave the EU. This is Euroscepticism's last hurrah before its influence on our politics is extinguished.
    We are, Article 50 has been invoked and even many Remainers now accept that. We may eventually rejoin the EEA/EFTA and have a Norway/Switzerland type relationship with the EU if we get a moderate Labour PM again but we are leaving the EU for good
    Nearly right. We're leaving the EU but I very much it will be for good, and I'm certain it won't be for ever.
    I hope I'm still around to see the celebrations when we rejoin.
    20 years hence when most of the leavers will be have gone to the Great Daily Mail Comments Section in the Sky a rejoin referendum will pass easily.
    That's my fear. I'm not sure I've got another 20 years!
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    I think he's gone off the reservation a bit. I wonder if he'll end up being sectioned once we leave, genuine question, not just being facetious. He seems utterly wedded to the EU, even more than his master.
    We're not going to leave the EU. This is Euroscepticism's last hurrah before its influence on our politics is extinguished.
    We are, Article 50 has been invoked and even many Remainers now accept that. We may eventually rejoin the EEA/EFTA and have a Norway/Switzerland type relationship with the EU if we get a moderate Labour PM again but we are leaving the EU for good
    Nearly right. We're leaving the EU but I very much it will be for good, and I'm certain it won't be for ever.
    I hope I'm still around to see the celebrations when we rejoin.
    20 years hence when most of the leavers will be have gone to the Great Daily Mail Comments Section in the Sky a rejoin referendum will pass easily.
    No country ever steps in the same EU twice, for it is not the same EU and not the same country.

    Heraclitus.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,191
    Ishmael_Z said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    I think he's gone off the reservation a bit. I wonder if he'll end up being sectioned once we leave, genuine question, not just being facetious. He seems utterly wedded to the EU, even more than his master.
    We're not going to leave the EU. This is Euroscepticism's last hurrah before its influence on our politics is extinguished.
    We are, Article 50 has been invoked and even many Remainers now accept that. We may eventually rejoin the EEA/EFTA and have a Norway/Switzerland type relationship with the EU if we get a moderate Labour PM again but we are leaving the EU for good
    Nearly right. We're leaving the EU but I very much it will be for good, and I'm certain it won't be for ever.
    I hope I'm still around to see the celebrations when we rejoin.
    20 years hence when most of the leavers will be have gone to the Great Daily Mail Comments Section in the Sky a rejoin referendum will pass easily.
    No country ever steps in the same EU twice, for it is not the same EU and not the same country.

    Heraclitus.
    Are you saying that people who wish to enter the EU are wets, Ishmael?
  • Options
    Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,301
    The Boris magic has long since faded. I'm not sure the Tory party will ever be truly happy. They had a brief period when they pretended Theresa was a latter-day Maggie but that went horribly sour. I suspect only Rees-Mogg as leader would make the Tories feel comfortable about themselves again, or possibly even Farage if he could be persuaded.
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    RoyalBlueRoyalBlue Posts: 3,223
    619 said:
    When things are dying down, why fan the flames?

    This Year Zero approach to history and culture will not end well. I don't think Mao's China or contemporary South Africa are models to emulate.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,955
    Ishmael_Z said:

    Agree with @foxinsoxuk from the previous thread we are heading for US style culture wars. Faisal Islam also mentioned this in a recent article on Sky News' website as well. Seeing reactions to what happened in Charlottesville on here only confirms my belief that's what we are heading to.

    Then again, PB may not be entirely representative.

    Here's the Fasial Islam article if anyone's interested: http://news.sky.com/story/sky-views-hacienda-generation-threat-to-tories-10977698

    There's a lot of critique of the American zeitgeist going on from people who know no more about the American zeitgeist than I do. Billie Holiday recorded Strange Fruit in 1939, the "strange fruit" being the bodies of lynched black men hanging from Southern magnolia trees. It isn't the case that there was then a blissful interlude of general niceness and interracial harmony rudely terminated by the rise of Trumpery. This is just American business as usual, and the fear that it is now about to cross the Atlantic is overblown.

    I don't see what "reactions to what happened in Charlottesville on here" you mean, incidentally. You may be diagnosing thoughtcrime to a greater extent than the text will stand.
    We really don't have the legacy of racial tension to the same extent. Basically, half the country had to fight the other half before ending slavery. We generally agreed it had been bad. Nor do fundamentalist religions have such a hold on our politics.
    So we won't see "culture wars" in the same way. The voting differentials between generations are economically driven.
    Re Charlottesville
    A democratically elected council voted to sell a statue. A bunch of people not connected to the City decided they didn't like it, organised Online and turned up mob-handed and in many cases armed, resulting in 3 deaths. They are out of order, because if they don't live there it is none of their business.
    Or am I missing something?
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    dixiedean said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Agree with @foxinsoxuk from the previous thread we are heading for US style culture wars. Faisal Islam also mentioned this in a recent article on Sky News' website as well. Seeing reactions to what happened in Charlottesville on here only confirms my belief that's what we are heading to.

    Then again, PB may not be entirely representative.

    Here's the Fasial Islam article if anyone's interested: http://news.sky.com/story/sky-views-hacienda-generation-threat-to-tories-10977698

    There's a lot of critique of the American zeitgeist going on from people who know no more about the American zeitgeist than I do. Billie Holiday recorded Strange Fruit in 1939, the "strange fruit" being the bodies of lynched black men hanging from Southern magnolia trees. It isn't the case that there was then a blissful interlude of general niceness and interracial harmony rudely terminated by the rise of Trumpery. This is just American business as usual, and the fear that it is now about to cross the Atlantic is overblown.

    I don't see what "reactions to what happened in Charlottesville on here" you mean, incidentally. You may be diagnosing thoughtcrime to a greater extent than the text will stand.
    We really don't have the legacy of racial tension to the same extent. Basically, half the country had to fight the other half before ending slavery. We generally agreed it had been bad. Nor do fundamentalist religions have such a hold on our politics.
    So we won't see "culture wars" in the same way. The voting differentials between generations are economically driven.
    Re Charlottesville
    A democratically elected council voted to sell a statue. A bunch of people not connected to the City decided they didn't like it, organised Online and turned up mob-handed and in many cases armed, resulting in 3 deaths. They are out of order, because if they don't live there it is none of their business.
    Or am I missing something?
    Of course they are (understating it hugely) "out of order". Whoever would, or has, suggest anything else?
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,191
    RoyalBlue said:

    619 said:
    When things are dying down, why fan the flames?

    This Year Zero approach to history and culture will not end well. I don't think Mao's China or contemporary South Africa are models to emulate.
    By this logic, they will have to blow up half of Mount Rushmore.
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,986
    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    I think he's gone off the reservation a bit. I wonder if he'll end up being sectioned once we leave, genuine question, not just being facetious. He seems utterly wedded to the EU, even more than his master.
    We're not going to leave the EU. This is Euroscepticism's last hurrah before its influence on our politics is extinguished.
    We are, Article 50 has been invoked and even many Remainers now accept that. We may eventually rejoin the EEA/EFTA and have a Norway/Switzerland type relationship with the EU if we get a moderate Labour PM again but we are leaving the EU for good
    Nearly right. We're leaving the EU but I very much it will be for good, and I'm certain it won't be for ever.
    I hope I'm still around to see the celebrations when we rejoin.
    20 years hence when most of the leavers will be have gone to the Great Daily Mail Comments Section in the Sky a rejoin referendum will pass easily.
    No as that would probably require joining the Euro which 82% oppose not 52%
  • Options
    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,775

    The Boris magic has long since faded. I'm not sure the Tory party will ever be truly happy. They had a brief period when they pretended Theresa was a latter-day Maggie but that went horribly sour. I suspect only Rees-Mogg as leader would make the Tories feel comfortable about themselves again, or possibly even Farage if he could be persuaded.

    Well Irish banditry won't produce many advocates, but the status quo might. Historically 'no change' has been an awful policy, but it has been a little better than adapting to changes that were predicted at the time. Socialism in contrast has not had one glimmer of success, rather a train of disaster.
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Does he realise how pathetic that makes him sound?

    (I suspect that George may have meant that comment to have a much less pleasant interpretation than Chapman has inferred)
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    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    RoyalBlue said:

    619 said:
    When things are dying down, why fan the flames?

    This Year Zero approach to history and culture will not end well. I don't think Mao's China or contemporary South Africa are models to emulate.
    Howabout 1922 Ireland? 1947 India? 1989 Eastern Europe? Should those statues of Stalin go back up? Those statues of Saddam Hussien? When KimJung Un gets bumped off should his statues remain?

    Removing statues, and renaming places has a history as long as human history. Why should we stop now?
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    619 said:
    I don't. Debate them. Show them up for the idiots they are. Destroy their arguments.

    Getting someone sacked for their beliefs undermines free speech and drives hate underground
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    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,974
    Charles said:

    619 said:
    I don't. Debate them. Show them up for the idiots they are. Destroy their arguments.

    Getting someone sacked for their beliefs undermines free speech and drives hate underground
    Agree. Does it affect his work? Highly unlikely, unless he's in a customer-facing role. How many people know who he works for? Very few.
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    Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 12,994
    edited August 2017

    The Boris magic has long since faded. I'm not sure the Tory party will ever be truly happy. They had a brief period when they pretended Theresa was a latter-day Maggie but that went horribly sour. I suspect only Rees-Mogg as leader would make the Tories feel comfortable about themselves again, or possibly even Farage if he could be persuaded.

    David Davis, whose face is increasingly coming to resemble a female baboon's pudenda in estrus as the Brexit catastrophe unravels, could be just the intellectually limited golf club bore for which the Conservative core is hankering.
  • Options
    nunuonenunuone Posts: 1,138

    Agree with @foxinsoxuk from the previous thread we are heading for US style culture wars. Faisal Islam also mentioned this in a recent article on Sky News' website as well. Seeing reactions to what happened in Charlottesville on here only confirms my belief that's what we are heading to.

    Then again, PB may not be entirely representative.

    Here's the Fasial Islam article if anyone's interested: http://news.sky.com/story/sky-views-hacienda-generation-threat-to-tories-10977698

    When has America not been in a culture war?

    Basically it's been about many white people mainly from the south denying black people are equal to them. That is the crux of the matter.
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    dixiedean said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Agree with @foxinsoxuk from the previous thread we are heading for US style culture wars. Faisal Islam also mentioned this in a recent article on Sky News' website as well. Seeing reactions to what happened in Charlottesville on here only confirms my belief that's what we are heading to.

    Then again, PB may not be entirely representative.

    Here's the Fasial Islam article if anyone's interested: http://news.sky.com/story/sky-views-hacienda-generation-threat-to-tories-10977698

    There's a lot of critique of the American zeitgeist going on from people who know no more about the American zeitgeist than I do. Billie Holiday recorded Strange Fruit in 1939, the "strange fruit" being the bodies of lynched black men hanging from Southern magnolia trees. It isn't the case that there was then a blissful interlude of general niceness and interracial harmony rudely terminated by the rise of Trumpery. This is just American business as usual, and the fear that it is now about to cross the Atlantic is overblown.

    I don't see what "reactions to what happened in Charlottesville on here" you mean, incidentally. You may be diagnosing thoughtcrime to a greater extent than the text will stand.
    We really don't have the legacy of racial tension to the same extent. Basically, half the country had to fight the other half before ending slavery. We generally agreed it had been bad. Nor do fundamentalist religions have such a hold on our politics.
    So we won't see "culture wars" in the same way. The voting differentials between generations are economically driven.
    Re Charlottesville
    A democratically elected council voted to sell a statue. A bunch of people not connected to the City decided they didn't like it, organised Online and turned up mob-handed and in many cases armed, resulting in 3 deaths. They are out of order, because if they don't live there it is none of their business.
    Or am I missing something?
    If the anti-protesters hadn't turned up there wouldn't have been a riot and likely wouldn't have been the deaths.
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    Dura_Ace said:

    The Boris magic has long since faded. I'm not sure the Tory party will ever be truly happy. They had a brief period when they pretended Theresa was a latter-day Maggie but that went horribly sour. I suspect only Rees-Mogg as leader would make the Tories feel comfortable about themselves again, or possibly even Farage if he could be persuaded.

    David Davis, whose face is increasingly coming to resemble a female baboon's pudenda in estrus as the Brexit catastrophe unravels, could be just the intellectually limited golf club bore for which the Conservative core is hankering.
    Harsh. But fair.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,955
    Ishmael_Z said:

    dixiedean said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Agree with @foxinsoxuk from the previous thread we are heading for US style culture wars. Faisal Islam also mentioned this in a recent article on Sky News' website as well. Seeing reactions to what happened in Charlottesville on here only confirms my belief that's what we are heading to.

    Then again, PB may not be entirely representative.

    Here's the Fasial Islam article if anyone's interested: http://news.sky.com/story/sky-views-hacienda-generation-threat-to-tories-10977698

    There's a lot of critique of the American zeitgeist going on from people who know no more about the American zeitgeist than I do. Billie Holiday recorded Strange Fruit in 1939, the "strange fruit" being the bodies of lynched black men hanging from Southern magnolia trees. It isn't the case that there was then a blissful interlude of general niceness and interracial harmony rudely terminated by the rise of Trumpery. This is just American business as usual, and the fear that it is now about to cross the Atlantic is overblown.

    I don't see what "reactions to what happened in Charlottesville on here" you mean, incidentally. You may be diagnosing thoughtcrime to a greater extent than the text will stand.
    We really don't have the legacy of racial tension to the same extent. Basically, half the country had to fight the other half before ending slavery. We generally agreed it had been bad. Nor do fundamentalist religions have such a hold on our politics.
    So we won't see "culture wars" in the same way. The voting differentials between generations are economically driven.
    Re Charlottesville
    A democratically elected council voted to sell a statue. A bunch of people not connected to the City decided they didn't like it, organised Online and turned up mob-handed and in many cases armed, resulting in 3 deaths. They are out of order, because if they don't live there it is none of their business.
    Or am I missing something?
    Of course they are (understating it hugely) "out of order". Whoever would, or has, suggest anything else?
    Was not suggesting you or anyone else was. Just wondering if I had missed some part of the story.
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