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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » If it gets to a confidence vote then timings will make it hard

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  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842
    rkrkrk said:

    I take it all the pb Leavers are in agreement with Peter North that they can live with a ten year recession in order to secure Brexit?

    http://peterjnorth.blogspot.co.uk/2017/10/i-dont-like-this-brexit-but-i-will-live.html?m=1

    I suspect we would rejoin before a recession got to ten years.
    I don't think there is any evidence to suggest a ten year recession is likely - not sure there has ever been one that long in a modern economy...
    Will we even be let back in if we're in a recession that bad.

    Cos we're outside the deficit targets whilst the sun is relatively shining. What sort of cuts do you propose to get us under the 3% deficit threshold given unemployment benefit will be way up - not even the Tories will propose stuff drastic enough to get us under that.

    We're heading out, and staying out.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,072
    I think he’s going to do it!
  • Bad form by the Catalan President not to give this speech in English.

    Doesn't he know I'm watching this?

    I'll bet Los Yoonios are complaining he's not doing it in Spanish.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,392
    edited October 2017

    Puigdemont flattering Britain :blush:

    Good thing too, if we're both about to become pariahs. We'll need to be nice to each other.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,881
    Pulpstar said:

    rkrkrk said:

    I take it all the pb Leavers are in agreement with Peter North that they can live with a ten year recession in order to secure Brexit?

    http://peterjnorth.blogspot.co.uk/2017/10/i-dont-like-this-brexit-but-i-will-live.html?m=1

    I suspect we would rejoin before a recession got to ten years.
    I don't think there is any evidence to suggest a ten year recession is likely - not sure there has ever been one that long in a modern economy...
    Will we even be let back in if we're in a recession that bad.

    Cos we're outside the deficit targets whilst the sun is relatively shining. What sort of cuts do you propose to get us under the 3% deficit threshold given unemployment benefit will be way up - not even the Tories will propose stuff drastic enough to get us under that.

    We're heading out, and staying out.
    We would still be much wealthier than almost all EU countries.
    Politically it might be tough- I imagine we would not get the opt outs we have now - but I'd have thought we would be welcome back - perhaps with a bit of grovelling...

    All academic since a 10 year recession will not happen.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842
    Bottled it.
  • I think he’s going to do it!

    Seems like he's not.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,072
    Gah! Bottled!
  • Pulpstar said:

    Bottled it.

    Playing the long game. He's won the international moral high ground, if the Spaniards refuse to talk now then they can go again. If the Spaniards do talk he can get a Scottish style referendum.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,392
    Are there any non-Indy supporting MPs attending, or have they stayed away?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,392

    Pulpstar said:

    Bottled it.

    Playing the long game. He's won the international moral high ground, if the Spaniards refuse to talk now then they can go again. If the Spaniards do talk he can get a Scottish style referendum.
    Sounds sensible, given not merely the practicalities being near impossible, but support being on a knife edge anyway.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,881
    Just as a thought experiment- how would leavers feel if whilst negotiating Brexit transition period -- TM agreed a mechanism to rejoin quickly if we do change our minds?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,392
    rkrkrk said:

    Just as a thought experiment- how would leavers feel if whilst negotiating Brexit transition period -- TM agreed a mechanism to rejoin quickly if we do change our minds?

    That would depend on the mechanism.
  • philiphphiliph Posts: 4,704
    edited October 2017
    rkrkrk said:

    Just as a thought experiment- how would leavers feel if whilst negotiating Brexit transition period -- TM agreed a mechanism to rejoin quickly if we do change our minds?

    How will we know for three or four years?
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,881
    edited October 2017
    kle4 said:

    rkrkrk said:

    Just as a thought experiment- how would leavers feel if whilst negotiating Brexit transition period -- TM agreed a mechanism to rejoin quickly if we do change our minds?

    That would depend on the mechanism.
    Well how about - at the end of the transition period we want - if all EU27 and UK agree - we can just go back to being a full member of the EU again instead of leaving?

    EDIT - and keep the current opt outs rebate etc.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,392
    rkrkrk said:

    kle4 said:

    rkrkrk said:

    Just as a thought experiment- how would leavers feel if whilst negotiating Brexit transition period -- TM agreed a mechanism to rejoin quickly if we do change our minds?

    That would depend on the mechanism.
    Well how about - at the end of the transition period we want - if all EU27 and UK agree - we can just go back to being a full member of the EU again instead of leaving?
    I think that would be problematic depending on what we mean by 'UK agree'. Legally, if it is agreed we can do so, there'd be no issue, but having gone to the trouble of asking the people to gauge their view in the first place, reversing course without also doing so, would enrage a lot of people.

    I suppose it would also depend if we would have to sign up to the things we had opt outs to before. I find it hard to believe even in a scenario where they wanted us back, that it would be without price.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842
    Actually I think Puidgemont has played this well on reflection.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,765
    nielh said:

    MTimT said:

    MTimT said:

    Elliot said:

    Remember when Dan Hannan and others said the status and lives of EU citizens in the UK wouldn't change if we voted to Leave...

    https://twitter.com/hzeffman/status/917787816129638401
    https://twitter.com/tnewtondunn/status/917788180623052800

    I imagine a visa for those in education or gainful employment will be established regardless of any deal.
    What about my colleague and his German girlfriend and daughter?

    She's not in gainful employment nor in education but looking after their child.

    This is people's lives up in the air.
    Surely the simple answer there is that they marry ...

    This is part of the trouble with discussions of this type of issue online - they morph into discussions of multiple different issues simultaneously with people talking at cross purposes because they are really talking about different issues. Is the issue:

    1. right to citizenship?
    2. right to residency?
    3. right to work?
    4. right to go through the same immigration line as your spouse/parent?

    It strikes me that there are easy fixes for each of those questions.
    There is a meaningful distinction between the right to remain here (akin to permanent residency) and citizenship.

    I have an EU wife who is self employed and on a low income, and also looks after our child. As far as I am concerned, I would only be happy with citizenship or something very close to it. Otherwise, her stay here is temporary and we have no ultimate rights - we can't come and go as we please. One scenario that I worry about: If we moved to her country, and then I got cancer or some other terminal illness (always a possibility) and needed to be treated on the NHS (as post brexit I would have no reciprocal rights) there would be no way for her to move back to Britain to care for me, as I would not meet the income requirement (£20k plus per year) to sponsor her and my son to come to Britain.

    People just dont appreciate the enormity of what is happening. Millions of people are being put through hell because of Brexit. Maybe you all have so much money you just don't worry.
    I would expect your wife to permanent residency, with the option to apply for naturalisation.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 30,846
    edited October 2017
    rkrkrk said:

    kle4 said:

    rkrkrk said:

    Just as a thought experiment- how would leavers feel if whilst negotiating Brexit transition period -- TM agreed a mechanism to rejoin quickly if we do change our minds?

    That would depend on the mechanism.
    Well how about - at the end of the transition period we want - if all EU27 and UK agree - we can just go back to being a full member of the EU again instead of leaving?

    EDIT - and keep the current opt outs rebate etc.
    We would already have left. The transition period is not an extension to our membership of the EU. It is a period during which some transitional arrangements are left in place to help with trade.

    As I explained earlier, once we leave the EU in March 2019 it would require a new treaty for us to rejoin. Do you really think the other EU members would just let us join under the same terms as before and with the same antipathy towards their project as we have always had?
  • Mr. Eagles, without any hint of spoilers, excited by the Star Wars trailer?

    I enjoyed it, got a bit emotional when Carrie Fisher was on screen.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,072
    Puigdemont is risking losing momentum I think...
  • Mr. Eagles, without any hint of spoilers, excited by the Star Wars trailer?

    I enjoyed it, got a bit emotional when Carrie Fisher was on screen.
    I suspect that for anyone who knows the franchise and is able to do a bit of intelligent thinking that we a have a good idea of some of the events that are going to occur that were hinted at but not directly shown in the trailer.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,392

    Puigdemont is risking losing momentum I think...

    Question is, having blinked first, will Spain reciprocate and help de-escalate matters, or, sensing weakness, will they pounce?
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,881

    rkrkrk said:

    kle4 said:

    rkrkrk said:

    Just as a thought experiment- how would leavers feel if whilst negotiating Brexit transition period -- TM agreed a mechanism to rejoin quickly if we do change our minds?

    That would depend on the mechanism.
    Well how about - at the end of the transition period we want - if all EU27 and UK agree - we can just go back to being a full member of the EU again instead of leaving?

    EDIT - and keep the current opt outs rebate etc.
    We would already have left. The transition period is not an extension to our membership of the EU. It is a period during which some transitional arrangements are left in place to help with trade.

    As I explained earlier, once we leave the EU in March 2019 it would require a new treaty for us to rejoin. Do you really think the other EIU members would just let us join under the same terms as before and with the same antipathy towards their project as we have always had?
    Okay- I should say sort out rejoining arrangements...
    whether it is likely or not - (I think actually the EU might be keen) - how would you feel if that were done? Arguably it's prudent when you leave a club like the EU to find out or even agree how you might become a member again...
  • Puigdemont is risking losing momentum I think...

    You mean he's a Corbynista???? :o
  • Mr. Eagles, without any hint of spoilers, excited by the Star Wars trailer?

    I enjoyed it, got a bit emotional when Carrie Fisher was on screen.
    I think there was a spoiler right near the end of the trailer...
  • Mr. Eagles, without any hint of spoilers, excited by the Star Wars trailer?

    I enjoyed it, got a bit emotional when Carrie Fisher was on screen.
    I suspect that for anyone who knows the franchise and is able to do a bit of intelligent thinking that we a have a good idea of some of the events that are going to occur that were hinted at but not directly shown in the trailer.
    Yup, I did see a few echoes of Hoth and Empire in it as well.

    Have to admit, The Justice League trailer is the one that has really got me stirring.

    I've been really worried about that film turning into a disaster.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9-DM9uBtVI
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,392
    edited October 2017

    Mr. Eagles, without any hint of spoilers, excited by the Star Wars trailer?

    I enjoyed it, got a bit emotional when Carrie Fisher was on screen.
    I suspect that for anyone who knows the franchise and is able to do a bit of intelligent thinking that we a have a good idea of some of the events that are going to occur that were hinted at but not directly shown in the trailer.
    Yup, I did see a few echoes of Hoth and Empire in it as well.

    Have to admit, The Justice League trailer is the one that has really got me stirring.

    I've been really worried about that film turning into a disaster.

    htt://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9-DM9uBtVI
    Batman Vs Superman had some decent trailers too...
  • Puigdemont is risking losing momentum I think...

    It's the smart move. It puts the focus entirely on Madrid. They can take the olive branch proffered, or they can reject it. If they do the former, Catalonia will end up with a higher degree of autonomy'; if they do the latter, then international opinion will swing very firmly behind the government in Barcelona.

  • kle4 said:

    Mr. Eagles, without any hint of spoilers, excited by the Star Wars trailer?

    I enjoyed it, got a bit emotional when Carrie Fisher was on screen.
    I suspect that for anyone who knows the franchise and is able to do a bit of intelligent thinking that we a have a good idea of some of the events that are going to occur that were hinted at but not directly shown in the trailer.
    Yup, I did see a few echoes of Hoth and Empire in it as well.

    Have to admit, The Justice League trailer is the one that has really got me stirring.

    I've been really worried about that film turning into a disaster.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9-DM9uBtVI
    Batman Vs Superman had some decent trailers too...
    Indeed. Zac Snyder stepping away is also a worry.
  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    The catalan government have seen they do not have universal support for indipendace they will seek to seek out some concessions but i don't think the Spanish government will play ball
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,765
    Cyclefree said:

    eek said:

    I take it all the pb Leavers are in agreement with Peter North that they can live with a ten year recession in order to secure Brexit?

    http://peterjnorth.blogspot.co.uk/2017/10/i-dont-like-this-brexit-but-i-will-live.html?m=1

    Are we missing something here as we clearly didn't hear the interview. Why should we allow people to stay if the EU wasn't to allow the same?
    Our decision on how to treat people who have made their lives here for decades, who are parents of British children, should not depend on how others treat British citizens living abroad.

    We could choose to take the moral high ground here regardless of whether the EU does or not. Ideally, it would be best to get a reciprocal deal. But if not I would not want my country to start deporting people who have lived here for decades and have done nothing wrong
    Nor I. If there's no deal, we should simply offer permanent residency to EU nationals who are lawfully here.

    But, that's a different thing from offering them the right to come and go as they wish, or to marry non-EU spouses and bring them in without having to pass the same income qualifications as the spouses of British nationals.
  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    If you want to know something of the history of barcelona read Cathedrat of the Seas by Falcones its a good book and the second most read text in spain after Don Quiote. He wrote another book called "the last jew in spain" which is equally enlightening and informative
  • Puigdemont is risking losing momentum I think...

    He has put the ball in Madrid's court.
  • rkrkrk said:

    rkrkrk said:

    kle4 said:

    rkrkrk said:

    Just as a thought experiment- how would leavers feel if whilst negotiating Brexit transition period -- TM agreed a mechanism to rejoin quickly if we do change our minds?

    That would depend on the mechanism.
    Well how about - at the end of the transition period we want - if all EU27 and UK agree - we can just go back to being a full member of the EU again instead of leaving?

    EDIT - and keep the current opt outs rebate etc.
    We would already have left. The transition period is not an extension to our membership of the EU. It is a period during which some transitional arrangements are left in place to help with trade.

    As I explained earlier, once we leave the EU in March 2019 it would require a new treaty for us to rejoin. Do you really think the other EIU members would just let us join under the same terms as before and with the same antipathy towards their project as we have always had?
    Okay- I should say sort out rejoining arrangements...
    whether it is likely or not - (I think actually the EU might be keen) - how would you feel if that were done? Arguably it's prudent when you leave a club like the EU to find out or even agree how you might become a member again...
    We would be able to rejoin on exactly the basis as any other new member. We would make our application and the existing members would consider it. I would assume that they would insist on full membership of the Euro and Schengen as a minimum since those are the requirements of all new members under the treaties. Of course we would also lose any rebate.

    If after all that you can persuade the British public to vote to rejoin then you will deserve your win. I doubt it can and will happen.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    Sean_F said:

    Cyclefree said:

    eek said:

    I take it all the pb Leavers are in agreement with Peter North that they can live with a ten year recession in order to secure Brexit?

    http://peterjnorth.blogspot.co.uk/2017/10/i-dont-like-this-brexit-but-i-will-live.html?m=1

    Are we missing something here as we clearly didn't hear the interview. Why should we allow people to stay if the EU wasn't to allow the same?
    Our decision on how to treat people who have made their lives here for decades, who are parents of British children, should not depend on how others treat British citizens living abroad.

    We could choose to take the moral high ground here regardless of whether the EU does or not. Ideally, it would be best to get a reciprocal deal. But if not I would not want my country to start deporting people who have lived here for decades and have done nothing wrong
    marry non-EU spouses and bring them in without having to pass the same income qualifications as the spouses of British nationals.
    which is what the EU is demanding
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @bbclaurak: 1. Can't help thinking May has made rather a lot of trouble for herself by not saying how she would vote if #euref ran again

    @bbclaurak: 2. Fairly or unfairly it gives impression she is not quite sure about her govts main policy
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @paulwaugh: Asked if he'd vote Remain again, Damian Green: "I don't resile from anything I said." But adds Q is 'dubious' cos wont' be 2nd referendum
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,392
    edited October 2017
    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: 1. Can't help thinking May has made rather a lot of trouble for herself by not saying how she would vote if #euref ran again

    @bbclaurak: 2. Fairly or unfairly it gives impression she is not quite sure about her govts main policy

    It is exactly the sought of thing designed to dare the less secure Leaver MPs into trying to take her down, and they might not be strong enough yet. Careless or brilliant?
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Every member of the cabinet will now be asked how they would vote next time.

    Including BoZo and Gove
  • PAWPAW Posts: 1,074
    It is much more important that a UK father should pay for a never work EU immigrant than for the food his family needs - Mr Junker.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,765
    kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: 1. Can't help thinking May has made rather a lot of trouble for herself by not saying how she would vote if #euref ran again

    @bbclaurak: 2. Fairly or unfairly it gives impression she is not quite sure about her govts main policy

    It is exactly the sought of thing designed to dare the less secure Leaver MPs into trying to take her down, and they might not be strong enough yet. Careless or brilliant?
    I listened to the interview and thought there was no reason for her to answer yes or no to something purely hypothetical.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Sean_F said:

    I listened to the interview and thought there was no reason for her to answer yes or no to something purely hypothetical.

    She then went on to talk about a Corbyn government...
  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    I think the peter north twtter thread sums uo where we are their is no solution and we will just have to get on with it. With our current politicians i dont see a good outcome
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,765
    Scott_P said:

    Sean_F said:

    I listened to the interview and thought there was no reason for her to answer yes or no to something purely hypothetical.

    She then went on to talk about a Corbyn government...
    I felt that Iain Dale was trying to get her to recant, and saw no reason why she should do.

  • PAWPAW Posts: 1,074
    It is better for a UK worker to pay for an EU bureaucrat bureaucrat's pension than to have a pension of his owm - Mr Verhofstadt.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Sean_F said:

    I felt that Iain Dale was trying to get her to recant, and saw no reason why she should do.

    He was, and she didn't. Maybe you can explain that to all of the "if people voted for it, it must be the right thing to do" crowd?

    She still doesn't think it's a good idea.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,771
    Pagan said:

    Pagan said:

    Pagan said:

    FPT concerning food shortages if we go wto

    People are perhaps jumping to wrong conclusions about food from the headline figure of a third of our food is imported. They forget we also export food.

    For example Fish from 2014

    Fish caught or farmed in the uk 666,000 tonnes
    Fish exported 499,000 tonnes (323,000 tonnes to the eu approx)
    Fish imported to the uk 721000 tonnes (231,000 tonnes from eu)

    So on the fish front if we stopped being able to import and export fish from the eu in a timely manner then we would have a 100,000 tonne surplus of fish for home consumption.

    Yes britain may have to change our fish tastes but we wouldnt be going hungry.

    It is also a mystery why import/export time restrictions prevent us from importing/exporting to the eu when we manage to import 490,000 tonnes from countries which we have existing border controls to and export 166,000 tonnes to countries we have border controls with.

    At worst our range of choices is restricted but no shortage

    Wouldn't fishermen just catch less fish if demand went down? Brexit could be great news for cod.

    Yes they would but still doesnt mean there would be a shortage. Just like when employers complain about skill shortages when what they mean is that we can't get someone with the skills we want at the price we want to pay them I suspect the supermarkets here are saying we may not be able to buy in stock at the price we want to pay for it.

    The "we" feeds through - it becomes "us", the consumers. British shoppers do not want to pay higher prices for their food (or anything else, of course). But if the supermarkets have to pay more, they will merely pass the cost on. We all have to eat, after all.

    Some food will get more expensive, some will get cheaper due to not having to abide by eu tariffs. Some will now be worth growing here as we won't need to pay farmers not to produce stuff. It is no different to the eu making some food more expensive by imposing tariff's or the sri lankan fish ban I mentioned.
    I used to think that lower food prices would be an unambiguous positive from Brexit, but I'm now struggling with how ridiculously expensive grocery shopping is in the US.

    $4 BREAD. Insane.

    (And that's before California sales tax of 9%.)
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    Scott_P said:

    Sean_F said:

    I listened to the interview and thought there was no reason for her to answer yes or no to something purely hypothetical.

    She then went on to talk about a Corbyn government...
    A Corbyn government isn’t “purely hypothetical”
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @DavidMills73: @gabrielmilland It's a political problem, but 52:48 is a vote for a remainy kind of leave. 65:35 would have been a vote for pulling up the drawbridge.

    @rafaelbehr: @DavidMills73 @gabrielmilland I think you'll find 52:48 is a vote for prancing around ineffectually, bickering and then accidentally setting fire to the drawbridge.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    edited October 2017

    A Corbyn government isn’t “purely hypothetical”

    It's as hypothetical as a second referendum

    EDIT: The political circumstances required for one are just as likely as those required for the other
  • rcs1000 said:

    Pagan said:

    Pagan said:

    Pagan said:

    FPT concerning food shortages if we go wto

    People are perhaps jumping to wrong conclusions about food from the headline figure of a third of our food is imported. They forget we also export food.

    For example Fish from 2014

    Fish caught or farmed in the uk 666,000 tonnes
    Fish exported 499,000 tonnes (323,000 tonnes to the eu approx)
    Fish imported to the uk 721000 tonnes (231,000 tonnes from eu)

    So on the fish front if we stopped being able to import and export fish from the eu in a timely manner then we would have a 100,000 tonne surplus of fish for home consumption.

    Yes britain may have to change our fish tastes but we wouldnt be going hungry.

    It is also a mystery why import/export time restrictions prevent us from importing/exporting to the eu when we manage to import 490,000 tonnes from countries which we have existing border controls to and export 166,000 tonnes to countries we have border controls with.

    At worst our range of choices is restricted but no shortage

    Wouldn't fishermen just catch less fish if demand went down? Brexit could be great news for cod.

    Yes they would but still doesnt mean there would be a shortage. Just like when employers complain about skill shortages when what they mean is that we can't get someone with the skills we want at the price we want to pay them I suspect the supermarkets here are saying we may not be able to buy in stock at the price we want to pay for it.

    The "we" feeds through - it becomes "us", the consumers. British shoppers do not want to pay higher prices for their food (or anything else, of course). But if the supermarkets have to pay more, they will merely pass the cost on. We all have to eat, after all.

    Some food will get more expensive, some will get cheaper due to not having to abide by eu tariffs. Some will now be worth growing here as we won't need to pay farmers not to produce stuff. It is no different to the eu making some food more expensive by imposing tariff's or the sri lankan fish ban I mentioned.
    I used to think that lower food prices would be an unambiguous positive from Brexit, but I'm now struggling with how ridiculously expensive grocery shopping is in the US.

    $4 BREAD. Insane.

    (And that's before California sales tax of 9%.)
    For all its dubious benefits as a wine region and its more obvious benefits for growing fruit, California is not natural wheat territory and seems to be under a semi permanent threat of drought. I am not surprised to find food is expensive.

    Besides, I thought Californians didn't eat bread as the whole population is gluten intolerant. :)
  • MJWMJW Posts: 1,282
    Sean_F said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: 1. Can't help thinking May has made rather a lot of trouble for herself by not saying how she would vote if #euref ran again

    @bbclaurak: 2. Fairly or unfairly it gives impression she is not quite sure about her govts main policy

    It is exactly the sought of thing designed to dare the less secure Leaver MPs into trying to take her down, and they might not be strong enough yet. Careless or brilliant?
    I listened to the interview and thought there was no reason for her to answer yes or no to something purely hypothetical.
    It struck me as a perfectly sensible answer - would anyone have believed her if she said she'd now vote to leave? What would she have said to the inevitable follow up question - what's changed? It's pretty ludicrous that Brexit has for some become a moral crusade where any admission of doubt that it's all for the best is heresy. Almost as if those who pushes so hard for Brexit know they've conned people and are terrified they'll be rumbled the moment someone points it out.
  • Scott_P said:

    @DavidMills73: @gabrielmilland It's a political problem, but 52:48 is a vote for a remainy kind of leave. 65:35 would have been a vote for pulling up the drawbridge.

    @rafaelbehr: @DavidMills73 @gabrielmilland I think you'll find 52:48 is a vote for prancing around ineffectually, bickering and then accidentally setting fire to the drawbridge.

    image

    http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2016/10/18/the-nearest-run-thing/

  • NEW THREAD

  • PeterCPeterC Posts: 1,274
    Scott_P said:

    Sean_F said:

    I felt that Iain Dale was trying to get her to recant, and saw no reason why she should do.

    He was, and she didn't. Maybe you can explain that to all of the "if people voted for it, it must be the right thing to do" crowd?

    She still doesn't think it's a good idea.
    Doesn't that put her in a tuly horrid position of having to lead the government while being opposed to it's central policy? Perhaps she just sees it as her duty to implement the referedum result. Personally I couldn't do that - I would let someone else do the job.
  • calumcalum Posts: 3,046
    :)
  • calumcalum Posts: 3,046
    calum said:

    :)

    (:
This discussion has been closed.