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SystemSystem Posts: 11,002
edited August 2013 in General

politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Survation poll out

Survation for The Mail on Sunday – VI (Change since August 4th)
CON 29% (+1)

LAB 37% (+1)

UKIP 17% (-1)

LD 11% (NC)

AP 7% (NC)

Read the full story here


«13

Comments

  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,286
    edited August 2013
    FPT:

    Stephen Crabb MP:

    "The world does not suddenly become a nicer or safer place just because a small majority of MPs decide that Britain should sit on its hands and watch on from the sidelines. Britain remains one of a very small number of democratic nations with the military and diplomatic capability to help to defend international law.”

    http://www.stephencrabb.com/displaynews.aspx?ArticleID=295
  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    edited August 2013
    FPT
    RedRag1 said:

    surbiton said:

    RedRag1 said:

    tim said:

    Survation ‏@Survation 11m
    Survation for The Mail on Sunday - Voting Intention (Change since August 4th)
    CON 29% (+1) LAB 37% (+1) UKIP 17% (-1) LD 11% (NC) AP 7% (NC)

    All the summer hysteria from the PB Tories and no movement.

    Labours percentage yet again within the Fort Knox style bracket. The rest is just noise.
    UKIP ain't budging either. Oh dear !
    And here lies the Tory problem. They like Avery LP/PB Hodges/Dan Hodges can repeat the weak, weak, weak line until they are quite literally blue in the face. It has not effected the Labour percentage. I just hope they realise this some time during July 2015.
    You think that 37% of the population will vote for Ed Miliband's finger to be on the nuclear button in 2015?

    Chief of Defence Staff Birmingham has been obliterated in a nuclear attack launched from Iran, Prime Minister. What are you instructions?

    PM Miliband Are you sure it is Iran, Chief?

    Chief of Defence Staff The intelligence assessment shows the highest level of confidence, Prime Minister.

    PM Miliband But what about French intelligence reports? What do they say?

    Chief of Defence Staff Manchester has now been hit , Prime Minister. Shall we respond?

    PM Miliband I need to consult my shadow cabinet, Chief. And wait for tomorrow's YouGov polls.

    Chief of Defence Staff Liverpool,has now been hit Prime Minister. I urge you to make a quick decision. London is sure to be next.

    PM Miliband Will it affect Islington and Brewers Green?

    Chief of Defence Staff It is sure to, Prime Minister. Glasgow and Faslane now gone, Sir.

    PM Miliband Let me sleep on it, Chief.

    [Prime Minister exits Cabinet Room and runs upstairs]

    PM Miliband Justine! Justine!
  • Very good night for Miliband.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 113,972
    edited August 2013
    Just how toxic is Blair.

    In hindsight, he he wanted military action in Syria, he should have come out against it, that would have got the public behind military action in Syria
  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    The poll findings are all "The Diet starts tomorrow" responses.
  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815

    Very good night for Miliband.

    Good night, Mr. Miliband. And goodbye.

  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,279
    Twitter
    Kenny Farquharson ‏@KennyFarq 19m
    We've an #indyref opinion poll in tomorrow's SoS.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Good evening, everyone.

    Interesting figures. Sounds like it's seen more as a victory for Parliament than defeat for Cameron. Ironic, given the result was something of a farce, but there we are.
  • GrandioseGrandiose Posts: 2,323
    If the fieldwork is after then this must be considered a pretty good poll for Cameron. The fact is that the Conservatives' charge faltered several weeks ago, although the position has solidified at around 6pts, bit more with pollsters with high UKIP and vice versa. Cameron sounded relieved when he lost the vote and he'll be relieved it is starting to look like VI hasn't shifted.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    I am desperately looking at the poll where it says the public blames Miliband for everything that has gone wrong with Syria.
  • Grandiose said:

    If the fieldwork is after then this must be considered a pretty good poll for Cameron. The fact is that the Conservatives' charge faltered several weeks ago, although the position has solidified at around 6pts, bit more with pollsters with high UKIP and vice versa. Cameron sounded relieved when he lost the vote and he'll be relieved it is starting to look like VI hasn't shifted.

    I've updated the thread header

    The fieldwork was entirely after the government defeat. Survation interviewed 1002 respondents online on Friday afternoon and evening seeking their reactions to the Government’s House of Commons defeat over Syria.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,124
    AveryLP said:

    Very good night for Miliband.

    Good night, Mr. Miliband. And goodbye.

    LOL
  • MrJonesMrJones Posts: 3,523
    "Tony Blair’s support for action was considered to have weakened the case by 40%, to 8% thinking he had strengthened it"

    Hopefully the people paying his wages will see that and put him out to grass.
  • Sleazy, broken Warmongers on the slide?
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,530
    FPT:

    Timetabling.

    It seems Cameron is now getting criticism on the timetabling of this as well as the recall. A few thoughts on this:

    The time pressure came from Obama; it seems he wanted to launch before or at this weekend, before he went away on an international trip. Obama does not have to get congressional approval before ordering strikes. As the senior member of any coalition, he has the final say on the timetable.

    Cameron wanted (rightly IMHO) for parliament's will to be known. For that to happen, he had to recall parliament with all the problems and inconvenience that entails.

    He could only release the analysis of intelligence information that the UK had. He could not press the US to release their analysis earlier than Obama wanted. As Obama did not need congressional approval, the best time to release the US's information was shortly before the planned strikes. There is also a danger that such a combined move may have made it looks as though it was a concerted effort, devaluing both in some people's eyes. (*)

    It is hard to see what else Cameron could have done to stop this, aside from choosing not to respond to the use of chemical weapons in Syria. That was a very difficult moral and political decision.

    (*) It is obvious that for many of our parliamentarians, no amount of evidence would be enough. That belief seems to be echoed by some on here.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    AveryLP said:

    FPT

    RedRag1 said:

    surbiton said:

    RedRag1 said:

    tim said:

    Survation ‏@Survation 11m
    Survation for The Mail on Sunday - Voting Intention (Change since August 4th)
    CON 29% (+1) LAB 37% (+1) UKIP 17% (-1) LD 11% (NC) AP 7% (NC)

    All the summer hysteria from the PB Tories and no movement.

    Labours percentage yet again within the Fort Knox style bracket. The rest is just noise.
    UKIP ain't budging either. Oh dear !
    And here lies the Tory problem. They like Avery LP/PB Hodges/Dan Hodges can repeat the weak, weak, weak line until they are quite literally blue in the face. It has not effected the Labour percentage. I just hope they realise this some time during July 2015.
    You think that 37% of the population will vote for Ed Miliband's finger to be on the nuclear button in 2015?

    Chief of Defence Staff Birmingham has been obliterated in a nuclear attack launched from Iran, Prime Minister. What are you instructions?

    PM Miliband Are you sure it is Iran, Chief?

    Chief of Defence Staff The intelligence assessment shows the highest level of confidence, Prime Minister.

    PM Miliband But what about French intelligence reports? What do they say?

    Chief of Defence Staff Manchester has now been hit , Prime Minister. Shall we respond?

    PM Miliband I need to consult my shadow cabinet, Chief. And wait for tomorrow's YouGov polls.

    Chief of Defence Staff Liverpool,has now been hit Prime Minister. I urge you to make a quick decision. London is sure to be next.

    PM Miliband Will it affect Islington and Brewers Green?

    Chief of Defence Staff It is sure to, Prime Minister. Glasgow and Faslane now gone, Sir.

    PM Miliband Let me sleep on it, Chief.

    [Prime Minister exits Cabinet Room and runs upstairs]

    PM Miliband Justine! Justine!

    PM Miliband I need to consult my shadow cabinet, Chief. And wait for tomorrow's YouGov polls.

    Avery, I cannot see why PM Miliband would consult the shadow cabinet. You Tory fops still think you wil be in charge. Fruedian !

    "Justine, Justine", I presume that refers to his wife and not asking Justine Greening to emerge from the locked room with the other MP to vote !


  • MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699
    Poor old AveryLP , not only out of touch with reality but in a world of his own
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. Jones, this reminds me a psych paper I read a few years ago. It assessed how homophobes' attitudes changed regarding increased rights (adoption, marriage) for gay people. When gay people said they did not want such rights it actually increased the homophobes' support for gay marriage and the like.

    Blair's like that. Except instead of being gay he's just a massive liar, and instead of being homphobes we've simply realised it.
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,279
    @MSmithsonPB 1m
    41% tell Survation that Cameron the party leader trusted most to handle international crises. EdM scored 21%
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,279
    POEDWAS.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    The Survation poll finds no appetite for lobbing a few missiles. According to the PBTories that must be "weak, weak" Miliband's fault.

    Why has there been no "Ed is Crap" threads the last two days ?
  • RedRag1RedRag1 Posts: 527
    Avery LP - Keep repeating the weak weak weak line until 2015...please. Meanwhile on planet earth another poll places Labour in the bracket. Wonder if the Yougov will place the Labour percentage in the bracket. Currently, on past polls since August 2010, there is over a 96% chance.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,124
    dr_spyn said:

    @MSmithsonPB 1m
    41% tell Survation that Cameron the party leader trusted most to handle international crises. EdM scored 21%

    Oh dear!

  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,530
    surbiton said:

    AveryLP said:

    FPT
    You think that 37% of the population will vote for Ed Miliband's finger to be on the nuclear button in 2015?

    Chief of Defence Staff Birmingham has been obliterated in a nuclear attack launched from Iran, Prime Minister. What are you instructions?

    PM Miliband Are you sure it is Iran, Chief?

    Chief of Defence Staff The intelligence assessment shows the highest level of confidence, Prime Minister.

    PM Miliband But what about French intelligence reports? What do they say?

    Chief of Defence Staff Manchester has now been hit , Prime Minister. Shall we respond?

    PM Miliband I need to consult my shadow cabinet, Chief. And wait for tomorrow's YouGov polls.

    Chief of Defence Staff Liverpool,has now been hit Prime Minister. I urge you to make a quick decision. London is sure to be next.

    PM Miliband Will it affect Islington and Brewers Green?

    Chief of Defence Staff It is sure to, Prime Minister. Glasgow and Faslane now gone, Sir.

    PM Miliband Let me sleep on it, Chief.

    [Prime Minister exits Cabinet Room and runs upstairs]

    PM Miliband Justine! Justine!


    PM Miliband I need to consult my shadow cabinet, Chief. And wait for tomorrow's YouGov polls.

    Avery, I cannot see why PM Miliband would consult the shadow cabinet. You Tory fops still think you wil be in charge. Fruedian !

    "Justine, Justine", I presume that refers to his wife and not asking Justine Greening to emerge from the locked room with the other MP to vote !
    (cue PB Tory mode)
    Miliband's shadow cabinet would be the MPs sitting around the coffin-shaped cabinet table at Number 10. His real cabinet will be the union barons.
    (/cue Tory PB mode)

    ;-)
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    dr_spyn said:

    @MSmithsonPB 1m
    41% tell Survation that Cameron the party leader trusted most to handle international crises. EdM scored 21%

    Good result for Ed - 21% is huge for a contemptible slug.
  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    edited August 2013
    surbiton said:

    AveryLP said:

    FPT

    RedRag1 said:

    surbiton said:

    RedRag1 said:

    tim said:

    Survation ‏@Survation 11m
    Survation for The Mail on Sunday - Voting Intention (Change since August 4th)
    CON 29% (+1) LAB 37% (+1) UKIP 17% (-1) LD 11% (NC) AP 7% (NC)

    All the summer hysteria from the PB Tories and no movement.

    Labours percentage yet again within the Fort Knox style bracket. The rest is just noise.
    UKIP ain't budging either. Oh dear !
    And here lies the Tory problem. They like Avery LP/PB Hodges/Dan Hodges can repeat the weak, weak, weak line until they are quite literally blue in the face. It has not effected the Labour percentage. I just hope they realise this some time during July 2015.
    [Dramatic dialogue of Shakespearian quality]


    PM Miliband I need to consult my shadow cabinet, Chief. And wait for tomorrow's YouGov polls.

    Avery, I cannot see why PM Miliband would consult the shadow cabinet. You Tory fops still think you wil be in charge. Fruedian !

    "Justine, Justine", I presume that refers to his wife and not asking Justine Greening to emerge from the locked room with the other MP to vote !


    Surby

    In referring to Ed as "PM Miliband" I am inciting the time honoured dramatic impact known as "supension of disbelief".

    And, arguing in the alternative, only you would fight on a technicality.

  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    edited August 2013
    How many times has Mr Smithson tweeted this poll?

    Mike Smithson @MSmithsonPB
    By 52% to 26% the those polled by Survation that they didn't agree with No10 accusation that EdM gave "succour” to the Assad regime

    Mike Smithson @MSmithsonPB
    By 55% to 45% the Survation sample said they don't Cameron’s judgement on whether President Assad was responsible for chemical attacks

    Mike Smithson @MSmithsonPB
    39% told Survation/MoS poll that Tony Blair's article supporting action weakened case for UK intervention. 8% said it strengthened it

    Mike Smithson @MSmithsonPB
    41% tell Survation that Cameron the party leader trusted most to handle international crises. EdM scored 21%

    Mike Smithson @MSmithsonPB
    Confirmed. All fieldwork for Survation/MoS poll was carried out yesterday AFTER Commons vote

    Mike Smithson @MSmithsonPB
    A larger version of the Survation infographic on Syria
    survation.com/wp-content/upl…

    Mike Smithson @MSmithsonPB
    The Survation poll for Mail on Sunday Survation finds support for military strikes in Syria at 19%. with 65% opposed

    Mike Smithson @MSmithsonPB
    Haven't got this confirmed but my understanding is that Survation poll carried out after Commons vote

    Mike Smithson @MSmithsonPB
    Just 22% tell Survation MoS poll that Cameron in touch with public opinion on Syria - 60% say he wasn't

    Mike Smithson @MSmithsonPB
    Infographic from Survation on its Syria findings for Mail on Sunday poll
    pic.twitter.com/E61IBrOQvJ

    Mike Smithson @MSmithsonPB
    The Survation 17% for UKIP is lowest for several months
    At peak in May the firm had Farage's party on 22%

    Mike Smithson @MSmithsonPB
    New Survation poll for Mail on Sunday
    Changes from Aug 4
    CON 29% (+1)
    LAB 37% (+1)
    UKIP 17% (-1)
    LD 11% =
  • Dave nervously entered the doctor's surgery. One thing worried him - where was the doctor? Behind the desk at the far end of the room was the doctor’s chair. Its back was facing him, so Dave gingerly edged forward to investigate. However, he was barely halfway across the room when the chair swivelled round, and there, to his infinite horror, was the dread Bashar Al Assad!

    The monster's mouth narrowed into a malicious grin, and he began to speak in his heavy Middle Eastern accent.

    "Ah, my boy! I see you still haven't slimmed down yet! Why is that?" he asked, and he leaned across the desk menacingly.

    "I tried, Bashar! Honest, I tried!" Dave replied, quivering with fear!

    "Trying is not good enough!" roared the monster, and quick as a flash he leapt out from his chair, grabbing Dave in the process, and using his immense strength, flinging him onto the nearby couch! Bashar then leapt back behind the desk, and, laughing maniacally, opened a drawer and produced a massive hacksaw!

    "No! Please, Bashar!" whimpered Dave pathetically. "Please, don't!"

    But the monster was adamant to teach him a lesson. He leapt back towards the couch and proceeded to hack off Dave's pseudo-feminine man-boobs with a single scythe-like motion! Mutilated and bleeding, Dave begged for mercy. But Bashar next did something that even Dave swore was just a myth: he extended his twelve-inch long proboscis, and used it to puncture the poor lad's blubbery abdominal region! And then to suck hard!

    "Nooooooooo!" Dave screamed, as he felt the monster guzzle up his precious life-fat, and within moments he was just a sack of skin and bones, fat-less it has to be admitted, but unfortunately life-less too. Once he had drained every last drop of his latest victim's, er, "load", Bashar let out a satisfied belch and a soft, low growl of contentment, before leaving the doctor's surgery.

  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    felix said:

    dr_spyn said:

    @MSmithsonPB 1m
    41% tell Survation that Cameron the party leader trusted most to handle international crises. EdM scored 21%

    Oh dear!

    And ?
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,688
    This post of mine finished up on the previous and dead thread. I'm going to repost it here, but I feel I owe everyone an apology for doing so. However someone may smile, and I rather enjoyed writing it.



    Following AveryLP's admirable plan. Here's my own contribution...

    Chief of Defence Staff: Birmingham has been obliterated in a nuclear attack launched from Iran, Prime Minister. What are you instructions?

    PM Miliband: Where in the world is Birmingham?

    Chief of Defence Staff: It's our city, Chief. A bit north.

    PM Miliband: My God, you mean our voters?

    Chief of Defence Staff : Yes

    PM Miliband: They live, or lived in Birmingham did they? I never knew.

    Chief of Defence Staff: Manchester too now, Prime Minister. Shall we respond?

    PM Miliband: Why, what have the Tories said?

    Chief of Defence Staff: No Sir, I mean Manchester has been obliterated too.

    PM Miliband: Well it had so much to answer for. My voters like the Smiths. Do you think the line will play well?

    Chief of Defence Staff: Sir!?

    PM Miliband: Yes?.. Oh my word I forgot to ask you how your weekend in Kent went. Did you meet my friend Trevor?

    Chief of Defence Staff: No Sir, our response?

    PM Miliband: Well just pooh-pooh anything the Tories have said, and make sure that we're not agreeing with Tony.

    Chief of Defence Staff: Sir, I don't think you understand the gravity of the situation. This is your big test!

    PM Miliband: Oh why didn't you tell me Yvette was here before! I have a big red button that I can press you know. It'll quieten down you defence types I tell you.
  • @plato

    He's not tweeted it as many times as I have
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,124
    surbiton said:

    felix said:

    dr_spyn said:

    @MSmithsonPB 1m
    41% tell Survation that Cameron the party leader trusted most to handle international crises. EdM scored 21%

    Oh dear!

    And ?
    I was just having an oh dear moment - and your problem is?
  • JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 5,997
    edited August 2013
    RedRag1 said:

    Meanwhile on planet earth another poll places Labour in the bracket. Wonder if the Yougov will place the Labour percentage in the bracket. Currently, on past polls since August 2010, there is over a 96% chance.

    I know you believe, against all evidence, that the polls have been flat, but if you actually look at the facts you will find that at the start of the year the average Labour lead was 10.5 and now it is 5.5. The average Labour percentage has fallen from 43 to 37.5.

    [Averaging eight consecutive polls as shown on this Wikipedia page]
  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    @another_richard

    The Conservatives need a new chief whip and improved party discipline.

    Perhaps the Conservative whips assumed that their MPs would 'never oppose a chance to bomb ragheads' as a PB sage informed us.

    Is Cousin Seth back from Cleethorpes yet ? The local Conservative MPs opposed giving succor to Al Qaeda it should be noted.


    Yes, I rather miscalculated there, ar.

    I forgot how much Tories preferred frolicking in the summer months to serious work.

    And as for the bombers, it appears most of those have become kippers and are wandering around the seaside pubs of England pretending to be peaceniks.

    I fully expect Farage to adopt as the new UKIP logo the now decommissioned CND mark.
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724

    @plato

    He's not tweeted it as many times as I have

    Well that's lie judging by your own timeline

    @TSEofPB
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    Omnium said:

    This post of mine finished up on the previous and dead thread. I'm going to repost it here, but I feel I owe everyone an apology for doing so. However someone may smile, and I rather enjoyed writing it.



    Following AveryLP's admirable plan. Here's my own contribution...

    Chief of Defence Staff: Birmingham has been obliterated in a nuclear attack launched from Iran, Prime Minister. What are you instructions?

    PM Miliband: Where in the world is Birmingham?

    Chief of Defence Staff: It's our city, Chief. A bit north.

    PM Miliband: My God, you mean our voters?

    Chief of Defence Staff : Yes

    PM Miliband: They live, or lived in Birmingham did they? I never knew.

    Chief of Defence Staff: Manchester too now, Prime Minister. Shall we respond?

    PM Miliband: Why, what have the Tories said?

    Chief of Defence Staff: No Sir, I mean Manchester has been obliterated too.

    PM Miliband: Well it had so much to answer for. My voters like the Smiths. Do you think the line will play well?

    Chief of Defence Staff: Sir!?

    PM Miliband: Yes?.. Oh my word I forgot to ask you how your weekend in Kent went. Did you meet my friend Trevor?

    Chief of Defence Staff: No Sir, our response?

    PM Miliband: Well just pooh-pooh anything the Tories have said, and make sure that we're not agreeing with Tony.

    Chief of Defence Staff: Sir, I don't think you understand the gravity of the situation. This is your big test!

    PM Miliband: Oh why didn't you tell me Yvette was here before! I have a big red button that I can press you know. It'll quieten down you defence types I tell you.

    Your sketch underlines your problem neatly. You chaps have always underestimated him and every time he has slapped you hard.

  • RedRag1RedRag1 Posts: 527

    RedRag1 said:

    Meanwhile on planet earth another poll places Labour in the bracket. Wonder if the Yougov will place the Labour percentage in the bracket. Currently, on past polls since August 2010, there is over a 96% chance.

    I know you believe, against all evidence, that the polls have been flat, but if you actually look at the facts you will find that at the start of the year the average Labour lead was 10.5 and now it is 5.5. The average Labour percentage has fallen from 43 to 37.5.

    [Averaging eight consecutive polls as shown on this Wikipedia page]
    John, add them all up then since August 2010 and tell me how may of those polls Labour have been outside the bracket, and what percentage have been within the bracket. I know...do you?
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    AveryLP said:

    @another_richard

    The Conservatives need a new chief whip and improved party discipline.

    Perhaps the Conservative whips assumed that their MPs would 'never oppose a chance to bomb ragheads' as a PB sage informed us.

    Is Cousin Seth back from Cleethorpes yet ? The local Conservative MPs opposed giving succor to Al Qaeda it should be noted.


    Yes, I rather miscalculated there, ar.

    I forgot how much Tories preferred frolicking in the summer months to serious work.

    And as for the bombers, it appears most of those have become kippers and are wandering around the seaside pubs of England pretending to be peaceniks.

    I fully expect Farage to adopt as the new UKIP logo the now decommissioned CND mark.

    OK, Avery, That was good, I have to admit.
  • john_zimsjohn_zims Posts: 3,399
    TGOHF

    'Good result for Ed - 21% is huge for a contemptible slug.'

    Polzeath 41% Weasel 21%

    Ed played a blinder..
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. T, on the global stage Afghanistan would probably be in far better shape, without attention and resources being needlessly shifted from there to Iraq (the modern equivalent of the Sicilian expedition of the Peloponnesian War).

    Your view's echoed in the comments to Robinson's most recent piece: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-23909443

    "This is a very clever win for Cameron. He gets to tell America that he really wants to join in but can't because his hands are tied after the vote.

    He upsets the Americans less than telling them no straight out and the British public is happy because he isn't taking us into another unpopular war.

    As a bonus, if it turns out we SHOULD have intervened, he can blame labour for voting no."
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549

    RedRag1 said:

    Meanwhile on planet earth another poll places Labour in the bracket. Wonder if the Yougov will place the Labour percentage in the bracket. Currently, on past polls since August 2010, there is over a 96% chance.

    I know you believe, against all evidence, that the polls have been flat, but if you actually look at the facts you will find that at the start of the year the average Labour lead was 10.5 and now it is 5.5. The average Labour percentage has fallen from 43 to 37.5.

    [Averaging eight consecutive polls as shown on this Wikipedia page]
    I am sure you are correct. But how many times have Labour gone below 36% ?
  • perdixperdix Posts: 1,806

    FPT:

    Timetabling.

    It seems Cameron is now getting criticism on the timetabling of this as well as the recall. A few thoughts on this:

    The time pressure came from Obama; it seems he wanted to launch before or at this weekend, before he went away on an international trip. Obama does not have to get congressional approval before ordering strikes. As the senior member of any coalition, he has the final say on the timetable.

    Cameron wanted (rightly IMHO) for parliament's will to be known. For that to happen, he had to recall parliament with all the problems and inconvenience that entails.

    He could only release the analysis of intelligence information that the UK had. He could not press the US to release their analysis earlier than Obama wanted. As Obama did not need congressional approval, the best time to release the US's information was shortly before the planned strikes. There is also a danger that such a combined move may have made it looks as though it was a concerted effort, devaluing both in some people's eyes. (*)

    It is hard to see what else Cameron could have done to stop this, aside from choosing not to respond to the use of chemical weapons in Syria. That was a very difficult moral and political decision.

    (*) It is obvious that for many of our parliamentarians, no amount of evidence would be enough. That belief seems to be echoed by some on here.

    Insightful thesis. The problems of voting in a recall parly were compounded by a naïve belief in ReD 's sincerity in initial support for the government. The whips were not fired up on the government side and when ReD changed his support it was too late to firm up all the government votes.

  • Poll finds 60% of British public oppose UK military action against Syria

    Survey carried out over period before and after Commons vote that saw David Cameron defeated in bid to win backing

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2013/aug/31/poll-british-military-action-syria?CMP=twt_fd
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. T, is that finished the first draft, or completely finished the whole thing?

    Congrats, either way.
  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    edited August 2013
    Plato said:

    How many times has Mr Smithson tweeted this poll?

    Mike's telecommunication costs in Biarritz are single-handedly forcing France out of their recession.

    Hollande will be able to fire a second missile purely on the proceeds.

  • corporealcorporeal Posts: 2,549
    SeanT said:

    fpt

    Corporeal is correct.

    Excuse me everyone while I print this out and frame it somewhere.
  • MrJonesMrJones Posts: 3,523

    Dave nervously entered the doctor's surgery. One thing worried him - where was the doctor? Behind the desk at the far end of the room was the doctor’s chair. Its back was facing him, so Dave gingerly edged forward to investigate. However, he was barely halfway across the room when the chair swivelled round, and there, to his infinite horror, was the dread Bashar Al Assad!

    The monster's mouth narrowed into a malicious grin, and he began to speak in his heavy Middle Eastern accent.

    "Ah, my boy! I see you still haven't slimmed down yet! Why is that?" he asked, and he leaned across the desk menacingly.

    "I tried, Bashar! Honest, I tried!" Dave replied, quivering with fear!

    "Trying is not good enough!" roared the monster, and quick as a flash he leapt out from his chair, grabbing Dave in the process, and using his immense strength, flinging him onto the nearby couch! Bashar then leapt back behind the desk, and, laughing maniacally, opened a drawer and produced a massive hacksaw!

    "No! Please, Bashar!" whimpered Dave pathetically. "Please, don't!"

    But the monster was adamant to teach him a lesson. He leapt back towards the couch and proceeded to hack off Dave's pseudo-feminine man-boobs with a single scythe-like motion! Mutilated and bleeding, Dave begged for mercy. But Bashar next did something that even Dave swore was just a myth: he extended his twelve-inch long proboscis, and used it to puncture the poor lad's blubbery abdominal region! And then to suck hard!

    "Nooooooooo!" Dave screamed, as he felt the monster guzzle up his precious life-fat, and within moments he was just a sack of skin and bones, fat-less it has to be admitted, but unfortunately life-less too. Once he had drained every last drop of his latest victim's, er, "load", Bashar let out a satisfied belch and a soft, low growl of contentment, before leaving the doctor's surgery.

    booker prize for sure
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Photos are indeed a rarity in novels (not that I'm much of a thriller reader). That said, Brandon Sanderson included drawings in The Way of Kings, and that's pretty unusual for fantasy.

    Writ smaller (and poorer :p) I'm writing a comedy at the moment. Shortish (35,000 words or so), but I know what you mean about it being difficult to assess a new genre.

    Writing-wise I'm reasonably happy, but marketing/promotion is proving trickier. Got something like 5-6 reviews for Journey to Altmortis in the pipeline, though no idea how fast/slow they'll be.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,530
    SeanT said:

    In more important news, I have finished a thriller. Finished WRITING one. It is very very very different to anything I've done before.

    This could be good, or bad, depending on your point of view. If you even have a point of view. Oh, you know what I mean.

    Anyway. I am now drinking Tahuan Argentinian Malbec 2011 by way of celebrex. The Argies are now making some f*cking top wines - and not just Malbecs. It is the wineland of the future. Possibly more potential than Chile or even Oz.

    Congratulations; I look forward to reading it. Sadly I found the Tom Knox novels well-written but not quite my cup of tea (*) - it'll be interesting to see what this new one is like.

    (*) Having said that, I found 'Bible of the Dead' so engrossing that I stayed up until after midnight in my tent one night to complete it. Hence giving me an eyestrain-induced headache from reading to by torchlight, a sore neck, and making me extremely tired for the next day's hike.

    Reading the book in a tent, on a wild camp during a storm does add a certain atmosphere to the proceedings!
  • RedRag1RedRag1 Posts: 527
    Mr Liburne - I stand corrected, it should read 96% of polls 36% or above.
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    AveryLP said:

    Plato said:

    How many times has Mr Smithson tweeted this poll?

    Mike's telecommunication costs in Biarritz are single-handedly forcing France out of their recession.

    Hollande will be able to fire a second missile purely on the proceeds.

    It's just bizarre as is TSE pretending to back him by fibbing about tweeting it. I wouldn't be surprised if TSE says he votes LD next.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    Does anyone think Syrian propaganda re: Al Qaeda strength amond rebels could yet derail Obama bombing ?
  • corporeal said:

    SeanT said:

    fpt

    Corporeal is correct.

    Excuse me everyone while I print this out and frame it somewhere.
    It was a great pleasure to publish your piece and David H's piece as well
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Miss Plato, stop being horrid to Mr. Eagles. His preference for Caesar over Hannibal is clearly indicative of some sort of head injury.
  • JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 5,997
    surbiton said:

    I am sure you are correct. But how many times have Labour gone below 36% ?

    You're as capable of counting as me, but I think it's about eight.

  • RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    edited August 2013
    Moderated
  • Plato said:

    AveryLP said:

    Plato said:

    How many times has Mr Smithson tweeted this poll?

    Mike's telecommunication costs in Biarritz are single-handedly forcing France out of their recession.

    Hollande will be able to fire a second missile purely on the proceeds.

    It's just bizarre as is TSE pretending to back him by fibbing about tweeting it. I wouldn't be surprised if TSE says he votes LD next.
    I've posted 19 tweets on this topic, Mike has tweeted on this poll twelve times.
  • NextNext Posts: 826
    SeanT said:

    Mr. T, is that finished the first draft, or completely finished the whole thing?

    Congrats, either way.

    Oh, just the raw 1st draft. But my agent wants a polished draft for the Frankfurt Book Fair (in about 6 weeks) so I won't be able to laze around paring my nails with self regard.

    Also, the book could easily be complete crap. I genuinely have no idea, as it is such a new venture. With a standard Tom Knox I generally have a sense as I finish, as to whether it has gone well.

    We shall see.

    One thing is for sure: it is adventurous. I am including lots of photos. Fairly rare in a novel. Unique in a thriller, I believe.

    Ta for the gratz. I trust your own writing thrives.
    Your page on "vanilla forums" now has you flagged with 23 "Trolls".

    Clearly your talents are not just related to thrillers.

    Well done, sir.
  • JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 5,997
    RedRag1 said:

    John, add them all up then since August 2010 and tell me how may of those polls Labour have been outside the bracket, and what percentage have been within the bracket. I know...do you?

    I can't remember what your arbitrarily-defined magic "bracket" is, but it's not relevant, as I am talking about trend, and direction of travel. What is important is not how people say they would vote now, but how they will vote in May 2015.
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724

    Plato said:

    AveryLP said:

    Plato said:

    How many times has Mr Smithson tweeted this poll?

    Mike's telecommunication costs in Biarritz are single-handedly forcing France out of their recession.

    Hollande will be able to fire a second missile purely on the proceeds.

    It's just bizarre as is TSE pretending to back him by fibbing about tweeting it. I wouldn't be surprised if TSE says he votes LD next.
    I've posted 19 tweets on this topic, Mike has tweeted on this poll twelve times.
    Well when I checked your timeline you hadn't. And WTF is the obsession with a Survation poll anyways? Bizarre. Truly weird
  • SeanT said:

    SeanT said:

    In more important news, I have finished a thriller. Finished WRITING one. It is very very very different to anything I've done before.

    This could be good, or bad, depending on your point of view. If you even have a point of view. Oh, you know what I mean.

    Anyway. I am now drinking Tahuan Argentinian Malbec 2011 by way of celebrex. The Argies are now making some f*cking top wines - and not just Malbecs. It is the wineland of the future. Possibly more potential than Chile or even Oz.

    Congratulations; I look forward to reading it. Sadly I found the Tom Knox novels well-written but not quite my cup of tea (*) - it'll be interesting to see what this new one is like.

    (*) Having said that, I found 'Bible of the Dead' so engrossing that I stayed up until after midnight in my tent one night to complete it. Hence giving me an eyestrain-induced headache from reading to by torchlight, a sore neck, and making me extremely tired for the next day's hike.

    Reading the book in a tent, on a wild camp during a storm does add a certain atmosphere to the proceedings!
    Well, I'm flattered, kinda!

    This book is so different to Tom Knox we are thinking of putting Tom in cryogenic suspension and publishing it under a different name (probably not my real name, as I am now and presently known - in a very minor way - for naughty memoirs and polemical blogs).

    This new book is more in the vein of Gillian Flynn, of Gone Girl fame. A somewhat more *upmarket* literary thriller. It's been liberating and challenging at the same time, tackling a new genre.

    I've tried to write a book that is genuinely unsettling - like a good ghost story. It is so much harder than it looks. I read every famous ghost novel/story in English prior to the writing, to prepare myself, and only two or three were genuinely spooky: The Haunting, the Monkey's Paw and the Exorcist. All the rest were about as scary as the Muppets, or - more often - outright rubbish.
    I was wondering what to write for the tomorrow afternoon thread, I'll do an open thread entitled what should be SeanT's new publishing name.

    I'll go for Ivor Biggun
  • Plato said:

    Plato said:

    AveryLP said:

    Plato said:

    How many times has Mr Smithson tweeted this poll?

    Mike's telecommunication costs in Biarritz are single-handedly forcing France out of their recession.

    Hollande will be able to fire a second missile purely on the proceeds.

    It's just bizarre as is TSE pretending to back him by fibbing about tweeting it. I wouldn't be surprised if TSE says he votes LD next.
    I've posted 19 tweets on this topic, Mike has tweeted on this poll twelve times.
    Well when I checked your timeline you hadn't. And WTF is the obsession with a Survation poll anyways? Bizarre. Truly weird
    Some of us are seriously into kittens, others into trains. While others are into Survation polls!

    :)
  • Plato said:

    Plato said:

    AveryLP said:

    Plato said:

    How many times has Mr Smithson tweeted this poll?

    Mike's telecommunication costs in Biarritz are single-handedly forcing France out of their recession.

    Hollande will be able to fire a second missile purely on the proceeds.

    It's just bizarre as is TSE pretending to back him by fibbing about tweeting it. I wouldn't be surprised if TSE says he votes LD next.
    I've posted 19 tweets on this topic, Mike has tweeted on this poll twelve times.
    Well when I checked your timeline you hadn't. And WTF is the obsession with a Survation poll anyways? Bizarre. Truly weird
    Well the embedded tweets in the thread header was a clue that I had tweeted on this topic.

    Bizarre? You mean a website called political betting decides to do a thread on the poll findings on the week's major political event.

    That is definitely bizarre.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 12,745
    Evening all :)

    My first chance to comment on the events of Thursday and the political fallout from the events in Parliament.

    You know what, I'm not going to.

    I'm more interested in the views of the public and why many people are now thinking the way we do. I believe the events of Iraq and Afghanistan, along with the economic downturn, have created a new insularity. The world is now our street and our community and beyond that, we don't know and we don't want to know.

    The recession forced us all to look inwards and attitudes to subjects like welfare and immigration reflect that new insularity. Some simply have to work hard to survive while others are much less secure about their economic circumstances. Insecurity breeds insularity - we may well sympathise with civilians gassed in their homes but that doesn't mean we want to do anything about it.

    Instead, we want to turn away from the world, haul up the metaphorical drawbridge in the belief that we need to concentrate on solving our own problems. The world has caused us problems be it immigration or financial insecurity and we want as little to do with it as possible.

    We may not be able to say, as we once did about other places that Syria "is a far off country about which we know nothing". We do know what is happening but we don't care because our concerns are now parochial. We worry about our own communities and society and indeed many see those changing beyond recognition.
  • MrJonesMrJones Posts: 3,523

    Mr. Jones, this reminds me a psych paper I read a few years ago. It assessed how homophobes' attitudes changed regarding increased rights (adoption, marriage) for gay people. When gay people said they did not want such rights it actually increased the homophobes' support for gay marriage and the like.

    Blair's like that. Except instead of being gay he's just a massive liar, and instead of being homphobes we've simply realised it.

    To stir a little more. If the people who pay his wages come to no longer see him as an asset but an actual liability perhaps they'll come to the view that Britain's help in any future shenanigans in the middle-east would be best served by lancing the boil of the dodgy dossier via pouring great big buckets of sh*te over the gang of four.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. Eagles, he could go for Jude Black.
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724

    Plato said:

    Plato said:

    AveryLP said:

    Plato said:

    How many times has Mr Smithson tweeted this poll?

    Mike's telecommunication costs in Biarritz are single-handedly forcing France out of their recession.

    Hollande will be able to fire a second missile purely on the proceeds.

    It's just bizarre as is TSE pretending to back him by fibbing about tweeting it. I wouldn't be surprised if TSE says he votes LD next.
    I've posted 19 tweets on this topic, Mike has tweeted on this poll twelve times.
    Well when I checked your timeline you hadn't. And WTF is the obsession with a Survation poll anyways? Bizarre. Truly weird
    Well the embedded tweets in the thread header was a clue that I had tweeted on this topic.

    Bizarre? You mean a website called political betting decides to do a thread on the poll findings on the week's major political event.

    That is definitely bizarre.
    I must note how many times you tweet all other polls - I noticed Mr Smithson's despite hundreds of ones about XFactor
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,688
    Surbiton said:

    Your sketch underlines your problem neatly. You chaps have always underestimated him and every time he has slapped you hard.

    Fair enough. What I wrote has no basis in fact and is, I think, somewhat unfair. For what it's worth I would settle for EdM being president of the universe. The idea that EdB, or the eagle harpys might be part of that settlement puts me off forever though.




  • NextNext Posts: 826
    On topic: Cameron pays the price for Labour's lies.

    Again.
  • Plato said:

    Plato said:

    Plato said:

    AveryLP said:

    Plato said:

    How many times has Mr Smithson tweeted this poll?

    Mike's telecommunication costs in Biarritz are single-handedly forcing France out of their recession.

    Hollande will be able to fire a second missile purely on the proceeds.

    It's just bizarre as is TSE pretending to back him by fibbing about tweeting it. I wouldn't be surprised if TSE says he votes LD next.
    I've posted 19 tweets on this topic, Mike has tweeted on this poll twelve times.
    Well when I checked your timeline you hadn't. And WTF is the obsession with a Survation poll anyways? Bizarre. Truly weird
    Well the embedded tweets in the thread header was a clue that I had tweeted on this topic.

    Bizarre? You mean a website called political betting decides to do a thread on the poll findings on the week's major political event.

    That is definitely bizarre.
    I must note how many times you tweet all other polls - I noticed Mr Smithson's despite hundreds of ones about XFactor
    I generally tweet polls when I can, but I try do so when I'm guest editor of the site, it makes it easier to do thread headers like today
  • SeanT said:

    SeanT said:

    In more important news, I have finished a thriller. Finished WRITING one. It is very very very different to anything I've done before.

    This could be good, or bad, depending on your point of view. If you even have a point of view. Oh, you know what I mean.

    Anyway. I am now drinking Tahuan Argentinian Malbec 2011 by way of celebrex. The Argies are now making some f*cking top wines - and not just Malbecs. It is the wineland of the future. Possibly more potential than Chile or even Oz.

    Congratulations; I look forward to reading it. Sadly I found the Tom Knox novels well-written but not quite my cup of tea (*) - it'll be interesting to see what this new one is like.

    (*) Having said that, I found 'Bible of the Dead' so engrossing that I stayed up until after midnight in my tent one night to complete it. Hence giving me an eyestrain-induced headache from reading to by torchlight, a sore neck, and making me extremely tired for the next day's hike.

    Reading the book in a tent, on a wild camp during a storm does add a certain atmosphere to the proceedings!
    Well, I'm flattered, kinda!

    This book is so different to Tom Knox we are thinking of putting Tom in cryogenic suspension and publishing it under a different name (probably not my real name, as I am now and presently known - in a very minor way - for naughty memoirs and polemical blogs).

    This new book is more in the vein of Gillian Flynn, of Gone Girl fame. A somewhat more *upmarket* literary thriller. It's been liberating and challenging at the same time, tackling a new genre.

    I've tried to write a book that is genuinely unsettling - like a good ghost story. It is so much harder than it looks. I read every famous ghost novel/story in English prior to the writing, to prepare myself, and only two or three were genuinely spooky: The Haunting, the Monkey's Paw and the Exorcist. All the rest were about as scary as the Muppets, or - more often - outright rubbish.
    I was wondering what to write for the tomorrow afternoon thread, I'll do an open thread entitled what should be SeanT's new publishing name.

    I'll go for Ivor Biggun
    I would go for Ed Cameron. Or maybe Bashar al Thomas.
  • Mr. Eagles, he could go for Jude Black.

    He needs a name that simultaneously inspires respect, admiration, erudition and fear.

    I say he goes for Gaius Julius Caesar
  • corporealcorporeal Posts: 2,549
    SeanT said:

    Photos are indeed a rarity in novels (not that I'm much of a thriller reader). That said, Brandon Sanderson included drawings in The Way of Kings, and that's pretty unusual for fantasy.

    Writ smaller (and poorer :p) I'm writing a comedy at the moment. Shortish (35,000 words or so), but I know what you mean about it being difficult to assess a new genre.

    Writing-wise I'm reasonably happy, but marketing/promotion is proving trickier. Got something like 5-6 reviews for Journey to Altmortis in the pipeline, though no idea how fast/slow they'll be.

    I was inspired, photowise, by this book:

    http://www.amazon.co.uk/Miss-Peregrines-Home-Peculiar-Children/dp/1594746036

    It's a kind of time-travel, YA fantasy spookerthon. I found it unreadably boring, HOWEVER the author included a trove of genuine Victorian photos which were brilliantly unnerving. They were only tangentially related to the plot but they made the book intriguing even as the plot and everything else SUCKED.

    The book was a big hit, worldwide.

    With the digital/Kindle revolution making photos much cheaper to include and much more compelling to see, I believe readers will expect, if possible, more visual stimulation from their books, including novels.

    Recall that Dickens had illustrations. As did Lewis Carroll.
    The victorians had a talent for incredibly creepy photos, especially the dead children ones.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. T, some photos in black and white or sepia with low quality can look pretty evocative. Got to consider image degradation on e-readers or the like. That's one of the trickiest things, I've found, about covers. They need to look good as both a colour thumbnail, for when people browse, but also work at medium-size in black and white for the e-reader.

    Right now people seem to be reading on a fair range of devices. I suspect e-readers will remain for the voracious and those who go on holiday often, but tablets will also persist.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 113,972
    edited August 2013
    @Corporeal - Are you John Rentoul?

    He's done a piece and he concludes with

    Last week's defeat for Cameron, and the way he responded to it, may have been a victory in disguise.

    http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/david-camerons-unlikely-victory-from-defeat-8792877.html
  • Y0kelY0kel Posts: 2,307
    Syria: Mystic Turk

    Looks like PM Erdogan of Turkey was right. Last night I reported that he said that action would occur in the next two weeks. Yesterday, from a military perspective at least, this appeared plain nuts. Delays in launching the attacks has already given Assad's forces plenty of prep time (so much so the Pentagon is having to redo its lists) so more delay didn't make sense. Perhaps Erdogan had picked up the straws in the wind. I suspect he is miffed.

    Many speculations. Is Obama looking a get out of jail free card? He has habit in domestic politics of hitching people to the wagon to take the return fire when things get difficult so this may be the same move. He might be looking Congress to say no and get out of overt action full stop. This promptly cuts off the legs of John Kerry.

    If he's not playing a very cynical game domestically, then you have to assume that he thinks he has this nailed down. The Administration was due consultations with Congressional types this afternoon. Is it possible he had them in the immediate minutes before his statement? Perhaps the US intends a decent sized strike & needs the cover.

    Most significant part of the speech. He talked about private support around the World that he wanted to be public. If you are a Gulf State in particular you'll know what he is getting at. They back it, they host bases, but they have yet to come out and say, 'yes we support such action'. Other countries have been similar. Like Obama's own leading from behind approach, a lot of people want to hide behind someone else's skirt. If they all start doing it, its a bit awkward. US officials want publicly stated support. Maybe 4 or 5 have made it crystal clear they back US military action.

    On the ground its made a question for Assads forces. They scattered, officials have got out of the way,command buildings have been left. How does this play out for them knowing something might occur but they have to wait with already a marginally impacted military infrastructure until a strike is over? Will it negatively affect them or will they think that the US will bottle it and just roll on?

    Same for insurgents, if Assad's military capabilities have been a bit thrown out of sync, can they take advantage?

    Finally, what would you make of it in Tehran. Moscow & wherever Assad is sitting? Laughing possibly.
  • MrJonesMrJones Posts: 3,523
    edited August 2013
    surbiton said:

    Does anyone think Syrian propaganda re: Al Qaeda strength among rebels could yet derail Obama bombing ?

    Could do as that's been the default position for a long time. The people who want regime change needed some kind of atrocity to bounce people over the minor problem of our allies on the ground being cannibals.

    edit: Should add that if the above is correct other actors may want to push things the other way e.g. Turkey, Saudi etc.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,530
    SeanT said:



    Well, I'm flattered, kinda!

    This book is so different to Tom Knox we are thinking of putting Tom in cryogenic suspension and publishing it under a different name (probably not my real name, as I am now and presently known - in a very minor way - for naughty memoirs and polemical blogs).

    This new book is more in the vein of Gillian Flynn, of Gone Girl fame. A somewhat more *upmarket* literary thriller. It's been liberating and challenging at the same time, tackling a new genre.

    I've tried to write a book that is genuinely unsettling - like a good ghost story. It is so much harder than it looks. I read every famous ghost novel/story in English prior to the writing, to prepare myself, and only two or three were genuinely spooky: The Haunting of Hill House, the Monkey's Paw and the Exorcist. All the rest were about as scary as the Muppets, or - more often - outright rubbish.

    Oh God, please let it be better than 'Gone Girl', which is one of the worst books I have read this year. The ending was terrible; the author just ran out of steam. But worse: there was no closure for the reader. The criminal got away with crime, and justice was not seen to be done. An author can get away with that, but only with care and finesse. Flynn can certainly write well, but the plot let the book down.

    She actually admits in the author's notes that she ran out of steam, and that her editor had to help her with the ending.

    Horror is really hard to do, because it depends on the reader / viewer's perceptions. Mrs J loves horror films because they frighten her, whereas they don't do much for me. I can admire them artistically, enjoy the plot, but the horror aspect doesn't really seem to effect me.

    When I was a young teenager, 'The Rats' really freaked me out. I read it last year for the first time in two decades, and it had lost all its impact.

    Good luck with the story. Any chance of getting a copy signed for my collection? ;-)
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. Eagles, no Pyrrhic victory line?

    That said, Pyrrhus was famously loyal (on a personal level), so perhaps the comparison is not very apt.
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    sunday herald @newsundayherald
    Bad news for the Yes campaign as poll shows record low in support for independence
  • corporealcorporeal Posts: 2,549

    @Corporeal - Are you John Rentoul?

    He's done a piece and he concludes with

    Last week's defeat for Cameron, and the way he responded to it, may have been a victory in disguise.

    http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/david-camerons-unlikely-victory-from-defeat-8792877.html

    Not that I know of, although what's impressive is that that story's dated in the future, maybe there's time for it to happen tonight.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,774
    SeanT said:

    SeanT said:

    In more important news, I have finished a thriller. Finished WRITING one. It is very very very different to anything I've done before.

    This could be good, or bad, depending on your point of view. If you even have a point of view. Oh, you know what I mean.

    Anyway. I am now drinking Tahuan Argentinian Malbec 2011 by way of celebrex. The Argies are now making some f*cking top wines - and not just Malbecs. It is the wineland of the future. Possibly more potential than Chile or even Oz.

    Congratulations; I look forward to reading it. Sadly I found the Tom Knox novels well-written but not quite my cup of tea (*) - it'll be interesting to see what this new one is like.

    (*) Having said that, I found 'Bible of the Dead' so engrossing that I stayed up until after midnight in my tent one night to complete it. Hence giving me an eyestrain-induced headache from reading to by torchlight, a sore neck, and making me extremely tired for the next day's hike.

    Reading the book in a tent, on a wild camp during a storm does add a certain atmosphere to the proceedings!
    Well, I'm flattered, kinda!

    This book is so different to Tom Knox we are thinking of putting Tom in cryogenic suspension and publishing it under a different name (probably not my real name, as I am now and presently known - in a very minor way - for naughty memoirs and polemical blogs).

    This new book is more in the vein of Gillian Flynn, of Gone Girl fame. A somewhat more *upmarket* literary thriller. It's been liberating and challenging at the same time, tackling a new genre.

    I've tried to write a book that is genuinely unsettling - like a good ghost story. It is so much harder than it looks. I read every famous ghost novel/story in English prior to the writing, to prepare myself, and only two or three were genuinely spooky: The Haunting of Hill House, the Monkey's Paw and the Exorcist. All the rest were about as scary as the Muppets, or - more often - outright rubbish.
    Some of MR James is pretty creepy, like the Gold of Abbot Thomas, and the Stalls of Barchester Cathedral. He shared Stephen King's ability to make ordinary things seem frightening.
  • @Corporeal - Are you John Rentoul?

    He's done a piece and he concludes with

    Last week's defeat for Cameron, and the way he responded to it, may have been a victory in disguise.

    http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/david-camerons-unlikely-victory-from-defeat-8792877.html


    These PB Tories get everywhere don't they? As I said earlier Yvette is this weeks big winner, not Janus Miliband.


    "Paradoxically, Miliband finds himself in the even more awkward position of being aligned with public opinion. Most voters probably share his deep emotional aversion to Britain's being seen as an "aircraft carrier for the US". But that leaves him with the feeble argument in public that perhaps if we speak nicely to Vladimir Putin he'll have a quiet word with his client Assad. And in private, further damage has been done to his standing in his own Shadow Cabinet.

    They saw at close quarters how he vacillated last week, first appearing to support air strikes and then inventing spurious grounds for delay. They saw how he played politics with a question of national security, refusing to support the Government when it conceded all his points, proving himself, as Sir Malcolm Rifkind said, "incapable of taking yes for an answer".

    Last week's defeat for Cameron, and the way he responded to it, may have been a victory in disguise."

  • Relations between David Cameron and Ed Miliband appear to have broken down completely as Downing Street accused the Labour leader of "buggering around" and "playing politics" rather than responding "seriously" to the crisis in Syria.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2013/aug/31/syria-commons-vote-cameron-miliband?CMP=twt_fd
  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,279
    edited August 2013
    Twitter
    sunday herald ‏@newsundayherald 20m
    After the Falkirk scandal: Unite union plans to boycott Labour conference in support of suspended members

    sunday herald ‏@newsundayherald 19m
    Bad news for the Yes campaign as poll shows record low in support for independence
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,774
    SeanT said:

    In more important news, I have finished a thriller. Finished WRITING one. It is very very very different to anything I've done before.

    This could be good, or bad, depending on your point of view. If you even have a point of view. Oh, you know what I mean.

    Anyway. I am now drinking Tahuan Argentinian Malbec 2011 by way of celebrex. The Argies are now making some f*cking top wines - and not just Malbecs. It is the wineland of the future. Possibly more potential than Chile or even Oz.

    I thoroughly enjoyed the Genesis Secret and Bible of the Dead.

    I'd enjoy reading a discussion between you, and Joe Abercrombie, another author who likes to discuss with fans how he goes about writing a novel - and who shares your dark humour.
  • NextNext Posts: 826
    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    In more important news, I have finished a thriller. Finished WRITING one. It is very very very different to anything I've done before.

    This could be good, or bad, depending on your point of view. If you even have a point of view. Oh, you know what I mean.

    Anyway. I am now drinking Tahuan Argentinian Malbec 2011 by way of celebrex. The Argies are now making some f*cking top wines - and not just Malbecs. It is the wineland of the future. Possibly more potential than Chile or even Oz.

    I thoroughly enjoyed the Genesis Secret and Bible of the Dead.

    I'd enjoy reading a discussion between you, and Joe Abercrombie, another author who likes to discuss with fans how he goes about writing a novel - and who shares your dark humour.
    Very kind of you. My favourite Tom Knox books are Babylon Rite and Genesis Secret, FWIW (almost nothing)

    I LOVE talking about writing (anything to put off the dreadful event itself!). I am fascinated by the diurnal habits of other creative people (when do they write/paint/think, how much do they booze etc).

    One of my favourite anecdotes is that Balzac would stimulate himself, prior to writing, with a nice long wank, but without actual orgasm and emission (what Byron called a "dry bob") - leaving him on the edge of release yet yearning to create.

    Imagine if he'd had the internet.


    Imagine if he'd had the internet.

    He'd never have done any writing?
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    fitalass said:

    Twitter
    sunday herald ‏@newsundayherald 20m
    After the Falkirk scandal: Unite union plans to boycott Labour conference in support of suspended members

    sunday herald ‏@newsundayherald 19m
    Bad news for the Yes campaign as poll shows record low in support for independence

    Unite plans to boycott Conference ! Are you trying to imply this is bad for MIliband ?

    Have you got no political antenna at all ?
  • Syrian crisis: Ed Miliband faces growing criticism from Labour ranks

    Ed Miliband is facing mounting criticism from within his own party for his handling of the vote on Syria, amid fears that Labour’s approach has damaged Britain’s standing on the world stage

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ed-miliband/10278338/Syrian-crisis-Ed-Miliband-faces-growing-criticism-from-Labour-ranks.html
  • Got to say I envy you SeanT. To have the discipline, skill and talent to write fiction is something I wish I had. I hope you keep on pushing yourself. Make the most of it.
  • PBModeratorPBModerator Posts: 660
    edited August 2013
    SeanT said:

    Why is Disqus weirdly refusing my photos of my new location?

    I'll try again


    sean thomas knox @thomasknox

    The location for my new thriller. pic.twitter.com/Vpm6pHNeVX

    And this:

    sean thomas knox @thomasknox

    On a GOOD day it looks like THIS. pic.twitter.com/WmJD3PAwgc

    The island is on the left, where that lighthouse stands. Eilean Sionnach. Fox Island. Once owned by Gavin Maxwell.

    SeanT, there's a bug with vanilla that is causing tweets to embed, we've had to disable it to save costs/bandwith
  • surbiton said:

    This is a must read for the Redheads then???

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ed-miliband/10278338/Syrian-crisis-Ed-Miliband-faces-growing-criticism-from-Labour-ranks.html

    MPs have privately begun to voice concerns that their leader made a catastrophic mistake by engineering the defeat of the Government’s motion in the House of Commons on Thursday night.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    SeanT said:


    I've tried to write a book that is genuinely unsettling - like a good ghost story. It is so much harder than it looks. I read every famous ghost novel/story in English prior to the writing, to prepare myself, and only two or three were genuinely spooky: The Haunting of Hill House, the Monkey's Paw and the Exorcist. All the rest were about as scary as the Muppets, or - more often - outright rubbish.

    I always found 'Whistle & I'll come for you my lad' - and quite a lot by M R James - pretty scary. Would be interested in what you think.
  • NextNext Posts: 826

    surbiton said:

    This is a must read for the Redheads then???

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ed-miliband/10278338/Syrian-crisis-Ed-Miliband-faces-growing-criticism-from-Labour-ranks.html

    MPs have privately begun to voice concerns that their leader made a catastrophic mistake by engineering the defeat of the Government’s motion in the House of Commons on Thursday night.
    Is there an opposite for a Pyrrhic victory - where the cost of victory makes it not worth it?

    If not, I suggest from now on we call it a "Cameron Defeat". Where the loser wins.
  • NextNext Posts: 826
    edited August 2013
    SeanT said:

    SeanT said:

    Why is Disqus weirdly refusing my photos of my new location?

    I'll try again


    sean thomas knox @thomasknox

    The location for my new thriller. pic.twitter.com/Vpm6pHNeVX

    And this:

    sean thomas knox @thomasknox

    On a GOOD day it looks like THIS. pic.twitter.com/WmJD3PAwgc

    The island is on the left, where that lighthouse stands. Eilean Sionnach. Fox Island. Once owned by Gavin Maxwell.

    SeanT, there's a bug with vanilla that is causing tweets to embed, we've had to disable it to save costs/bandwith
    Ah, OK, I'll stop trying.

    Anyone interested can find photos of my location on my twitterstream:

    @thomasknox
    That doesn't work either - just gives a vanillaforums reference that fails.

    You need the link: https://twitter.com/thomasknox

    Edit: you edited - works now.
  • As a Spurs fan when we play the much loved Goners, we are all too often left trying to believe after another defeat that actually we are the winners by taking the high-ground of erm having had Ozzie, Rickie, Stevie, Glenn & Chris, Jug ears and Gazza and being erm quite good at the FA Cup other than for the last 20 years!

    I'm hoping not to have that tomorrow.

    Remember though Yvette's having a great Summer 2013!!!!
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Next said:

    surbiton said:

    This is a must read for the Redheads then???

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ed-miliband/10278338/Syrian-crisis-Ed-Miliband-faces-growing-criticism-from-Labour-ranks.html

    MPs have privately begun to voice concerns that their leader made a catastrophic mistake by engineering the defeat of the Government’s motion in the House of Commons on Thursday night.
    Is there an opposite for a Pyrrhic victory - where the cost of victory makes it not worth it?

    If not, I suggest from now on we call it a "Cameron Defeat". Where the loser wins.
    Surely that is a Pyrrhic victory for Ed Miliband though?

    (as an aside, I remember the wonderfully named King Zog I used to claim to be the most famous King of Albania since Pyrrhus)
  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,279
    Crivens, we are going to have grumpy Lab and SNP supporters this evening.

    Twitter
    Kenny Farquharson ‏@KennyFarq 18m
    Scotland on Sunday front page. pic.twitter.com/CQF7h5z7Jx

    Kenny Farquharson ‏@KennyFarq 32s
    New #indyref poll: Yes 29; No 59. YouGov, commissioned by DevoPlus. Full details and breakdown in tomorrow's Scotland on Sunday.
  • Yvette's doing better all the time!!!

    Amongst the thrashing around in this article, guess who also pops up...

    Miliband likes to posture as a prophet of a new, ethical politics, but he has never looked more grubby than he did on Thursday: conspiring to thwart Cameron in order to distance himself from the memory of Tony Blair and Iraq. It goes to show how quickly politicians’ skin hardens and how low their horizons can fall. I had Miliband down as one of those who, seeing the images of Ghouta, would set party politics aside. But his raging desire to dissociate himself from Blair and his own elder brother was stronger than his desire to associate himself with a robust international response to the use of chemical weapons. In his desperation to maximise his chances of becoming prime minister, he showed precisely why he is not fit to occupy that role.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/syria/10277616/A-nauseating-preening-and-grubby-carnival-of-inaction.html
This discussion has been closed.