Let's say Remain had won the referendum by the same margins the most bullish polls were showing in the last 48 hours, by 54% to 46%.
The pound would have spiked, and immigration would probably have reached record highs off the back of overvalued sterling and strong global growth in 2017. In the meantime, calls within the EU to build an EU army, strengthen the governance of the eurozone, calls for a 'United States of Europe' from some European politicians, and the threats to suspend voting rights of Poland and Hungary, would have received greater coverage in the UK press, as they'd have been of far greater interest to us.
In addition, aspects of Dave's deal might have been watered down, or found to be wanting, as they were challenged in the ECJ or punted into the long grass. The interpretation of the agreement that the UK wasn't committed to 'ever closer union' would have been both scrutinised, and tested.
So the polling for this very question, "In hindsight, do you think Britain was right or wrong to Remain in the EU?", could have been showing similar, or greater, deficits than it is now.
How seriously would Remainers have taken a call from Leavers for a second referendum off the back of that?
I don't have the heart to tell him Matthew Parris isn't PM. Can someone do it for me please?
Is there anyone doing a better job of sabotaging Brexit than TMay?
well she is a remainer after all. But I'm sure we can both agree Clegg, Blair and Adonis have done an even better job of ending our EU membership. You'd think nearly 18 months on lessons would have been learned. Either way I'm glad you're accepting a soft brexit, I'll take that too.
On topic this figure will be interesting once the Brexit deal is fleshed out, right now it is just noise.
Although with UKIP using thing kind of language/rhetoric who knows what's going on.
Farage is already positioning to make the same kind of switch that Marine Le Pen made in her rhetoric on the EU. Anti-EU politics will end up being akin to anti-Washington politics in the US, where secessionism is very much a fringe pursuit. I seriously expect some unlikely voices to end up saying that we'd be better off going all the way in than accepting "May's vassal state deal".
Just look under that tweet and some Kippers/Leavers think Farage is going to back Remain soon.
That's probably what it will take. If a big hitter like Farage or Boris say they were wrong to back Brexit then it really is game on. Perhaps Dave should have left Warsi and Wollaston as sleeper cells 'backing' leave
They don't even need to say they were wrong to back Brexit. They can say that Brexit was a vote to reject the Cameron, Clegg, Blair and Adonis approach of being mealy-mouthed about the EU and trying to have it both ways. Either we're in or we're out, but let's not have any half measures.
Why would they wish to do that?
Because support for Brexit is unsustainable and it's the best way of reframing the question to save face.
The polls suggest its rather sustainable otherwise remain would have a decent lead. We're heading towards injury time, remain have used all their subs and need to produce something they haven't shown in the previous 90 minutes.
The whistle for half-time was blown when sufficient progress was reached. We'll see how play takes shape in the second half once May's cabinet has agreed a position on the final state.
Now now, we both know we're way beyond half time. Your team gave yourselves a mountain to climb - certainly not the fault of leave that they had better arguments and better organisation, remain have had awful tactics both before and after this referendum.
You're right, he is another one. Everytime he tweets the remainers sigh. If they want to reverse the result they need to be on message, the federalist cries of Guy must be infuriating to the non extremist remainers.
Y'all might be getting a thread on electoral reform in the morning.
The government is facing fresh pressure to shrink parliament’s upper chamber after Labour’s leader in the Lords said the opposition was prepared to adopt a “two out, one in” policy and limit new peerages to 15-year terms.
Donald Trump’s deteriorating relationship with Britain is likely to kill off any lingering cabinet hopes of a swift post-Brexit trade deal with the United States, a former British ambassador to Washington has warned.
Sir Nigel Sheinwald said that a series of controversial interventions by the US president in British issues meant that the remote prospect of a quick transatlantic deal, heralded by pro-Brexit cabinet members, should now be “put out of our minds” for good.
His intervention comes as a new poll highlights the British public’s opposition to Trump in the wake of his decision to cancel a trip to the UK, with fewer than a fifth of voters (18%) believing he is a friend of Britain.
Almost three-quarters of voters (72%) also believe that the US president is a risk to international stability, according to a new Opinium poll for the Observer. A similar proportion (71%) believe he is untrustworthy. Two in five voters believe that Trump should not be visiting Britain at all.
Very disappointing poll number for Labour. How a party as clueless, heartless and incompetent as the Tories are on 40% beggars belief.
Because the alternative is clueless, heartless and incompetent Labour.
The LibDems really should be doing better but then again they're clueless, heartless and incompetent as well.
not sure that fits in with Murali's student politics. No one is covering themselves in glory leadership wise but even if May or Corbyn were excelling I feel views are more entrenched than ever before so I don't see an impressive new Tory or Labour leader changing the polls much.
It's interesting to compare with 5 years ago (Jan 2013 comes up on their website). Labour had almost the same vote share, at 41%, but the Tories were down to 31%.
Let's say Remain had won the referendum by the same margins the most bullish polls were showing in the last 48 hours, by 54% to 46%.
The pound would have spiked, and immigration would probably have reached record highs off the back of overvalued sterling and strong global growth in 2017. In the meantime, calls within the EU to build an EU army, strengthen the governance of the eurozone, calls for a 'United States of Europe' from some European politicians, and the threats to suspend voting rights of Poland and Hungary, would have received greater coverage in the UK press, as they'd have been of far greater interest to us.
In addition, aspects of Dave's deal might have been watered down, or found to be wanting, as they were challenged in the ECJ or punted into the long grass. The interpretation of the agreement that the UK wasn't committed to 'ever closer union' would have been both scrutinised, and tested.
So the polling for this very question, "In hindsight, do you think Britain was right or wrong to Remain in the EU?", could have been showing similar, or greater, deficits than it is now.
How seriously would Remainers have taken a call from Leavers for a second referendum off the back of that?
You're right, he is another one. Everytime he tweets the remainers sigh. If they want to reverse the result they need to be on message
You realise he is praising the UK PM for implementing EU policy, right?
I suppose it was too much to expect you to actually read a link...
Sorry Scott, in fairness its hard to keep up given your whole life appears to be spent reposting tweets on the internet I think I'm with the 99% of Brits who don't read what Guy has to say, which is a shame because I'm sure every now and again he gets something right. Either way I'm sure Terry May will be chuffed that such a distinguished figure has been praising her. Who next? Matthew Parris!?
And remember this is in a week with atrocious NHS headlines, with the public consistently rating the NHS as the most important issue (other than Brexit).
And remember this is in a week with atrocious NHS headlines, with the public consistently rating the NHS as the most important issue (other than Brexit).
Interesting thing about this new poll is that the three main parties are collectively down 6 percentage points compared to GE2017. Do we have the Green and UKIP figures?
Vince is not doing a stellar job. Although the problems in the Back Office (see the current Private Eye) do not help.
Perhaps if the Lib Dems backed Brexit their numbers might improve Jo Swinson cant get back to work soon enough!
What’s the matter with her? Someone certainly needs to do a bit of ‘scruff of the neck seizing’ and shaking.
I think she knows the job of the Lib Dems will be a lot easier in the post Brexit post Corbyn landscape. At 37 she can take her time - you don't want to be on the political scrapheap by your early 40s.
Donald Trump’s deteriorating relationship with Britain is likely to kill off any lingering cabinet hopes of a swift post-Brexit trade deal with the United States, a former British ambassador to Washington has warned.
Sir Nigel Sheinwald said that a series of controversial interventions by the US president in British issues meant that the remote prospect of a quick transatlantic deal, heralded by pro-Brexit cabinet members, should now be “put out of our minds” for good.
His intervention comes as a new poll highlights the British public’s opposition to Trump in the wake of his decision to cancel a trip to the UK, with fewer than a fifth of voters (18%) believing he is a friend of Britain.
Almost three-quarters of voters (72%) also believe that the US president is a risk to international stability, according to a new Opinium poll for the Observer. A similar proportion (71%) believe he is untrustworthy. Two in five voters believe that Trump should not be visiting Britain at all.
The latest buzz for a Presidential visit to the UK is "Rump the Trump"! Somehow, the thought of a million or so bare backsides could embarrass the Donald...
And remember this is in a week with atrocious NHS headlines, with the public consistently rating the NHS as the most important issue (other than Brexit).
Corbyn trumps NHS winter crises and loses out.
Indeed.
Notable thing this week I think was the Williamson plan to raise Council Tax 20% for Band D and 40% for Band E.
Up to now Corbyn has tried to pretend tax rises would only be on the rich. This proposal blows that out of the water.
I was surprised how relaxed some of the Lab reaction on here was to this proposal. I think most ordinary people of all political persuasions (and the occupiers of both Band D and Band E homes are very much ordinary people) would be astonished at the magnitude of this proposal.
No question that the best line of attack for Con will be tax - and what Corbyn will mean for tax on ordinary people - and this proposal is an open goal for them.
The government are damned if they do and damned if they don't on Brexit. Most people don't want to revisit it through a new referendum, but they don't seem to think Brexit is really worth the cost, the time and distraction either. They just want to get it out the way. It is only beginning to dawn on people that Brexit is a state that you are in, not a transition where you do a few deals and it's sorted. It will go on forever. Meanwhile the degraded NHS is getting cut through. None of this is good news for the government.
Some vox pops with a mostly Leaver crowd. The government will get the blame from Leavers groups 2 (Frustrated and Anxious) and 3 (Regretful), as well as Remainers of course: https://www.demos.co.uk/project/citizens-voices/
The reluctance to correlate enthusiasm for the EU with the only party unequivocally being in favour still being at 6% is really getting quite funny. When are the remainers going to accept that a lot of people may not like this government for a lot of reasons but they do give a damn about the EU.
All that has happened is they have been replaced by with a charge under a different name.
The cost will still be borne by the consumer; it'll just be spread out evenly across all sales. The consumer is thereby deprived of the choice of avoiding the charge by not paying by credit card. The clear winner is the credit card companies who will see a significant uptick in business now that an impediment to the use of their services has been removed by those thoughtful chaps in Brussels. So: bad for consumers, good for banks, neutral for the businesses who were imposing the irritating credit card surcharges.
Too many tweets make a twat, and too much retweeting ...
Donald Trump’s deteriorating relationship with Britain is likely to kill off any lingering cabinet hopes of a swift post-Brexit trade deal with the United States, a former British ambassador to Washington has warned.
Sir Nigel Sheinwald said that a series of controversial interventions by the US president in British issues meant that the remote prospect of a quick transatlantic deal, heralded by pro-Brexit cabinet members, should now be “put out of our minds” for good.
His intervention comes as a new poll highlights the British public’s opposition to Trump in the wake of his decision to cancel a trip to the UK, with fewer than a fifth of voters (18%) believing he is a friend of Britain.
Almost three-quarters of voters (72%) also believe that the US president is a risk to international stability, according to a new Opinium poll for the Observer. A similar proportion (71%) believe he is untrustworthy. Two in five voters believe that Trump should not be visiting Britain at all.
The latest buzz for a Presidential visit to the UK is "Rump the Trump"! Somehow, the thought of a million or so bare backsides could embarrass the Donald...
Donald Trump’s deteriorating relationship with Britain is likely to kill off any lingering cabinet hopes of a swift post-Brexit trade deal with the United States, a former British ambassador to Washington has warned.
Sir Nigel Sheinwald said that a series of controversial interventions by the US president in British issues meant that the remote prospect of a quick transatlantic deal, heralded by pro-Brexit cabinet members, should now be “put out of our minds” for good.
His intervention comes as a new poll highlights the British public’s opposition to Trump in the wake of his decision to cancel a trip to the UK, with fewer than a fifth of voters (18%) believing he is a friend of Britain.
Almost three-quarters of voters (72%) also believe that the US president is a risk to international stability, according to a new Opinium poll for the Observer. A similar proportion (71%) believe he is untrustworthy. Two in five voters believe that Trump should not be visiting Britain at all.
That was dead as soon as Trump beat Clinton. Trump doesn’t like trade deals.
Up to a point Lord Copper. Theresa May cannot sack anyone without ending her own career, so the net extent of the reshuffle was the square root of bugger all. Every minister anyone has ever heard of is still in place. Of course voters don't care -- nothing happened. Was it just reporters or were some Tories getting in a tizz? That's another question. Politically though, it cannot have helped the PM to have had her weakness exposed, not just that she is impotent but that, as with the election, she seems to commit publicly to things without thinking them through.
“I appreciate and understand that nowhere will be more impacted by the United Kingdom’s exit from the European Union than Ireland. I grew up only a few miles from the Fermanagh-Monaghan border. I saw for myself growing up how even during our darkest days we shared close economic, cultural and social ties across the border.
“Those ties have strengthened since the Troubles ended, to the extent that in recent times we have enjoyed extraordinarily, unimaginably positive relations between our two states. I don’t want to lose any of that.”
Up to a point Lord Copper. Theresa May cannot sack anyone without ending her own career, so the net extent of the reshuffle was the square root of bugger all. Every minister anyone has ever heard of is still in place. Of course voters don't care -- nothing happened. Was it just reporters or were some Tories getting in a tizz? That's another question.
She sacked Justine Greening and as far as I know she is still PM
“I appreciate and understand that nowhere will be more impacted by the United Kingdom’s exit from the European Union than Ireland. I grew up only a few miles from the Fermanagh-Monaghan border. I saw for myself growing up how even during our darkest days we shared close economic, cultural and social ties across the border.
“Those ties have strengthened since the Troubles ended, to the extent that in recent times we have enjoyed extraordinarily, unimaginably positive relations between our two states. I don’t want to lose any of that.”
And she went on to say the UK was much the bigger partner for trade and supported TM 100%. It raises the question if she was in the HOC she could be in the cabinet, much like Ruth Davidson
Up to a point Lord Copper. Theresa May cannot sack anyone without ending her own career, so the net extent of the reshuffle was the square root of bugger all. Every minister anyone has ever heard of is still in place. Of course voters don't care -- nothing happened. Was it just reporters or were some Tories getting in a tizz? That's another question.
She sacked Justine Greening and as far as I know she is still PM
The three people who know who Justine Greening is would point out the Prime Minister offered her DWP which is not clearly a demotion. And according to the last thread it is Nick Timothy who is now Prime Minister.
Goodness. Here we are at the beginning of 2018, and despite all the government woes, Corbyn Labour can only achieve a dead tie in the Observer Opinium poll. Even Kinnock and Miliband were ahead in double figures. All it will take is a new younger Tory PM in the last year of this parliament, a better Tory campaign, a more attractive Tory manifesto, and only the slightest swing to the government will mean thatLabour will lose a fourth election in a row for only the second time in its history.
The Brexit hysteria will reach a crescendo as we approach the exit date and the ultra-remainers see their dream finally dying.
The vast majority of the UK will just go about their lives post-exit and the fringe elements will be left ranting on the sidelines like swivel-eyed loons.
Though David Gauke might be acting ultra vires regarding this.
Which is presumably why it is framed as 'fights to' and 'to try to halt' rather than promising it will work. The MoJ even says he will only move forward if there is a reasonable prospect of success. So can it be acting beyond his powers if all he is doing is taking advice on whether proper legal procedures were followed, and launching legal action if it wasn't?
Up to a point Lord Copper. Theresa May cannot sack anyone without ending her own career, so the net extent of the reshuffle was the square root of bugger all. Every minister anyone has ever heard of is still in place. Of course voters don't care -- nothing happened. Was it just reporters or were some Tories getting in a tizz? That's another question.
She sacked Justine Greening and as far as I know she is still PM
The three people who know who Justine Greening is would point out the Prime Minister offered her DWP which is not clearly a demotion. And according to the last thread it is Nick Timothy who is now Prime Minister.
The Brexit hysteria will reach a crescendo as we approach the exit date and the ultra-remainers see their dream finally dying.
The vast majority of the UK will just go about their lives post-exit and the fringe elements will be left ranting on the sidelines like swivel-eyed loons.
But there wont be freedom of movement in the compromise settlement. We wont be in the Single Market. We wont be subject to EU laws. The wishes of the extremists might be ignored, but the wishes of the People must never be ignored.
Goodness. Here we are at the beginning of 2018, and despite all the government woes, Corbyn Labour can only achieve a dead tie in the Observer Opinium poll. Even Kinnock and Miliband were ahead in double figures. All it will take is a new younger Tory PM in the last year of this parliament, a better Tory campaign, a more attractive Tory manifesto, and only the slightest swing to the government will mean thatLabour will lose a fourth election in a row for only the second time in its history.
Or you could simplify your argument even more and say all it will take is a few more people to vote Conservative and they are home and dry. Yes a fresh faced new Tory leader might have a honeymoon. But Theresa May's didn't survive a campaign. It will be hard to come up with a worse manifesto than 2017's, but will it really make that much difference? And as to the Tory campaign, they always have big cheque books. But if Labour has ten times more troops on the ground again that might prove to be tough to beat.
Oh and Labour and Conservatives were on level pegging on the 10th of October 1992. It didn't stop them getting a landslide 5 years later.
Though David Gauke might be acting ultra vires regarding this.
Which is presumably why it is framed as 'fights to' and 'to try to halt' rather than promising it will work. The MoJ even says he will only move forward if there is a reasonable prospect of success. So can it be acting beyond his powers if all he is doing is taking advice on whether proper legal procedures were followed, and launching legal action if it wasn't?
A legal expert thinks The Lord Chancellor has no standing in this case, which is why he thinks nothing like this has ever happened before.
Not entirely convinced by the ‘Corbyn frightens people’ narrative. I think it’s fairly obvious the opposition to Corbyn is ideological. People are not voting on competence, they voting on values. If immigration is a high priority, you don’t like diversity, multiculturalism etc it doesn’t matter how ‘competent’ Labour are, ultimately you’re likely to vote Conservative. If immigration isn’t a high priority, you like/are at ease with diversity, multiculturalism and have a range of socially liberal positions you’re likely to vote Labour.
The country is split down the middle, the GE told us that, the polls after it have told us that, this poll isn’t a surprise. Even under a leader right wingers didn’t dislike as much, the polling would be much the same. Labour are not going to transform themselves into a Blue Labour style, ‘tough on immigration’, small c social conservative party. Not least because many of the social liberal voters who now are a significant part of Labour’s coalition would walk away from them and whether they’d gain enough WWC social conservatives to balance it out remains to be seen.
Both parties have reached their ceiling. I don’t see Labour converting old pensioners to their cause. But then so I don’t see the Tories converting middle aged and younger voters to their cause either. Which I guess is the significance of Project Brexit not gaining any more Brexiteers.
The Brexit hysteria will reach a crescendo as we approach the exit date and the ultra-remainers see their dream finally dying.
The vast majority of the UK will just go about their lives post-exit and the fringe elements will be left ranting on the sidelines like swivel-eyed loons.
But there wont be freedom of movement in the compromise settlement. We wont be in the Single Market. We wont be subject to EU laws. The wishes of the extremists might be ignored, but the wishes of the People must never be ignored.
We haven't seen the Deal yet, it may include all those things. May is the Lord Halifax of the Brexit Darkest Hour.
Up to a point Lord Copper. Theresa May cannot sack anyone without ending her own career, so the net extent of the reshuffle was the square root of bugger all. Every minister anyone has ever heard of is still in place. Of course voters don't care -- nothing happened. Was it just reporters or were some Tories getting in a tizz? That's another question.
She sacked Justine Greening and as far as I know she is still PM
The three people who know who Justine Greening is would point out the Prime Minister offered her DWP which is not clearly a demotion. And according to the last thread it is Nick Timothy who is now Prime Minister.
Not entirely convinced by the ‘Corbyn frightens people’ narrative. I think it’s fairly obvious the opposition to Corbyn is ideological. People are not voting on competence, they voting on values. If immigration is a high priority, you don’t like diversity, multiculturalism etc it doesn’t matter how ‘competent’ Labour are, ultimately you’re likely to vote Conservative. If immigration isn’t a high priority, you like/are at ease with diversity, multiculturalism and have a range of socially liberal positions you’re likely to vote Labour.
The country is split down the middle, the GE told us that, the polls after it have told us that, this poll isn’t a surprise. Even under a leader right wingers didn’t dislike as much, the polling would be much the same. Labour are not going to transform themselves into a Blue Labour style, ‘tough on immigration’, small c social conservative party. Not least because many of the social liberal voters who now are a significant part of Labour’s coalition would walk away from them and whether they’d gain enough WWC social conservatives to balance it out remains to be seen.
Both parties have reached their ceiling. I don’t see Labour converting old pensioners to their cause. But then so I don’t see the Tories converting middle aged and younger voters in their cause either. Which I guess is the significance of Project Brexit not gaining any more Brexiteers.
People dont like Corbyn because he is on the extreme hard left. He belongs in the SWP rather than Labour. Just because one doesnt like Corbyn doesnt mean one is "blue" in any shape or form. Many people would like to see a John Smith or Harold Wilson type Labour leader, neither hard left or Blairite.
Up to a point Lord Copper. Theresa May cannot sack anyone without ending her own career, so the net extent of the reshuffle was the square root of bugger all. Every minister anyone has ever heard of is still in place. Of course voters don't care -- nothing happened. Was it just reporters or were some Tories getting in a tizz? That's another question.
She sacked Justine Greening and as far as I know she is still PM
The three people who know who Justine Greening is would point out the Prime Minister offered her DWP which is not clearly a demotion. And according to the last thread it is Nick Timothy who is now Prime Minister.
You said TM cannot sack anyone and she did
Before the non-reshuffle I predicted on this very here pb that nothing would happen. The PM cannot act against any plausible challenger because even though Boris/DD/whoever can't be sure they will win, the one thing that is clear is that Theresa May will lose. The PM and Cabinet are trapped in an unstable equilibrium.
There’s going to be a lot of jockeying for good personal headlines from Tory Ministers to get into pole position to replace TM.
Damian Hinds to announce new grammar schools should have discipline and lessons should start at 7:30 am to get lazy. Teenagers out of bed? Jeremy Hunt to announce English pronounciatipn tests for foreign nurses and doctors? Gavin Williamson to declare army hazings are vital to British military tradition? Boris Johnson to organise a military show of strength in Gibraltar/Falklands to commemorate something or other...
The reluctance to correlate enthusiasm for the EU with the only party unequivocally being in favour still being at 6% is really getting quite funny. When are the remainers going to accept that a lot of people may not like this government for a lot of reasons but they do give a damn about the EU.
I know quite a few people who like the EU but aren’t voting LD, they are voting Labour. The reality is many Remainers are voting for the party which they believe is best placed to limit the Tories’ ability to impose their agenda. They see that party as being Labour, not the LDs.
Up to a point Lord Copper. Theresa May cannot sack anyone without ending her own career, so the net extent of the reshuffle was the square root of bugger all. Every minister anyone has ever heard of is still in place. Of course voters don't care -- nothing happened. Was it just reporters or were some Tories getting in a tizz? That's another question.
She sacked Justine Greening and as far as I know she is still PM
The three people who know who Justine Greening is would point out the Prime Minister offered her DWP which is not clearly a demotion. And according to the last thread it is Nick Timothy who is now Prime Minister.
Goodness. Here we are at the beginning of 2018, and despite all the government woes, Corbyn Labour can only achieve a dead tie in the Observer Opinium poll. Even Kinnock and Miliband were ahead in double figures. All it will take is a new younger Tory PM in the last year of this parliament, a better Tory campaign, a more attractive Tory manifesto, and only the slightest swing to the government will mean thatLabour will lose a fourth election in a row for only the second time in its history.
Corbyn will be, what, 73 by the next election, so it might not be just the PM who is younger. Or even the PM given some rivals are older than Theresa May.
It's interesting to compare with 5 years ago (Jan 2013 comes up on their website). Labour had almost the same vote share, at 41%, but the Tories were down to 31%.
Labour have hugely motivated and solidified the centre-left/Left wing vote behind them.
Corbyn and McDonnell will interpret that as strong support for their core socialist programme.
However, given that block involves many centre-left, moderate voters, who own property, they may be surprised at how it fritters away in office, if they try.
Up to a point Lord Copper. Theresa May cannot sack anyone without ending her own career, so the net extent of the reshuffle was the square root of bugger all. Every minister anyone has ever heard of is still in place. Of course voters don't care -- nothing happened. Was it just reporters or were some Tories getting in a tizz? That's another question.
She sacked Justine Greening and as far as I know she is still PM
The three people who know who Justine Greening is would point out the Prime Minister offered her DWP which is not clearly a demotion. And according to the last thread it is Nick Timothy who is now Prime Minister.
You said TM cannot sack anyone and she did
Greening resigned.
She had no choice
She could have been DWP Secretary so she did have a choice. The example you want is Priti Patel.
Up to a point Lord Copper. Theresa May cannot sack anyone without ending her own career, so the net extent of the reshuffle was the square root of bugger all. Every minister anyone has ever heard of is still in place. Of course voters don't care -- nothing happened. Was it just reporters or were some Tories getting in a tizz? That's another question.
She sacked Justine Greening and as far as I know she is still PM
The three people who know who Justine Greening is would point out the Prime Minister offered her DWP which is not clearly a demotion. And according to the last thread it is Nick Timothy who is now Prime Minister.
You said TM cannot sack anyone and she did
Greening resigned.
She had no choice
Greening did not resign. She did not have a cabinet post to resign from. She had ceased to be education secretary, the moment May told her that the post was no longer hers and had not been appointed to another post. Therefore she did not resign. She declined to accept another job in the cabinet -which is quite different.
Am I the only one who feels a bit of non-political unease over the way this is being handled? If his sentence was too low, the prosecution could have appealed it. If he's provably committed other crimes that would have made a difference, they should have prosecuted originally. But this rush to second-guess the Parole Board and dig up new prosecutions at the 11th hour seems more a response to public outrage than a judicious approach.
The reluctance to correlate enthusiasm for the EU with the only party unequivocally being in favour still being at 6% is really getting quite funny. When are the remainers going to accept that a lot of people may not like this government for a lot of reasons but they do give a damn about the EU.
I know quite a few people who like the EU but aren’t voting LD, they are voting Labour. The reality is many Remainers are voting for the party which they believe is best placed to limit the Tories’ ability to impose their agenda. They see that party as being Labour, not the LDs.
Exactly so. At the start of the 2017 campaign I intended to vote Lib Dem. But as it began to look like Labour might get somewhere I switched as I judged that was the vote most likely to derail Brexit.
The Brexit hysteria will reach a crescendo as we approach the exit date and the ultra-remainers see their dream finally dying.
The vast majority of the UK will just go about their lives post-exit and the fringe elements will be left ranting on the sidelines like swivel-eyed loons.
Oh dear - lie down brother.
Yes, we’ll continue poorer, less influential but we’ll have blue passports - yay!!!!
Though David Gauke might be acting ultra vires regarding this.
Which is presumably why it is framed as 'fights to' and 'to try to halt' rather than promising it will work. The MoJ even says he will only move forward if there is a reasonable prospect of success. So can it be acting beyond his powers if all he is doing is taking advice on whether proper legal procedures were followed, and launching legal action if it wasn't?
A legal expert thinks The Lord Chancellor has no standing in this case, which is why he thinks nothing like this has ever happened before.
Legal experts again - Gauke is doing the right thing.
Pity all these so called legal experts who tied in first time buyers to outrageous leasehold tenures. Now that is a scandal and the legal profession should be ashamed. Hope they are taken to the cleaners over it
Not entirely convinced by the ‘Corbyn frightens people’ narrative. I think it’s fairly obvious the opposition to Corbyn is ideological. People are not voting on competence, they voting on values. If immigration is a high priority, you don’t like diversity, multiculturalism etc it doesn’t matter how ‘competent’ Labour are, ultimately you’re likely to vote Conservative. If immigration isn’t a high priority, you like/are at ease with diversity, multiculturalism and have a range of socially liberal positions you’re likely to vote Labour.
The country is split down the middle, the GE told us that, the polls after it have told us that, this poll isn’t a surprise. Even under a leader right wingers didn’t dislike as much, the polling would be much the same. Labour are not going to transform themselves into a Blue Labour style, ‘tough on immigration’, small c social conservative party. Not least because many of the social liberal voters who now are a significant part of Labour’s coalition would walk away from them and whether they’d gain enough WWC social conservatives to balance it out remains to be seen.
Both parties have reached their ceiling. I don’t see Labour converting old pensioners to their cause. But then so I don’t see the Tories converting middle aged and younger voters in their cause either. Which I guess is the significance of Project Brexit not gaining any more Brexiteers.
People dont like Corbyn because he is on the extreme hard left. He belongs in the SWP rather than Labour. Just because one doesnt like Corbyn doesnt mean one is "blue" in any shape or form. Many people would like to see a John Smith or Harold Wilson type Labour leader, neither hard left or Blairite.
Ed Miliband wasn’t ‘extreme left’ and he got an even worse result at a GE than Corbyn did. I used to believe the biggest issue with Corbyn what you say, but the fact that he did better than Miliband changed my mind. The biggest issue for Labour is that there are only so many people who share their vision/values. But then that’s the same issue the Tories face as well. I’m not convinced those who believe immigration is the main issue this country faces are going to consider a Wilson or Smith style Labour Party.
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The pound would have spiked, and immigration would probably have reached record highs off the back of overvalued sterling and strong global growth in 2017. In the meantime, calls within the EU to build an EU army, strengthen the governance of the eurozone, calls for a 'United States of Europe' from some European politicians, and the threats to suspend voting rights of Poland and Hungary, would have received greater coverage in the UK press, as they'd have been of far greater interest to us.
In addition, aspects of Dave's deal might have been watered down, or found to be wanting, as they were challenged in the ECJ or punted into the long grass. The interpretation of the agreement that the UK wasn't committed to 'ever closer union' would have been both scrutinised, and tested.
So the polling for this very question, "In hindsight, do you think Britain was right or wrong to Remain in the EU?", could have been showing similar, or greater, deficits than it is now.
How seriously would Remainers have taken a call from Leavers for a second referendum off the back of that?
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/dec/17/boris-johnson-breaks-ranks-with-brexit-vassal-state-warning
Con 40 (+1) Lab 40 (-1) LD 6 (-1)
Changes since Dec 2017
Vince Cable, the Lib Dem leader, has a lower net approval rating (-19%) than either Jeremy Corbyn (-10) or Theresa May (-17%).
May’s lead over Corbyn on who would make the best prime minister has fallen very slightly, from six points to five points.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jan/13/trump-tension-risk-quick-us-uk-trade-deal
Jeremy Corbyn is keeping the Tories so high in the polls.
The government is facing fresh pressure to shrink parliament’s upper chamber after Labour’s leader in the Lords said the opposition was prepared to adopt a “two out, one in” policy and limit new peerages to 15-year terms.
https://www.ft.com/content/f813edac-f7a5-11e7-8715-e94187b3017e
The LibDems really should be doing better but then again they're clueless, heartless and incompetent as well.
Jo Swinson cant get back to work soon enough!
I suppose it was too much to expect you to actually read a link...
Sir Nigel Sheinwald said that a series of controversial interventions by the US president in British issues meant that the remote prospect of a quick transatlantic deal, heralded by pro-Brexit cabinet members, should now be “put out of our minds” for good.
His intervention comes as a new poll highlights the British public’s opposition to Trump in the wake of his decision to cancel a trip to the UK, with fewer than a fifth of voters (18%) believing he is a friend of Britain.
Almost three-quarters of voters (72%) also believe that the US president is a risk to international stability, according to a new Opinium poll for the Observer. A similar proportion (71%) believe he is untrustworthy. Two in five voters believe that Trump should not be visiting Britain at all.
I think I'm with the 99% of Brits who don't read what Guy has to say, which is a shame because I'm sure every now and again he gets something right.
Either way I'm sure Terry May will be chuffed that such a distinguished figure has been praising her. Who next? Matthew Parris!?
https://twitter.com/MattSingh_/status/952284140489134080
Notable thing this week I think was the Williamson plan to raise Council Tax 20% for Band D and 40% for Band E.
Up to now Corbyn has tried to pretend tax rises would only be on the rich. This proposal blows that out of the water.
I was surprised how relaxed some of the Lab reaction on here was to this proposal. I think most ordinary people of all political persuasions (and the occupiers of both Band D and Band E homes are very much ordinary people) would be astonished at the magnitude of this proposal.
No question that the best line of attack for Con will be tax - and what Corbyn will mean for tax on ordinary people - and this proposal is an open goal for them.
Some vox pops with a mostly Leaver crowd. The government will get the blame from Leavers groups 2 (Frustrated and Anxious) and 3 (Regretful), as well as Remainers of course: https://www.demos.co.uk/project/citizens-voices/
It’s that simple.
https://twitter.com/MsHelicat/status/952290161827729408
I could foresee a poll on the NHS requiring it to be subject to cross party agreement and that labour weaponising it is doing them no favours.
But ultimately labour need to really ask themselves is a Corbyn - McDonnell hard left solution the answer or would they max out at about 30%
Too many tweets make a twat, and too much retweeting ...
Trump doesn’t like trade deals.
“I appreciate and understand that nowhere will be more impacted by the United Kingdom’s exit from the European Union than Ireland. I grew up only a few miles from the Fermanagh-Monaghan border. I saw for myself growing up how even during our darkest days we shared close economic, cultural and social ties across the border.
“Those ties have strengthened since the Troubles ended, to the extent that in recent times we have enjoyed extraordinarily, unimaginably positive relations between our two states. I don’t want to lose any of that.”
https://twitter.com/ShippersUnbound/status/952294520447815681
The vast majority of the UK will just go about their lives post-exit and the fringe elements will be left ranting on the sidelines like swivel-eyed loons.
Racism by Kippers, say it ain't so.
https://twitter.com/MsHelicat/status/952299286326226944
Oh and Labour and Conservatives were on level pegging on the 10th of October 1992. It didn't stop them getting a landslide 5 years later.
The country is split down the middle, the GE told us that, the polls after it have told us that, this poll isn’t a surprise. Even under a leader right wingers didn’t dislike as much, the polling would be much the same. Labour are not going to transform themselves into a Blue Labour style, ‘tough on immigration’, small c social conservative party. Not least because many of the social liberal voters who now are a significant part of Labour’s coalition would walk away from them and whether they’d gain enough WWC social conservatives to balance it out remains to be seen.
Both parties have reached their ceiling. I don’t see Labour converting old pensioners to their cause. But then so I don’t see the Tories converting middle aged and younger voters to their cause either. Which I guess is the significance of Project Brexit not gaining any more Brexiteers.
https://tinyurl.com/y8k7hlge
https://twitter.com/sirpauljenkins/status/952290174611968002
Damian Hinds to announce new grammar schools should have discipline and lessons should start at 7:30 am to get lazy. Teenagers out of bed? Jeremy Hunt to announce English pronounciatipn tests for foreign nurses and doctors? Gavin Williamson to declare army hazings are vital to British military tradition? Boris Johnson to organise a military show of strength in Gibraltar/Falklands to commemorate something or other...
Perhaps she's thinking about the last time a Royal married a divorced American.
Corbyn and McDonnell will interpret that as strong support for their core socialist programme.
However, given that block involves many centre-left, moderate voters, who own property, they may be surprised at how it fritters away in office, if they try.
The example you want is Priti Patel.
Yes, we’ll continue poorer, less influential but we’ll have blue passports - yay!!!!
Pity all these so called legal experts who tied in first time buyers to outrageous leasehold tenures. Now that is a scandal and the legal profession should be ashamed. Hope they are taken to the cleaners over it