Your man is taking a beating right now and it is not a good look to be against your Country.
But on an issue that is important to you, have you seen the Government announcement that it is extending a trial scheme of 23,000 to approx 300,000 whereby those with dementia, disabled and with health issues will be paid directly for them to choose and pay direct for carers of their choice, be it family or other relatives and that payments will be authorized through their doctor to ensure no abuse of the scheme. Also gym membership, holidays and general personal counselling will be available
It is being announced as handing control directly to the patient over their own care.
Interesting at the very least
Interesting detail on the Disabled payments. Thanks for the info,
TBF Mrs BJ uses her money for the Social Care Providers of her choice already and her Carer (me) also gets Carers Allowance direct from the state already.
Not sure how the proposed scheme will impact.
The Holiday thing looks interesting as a £400 short break cost us nearly £3000 last year. End up paying for two sets of Social Carers. specialist transport, accommodation etc Its an absolute ball ache.
BJo I admire your tenacity on here as a Corbyn supporter .I hope you stay as it is good to here a differing view , from the dominant anti Corbyn rhetoric.
"Windrush Generation were invited as settlers and as British subjects. Minors also had the right to stay. We call on the government to stop all deportations, change the burden of proof and establish an amnesty for anyone who was a minor."
Has anyone got a link to the full facts on this story? Unbias and objective?
I could be wrong but I struggle to believe HMG and the Home Office would look to deport British subjects who’ve been living here for decades who immigrated legally under old immigration laws.
It's hard to find details on specific cases, but I wonder if some of these people have left the country for an extended period of time and then returned. Even so, it's still pretty poor from the Home Office and another example of them going after easy targets.
Many thanks. I agree there are some shocking stories there.
What makes it worse is that May has refused to meet the High Commissioners for Caribbean countries about the matter. She obviously doesn’t care about the suffering she’s caused.
Hasn't a meeting been scheduled at the Commonwealth head of government meeting?
Don’t know what’s happening to the 'blockquote' mechanism
The answer is no; asked for but refused. By May.
Ah, thanks for correcting me. Then, she is a silly bint who needs to wake up to a completely avoidable disaster. The Vogons were iirc an allegory of British bureaucracy. Shame Douglas Adams was so spot on.
Clear statement "This was not the policy's intention, we apologise, and we will sort it out."
End of.
People have spent considerable amounts. Poor people. JAM people. Surely, surely NHI records should be available.
I read about one person getting deported that had over 30 years of NI contributions. The civil servants involved in this case should be sent to collect trollies at Tesco or something.
Your man is taking a beating right now and it is not a good look to be against your Country.
But on an issue that is important to you, have you seen the Government announcement that it is extending a trial scheme of 23,000 to approx 300,000 whereby those with dementia, disabled and with health issues will be paid directly for them to choose and pay direct for carers of their choice, be it family or other relatives and that payments will be authorized through their doctor to ensure no abuse of the scheme. Also gym membership, holidays and general personal counselling will be available
It is being announced as handing control directly to the patient over their own care.
Interesting at the very least
Interesting detail on the Disabled payments. Thanks for the info,
TBF Mrs BJ uses her money for the Social Care Providers of her choice already and her Carer (me) also gets Carers Allowance direct from the state already.
Not sure how the proposed scheme will impact.
The Holiday thing looks interesting as a £400 short break cost us nearly £3000 last year. End up paying for two sets of Social Carers. specialist transport, accommodation etc Its an absolute ball ache.
It does seem to be a genuine attempt to give control to the patients who know their need better than most.
I thought that was the job of ATOS and Maximus. And to be clear, Yvette Cooper started this off and it was weaponised by the Tories. I hope people who need social care are not expected to fill in 40 page forms to have their support needs turned down.
The question we should be asking is not whether he is out to make a case against the government, but whether that is his idea, another Tory wannabe's, or the government's.
If I were TMay I wouldn't mind using him as a sounding board.
Jacob Rees-Mogg has really upset some of the Mogglodytes over his disavowal of the Rivers Of Blood speech. I'm trying to work out whether that means that he's very serious about becoming next Tory leader or whether that means he's completely blown it.
He's moving to the centre ground.
The Enoch was right brigade in the Tory party is insignificant.
Plus JRM is very proud of his father.
I would hope that Mogg can occupy the "non-whites can be British" position without that being seen as a centrist position.
This whole Windrush car crash is indicitive of a Gov't system that has absolubtely no wiggle room or exception making for any sort of "individual case" whatsoever.
Decent Labour MPs seem to accept the horrific danger for European security, during a time of renewed Russian aggression, of Corbyn being Prime Minister. Let us hope they have the courage to do what is needed to stop it. The British centre-left can always be rebuilt. The future of global democracy may not be.
Of course right wing Corbyn hating PB Tories cheer lead right wing Corbyn Haters in the PLP.
Woodcock has voted for every war since he became an MP
How much safer have those wars like Libya made us?
How much have they cost?
Are we safer or less safe?
Have innocents been saved at the cost of other innocents lives.
Do Billy Big Bollocks feel better as they cheerlead war after war after war.
I can tell why you are desperate to change the subjects to other wars because you know how utterly indefensible Corbyn is over this one. He is willing to let thousands and thousand of innocent people die from the spread of chemical weapons after the convention breaks down as long as he can attack the Tories. His sympathies with the brutal Russian regime are as shameful as those with Hamas and the IRA. His friends in Hezbollah slaughtered democracy protesters on the streets of Tehran and yet he happily acted as a paid mouthpiece for the Ayatollahs on Press TV afterwards.
So you can bugger off with your accusations of Toryism. I have voted for two Labour leaders and I will go back to supporting the next one that consistently stands up for democracy and human rights.
Corrected for you
Of course right wing Corbyn hating PB Tory Lite Posters cheer lead right wing Tory Lite Corbyn Haters in the PLP.
Woodcock has voted for every war since he became an MP
How much safer have those wars like Libya made us?
How much have they cost?
Are we safer or less safe?
Have innocents been saved at the cost of other innocents lives.
Do Billy Big Bollocks feel better as they cheer lead war after war after war.
I think that the Falklands War, the First Gulf War, the US intervention in Bosnia, NATO's intervention in Kosovo, the campaign against terrorists in Northern Ireland, the intervention in Sierra Leone were all just wars which had positive outcomes. The interventions in Afghanistan and Libya were just wars which had more mixed outcomes.
More Mixed LOL
I tried to give your question a serious answer, but was clearly wasting my time.
I am pleased Corbyn is holding the government to account, which is his job, and not rolling over to have his tummy tickled like John Woodcock and Mike Gapes.
This whole Windrush car crash is indicitive of a Gov't system that has absolubtely no wiggle room or exception making for any sort of "individual case" whatsoever.
The bureaucracy is eating itself, and a whole bunch of well paid people in the chain appear to have no actual authority at all. Either empower them or get rid of them.
A Russian investigative journalist who wrote about the deaths of mercenaries in Syria has died in hospital after falling from his fifth-floor flat.
Maxim Borodin was found badly injured by neighbours in Yekaterinburg and taken to hospital, where he later died. Local officials said no suicide note was found but the incident was unlikely to be of a criminal nature.
However, a friend revealed Borodin had said his flat had been surrounded by security men two days earlier.
I am pleased Corbyn is holding the government to account, which is his job, and not rolling over to have his tummy tickled like John Woodcock and Mike Gapes.
Me too.I'm as certain to vote Labour as when I first did so in 1974 to keep out of Vietnam.Harold Wilson kept his word and saved many young Brits lives.Vietnam's people are still suffering,however, from the long-term effects of Agent Orange.Funnily enough,I have Vietnamese family now.More tonnage of US bombs were dropped on Vietnam than the total bombardment of WW2 and what happened? The USA lost.
Decent Labour MPs seem to accept the horrific danger for European security, during a time of renewed Russian aggression, of Corbyn being Prime Minister. Let us hope they have the courage to do what is needed to stop it. The British centre-left can always be rebuilt. The future of global democracy may not be.
Of course right wing Corbyn hating PB Tories cheer lead right wing Corbyn Haters in the PLP.
Woodcock has voted for every war since he became an MP
How much safer have those wars like Libya made us?
How much have they cost?
Are we safer or less safe?
Have innocents been saved at the cost of other innocents lives.
Do Billy Big Bollocks feel better as they cheerlead war after war after war.
So you can bugger off with your accusations of Toryism. I have voted for two Labour leaders and I will go back to supporting the next one that consistently stands up for democracy and human rights.
Corrected for you
Of course right wing Corbyn hating PB Tory Lite Posters cheer lead right wing Tory Lite Corbyn Haters in the PLP.
Woodcock has voted for every war since he became an MP
How much safer have those wars like Libya made us?
How much have they cost?
Are we safer or less safe?
Have innocents been saved at the cost of other innocents lives.
Do Billy Big Bollocks feel better as they cheer lead war after war after war.
I think.
More Mixed LOL
I tried to give your question a serious answer, but was clearly wasting my time.
There is no black and white answer when it comes to deciding whether or not to resort to military action; you have to take each one on its merits.
In the late 1990s the international outrage was due to the West *not* intervening, due to the massacres in Bosnia and Rwanda. Those non-interventions were partly due to the US experience in Somalia. Today, the controversy is all about the West choosing to intervene due to the experiences of Afghanistan, Iraq and Libya.
Our Governments are damned if they do, damned if they don't. Non-Western Governments are all too often excused.
Your man is taking a beating right now and it is not a good look to be against your Country.
But on an issue that is important to you, have you seen the Government announcement that it is extending a trial scheme of 23,000 to approx 300,000 whereby those with dementia, disabled and with health issues will be paid directly for them to choose and pay direct for carers of their choice, be it family or other relatives and that payments will be authorized through their doctor to ensure no abuse of the scheme. Also gym membership, holidays and general personal counselling will be available
It is being announced as handing control directly to the patient over their own care.
Interesting at the very least
Interesting detail on the Disabled payments. Thanks for the info,
TBF Mrs BJ uses her money for the Social Care Providers of her choice already and her Carer (me) also gets Carers Allowance direct from the state already.
Not sure how the proposed scheme will impact.
The Holiday thing looks interesting as a £400 short break cost us nearly £3000 last year. End up paying for two sets of Social Carers. specialist transport, accommodation etc Its an absolute ball ache.
It does seem to be a genuine attempt to give control to the patients who know their need better than most.
I thought that was the job of ATOS and Maximus. And to be clear, Yvette Cooper started this off and it was weaponised by the Tories. I hope people who need social care are not expected to fill in 40 page forms to have their support needs turned down.
Their support needs come under direct control of their doctor
The question we should be asking is not whether he is out to make a case against the government, but whether that is his idea, another Tory wannabe's, or the government's.
If I were TMay I wouldn't mind using him as a sounding board.
Jacob Rees-Mogg has really upset some of the Mogglodytes over his disavowal of the Rivers Of Blood speech. I'm trying to work out whether that means that he's very serious about becoming next Tory leader or whether that means he's completely blown it.
He's moving to the centre ground.
The Enoch was right brigade in the Tory party is insignificant.
Plus JRM is very proud of his father.
I would hope that Mogg can occupy the "non-whites can be British" position without that being seen as a centrist position.
I seriously doubt he has ever said or thought anything else - if he had said it, someone would have dug up the quote and told us about it.
I am pleased Corbyn is holding the government to account, which is his job, and not rolling over to have his tummy tickled like John Woodcock and Mike Gapes.
Today will be provide another stomach-turning example of Corbyn being utterly against violence, except where it is used to bring about aims he agrees with.
It's like watching an evangelising vegan occassionally tuck into a veal escalope with gusto....
And because it was Mrs May who set up the system, she'll go on pushing others out to defend it rather than rethinking it - because rethinking it would have to mean starting from the basic principles and assumptions the policy's based on.
I'm hoping for a u-turn, and think there's a reasonable likelihood. If she's got JRM + the Bremain rebels against her, I can't see how TM can resist.
Given the clusterfuck and Mrs May's tin ear over the Windrush generation can any Tories really tell me they want the Maybot to contest the next general election? #NothingHasChanged
And because it was Mrs May who set up the system, she'll go on pushing others out to defend it rather than rethinking it - because rethinking it would have to mean starting from the basic principles and assumptions the policy's based on.
I'm hoping for a u-turn, and think there's a reasonable likelihood. If she's got JRM + the Bremain rebels against her, I can't see how TM can resist.
I am against this as well - it needs sorting urgently
"Windrush Generation were invited as settlers and as British subjects. Minors also had the right to stay. We call on the government to stop all deportations, change the burden of proof and establish an amnesty for anyone who was a minor."
Has anyone got a link to the full facts on this story? Unbias and objective?
I could be wrong but I struggle to believe HMG and the Home Office would look to deport British subjects who’ve been living here for decades who immigrated legally under old immigration laws.
It's hard to find details on specific cases, but I wonder if some of these people have left the country for an extended period of time and then returned. Even so, it's still pretty poor from the Home Office and another example of them going after easy targets.
Many thanks. I agree there are some shocking stories there.
What makes it worse is that May has refused to meet the High Commissioners for Caribbean countries about the matter. She obviously doesn’t care about the suffering she’s caused.
Hasn't a meeting been scheduled at the Commonwealth head of government meeting?
I think she probably does care.
I think it's more a sign of May's discomfort in meeting anyone anywhere when she knows she may be given a rough ride, or be required to be empathetic.
She knows she'd struggle to avoid doing anything other than give stock answers, as she can't really think on her feet.
She'd prefer to sit in a quiet room for a few weeks until she's analysed it, figured it out, and prepared a new position.
And because it was Mrs May who set up the system, she'll go on pushing others out to defend it rather than rethinking it - because rethinking it would have to mean starting from the basic principles and assumptions the policy's based on.
I'm hoping for a u-turn, and think there's a reasonable likelihood. If she's got JRM + the Bremain rebels against her, I can't see how TM can resist.
It needs more than a U-turn. People have lost jobs and benefits as a result of this policy; they have been denied NHS treatment; they have been detained and some have been deported. Compensation and damages also have to be paid out. The government has got to put right the hardships it created.
A Russian investigative journalist who wrote about the deaths of mercenaries in Syria has died in hospital after falling from his fifth-floor flat.
Maxim Borodin was found badly injured by neighbours in Yekaterinburg and taken to hospital, where he later died. Local officials said no suicide note was found but the incident was unlikely to be of a criminal nature.
However, a friend revealed Borodin had said his flat had been surrounded by security men two days earlier.
Hopefully the debate today deters May from using missiles without approval again. She's foreseen the potential uproar and sought to minimize fallout but contributions will still be analyzed closely today...
The Gov't needs to be able to authorise airstrikes and so forth quickly, and so for reasons of expediancy thus it can bypass parliament. There really should be a vote after the fact though.
Although I think the strikes are a nonsense I think the Gov't "order" in this case is correct. So I'm completely at odds with @JackW positions on the matter.
I do not demur from your position that a government must be able to exercise the royal prerogative for reasons of operational or covert expediency. However that was clearly not the case with these airstrikes that the government were briefing on the weekend before last.
There was ample opportunity for the recall of Parliament but the Prime Minister recoiled from her duty to do so.
Decent Labour MPs seem to accept the horrific danger for European security, during a time of renewed Russian aggression, of Corbyn being Prime Minister. Let us hope they have the courage to do what is needed to stop it. The British centre-left can always be rebuilt. The future of global democracy may not be.
Of course right wing Corbyn hating PB Tories cheer lead right wing Corbyn Haters in the PLP.
Woodcock has voted for every war since he became an MP
How much safer have those wars like Libya made us?
How much have they cost?
Are we safer or less safe?
Have innocents been saved at the cost of other innocents lives.
Do Billy Big Bollocks feel better as they cheerlead war after war after war.
So you can bugger off with your accusations of Toryism. I have voted for two Labour leaders and I will go back to supporting the next one that consistently stands up for democracy and human rights.
Corrected for you
Of course right wing Corbyn hating PB Tory Lite Posters cheer lead right wing Tory Lite Corbyn Haters in the PLP.
Woodcock has voted for every war since he became an MP
How much safer have those wars like Libya made us?
How much have they cost?
Are we safer or less safe?
Have innocents been saved at the cost of other innocents lives.
Do Billy Big Bollocks feel better as they cheer lead war after war after war.
I think.
More Mixed LOL
I tried to give your question a serious answer, but was clearly wasting my time.
There is no black and white answer when it comes to deciding whether or not to resort to military action; you have to take each one on its merits.
In the late 1990s the international outrage was due to the West *not* intervening, due to the massacres in Bosnia and Rwanda. Those non-interventions were partly due to the US experience in Somalia. Today, the controversy is all about the West choosing to intervene due to the experiences of Afghanistan, Iraq and Libya.
Our Governments are damned if they do, damned if they don't. Non-Western Governments are all too often excused.
Indeed so. We didn’t intervene in Bosnia and the result was the Srebrenica massacre, we did intervene in Libya to prevent the same thing happening in Benghazi. Both decisions can’t be wrong.
Decent Labour MPs seem to accept the horrific danger for European security, during a time of renewed Russian aggression, of Corbyn being Prime Minister. Let us hope they have the courage to do what is needed to stop it. The British centre-left can always be rebuilt. The future of global democracy may not be.
Of course right wing Corbyn hating PB Tories cheer lead right wing Corbyn Haters in the PLP.
Woodcock has voted for every war since he became an MP
How much safer have those wars like Libya made us?
How much have they cost?
Are we safer or less safe?
Have innocents been saved at the cost of other innocents lives.
Do Billy Big Bollocks feel better as they cheerlead war after war after war.
So you can bugger off with your accusations of Toryism. I have voted for two Labour leaders and I will go back to supporting the next one that consistently stands up for democracy and human rights.
Corrected for you
Of course right wing Corbyn hating PB Tory Lite Posters cheer lead right wing Tory Lite Corbyn Haters in the PLP.
Woodcock has voted for every war since he became an MP
How much safer have those wars like Libya made us?
How much have they cost?
Are we safer or less safe?
Have innocents been saved at the cost of other innocents lives.
Do Billy Big Bollocks feel better as they cheer lead war after war after war.
I think.
More Mixed LOL
I tried to give your question a serious answer, but was clearly wasting my time.
There is no black and white answer when it comes to deciding whether or not to resort to military action; you have to take each one on its merits.
In the late 1990s the international outrage was due to the West *not* intervening, due to the massacres in Bosnia and Rwanda. Those non-interventions were partly due to the US experience in Somalia. Today, the controversy is all about the West choosing to intervene due to the experiences of Afghanistan, Iraq and Libya.
Our Governments are damned if they do, damned if they don't. Non-Western Governments are all too often excused.
I don't agree with you on much, but that seems entirely fair.
A Russian investigative journalist who wrote about the deaths of mercenaries in Syria has died in hospital after falling from his fifth-floor flat.
Maxim Borodin was found badly injured by neighbours in Yekaterinburg and taken to hospital, where he later died. Local officials said no suicide note was found but the incident was unlikely to be of a criminal nature.
However, a friend revealed Borodin had said his flat had been surrounded by security men two days earlier.
"He'd had a lot to drink, and just happened to walk out onto his balcony and tumble over. Reports of men on the staircases and on his balcony are a pure fabrication. Clearly, he was so intoxicated, he didn't even have the presence of mind to write a note to his loved ones. He will be sorely missed."
A Russian investigative journalist who wrote about the deaths of mercenaries in Syria has died in hospital after falling from his fifth-floor flat.
Maxim Borodin was found badly injured by neighbours in Yekaterinburg and taken to hospital, where he later died. Local officials said no suicide note was found but the incident was unlikely to be of a criminal nature.
However, a friend revealed Borodin had said his flat had been surrounded by security men two days earlier.
Russian dissidents do seem to have a rather bad habit of falling off balconies, don’t you think?
You should make no assumptions without a clear inquiry and vote from the UN Security Council. Anything else would be a betrayal of the democracy and an insult to the UN and the world order.
This is a problem for the government, the optics look horrible, and you can blame George Osborne when they u-turn.
The extent to which savage government cuts have deprived disabled people of legal aid in disputes over their benefit payments is revealed today by new official figures that show a 99% decline since 2011.
The total number of disabled people granted legal aid in welfare cases has plummeted from 29,801 in 2011-12 to just 308 in 2016-17, cutting some of the most vulnerable people in society adrift without expert advice in often highly complex and distressing cases.
MPs and charities representing disabled people reacted furiously to the figures, released in a parliamentary answer, saying they bore out their worst fears at the time ministers announced the cuts several years ago.
And because it was Mrs May who set up the system, she'll go on pushing others out to defend it rather than rethinking it - because rethinking it would have to mean starting from the basic principles and assumptions the policy's based on.
I'm hoping for a u-turn, and think there's a reasonable likelihood. If she's got JRM + the Bremain rebels against her, I can't see how TM can resist.
I am against this as well - it needs sorting urgently
A Russian investigative journalist who wrote about the deaths of mercenaries in Syria has died in hospital after falling from his fifth-floor flat.
Maxim Borodin was found badly injured by neighbours in Yekaterinburg and taken to hospital, where he later died. Local officials said no suicide note was found but the incident was unlikely to be of a criminal nature.
However, a friend revealed Borodin had said his flat had been surrounded by security men two days earlier.
Your man is taking a beating right now and it is not a good look to be against your Country.
But on an issue that is important to you, have you seen the Government announcement that it is extending a trial scheme of 23,000 to approx 300,000 whereby those with dementia, disabled and with health issues will be paid directly for them to choose and pay direct for carers of their choice, be it family or other relatives and that payments will be authorized through their doctor to ensure no abuse of the scheme. Also gym membership, holidays and general personal counselling will be available
It is being announced as handing control directly to the patient over their own care.
Interesting at the very least
Interesting detail on the Disabled payments. Thanks for the info,
TBF Mrs BJ uses her money for the Social Care Providers of her choice already and her Carer (me) also gets Carers Allowance direct from the state already.
Not sure how the proposed scheme will impact.
The Holiday thing looks interesting as a £400 short break cost us nearly £3000 last year. End up paying for two sets of Social Carers. specialist transport, accommodation etc Its an absolute ball ache.
It does seem to be a genuine attempt to give control to the patients who know their need better than most.
I thought that was the job of ATOS and Maximus. And to be clear, Yvette Cooper started this off and it was weaponised by the Tories. I hope people who need social care are not expected to fill in 40 page forms to have their support needs turned down.
Their support needs come under direct control of their doctor
Given the clusterfuck and Mrs May's tin ear over the Windrush generation can any Tories really tell me they want the Maybot to contest the next general election? #NothingHasChanged
Doesn't paint Amber Rudd in a great light either. Step forward Jeremy Hunt...
Given the clusterfuck and Mrs May's tin ear over the Windrush generation can any Tories really tell me they want the Maybot to contest the next general election? #NothingHasChanged
I am sure she is crying her eyes out after reading the heart rending stories of people being locked up in detention centres, losing jobs and hopes, and being denied cancer treatment.
Given the clusterfuck and Mrs May's tin ear over the Windrush generation can any Tories really tell me they want the Maybot to contest the next general election? #NothingHasChanged
Doesn't paint Amber Rudd in a great light either. Step forward Jeremy Hunt...
My parents' generation are quite upset now.
They are wondering if they are going to get deported.
And because it was Mrs May who set up the system, she'll go on pushing others out to defend it rather than rethinking it - because rethinking it would have to mean starting from the basic principles and assumptions the policy's based on.
I'm hoping for a u-turn, and think there's a reasonable likelihood. If she's got JRM + the Bremain rebels against her, I can't see how TM can resist.
It needs more than a U-turn. People have lost jobs and benefits as a result of this policy; they have been denied NHS treatment; they have been detained and some have been deported. Compensation and damages also have to be paid out. The government has got to put right the hardships it created.
Given the clusterfuck and Mrs May's tin ear over the Windrush generation can any Tories really tell me they want the Maybot to contest the next general election? #NothingHasChanged
Doesn't paint Amber Rudd in a great light either. Step forward Jeremy Hunt...
Don't think so. After Theresa it's time to move on to a fresh face.
And because it was Mrs May who set up the system, she'll go on pushing others out to defend it rather than rethinking it - because rethinking it would have to mean starting from the basic principles and assumptions the policy's based on.
I'm hoping for a u-turn, and think there's a reasonable likelihood. If she's got JRM + the Bremain rebels against her, I can't see how TM can resist.
I am against this as well - it needs sorting urgently
Nice to agree with you for a change.
There are some things we all need to agree on and this is one of them
Given the clusterfuck and Mrs May's tin ear over the Windrush generation can any Tories really tell me they want the Maybot to contest the next general election? #NothingHasChanged
I am sure she is crying her eyes out after reading the heart rending stories of people being locked up in detention centres, losing jobs and hopes, and being denied cancer treatment.
She’s a Tory. They are ordinary working people. Go figure!
And because it was Mrs May who set up the system, she'll go on pushing others out to defend it rather than rethinking it - because rethinking it would have to mean starting from the basic principles and assumptions the policy's based on.
I'm hoping for a u-turn, and think there's a reasonable likelihood. If she's got JRM + the Bremain rebels against her, I can't see how TM can resist.
It needs more than a U-turn. People have lost jobs and benefits as a result of this policy; they have been denied NHS treatment; they have been detained and some have been deported. Compensation and damages also have to be paid out. The government has got to put right the hardships it created.
Fair points - although I imagine compensation could take years and will be fiercely contested by the govt.
A Russian investigative journalist who wrote about the deaths of mercenaries in Syria has died in hospital after falling from his fifth-floor flat.
Maxim Borodin was found badly injured by neighbours in Yekaterinburg and taken to hospital, where he later died. Local officials said no suicide note was found but the incident was unlikely to be of a criminal nature.
However, a friend revealed Borodin had said his flat had been surrounded by security men two days earlier.
This can't be palmed off as an administrative bungle. This is a policy that has been rigorously followed through on. In the post-Brexit climate, this policy is the new normal.
Given the clusterfuck and Mrs May's tin ear over the Windrush generation can any Tories really tell me they want the Maybot to contest the next general election? #NothingHasChanged
Doesn't paint Amber Rudd in a great light either. Step forward Jeremy Hunt...
Don't think so. After Theresa it's time to move on to a fresh face.
For 90+% of the country, Jeremy Hunt is a fresh face.
Given the clusterfuck and Mrs May's tin ear over the Windrush generation can any Tories really tell me they want the Maybot to contest the next general election? #NothingHasChanged
Doesn't paint Amber Rudd in a great light either. Step forward Jeremy Hunt...
My parents' generation are quite upset now.
They are wondering if they are going to get deported.
I'd better ask my mother in law to cook and freeze some food for us in case she's put on a plane back to India.
This can't be palmed off as an administrative bungle. This is a policy that has been rigorously followed through on. In the post-Brexit climate, this policy is the new normal.
It is not and has never been government policy for those with indefinite leave to remain to be deported.
As successive governments have moved the obligation onto the citizen to prove their status, this has only sought to highlight those groups of people who - despite having ILR - are unable to prove it.
Quite where you think the malice lies here, the truth is that once identified firm action needs to be taken. As ever, the government is slow to realise, slow to act, and slow to grasp the extent of the problem. Plus ca change.
Given the clusterfuck and Mrs May's tin ear over the Windrush generation can any Tories really tell me they want the Maybot to contest the next general election? #NothingHasChanged
Doesn't paint Amber Rudd in a great light either. Step forward Jeremy Hunt...
My parents' generation are quite upset now.
They are wondering if they are going to get deported.
I'd better ask my mother in law to cook and freeze some food for us in case she's put on a plane back to India.
Given the clusterfuck and Mrs May's tin ear over the Windrush generation can any Tories really tell me they want the Maybot to contest the next general election? #NothingHasChanged
Doesn't paint Amber Rudd in a great light either. Step forward Jeremy Hunt...
My parents' generation are quite upset now.
They are wondering if they are going to get deported.
I'd better ask my mother in law to cook and freeze some food for us in case she's put on a plane back to India.
Seriously, what ‘evidence’ did the Ugandan Asians have to have?
This can't be palmed off as an administrative bungle. This is a policy that has been rigorously followed through on. In the post-Brexit climate, this policy is the new normal.
It is not and has never been government policy for those with indefinite leave to remain to be deported.
As successive governments have moved the obligation onto the citizen to prove their status, this has only sought to highlight those groups of people who - despite having ILR - are unable to prove it.
Quite where you think the malice lies here, the truth is that once identified firm action needs to be taken. As ever, the government is slow to realise, slow to act, and slow to grasp the extent of the problem. Plus ca change.
The question we should be asking is not whether he is out to make a case against the government, but whether that is his idea, another Tory wannabe's, or the government's.
If I were TMay I wouldn't mind using him as a sounding board.
Jacob Rees-Mogg has really upset some of the Mogglodytes over his disavowal of the Rivers Of Blood speech. I'm trying to work out whether that means that he's very serious about becoming next Tory leader or whether that means he's completely blown it.
I think that this has the potential to cause a great deal of trouble for the Govt; Mrs M is ‘lucky’ that many minds will be on Syria.
The point I think that Mogg is making is that the treatment of the Windrush generation is ‘not British’. And that pushes a lot of buttons.
Enoch Powell made a similar comment about the Ugandan Asians - essentially that we had made a commitment to let them in and Britain should honour its commitments. There are plenty of decent right-wingers who do not think that Britain should develop a reputation for weaseling out of its responsibilities. The Government's Windrush position is completely untenable from any political viewpoint and I can't see it lasting the week.
In completely unexpected news, it appears that some of Guido’s elves have been looking through the social media accounts of Corbynista candidates.
First up, the delightful Elizabeth Hayden, nominated for the Momentum National Co-ordinating Group, which votes tonight. Endorsed By Rebecca Long-Bailey and John Trickett.
The question we should be asking is not whether he is out to make a case against the government, but whether that is his idea, another Tory wannabe's, or the government's.
If I were TMay I wouldn't mind using him as a sounding board.
Jacob Rees-Mogg has really upset some of the Mogglodytes over his disavowal of the Rivers Of Blood speech. I'm trying to work out whether that means that he's very serious about becoming next Tory leader or whether that means he's completely blown it.
I think that this has the potential to cause a great deal of trouble for the Govt; Mrs M is ‘lucky’ that many minds will be on Syria.
The point I think that Mogg is making is that the treatment of the Windrush generation is ‘not British’. And that pushes a lot of buttons.
Enoch Powell made a similar comment about the Ugandan Asians - essentially that we had made a commitment to let them in and Britain should honour its commitments. There are plenty of decent right-wingers who do not think that Britain should develop a reputation for weaseling out of its responsibilities. The Government's Windrush position is completely untenable from any political viewpoint and I can't see it lasting the week.
I can't see it lasting the day. Another tin-eared performance from Theresa May's advisors.
This can't be palmed off as an administrative bungle. This is a policy that has been rigorously followed through on. In the post-Brexit climate, this policy is the new normal.
It is not and has never been government policy for those with indefinite leave to remain to be deported.
As successive governments have moved the obligation onto the citizen to prove their status, this has only sought to highlight those groups of people who - despite having ILR - are unable to prove it.
Quite where you think the malice lies here, the truth is that once identified firm action needs to be taken. As ever, the government is slow to realise, slow to act, and slow to grasp the extent of the problem. Plus ca change.
The only part of that article I disagree with is the idea this policy was dreamed up in 2010. Immigration checks at work, for example, started in 2004.
This can't be palmed off as an administrative bungle. This is a policy that has been rigorously followed through on. In the post-Brexit climate, this policy is the new normal.
It is a bit amusing that the Daily Mail and the Sun are now so opposed to it. TM must feel a bit like they are moving the goalposts on her.
This can't be palmed off as an administrative bungle. This is a policy that has been rigorously followed through on. In the post-Brexit climate, this policy is the new normal.
It is not and has never been government policy for those with indefinite leave to remain to be deported.
As successive governments have moved the obligation onto the citizen to prove their status, this has only sought to highlight those groups of people who - despite having ILR - are unable to prove it.
Quite where you think the malice lies here, the truth is that once identified firm action needs to be taken. As ever, the government is slow to realise, slow to act, and slow to grasp the extent of the problem. Plus ca change.
Stephen Bush is [unusually] overstating it: this is a one-off, but very real, problem with an older generation, given that more recent (and future) immigrants and their children will all be documented. In principle there is no problem with a so-called "hostile environment" to deter illegal immigrants.
That said the Government's approach to the Windrush children has been overly bureaucratic and tone-deaf and needs to be sorted quickly. As @NickPalmer says below, it surely will be.
Jacob Rees-Mogg, the rightwing Conservative backbencher, told LBC during his new phone-in programme this morning that the treatment of the “Windrush generation” by the Home Office (see 9.43am) was a “deep disgrace”. These are from LBC’s Theo Usherwood.
Stand by your beds in the Home Office on Windrush generation. Rees-Mogg: "These people are as British as you and I are. Home Office is coming out with bureaucratic guff. Deep disgrace. "You do wonder about Home Office sometimes... not the most efficient Government department." April 16, 2018
Amber Rudd takes questions in the Commons at 2.30pm. Judging by this, and other tweets, the Government has a limited amount of time to fix the problem. https://t.co/BSoKaF1aCe April 16, 2018
The question we should be asking is not whether he is out to make a case against the government, but whether that is his idea, another Tory wannabe's, or the government's.
If I were TMay I wouldn't mind using him as a sounding board.
Jacob Rees-Mogg has really upset some of the Mogglodytes over his disavowal of the Rivers Of Blood speech. I'm trying to work out whether that means that he's very serious about becoming next Tory leader or whether that means he's completely blown it.
I think that this has the potential to cause a great deal of trouble for the Govt; Mrs M is ‘lucky’ that many minds will be on Syria.
The point I think that Mogg is making is that the treatment of the Windrush generation is ‘not British’. And that pushes a lot of buttons.
Enoch Powell made a similar comment about the Ugandan Asians - essentially that we had made a commitment to let them in and Britain should honour its commitments. There are plenty of decent right-wingers who do not think that Britain should develop a reputation for weaseling out of its responsibilities. The Government's Windrush position is completely untenable from any political viewpoint and I can't see it lasting the week.
I can't see it lasting the day. Another tin-eared performance from Theresa May's advisors.
What is the policy position that actually needs to change here?
The hostile environment for illegal migrants will stay.
All that will change is that the government will announce support to help the Windrush generation to document their ILR, long before the authorities come calling.
This can't be palmed off as an administrative bungle. This is a policy that has been rigorously followed through on. In the post-Brexit climate, this policy is the new normal.
It is not and has never been government policy for those with indefinite leave to remain to be deported.
As successive governments have moved the obligation onto the citizen to prove their status, this has only sought to highlight those groups of people who - despite having ILR - are unable to prove it....
Indeed, it has been blindingly obvious for the best part of a decade - and it has been weaponised by the Home Office in recent years, well beyond how a simply unfeeling bureaucracy would act.
Someone higher up in the chain has mandated a no compromise policy to the extent that even when the immigration authorities make obvious mistakes, they still force individuals to go through he courts before they will accept the fact. (A process which can take years and cost thousands of pounds, for people in the meantime prohibited from working.)
This can't be palmed off as an administrative bungle. This is a policy that has been rigorously followed through on. In the post-Brexit climate, this policy is the new normal.
It is a bit amusing that the Daily Mail and the Sun are now so opposed to it. TM must feel a bit like they are moving the goalposts on her.
In a just world this should be terminal for Theresa May. It won't be though, because fundamentally Conservatives just don't really care very much about this side of immigration administration.
Post-Brexit, the government has been explicitly proceeding on the basis that it's fine to treat people as pawns in discussions about immigration. This is the logical conclusion of such a line of thought.
What is the policy position that actually needs to change here?
The hostile environment for illegal migrants will stay.
All that will change is that the government will announce support to help the Windrush generation to document their ILR, long before the authorities come calling.
A very sensible suggestion. What will probably happen is the Gov't will leap too far the other way then it'll be used as an argument by some sharp lawyer or other in an immigration case that has nothing to do with commonwealth immigration from 50 or so years ago.
I watched the PBS documentary on Vietnam last night and found it balanced and interesting.
Ho Chi Minh came out quite well , apart from having the usual fanatical mindset, which meant he was always going to order mass executions of people who didn't totally agree with him.
The Americans retained the tendency to do the right thing for the wrong reason or the wrong thing for the right reason and thus cocked it up as usual.
I went to the 1968 Grosvenor Square demo and remember the small group of fanatics there who saw their aim as to incite as much violence as possible. Only then could you distinguish the true believers from the vague sympathisers who must be eliminated in the future.
Famine conditions in Vietnam spawned the rise of the Vietminh and the inevitable then happened. A small group of fanatics gained control. It seemed the same in 1917 Russia, but I speak only as an observer with a mere scientific training - thus no knowledge of false consciousness and all the other bollocks associated with sociology, a Mickey Mouse science if ever there was one.
Here's my hypothesis. Ignore anyone with a sociology or part sociology degree - they're probably bonkers. Karl should have been patted on the head and complimented on his analysis, but quietly ignored on his solution. "It won't work, Marx junior, all you'll do is invigorate a group of loons who believe that their mythical end justifies wholesale slaughter."
Is Jezza a true believer or a harmless and well-meaning amateur playing with his plant pots?
There you are, it may be barmy, but that never stopped other barmpots from taking control if they're ruthless enough. Sadly I'm not.
This can't be palmed off as an administrative bungle. This is a policy that has been rigorously followed through on. In the post-Brexit climate, this policy is the new normal.
It is a bit amusing that the Daily Mail and the Sun are now so opposed to it. TM must feel a bit like they are moving the goalposts on her.
In a just world this should be terminal for Theresa May. It won't be though, because fundamentally Conservatives just don't really care very much about this side of immigration administration.
Post-Brexit, the government has been explicitly proceeding on the basis that it's fine to treat people as pawns in discussions about immigration. This is the logical conclusion of such a line of thought.
I see some ultra-Remainers and Government critics are massively overplaying their hand on the Windrush issue this morning, guaranteeing Tories who shared some real concerns on this specific issue will now quickly swing back behind Theresa May.
I see some ultra-Remainers and Government critics are massively overplaying their hand on the Windrush issue this morning, guaranteeing Tories who shared some real concerns on this specific issue will now quickly swing back behind Theresa May.
I don't think that will happen because I have faith that there are principled Tory backbenchers out there who will force a government u-turn regardless.
But if it did - what does it say about those Tories that they are happy to leave fellow citizens in the lurch?
This can't be palmed off as an administrative bungle. This is a policy that has been rigorously followed through on. In the post-Brexit climate, this policy is the new normal.
It is a bit amusing that the Daily Mail and the Sun are now so opposed to it. TM must feel a bit like they are moving the goalposts on her.
In a just world this should be terminal for Theresa May. It won't be though, because fundamentally Conservatives just don't really care very much about this side of immigration administration.
Post-Brexit, the government has been explicitly proceeding on the basis that it's fine to treat people as pawns in discussions about immigration. This is the logical conclusion of such a line of thought.
So the rules have changed in the last two years?
This whole approach, including the approach to enforcement, comes from the top. The post-Brexit climate determines how rules are enforced. 3 million European citizens in the UK are being left in limbo while the government uses them as counters to play games with. This is the new normal.
What is the policy position that actually needs to change here?
The hostile environment for illegal migrants will stay.
All that will change is that the government will announce support to help the Windrush generation to document their ILR, long before the authorities come calling.
A very sensible suggestion. What will probably happen is the Gov't will leap too far the other way then it'll be used as an argument by some sharp lawyer or other in an immigration case that has nothing to do with commonwealth immigration from 50 or so years ago.
There will undoubtedly be some trying to exploit this controversy, plus some whose status is unclear (people who came, then left) getting the benefit of doubt they might not fully deserve. But, as with other matters of justice, better to let some off than incorrectly punish innocents.
I see some ultra-Remainers and Government critics are massively overplaying their hand on the Windrush issue this morning, guaranteeing Tories who shared some real concerns on this specific issue will now quickly swing back behind Theresa May.
I don't think that will happen because I have faith that there are principled Tory backbenchers out there who will force a government u-turn regardless.
But if it did - what does it say about those Tories that they are happy to leave fellow citizens in the lurch?
BREAKING: Immigration minister Caroline Nokes appears to admit to @itvnews@pennymitv that some Windrush immigrants have indeed been deported, but she can't give numbers.
What is the policy position that actually needs to change here?
The hostile environment for illegal migrants will stay.
All that will change is that the government will announce support to help the Windrush generation to document their ILR, long before the authorities come calling.
A very sensible suggestion. What will probably happen is the Gov't will leap too far the other way then it'll be used as an argument by some sharp lawyer or other in an immigration case that has nothing to do with commonwealth immigration from 50 or so years ago.
There will undoubtedly be some trying to exploit this controversy, plus some whose status is unclear (people who came, then left) getting the benefit of doubt they might not fully deserve. But, as with other matters of justice, better to let some off than incorrectly punish innocents.
We'll effectively be running a fifty year amnesty, i.e. show that you have been living and working, in the system, for fifty years. Attach an explanation as to how you arrived here without a passport, Bob's your uncle.
Sure, it's open to fraud, but a handful of people would fit the bill.
I see some ultra-Remainers and Government critics are massively overplaying their hand on the Windrush issue this morning...
In what respect ?
You'd think the other side of the argument was that were right to deport them, instead of what it is, which is just a discussion about how best to rectify the problem (e.g. if it should be on the Commonwealth agenda*).
Comments
I read about one person getting deported that had over 30 years of NI contributions.
The civil servants involved in this case should be sent to collect trollies at Tesco or something.
But when the alternative is Corbyn...
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_lu1xyYx3Eo
Maxim Borodin was found badly injured by neighbours in Yekaterinburg and taken to hospital, where he later died.
Local officials said no suicide note was found but the incident was unlikely to be of a criminal nature.
However, a friend revealed Borodin had said his flat had been surrounded by security men two days earlier.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-43781351
As an aside I am in the position to report there has been a run on the sale of bongos in north Hertfordshire - the power of SeanT !!
Rumours that Sean Fear was seen crossing the border from Bedfordshire in a large van have yet to be verified.
In the late 1990s the international outrage was due to the West *not* intervening, due to the massacres in Bosnia and Rwanda. Those non-interventions were partly due to the US experience in Somalia. Today, the controversy is all about the West choosing to intervene due to the experiences of Afghanistan, Iraq and Libya.
Our Governments are damned if they do, damned if they don't. Non-Western Governments are all too often excused.
Leaving Notts to make 10.
(Even partisans will be lamenting Hameed's lack of form, though.)
It's like watching an evangelising vegan occassionally tuck into a veal escalope with gusto....
If she's got JRM + the Bremain rebels against her, I can't see how TM can resist.
I think she probably does care.
I think it's more a sign of May's discomfort in meeting anyone anywhere when she knows she may be given a rough ride, or be required to be empathetic.
She knows she'd struggle to avoid doing anything other than give stock answers, as she can't really think on her feet.
She'd prefer to sit in a quiet room for a few weeks until she's analysed it, figured it out, and prepared a new position.
https://www.abitleftandabitlost.com/posts/lets-hope-the-hawks-are-satiated-further-strikes-on-syria-will-help-no-one
https://sports.ladbrokes.com/en-gb/betting/politics/uk/uk-politics/next-cabinet-minister-to-leave/226271370/
I'm on.
There was ample opportunity for the recall of Parliament but the Prime Minister recoiled from her duty to do so.
The extent to which savage government cuts have deprived disabled people of legal aid in disputes over their benefit payments is revealed today by new official figures that show a 99% decline since 2011.
The total number of disabled people granted legal aid in welfare cases has plummeted from 29,801 in 2011-12 to just 308 in 2016-17, cutting some of the most vulnerable people in society adrift without expert advice in often highly complex and distressing cases.
MPs and charities representing disabled people reacted furiously to the figures, released in a parliamentary answer, saying they bore out their worst fears at the time ministers announced the cuts several years ago.
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2018/apr/14/disabled-people-lose-legal-aid-99-per-cent-benefits-disputes
Step forward Jeremy Hunt...
They are wondering if they are going to get deported.
PikeGavin Wilkinson?Revealed: 'Bankrupt' Tory Council Raided £9m Schools Subsidy To Fix Budget
https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/northamptonshire-county-council-raided-schools-s106-subsidy-to-fix-budget_uk_5ace394ee4b0648767760786
As successive governments have moved the obligation onto the citizen to prove their status, this has only sought to highlight those groups of people who - despite having ILR - are unable to prove it.
Quite where you think the malice lies here, the truth is that once identified firm action needs to be taken. As ever, the government is slow to realise, slow to act, and slow to grasp the extent of the problem. Plus ca change.
https://twitter.com/georgeeaton/status/985812476766904320
First up, the delightful Elizabeth Hayden, nominated for the Momentum National Co-ordinating Group, which votes tonight. Endorsed By Rebecca Long-Bailey and John Trickett.
https://order-order.com/2018/04/16/long-bailey-endorses-momentum-candidate-who-posted-terror-attack-slurs/
One may only wonder, back in the day, whether such antics were prevalent when OGH wandered the corridors of the Beeb !! ....
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-43752584
TM must feel a bit like they are moving the goalposts on her.
That said the Government's approach to the Windrush children has been overly bureaucratic and tone-deaf and needs to be sorted quickly. As @NickPalmer says below, it surely will be.
The hostile environment for illegal migrants will stay.
All that will change is that the government will announce support to help the Windrush generation to document their ILR, long before the authorities come calling.
Someone higher up in the chain has mandated a no compromise policy to the extent that even when the immigration authorities make obvious mistakes, they still force individuals to go through he courts before they will accept the fact. (A process which can take years and cost thousands of pounds, for people in the meantime prohibited from working.)
https://twitter.com/Claire_Phipps/status/985847583141695488
Post-Brexit, the government has been explicitly proceeding on the basis that it's fine to treat people as pawns in discussions about immigration. This is the logical conclusion of such a line of thought.
Ho Chi Minh came out quite well , apart from having the usual fanatical mindset, which meant he was always going to order mass executions of people who didn't totally agree with him.
The Americans retained the tendency to do the right thing for the wrong reason or the wrong thing for the right reason and thus cocked it up as usual.
I went to the 1968 Grosvenor Square demo and remember the small group of fanatics there who saw their aim as to incite as much violence as possible. Only then could you distinguish the true believers from the vague sympathisers who must be eliminated in the future.
Famine conditions in Vietnam spawned the rise of the Vietminh and the inevitable then happened. A small group of fanatics gained control. It seemed the same in 1917 Russia, but I speak only as an observer with a mere scientific training - thus no knowledge of false consciousness and all the other bollocks associated with sociology, a Mickey Mouse science if ever there was one.
Here's my hypothesis. Ignore anyone with a sociology or part sociology degree - they're probably bonkers. Karl should have been patted on the head and complimented on his analysis, but quietly ignored on his solution. "It won't work, Marx junior, all you'll do is invigorate a group of loons who believe that their mythical end justifies wholesale slaughter."
Is Jezza a true believer or a harmless and well-meaning amateur playing with his plant pots?
There you are, it may be barmy, but that never stopped other barmpots from taking control if they're ruthless enough. Sadly I'm not.
This decision in record time.
But if it did - what does it say about those Tories that they are happy to leave fellow citizens in the lurch?
https://twitter.com/BillNeelyNBC/status/985847602720772096
Verified account @PaulBrandITV
BREAKING: Immigration minister Caroline Nokes appears to admit to @itvnews @pennymitv that some Windrush immigrants have indeed been deported, but she can't give numbers.
https://twitter.com/PaulBrandITV/status/985846900644614145
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/15/why-the-children-of-windrush-demand-an-immigration-amnesty?CMP=share_btn_tw
Appalling.
Embarrassment Modesty prevents me from naming the PBer who tipped her to be Jezza's successor at 100/1
Sure, it's open to fraud, but a handful of people would fit the bill.
*about five years too late, clearly.