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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The latest PB/Polling Matters podcast featuring Professor Coli

SystemSystem Posts: 6,199
edited April 26 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The latest PB/Polling Matters podcast featuring Professor Colin Rallings

On this week’s podcast Keiran Pedley is joined by Professor Colin Rallings of the University of Plymouth to look ahead to next week’s local elections. Rallings breaks down which results to look out for and what they might mean for the future with some interesting insight into how the UKIP vote continues to unwind across the country and how Labour might do in London following today’s YouGov poll for Queen Mary University.

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 11,509
    First - Like LEAVE
  • Superb podcast.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 5,701
    Second like remain
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 11,439
    Re betting on London borough elections.

    There is sometimes a 'local variation' to national or regional results depending on how well the individual council is perceived to be doing - closing car parks or ending bin collections rarely being a vote winner for example.

    Does anyone know how the London councils are perceive to be run ?

    I've read a few times that Wandsworth is now held in far lower regard than it was in its 1990s glory days.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 15,206
    Pulpstar said:

    MaxPB said:

    Foxy said:

    MaxPB said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Whilst not disagreeing with the general view of Liam Fox, isn't part of the problem with his department that they can't actually do anything very substantive until we know what the final trade deal with the EU is going to look like?

    It is a problem but the issue of how the plethora of EU deals are going to be rolled over (if they are) is something that should have had his urgent attention. The next priority is to start exploring how we make those deals more win win for us and the other country. Restrictions on products being made elsewhere in the EU that the third country sells would be an obvious example as would be seeking an offset for financial services access.
    I agree with @Max_PB that the failure to make progress on this is pushing us into continuing a Customs Union that looks incredibly like the current one for at least the transitional period.
    It is a bit more than cut and paste job, as this little article on the EU Korea trade deal explains:

    https://uktradeforum.net/2018/02/21/rolling-over-eu-free-trade-deals-a-look-at-an-actual-text/

    Maybe it is, he's had almost two years and a government and not a single deal has been agreed in principle. It might not be a simple job, but he's had enough time.
    I am happy to agree that my colleague and near namesake is a waste of space.

    On the positive side at least he is no longer in clinical practice.

    He is indeed completely useless. My friend who was there has moved to another department and hasn't looked back. Still very Brexit focussed, but actually making some kind of difference.

    The friend was the one who confirmed to me that the civil service have been pushing the customs union option to the government because they have no faith in Fox to roll over the current EU trade deals in time. His department hasn't even set a target of how many deals they want signed or set any kind of priority among the existing deals that should be rolled over first.
    I voted to remain, but respect the vote. However if as you say (And obviously you're no remainer) it seems Fox's department isn't trusted completely by the Gov't it might be best to simply remain in the CU.
    No, it would be easier to fire Fox and get Kwasi in.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 15,206

    Re betting on London borough elections.

    There is sometimes a 'local variation' to national or regional results depending on how well the individual council is perceived to be doing - closing car parks or ending bin collections rarely being a vote winner for example.

    Does anyone know how the London councils are perceive to be run ?

    I've read a few times that Wandsworth is now held in far lower regard than it was in its 1990s glory days.

    Enfield wards along Green Lanes might throw up a few surprise results. The residents are absolutely scathing about the local cycle lane scheme which nobody seems to use.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 19,838
    FPT @Richard_Tyndall

    On Grey I wonder whether he was deliberately or unconsciously mirroring Latimer’s comment:

    “Be of good cheer, Master Ridley for by our actions we shall this day light such a candle that by God’s grace in England shall never be put out”
  • nielhnielh Posts: 1,118

    Re betting on London borough elections.

    There is sometimes a 'local variation' to national or regional results depending on how well the individual council is perceived to be doing - closing car parks or ending bin collections rarely being a vote winner for example.

    Does anyone know how the London councils are perceive to be run ?

    I've read a few times that Wandsworth is now held in far lower regard than it was in its 1990s glory days.

    The electorate within the central london boroughs has become more diverse over time. There are renters in househares, yuppies, foreign property owners (who are possibly not eligible to vote), the super rich and large groups of social housing tenants all on the same street, in the same ward. They all want different things from the Council. The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently isn't quite going to please everyone. Similarly, one group of voters might be bothered by a controversial planning application, or loud music in the park, but another group might not be bothered at all.

    I have no idea whatsoever what is going to happen and won't be putting any bets on it, but my inclination is that the Labour surge is overstated.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 45,131
    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 19,838
    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    West minister also invite band H householders to make a voluntary donation equivalent to their council tax to their community fund
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 11,439
    Charles said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    West minister also invite band H householders to make a voluntary donation equivalent to their council tax to their community fund
    How many do ?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 3,062
    Charles said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    West minister also invite band H householders to make a voluntary donation equivalent to their council tax to their community fund
    I would expect Westminster council to get a bit of a hammering following their part surrounding the Grenfell fire.

    I gues we will find out in 8 days.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 21,993
    edited April 26

    Re betting on London borough elections.

    There is sometimes a 'local variation' to national or regional results depending on how well the individual council is perceived to be doing - closing car parks or ending bin collections rarely being a vote winner for example.

    Does anyone know how the London councils are perceive to be run ?

    I've read a few times that Wandsworth is now held in far lower regard than it was in its 1990s glory days.

    So far as I can tell, Wandsworth is still well-regarded. Putney and Battersea will probably vote more heavily for the Conservatives next week than they did last June.

    The 1990's were glory days, because the Conservatives held the Council, while Labour were dominant almost everywhere else.
  • nunuonenunuone Posts: 595
    Foxy said:

    Charles said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    West minister also invite band H householders to make a voluntary donation equivalent to their council tax to their community fund
    I would expect Westminster council to get a bit of a hammering following their part surrounding the Grenfell fire.

    I gues we will find out in 8 days.
    What was their part?
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 11,439
    Sean_F said:

    Re betting on London borough elections.

    There is sometimes a 'local variation' to national or regional results depending on how well the individual council is perceived to be doing - closing car parks or ending bin collections rarely being a vote winner for example.

    Does anyone know how the London councils are perceive to be run ?

    I've read a few times that Wandsworth is now held in far lower regard than it was in its 1990s glory days.

    So far as I can tell, Wandsworth is still well-regarded. Putney and Battersea will probably vote more heavily for the Conservatives next week than they did last June.

    The 1990's were glory days, because the Conservatives held the Council, while Labour were dominant almost everywhere else.
    The Conservatives only held the council because it was their glory days or to be precise their days of zero or very low local tax.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 11,439
    Foxy said:

    Charles said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    West minister also invite band H householders to make a voluntary donation equivalent to their council tax to their community fund
    I would expect Westminster council to get a bit of a hammering following their part surrounding the Grenfell fire.

    I gues we will find out in 8 days.
    Grenfell was in K&C not Westminster.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 3,062

    Foxy said:

    Charles said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    West minister also invite band H householders to make a voluntary donation equivalent to their council tax to their community fund
    I would expect Westminster council to get a bit of a hammering following their part surrounding the Grenfell fire.

    I gues we will find out in 8 days.
    Grenfell was in K&C not Westminster.
    My mistake, but surely not enhancing Tory reputations in those parts.

  • nielhnielh Posts: 1,118
    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    It isn't a model that is going to necessarily work for you if you are poor, and live in central London. If labour can get out their vote, and the conservative vote is supressed due to Brexit or whatever, then it might cause an upset.

    On the other hand, for most people emptying the bins is the only work that the Council do that affect our everyday lives.
  • YBarddCwscYBarddCwsc Posts: 1,750
    Foxy said:

    Charles said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    West minister also invite band H householders to make a voluntary donation equivalent to their council tax to their community fund
    I would expect Westminster council to get a bit of a hammering following their part surrounding the Grenfell fire.

    I gues we will find out in 8 days.
    The Chief Executive of K&C, who had to resign over Grenfell, was actually a well-known LibDem.

    Still, blaming a different party in a different borough is good Foxy Logic.
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 3,159
    Very informative podcast. Thanks.
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 1,071
    Good to see the Home Office reverting to type as the poison chalice of government departments.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 17,972
    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Charles said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    West minister also invite band H householders to make a voluntary donation equivalent to their council tax to their community fund
    I would expect Westminster council to get a bit of a hammering following their part surrounding the Grenfell fire.

    I gues we will find out in 8 days.
    Grenfell was in K&C not Westminster.
    My mistake, but surely not enhancing Tory reputations in those parts.

    It was a Tory that started the fire, designed the building and refused to buy mansions for the victims no doubt - on planet Foxy.
  • brendan16brendan16 Posts: 1,055
    TGOHF said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Charles said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    West minister also invite band H householders to make a voluntary donation equivalent to their council tax to their community fund
    I would expect Westminster council to get a bit of a hammering following their part surrounding the Grenfell fire.

    I gues we will find out in 8 days.
    Grenfell was in K&C not Westminster.
    My mistake, but surely not enhancing Tory reputations in those parts.

    It was a Tory that started the fire, designed the building and refused to buy mansions for the victims no doubt - on planet Foxy.
    The equivalent of £70,000 per flat was spend on refurbishing the the block. Was the lack of money spent by the Council the ultimate cause or just poor quality work and corner cutting - £70k is no small sum.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 21,993
    nielh said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    It isn't a model that is going to necessarily work for you if you are poor, and live in central London. If labour can get out their vote, and the conservative vote is supressed due to Brexit or whatever, then it might cause an upset.

    On the other hand, for most people emptying the bins is the only work that the Council do that affect our everyday lives.
    Inner London has become very segregated between rich and poor. That makes it very hard for Labour to win the three Conservative boroughs. They can pile up votes in North Westminster, North Kensington, Tooting, and Roehampton, without winning many more seats.

    OTOH, Lambeth, Southwark, Islington, Hackney, Camden have loads of rich left wing voters to add to the poor left wing voters, so Labour can win massively.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 3,799
    brendan16 said:

    TGOHF said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Charles said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    West minister also invite band H householders to make a voluntary donation equivalent to their council tax to their community fund
    I would expect Westminster council to get a bit of a hammering following their part surrounding the Grenfell fire.

    I gues we will find out in 8 days.
    Grenfell was in K&C not Westminster.
    My mistake, but surely not enhancing Tory reputations in those parts.

    It was a Tory that started the fire, designed the building and refused to buy mansions for the victims no doubt - on planet Foxy.
    The equivalent of £70,000 per flat was spend on refurbishing the the block. Was the lack of money spent by the Council the ultimate cause or just poor quality work and corner cutting - £70k is no small sum.
    None of which is going to save the Tory council in K&C.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 21,993

    brendan16 said:

    TGOHF said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Charles said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    West minister also invite band H householders to make a voluntary donation equivalent to their council tax to their community fund
    I would expect Westminster council to get a bit of a hammering following their part surrounding the Grenfell fire.

    I gues we will find out in 8 days.
    Grenfell was in K&C not Westminster.
    My mistake, but surely not enhancing Tory reputations in those parts.

    It was a Tory that started the fire, designed the building and refused to buy mansions for the victims no doubt - on planet Foxy.
    The equivalent of £70,000 per flat was spend on refurbishing the the block. Was the lack of money spent by the Council the ultimate cause or just poor quality work and corner cutting - £70k is no small sum.
    None of which is going to save the Tory council in K&C.
    I don't think K & C will switch.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 5,701
    TGOHF said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Charles said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    West minister also invite band H householders to make a voluntary donation equivalent to their council tax to their community fund
    I would expect Westminster council to get a bit of a hammering following their part surrounding the Grenfell fire.

    I gues we will find out in 8 days.
    Grenfell was in K&C not Westminster.
    My mistake, but surely not enhancing Tory reputations in those parts.

    It was a Tory that started the fire, designed the building and refused to buy mansions for the victims no doubt - on planet Foxy.
    Foxy does seem to have lost any objectivity of late.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 3,062
    Arsenal cocking it up...
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 3,062
    edited April 26
    Floater said:

    TGOHF said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Charles said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    West minister also invite band H householders to make a voluntary donation equivalent to their council tax to their community fund
    I would expect Westminster council to get a bit of a hammering following their part surrounding the Grenfell fire.

    I gues we will find out in 8 days.
    Grenfell was in K&C not Westminster.
    My mistake, but surely not enhancing Tory reputations in those parts.

    It was a Tory that started the fire, designed the building and refused to buy mansions for the victims no doubt - on planet Foxy.
    Foxy does seem to have lost any objectivity of late.
    The Tory mask has well and truly slipped over the last couple of years. I wish them every possible disaster.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 45,131
    Decided to do something a bit daring tonight, and TSB banking seems to be working fine for me.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 19,838
    Foxy said:

    Charles said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    West minister also invite band H householders to make a voluntary donation equivalent to their council tax to their community fund
    I would expect Westminster council to get a bit of a hammering following their part surrounding the Grenfell fire.

    I gues we will find out in 8 days.
    It’s in Kensington?
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 19,838

    Charles said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    West minister also invite band H householders to make a voluntary donation equivalent to their council tax to their community fund
    How many do ?
    New this year so don’t know
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 5,701
    Foxy said:

    Floater said:

    TGOHF said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Charles said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    West minister also invite band H householders to make a voluntary donation equivalent to their council tax to their community fund
    I would expect Westminster council to get a bit of a hammering following their part surrounding the Grenfell fire.

    I gues we will find out in 8 days.
    Grenfell was in K&C not Westminster.
    My mistake, but surely not enhancing Tory reputations in those parts.

    It was a Tory that started the fire, designed the building and refused to buy mansions for the victims no doubt - on planet Foxy.
    Foxy does seem to have lost any objectivity of late.
    The Tory mask has well and truly slipped over the last couple of years. I wish them every possible disaster.
    and the Labour mask hasn't?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 24,532
    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 24,532
    Sean_F said:

    nielh said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    It isn't a model that is going to necessarily work for you if you are poor, and live in central London. If labour can get out their vote, and the conservative vote is supressed due to Brexit or whatever, then it might cause an upset.

    On the other hand, for most people emptying the bins is the only work that the Council do that affect our everyday lives.
    Inner London has become very segregated between rich and poor. That makes it very hard for Labour to win the three Conservative boroughs. They can pile up votes in North Westminster, North Kensington, Tooting, and Roehampton, without winning many more seats.

    OTOH, Lambeth, Southwark, Islington, Hackney, Camden have loads of rich left wing voters to add to the poor left wing voters, so Labour can win massively.
    I hope you are right, but I have bet on Labour on what I thought were generous odds.
  • brendan16brendan16 Posts: 1,055

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
    Hampshire county actually runs the services that actually matter and cost lots like social care and children's services. Most districts do very little bar collecting rubbish and running leisure centres - it's easy to charge so little when you deliver so little.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 15,206
    Councils are weird to me, they are little fiefdoms with very little oversight. However, they get little credit for anything good they do and all the blame when nothing works properly. I really couldn't imagine wanting to be a councillor, being an MP seems terrible but local government is so much worse.
  • brendan16brendan16 Posts: 1,055
    edited April 26
    Sean_F said:

    nielh said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    It isn't a model that is going to necessarily work for you if you are poor, and live in central London. If labour can get out their vote, and the conservative vote is supressed due to Brexit or whatever, then it might cause an upset.

    On the other hand, for most people emptying the bins is the only work that the Council do that affect our everyday lives.
    Inner London has become very segregated between rich and poor. That makes it very hard for Labour to win the three Conservative boroughs. They can pile up votes in North Westminster, North Kensington, Tooting, and Roehampton, without winning many more seats.

    OTOH, Lambeth, Southwark, Islington, Hackney, Camden have loads of rich left wing voters to add to the poor left wing voters, so Labour can win massively.
    Much of inner London is becoming so solidly Labour it's verging on a one party state. We already have Newham and Barking with zero opposition - possibly Islington, Lambeth, Southwark, Lewisham Hackney and even Camden might follow. It's not good for democracy or accountability if no one is holding the ruling party to account.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 45,131
    edited April 26

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
    I set up my council tax DD today and told the lady on the phone that I thought all councils should switch to unitary. It's truly eye watering up here, the same band in the village up the road in Doncaster MBC (Tickhill) is 1903 rather than 2347.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 24,532
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
    I set up my council tax DD today and told the lady on the phone that I thought all councils should switch to unitary. It's truly eye watering up here, the same band in the village up the road in Doncaster MBC (Tickhill) is 1903 rather than 2347.
    It’s a pleasant retirement with a nice bit of local status for some people.

    That’s the problem.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 21,993
    brendan16 said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
    Hampshire county actually runs the services that actually matter and cost lots like social care and children's services. Most districts do very little bar collecting rubbish and running leisure centres - it's easy to charge so little when you deliver so little.
    I don't think two tiers of local authorities make sense . The whole lot should be converted into unitary councils.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 24,532
    brendan16 said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
    Hampshire county actually runs the services that actually matter and cost lots like social care and children's services. Most districts do very little bar collecting rubbish and running leisure centres - it's easy to charge so little when you deliver so little.
    If it were easy, all districts would be doing it.

    You should read up on what the EHDC is doing, and has done, before being so dismissive about it.
  • nielhnielh Posts: 1,118
    MaxPB said:

    Councils are weird to me, they are little fiefdoms with very little oversight. However, they get little credit for anything good they do and all the blame when nothing works properly. I really couldn't imagine wanting to be a councillor, being an MP seems terrible but local government is so much worse.

    They need to pay Councillors properly, to try and attract more capable and experienced people in to the role, and also reflecting the fact that it has serious responsibility.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 14,604
    After all the full on attacks over illegal immigrant targets 53% support the targets, 39% dont

    So on illegal immigrant targets the media and labour lose the argument.

    On Rudd resigning 41%/41% which is surprising despite every attempt to get Rudd to resign.

    I still think she has been poor and Windrush is dreadful but not sure how much electoral damage it has done
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 45,131
    Sean_F said:

    brendan16 said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
    Hampshire county actually runs the services that actually matter and cost lots like social care and children's services. Most districts do very little bar collecting rubbish and running leisure centres - it's easy to charge so little when you deliver so little.
    I don't think two tiers of local authorities make sense . The whole lot should be converted into unitary councils.
    Well quite.

    So much duplication with the whole county/district thing.
    And then the parish tax on top :p

  • Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 5,557

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
    I set up my council tax DD today and told the lady on the phone that I thought all councils should switch to unitary. It's truly eye watering up here, the same band in the village up the road in Doncaster MBC (Tickhill) is 1903 rather than 2347.
    It’s a pleasant retirement with a nice bit of local status for some people.

    That’s the problem.
    I have always assumed that the opportunities for corruption were unparalleled.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 14,604
    edited April 26
    nielh said:

    MaxPB said:

    Councils are weird to me, they are little fiefdoms with very little oversight. However, they get little credit for anything good they do and all the blame when nothing works properly. I really couldn't imagine wanting to be a councillor, being an MP seems terrible but local government is so much worse.

    They need to pay Councillors properly, to try and attract more capable and experienced people in to the role, and also reflecting the fact that it has serious responsibility.
    I was asked to serve on my council 50 years ago and in those days you did it to serve your community and it was unpaid.

    I was tempted but running my own business within the community I did not want to involve politics so I chaired the PTA, group scout council, and the local community centre committee instead
  • marke09marke09 Posts: 827
    Mansfield Chad‏Verified account @ChadNews

    Labour loses overall control of Ashfield District Council
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 45,131
    marke09 said:

    Mansfield Chad‏Verified account @ChadNews

    Labour loses overall control of Ashfield District Council

    Get in
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 21,993
    Ishmael_Z said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
    I set up my council tax DD today and told the lady on the phone that I thought all councils should switch to unitary. It's truly eye watering up here, the same band in the village up the road in Doncaster MBC (Tickhill) is 1903 rather than 2347.
    It’s a pleasant retirement with a nice bit of local status for some people.

    That’s the problem.
    I have always assumed that the opportunities for corruption were unparalleled.
    Not if you're a councillor.

    Such corruption as exists will be among planning officers.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 22,485
    Sean_F said:

    nielh said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    It isn't a model that is going to necessarily work for you if you are poor, and live in central London. If labour can get out their vote, and the conservative vote is supressed due to Brexit or whatever, then it might cause an upset.

    On the other hand, for most people emptying the bins is the only work that the Council do that affect our everyday lives.
    Inner London has become very segregated between rich and poor. That makes it very hard for Labour to win the three Conservative boroughs. They can pile up votes in North Westminster, North Kensington, Tooting, and Roehampton, without winning many more seats.

    OTOH, Lambeth, Southwark, Islington, Hackney, Camden have loads of rich left wing voters to add to the poor left wing voters, so Labour can win massively.
    Are there any lower middle-class people left in areas like this?
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 21,993

    After all the full on attacks over illegal immigrant targets 53% support the targets, 39% dont

    So on illegal immigrant targets the media and labour lose the argument.

    On Rudd resigning 41%/41% which is surprising despite every attempt to get Rudd to resign.

    I still think she has been poor and Windrush is dreadful but not sure how much electoral damage it has done

    In fairness to Corbyn, he simply objects to the idea of deporting illegal immigrants. He isn't after votes.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 21,993
    AndyJS said:

    Sean_F said:

    nielh said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    It isn't a model that is going to necessarily work for you if you are poor, and live in central London. If labour can get out their vote, and the conservative vote is supressed due to Brexit or whatever, then it might cause an upset.

    On the other hand, for most people emptying the bins is the only work that the Council do that affect our everyday lives.
    Inner London has become very segregated between rich and poor. That makes it very hard for Labour to win the three Conservative boroughs. They can pile up votes in North Westminster, North Kensington, Tooting, and Roehampton, without winning many more seats.

    OTOH, Lambeth, Southwark, Islington, Hackney, Camden have loads of rich left wing voters to add to the poor left wing voters, so Labour can win massively.
    Are there any lower middle-class people left in areas like this?
    Hardly.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 45,131
    Sean_F said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
    I set up my council tax DD today and told the lady on the phone that I thought all councils should switch to unitary. It's truly eye watering up here, the same band in the village up the road in Doncaster MBC (Tickhill) is 1903 rather than 2347.
    It’s a pleasant retirement with a nice bit of local status for some people.

    That’s the problem.
    I have always assumed that the opportunities for corruption were unparalleled.
    Not if you're a councillor.

    Such corruption as exists will be among planning officers.
    My Dad's been a councillor for ages. Trust me, he's not in it for the money.
  • RoyalBlueRoyalBlue Posts: 2,338
    Has anyone tallied how many Tory MPs spoke this afternoon in favour of a customs union?
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 3,799
    Pulpstar said:

    Decided to do something a bit daring tonight, and TSB banking seems to be working fine for me.

    It's just taken one week to trash the TSB brand... I bet when the full story emerges it will be down to senior management not wanting to hear IT concerns ahead of a major migration.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 14,604
    RoyalBlue said:

    Has anyone tallied how many Tory MPs spoke this afternoon in favour of a customs union?

    I switched over and the tory benches were bare with maybe 30 odd tories debating. I think the rest were out canvassing
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 3,799
    Sean_F said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
    I set up my council tax DD today and told the lady on the phone that I thought all councils should switch to unitary. It's truly eye watering up here, the same band in the village up the road in Doncaster MBC (Tickhill) is 1903 rather than 2347.
    It’s a pleasant retirement with a nice bit of local status for some people.

    That’s the problem.
    I have always assumed that the opportunities for corruption were unparalleled.
    Not if you're a councillor.

    Such corruption as exists will be among planning officers.
    And you have to think they are going to be under close scrutiny for any unexplained jumps in income.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 14,604

    Pulpstar said:

    Decided to do something a bit daring tonight, and TSB banking seems to be working fine for me.

    It's just taken one week to trash the TSB brand... I bet when the full story emerges it will be down to senior management not wanting to hear IT concerns ahead of a major migration.
    Probably and a 50 million or so fine heading their way with millions more in compensation.

    If it was me I would be an ex TSB customer by now
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 3,062
    Pulpstar said:

    marke09 said:

    Mansfield Chad‏Verified account @ChadNews

    Labour loses overall control of Ashfield District Council

    Get in
    On East Midlands Today it seems to be personal conflicts that led 5 councillors to shift from Labour to sit as independents. Not clear what the issues are.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 22,485
    Sean_F said:

    AndyJS said:

    Sean_F said:

    nielh said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    It isn't a model that is going to necessarily work for you if you are poor, and live in central London. If labour can get out their vote, and the conservative vote is supressed due to Brexit or whatever, then it might cause an upset.

    On the other hand, for most people emptying the bins is the only work that the Council do that affect our everyday lives.
    Inner London has become very segregated between rich and poor. That makes it very hard for Labour to win the three Conservative boroughs. They can pile up votes in North Westminster, North Kensington, Tooting, and Roehampton, without winning many more seats.

    OTOH, Lambeth, Southwark, Islington, Hackney, Camden have loads of rich left wing voters to add to the poor left wing voters, so Labour can win massively.
    Are there any lower middle-class people left in areas like this?
    Hardly.
    I thought so.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 21,993

    Sean_F said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
    I set up my council tax DD today and told the lady on the phone that I thought all councils should switch to unitary. It's truly eye watering up here, the same band in the village up the road in Doncaster MBC (Tickhill) is 1903 rather than 2347.
    It’s a pleasant retirement with a nice bit of local status for some people.

    That’s the problem.
    I have always assumed that the opportunities for corruption were unparalleled.
    Not if you're a councillor.

    Such corruption as exists will be among planning officers.
    And you have to think they are going to be under close scrutiny for any unexplained jumps in income.
    If I were corrupt, I'd want to be paid in gemstones, which leave no paper trail.
  • nielhnielh Posts: 1,118
    Foxy said:

    Pulpstar said:

    marke09 said:

    Mansfield Chad‏Verified account @ChadNews

    Labour loses overall control of Ashfield District Council

    Get in
    On East Midlands Today it seems to be personal conflicts that led 5 councillors to shift from Labour to sit as independents. Not clear what the issues are.
    Isn't this the area where there was a couple of recent momentum related defections to the Tories?
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 3,799

    Pulpstar said:

    Decided to do something a bit daring tonight, and TSB banking seems to be working fine for me.

    It's just taken one week to trash the TSB brand... I bet when the full story emerges it will be down to senior management not wanting to hear IT concerns ahead of a major migration.
    Probably and a 50 million or so fine heading their way with millions more in compensation.

    If it was me I would be an ex TSB customer by now
    I don't suppose the new TSB owners Banco Sabadell are very impressed. Then again maybe they put the pressure on to migrate when the systems were clearly not ready.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 3,799
    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
    I set up my council tax DD today and told the lady on the phone that I thought all councils should switch to unitary. It's truly eye watering up here, the same band in the village up the road in Doncaster MBC (Tickhill) is 1903 rather than 2347.
    It’s a pleasant retirement with a nice bit of local status for some people.

    That’s the problem.
    I have always assumed that the opportunities for corruption were unparalleled.
    Not if you're a councillor.

    Such corruption as exists will be among planning officers.
    And you have to think they are going to be under close scrutiny for any unexplained jumps in income.
    If I were corrupt, I'd want to be paid in gemstones, which leave no paper trail.
    Uhuh. And what would yo do with them?
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 14,604

    Pulpstar said:

    Decided to do something a bit daring tonight, and TSB banking seems to be working fine for me.

    It's just taken one week to trash the TSB brand... I bet when the full story emerges it will be down to senior management not wanting to hear IT concerns ahead of a major migration.
    Probably and a 50 million or so fine heading their way with millions more in compensation.

    If it was me I would be an ex TSB customer by now
    I don't suppose the new TSB owners Banco Sabadell are very impressed. Then again maybe they put the pressure on to migrate when the systems were clearly not ready.
    I am sure you are right but why risk your business without being certain of the outcome.

    A TSB Ratner style trashing of your reputation
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 3,062
    nielh said:

    Foxy said:

    Pulpstar said:

    marke09 said:

    Mansfield Chad‏Verified account @ChadNews

    Labour loses overall control of Ashfield District Council

    Get in
    On East Midlands Today it seems to be personal conflicts that led 5 councillors to shift from Labour to sit as independents. Not clear what the issues are.
    Isn't this the area where there was a couple of recent momentum related defections to the Tories?
    It seems to be mostly a dispute about shrinking bins:

    https://www.chad.co.uk/news/labour-loses-overall-control-of-ashfield-district-council-1-9098705/amp?__twitter_impression=true
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 3,799

    Pulpstar said:

    Decided to do something a bit daring tonight, and TSB banking seems to be working fine for me.

    It's just taken one week to trash the TSB brand... I bet when the full story emerges it will be down to senior management not wanting to hear IT concerns ahead of a major migration.
    Probably and a 50 million or so fine heading their way with millions more in compensation.

    If it was me I would be an ex TSB customer by now
    I don't suppose the new TSB owners Banco Sabadell are very impressed. Then again maybe they put the pressure on to migrate when the systems were clearly not ready.
    I am sure you are right but why risk your business without being certain of the outcome.

    A TSB Ratner style trashing of your reputation
    I think the pressure in this case will have been the ongoing cost to TSB of remaining on a platform run by Lloyds. Lloyds were apparently charging £200m per year for that service (but at least it was reliable!)
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 21,993

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
    I set up my council tax DD today and told the lady on the phone that I thought all councils should switch to unitary. It's truly eye watering up here, the same band in the village up the road in Doncaster MBC (Tickhill) is 1903 rather than 2347.
    It’s a pleasant retirement with a nice bit of local status for some people.

    That’s the problem.
    I have always assumed that the opportunities for corruption were unparalleled.
    Not if you're a councillor.

    Such corruption as exists will be among planning officers.
    And you have to think they are going to be under close scrutiny for any unexplained jumps in income.
    If I were corrupt, I'd want to be paid in gemstones, which leave no paper trail.
    Uhuh. And what would yo do with them?
    Place them in a safe depositry, and then gradually sell them over a period of years.
  • brendan16brendan16 Posts: 1,055

    After all the full on attacks over illegal immigrant targets 53% support the targets, 39% dont

    So on illegal immigrant targets the media and labour lose the argument.

    On Rudd resigning 41%/41% which is surprising despite every attempt to get Rudd to resign.

    I still think she has been poor and Windrush is dreadful but not sure how much electoral damage it has done

    Laboir voters don't like Amber Rudd and many Brexit supporting Tories aren't too keen either which explains her numbers. She made another ill timed intervention on the customs union today.

    The Windrush cases were legal immigrants - why shouldn't the government set targets to tackle illegal immigration. It's not fair on those who followed the rules and came here legally to confuse the two. And yet again it exposes our poor immigration systems snd record keeping.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 3,799
    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
    I set up my council tax DD today and told the lady on the phone that I thought all councils should switch to unitary. It's truly eye watering up here, the same band in the village up the road in Doncaster MBC (Tickhill) is 1903 rather than 2347.
    It’s a pleasant retirement with a nice bit of local status for some people.

    That’s the problem.
    I have always assumed that the opportunities for corruption were unparalleled.
    Not if you're a councillor.

    Such corruption as exists will be among planning officers.
    And you have to think they are going to be under close scrutiny for any unexplained jumps in income.
    If I were corrupt, I'd want to be paid in gemstones, which leave no paper trail.
    Uhuh. And what would yo do with them?
    Place them in a safe depositry, and then gradually sell them over a period of years.
    Good luck in not getting spotted flaunting the proceeds!

    Correction - as they are proceeds of corruption, I hope you get caught! :wink:
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 22,485
    How much porridge is Bill Cosby facing?
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 21,993

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
    I set up my council tax DD today and told the lady on the phone that I thought all councils should switch to unitary. It's truly eye watering up here, the same band in the village up the road in Doncaster MBC (Tickhill) is 1903 rather than 2347.
    It’s a pleasant retirement with a nice bit of local status for some people.

    That’s the problem.
    I have always assumed that the opportunities for corruption were unparalleled.
    Not if you're a councillor.

    Such corruption as exists will be among planning officers.
    And you have to think they are going to be under close scrutiny for any unexplained jumps in income.
    If I were corrupt, I'd want to be paid in gemstones, which leave no paper trail.
    Uhuh. And what would yo do with them?
    Place them in a safe depositry, and then gradually sell them over a period of years.
    Good luck in not getting spotted flaunting the proceeds!

    Correction - as they are proceeds of corruption, I hope you get caught! :wink:
    The point is not to flaunt the proceeds. A gradual increase in your standard of living won't attract attention.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 3,799
    edited April 26
    brendan16 said:

    After all the full on attacks over illegal immigrant targets 53% support the targets, 39% dont

    So on illegal immigrant targets the media and labour lose the argument.

    On Rudd resigning 41%/41% which is surprising despite every attempt to get Rudd to resign.

    I still think she has been poor and Windrush is dreadful but not sure how much electoral damage it has done

    Laboir voters don't like Amber Rudd and many Brexit supporting Tories aren't too keen either which explains her numbers. She made another ill timed intervention on the customs union today.

    The Windrush cases were legal immigrants - why shouldn't the government set targets to tackle illegal immigration. It's not fair on those who followed the rules and came here legally to confuse the two. And yet again it exposes our poor immigration systems snd record keeping.
    It's not the ends, it's the means to the end that are at fault here. The Windrush issue arose from the 'hostile environment' policy launched by May. Creating a 'hostile environment' means making life difficult for anyone who might be suspected of not having the right to live here. Tbh it smacks of the sort of policies more at home in the 3rd Reich than Britain!
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 3,799
    AndyJS said:

    How much porridge is Bill Cosby facing?

    15 to 30 years according to the Guardian.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/apr/26/bill-cosby-guilty-trial-sexual-assault
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 14,604

    brendan16 said:

    After all the full on attacks over illegal immigrant targets 53% support the targets, 39% dont

    So on illegal immigrant targets the media and labour lose the argument.

    On Rudd resigning 41%/41% which is surprising despite every attempt to get Rudd to resign.

    I still think she has been poor and Windrush is dreadful but not sure how much electoral damage it has done

    Laboir voters don't like Amber Rudd and many Brexit supporting Tories aren't too keen either which explains her numbers. She made another ill timed intervention on the customs union today.

    The Windrush cases were legal immigrants - why shouldn't the government set targets to tackle illegal immigration. It's not fair on those who followed the rules and came here legally to confuse the two. And yet again it exposes our poor immigration systems snd record keeping.
    It's not the ends, it's the means to the end that are at fault here. The Windrush issue arose from the 'hostile environment' policy launched by May. Creating a 'hostile environment' means making life difficult for anyone who might be suspected of not having the right to live here. Tbh it smacks of the sort of policies more at home in the 3rd Reich than Britain!
    Ben - in the nicest way possible - it was not May who coined the hostile environment it was Alan Johnson and was supported by both parties through to now. And your last sentence is not worthy of you
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 3,799
    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
    I set up my council tax DD today and told the lady on the phone that I thought all councils should switch to unitary. It's truly eye watering up here, the same band in the village up the road in Doncaster MBC (Tickhill) is 1903 rather than 2347.
    It’s a pleasant retirement with a nice bit of local status for some people.

    That’s the problem.
    I have always assumed that the opportunities for corruption were unparalleled.
    Not if you're a councillor.

    Such corruption as exists will be among planning officers.
    And you have to think they are going to be under close scrutiny for any unexplained jumps in income.
    If I were corrupt, I'd want to be paid in gemstones, which leave no paper trail.
    Uhuh. And what would yo do with them?
    Place them in a safe depositry, and then gradually sell them over a period of years.
    Good luck in not getting spotted flaunting the proceeds!

    Correction - as they are proceeds of corruption, I hope you get caught! :wink:
    The point is not to flaunt the proceeds. A gradual increase in your standard of living won't attract attention.
    I take your word for it. :wink:

    However, I suspect Planning Officers have to be seen to be whiter than white.
  • philiphphiliph Posts: 2,838
    edited April 26
    AndyJS said:

    How much porridge is Bill Cosby facing?

    Round about 3650 bowls of he has it every morning, or that may be the tariff for each offence.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 5,261
    edited April 26
    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    If I were corrupt, I'd want to be paid in gemstones, which leave no paper trail.

    Uhuh. And what would yo do with them?
    Place them in a safe depositry, and then gradually sell them over a period of years.
    Goddamn it, you had a priceless opportunity to be the first PBer to use the word "vajazzled"! Did you take it? Oh, no.

    You had one job to do.
    One job.

    Pause.

    Ah, my coat... :)

  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 14,604
    Time to say goodnight

    May everyone have a peaceful nights rest
  • JonnyJimmyJonnyJimmy Posts: 2,548
    Being a xenophobic Brexit supporter, a man fought to hit me violently (7,2,3,5)
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 3,799

    brendan16 said:

    After all the full on attacks over illegal immigrant targets 53% support the targets, 39% dont

    So on illegal immigrant targets the media and labour lose the argument.

    On Rudd resigning 41%/41% which is surprising despite every attempt to get Rudd to resign.

    I still think she has been poor and Windrush is dreadful but not sure how much electoral damage it has done

    Laboir voters don't like Amber Rudd and many Brexit supporting Tories aren't too keen either which explains her numbers. She made another ill timed intervention on the customs union today.

    The Windrush cases were legal immigrants - why shouldn't the government set targets to tackle illegal immigration. It's not fair on those who followed the rules and came here legally to confuse the two. And yet again it exposes our poor immigration systems snd record keeping.
    It's not the ends, it's the means to the end that are at fault here. The Windrush issue arose from the 'hostile environment' policy launched by May. Creating a 'hostile environment' means making life difficult for anyone who might be suspected of not having the right to live here. Tbh it smacks of the sort of policies more at home in the 3rd Reich than Britain!
    Ben - in the nicest way possible - it was not May who coined the hostile environment it was Alan Johnson and was supported by both parties through to now. And your last sentence is not worthy of you
    Sorry Big_G, Theresa introduced the Hostile Environment policy in 2012.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/9291483/Theresa-May-interview-Were-going-to-give-illegal-migrants-a-really-hostile-reception.html

    Now, that was aimed at illegal immigrants and we might all say they shouldn't be here, so they are fair game. But the problem is the policy has had unintended consequences in unfairly discriminating against people who have every right to live here.

    In referring to the 3rd Reich, I merely make the point that the sort of hoops some of the Windrush generation have been put through to prove their right to live here would not have been out of place in that regime. "Ihre Papiere bitte..."
  • YBarddCwscYBarddCwsc Posts: 1,750

    The new chair of Welsh Labour lives in ... err. ... Bolton

    https://tinyurl.com/ydxo7gpe

    They might just as well have appointed Roger from the South of France..

    Unbelievably, Welsh Labour have less integrity than SLAB.

    It is harsh thing to say, but Welsh Labour actually have less integrity than UKIP
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 21,993

    brendan16 said:

    After all the full on attacks over illegal immigrant targets 53% support the targets, 39% dont

    So on illegal immigrant targets the media and labour lose the argument.

    On Rudd resigning 41%/41% which is surprising despite every attempt to get Rudd to resign.

    I still think she has been poor and Windrush is dreadful but not sure how much electoral damage it has done

    Laboir voters don't like Amber Rudd and many Brexit supporting Tories aren't too keen either which explains her numbers. She made another ill timed intervention on the customs union today.

    The Windrush cases were legal immigrants - why shouldn't the government set targets to tackle illegal immigration. It's not fair on those who followed the rules and came here legally to confuse the two. And yet again it exposes our poor immigration systems snd record keeping.
    It's not the ends, it's the means to the end that are at fault here. The Windrush issue arose from the 'hostile environment' policy launched by May. Creating a 'hostile environment' means making life difficult for anyone who might be suspected of not having the right to live here. Tbh it smacks of the sort of policies more at home in the 3rd Reich than Britain!
    I think the Third Reich was a bit more radical.
  • JonnyJimmyJonnyJimmy Posts: 2,548

    Being a xenophobic Brexit supporter, a man fought to hit me violently (7,2,3,5)

    Hope @AlastairMeeks appreciates me normalising his definitions
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 3,799

    Being a xenophobic Brexit supporter, a man fought to hit me violently (7,2,3,5)

    foaming at the mouth
  • ElliotElliot Posts: 1,505

    brendan16 said:

    After all the full on attacks over illegal immigrant targets 53% support the targets, 39% dont

    So on illegal immigrant targets the media and labour lose the argument.

    On Rudd resigning 41%/41% which is surprising despite every attempt to get Rudd to resign.

    I still think she has been poor and Windrush is dreadful but not sure how much electoral damage it has done

    Laboir voters don't like Amber Rudd and many Brexit supporting Tories aren't too keen either which explains her numbers. She made another ill timed intervention on the customs union today.

    The Windrush cases were legal immigrants - why shouldn't the government set targets to tackle illegal immigration. It's not fair on those who followed the rules and came here legally to confuse the two. And yet again it exposes our poor immigration systems snd record keeping.
    It's not the ends, it's the means to the end that are at fault here. The Windrush issue arose from the 'hostile environment' policy launched by May. Creating a 'hostile environment' means making life difficult for anyone who might be suspected of not having the right to live here. Tbh it smacks of the sort of policies more at home in the 3rd Reich than Britain!
    Ben - in the nicest way possible - it was not May who coined the hostile environment it was Alan Johnson and was supported by both parties through to now. And your last sentence is not worthy of you
    Sorry Big_G, Theresa introduced the Hostile Environment policy in 2012.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/9291483/Theresa-May-interview-Were-going-to-give-illegal-migrants-a-really-hostile-reception.html

    Now, that was aimed at illegal immigrants and we might all say they shouldn't be here, so they are fair game. But the problem is the policy has had unintended consequences in unfairly discriminating against people who have every right to live here.

    In referring to the 3rd Reich, I merely make the point that the sort of hoops some of the Windrush generation have been put through to prove their right to live here would not have been out of place in that regime. "Ihre Papiere bitte..."
    A poorly designed policy having unintended consequences means the policy should be better designed, not abandoned. My parents were some of the many immigrants that played by the rules. I don't think it's right that those that don't get to stay.
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 7,601
    Pulpstar said:

    marke09 said:

    Mansfield Chad‏Verified account @ChadNews

    Labour loses overall control of Ashfield District Council

    Get in
    Labour's former council leader, councillor Chris Baron, and councillor Lee Anderson joined the Conservatives, councillor Glenys Maxwell joined the Ashfield Independents and councillor Tim Brown, Amanda Brown, Joanne Donnelly, Helen Hollis and Steve Carroll became independents.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 11,823
    viewcode said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    If I were corrupt, I'd want to be paid in gemstones, which leave no paper trail.

    Uhuh. And what would yo do with them?
    Place them in a safe depositry, and then gradually sell them over a period of years.
    Goddamn it, you had a priceless opportunity to be the first PBer to use the word "vajazzled"! Did you take it? Oh, no.

    You had one job to do.
    One job.

    Pause.

    Ah, my coat... :)

    Acquiring a vaj to be azzled might give anyone pause for thought.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 6,254
    MaxPB said:

    Councils are weird to me, they are little fiefdoms with very little oversight. However, they get little credit for anything good they do and all the blame when nothing works properly. I really couldn't imagine wanting to be a councillor, being an MP seems terrible but local government is so much worse.

    Thatcher centralised the control of much of their funding, and austerity saw central government cut it massively.
    Local government has been the plaything of central government for many decades, and while there is certainly a paucity of good leadership locally, successive governments have done very little that’s coherent in encouraging it.
  • JonnyJimmyJonnyJimmy Posts: 2,548

    Being a xenophobic Brexit supporter, a man fought to hit me violently (7,2,3,5)

    foaming at the mouth
    Correct! (I know you don't need telling)
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 3,062
    Elliot said:

    brendan16 said:

    After all the full on attacks over illegal immigrant targets 53% support the targets, 39% dont

    So on illegal immigrant targets the media and labour lose the argument.

    On Rudd resigning 41%/41% which is surprising despite every attempt to get Rudd to resign.

    I still think she has been poor and Windrush is dreadful but not sure how much electoral damage it has done

    Laboir voters don't like Amber Rudd and many Brexit supporting Tories aren't too keen either which explains her numbers. She made another ill timed intervention on the customs union today.

    The Windrush cases were legal immigrants - why shouldn't the government set targets to tackle illegal immigration. It's not fair on those who followed the rules and came here legally to confuse the two. And yet again it exposes our poor immigration systems snd record keeping.
    It's not the ends, it's the means to the end that are at fault here. The Windrush issue arose from the 'hostile environment' policy launched by May. Creating a 'hostile environment' means making life difficult for anyone who might be suspected of not having the right to live here. Tbh it smacks of the sort of policies more at home in the 3rd Reich than Britain!
    Ben - in the nicest way possible - it was not May who coined the hostile environment it was Alan Johnson and was supported by both parties through to now. And your last sentence is not worthy of you
    Sorry Big_G, Theresa introduced the Hostile Environment policy in 2012.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/9291483/Theresa-May-interview-Were-going-to-give-illegal-migrants-a-really-hostile-reception.html

    Now, that was aimed at illegal immigrants and we might all say they shouldn't be here, so they are fair game. But the problem is the policy has had unintended consequences in unfairly discriminating against people who have every right to live here.

    In referring to the 3rd Reich, I merely make the point that the sort of hoops some of the Windrush generation have been put through to prove their right to live here would not have been out of place in that regime. "Ihre Papiere bitte..."
    A poorly designed policy having unintended consequences means the policy should be better designed, not abandoned. My parents were some of the many immigrants that played by the rules. I don't think it's right that those that don't get to stay.
    The point of the Windrush scandal is that it is a policy that persecuted legal immigrants, like my own paternal grandparents.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 5,261

    In referring to the 3rd Reich, I merely make the point that the sort of hoops some of the Windrush generation have been put through to prove their right to live here would not have been out of place in that regime. "Ihre Papiere bitte..."

    It's more European than third-Reich-y. I spoke a few days ago about a "registration culture": many European countries have a longstanding tradition of requiring their citizens to inform the authorities when they move around, even requiring hotels to promptly pass on their guests' identities. We don't really have such a culture, which is why ID cards or similar really aren't a good idea in a UK context.

  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 3,799
    Elliot said:

    brendan16 said:



    So on illegal immigrant targets the media and labour lose the argument.

    On Rudd resigning 41%/41% which is surprising despite every attempt to get Rudd to resign.

    I still think she has been poor and Windrush is dreadful but not sure how much electoral damage it has done

    Laboir voters don't like Amber Rudd and many Brexit supporting Tories aren't too keen either which explains her numbers. She made another ill timed intervention on the customs union today.

    The Windrush cases were legal immigrants - why shouldn't the government set targets to tackle illegal immigration. It's not fair on those who followed the rules and came here legally to confuse the two. And yet again it exposes our poor immigration systems snd record keeping.
    It's not the ends, it's the means to the end that are at fault here. The Windrush issue arose from the 'hostile environment' policy launched by May. Creating a 'hostile environment' means making life difficult for anyone who might be suspected of not having the right to live here. Tbh it smacks of the sort of policies more at home in the 3rd Reich than Britain!
    Ben - in the nicest way possible - it was not May who coined the hostile environment it was Alan Johnson and was supported by both parties through to now. And your last sentence is not worthy of you
    Sorry Big_G, Theresa introduced the Hostile Environment policy in 2012.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/9291483/Theresa-May-interview-Were-going-to-give-illegal-migrants-a-really-hostile-reception.html

    Now, that was aimed at illegal immigrants and we might all say they shouldn't be here, so they are fair game. But the problem is the policy has had unintended consequences in unfairly discriminating against people who have every right to live here.

    In referring to the 3rd Reich, I merely make the point that the sort of hoops some of the Windrush generation have been put through to prove their right to live here would not have been out of place in that regime. "Ihre Papiere bitte..."
    A poorly designed policy having unintended consequences means the policy should be better designed, not abandoned. My parents were some of the many immigrants that played by the rules. I don't think it's right that those that don't get to stay.
    The policy of having immigration controls and not allowing illegal immigration is fine. The policy of creating a 'hostile environment' to is wrong, nasty, has very sinister overtones and needs to be abandoned. But then who was it who described the Tories as the nasty party?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 22,643
    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
    I set up my council tax DD today and told the lady on the phone that I thought all councils should switch to unitary. It's truly eye watering up here, the same band in the village up the road in Doncaster MBC (Tickhill) is 1903 rather than 2347.
    It’s a pleasant retirement with a nice bit of local status for some people.

    That’s the problem.
    I have always assumed that the opportunities for corruption were unparalleled.
    Not if you're a councillor.

    Such corruption as exists will be among planning officers.
    And you have to think they are going to be under close scrutiny for any unexplained jumps in income.
    If I were corrupt, I'd want to be paid in gemstones, which leave no paper trail.
    Uhuh. And what would yo do with them?
    Place them in a safe depositry, and then gradually sell them over a period of years.
    Good luck in not getting spotted flaunting the proceeds!

    Correction - as they are proceeds of corruption, I hope you get caught! :wink:
    The point is not to flaunt the proceeds. A gradual increase in your standard of living won't attract attention.
    So, a new Lamborghini is out then?
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 3,799
    rcs1000 said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    nielh said:

    The Wandsworth/Westminster model of very low council tax whilst emptying the bins efficiently

    I'd say this is what 90% of the country wants to be perfectly honest. That and the roads to be kept in good nick.
    East Hampshire District Council is also very, very good, and looking to eliminate council tax entirely.

    Unfortunately, Hampshire County Council makes up the bulk of the bill, and those that run it are soaking wet and in the hands of the officials.
    I set up my council tax DD today and told the lady on the phone that I thought all councils should switch to unitary. It's truly eye watering up here, the same band in the village up the road in Doncaster MBC (Tickhill) is 1903 rather than 2347.
    It’s a pleasant retirement with a nice bit of local status for some people.

    That’s the problem.
    I have always assumed that the opportunities for corruption were unparalleled.
    Not if you're a councillor.

    Such corruption as exists will be among planning officers.
    And you have to think they are going to be under close scrutiny for any unexplained jumps in income.
    If I were corrupt, I'd want to be paid in gemstones, which leave no paper trail.
    Uhuh. And what would yo do with them?
    Place them in a safe depositry, and then gradually sell them over a period of years.
    Good luck in not getting spotted flaunting the proceeds!

    Correction - as they are proceeds of corruption, I hope you get caught! :wink:
    The point is not to flaunt the proceeds. A gradual increase in your standard of living won't attract attention.
    So, a new Lamborghini is out then?
    In which case, what's the point? There's no point in risking the sack, disgrace and prison if you can't have a new yatch occasionally. :smile:
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 3,799

    Being a xenophobic Brexit supporter, a man fought to hit me violently (7,2,3,5)

    foaming at the mouth
    Correct! (I know you don't need telling)

    If it's a good clue (and it was) there's no doubt when you've got the right answer.

    Here's one of my favourites... very easy too:

    He upsets the classroom (12).
  • JonnyJimmyJonnyJimmy Posts: 2,548

    Being a xenophobic Brexit supporter, a man fought to hit me violently (7,2,3,5)

    foaming at the mouth
    Correct! (I know you don't need telling)

    If it's a good clue (and it was) there's no doubt when you've got the right answer.

    Here's one of my favourites... very easy too:

    He upsets the classroom (12).
    Schoolmaster (don't even need to check the anagram!)
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 3,799

    Being a xenophobic Brexit supporter, a man fought to hit me violently (7,2,3,5)

    foaming at the mouth
    Correct! (I know you don't need telling)

    If it's a good clue (and it was) there's no doubt when you've got the right answer.

    Here's one of my favourites... very easy too:

    He upsets the classroom (12).
    Schoolmaster (don't even need to check the anagram!)
    Well, I did say it was very easy. I just like the coincidence :smile:
This discussion has been closed.