Just looked through the previous thread and couldn't find any comments referring to today's Guardian/ICM poll.
Or You Gov published today
If these polls are accurate it is amazing that despite 24/7 media broadcast attacks on all things government and Brexit the Country is not listening to them
Outside their riduculous London bubble real people are disgusted by Windrush but are content to see it dealt with fairly, but Abbott and others in labour lining up against deportations of illegal immigrants and giving every impression they would open the borders to one and all is very damaging to labour
Made it to sunny Valencia, the flight was extremely bumpy along the way. Now 5 days of relaxation in the sun with my soon to be wife.
Life tip, never have a big wedding. It's the world's worst idea. Not only are people deciding things without our consent, we're going to end up paying for it all. We've come here to have a bit of calm before we go back and lay down the law. So far the total cost is coming in at £85k, which is, IMO way, way too much money being burned for one day of our lives.
Life tip #2: stay off PB when you and your beloved are having a romantic trip to Valencia.
She's putting her face on so I've got a bit of time lol.
so you are time-limited - the worst curse for a PB-er: no time to point out why everyone else on PB has got it wrong.
Made it to sunny Valencia, the flight was extremely bumpy along the way. Now 5 days of relaxation in the sun with my soon to be wife.
Life tip, never have a big wedding. It's the world's worst idea. Not only are people deciding things without our consent, we're going to end up paying for it all. We've come here to have a bit of calm before we go back and lay down the law. So far the total cost is coming in at £85k, which is, IMO way, way too much money being burned for one day of our lives.
Well, yesterday I enraged a few on here by saying that I did not think prostitution was something to be encouraged.
So, today, I'm going to try enrage a few more and post my response to @NickPalmer (fpt) on transgender people on all-women shortlists.
This is what Mr P said:
"I know people on both sides of this argument who feel very strongly. The argument for the party's position is that we really can't get involved in physical examinations to determine degrees of gender and the common sense solution is to let people decide what they are. The argument against is that even after the op a trans woman won't have experienced the difficulties that women often have as they grow up even in today's society.
I've avoided taking a view, as it's not something I'm really qualified to judge, but I can see both sides. Regardless, though, it's the sort of issue that we should not be preoccupied with as the main opposition."
A man claiming to "identify" as a woman without taking any actual steps to make that a reality and without any medical diagnosis of his condition and wanting to take the place of women is not a victim but a bully. And, frankly, women have had enough of men bullying them and telling them that they know best. Now we have some of them telling us what it is to be a woman. Well, they can fuck off, frankly.
People who are genuinely transgender deserve all necessary help and support. But too many of those claiming to be fighting for transgender rights seem to me to want "rights" on the basis of the flimsiest of evidence and at the expense of women. And there are too many who are too scared to call them out on this.
To me this shows a completely stupid and ridiculous over-compensation to make a vanishingly small group marginally happier at the cost of everyone else. Its self indulgent twaddle.
What on earth is the problem with gender neutral loos? Surely women should welcome this given the disparity at theatres especially in queue length when there are gendered loos?
As long as it is all cubicles, no problem, but mixing urinals and cubicles probably not.
Mixing urinals and cubicles as a means of screaming’gender equality’ is plain daft.
You could do that in a men's loo if you wanted to... there's a reason you don't...
There are cubicles in all the mens loos I use. And if you’re suggesting what I think you’re suggesting it wasn’t unknown in my student days, although very rare, for a young man and a young woman to go into the same cubicle. As I am assured also happens on aeroplanes, although given the space in most that I’ve travelled on.....
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago.
There are never enough womens loos at public places. Never. There need to be about 4 times as many as there are for men. There's all sorts of stuff we need to do in there for which we need time and space. And we can't go round the back of the theatre and pee against a wall either.
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago. Usually it's a group of young women walking in together, presumably after psyching each other up to do it.
I see that happening too. Generally they're following the guy in to have a quick snort.
"A man claiming to "identify" as a woman without taking any actual steps to make that a reality and without any medical diagnosis of his condition and wanting to take the place of women is not a victim but a bully. And, frankly, women have had enough of men bullying them and telling them that they know best. Now we have some of them telling us what it is to be a woman. Well, they can fuck off, frankly."
I am see any evidence that more than a trivial number of these people exist.
All the people I know (admittedly only a handful) who consider themselves transgender have spent years and years establishing/coming to terms with that.
I am sure. But they usually do so with the help of doctors and others etc. There seem to be some - maybe a very few who are vocal - who are not doing this. I do not like the idea (or the proposal from the government) that someone can call themselves a woman without any sort of independent verification or medical diagnosis and, thereby, get access to women's changing rooms, hostels, loos etc. That seems to me to leave an obvious loophole for a man intent on malice to get access to women when they are vulnerable.
Made it to sunny Valencia, the flight was extremely bumpy along the way. Now 5 days of relaxation in the sun with my soon to be wife.
Life tip, never have a big wedding. It's the world's worst idea. Not only are people deciding things without our consent, we're going to end up paying for it all. We've come here to have a bit of calm before we go back and lay down the law. So far the total cost is coming in at £85k, which is, IMO way, way too much money being burned for one day of our lives.
Life tip #2: stay off PB when you and your beloved are having a romantic trip to Valencia.
She's putting her face on so I've got a bit of time lol.
so you are time-limited - the worst curse for a PB-er: no time to point out why everyone else on PB has got it wrong.
Enjoy Valencia.
Cheers, she's almost ready. Maybe another 15 mins.
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago. Usually it's a group of young women walking in together, presumably after psyching each other up to do it.
I used to see this all the time at night clubs on a weekend night.
This is back in the day when I was young enough to go clubbing.
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago.
There are never enough womens loos at public places. Never. There need to be about 4 times as many as there are for men. There's all sorts of stuff we need to do in there for which we need time and space. And we can't go round the back of the theatre and pee against a wall either.
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago. Usually it's a group of young women walking in together, presumably after psyching each other up to do it.
I used to see this all the time at night clubs on a weekend night.
This is back in the day when I was young enough to go clubbing.
I imagine that men are less uncomfortable about women using mens' loos than the reverse.
Just looked through the previous thread and couldn't find any comments referring to today's Guardian/ICM poll.
Or You Gov published today
If these polls are accurate it is amazing that despite 24/7 media broadcast attacks on all things government and Brexit the Country is not listening to them
Outside their riduculous London bubble real people are disgusted by Windrush but are content to see it dealt with fairly, but Abbott and others in labour lining up against deportations of illegal immigrants and giving every impression they would open the borders to one and all is very damaging to labour
YouGov was discussed on last night’s thread. They also showed on Friday that most feel that the government have handled the issue badly (64%). So it’s not only the ‘London’ bubble who is critical.
Both the opposition and the government have been rightly criticised in recent months - for Windrush and antisemitism and several people on this site called it that it wouldn’t really shift the polls (ICM is showing pretty much MOE movements and we’ve seen small Tory leads of 1-3 points in polls since the start of the year). That is not a shock. Corbyn had some pretty bad headlines during the GE and that didn’t stop nearly 40% of people from voting for him either.
No one really cares about the process of Brexit, however if the stories surrounding free movement are true (cf Independent on Sunday) then long term that might cause issues. Labour despite having quite a different tone on immigration now to Miliband’s time have for years not been rated on being tough on immigration; that is priced in much like the Tories not being entirely trusted on the NHS is priced tbh. That’s why the Winter Crisis didn’t actually affect their VI.
I see Viscount Hailsham AKA (AKA Douglas Hogg Ex-MP) was one of the Tory Peers voting to block the democratic will of the British people over Brexit... The same multi-millionaire Viscount Hailsham who charged tax-payers £2000 to have his moat cleaned.
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago. Usually it's a group of young women walking in together, presumably after psyching each other up to do it.
I used to see this all the time at night clubs on a weekend night.
This is back in the day when I was young enough to go clubbing.
I imagine that men are less uncomfortable about women using mens' loos than the reverse.
Surely not? In the gents the blokes are stood in the open with their bits hanging out! The women are all behind a closed door.
The Germaine Greer argument - that if you change sex halfway during your life you're still not a proper one - is an interesting one.
I think that once you transition you are a proper woman, albeit you've arrived at your destination in an unusual way. So if that is what she's saying I think she's wrong.
But if what she's saying is that you don't have the same experiences as a woman who was born and grew up as a woman, then she's absolutely right. You do not know what it is like to be a girl child or a girl teenager or a young woman working in a male environment, for instance, if you become a woman later in life. Your life experience is necessarily different and your knowledge of female experience is very different to that of women born as such. That to me is self-evident. It doesn't make your experience worse; it's just different in the same way that a woman cannot know what it is like to suffer from dysmorphia.
Why this should be controversial and lead to attacks on her, stopping her from speaking and all the rest of it I don't know. The level of intolerance from people who don't want to hear something they disagree with is quite frightening.
I do wonder whether a man who transitions into a woman retains some of his/her male attributes i.e. a level of self-belief/being used to being listened to/even arrogance etc. If so, that may also make their experience - even as a transgender woman - different to many women.
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago.
There are never enough womens loos at public places. Never. There need to be about 4 times as many as there are for men. There's all sorts of stuff we need to do in there for which we need time and space. And we can't go round the back of the theatre and pee against a wall either.
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago. Usually it's a group of young women walking in together, presumably after psyching each other up to do it.
I used to see this all the time at night clubs on a weekend night.
This is back in the day when I was young enough to go clubbing.
I imagine that men are less uncomfortable about women using mens' loos than the reverse.
Surely not? In the gents the blokes are stood in the open with their bits hanging out! The women are all behind a closed door.
there are of course ladies urinals or they can bring a hand held portable one
It would be good to see May forced to take responsibility for her part in this mess. When people are having their lives ruined by idiotic government decisions, trying to pretend it is someone else's fault is not a tenable position for very long.
The Germaine Greer argument - that if you change sex halfway during your life you're still not a proper one - is an interesting one.
I think that once you transition you are a proper woman, albeit you've arrived at your destination in an unusual way. So if that is what she's saying I think she's wrong.
But if what she's saying is that you don't have the same experiences as a woman who was born and grew up as a woman, then she's absolutely right. You do not know what it is like to be a girl child or a girl teenager or a young woman working in a male environment, for instance, if you become a woman later in life. Your life experience is necessarily different and your knowledge of female experience is very different to that of women born as such. That to me is self-evident. It doesn't make your experience worse; it's just different in the same way that a woman cannot know what it is like to suffer from dysmorphia.
Why this should be controversial and lead to attacks on her, stopping her from speaking and all the rest of it I don't know. The level of intolerance from people who don't want to hear something they disagree with is quite frightening.
I do wonder whether a man who transitions into a woman retains some of his/her male attributes i.e. a level of self-belief/being used to being listened to/even arrogance etc. If so, that may also make their experience - even as a transgender woman - different to many women.
yeah but if you grow up, say, in Phillimore Gardens W8, then go to Notting Hill Prep then Eton/Benenden then Oxbridge as a girl or a boy you will not have the same experiences as a girl growing up in the Hindu Kush.
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago.
There are never enough womens loos at public places. Never. There need to be about 4 times as many as there are for men. There's all sorts of stuff we need to do in there for which we need time and space. And we can't go round the back of the theatre and pee against a wall either.
clearly you don't believe in equality
No, on this issue I don't. Each according to his/her need. Try being pregnant, needing to pee every 10 mins and have to queue for 15 just to get to the bloody loo.
And it doesn't make commercial sense for the venues either. All that time spent queueing is time when women cannot be in the bars/shops spending money.
Yesterday at the British Museum the female loo queue was snaking up the stairs and round the Reading Room. I spent more time waiting to pee than I did looking at Rodin and the Greek sculptures. Time and money spent in shops: Zero.
The Germaine Greer argument - that if you change sex halfway during your life you're still not a proper one - is an interesting one.
I think that once you transition you are a proper woman, albeit you've arrived at your destination in an unusual way. So if that is what she's saying I think she's wrong.
But if what she's saying is that you don't have the same experiences as a woman who was born and grew up as a woman, then she's absolutely right. You do not know what it is like to be a girl child or a girl teenager or a young woman working in a male environment, for instance, if you become a woman later in life. Your life experience is necessarily different and your knowledge of female experience is very different to that of women born as such. That to me is self-evident. It doesn't make your experience worse; it's just different in the same way that a woman cannot know what it is like to suffer from dysmorphia.
Why this should be controversial and lead to attacks on her, stopping her from speaking and all the rest of it I don't know. The level of intolerance from people who don't want to hear something they disagree with is quite frightening.
I do wonder whether a man who transitions into a woman retains some of his/her male attributes i.e. a level of self-belief/being used to being listened to/even arrogance etc. If so, that may also make their experience - even as a transgender woman - different to many women.
yeah but if you grow up, say, in Phillimore Gardens W8, then go to Notting Hill Prep then Eton/Benenden then Oxbridge as a girl or a boy you will not have the same experiences as a girl growing up in the Hindu Kush.
Where does it end?
There are some experiences all women everywhere in the world have in common, no matter where they're brought up.
Well, yesterday I enraged a few on here by saying that I did not think prostitution was something to be encouraged.
So, today, I'm going to try enrage a few more and post my response to @NickPalmer (fpt) on transgender people on all-women shortlists.
This is what Mr P said:
"I know people on both sides of this argumenng I'm really qualified to judge, but I can see both sides. Regardless, though, it's the sort of issue that we should not be preoccupied with as the main opposition."
No. The common-sense position is to say that if someone has been diagnosed by a doctor and is taking steps to transition then they are transgender. If they are not doing so and still have all their male genitalia then they are a male and should not be on all-women shortlists or in women's loos and changing rooms.
A man claiming to "identify" as a woman without taking any actual steps to make that a reality and without any medical diagnosis of his condition and wanting to take the place of women is not a victim but a bully. And, frankly, women have had enough of men bullying them and telling them that they know best. Now we have some of them telling us what it is to be a woman. Well, they can fuck off, frankly.
People who are genuinely transgender deserve all necessary help and support. But too many of those claiming to be fighting for transgender rights seem to me to want "rights" on the basis of the flimsiest of evidence and at the expense of women. And there are too many who are too scared to call them out on this.
My wife was at the Women of Scotland lunch a week ago. One of the women present was in charge of some of the theatres in Edinburgh. She explained that they only had gender neutral toilets with urinals beside the cubicles. A transgender friend had apparently told her how wonderful this was. I suspect that there are a very large number of crossed legs in the second half.
To me this shows a completely stupid and ridiculous over-compensation to make a vanishingly small group marginally happier at the cost of everyone else. Its self indulgent twaddle.
What on earth is the problem with gender neutral loos? Surely women should welcome this given the disparity at theatres especially in queue length when there are gendered loos?
As long as it is all cubicles, no problem, but mixing urinals and cubicles probably not.
Yes I can see that would be an issue.
Cubicles though seem a no-brainer and welcome for women as I (and @SandyRentool) noted.
My experience at my employer's head office and a conference centre in Stockholm was that all the cubicles were private and equipped with a toilet bowl and sink and so were all unisex. Makes sense to me.
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago.
There are never enough womens loos at public places. Never. There need to be about 4 times as many as there are for men. There's all sorts of stuff we need to do in there for which we need time and space. And we can't go round the back of the theatre and pee against a wall either.
clearly you don't believe in equality
No, on this issue I don't. Each according to his/her need. Try being pregnant, needing to pee every 10 mins and have to queue for 15 just to get to the bloody loo.
And it doesn't make commercial sense for the venues either. All that time spent queueing is time when women cannot be in the bars/shops spending money.
Yesterday at the British Museum the female loo queue was snaking up the stairs and round the Reading Room. I spent more time waiting to pee than I did looking at Rodin and the Greek sculptures. Time and money spent in shops: Zero.
yes but think of all those happy blokes knowing their not being dragged round shops.
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago.
There are never enough womens loos at public places. Never. There need to be about 4 times as many as there are for men. There's all sorts of stuff we need to do in there for which we need time and space. And we can't go round the back of the theatre and pee against a wall either.
clearly you don't believe in equality
No, on this issue I don't. Each according to his/her need. Try being pregnant, needing to pee every 10 mins and have to queue for 15 just to get to the bloody loo.
And it doesn't make commercial sense for the venues either. All that time spent queueing is time when women cannot be in the bars/shops spending money.
Yesterday at the British Museum the female loo queue was snaking up the stairs and round the Reading Room. I spent more time waiting to pee than I did looking at Rodin and the Greek sculptures. Time and money spent in shops: Zero.
Lol The British Museum is absolubtely humungous too. You'd have thought they would have proper toilet facilities.
The abstentionalist position is eternal and for ever but a united island of Ireland looks to now be on the horizon. Thanks to Brexit,a border poll seems inevitable.
Just nonsense
the abstensionist position also applied to the RoI then was changed the abstenstionist position also applied to Stormont then changed at some point it will change for Westminster as people get pissed of not being represented
as for a UI we have yet to see how the south will afford it and if there are enough people up north who want 30% cut in their living standard
NI is pluraliity catholic under the age of 35 consistently a large chunk of that community show no great urge for unification . In any event the fastest growing segment in NI is no religion which is impacting the sectarian headcount on both sides. No religion was 17% at the last census and growing.
As for Brexit and a border poll imo the two parties which always go to the brink and beyond ( NI and EU ) will simply come up with another fudge as they always do
Quote: In any event the fastest growing segment in NI is no religion which is impacting the sectarian headcount on both sides. No religion was 17% at the last census and growing. Unquote.
Ah, but are they Protestant no religionists or Catholic ones?
Yebbut they still asked a Community background (or Religion brought up in) question in 2011.
According to my calculations (which are sometimes correct!):
County Armagh 59% Catholic "community", 37% Protestant "community", 4% other or none Antrim 39%, 53%, 8% Down 31%, 60%, 8% Fermanagh 59%, 38%, 3% Londonderry 61%, 35%, 4% Tyrone 65%, 32%, 2%
Northern Ireland 45%, 48%, 7%
In 2011, the Republic also had a Census, allowing us to mention:
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago.
There are never enough womens loos at public places. Never. There need to be about 4 times as many as there are for men. There's all sorts of stuff we need to do in there for which we need time and space. And we can't go round the back of the theatre and pee against a wall either.
clearly you don't believe in equality
If there 4 times as many loos for women as men, there probably would be equality of queueing time, though unisex loos that are all cubicle would have the same effect.
LABOUR ACTIVISTS BRAND FIRST BAME HOME SECRETARY “COCONUT” AND “UNCLE TOM”
Sajid Javid’s appointment as the first BAME holder of a Great Office of State has been met with a torrent of vitriol from Labour activists, members, councillors and pro-Corbyn social media fanboys.
The tweets are absolutely disgusting and just leaves one in despair.
Well, yesterday I enraged a few on here by saying that I did not think prostitution was something to be encouraged.
So, today, I'm going to try enrage a few more and post my response to @NickPalmer (fpt) on transgender people on all-women shortlists.
This is what Mr P said:
"I know people on both sides of this argumenng I'm really qualified to judge, but I can see both sides. Regardless, though, it's the sort of issue that we should not be preoccupied with as the main opposition."
No. The common-sense position is to say that if someone has been diagnosed by a doctor and is taking steps to transition then they are transgender. If they are not doing so and still have all their male genitalia then they are a male and should not be on all-women shortlists or in women's loos and changing rooms.
A man claiming to "identify" as a woman without taking any actual steps to make that a reality and without any medical diagnosis of his condition and wanting to take the place of women is not a victim but a bully. And, frankly, women have had enough of men bullying them and telling them that they know best. Now we have some of them telling us what it is to be a woman. Well, they can fuck off, frankly.
People who are genuinely transgender deserve all necessary help and support. But too many of those claiming to be fighting for transgender rights seem to me to want "rights" on the basis of the flimsiest of evidence and at the expense of women. And there are too many who are too scared to call them out on this.
To me this shows a completely stupid and ridiculous over-compensation to make a vanishingly small group marginally happier at the cost of everyone else. Its self indulgent twaddle.
What on earth is the problem with gender neutral loos? Surely women should welcome this given the disparity at theatres especially in queue length when there are gendered loos?
As long as it is all cubicles, no problem, but mixing urinals and cubicles probably not.
Yes I can see that would be an issue.
Cubicles though seem a no-brainer and welcome for women as I (and @SandyRentool) noted.
My experience at my employer's head office and a conference centre in Stockholm was that all the cubicles were private and equipped with a toilet bowl and sink and so were all unisex. Makes sense to me.
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago.
There are never enough womens loos at public places. Never. There need to be about 4 times as many as there are for men. There's all sorts of stuff we need to do in there for which we need time and space. And we can't go round the back of the theatre and pee against a wall either.
clearly you don't believe in equality
If there 4 times as many loos for women as men, there probably would be equality of queueing time, though unisex loos that are all cubicle would have the same effect.
Re the Tories issue with the NHS being priced in, this is why I also can’t see this having an affect either: https://twitter.com/hackneyabbott/status/991272850953834497 Those who tend to rely on the NHS tend to be older voters who are hardcore Tories, if the NHS Winter crisis didn’t waver their support, this certainly won’t.
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago.
There are never enough womens loos at public places. Never. There need to be about 4 times as many as there are for men. There's all sorts of stuff we need to do in there for which we need time and space. And we can't go round the back of the theatre and pee against a wall either.
clearly you don't believe in equality
If there 4 times as many loos for women as men, there probably would be equality of queueing time, though unisex loos that are all cubicle would have the same effect.
no there wouldn't be
women would just take even longer as there would be no pressure to hurry up
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago.
There are never enough womens loos at public places. Never. There need to be about 4 times as many as there are for men. There's all sorts of stuff we need to do in there for which we need time and space. And we can't go round the back of the theatre and pee against a wall either.
clearly you don't believe in equality
No, on this issue I don't. Each according to his/her need. Try being pregnant, needing to pee every 10 mins and have to queue for 15 just to get to the bloody loo.
And it doesn't make commercial sense for the venues either. All that time spent queueing is time when women cannot be in the bars/shops spending money.
Yesterday at the British Museum the female loo queue was snaking up the stairs and round the Reading Room. I spent more time waiting to pee than I did looking at Rodin and the Greek sculptures. Time and money spent in shops: Zero.
Lol The British Museum is absolubtely humungous too. You'd have thought they would have proper toilet facilities.
Even in the members' area the toilet facilities are useless at the British Museum.
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago.
There are never enough womens loos at public places. Never. There need to be about 4 times as many as there are for men. There's all sorts of stuff we need to do in there for which we need time and space. And we can't go round the back of the theatre and pee against a wall either.
clearly you don't believe in equality
If there 4 times as many loos for women as men, there probably would be equality of queueing time, though unisex loos that are all cubicle would have the same effect.
LABOUR ACTIVISTS BRAND FIRST BAME HOME SECRETARY “COCONUT” AND “UNCLE TOM”
Sajid Javid’s appointment as the first BAME holder of a Great Office of State has been met with a torrent of vitriol from Labour activists, members, councillors and pro-Corbyn social media fanboys.
The tweets are absolutely disgusting and just leaves one in despair.
What is Corbyn going to do about it
Rubbish. It shows that Labour are a party of equal opportunity racist scum. Treating all minorities the same.
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago.
There are never enough womens loos at public places. Never. There need to be about 4 times as many as there are for men. There's all sorts of stuff we need to do in there for which we need time and space. And we can't go round the back of the theatre and pee against a wall either.
clearly you don't believe in equality
If there 4 times as many loos for women as men, there probably would be equality of queueing time, though unisex loos that are all cubicle would have the same effect.
When are urinals going to be phased out by ?
What's wrong with them?
Nothing - it is the implication of @Foxy last comment though equality of queueing time, though unisex loos that are all cubicle would have the same effect. Certainly one way to achieve gender equality
Re the Tories issue with the NHS being priced in, this is why I also can’t see this having an affect either: https://twitter.com/hackneyabbott/status/991272850953834497 Those who tend to rely on the NHS tend to be older voters who are hardcore Tories, if the NHS Winter crisis didn’t waver their support, this certainly won’t.
"A man claiming to "identify" as a woman without taking any actual steps to make that a reality and without any medical diagnosis of his condition and wanting to take the place of women is not a victim but a bully. And, frankly, women have had enough of men bullying them and telling them that they know best. Now we have some of them telling us what it is to be a woman. Well, they can fuck off, frankly."
I am see any evidence that more than a trivial number of these people exist.
All the people I know (admittedly only a handful) who consider themselves transgender have spent years and years establishing/coming to terms with that.
I am sure. But they usually do so with the help of doctors and others etc. There seem to be some - maybe a very few who are vocal - who are not doing this. I do not like the idea (or the proposal from the government) that someone can call themselves a woman without any sort of independent verification or medical diagnosis and, thereby, get access to women's changing rooms, hostels, loos etc. That seems to me to leave an obvious loophole for a man intent on malice to get access to women when they are vulnerable.
Unfortunately you would be considered transphobic by most of the modern left.
In good company with germaine Greer and Peter tatchell.
Their argument is different. To them, it doesn't matter if you go through a process, however long it takes - you still do not have the experience of a cisgender woman.
Please could you identify a"fake" transgender person who wants to use women's toilets but who should not be allowed to, because I can only assume a legal process is a question of "fake"/"real".
The dividing line should be a medical diagnosis and the start of treatment.
Not someone waking up one morning and deciding that they "identify" as a woman.
If I were to announce in 15 minutes time that I "identified" as a man it wouldn't make me a man (or, indeed, transgender) nor should it allow me to wander into men's loos at will or compete in the men's section of Wimbledon Tennis, for instance.
These people simply do not exist and there is no need to base a policy on them.
Re the Tories issue with the NHS being priced in, this is why I also can’t see this having an affect either: https://twitter.com/hackneyabbott/status/991272850953834497 Those who tend to rely on the NHS tend to be older voters who are hardcore Tories, if the NHS Winter crisis didn’t waver their support, this certainly won’t.
I cannot see any sense in this. TM is wrong
I also don’t agree with TMay’s stance on this. I doubt most members of the public will care though.
Re the Tories issue with the NHS being priced in, this is why I also can’t see this having an affect either: https://twitter.com/hackneyabbott/status/991272850953834497 Those who tend to rely on the NHS tend to be older voters who are hardcore Tories, if the NHS Winter crisis didn’t waver their support, this certainly won’t.
I cannot see any sense in this. TM is wrong
I also don’t agree with TMay’s stance on this. I doubt most members of the public will care though.
There are times when commonsense goes and this is one of them.
Ms. Apocalypse, the information I read was only about rate of incidence, not treatment.
There is, incidentally, a drive to pathologise a lot of quirks and to perhaps over-diagnose disorders generally. The classic example, of course, being kleptomania, invented when middle class Parisian women kept nicking stuff they could afford from newfangled department stores.
Made it to sunny Valencia, the flight was extremely bumpy along the way. Now 5 days of relaxation in the sun with my soon to be wife.
Life tip, never have a big wedding. It's the world's worst idea. Not only are people deciding things without our consent, we're going to end up paying for it all. We've come here to have a bit of calm before we go back and lay down the law. So far the total cost is coming in at £85k, which is, IMO way, way too much money being burned for one day of our lives.
Remember the golden rule: he who pays the gold makes the rules.
Made it to sunny Valencia, the flight was extremely bumpy along the way. Now 5 days of relaxation in the sun with my soon to be wife.
Life tip, never have a big wedding. It's the world's worst idea. Not only are people deciding things without our consent, we're going to end up paying for it all. We've come here to have a bit of calm before we go back and lay down the law. So far the total cost is coming in at £85k, which is, IMO way, way too much money being burned for one day of our lives.
That's 16k less than I sold my house for
From memory, we spent about £16k on our wedding (albeit nine years ago). For that we got an historic warship for the afternoon and evening, entertainment, good food, and a hundred or so friends and family from around the world. Oh, and we paid for a couple of friends to pay in their hotel because they were skint.
We've chatted about this since, and we can't work out any way we could have spent more money to get a better wedding. Then again, Mrs J couldn't even be bothered with flowers for the wedding, and we only got some when the venue insisted. The florist asked us:"Have you decided on a colour scheme for the wedding?" and Mrs J replied: "It's on a f'ing warship!"
Incidentally, £16k was about what it cost me to walk around the coast for a year, and was coincidentally about the same redundancy payment I got before the walk ...
Made it to sunny Valencia, the flight was extremely bumpy along the way. Now 5 days of relaxation in the sun with my soon to be wife.
Life tip, never have a big wedding. It's the world's worst idea. Not only are people deciding things without our consent, we're going to end up paying for it all. We've come here to have a bit of calm before we go back and lay down the law. So far the total cost is coming in at £85k, which is, IMO way, way too much money being burned for one day of our lives.
Remember the golden rule: he who pays the gold makes the rules.
There are cubicles in all the mens loos I use. And if you’re suggesting what I think you’re suggesting it wasn’t unknown in my student days, although very rare, for a young man and a young woman to go into the same cubicle. As I am assured also happens on aeroplanes, although given the space in most that I’ve travelled on.....
Ahhh, the mile high club.
Now, have you heard of the half mile high club?
It's like the mile high club, but with half the number of people.
There are cubicles in all the mens loos I use. And if you’re suggesting what I think you’re suggesting it wasn’t unknown in my student days, although very rare, for a young man and a young woman to go into the same cubicle. As I am assured also happens on aeroplanes, although given the space in most that I’ve travelled on.....
Ahhh, the mile high club.
Now, have you heard of the half mile high club?
It's like the mile high club, but with half the number of people.
Ms. Apocalypse, the information I read was only about rate of incidence, not treatment.
There is, incidentally, a drive to pathologise a lot of quirks and to perhaps over-diagnose disorders generally. The classic example, of course, being kleptomania, invented when middle class Parisian women kept nicking stuff they could afford from newfangled department stores.
Perceptions as to the availability/affordability of treatment are highly likely to affect incidence stats, because why bother to get diagnosed if you don't think you are going to be effectively treated?
Having talked to many friends about their weddings, I reckon the key to a cheap and happy wedding is:
1) Keep family and friends out of the key arrangements. Do what the two of you want, not what other people want you to do. 2) Never, every buy a wedding magazine. That way madness lies.
Thanks Harry. One point to note: we're nearly a year into the Parliamentary term and this is the first by-election, and it's not in a seat that will affect the government's ability to make laws. Anyone still thinking that the government is going to collapse through attrition should take note.
Having talked to many friends about their weddings, I reckon the key to a cheap and happy wedding is:
1) Keep family and friends out of the key arrangements. Do what the two of you want, not what other people want you to do. 2) Never, every buy a wedding magazine. That way madness lies.
3) the two people getting married should ideally be in love?
OT. cyclefree. Thanks for your interesting comment on my cafe owner friend. You're more compassionate than the average PBer. Out of interest one piece of information that I didn't know when I wrote that letter is that he had produced a work permit but it was a fake. One readily available on the internet apparently and whether because it was convincing or he was too inexperienced to know the difference I don't know but £15,000 is a big price to pay for a very honest mistake.
That all makes sense, Roger, but what I can't get my head round is that you blame the Conservatives for this. Do you not know that these rules and penalties were introduced by the last Labour government? The selectivity of your indignation is a wonder to behold.
Richard. That's true but from my research 1. The fines have trebled 2. The insidiousness of offering a lesser fine for information about other illegals is new.
Having talked to many friends about their weddings, I reckon the key to a cheap and happy wedding is:
1) Keep family and friends out of the key arrangements. Do what the two of you want, not what other people want you to do. 2) Never, every buy a wedding magazine. That way madness lies.
3) the two people getting married should ideally be in love?
Re the Tories issue with the NHS being priced in, this is why I also can’t see this having an affect either: https://twitter.com/hackneyabbott/status/991272850953834497 Those who tend to rely on the NHS tend to be older voters who are hardcore Tories, if the NHS Winter crisis didn’t waver their support, this certainly won’t.
I cannot see any sense in this. TM is wrong
She does seem to take some hard-nosed decisions, that actually actually she should be flexible on.
Made it to sunny Valencia, the flight was extremely bumpy along the way. Now 5 days of relaxation in the sun with my soon to be wife.
Life tip, never have a big wedding. It's the world's worst idea. Not only are people deciding things without our consent, we're going to end up paying for it all. We've come here to have a bit of calm before we go back and lay down the law. So far the total cost is coming in at £85k, which is, IMO way, way too much money being burned for one day of our lives.
That's 16k less than I sold my house for
From memory, we spent about £16k on our wedding (albeit nine years ago). For that we got an historic warship for the afternoon and evening, entertainment, good food, and a hundred or so friends and family from around the world. Oh, and we paid for a couple of friends to pay in their hotel because they were skint.
We've chatted about this since, and we can't work out any way we could have spent more money to get a better wedding. Then again, Mrs J couldn't even be bothered with flowers for the wedding, and we only got some when the venue insisted. The florist asked us:"Have you decided on a colour scheme for the wedding?" and Mrs J replied: "It's on a f'ing warship!"
Incidentally, £16k was about what it cost me to walk around the coast for a year, and was coincidentally about the same redundancy payment I got before the walk ...
Don’t know what my grandson and granddaughter-elect are paying, but it’s not in the stratorsphere. They’ve saved by having it on a Tuesday in next October’s half-term.... they’re both teachers and so are many of their friends. Lovely looking Tudor venue.
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago.
There are never enough womens loos at public places. Never. There need to be about 4 times as many as there are for men. There's all sorts of stuff we need to do in there for which we need time and space. And we can't go round the back of the theatre and pee against a wall either.
clearly you don't believe in equality
No, on this issue I don't. Each according to his/her need. Try being pregnant, needing to pee every 10 mins and have to queue for 15 just to get to the bloody loo.
And it doesn't make commercial sense for the venues either. All that time spent queueing is time when women cannot be in the bars/shops spending money.
Yesterday at the British Museum the female loo queue was snaking up the stairs and round the Reading Room. I spent more time waiting to pee than I did looking at Rodin and the Greek sculptures. Time and money spent in shops: Zero.
Lol The British Museum is absolubtely humungous too. You'd have thought they would have proper toilet facilities.
Made it to sunny Valencia, the flight was extremely bumpy along the way. Now 5 days of relaxation in the sun with my soon to be wife.
Life tip, never have a big wedding. It's the world's worst idea. Not only are people deciding things without our consent, we're going to end up paying for it all. We've come here to have a bit of calm before we go back and lay down the law. So far the total cost is coming in at £85k, which is, IMO way, way too much money being burned for one day of our lives.
That's 16k less than I sold my house for
From memory, we spent about £16k on our wedding (albeit nine years ago). For that we got an historic warship for the afternoon and evening, entertainment, good food, and a hundred or so friends and family from around the world. Oh, and we paid for a couple of friends to pay in their hotel because they were skint.
We've chatted about this since, and we can't work out any way we could have spent more money to get a better wedding. Then again, Mrs J couldn't even be bothered with flowers for the wedding, and we only got some when the venue insisted. The florist asked us:"Have you decided on a colour scheme for the wedding?" and Mrs J replied: "It's on a f'ing warship!"
Incidentally, £16k was about what it cost me to walk around the coast for a year, and was coincidentally about the same redundancy payment I got before the walk ...
I tend to find that the enjoyment of a wedding is inversely proportionate to the planning (and probably expenditure) that has been applied... finding themed tables with customised bags of sweets wrapped in pictures of the couples first holiday together was a particular low point... ceremony followed by a piss up at a pub with a good juke box and great speeches works for me...
There are cubicles in all the mens loos I use. And if you’re suggesting what I think you’re suggesting it wasn’t unknown in my student days, although very rare, for a young man and a young woman to go into the same cubicle. As I am assured also happens on aeroplanes, although given the space in most that I’ve travelled on.....
Ahhh, the mile high club.
Now, have you heard of the half mile high club?
It's like the mile high club, but with half the number of people.
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago.
There are never enough womens loos at public places. Never. There need to be about 4 times as many as there are for men. There's all sorts of stuff we need to do in there for which we need time and space. And we can't go round the back of the theatre and pee against a wall either.
clearly you don't believe in equality
No, on this issue I don't. Each according to his/her need. Try being pregnant, needing to pee every 10 mins and have to queue for 15 just to get to the bloody loo.
And it doesn't make commercial sense for the venues either. All that time spent queueing is time when women cannot be in the bars/shops spending money.
Yesterday at the British Museum the female loo queue was snaking up the stairs and round the Reading Room. I spent more time waiting to pee than I did looking at Rodin and the Greek sculptures. Time and money spent in shops: Zero.
Lol The British Museum is absolubtely humungous too. You'd have thought they would have proper toilet facilities.
The world's largest stolen goods warehouse?
(only kidding!!!)
If you took out all the culturally appropriated items there the toilets would be pretty much all that was left. Unless it turns out we nicked the idea from the Chinese.
LABOUR ACTIVISTS BRAND FIRST BAME HOME SECRETARY “COCONUT” AND “UNCLE TOM”
Sajid Javid’s appointment as the first BAME holder of a Great Office of State has been met with a torrent of vitriol from Labour activists, members, councillors and pro-Corbyn social media fanboys.
The tweets are absolutely disgusting and just leaves one in despair.
Made it to sunny Valencia, the flight was extremely bumpy along the way. Now 5 days of relaxation in the sun with my soon to be wife.
Life tip, never have a big wedding. It's the world's worst idea. Not only are people deciding things without our consent, we're going to end up paying for it all. We've come here to have a bit of calm before we go back and lay down the law. So far the total cost is coming in at £85k, which is, IMO way, way too much money being burned for one day of our lives.
Remember the golden rule: he who pays the gold makes the rules.
Yes, as I said we're going to lay down the law when we go to London on Saturday. The issue is that the wedding will be there and we aren't so all these people are making decisions, but since nothing is paid for except the venue deposit it can all be cancelled.
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago.
There are never enough womens loos at public places. Never. There need to be about 4 times as many as there are for men. There's all sorts of stuff we need to do in there for which we need time and space. And we can't go round the back of the theatre and pee against a wall either.
clearly you don't believe in equality
No, on this issue I don't. Each according to his/her need. Try being pregnant, needing to pee every 10 mins and have to queue for 15 just to get to the bloody loo.
And it doesn't make commercial sense for the venues either. All that time spent queueing is time when women cannot be in the bars/shops spending money.
Yesterday at the British Museum the female loo queue was snaking up the stairs and round the Reading Room. I spent more time waiting to pee than I did looking at Rodin and the Greek sculptures. Time and money spent in shops: Zero.
Lol The British Museum is absolubtely humungous too. You'd have thought they would have proper toilet facilities.
The world's largest stolen goods warehouse?
(only kidding!!!)
If you took out all the culturally appropriated items there the toilets would be pretty much all that was left. Unless it turns out we nicked the idea from the Chinese.
Thank God we did nick/buy/haggle them. The fantastic Assyrian collection, for example, would have been completed destroyed if it had been left in the Mosul area, and very badly looted if it had put in Gertrude Bell's museum in Baghdad.
As it happens, I'm going to a wedding on Thursday in Northern Ireland. If I'm posting on Thursday evening (or Friday morning, in all probability), expect even less sense than usual.
Made it to sunny Valencia, the flight was extremely bumpy along the way. Now 5 days of relaxation in the sun with my soon to be wife.
Life tip, never have a big wedding. It's the world's worst idea. Not only are people deciding things without our consent, we're going to end up paying for it all. We've come here to have a bit of calm before we go back and lay down the law. So far the total cost is coming in at £85k, which is, IMO way, way too much money being burned for one day of our lives.
That's 16k less than I sold my house for
From memory, we spent about £16k on our wedding (albeit nine years ago). For that we got an historic warship for the afternoon and evening, entertainment, good food, and a hundred or so friends and family from around the world. Oh, and we paid for a couple of friends to pay in their hotel because they were skint.
We've chatted about this since, and we can't work out any way we could have spent more money to get a better wedding. Then again, Mrs J couldn't even be bothered with flowers for the wedding, and we only got some when the venue insisted. The florist asked us:"Have you decided on a colour scheme for the wedding?" and Mrs J replied: "It's on a f'ing warship!"
Incidentally, £16k was about what it cost me to walk around the coast for a year, and was coincidentally about the same redundancy payment I got before the walk ...
I tend to find that the enjoyment of a wedding is inversely proportionate to the planning (and probably expenditure) that has been applied... finding themed tables with customised bags of sweets wrapped in pictures of the couples first holiday together was a particular low point... ceremony followed by a piss up at a pub with a good juke box and great speeches works for me...
In our case, we got married quite late, which meant we had both been to many, many weddings. I'd been to scores of church weddings, and sadly the memories had sort of merged into one. Since neither of us are religious, a church wedding seemed wrong. We also wanted something that would be memorable for everyone, and so we chose HMS Warrior in Portsmouth harbour. It was a great choice.
Made it to sunny Valencia, the flight was extremely bumpy along the way. Now 5 days of relaxation in the sun with my soon to be wife.
Life tip, never have a big wedding. It's the world's worst idea. Not only are people deciding things without our consent, we're going to end up paying for it all. We've come here to have a bit of calm before we go back and lay down the law. So far the total cost is coming in at £85k, which is, IMO way, way too much money being burned for one day of our lives.
Remember the golden rule: he who pays the gold makes the rules.
Yes, as I said we're going to lay down the law when we go to London on Saturday. The issue is that the wedding will be there and we aren't so all these people are making decisions, but since nothing is paid for except the venue deposit it can all be cancelled.
London Eye? Arsenal Football Club? Chelsea Town Hall? Kensington Roof Gardens?
“Christopher Chandler has never been associated directly or indirectly with Russian intelligence or the Russian state. Neither Christopher Chandler nor anyone at Legatum is aware of any such alleged “investigation” by French authorities, not 16 years ago or at any time since. To be clear Christopher Chandler has never been approached at any time by the French or any other authorities regarding Russia and maintains a sterling record of ethical business practices earned over many decades. These accusations are complete nonsense, and have been previously rebutted by the Legatum Group
As it happens, I'm going to a wedding on Thursday in Northern Ireland. If I'm posting on Thursday evening (or Friday morning, in all probability), expect even less sense than usual.
Having talked to many friends about their weddings, I reckon the key to a cheap and happy wedding is:
1) Keep family and friends out of the key arrangements. Do what the two of you want, not what other people want you to do. 2) Never, every buy a wedding magazine. That way madness lies.
In our case the secret was, well it was a secret - we got married and then told everyone the next day.
“Christopher Chandler has never been associated directly or indirectly with Russian intelligence or the Russian state. Neither Christopher Chandler nor anyone at Legatum is aware of any such alleged “investigation” by French authorities, not 16 years ago or at any time since. To be clear Christopher Chandler has never been approached at any time by the French or any other authorities regarding Russia and maintains a sterling record of ethical business practices earned over many decades. These accusations are complete nonsense, and have been previously rebutted by the Legatum Group
I think they should have gone the FO not confirming not denying, or better yet say nothing. Actually saying he's never been associated with the Russians reminds me of that great lecture by the US lawyer about why you should never talk to the police...
As it happens, I'm going to a wedding on Thursday in Northern Ireland. If I'm posting on Thursday evening (or Friday morning, in all probability), expect even less sense than usual.
As it happens, I'm going to a wedding on Thursday in Northern Ireland. If I'm posting on Thursday evening (or Friday morning, in all probability), expect even less sense than usual.
Won't that wedding last until Sunday anyway?
After Thursday evening I doubt I'll be in a position to know.
Re the Tories issue with the NHS being priced in, this is why I also can’t see this having an affect either: https://twitter.com/hackneyabbott/status/991272850953834497 Those who tend to rely on the NHS tend to be older voters who are hardcore Tories, if the NHS Winter crisis didn’t waver their support, this certainly won’t.
I cannot see any sense in this. TM is wrong
I also don’t agree with TMay’s stance on this. I doubt most members of the public will care though.
I've seen women brazenly walk into men's toilets lots of times in order to avoid the long queues at the female facilities. One example was at the NEC about five years ago.
There are never enough womens loos at public places. Never. There need to be about 4 times as many as there are for men. There's all sorts of stuff we need to do in there for which we need time and space. And we can't go round the back of the theatre and pee against a wall either.
Not easily, at any rate.
It is one of those things where you wonder why it is such a seemingly persistent issue - so many places the loos are of equal floorspace, is it so hard to just set aside more room for the ladies' room so they can fit more in? Apparently so.
On the toilet issue, there is another scenario: Offices with equal provision that are then occupied by engineering companies with an 80% male workforce.
Made it to sunny Valencia, the flight was extremely bumpy along the way. Now 5 days of relaxation in the sun with my soon to be wife.
Life tip, never have a big wedding. It's the world's worst idea. Not only are people deciding things without our consent, we're going to end up paying for it all. We've come here to have a bit of calm before we go back and lay down the law. So far the total cost is coming in at £85k, which is, IMO way, way too much money being burned for one day of our lives.
That's 16k less than I sold my house for
From memory, we spent about £16k on our wedding (albeit nine years ago). For that we got an historic warship for the afternoon and evening, entertainment, good food, and a hundred or so friends and family from around the world. Oh, and we paid for a couple of friends to pay in their hotel because they were skint.
We've chatted about this since, and we can't work out any way we could have spent more money to get a better wedding. Then again, Mrs J couldn't even be bothered with flowers for the wedding, and we only got some when the venue insisted. The florist asked us:"Have you decided on a colour scheme for the wedding?" and Mrs J replied: "It's on a f'ing warship!"
Incidentally, £16k was about what it cost me to walk around the coast for a year, and was coincidentally about the same redundancy payment I got before the walk ...
Less than £500 in our case covering dinner for the family, dancing and an evening party. It needs you to do a lot of the work yourself. Everyone thoroughly enjoyed themselves and we're still happily married!
Made it to sunny Valencia, the flight was extremely bumpy along the way. Now 5 days of relaxation in the sun with my soon to be wife.
Life tip, never have a big wedding. It's the world's worst idea. Not only are people deciding things without our consent, we're going to end up paying for it all. We've come here to have a bit of calm before we go back and lay down the law. So far the total cost is coming in at £85k, which is, IMO way, way too much money being burned for one day of our lives.
That's 16k less than I sold my house for
From memory, we spent about £16k on our wedding (albeit nine years ago). For that we got an historic warship for the afternoon and evening, entertainment, good food, and a hundred or so friends and family from around the world. Oh, and we paid for a couple of friends to pay in their hotel because they were skint.
We've chatted about this since, and we can't work out any way we could have spent more money to get a better wedding. Then again, Mrs J couldn't even be bothered with flowers for the wedding, and we only got some when the venue insisted. The florist asked us:"Have you decided on a colour scheme for the wedding?" and Mrs J replied: "It's on a f'ing warship!"
Incidentally, £16k was about what it cost me to walk around the coast for a year, and was coincidentally about the same redundancy payment I got before the walk ...
Less than £500 in our case covering dinner for the family, dancing and an evening party. It needs you to do a lot of the work yourself. Everyone thoroughly enjoyed themselves and we're still happily married!
Made it to sunny Valencia, the flight was extremely bumpy along the way. Now 5 days of relaxation in the sun with my soon to be wife.
Life tip, never have a big wedding. It's the world's worst idea. Not only are people deciding things without our consent, we're going to end up paying for it all. We've come here to have a bit of calm before we go back and lay down the law. So far the total cost is coming in at £85k, which is, IMO way, way too much money being burned for one day of our lives.
That's 16k less than I sold my house for
From memory, we spent about £16k on our wedding (albeit nine years ago). For that we got an historic warship for the afternoon and evening, entertainment, good food, and a hundred or so friends and family from around the world. Oh, and we paid for a couple of friends to pay in their hotel because they were skint.
We've chatted about this since, and we can't work out any way we could have spent more money to get a better wedding. Then again, Mrs J couldn't even be bothered with flowers for the wedding, and we only got some when the venue insisted. The florist asked us:"Have you decided on a colour scheme for the wedding?" and Mrs J replied: "It's on a f'ing warship!"
Incidentally, £16k was about what it cost me to walk around the coast for a year, and was coincidentally about the same redundancy payment I got before the walk ...
Less than £500 in our case covering dinner for the family, dancing and an evening party. It needs you to do a lot of the work yourself. Everyone thoroughly enjoyed themselves and we're still happily married!
Good on you.
Getting married in a few weeks time, managing to keep it under £7,500. 60 guests at reception a further 50 in the evening... Took some doing to keep it at that price. Second time round for both of us..
Made it to sunny Valencia, the flight was extremely bumpy along the way. Now 5 days of relaxation in the sun with my soon to be wife.
Life tip, never have a big wedding. It's the world's worst idea. Not only are people deciding things without our consent, we're going to end up paying for it all. We've come here to have a bit of calm before we go back and lay down the law. So far the total cost is coming in at £85k, which is, IMO way, way too much money being burned for one day of our lives.
That's 16k less than I sold my house for
From memory, we spent about £16k on our wedding (albeit nine years ago). For that we got an historic warship for the afternoon and evening, entertainment, good food, and a hundred or so friends and family from around the world. Oh, and we paid for a couple of friends to pay in their hotel because they were skint.
We've chatted about this since, and we can't work out any way we could have spent more money to get a better wedding. Then again, Mrs J couldn't even be bothered with flowers for the wedding, and we only got some when the venue insisted. The florist asked us:"Have you decided on a colour scheme for the wedding?" and Mrs J replied: "It's on a f'ing warship!"
Incidentally, £16k was about what it cost me to walk around the coast for a year, and was coincidentally about the same redundancy payment I got before the walk ...
Less than £500 in our case covering dinner for the family, dancing and an evening party. It needs you to do a lot of the work yourself. Everyone thoroughly enjoyed themselves and we're still happily married!
LABOUR ACTIVISTS BRAND FIRST BAME HOME SECRETARY “COCONUT” AND “UNCLE TOM”
Sajid Javid’s appointment as the first BAME holder of a Great Office of State has been met with a torrent of vitriol from Labour activists, members, councillors and pro-Corbyn social media fanboys.
The tweets are absolutely disgusting and just leaves one in despair.
What is Corbyn going to do about it
Big shrug.....
Calling someone a Coconut meets the level necessary for a criminal conviction (rightly or wrongly). It is extremely offensive for what lies underneath it.
On the toilet issue, there is another scenario: Offices with equal provision that are then occupied by engineering companies with an 80% male workforce.
A techie and toilet related anecdote I heard recently: an acquaintance of mine got a contracting job at a startup. On his first day, the company boss gave a ten-minute talk to the entire company about the proper use of the toilet.
It was, shall we say, an interesting introduction to the company ...
OT. cyclefree. Thanks for your interesting comment on my cafe owner friend. You're more compassionate than the average PBer. Out of interest one piece of information that I didn't know when I wrote that letter is that he had produced a work permit but it was a fake. One readily available on the internet apparently and whether because it was convincing or he was too inexperienced to know the difference I don't know but £15,000 is a big price to pay for a very honest mistake.
That all makes sense, Roger, but what I can't get my head round is that you blame the Conservatives for this. Do you not know that these rules and penalties were introduced by the last Labour government? The selectivity of your indignation is a wonder to behold.
Richard. That's true but from my research 1. The fines have trebled 2. The insidiousness of offering a lesser fine for information about other illegals is new.
Isnt that just the difference between a whore and an escort? The price? Semantics.
Comments
If these polls are accurate it is amazing that despite 24/7 media broadcast attacks on all things government and Brexit the Country is not listening to them
Outside their riduculous London bubble real people are disgusted by Windrush but are content to see it dealt with fairly, but Abbott and others in labour lining up against deportations of illegal immigrants and giving every impression they would open the borders to one and all is very damaging to labour
Enjoy Valencia.
As I am assured also happens on aeroplanes, although given the space in most that I’ve travelled on.....
Generally they're following the guy in to have a quick snort.
This is back in the day when I was young enough to go clubbing.
https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/theresa-may-facing-parliamentary-ambush-to-force-publication-of-windrush-documents-labour-opposition-day_uk_5ae87689e4b02baed1be3433?x2p
Both the opposition and the government have been rightly criticised in recent months - for Windrush and antisemitism and several people on this site called it that it wouldn’t really shift the polls (ICM is showing pretty much MOE movements and we’ve seen small Tory leads of 1-3 points in polls since the start of the year). That is not a shock. Corbyn had some pretty bad headlines during the GE and that didn’t stop nearly 40% of people from voting for him either.
No one really cares about the process of Brexit, however if the stories surrounding free movement are true (cf Independent on Sunday) then long term that might cause issues. Labour despite having quite a different tone on immigration now to Miliband’s time have for years not been rated on being tough on immigration; that is priced in much like the Tories not being entirely trusted on the NHS is priced tbh. That’s why the Winter Crisis didn’t actually affect their VI.
@AndyJS yes, it’s in tweet form.
I think that once you transition you are a proper woman, albeit you've arrived at your destination in an unusual way. So if that is what she's saying I think she's wrong.
But if what she's saying is that you don't have the same experiences as a woman who was born and grew up as a woman, then she's absolutely right. You do not know what it is like to be a girl child or a girl teenager or a young woman working in a male environment, for instance, if you become a woman later in life. Your life experience is necessarily different and your knowledge of female experience is very different to that of women born as such. That to me is self-evident. It doesn't make your experience worse; it's just different in the same way that a woman cannot know what it is like to suffer from dysmorphia.
Why this should be controversial and lead to attacks on her, stopping her from speaking and all the rest of it I don't know. The level of intolerance from people who don't want to hear something they disagree with is quite frightening.
I do wonder whether a man who transitions into a woman retains some of his/her male attributes i.e. a level of self-belief/being used to being listened to/even arrogance etc. If so, that may also make their experience - even as a transgender woman - different to many women.
Where does it end?
And it doesn't make commercial sense for the venues either. All that time spent queueing is time when women cannot be in the bars/shops spending money.
Yesterday at the British Museum the female loo queue was snaking up the stairs and round the Reading Room. I spent more time waiting to pee than I did looking at Rodin and the Greek sculptures. Time and money spent in shops: Zero.
According to my calculations (which are sometimes correct!):
County Armagh 59% Catholic "community", 37% Protestant "community", 4% other or none
Antrim 39%, 53%, 8%
Down 31%, 60%, 8%
Fermanagh 59%, 38%, 3%
Londonderry 61%, 35%, 4%
Tyrone 65%, 32%, 2%
Northern Ireland 45%, 48%, 7%
In 2011, the Republic also had a Census, allowing us to mention:
Cavan 85%, 7%, 8%
Donegal 85%, 7%, 6%
Monaghan 87%, 7%, 6%
Just for a bit of fun - remember, this just for a bit of fun! - all 9 Counties of Ulster:
51% Catholic "community", 43% Protestant "community", 7% other or none.
https://twitter.com/taylormaycan/status/991301541603799040
No wonder Brexiters are so angry these days.
Sajid Javid’s appointment as the first BAME holder of a Great Office of State has been met with a torrent of vitriol from Labour activists, members, councillors and pro-Corbyn social media fanboys.
The tweets are absolutely disgusting and just leaves one in despair.
What is Corbyn going to do about it
https://twitter.com/hackneyabbott/status/991272850953834497
Those who tend to rely on the NHS tend to be older voters who are hardcore Tories, if the NHS Winter crisis didn’t waver their support, this certainly won’t.
women would just take even longer as there would be no pressure to hurry up
the retail sector would just collapse
https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/tory-candidate-suspended-dudley_uk_5ae824eee4b055fd7fcf32b8
Certainly one way to achieve gender equality
I will call TM out when I believe she is wrong
There is, incidentally, a drive to pathologise a lot of quirks and to perhaps over-diagnose disorders generally. The classic example, of course, being kleptomania, invented when middle class Parisian women kept nicking stuff they could afford from newfangled department stores.
https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2016/apr/07/loneliest-city-in-world
We've chatted about this since, and we can't work out any way we could have spent more money to get a better wedding. Then again, Mrs J couldn't even be bothered with flowers for the wedding, and we only got some when the venue insisted. The florist asked us:"Have you decided on a colour scheme for the wedding?" and Mrs J replied: "It's on a f'ing warship!"
Incidentally, £16k was about what it cost me to walk around the coast for a year, and was coincidentally about the same redundancy payment I got before the walk ...
Now, have you heard of the half mile high club?
It's like the mile high club, but with half the number of people.
1) Keep family and friends out of the key arrangements. Do what the two of you want, not what other people want you to do.
2) Never, every buy a wedding magazine. That way madness lies.
She does seem to take some hard-nosed decisions, that actually actually she should be flexible on.
(only kidding!!!)
https://twitter.com/dpjhodges/status/991339995536547840?s=21
https://twitter.com/patrickwintour/status/991340635817947137?s=21
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-sussex-43965393
“Christopher Chandler has never been associated directly or indirectly with Russian intelligence or the Russian state. Neither Christopher Chandler nor anyone at Legatum is aware of any such alleged “investigation” by French authorities, not 16 years ago or at any time since. To be clear Christopher Chandler has never been approached at any time by the French or any other authorities regarding Russia and maintains a sterling record of ethical business practices earned over many decades. These accusations are complete nonsense, and have been previously rebutted by the Legatum Group
https://www.legatum.com/news/legatum-group-response-to-the-sunday-times-article-3rd-december-2017/
It is one of those things where you wonder why it is such a seemingly persistent issue - so many places the loos are of equal floorspace, is it so hard to just set aside more room for the ladies' room so they can fit more in? Apparently so.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-12685953
It was, shall we say, an interesting introduction to the company ...
Semantics.