Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » This looks like a spectacular bust up between the SNP and the

SystemSystem Posts: 6,389
edited June 13 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » This looks like a spectacular bust up between the SNP and the Speaker but it does look staged

WATCH: SNP leader @IanBlackfordMP gets thrown out of the Commons and his MPs follow pic.twitter.com/1sgWkJOCsH

Read the full story here


«1345

Comments

  • RobDRobD Posts: 34,017
    Their outrage was literally scripted!
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 45,566
    Any markets on Qatar not hosting the 2022 World Cup?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 69,033
    It is the final tweet that makes this thread so brilliant.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 19,319
    edited June 13
    Scott_P said:
    She probably doesn't need their votes now.

    The SNP have chosen a nifty way of supporting the government whilst appearing to oppose it. I presume it's a dry run for any No Confidence vote.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 69,033

    Scott_P said:
    They probably don't need their votes now.

    The SNP have chosen a nifty way of supporting the government whilst appearing to oppose them. I presume it's a dry run for any No Confidence vote.
    Only Ian Blackford has been expelled for today.

    The rest of the SNP delegation can still vote today.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 21,402
    Of course it's staged. The SNP do have a serious point here though.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 19,319

    Scott_P said:
    They probably don't need their votes now.

    The SNP have chosen a nifty way of supporting the government whilst appearing to oppose them. I presume it's a dry run for any No Confidence vote.
    Only Ian Blackford has been expelled for today.

    The rest of the SNP delegation can still vote today.
    Yes, but will they?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 46,183
    Have the SNP effectively Sinn Feined themselves on today's crucial votes. If so what a coup for the Gov't !
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 46,183

    Scott_P said:
    They probably don't need their votes now.

    The SNP have chosen a nifty way of supporting the government whilst appearing to oppose them. I presume it's a dry run for any No Confidence vote.
    Only Ian Blackford has been expelled for today.

    The rest of the SNP delegation can still vote today.
    But will they >
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 15,569

    Scott_P said:
    She probably doesn't need their votes now.

    The SNP have chosen a nifty way of supporting the government whilst appearing to oppose it. I presume it's a dry run for any No Confidence vote.
    Yes, if the SNP aren't coming back to the chamber today then the vote will be easily won by the government. If the SNP do a Sinn Fein then the Pro-EU lot have lost all of their power. :D
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 19,989

    Any markets on Qatar not hosting the 2022 World Cup?

    Sadly not that I can find, and have been looking for a while. Qatar is in real trouble to get ready, a lot of which can’t be resolved by throwing money at the problem.
  • PeterMannionPeterMannion Posts: 287
    #SNPgammon
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 30,271
    Why were the SNP pulling this stunt?
  • MarkHopkinsMarkHopkins Posts: 5,487
    edited June 13
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 19,989
    If the whole SNP delegation look like taking the day off, I wonder what ancient Parliamentary processes could be used by the Conservative ERG members to advance their cause..?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 30,271
    An England fan has told police he was robbed and attacked by five local men in Moscow on Monday.

    It follows claims a French gay man and a companion suffered serious injuries on Saturday after being beaten by two men who gave them a lift in St Petersburg.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5839293/England-fan-robbed-beaten-Moscow-gay-French-fan-left-disabled-homophobic-attack.html
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 14,887
    Just when you think political events can't get any stranger, we have a key opposition bloc absenting itself from the chamber on what seems to be a misguided premise, and in so doing, missing a critical opportunity to give the government a bloody nose.

    I think for each parliamentary session in future we will need a "Previously in the House of Commons..." prologue.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 46,183

    Why were the SNP pulling this stunt?

    Same reason Skinner does - to get on the TV.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 19,319

    Why were the SNP pulling this stunt?

    Grievance harvesting, of course.
  • AnazinaAnazina Posts: 2,314
    Australia doing their best to convert this day/night match into a mid-afternoon match.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 45,566
    Mr. Sandpit, cheers. Any thoughts on more serious implications for Qatar of the blockade?
  • MarkHopkinsMarkHopkins Posts: 5,487

    BTW what does asking for the House to sit in private actually mean?

  • JohnOJohnO Posts: 3,255


    BTW what does asking for the House to sit in private actually mean?

    No public, no press.
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 6,363
    MaxPB said:

    Scott_P said:
    She probably doesn't need their votes now.

    The SNP have chosen a nifty way of supporting the government whilst appearing to oppose it. I presume it's a dry run for any No Confidence vote.
    Yes, if the SNP aren't coming back to the chamber today then the vote will be easily won by the government. If the SNP do a Sinn Fein then the Pro-EU lot have lost all of their power. :D
    Are there any grown ups left in the Palace of Westminster?

    The place is in danger of looking utterly out of control and ungovernable/unmanagble.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 34,017


    BTW what does asking for the House to sit in private actually mean?

    No TV, no Hansard.
  • MarkHopkinsMarkHopkins Posts: 5,487
    JohnO said:


    BTW what does asking for the House to sit in private actually mean?

    No public, no press.
    RobD said:


    BTW what does asking for the House to sit in private actually mean?

    No TV, no Hansard.

    So what's the point of asking for that here?

    (Other than to just be annoying).

  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 45,566
    Mr. Pulpstar, whilst not remotely my sort of game, throwing down $100m right off the bat as prize money is pretty impressive.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 22,192
    edited June 13
    Looks like the SNP haven't Sinn Feined themselves from the EU votes.

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 69,033
    malcolmg said:
    He’s a lawyer and academic.

    What’s your qualifications to critique his analysis?
  • sarissasarissa Posts: 441


    BTW what does asking for the House to sit in private actually mean?

    A Commons division to approve it would have been necessary. It would of course have been defeated and normal service resumed.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 19,989
    edited June 13

    Mr. Sandpit, cheers. Any thoughts on more serious implications for Qatar of the blockade?

    Another angle that might see Qatar in trouble, is if there’s a significant number of homophobic incidents in Russia. I imagine that the same sort of gay activists behind the cake prosecution in the UK might openly try and get arrested at the forthcoming World Cup, with the intention of targeting FIFA for not keeping them safe.

    The broader issues in Qatar are that their neighbours hate them, and their neighbours control the regional construction industry and supply of materials. Their local Qatari companies cannot attract either experienced Western managers, nor unskilled labour from Asia for a variety of reasons. Right now there’s a stadium and a half built, and a lot of empty building sites. Even if everything they planned gets built, they were relying heavily on their neighbours to handle a lot of the logistics and accommodation around the tournament itself. It could be that plane loads of England fans go from the airport, to the stadium, back to the airport for a 7 hour flight without spending a penny in Qatar. It’s a 7 hour flight.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 19,319

    Looks like the SNP haven't Sinn Feined themselves from the EU votes.

    Pah, they can't even stage a walkout properly, the wee timorous beasties.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 45,566
    Mr. P, to be fair, wetting oneself is a better outcome than being mauled to death.

    Mr. Sandpit, cheers. I do wonder if that situation will come to a head at some point.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 9,293
    @Scott_P - I think I can name four - I think I can see Brown hiding at the back.
  • OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 5,486
    Scott_P said:
    Sure I was only 7 at the time, but I can only pick out Robin Cook, which is nearly as embarrassing as peeing myself to repel a bear.
  • PolruanPolruan Posts: 1,449
    sarissa said:


    BTW what does asking for the House to sit in private actually mean?

    A Commons division to approve it would have been necessary. It would of course have been defeated and normal service resumed.
    IIRC it’s an archaic procedure where you cry “I spy strangers” and the gallery has to be cleared so that the House can vote in secret on whether to readmit the spectators. Not sure if it still works exactly like that but was used quite a bit as a deliberate spoiling/delaying tactic on private members’ bill days by David Maclean, Eric Forth and other backbenchers when Blair was PM. Basically a more entertaining form of filibuster.
  • OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 5,486

    Mr. P, to be fair, wetting oneself is a better outcome than being mauled to death.

    Mr. Sandpit, cheers. I do wonder if that situation will come to a head at some point.

    Two things. Once the bear has gone there's only your word that wetting yourself was an anti-bear strategy. And surely there are better ways to protect yourself from a bear?
  • RobDRobD Posts: 34,017

    JohnO said:


    BTW what does asking for the House to sit in private actually mean?

    No public, no press.
    RobD said:


    BTW what does asking for the House to sit in private actually mean?

    No TV, no Hansard.

    So what's the point of asking for that here?

    (Other than to just be annoying).

    That's a good question.
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 3,684
    Scott_P said:
    Is that George Robertson towards the back?
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 38,779
    tlg86 said:

    @Scott_P - I think I can name four - I think I can see Brown hiding at the back.

    I think I am at 4 also, not including Gordo

    A scary looking Alistair Darling if I am not mistaken
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 15,212
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 14,887
    sarissa said:


    BTW what does asking for the House to sit in private actually mean?

    A Commons division to approve it would have been necessary. It would of course have been defeated and normal service resumed.
    Interesting that you can hear Bercow say (in response presumably to his advisors sitting in front of him - who they btw?) "we'll have to have the vote".
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 38,779

    Is that George Robertson towards the back?

    yes, I think so.

    Donald Dewar
    John Smith
    Robin Cook
    Alistair Darling
    Gordon Brown
    George Robertson
  • PolruanPolruan Posts: 1,449

    Mr. P, to be fair, wetting oneself is a better outcome than being mauled to death.

    Mr. Sandpit, cheers. I do wonder if that situation will come to a head at some point.

    Two things. Once the bear has gone there's only your word that wetting yourself was an anti-bear strategy. And surely there are better ways to protect yourself from a bear?
    Also, we only hear from those for whom it worked: no scope to report back on failed self-protection wetting.
  • david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 14,584
    edited June 13

    Scott_P said:
    Sure I was only 7 at the time, but I can only pick out Robin Cook, which is nearly as embarrassing as peeing myself to repel a bear.
    Alastair Darling, top-left, I think, with a beard? (Though he looks photoshopped).

    John Smith, dead centre too.

    So that'd have been four without prompting, with Dewar. (I'd wouldn't have got Robertson without prompting and Brown is too well hidden).
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 9,313
    Scott_P said:
    A group photo of Conservative prime ministers felled by Europe?
  • VerulamiusVerulamius Posts: 817
    Scott_P said:

    Is that George Robertson towards the back?

    yes, I think so.

    Donald Dewar
    John Smith
    Robin Cook
    Alistair Darling
    Gordon Brown
    George Robertson
    Where is John Reid?
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 38,779

    Where is John Reid?

    Is he standing just in front of John Smith, with hair?
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 45,566
    Mr. Me, you should stand still and if it approaches, raise your hand so it can see your palm. If it doesn't wander off, raise your other palm. If it still seems aggressive, kick the person next to you in the groin and run away. With luck, the bear will be too busy eating your companion to chase you.

    If you have no companion, and the bear's aggressive, you're screwed unless you have a high powered rifle. They can run faster than a horse, swim, climb trees, have a better sense of smell than a dog, and even have impressive dexterity. And they're immensely strong.

    Bears are very impressive animals, but not one with which you want to fight.
  • david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 14,584

    Scott_P said:
    A group photo of Conservative prime ministers felled by Europe?
    You'd need the ghosts of Thatcher and, perhaps, Macmillan too.
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 9,313

    Scott_P said:
    A group photo of Conservative prime ministers felled by Europe?
    You'd need the ghosts of Thatcher and, perhaps, Macmillan too.
    Neville Chamberlain too.
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,250
    edited June 13
    Scott_P said:
    Worrying the PM called Major round,isn't he in the total remain in camp.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 6,616
    Scott_P said:
    Advice on writing a resignation speech?
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 38,779

    Worrying the PM called Major round,isn't he in the total remain camp.

    Apparently it was a fund raising photo op. Not Brexit related
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 9,953
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 14,887
    Scott_P said:

    Worrying the PM called Major round,isn't he in the total remain camp.

    Apparently it was a fund raising photo op. Not Brexit related
    Trying to scare up some of the £39bn exit bill?
  • OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 5,486

    If you have no companion, and the bear's aggressive, you're screwed unless you have a high powered rifle.

    A cousin had to learn to use a rifle as she does fieldwork in remote parts of Alaska. I don't think she's had to shoot a bear yet, though.
  • david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 14,584

    Scott_P said:
    A group photo of Conservative prime ministers felled by Europe?
    You'd need the ghosts of Thatcher and, perhaps, Macmillan too.
    Neville Chamberlain too.
    I did think about adding him but thought I'd then be opening up a can of 19th century worms as well and I don't know enough about, say, the 1880 election to remember how much of an issue Europe was (was that Midlothian or was Gladstone going on about Bulgarians, or both? etc)
  • brendan16brendan16 Posts: 1,292
    edited June 13
    WIll Anna Soubry ever suck it up and move on? She did of course get elected on a Tory manifesto that stated we would leave the single market and customs union. There is no reference to either the single market of the customs union in the GFA as far as I am aware?

    Maybe it's time she forced a by election so the people of Broxtowe can have a people's vote?!
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 887
    Scott_P said:
    I'll give you Dalyell of the West Lothian question at bottom right as we look.

    Is Reid grey haired and bespectacled between Smith and Darling?
  • david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 14,584
    brendan16 said:

    WIll Anna Soubry ever suck it up and move on? She did of course get elected on a Tory manifesto that stated we would leave the single market and customs union.

    Maybe it's time she forced a by election so the people of Broxtowe can have a people's vote?!
    Individual MPs can be elected on their own pledges, which may differ from national ones.

    In any case, the ballot question was Leave or Remain in the EU, not in the customs union.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 45,566
    Mr. Me, hopefully she'll never find herself in that situation.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 14,887
    Scott_P said:

    tlg86 said:

    @Scott_P - I think I can name four - I think I can see Brown hiding at the back.

    I think I am at 4 also, not including Gordo

    A scary looking Alistair Darling if I am not mistaken
    Russell Harty at the front?
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 5,083
    edited June 13
    TOPPING said:

    Scott_P said:

    tlg86 said:

    @Scott_P - I think I can name four - I think I can see Brown hiding at the back.

    I think I am at 4 also, not including Gordo

    A scary looking Alistair Darling if I am not mistaken
    Russell Harty at the front?
    Of Grace Jones fame? I think you might be right ;)
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 25,632

    brendan16 said:

    WIll Anna Soubry ever suck it up and move on? She did of course get elected on a Tory manifesto that stated we would leave the single market and customs union.

    Maybe it's time she forced a by election so the people of Broxtowe can have a people's vote?!
    Individual MPs can be elected on their own pledges, which may differ from national ones.

    In any case, the ballot question was Leave or Remain in the EU, not in the customs union.
    Leave campaigned heavily on the Customs Union. It was in all the literature I delivered and in social media. Leave.EU also campaigned on it, in their own special way. It’s certainly a big reason I voted Leave, and it was the basis on which all Conservative MPs were elected last year.

    That’s different to people remembering the principal reason why they cast their Leave vote of course, which came down to sovereignty (which includes ability to make trade deals), immigration control or more money for the NHS.

    My ears perk up whenever I read “it wasn’t on the ballot paper” because it’s usually an attempt at exploiting the fact voters only recall the reasoning for their vote at a high-level in order to interpret the mandate in a way that suits the author.
  • justin124justin124 Posts: 5,386
    I wonder what would be the impact of the SNP deciding to behave like this at every PMQs? Or indeed in the middle of every debate relating to Brexit simply to cause chaos on the floor of the House?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 25,632

    Scott_P said:
    Worrying the PM called Major round,isn't he in the total remain in camp.
    “How do I deal with Bastards, old and new?”
  • RobDRobD Posts: 34,017
    justin124 said:

    I wonder what would be the impact of the SNP deciding to behave like this at every PMQs? Or indeed in the middle of every debate relating to Brexit simply to cause chaos on the floor of the House?

    While exciting, it was only a couple of minutes before they were ejected.
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,250

    Scott_P said:
    Worrying the PM called Major round,isn't he in the total remain in camp.
    “How do I deal with Bastards, old and new?”
    Very good Mr Royale ;-)
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 25,632
    MaxPB said:

    Scott_P said:
    She probably doesn't need their votes now.

    The SNP have chosen a nifty way of supporting the government whilst appearing to oppose it. I presume it's a dry run for any No Confidence vote.
    Yes, if the SNP aren't coming back to the chamber today then the vote will be easily won by the government. If the SNP do a Sinn Fein then the Pro-EU lot have lost all of their power. :D
    It’s the hung parliament that gives the Europhile Tory rebels the most power.

    It May had got a majority of 40, 15-20 rebels on the EU side could have more or less been ignored. 70-80 in the ERG could not have been, and they would have had the power, so we’d be getting a cleaner and harder Brexit.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 25,632

    Scott_P said:
    A group photo of Conservative prime ministers felled by Europe?
    You'd need the ghosts of Thatcher and, perhaps, Macmillan too.
    Neville Chamberlain too.
    I did think about adding him but thought I'd then be opening up a can of 19th century worms as well and I don't know enough about, say, the 1880 election to remember how much of an issue Europe was (was that Midlothian or was Gladstone going on about Bulgarians, or both? etc)
    The Zulu War - and other failed imperial adventures by the Disraeli Government- were certainly an issue in that.
  • justin124justin124 Posts: 5,386
    RobD said:

    justin124 said:

    I wonder what would be the impact of the SNP deciding to behave like this at every PMQs? Or indeed in the middle of every debate relating to Brexit simply to cause chaos on the floor of the House?

    While exciting, it was only a couple of minutes before they were ejected.
    Indeed - but they could have pushed it further. Had the SNP Leader refused to leave when so ordered, the Speaker would have had to put a motion to the House and that could have taken almost half an hour. Then at the end of that Division a second SNP MP gets up to make the same point and the entire process has to be followed all over again. I recall one of Nigel Lawson's later Budget Speeches being disrupted in this way in the late 1980s when Alex Salmond and other SNP MPs forced such divisions in the middle of the Speech. 35 MPs could potentially cauise a lot of procedural mayhem - if sufficiently determined!
  • volcanopetevolcanopete Posts: 2,041
    brendan16 said:

    WIll Anna Soubry ever suck it up and move on? She did of course get elected on a Tory manifesto that stated we would leave the single market and customs union. There is no reference to either the single market of the customs union in the GFA as far as I am aware?

    Maybe it's time she forced a by election so the people of Broxtowe can have a people's vote?!
    deselection of MPs in the Tory party? Let's hope it receives as much attention as deselection of MPs in the Labour party.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 15,569
    Looks like Force India are wobbling badly. Could be a good opportunity for McLaren to get some fresh ideas from a team that does better than them with a third of the budget.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 34,017
    edited June 13
    justin124 said:

    RobD said:

    justin124 said:

    I wonder what would be the impact of the SNP deciding to behave like this at every PMQs? Or indeed in the middle of every debate relating to Brexit simply to cause chaos on the floor of the House?

    While exciting, it was only a couple of minutes before they were ejected.
    Indeed - but they could have pushed it further. Had the SNP Leader refused to leave when so ordered, the Speaker would have had to put a motion to the House and that could have taken almost half an hour. Then at the end of that Division a second SNP MP gets up to make the same point and the entire process has to be followed all over again. I recall one of Nigel Lawson's later Budget Speeches being disrupted in this way in the late 1980s when Alex Salmond and other SNP MPs forced such divisions in the middle of the Speech. 35 MPs could potentially cauise a lot of procedural mayhem - if sufficiently determined!
    Suspect that the vote would not require a division. The SNP members can only shout so hard.
  • david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 14,584

    brendan16 said:

    WIll Anna Soubry ever suck it up and move on? She did of course get elected on a Tory manifesto that stated we would leave the single market and customs union.

    Maybe it's time she forced a by election so the people of Broxtowe can have a people's vote?!
    Individual MPs can be elected on their own pledges, which may differ from national ones.

    In any case, the ballot question was Leave or Remain in the EU, not in the customs union.
    Leave campaigned heavily on the Customs Union. It was in all the literature I delivered and in social media. Leave.EU also campaigned on it, in their own special way. It’s certainly a big reason I voted Leave, and it was the basis on which all Conservative MPs were elected last year.

    That’s different to people remembering the principal reason why they cast their Leave vote of course, which came down to sovereignty (which includes ability to make trade deals), immigration control or more money for the NHS.

    My ears perk up whenever I read “it wasn’t on the ballot paper” because it’s usually an attempt at exploiting the fact voters only recall the reasoning for their vote at a high-level in order to interpret the mandate in a way that suits the author.
    Sure,and I wouldn't argue that to stay in the Single Market wouldn't be seen as a betrayal of the Leave result, because it'd mean remaining bound by so much of what the EU does. I'm not sure that's necessarily as true of the CU, where in any case it's looking pretty obvious that those promised trade deals are pretty illusory.

    However, on a purely factual basis, the instruction the electorate gave was to leave the EU. It's for MPs to interpret that instruction and then justify their decision.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 22,192

    MaxPB said:

    Scott_P said:
    She probably doesn't need their votes now.

    The SNP have chosen a nifty way of supporting the government whilst appearing to oppose it. I presume it's a dry run for any No Confidence vote.
    Yes, if the SNP aren't coming back to the chamber today then the vote will be easily won by the government. If the SNP do a Sinn Fein then the Pro-EU lot have lost all of their power. :D
    It’s the hung parliament that gives the Europhile Tory rebels the most power.

    It May had got a majority of 40, 15-20 rebels on the EU side could have more or less been ignored. 70-80 in the ERG could not have been, and they would have had the power, so we’d be getting a cleaner and harder Brexit.
    Do you think May would have used a larger majority to impose an Irish sea border? If not, a cleaner and harder Brexit doesn't exist.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 4,499

    MaxPB said:

    Scott_P said:
    She probably doesn't need their votes now.

    The SNP have chosen a nifty way of supporting the government whilst appearing to oppose it. I presume it's a dry run for any No Confidence vote.
    Yes, if the SNP aren't coming back to the chamber today then the vote will be easily won by the government. If the SNP do a Sinn Fein then the Pro-EU lot have lost all of their power. :D
    It’s the hung parliament that gives the Europhile Tory rebels the most power.

    It May had got a majority of 40, 15-20 rebels on the EU side could have more or less been ignored. 70-80 in the ERG could not have been, and they would have had the power, so we’d be getting a cleaner and harder Brexit.
    You're assuming the 70-80 in ERG are as rebellious as the 15-20 proEU rebels. I doubt that. The 15-20 are just the most committed, there must be well over 50 other Tory MPs who would like to see a soft-Brexit.
  • NotThatNickNotThatNick Posts: 9
    Anorak said:

    TOPPING said:

    Scott_P said:

    tlg86 said:

    @Scott_P - I think I can name four - I think I can see Brown hiding at the back.

    I think I am at 4 also, not including Gordo

    A scary looking Alistair Darling if I am not mistaken
    Russell Harty at the front?
    Of Grace Jones fame? I think you might be right ;)
    Isn't that a young Gavin Strang, not Russell Harty
  • justin124justin124 Posts: 5,386
    RobD said:

    justin124 said:

    RobD said:

    justin124 said:

    I wonder what would be the impact of the SNP deciding to behave like this at every PMQs? Or indeed in the middle of every debate relating to Brexit simply to cause chaos on the floor of the House?

    While exciting, it was only a couple of minutes before they were ejected.
    Indeed - but they could have pushed it further. Had the SNP Leader refused to leave when so ordered, the Speaker would have had to put a motion to the House and that could have taken almost half an hour. Then at the end of that Division a second SNP MP gets up to make the same point and the entire process has to be followed all over again. I recall one of Nigel Lawson's later Budget Speeches being disrupted in this way in the late 1980s when Alex Salmond and other SNP MPs forced such divisions in the middle of the Speech. 35 MPs could potentially cauise a lot of procedural mayhem - if sufficiently determined!
    Suspect that the vote would not require a division. The SNP members can only shout so hard.
    It would mean a Division.When Salmond and his colleagues did this in the middle of the Budget speech there were only a handful of SNP members.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 23,462
    Scott_P said:
    I think they're just following convention, and announcing their upcoming nuptuals first to the Prime Minister.
  • david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 14,584
    justin124 said:

    I wonder what would be the impact of the SNP deciding to behave like this at every PMQs? Or indeed in the middle of every debate relating to Brexit simply to cause chaos on the floor of the House?

    Procedures of the Commons would be revised. IIRC, many of the Commons' current procedures date from the time when the Irish nationalists tactically (ab)used the rules of the day to disrupt business to such an extent that it necessitated reform.

    Labour would likely go along with tightening the rules as parties that think they've a decent chance of winning are never that keen on protecting the rights of parliament to be awkward.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 19,989
    MaxPB said:

    Looks like Force India are wobbling badly. Could be a good opportunity for McLaren to get some fresh ideas from a team that does better than them with a third of the budget.

    Excellent Joe Saward blog about offtrack happenings in Canada. Lots of happenings.
    https://www.motorsportweek.com/joeblogsf1/id/00246
  • RobDRobD Posts: 34,017
    edited June 13
    justin124 said:

    RobD said:

    justin124 said:

    RobD said:

    justin124 said:

    I wonder what would be the impact of the SNP deciding to behave like this at every PMQs? Or indeed in the middle of every debate relating to Brexit simply to cause chaos on the floor of the House?

    While exciting, it was only a couple of minutes before they were ejected.
    Indeed - but they could have pushed it further. Had the SNP Leader refused to leave when so ordered, the Speaker would have had to put a motion to the House and that could have taken almost half an hour. Then at the end of that Division a second SNP MP gets up to make the same point and the entire process has to be followed all over again. I recall one of Nigel Lawson's later Budget Speeches being disrupted in this way in the late 1980s when Alex Salmond and other SNP MPs forced such divisions in the middle of the Speech. 35 MPs could potentially cauise a lot of procedural mayhem - if sufficiently determined!
    Suspect that the vote would not require a division. The SNP members can only shout so hard.
    It would mean a Division.When Salmond and his colleagues did this in the middle of the Budget speech there were only a handful of SNP members.
    I thought the Speaker could ask members to stand/sit to indicate their support? It would be obvious if a majority supported the motion. Anyway, after the first division, if there was one, I suspect there would be no appetite among other members for it to continue.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 21,402
    Scott_P said:
    It must have been pressing if Sir John was persuaded to miss the cricket.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 38,779

    Isn't that a young Gavin Strang, not Russell Harty

    Good shout
  • RobDRobD Posts: 34,017

    MaxPB said:

    Scott_P said:
    She probably doesn't need their votes now.

    The SNP have chosen a nifty way of supporting the government whilst appearing to oppose it. I presume it's a dry run for any No Confidence vote.
    Yes, if the SNP aren't coming back to the chamber today then the vote will be easily won by the government. If the SNP do a Sinn Fein then the Pro-EU lot have lost all of their power. :D
    It’s the hung parliament that gives the Europhile Tory rebels the most power.

    It May had got a majority of 40, 15-20 rebels on the EU side could have more or less been ignored. 70-80 in the ERG could not have been, and they would have had the power, so we’d be getting a cleaner and harder Brexit.
    Do you think May would have used a larger majority to impose an Irish sea border? If not, a cleaner and harder Brexit doesn't exist.
    The "cleanest" and "hardest" brexit would surely be WTO? The border wouldn't be in the Irish Sea.
This discussion has been closed.