That Boris statement must surely be a resignation statement if verified? In which case a confidence vote is very likely this week I would have thought
I am not at all sure that it will be necessary. I think TM will resign as well triggering a leadership campaign
I really hope so, because with TM Brexit does not mean Brexit, her red lines are not red at all, she is a remainer in leave clothing, she has to go, she has betrayed the democratic will of the British people
This actually makes leave much less likely and TM, to her credit, tried to agree a deal that would have a chance with the EU and the HOC. The end game will now be a Norway style deal or remain
I'd say no deal or remain.
The Tories are pretty fucked. Corbyn is laughing right now, he just has to watch them destroy any chance of winning the next election. His own inability to formuulate a policy on brexit doesn't even matter.
Even now Corbyn is nowhere near a majority either and his party is divided on far more than just Brexit
At this point, I’d expect May to weather the now surely inevitable no confidence vote later this week. A series of further Cabinet resignations tomorrow and she’s toast (and I’ll be buying the bubbly for TSE to ease the pain of Frankfurt).
The showdown was always going to take place at some point: I had thought early autumn more likely. I’m profoundly pessimistic about the party’s future. Perhaps holding the ultra critical Oxshott and Stoke D’Abernon by-election on Thursday will revive my spirits.
Perhaps the Tories must now split. A leadership contest will be held, and the supporters of the losing candidate won’t follow the new leader.
History doesn’t repeat, but it rhymes...
I expect that there will be a leadership contest. And I expect that the Party will unite around the new leader.
Why? There does not seem support across a majority for what the Rees Moggs of the world want either. Surely someone new takes over and the fight just begins again.
The party needs to split. It no longer has common cause on the fundamental issue of the day. If the sides cannot agree on a middle way, and they self evidently cannot, they should stop pretending.
Not really, there are probably about 20 remainer ultras, 20-30 remainer-lites (think May/Hammond), 50-60 Brexit-lite (think Javid) and another 60-80 Brexit-ultras. The rest are somewhere in between and biddable.
The point is the ultras on either side prevent anything from happening. The pretence that all of them can be made happy has led to the incompetent dithering and can kicking we have seen.
Until they tories fight this out they cannot move on. Whether enough is left to move on after the fight remains to be seen.
A leadership election will bridge a lot of the gap. If someone like Javid wins then he'll get the support of all groups except the remainer ultras, only around half of those will back whatever vision of brexit he has. The rest won't be happy unless they've undone the public vote, I wouldn't mind dumping them and running a minority.
There really isn’t time to have a leadership election. The clock is ticking, and I doubt the EU will change their demands based on who is in No 10.
We need to have a bloodletting, it's the only way for the party to move on. Its been far too long since we all had a massive and open fight over the soul/heart of the party. Right now there's too much sniping and bad blood for a unity candidate and coronation, no one will agree on the candidate.
Which is all fine and dandy for the Tory Party. The country may come to feel that p*ssing about with an internal civil war less than nine months before the country falls over a cliff edge is less than responsible.
And lets not forget: the current status of the deal is no deal and it will remain that way until something is actually agreed.
Perhaps the Tories must now split. A leadership contest will be held, and the supporters of the losing candidate won’t follow the new leader.
History doesn’t repeat, but it rhymes...
I expect that there will be a leadership contest. And I expect that the Party will unite around the new leader.
Tmay has to go. Fuck her and her weird aspergery hand movements. She is a walking disaster. She is (inter alia) a victim of her own autism. All those red lines so soon? What An Idiot.
Elect a Hard Brexit leader. If it is No Deal Brexit we will cope. We have seen worse. We survived the fucking Blitz. Let the nation unite around Harry Kane and rhubarb crumble.
SeanT goes overnight from backing the Great May Brexit fudge to backing Davis and Mogg full hard Brexit.
SeanT dithered between Remain and Leave before eventually going for Leave.
Leave narrowly won. On Brexit as SeanT goes so goes the nation?
Sean T for PM? At least there would be no dithering and we could provide the certainty business needs on day 1!!
We have tried the Chamberlain approach - time for Churchill and rhubarb crumble....?
That Boris statement must surely be a resignation statement if verified? In which case a confidence vote is very likely this week I would have thought
I am not at all sure that it will be necessary. I think TM will resign as well triggering a leadership campaign
I really hope so, because with TM Brexit does not mean Brexit, her red lines are not red at all, she is a remainer in leave clothing, she has to go, she has betrayed the democratic will of the British people
This actually makes leave much less likely and TM, to her credit, tried to agree a deal that would have a chance with the EU and the HOC. The end game will now be a Norway style deal or remain
I'd say no deal or remain.
The Tories are pretty fucked. Corbyn is laughing right now, he just has to watch them destroy any chance of winning the next election. His own inability to formuulate a policy on brexit doesn't even matter.
Even now Corbyn is nowhere near a majority either and his party is divided on far more than just Brexit
The Tories will be more immediately hit. Corbyn is as divided but he just needs to hold it toget her long enough for the tory implosion. They're screwed.
You have to feel sorry for Mrs May, uniting the two wings of the Tory party on Brexit is an almost impossible task.
She shouldn't have taken the job. Nobody even today knows what she actually stands for.
She seems to stand for whatever her SPADS, civil servants and Chiefs of staff tell her to stand for. No one elected Nick Timothy or Olly Robbins but between them for the last 2 years have they in effect been deciding what she stands for?
Thank you - my party are in crisis and I will not support any hard Brexiteers
In the end this looks like a peoples vote is inevitable as is staying in
Good for you. I honestly take no pleasure in seeing your party in such a state. I used to be a mainly Conservative voter myself until I switched to the Lib Dems and I still have a lot of respect for many of the Conservatives on the more liberal wing of the party. If I had to choose for one of the big two parties to implode/self-destruct it wouldn't be the Conservatives.
Maybe it was inevitable but if we go full on hard Brexit I will resign
If that’s your view, you’d probably be more comfortable in the Liberal Democrats.
Is that the polite Tory way of saying why don't you F___off and join the Tories then?
I think Moggites will soon join Corbynites in telling a lot of their Remainer and Blairite MPs to F off and join the LDs
If that is their answer to the choice of an proven effective & competent Minister who might get the job down properly and deliver, then really are not serious about getting a workable deal.
Which is all fine and dandy for the Tory Party. The country may come to feel that p*ssing about with an internal civil war less than nine months before the country falls over a cliff edge is less than responsible.
And lets not forget: the current status of the deal is no deal and it will remain that way until something is actually agreed.
Which suits thr ERG. They are happy to run down the clock for no deal brexit. However, we could get a leadership election done by end of August, nothing is going to happen in the summer anyway, the whole EU machinery is closed anyway.
Why not wait until the morning when the media are better equipped to cover your flounce?
An even bigger name is resigning in the morning...
No - if there was and organised plot, Davis would have resigned around 8-9pm, in order to hit the morning papers and the 10pm news slots without giving No 10 much time to respond. Resigning so late is rotten PR tactics. I'd say that he's acting alone, not for the first time.
That said, immense pressure now on Boris, Fox and the rest to follow up. Especially Boris, given what was leaked. Interesting question, mind, as to who leaked it. Boris had nothing to gain from that but nor did May. The natural assumption is that it was a different Brexiteer, possibly one who had his or her eye on the leadership and certainly one who wishes harm on Boris.
Actually, waiting to resign was a great move. Anything yesterday would have been drowned out by the World Cup and would have played into May's 'taxi' narrative. It would also have looked impulsive. Now he can claim he considered it, asked for clarifications from May and when they were not forthcoming he resigned. They have clear press air Monday and Tuesday and May has to face the 1922 tomorrow. That should be fun.
I cannot see how she survives, although this does have a feeling of 2008/2009 and the Labour Party trying to get rid of Gordon Brown. Will the Tory Party be more successful at removing an ill suited leader. I’ve long tipped Javid for leader, and if they could manoeuvre him into position they could be alright. First thing needed would be a large number of Civil Servants working out what no deal looks like, which should have been our base negotiating position all along.
And when the answer is an economic catastrophe, then what?
Perhaps the Tories must now split. A leadership contest will be held, and the supporters of the losing candidate won’t follow the new leader.
History doesn’t repeat, but it rhymes...
I think it's an absolute certainty that they'll split. They're not only facing in different directions but pulling strongly in different directions.
In which case Labour will split soon after, it is straining the elastic to breaking point keeping Umunna and Kendall and Corbyn and McDonnell in the same party.
At least the majority of the Cabinet has not yet resigned unlike the majority of Corbyn's formet Shadow Cabinet
The hope of government will keep labour in place. They didn't split when they thought a tory landslide was coming, they won't now.
They will when they have to decide between their working class Leave seats and their urban middle class Remain seats
Thank you - my party are in crisis and I will not support any hard Brexiteers
In the end this looks like a peoples vote is inevitable as is staying in
Good for you. I honestly take no pleasure in seeing your party in such a state. I used to be a mainly Conservative voter myself until I switched to the Lib Dems and I still have a lot of respect for many of the Conservatives on the more liberal wing of the party. If I had to choose for one of the big two parties to implode/self-destruct it wouldn't be the Conservatives.
Maybe it was inevitable but if we go full on hard Brexit I will resign
Why? One of the logical endpoints of Article 50 (agreed, post facto, by a Tory PM, despite promising us a vote) is that if ever leave we will leave in a way which severely damages us (i.e. we don't leave at all, or we leave and lose 10% GDP),
A fucking Tory prime minister, David Cameron, promised us a cast-iron guarantee of a vote on this Treaty, and Article 50, and then did sweet FA when he was in power. Fuck him. He is a traitor like Osborne and Blair and Brown and the rest. Burn them all. Heap up the pyres in Smithfield. As soon as he assumed power he could have demanded a new vote from the EU, and if rejected he could have done a De Gaulle and empty-chaired everything until they agreed.
He didn't.
Enuff. We were failed by all our leaders, left and right, Let them shrivel and die.
Your £15 plonk is doing you no good. What is your solution ?
That Boris statement must surely be a resignation statement if verified? In which case a confidence vote is very likely this week I would have thought
I am not at all sure that it will be necessary. I think TM will resign as well triggering a leadership campaign
I really hope so, because with TM Brexit does not mean Brexit, her red lines are not red at all, she is a remainer in leave clothing, she has to go, she has betrayed the democratic will of the British people
This actually makes leave much less likely and TM, to her credit, tried to agree a deal that would have a chance with the EU and the HOC. The end game will now be a Norway style deal or remain
I'd say no deal or remain.
The Tories are pretty fucked. Corbyn is laughing right now, he just has to watch them destroy any chance of winning the next election. His own inability to formuulate a policy on brexit doesn't even matter.
Even now Corbyn is nowhere near a majority either and his party is divided on far more than just Brexit
I think a Corbyn minority Government where he couldn’t do anything he promised wouldn’t necessarily be bad for the conservatives. I think I might by my Euros for my holiday in the morning though!
Thank you - my party are in crisis and I will not support any hard Brexiteers
In the end this looks like a peoples vote is inevitable as is staying in
Good for you. I honestly take no pleasure in seeing your party in such a state. I used to be a mainly Conservative voter myself until I switched to the Lib Dems and I still have a lot of respect for many of the Conservatives on the more liberal wing of the party. If I had to choose for one of the big two parties to implode/self-destruct it wouldn't be the Conservatives.
Maybe it was inevitable but if we go full on hard Brexit I will resign
If that’s your view, you’d probably be more comfortable in the Liberal Democrats.
There's not a majority for no deal Brexit in the Tory parliamentary party, I should think, why is opposing that against party principles ?
The nation voted to leave. If we can’t get an acceptable deal, we should leave without one. The Tory MPs who don’t accept that are the ones going against party principles.
The key words there are acceptable deal. The cabinet said May's proposal woukd be an acceptable deal.
Perhaps the Tories must now split. A leadership contest will be held, and the supporters of the losing candidate won’t follow the new leader.
History doesn’t repeat, but it rhymes...
I expect that there will be a leadership contest. And I expect that the Party will unite around the new leader.
Why? There does not seem support across a majority for what the Rees Moggs of the world want either. Surely someone new takes over and the fight just begins again. It's not like if may wins, or someone who backs the deal, that Mogg and co will suddenly be supportive of it.
The party needs to split. It no longer has common cause on the fundamental issue of the day. If the sides cannot agree on a middle way, and they self evidently cannot, they should stop pretending.
Brexit is just an issue. It's a big issue but it's not an existential one; that's what UKIP's for.
Once there has been a contest and a vote, the new leader has the authority of the Party behind him or her and those who don't like it will have much more trouble opposing it than at present. I think the membership will be a lot less understanding of rebels after a clear mandate has been given to a new leader.
Come on David. The majority Brexit-supporting membership won’t be bought off with fine words after this fiasco.
The Brexiteer who gets to the final two will win.
If a Brexiteer win (and I fully agree that in current circumstances, he or she would; probably Gove), then they get to negotiate on the basis on which they stood. If they can't deliver a deal then we leave with no deal.
Thank you - my party are in crisis and I will not support any hard Brexiteers
In the end this looks like a peoples vote is inevitable as is staying in
Good for you. I honestly take no pleasure in seeing your party in such a state. I used to be a mainly Conservative voter myself until I switched to the Lib Dems and I still have a lot of respect for many of the Conservatives on the more liberal wing of the party. If I had to choose for one of the big two parties to implode/self-destruct it wouldn't be the Conservatives.
Maybe it was inevitable but if we go full on hard Brexit I will resign
If that’s your view, you’d probably be more comfortable in the Liberal Democrats.
There's not a majority for no deal Brexit in the Tory parliamentary party, I should think, why is opposing that against party principles ?
The nation voted to leave. If we can’t get an acceptable deal, we should leave without one. The Tory MPs who don’t accept that are the ones going against party principles.
The nation voted to leave having been told repeatedly that the EU would be desperate for a deal and negotiations would be easy. If that turns out to be a lie (!) then we shouldn’t be leaving.
It seems that Medway Council has caught up with the 21st century and I’ve been able to upload my application for a postal vote (as an overseas voter). I hope if a GE does occur in the upcoming months I’ll receive my ballot in time to return it. Unless it should happen to be on October 4th, in which case I’ll be in London and can take the HS1 train down to Gillingham to vote in person!
Perhaps the Tories must now split. A leadership contest will be held, and the supporters of the losing candidate won’t follow the new leader.
History doesn’t repeat, but it rhymes...
I expect that there will be a leadership contest. And I expect that the Party will unite around the new leader.
Why? There does not seem support across a majority for what the Rees Moggs of the world want either. Surely someone new takes over and the fight just begins again. It's not like if may wins, or someone who backs the deal, that Mogg and co will suddenly be supportive of it.
The party needs to split. It no longer has common cause on the fundamental issue of the day. If the sides cannot agree on a middle way, and they self evidently cannot, they should stop pretending.
Brexit is just an issue. It's a big issue but it's not an existential one
You're kidding yourself. It is abundantly clear from the outside that it is existential. Pretending it isn't, that the sides can be reconciled, is why the party put off even the cabinet trying to unify until now.
That Boris statement must surely be a resignation statement if verified? In which case a confidence vote is very likely this week I would have thought
I am not at all sure that it will be necessary. I think TM will resign as well triggering a leadership campaign
I really hope so, because with TM Brexit does not mean Brexit, her red lines are not red at all, she is a remainer in leave clothing, she has to go, she has betrayed the democratic will of the British people
This actually makes leave much less likely and TM, to her credit, tried to agree a deal that would have a chance with the EU and the HOC. The end game will now be a Norway style deal or remain
I'd say no deal or remain.
The Tories are pretty fucked. Corbyn is laughing right now, he just has to watch them destroy any chance of winning the next election. His own inability to formuulate a policy on brexit doesn't even matter.
Even now Corbyn is nowhere near a majority either and his party is divided on far more than just Brexit
The Tories will be more immediately hit. Corbyn is as divided but he just needs to hold it toget her long enough for the tory implosion. They're screwed.
No as most Tory voters at the end of the day back hard Brexit, most Labour voters back soft Brexit though and staying in the single market but Corbyn does not as he knows he needs marginal working class marginal Labour Leave seats to become PM as he cannot win many more Remain Tory seats a centrist Labour leader could.
So long term Brexit screws Corbyn more than a hard Brexit backing Tory leader
If that is their answer to the choice of an proven effective & competent Minister who might get the job down properly and deliver, then really are not serious about getting a workable deal.
Their preferred deal is NO DEAL. They want to fall off the cliff because they believe as they fall, they will begin to fly to the promised land.
That Boris statement must surely be a resignation statement if verified? In which case a confidence vote is very likely this week I would have thought
I am not at all sure that it will be necessary. I think TM will resign as well triggering a leadership campaign
I really hope so, because with TM Brexit does not mean Brexit, her red lines are not red at all, she is a remainer in leave clothing, she has to go, she has betrayed the democratic will of the British people
This actually makes leave much less likely and TM, to her credit, tried to agree a deal that would have a chance with the EU and the HOC. The end game will now be a Norway style deal or remain
I'd say no deal or remain.
The Tories are pretty fucked. Corbyn is laughing right now, he just has to watch them destroy any chance of winning the next election. His own inability to formuulate a policy on brexit doesn't even matter.
Even now Corbyn is nowhere near a majority either and his party is divided on far more than just Brexit
The Tories will be more immediately hit. Corbyn is as divided but he just needs to hold it toget her long enough for the tory implosion. They're screwed.
No as most Tory voters at the end of the day back hard Brexit, most Labour voters back soft Brexit though and staying in the single market but Corbyn does not as he knows he needs marginal working class Leave seats to become PM as he cannot win many more Remain Tory seats a centrist Labour leader did.
So long term Brexit screws Corbyn more than a hard Brexit backing Tory leader
Why not wait until the morning when the media are better equipped to cover your flounce?
An even bigger name is resigning in the morning...
No - if there was and organised plot, Davis would have resigned around 8-9pm, in order to hit the morning papers and the 10pm news slots without giving No 10 much time to respond. Resigning so late is rotten PR tactics. I'd say that he's acting alone, not for the first time.
That said, immense pressure now on Boris, Fox and the rest to follow up. Especially Boris, given what was leaked. Interesting question, mind, as to who leaked it. Boris had nothing to gain from that but nor did May. The natural assumption is that it was a different Brexiteer, possibly one who had his or her eye on the leadership and certainly one who wishes harm on Boris.
Actually, waiting to resign was a great move. Anything yesterday would have been drowned out by the World Cup and would have played into May's 'taxi' narrative. It would also have looked impulsive. Now he can claim he considered it, asked for clarifications from May and when they were not forthcoming he resigned. They have clear press air Monday and Tuesday and May has to face the 1922 tomorrow. That should be fun.
I cannot see how she survives, although this does have a feeling of 2008/2009 and the Labour Party trying to get rid of Gordon Brown. Will the Tory Party be more successful at removing an ill suited leader. I’ve long tipped Javid for leader, and if they could manoeuvre him into position they could be alright. First thing needed would be a large number of Civil Servants working out what no deal looks like, which should have been our base negotiating position all along.
And when the answer is an economic catastrophe, then what?
Then mitigate the catastrophe that people voted for?
Perhaps the Tories must now split. A leadership contest will be held, and the supporters of the losing candidate won’t follow the new leader.
History doesn’t repeat, but it rhymes...
I think it's an absolute certainty that they'll split. They're not only facing in different directions but pulling strongly in different directions.
In which case Labour will split soon after, it is straining the elastic to breaking point keeping Umunna and Kendall and Corbyn and McDonnell in the same party.
At least the majority of the Cabinet has not yet resigned unlike the majority of Corbyn's formet Shadow Cabinet
The hope of government will keep labour in place. They didn't split when they thought a tory landslide was coming, they won't now.
They will when they have to decide between their working class Leave seats and their urban middle class Remain seats
If the tories are in chaos, and it appears they will be, they can hold both, even if they shouldn't. I don't think you realise how stupid and incompetent this government is looking.
Which might be fixable, but still the factions fight.
Why not wait until the morning when the media are better equipped to cover your flounce?
An even bigger name is resigning in the morning...
No - if there was and organised plot, Davis would have resigned around 8-9pm, in order to hit the morning papers and the 10pm news slots without giving No 10 much time to respond. Resigning so late is rotten PR tactics. I'd say that he's acting alone, not for the first time.
That said, immense pressure now on Boris, Fox and the rest to follow up. Especially Boris, given what was leaked. Interesting question, mind, as to who leaked it. Boris had nothing to gain from that but nor did May. The natural assumption is that it was a different Brexiteer, possibly one who had his or her eye on the leadership and certainly one who wishes harm on Boris.
Actually, waiting to resign was a great move. Anything yesterday would have been drowned out by the World Cup and would have played into May's 'taxi' narrative. It would also have looked impulsive. Now he can claim he considered it, asked for clarifications from May and when they were not forthcoming he resigned. They have clear press air Monday and Tuesday and May has to face the 1922 tomorrow. That should be fun.
I cannot see how she survives, although this does have a feeling of 2008/2009 and the Labour Party trying to get rid of Gordon Brown. Will the Tory Party be more successful at removing an ill suited leader. I’ve long tipped Javid for leader, and if they could manoeuvre him into position they could be alright. First thing needed would be a large number of Civil Servants working out what no deal looks like, which should have been our base negotiating position all along.
And when the answer is an economic catastrophe, then what?
Then mitigate the catastrophe that people voted for?
But you see, that’s the problem. Any attempt to mitigate the pointless and self-inflicted damage of Brexit is “defying the will of the people”. It’s exaclty this silliness that has got us into this mess.
That Boris statement must surely be a resignation statement if verified? In which case a confidence vote is very likely this week I would have thought
I am not at all sure that it will be necessary. I think TM will resign as well triggering a leadership campaign
I really hope so, because with TM Brexit does not mean Brexit, her red lines are not red at all, she is a remainer in leave clothing, she has to go, she has betrayed the democratic will of the British people
This actually makes leave much less likely and TM, to her credit, tried to agree a deal that would have a chance with the EU and the HOC. The end game will now be a Norway style deal or remain
I'd say no deal or remain.
The Tories are pretty fucked. Corbyn is laughing right now, he just has to watch them destroy any chance of winning the next election. His own inability to formuulate a policy on brexit doesn't even matter.
Even now Corbyn is nowhere near a majority either and his party is divided on far more than just Brexit
The Tories will be more immediately hit. Corbyn is as divided but he just needs to hold it toget her long enough for the tory implosion. They're screwed.
No as most Tory voters at the end of the day back hard Brexit, most Labour voters back soft Brexit though and staying in the single market but Corbyn does not as he knows he needs marginal working class Leave seats to become PM as he cannot win many more Remain Tory seats a centrist Labour leader did.
So long term Brexit screws Corbyn more than a hard Brexit backing Tory leader
Forget about what the polls say now, if there is another election because the Tories implode, Labour will win a comfortable majority, perhaps a landslide one. It really is as straightforward as that. Voters will not return a party that has torn itself asunder back to office.
Of course, that’s when Corbyn’s own problems will begin and his govt may meet the same fate.
I wonder if some in the EU are worried that it seems as though leaving is impossible, and that they are all on the same train with no possibility of getting off?
I wonder if some in the EU are worried that it seems as though leaving is impossible, and that they are all on the same train with no possibility of getting off?
I wonder if some in the EU are worried that it seems as though leaving is impossible, and that they are all on the same train with no possibility of getting off?
Not all countries have as sclerotic a political system as we do, which has been a big part of the problem. There is no way that Mogg and Soubry would be in the same party under a continental electoral system (or indeed Umunna and Corbyn)
That Boris statement must surely be a resignation statement if verified? In which case a confidence vote is very likely this week I would have thought
I am not at all sure that it will be necessary. I think TM will resign as well triggering a leadership campaign
I really hope so, because with TM Brexit does not mean Brexit, her red lines are not red at all, she is a remainer in leave clothing, she has to go, she has betrayed the democratic will of the British people
This actually makes leave much less likely and TM, to her credit, tried to agree a deal that would have a chance with the EU and the HOC. The end game will now be a Norway style deal or remain
I'd say no deal or remain.
The Tories are pretty fucked. Corbyn is laughing right now, he just has to watch them destroy any chance of winning the next election. His own inability to formuulate a policy on brexit doesn't even matter.
Even now Corbyn is nowhere near a majority either and his party is divided on far more than just Brexit
The Tories will be more immediately hit. Corbyn is as divided but he just needs to hold it toget her long enough for the tory implosion. They're screwed.
No as most Tory voters at the end of the day back hard Brexit, most Labour voters back soft Brexit though and staying in the single market but Corbyn does not as he knows he needs marginal working class Leave seats to become PM as he cannot win many more Remain Tory seats a centrist Labour leader did.
So long term Brexit screws Corbyn more than a hard Brexit backing Tory leader
Forget about what the polls say now, if there is another election because the Tories implode, Labour will win a comfortable majority, perhaps a landslide one. It really is as straightforward as that. Voters will not return a party that has torn itself asunder back to office.
Of course, that’s when Corbyn’s own problems will begin and his govt may meet the same fate.
100% agree. Corbyn's government would face many problems indeed. But no way the tories are largest party when tearing themselves apart.
That Boris statement must surely be a resignation statement if verified? In which case a confidence vote is very likely this week I would have thought
I am not at all sure that it will be necessary. I think TM will resign as well triggering a leadership campaign
I really hope so, because with TM Brexit does not mean Brexit, her red lines are not red at all, she is a remainer in leave clothing, she has to go, she has betrayed the democratic will of the British people
This actually makes leave much less likely and TM, to her credit, tried to agree a deal that would have a chance with the EU and the HOC. The end game will now be a Norway style deal or remain
I'd say no deal or remain.
The Tories are pretty fucked. Corbyn is laughing right now, he just has to watch them destroy any chance of winning the next election. His own inability to formuulate a policy on brexit doesn't even matter.
Even now Corbyn is nowhere near a majority either and his party is divided on far more than just Brexit
The Tories will be more immediately hit. Corbyn is as divided but he just needs to hold it toget her long enough for the tory implosion. They're screwed.
No as most Tory voters at the end of the day back hard Brexit, most Labour voters back soft Brexit though and staying in the single market but Corbyn does not as he knows he needs marginal working class Leave seats to become PM as he cannot win many more Remain Tory seats a centrist Labour leader did.
So long term Brexit screws Corbyn more than a hard Brexit backing Tory leader
They key words there are long term.
I don’t see how Corbyn will be in a position to have majority government in the short term. I think the Tory support is significantly held up by those who don’t want a Corbyn Government, so as long as they put someone up and they don’t totally disintegrate there is a significant block between Corbyn and power.
Why not wait until the morning when the media are better equipped to cover your flounce?
An even bigger name is resigning in the morning...
No - if there was and organised plot, Davis would have resigned around 8-9pm, in order to hit the morning papers and the 10pm news slots without giving No 10 much time to respond. Resigning so late is rotten PR tactics. I'd say that he's acting alone, not for the first time.
That said, immense pressure now on Boris, Fox and the rest to follow up. Especially Boris, given what was leaked. Interesting question, mind, as to who leaked it. Boris had nothing to gain from that but nor did May. The natural assumption is that it was a different Brexiteer, possibly one who had his or her eye on the leadership and certainly one who wishes harm on Boris.
Actually, waiting to resign was a great move. Anything yesterday would have been drowned out by the World Cup and would have played into May's 'taxi' narrative. It would also have looked impulsive. Now he can claim he considered it, asked for clarifications from May and when they were not forthcoming he resigned. They have clear press air Monday and Tuesday and May has to face the 1922 tomorrow. That should be fun.
I cannot see how she survives, although this does have a feeling of 2008/2009 and the Labour Party trying to get rid of Gordon Brown. Will the Tory Party be more successful at removing an ill suited leader. I’ve long tipped Javid for leader, and if they could manoeuvre him into position they could be alright. First thing needed would be a large number of Civil Servants working out what no deal looks like, which should have been our base negotiating position all along.
And when the answer is an economic catastrophe, then what?
Then mitigate the catastrophe that people voted for?
But you see, that’s the problem. Any attempt to mitigate the pointless and self-inflicted damage of Brexit is “defying the will of the people”. It’s exaclty this silliness that has got us into this mess.
You can always change your will with another visit to a solicitor.
Likewise, the will of the people can also be changed by another visit to the polling station. Why should a will be a permanent one ?
So who will replace him? Perhaps, in a radical departure from her previous strategy, May will appoint somebody who is not a clueless drunken old sod. Maybe Gove, the Grima Wormtongue of the cabinet, will be recognised as having the utter lack of principles we need in this terrible situation.
I don't see how she can currently appoint anyone to replace DD. Who would want the job? Just look how she and Olly Robbins have been undercutting DD to create their own master plan over the last few months. It's become a non-job.
What she has now is her plan. She owns it. She can't blame anyone else. And it's so complex and messy that nobody will want it when they've kicked the tyres - not the EU, not her party members, not the 17.4m voters.
DD resigning could break the spell. Like the emperor's new clothes, people will suddenly see that she is a prime minister with no authority. None. She can't sell something she doesn't believe in. She doesn't have the will for it. She doesn't have the vision. She is a poor performer on TV. She's an awful campaigner. She vacillates and ties herself in knots. She is weighed in the balance and found wanting. She has to go.
So who will replace him? Perhaps, in a radical departure from her previous strategy, May will appoint somebody who is not a clueless drunken old sod. Maybe Gove, the Grima Wormtongue of the cabinet, will be recognised as having the utter lack of principles we need in this terrible situation.
I don't see how she can currently appoint anyone to replace DD. Who would want the job? Just look how she and Olly Robbins have been undercutting DD to create their own master plan over the last few months. It's become a non-job.
What she has now is her plan. She owns it. She can't blame anyone else. And it's so complex and messy that nobody will want it when they've kicked the tyres - not the EU, not her party members, not the 17.4m voters.
DD resigning could break the spell. Like the emperor's new clothes, people will suddenly see that she is a prime minister with no authority. None. She can't sell something she doesn't believe in. She doesn't have the will for it. She doesn't have the vision. She is a poor performer on TV. She's an awful campaigner. She vacillates and ties herself in knots. She is weighed in the balance and found wanting. She has to go.
One of the best things about dumping Theresa will be getting rid of Robbins. He's definitely part of the problem. Hammond as well, another virulent remainer.
That Boris statement must surely be a resignation statement if verified? In which case a confidence vote is very likely this week I would have thought
I am not at all sure that it will be necessary. I think TM will resign as well triggering a leadership campaign
I really hope so, because with TM Brexit does not mean Brexit, her red lines are not red at all, she is a remainer in leave clothing, she has to go, she has betrayed the democratic will of the British people
This actually makes leave much less likely and TM, to her credit, tried to agree a deal that would have a chance with the EU and the HOC. The end game will now be a Norway style deal or remain
I'd say no deal or remain.
The Tories are pretty fucked. Corbyn is laughing right now, he just has to watch them destroy any chance of winning the next election. His own inability to formuulate a policy on brexit doesn't even matter.
Even now Corbyn is nowhere near a majority either and his party is divided on far more than just Brexit
The Tories will be more immediately hit. Corbyn is as divided but he just needs to hold it toget her long enough for the tory implosion. They're screwed.
No as most Tory voters at the end of the day back hard Brexit, most Labour voters back soft Brexit though and staying in the single market but Corbyn does not as he knows he needs marginal working class Leave seats to become PM as he cannot win many more Remain Tory seats a centrist Labour leader did.
So long term Brexit screws Corbyn more than a hard Brexit backing Tory leader
Forget about what the polls say now, if there is another election because the Tories implode, Labour will win a comfortable majority, perhaps a landslide one. It really is as straightforward as that. Voters will not return a party that has torn itself asunder back to office.
Of course, that’s when Corbyn’s own problems will begin and his govt may meet the same fate.
100% agree. Corbyn's government would face many problems indeed. But no way the tories are largest party when tearing themselves apart.
God Bless the Fixed Term Parliaments Act.
Although there’s something to be said about leaving office now, rather than letting the resentment build.
A new vote. And if the Commons won't agree this, then No Deal, and we Exit to WTO, and we don't pay £40bn, and Airbus leaves, and the rest.
We will survive. THIS IS SPARTA.
That'll be fine for you, me and almost exclusively well heeled 50 somethings that are the inmates of pb.com. But people actually rely on those Airbus jobs and other jobs like them to pay their mortgages. They are not going to well disposed to the purblind recklessness of Brexit when they are living in B&Bs.
One of the best things about dumping Theresa will be getting rid of Robbins. He's definitely part of the problem. Hammond as well, another virulent remainer.
That Boris statement must surely be a resignation statement if verified? In which case a confidence vote is very likely this week I would have thought
I am not at all sure that it will be necessary. I think TM will resign as well triggering a leadership campaign
I really hope so, because with TM Brexit does not mean Brexit, her red lines are not red at all, she is a remainer in leave clothing, she has to go, she has betrayed the democratic will of the British people
This actually makes leave much less likely and TM, to her credit, tried to agree a deal that would have a chance with the EU and the HOC. The end game will now be a Norway style deal or remain
I'd say no deal or remain.
The Tories are pretty fucked. Corbyn is laughing right now, he just has to watch them destroy any chance of winning the next election. His own inability to formuulate a policy on brexit doesn't even matter.
No way, if we proposed any referendum which has remain on the ballot paper we'd be out of powered for a generation or longer. It would be "the deal" vs "No deal" both options would take us out of the EU.
But the tories cannot agree on what deal to ask for. There is no deal to be had now -May's gambit has failed. Therefore there is nothing to put to the people. No deal does not have enough support either. So sonething must be given as an alternative. It will be remain.
And yes they probably will be out of power for a generation. Brexit has destroyed it. It held on for a bit, but the sides cannot coexist like this.
Nah, you're far too negative on this. We won't split because 20 or so MPs from the 2017 election won't get in line. We might run the clock down on brexit, leave and then go to the public with a new leader.
They might not split. But they should. And it's more than 20. What if someone who backs the deal wins? Then you've got 60 plus who won't get in line. It's become a joke. The party needs to decide what it's stance is already.
If it gets to the membership then it will be whoever is more sceptic. Both final candidates will use May's insipid deal as a starting point and atrip away or add to it what they want, though.
How soon we forget the last time we decided a Conservative Leader on those grounds, it delivered us IDS!
That Boris statement must surely be a resignation statement if verified? In which case a confidence vote is very likely this week I would have thought
I am not at all sure that it will be necessary. I think TM will resign as well triggering a leadership campaign
I really hope so, because with TM Brexit does not mean Brexit, her red lines are not red at all, she is a remainer in leave clothing, she has to go, she has betrayed the democratic will of the British people
This actually makes leave much less likely and TM, to her credit, tried to agree a deal that would have a chance with the EU and the HOC. The end game will now be a Norway style deal or remain
I'd say no deal or remain.
The Tories are pretty fucked. Corbyn is laughing right now, he just has to watch them destroy any chance of winning the next election. His own inability to formuulate a policy on brexit doesn't even matter.
Even now Corbyn is nowhere near a majority either and his party is divided on far more than just Brexit
The Tories will be more immediately hit. Corbyn is as divided but he just needs to hold it toget her long enough for the tory implosion. They're screwed.
No as most Tory voters at the end of the day back hard Brexit, most Labour voters back soft Brexit though and staying in the single market but Corbyn does not as he knows he needs marginal working class Leave seats to become PM as he cannot win many more Remain Tory seats a centrist Labour leader did.
So long term Brexit screws Corbyn more than a hard Brexit backing Tory leader
They key words there are long term.
I don’t see how Corbyn will be in a position to have majority government in the short term. I think the Tory support is significantly held up by those who don’t want a Corbyn Government, so as long as they put someone up and they don’t totally disintegrate there is a significant block between Corbyn and power.
A Corbyn government would attempt many poor ideas, and likely be riven with infighting. But this government is and will remain riven with infighting for certain. No one they put up can bring together people who want a soft Brexit and those who want a no deal Brexit. So the incompetence will continue.
One of the best things about dumping Theresa will be getting rid of Robbins. He's definitely part of the problem. Hammond as well, another virulent remainer.
Aka the realists.
No, the EUphiles who are trying to subvert democracy, much like your own views.
Thank you - my party are in crisis and I will not support any hard Brexiteers
In the end this looks like a peoples vote is inevitable as is staying in
Good for you. I honestly take no pleasure in seeing your party in such a state. I used to be a mainly Conservative voter myself until I switched to the Lib Dems and I still have a lot of respect for many of the Conservatives on the more liberal wing of the party. If I had to choose for one of the big two parties to implode/self-destruct it wouldn't be the Conservatives.
Maybe it was inevitable but if we go full on hard Brexit I will resign
Why? One of the logical endpoints of Article 50 (agreed, post facto, by a Tory PM, despite promising us a vote) is that if ever leave we will leave in a way which severely damages us (i.e. we don't leave at all, or we leave and lose 10% GDP),
A fucking Tory prime minister, David Cameron, promised us a cast-iron guarantee of a vote on this Treaty, and Article 50, and then did sweet FA when he was in power. Fuck him. He is a traitor like Osborne and Blair and Brown and the rest. Burn them all. Heap up the pyres in Smithfield. As soon as he assumed power he could have demanded a new vote from the EU, and if rejected he could have done a De Gaulle and empty-chaired everything until they agreed.
He didn't.
Enuff. We were failed by all our leaders, left and right, Let them shrivel and die.
Your £15 plonk is doing you no good. What is your solution ?
A new vote. And if the Commons won't agree this, then No Deal, and we Exit to WTO, and we don't pay £40bn, and Airbus leaves, and the rest.
If that is their answer to the choice of an proven effective & competent Minister who might get the job down properly and deliver, then really are not serious about getting a workable deal.
Their preferred deal is NO DEAL. They want to fall off the cliff because they believe as they fall, they will begin to fly to the promised land.
"Lewis Goodall Verified account @lewis_goodall 55s55 seconds ago
Response from @IanLaveryMP , Chair of the Labour Party: "This is absolute chaos and Theresa May has no authority left. The Prime Minister is in office but not in power. We can't go on like this. Britain needs a functioning government."
"Lewis Goodall
If May is Thatcher, Olly Robbins is Alan Walters, Davis is Howe- then Sajid Javid is surely John Major. Watch him very closely in the next 48 hours."
One of the best things about dumping Theresa will be getting rid of Robbins. He's definitely part of the problem. Hammond as well, another virulent remainer.
Aka the realists.
No, the EUphiles who are trying to subvert democracy, much like your own views.
The Brexiteers subversion of a very narrow referendum win has done far more damage to democracy than the EU ever has
Anyway, I have to go to work in 6 hours, so should probably sleep.
May is a goner. Cabinet members who agreed on Friday and quit now cannot be trusted. No replacement will magically erase the tories' problems. No deal is the only game in town. Corbyn will win the next election.
Anyway, I have to go to work in 6 hours, so should probably sleep.
May is a goner. No replacement will magically erase the tories' problems. No deal is the only game in town. Corbyn will win the next election.
Corbyn could not even decisively win the last local elections let alone the next general election and Corbyn's support for leaving the single market will start to see some Labour Remainers peel off to the LDs if the next Tory leader is a hard Brexiteer
Anyway, I have to go to work in 6 hours, so should probably sleep.
May is a goner. No replacement will magically erase the tories' problems. No deal is the only game in town. Corbyn will win the next election.
Corbyn could not even decisively win the last local elections let alone the next general election and Corbyn's support for leaving the single market will start to see some Labour Remainers peel off to the LDs if the next Tory leader is a hard Brexiteer
Things have changed. The Tories are committing seppukku. Against a gutted opponent , Corbyn can win.
Anyway, I have to go to work in 6 hours, so should probably sleep.
May is a goner. No replacement will magically erase the tories' problems. No deal is the only game in town. Corbyn will win the next election.
Corbyn could not even decisively win the last local elections let alone the next general election and Corbyn's support for leaving the single market will start to see some Labour Remainers peel off to the LDs if the next Tory leader is a hard Brexiteer
Things have changed. The Tories are committing seppukku. Against a gutted opponent , Corbyn can win.
No, we're getting rid of our loser PM. Once the dust settles we'll be much better off.
Thank you - my party are in crisis and I will not support any hard Brexiteers
In the end this looks like a peoples vote is inevitable as is staying in
Good for you. I honestly take no pleasure in seeing your party in such a state. I used to be a mainly Conservative voter myself until I switched to the Lib Dems and I still have a lot of respect for many of the Conservatives on the more liberal wing of the party. If I had to choose for one of the big two parties to implode/self-destruct it wouldn't be the Conservatives.
Maybe it was inevitable but if we go full on hard Brexit I will resign
Why? One of the logical endpoints of Article 50 (agreed, post facto, by a Tory PM, despite promising us a vote) is that if ever leave we will leave in a way which severely damages us (i.e. we don't leave at all, or we leave and lose 10% GDP),
A fucking Tory prime minister, David Cameron, promised us a cast-iron guarantee of a vote on this Treaty, and Article 50, and then did sweet FA when he was in power. Fuck him. He is a traitor like Osborne and Blair and Brown and the rest. Burn them all. Heap up the pyres in Smithfield. As soon as he assumed power he could have demanded a new vote from the EU, and if rejected he could have done a De Gaulle and empty-chaired everything until they agreed.
He didn't.
Enuff. We were failed by all our leaders, left and right, Let them shrivel and die.
Your £15 plonk is doing you no good. What is your solution ?
A new vote. And if the Commons won't agree this, then No Deal, and we Exit to WTO, and we don't pay £40bn, and Airbus leaves, and the rest.
We will survive. THIS IS SPARTA.
If...
Only it were.
And Sparta was a squalid tyranny, even by the standards of the ancient world. Perhaps the nearest any human society has come to Orwell’s Oceania.
That Boris statement must surely be a resignation statement if verified? In which case a confidence vote is very likely this week I would have thought
I am not at all sure that it will be necessary. I think TM will resign as well triggering a leadership campaign
I really hope so, because with TM Brexit does not mean Brexit, her red lines are not red at all, she is a remainer in leave clothing, she has to go, she has betrayed the democratic will of the British people
This actually makes leave much less likely and TM, to her credit, tried to agree a deal that would have a chance with the EU and the HOC. The end game will now be a Norway style deal or remain
I'd say no deal or remain.
The Tories are pretty fucked. Corbyn is laughing right now, he just has to watch them destroy any chance of winning the next election. His own inability to formuulate a policy on brexit doesn't even matter.
Even now Corbyn is nowhere near a majority either and his party is divided on far more than just Brexit
The Tories will be more immediately hit. Corbyn is as divided but he just needs to hold it toget her long enough for the tory implosion. They're screwed.
No as most Tory voters at the end of the
So long term Brexit screws Corbyn more than a hard Brexit backing Tory leader
Forget about what the polls say now, if there is another election because the Tories implode, Labour will win a comfortable majority, perhaps a landslide one. It really is as straightforward as that. Voters will not return a party that has torn itself asunder back to office.
Of course, that’s when Corbyn’s own problems will begin and his govt may meet the same fate.
Nope. Labour is equally torn asunder and split top to bottom on Brexit.
I know you are a diehard Remainer who can't stand the fact most of your party's members and voters would rally behind a hard Brexit backing leader but there we are. Though I do agree if Corbyn gets in it will likely be scraping in propped up by minor parties trying to do his own Brexit fudge taking over where May left off and hammered on both sides by his pro EEA backbenchers and a hard Brexit backing Tory Leader of the Opposition
Anyway, I have to go to work in 6 hours, so should probably sleep.
May is a goner. No replacement will magically erase the tories' problems. No deal is the only game in town. Corbyn will win the next election.
Corbyn could not even decisively win the last local elections let alone the next general election and Corbyn's support for leaving the single market will start to see some Labour Remainers peel off to the LDs if the next Tory leader is a hard Brexiteer
Things have changed. The Tories are committing seppukku. Against a gutted opponent , Corbyn can win.
No, we're getting rid of our loser PM. Once the dust settles we'll be much better off.
I think if Javid resigns tomorrow on the basis of May breaking her word on EU migration then she falls and he becomes leader.
I think they'll all rally round May and she'll see off the inevitable confidence vote.
No way. Every MP knows that if they back her she will dig in and run in 2022. She won't be allowed to do that, so in that basis alone she will lose a VoNC.
Worst case scenario happens and government falls. General election in August? (When I, and everyone else, is on holiday) Is that possible in 'modern' times, or would we have a long campaign to see us to September?
Anyway, I have to go to work in 6 hours, so should probably sleep.
May is a goner. No replacement will magically erase the tories' problems. No deal is the only game in town. Corbyn will win the next election.
Corbyn could not even decisively win the last local elections let alone the next general election and Corbyn's support for leaving the single market will start to see some Labour Remainers peel off to the LDs if the next Tory leader is a hard Brexiteer
Things have changed. The Tories are committing seppukku. Against a gutted opponent , Corbyn can win.
No, we're getting rid of our loser PM. Once the dust settles we'll be much better off.
The loser pm whose plan the cabinet just agreed.
Yesterday's chip paper. Nobody who has read it can make sense of it. It's full of contradictions, holes and is unacceptable to the EU as it tries to divide the four freedoms.
She should appoint Liddington to DexEU, get her own supporters to write letters triggering an immeadiate Confidence vote then go on the attack. The years protection she gets under the rules after winnng a confidence vote will see her through Brexit Day.
I think if Javid resigns tomorrow on the basis of May breaking her word on EU migration then she falls and he becomes leader.
I think they'll all rally round May and she'll see off the inevitable confidence vote.
No way. Every MP knows that if they back her she will dig in and run in 2022. She won't be allowed to do that, so in that basis alone she will lose a VoNC.
Javid as PM and Gove as chancellor, here we come.
And then? What does he know that no one else does??
She should appoint Liddington to DexEU, get her own supporters to write letters triggering an immeadiate Confidence vote then go on the attack. The years protection she gets under the rules after winnng a confidence vote will see her through Brexit Day.
And to 2022, she won't win, which is why she won't do it. She's a loser, a proven one.
Anyway, I have to go to work in 6 hours, so should probably sleep.
May is a goner. No replacement will magically erase the tories' problems. No deal is the only game in town. Corbyn will win the next election.
Corbyn could not even decisively win the last local elections let alone the next general election and Corbyn's support for leaving the single market will start to see some Labour Remainers peel off to the LDs if the next Tory leader is a hard Brexiteer
Things have changed. The Tories are committing seppukku. Against a gutted opponent , Corbyn can win.
I think if Javid resigns tomorrow on the basis of May breaking her word on EU migration then she falls and he becomes leader.
I think they'll all rally round May and she'll see off the inevitable confidence vote.
No way. Every MP knows that if they back her she will dig in and run in 2022. She won't be allowed to do that, so in that basis alone she will lose a VoNC.
Javid as PM and Gove as chancellor, here we come.
And then? What does he know that no one else does??
How to negotiate his way out of a wet paper bag, for one.
Davis isn't enough on his own. You need at least Boris and Grayling to go - the two leaver cabinet ministers yet to make public statements post Chequers. But even then they are yesterday's men. Ideally an outrider for Javid. They need someone with a future ahead of them to resign to clear the way for Javid if this is to bring her down.
Only 11 days till parliamentry recess. It'll look farsical if MPs have to return to London to vote in a confidence vote after recess. And of course the Commons needs to be sitting to call an early election.
Which demographics do we reckon are still around? I guess it would reward whatever party is enthusiastic and organized, as you can work around it with proxy votes etc
How soon we forget the last time we decided a Conservative Leader on those grounds, it delivered us IDS!
The other option was Ken Clark. I don't see that the members had a choice.
Look where it got us, another Labour Government with a big majority which delivered the last big EU Treaty...
The Tories gained 33 seats at the 2005 general election, 3 more than Corbyn gained at the 2017 general election
And those 33 seats took us to the grand total of 198 seats while Labour held 355 and the Libdems 62, still leaving us in a far weaker position than Labour seat wise in Opposition. Cameron and Osborne were left with a mountain to climb to achieve a majority, and that is why it took two GE's to achieve one that delivered that EU Referendum.
Worst case scenario happens and government falls. General election in August? (When I, and everyone else, is on holiday) Is that possible in 'modern' times, or would we have a long campaign to see us to September?
THere will be no election until Corbyn's government falls after a No confidence vote.
Anyway, I have to go to work in 6 hours, so should probably sleep.
May is a goner. No replacement will magically erase the tories' problems. No deal is the only game in town. Corbyn will win the next election.
Corbyn could not even decisively win the last local elections let alone the next general election and Corbyn's support for leaving the single market will start to see some Labour Remainers peel off to the LDs if the next Tory leader is a hard Brexiteer
Things have changed. The Tories are committing seppukku. Against a gutted opponent , Corbyn can win.
No, we're getting rid of our loser PM. Once the dust settles we'll be much better off.
The loser pm whose plan the cabinet just agreed.
... in the confident expectation that her normal stardust of success would, when sprinkled on the polished turd, make it clearly even more absurd and impossible than it already was.
When No 10 briefed out the line that resigning ministers would have to get the taxi home, I thought that it was stupid. You don't bait your own team when you want them to support you. It's not strength, its desperation. Anyway, any sensible minister would wait to get home before resigning.
Davis isn't enough on his own. You need at least Boris and Grayling to go - the two leaver cabinet ministers yet to make public statements post Chequers. But even then they are yesterday's men. Ideally an outrider for Javid. They need someone with a future ahead of them to resign to clear the way for Javid if this is to bring her down.
Only 11 days till parliamentry recess. It'll look farsical if MPs have to return to London to vote in a confidence vote after recess. And of course the Commons needs to be sitting to call an early election.
Agreed. Right now it looks very much like a Brexit department walk out, which considering the relentless negative Westminster Lobby media coverage is hardly going to come as a surprise to the public. Tomorrow's meeting of the Westminster Conservative party is going to be the key to what unfolds this week. Setting aside the uber Brexit and Remain MPs for a moment, while they may be the continued fly in the ointment to the Government getting an acceptable and workable Brexit deal through Parliament. No, more importantly, they are not the ones who will decide May's continued future as Leader and PM and therefore the probable date of the next GE, until at least Brexit is achieved...
And look at the comments underneath, especially the third one that takes on each of TM's points.
I suspect that most party members will agree with DD's letter more than May's.
I would have said that ConservativeHome's regulars would have been reasonable representative of the party members up to about ten years ago, but not now. I was a regular commentator on the site back in those days, used to regularly take part in their polls back then too. But its been many years since I have bothered to interact in the comments threads. I left when the site's comments threads turned into a grumpy angry UKIP forum. I sourced this link to May's response to the Davis resignation letter via twitter.
Comments
The showdown was always going to take place at some point: I had thought early autumn more likely. I’m profoundly pessimistic about the party’s future. Perhaps holding the ultra critical Oxshott and Stoke D’Abernon by-election on Thursday will revive my spirits.
Jul 2018 - Sep 2018: 2.7 / 3.7
Oct 2018 - Dec 2018: 6.6 / 12
Jan 2019 - Mar 2019: 7.6 / 15
Apl 2019 - Jun 2019: 7.6 / 19
Jul 2019 - Sep 2019: 9.4 / 12
July 2020 or Later: 3.35 / 20"
https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/politics/market/1.125589838
That always works right?
And that failed too.
So long term Brexit screws Corbyn more than a hard Brexit backing Tory leader
Which might be fixable, but still the factions fight.
Of course, that’s when Corbyn’s own problems will begin and his govt may meet the same fate.
Likewise, the will of the people can also be changed by another visit to the polling station. Why should a will be a permanent one ?
What she has now is her plan. She owns it. She can't blame anyone else. And it's so complex and messy that nobody will want it when they've kicked the tyres - not the EU, not her party members, not the 17.4m voters.
DD resigning could break the spell. Like the emperor's new clothes, people will suddenly see that she is a prime minister with no authority. None. She can't sell something she doesn't believe in. She doesn't have the will for it. She doesn't have the vision. She is a poor performer on TV. She's an awful campaigner. She vacillates and ties herself in knots. She is weighed in the balance and found wanting. She has to go.
Although there’s something to be said about leaving office now, rather than letting the resentment build.
https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1015891199129944064?s=21
Only it were.
Verified account @lewis_goodall
55s55 seconds ago
Response from @IanLaveryMP , Chair of the Labour Party: "This is absolute chaos and Theresa May has no authority left. The Prime Minister is in office but not in power. We can't go on like this. Britain needs a functioning government."
"Lewis Goodall
If May is Thatcher, Olly Robbins is Alan Walters, Davis is Howe- then Sajid Javid is surely John Major. Watch him very closely in the next 48 hours."
May is a goner.
Cabinet members who agreed on Friday and quit now cannot be trusted.
No replacement will magically erase the tories' problems.
No deal is the only game in town.
Corbyn will win the next election.
Vote for revolutionaries.
Not chancers, incompetents and profiteers,
I know you are a diehard Remainer who can't stand the fact most of your party's members and voters would rally behind a hard Brexit backing leader but there we are. Though I do agree if Corbyn gets in it will likely be scraping in propped up by minor parties trying to do his own Brexit fudge taking over where May left off and hammered on both sides by his pro EEA backbenchers and a hard Brexit backing Tory Leader of the Opposition
Javid as PM and Gove as chancellor, here we come.
Worst case scenario happens and government falls.
General election in August? (When I, and everyone else, is on holiday) Is that possible in 'modern' times, or would we have a long campaign to see us to September?
James Forsyth"
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2018/07/david-davis-resigns/
Only 11 days till parliamentry recess. It'll look farsical if MPs have to return to London to vote in a confidence vote after recess. And of course the Commons needs to be sitting to call an early election.
When No 10 briefed out the line that resigning ministers would have to get the taxi home, I thought that it was stupid. You don't bait your own team when you want them to support you. It's not strength, its desperation. Anyway, any sensible minister would wait to get home before resigning.
He should be more than an intellectual match for Barnier and if anyone can sell the Great May Brexit Fudge to the EU he probably can
I suspect that most party members will agree with DD's letter more than May's.