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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Ashcroft US poll finds 53% saying there are grounds to believe

SystemSystem Posts: 11,020
edited September 2018 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Ashcroft US poll finds 53% saying there are grounds to believe that Trump committed crimes that would warrant impeachment

A 6k sample poll of US voters has just been published by Lord Ashcroft and sets the scene for the important midterm elections that take place in the first week in November.

Read the full story here


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  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,860
    edited September 2018
    1st like Jezza in next GE
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,983
    Mr. Owls, we must hope not.
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,291
    bigjohnowls said:

    1st like Jezza in next GE

    For ever the optimist BJO
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,115
    Can't Vanilla do something about that first?
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,274
    edited September 2018
    Fifth!

    And from a dodgy wifi connection on Dutch railways, too.

    Like UKIP?
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    All this does is highlight the polarization in US. To some Trump can do no wrong, the others every single thing he does is absolutely the worst thing ever.

    I did have to chuckle at the NYT editorial piece the other day where they actually stated there were no political scandals during Obama's administration. Now obviously if we set the bar by standards of Trump sure, but none, nadda, like really...
  • Options
    logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,715
    IanB2 said:

    Fifth!

    And from a dodgy wifi connection on Dutch railways, too.

    Like UKIP?

    Sixth surely - Tory/Lab/SNP/LibDem/Green/UKIP
  • Options
    RobDRobD Posts: 58,967
    FrancisUrquhart said:

    All this does is highlight the polarization in US. To some Trump can do no wrong, the others every single thing he does is absolutely the worst thing ever.

    I did have to chuckle at the NYT editorial piece the other day where they actually stated there were no political scandals during Obama's administration. Now obviously if we set the bar by standards of Trump sure, but none, nadda, like really...

    Says a lot about the NYT....
  • Options
    logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,715
    logical_song said:

    IanB2 said:

    Fifth!

    And from a dodgy wifi connection on Dutch railways, too.

    Like UKIP?

    Sixth surely - Tory/Lab/SNP/LibDem/Green/UKIP
    Forgot DUP and SF I suppose.
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,653
    edited September 2018
    https://twitter.com/TomMcTague/status/1042429981652131852
    https://twitter.com/TomMcTague/status/1042429999897366530
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited September 2018
    RobD said:

    FrancisUrquhart said:

    All this does is highlight the polarization in US. To some Trump can do no wrong, the others every single thing he does is absolutely the worst thing ever.

    I did have to chuckle at the NYT editorial piece the other day where they actually stated there were no political scandals during Obama's administration. Now obviously if we set the bar by standards of Trump sure, but none, nadda, like really...

    Says a lot about the NYT....
    Yes well. They have lost their shit worse than Adonis over Brexit.

    It was the weirdest piece, as they tried to tie all the things they think are positive to the evils of Trump and how because Obama was so great nothing got changed e.g. there has been movement on gun control at state level, because Trump says stupid shit about it, but none under Obama because he was so in tune with the nation.
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    TrèsDifficileTrèsDifficile Posts: 1,729
    Does this mean that roughly 6% of the population think that Trump was unaware of collusion, but want him impeached anyway?
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    https://twitter.com/faisalislam/status/1042444401199525889
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,653
    Goodness - a very clear plurality - and almost a majority think Trump's campaign colluded with Russia and Trump knew.

    And we think we've got problems!
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    Momentum has said it will not block a debate on Brexit at the Labour conference, meaning the party could see members back a second referendum on the conference floor.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/sep/19/momentum-wont-block-second-brexit-vote-debate-at-labour-conference
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    SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,704
    Scott_P said:

    https://twitter.com/faisalislam/status/1042444401199525889

    It's in everyones interests to compromise and get a deal done...

    Shocker.
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    SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,704
    bigjohnowls said:

    1st like Jezza in next GE

    First to resign hopefully.
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    https://twitter.com/HTScotPol/status/1042445973279125504
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,653
    Tesla Inc. is under investigation by the Justice Department over public statements made by the company and Chief Executive Officer Elon Musk, according to two people familiar with the matter. The criminal probe is running alongside a previously reported civil inquiry by securities regulators.

    Federal prosecutors opened a fraud investigation after Musk tweeted last month that he was contemplating taking Tesla private and had “funding secured” for the deal, said the people, who were granted anonymity to discuss a confidential criminal probe. The tweet initially sent the company’s shares higher.

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-09-18/tesla-is-said-to-face-u-s-criminal-probe-over-musk-statements
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    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,291
    Scott_P said:

    https://twitter.com/faisalislam/status/1042444401199525889

    Is that a first for Islam - the arch remainer daring to flag up a problem for Barnier
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,653
    Scott_P said:

    https://twitter.com/HTScotPol/status/1042445973279125504

    To add insult to injury they don't even get his name right....
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited September 2018
    CarlottaVance said:

    Tesla Inc. is under investigation by the Justice Department over public statements made by the company and Chief Executive Officer Elon Musk, according to two people familiar with the matter. The criminal probe is running alongside a previously reported civil inquiry by securities regulators.

    Federal prosecutors opened a fraud investigation after Musk tweeted last month that he was contemplating taking Tesla private and had “funding secured” for the deal, said the people, who were granted anonymity to discuss a confidential criminal probe. The tweet initially sent the company’s shares higher.

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-09-18/tesla-is-said-to-face-u-s-criminal-probe-over-musk-statements

    image
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    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,291
    CarlottaVance said:

    Scott_P said:

    https://twitter.com/HTScotPol/status/1042445973279125504

    To add insult to injury they don't even get his name right....
    Good to see Ruth winning the day
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,995
    What the polling shows is that any impeachment proceedings if the Democrats took the House would go on partisan lines exactly as the Clinton impeachment proceedings in 1998
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    https://twitter.com/BBCPhilipSim/status/1042448106216988673
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    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,896
    India laying down the runs. This isn’t going to last 25 overs.
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    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,607
    @rcs1000 just saw that Goldman is selling Simon, trouble brewing or just cashing in on an overvalued asset?
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    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,611
    TrèsDifficile said:

    Does this mean that roughly 6% of the population think that Trump was unaware of collusion, but want him impeached anyway?

    There are any number of other offences worthy of impeachment!
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,653
    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    At least six million passengers on UK-originating flights transferring in the continent would have to group through extra security and screening before embarking on their second journey.

    The claims come in a confidential memo sent by the Airports Council International - the EU airport lobby to Michel Barnier, Brussels' chief Brexit negotiator.

    They demand "urgently" that the UK be allowed to stay as part of the "one-stop security" regime, which allows for the current free flow of transferring passengers.

    EU airports would not be ready, the industry warned, even though UK airports will be unaffected.

    https://news.sky.com/story/eu-airports-unable-to-cope-with-safety-risks-of-no-deal-brexit-leaked-memo-reveals-11502372
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    Foxy said:

    TrèsDifficile said:

    Does this mean that roughly 6% of the population think that Trump was unaware of collusion, but want him impeached anyway?

    There are any number of other offences worthy of impeachment!
    Allegedly...
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,059
    https://twitter.com/darranmarshall/status/1042444642904666112?s=21
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    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,291
    CarlottaVance said:

    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    At least six million passengers on UK-originating flights transferring in the continent would have to group through extra security and screening before embarking on their second journey.

    The claims come in a confidential memo sent by the Airports Council International - the EU airport lobby to Michel Barnier, Brussels' chief Brexit negotiator.

    They demand "urgently" that the UK be allowed to stay as part of the "one-stop security" regime, which allows for the current free flow of transferring passengers.

    EU airports would not be ready, the industry warned, even though UK airports will be unaffected.

    https://news.sky.com/story/eu-airports-unable-to-cope-with-safety-risks-of-no-deal-brexit-leaked-memo-reveals-11502372

    This is only the start. When EU countries realise we could no deal Brexit the pressure on Barnier and the EU will be a crisis of their own making
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,291
    williamglenn said:

    https://twitter.com/darranmarshall/status/1042444642904666112?s=21

    And the whole will leave
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    MortimerMortimer Posts: 13,942
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    At least six million passengers on UK-originating flights transferring in the continent would have to group through extra security and screening before embarking on their second journey.

    The claims come in a confidential memo sent by the Airports Council International - the EU airport lobby to Michel Barnier, Brussels' chief Brexit negotiator.

    They demand "urgently" that the UK be allowed to stay as part of the "one-stop security" regime, which allows for the current free flow of transferring passengers.

    EU airports would not be ready, the industry warned, even though UK airports will be unaffected.

    https://news.sky.com/story/eu-airports-unable-to-cope-with-safety-risks-of-no-deal-brexit-leaked-memo-reveals-11502372

    This is only the start. When EU countries realise we could no deal Brexit the pressure on Barnier and the EU will be a crisis of their own making
    I wonder what the French for ‘overplaying a strong hand’ is...
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,291
    Mortimer said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    At least six million passengers on UK-originating flights transferring in the continent would have to group through extra security and screening before embarking on their second journey.

    The claims come in a confidential memo sent by the Airports Council International - the EU airport lobby to Michel Barnier, Brussels' chief Brexit negotiator.

    They demand "urgently" that the UK be allowed to stay as part of the "one-stop security" regime, which allows for the current free flow of transferring passengers.

    EU airports would not be ready, the industry warned, even though UK airports will be unaffected.

    https://news.sky.com/story/eu-airports-unable-to-cope-with-safety-risks-of-no-deal-brexit-leaked-memo-reveals-11502372

    This is only the start. When EU countries realise we could no deal Brexit the pressure on Barnier and the EU will be a crisis of their own making
    I wonder what the French for ‘overplaying a strong hand’ is...
    Mon Dieu
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,860
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    At least six million passengers on UK-originating flights transferring in the continent would have to group through extra security and screening before embarking on their second journey.

    The claims come in a confidential memo sent by the Airports Council International - the EU airport lobby to Michel Barnier, Brussels' chief Brexit negotiator.

    They demand "urgently" that the UK be allowed to stay as part of the "one-stop security" regime, which allows for the current free flow of transferring passengers.

    EU airports would not be ready, the industry warned, even though UK airports will be unaffected.

    https://news.sky.com/story/eu-airports-unable-to-cope-with-safety-risks-of-no-deal-brexit-leaked-memo-reveals-11502372

    This is only the start. When EU countries realise we could no deal Brexit the pressure on Barnier and the EU will be a crisis of their own making
    Parliament will not agree a No Deal BREXIT

    You are still in we hold all the cards mindset when in fact Mrs May has a handful of Old Maids
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,291
    bigjohnowls said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    At least six million passengers on UK-originating flights transferring in the continent would have to group through extra security and screening before embarking on their second journey.

    The claims come in a confidential memo sent by the Airports Council International - the EU airport lobby to Michel Barnier, Brussels' chief Brexit negotiator.

    They demand "urgently" that the UK be allowed to stay as part of the "one-stop security" regime, which allows for the current free flow of transferring passengers.

    EU airports would not be ready, the industry warned, even though UK airports will be unaffected.

    https://news.sky.com/story/eu-airports-unable-to-cope-with-safety-risks-of-no-deal-brexit-leaked-memo-reveals-11502372

    This is only the start. When EU countries realise we could no deal Brexit the pressure on Barnier and the EU will be a crisis of their own making
    Parliament will not agree a No Deal BREXIT

    You are still in we hold all the cards mindset when in fact Mrs May has a handful of Old Maids
    No I agree but high stakes poker all the way to the wire
  • Options
    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Lock him up! Lock him up!
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,586
    HYUFD said:

    What the polling shows is that any impeachment proceedings if the Democrats took the House would go on partisan lines exactly as the Clinton impeachment proceedings in 1998

    Until you’ve seen what evidence might be laid before Congress, that would be a premature judgment.
    Of course here will be a core of his support who stick with Trump whatever happens - but that was also true of Nixon.
    What gets presented to Congress is far likelier to be along Nixonian than Clintonian lines. And Mueller is, after all, a lifelong Republican.
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,653
    Number 10 raising their game?

    https://twitter.com/10DowningStreet/status/1042454098795225088
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,653
    bigjohnowls said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    At least six million passengers on UK-originating flights transferring in the continent would have to group through extra security and screening before embarking on their second journey.

    The claims come in a confidential memo sent by the Airports Council International - the EU airport lobby to Michel Barnier, Brussels' chief Brexit negotiator.

    They demand "urgently" that the UK be allowed to stay as part of the "one-stop security" regime, which allows for the current free flow of transferring passengers.

    EU airports would not be ready, the industry warned, even though UK airports will be unaffected.

    https://news.sky.com/story/eu-airports-unable-to-cope-with-safety-risks-of-no-deal-brexit-leaked-memo-reveals-11502372

    This is only the start. When EU countries realise we could no deal Brexit the pressure on Barnier and the EU will be a crisis of their own making
    Parliament will not agree a No Deal BREXIT
    No deal Brexit is the default - they have to agree something else to stop it happening.
  • Options
    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Mortimer said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    At least six million passengers on UK-originating flights transferring in the continent would have to group through extra security and screening before embarking on their second journey.

    The claims come in a confidential memo sent by the Airports Council International - the EU airport lobby to Michel Barnier, Brussels' chief Brexit negotiator.

    They demand "urgently" that the UK be allowed to stay as part of the "one-stop security" regime, which allows for the current free flow of transferring passengers.

    EU airports would not be ready, the industry warned, even though UK airports will be unaffected.

    https://news.sky.com/story/eu-airports-unable-to-cope-with-safety-risks-of-no-deal-brexit-leaked-memo-reveals-11502372

    This is only the start. When EU countries realise we could no deal Brexit the pressure on Barnier and the EU will be a crisis of their own making
    I wonder what the French for ‘overplaying a strong hand’ is...
    How swiftly and seamlessly the headbangers have moved on from “we hold all the cards”.
  • Options
    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    And on the subject of alleged political law breakers:

    https://twitter.com/ftbrussels/status/1042423886934093824?s=21
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    LordOfReasonLordOfReason Posts: 457
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    At least six million passengers on UK-originating flights transferring in the continent would have to group through extra security and screening before embarking on their second journey.

    EU airports would not be ready, the industry warned, even though UK airports will be unaffected.

    https://news.sky.com/story/eu-airports-unable-to-cope-with-safety-risks-of-no-deal-brexit-leaked-memo-reveals-11502372

    This is only the start. When EU countries realise we could no deal Brexit the pressure on Barnier and the EU will be a crisis of their own making
    Totally disagree with you, you are becoming as over optimistic as the Daily Express on this. In fact the very opposite of what you are saying is actually happening, the EU negotiation is no longer properly based on avoiding pain to both sides, just deadlocked in political sticking points. Everything the EU now says smacks to me of “we are being as helpful and accommodating as we can, if it’s no deal definitely not our fault gov.”

    It’s beginning to stink of it. Can’t you smell it? Not only are they already winning the no deal blame game by getting to the microphones first, they have taken decision to only negotiate properly after a British General Election.

    The EU taking note of what Corbyn shadow cabinet, PLP, labour members, union backers and labour supporters saying, benchmarked against the failing bluster of Corbyns official position and the counterpoint to wriggle of any Tory leader, and this is hurting our Governments honest attempts at negotiation.

    Because of the better deal EU will get for themselves from a Labour (or lab/libdem) negotiating team, they are not going to properly negotiate with us this side of a GE. I am more convinced every hour, no deal and delay is EUs tactics playing out in front of our eyes. And they are going to sneak the blame on our government as best they can.

    Of course I haven't come to this conclusion reading the Daily Express. Down at the Express they seem to be swallowing all the EU lies and machination as positive progress at the moment. What’s wrong with the editorial team at the Express and yourselves don’t you read The Sun?
  • Options
    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,081
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Scott_P said:

    https://twitter.com/HTScotPol/status/1042445973279125504

    To add insult to injury they don't even get his name right....
    Good to see Ruth winning the day
    Since the SCon education spokesperson, their 2016 manifesto and Ruth herself have spoken in favour of P1 testing, it'll be fascinating to see the justifications for this umpteenth u turn.
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,291
    AlastairMeeks said:

    Mortimer said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    At least six million passengers on UK-originating flights transferring in the continent would have to group through extra security and screening before embarking on their second journey.

    The claims come in a confidential memo sent by the Airports Council International - the EU airport lobby to Michel Barnier, Brussels' chief Brexit negotiator.

    They demand "urgently" that the UK be allowed to stay as part of the "one-stop security" regime, which allows for the current free flow of transferring passengers.

    EU airports would not be ready, the industry warned, even though UK airports will be unaffected.

    https://news.sky.com/story/eu-airports-unable-to-cope-with-safety-risks-of-no-deal-brexit-leaked-memo-reveals-11502372

    This is only the start. When EU countries realise we could no deal Brexit the pressure on Barnier and the EU will be a crisis of their own making
    I wonder what the French for ‘overplaying a strong hand’ is...
    How swiftly and seamlessly the headbangers have moved on from “we hold all the cards”.
    Neither side holds all the cards. That is why it is a negotiation but good to see Barnier getting it for his grandstanding
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,932
    Scott_P said:

    https://twitter.com/HTScotPol/status/1042445973279125504

    Those pygmy pipsqueaks should be told where to get off, especially the duplitious Tories who whinged for years to get them and now have voted against in political chicanery.
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    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,334
    It'd be interesting to meet some of the 1% who think that Trump colluded deliberately with Russia AND they support him, and the 9% who think he may (OK, "may") have committed impeachable offences but they back him anyway. All those Putin hackers making inroads...
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    oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,831
    Looks like Mr Murray has been at the paranoia juice.

    All he can see is conspiracies...

    https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2018/09/deep-state-trying-undermine-corbyn
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,995
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    At least six million passengers on UK-originating flights transferring in the continent would have to group through extra security and screening before embarking on their second journey.

    The claims come in a confidential memo sent by the Airports Council International - the EU airport lobby to Michel Barnier, Brussels' chief Brexit negotiator.

    They demand "urgently" that the UK be allowed to stay as part of the "one-stop security" regime, which allows for the current free flow of transferring passengers.

    EU airports would not be ready, the industry warned, even though UK airports will be unaffected.

    https://news.sky.com/story/eu-airports-unable-to-cope-with-safety-risks-of-no-deal-brexit-leaked-memo-reveals-11502372

    This is only the start. When EU countries realise we could no deal Brexit the pressure on Barnier and the EU will be a crisis of their own making
    We won't no deal Brexit, Parliament would vote for a second EU referendum first which Remain would likely win
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,932
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Scott_P said:

    https://twitter.com/HTScotPol/status/1042445973279125504

    To add insult to injury they don't even get his name right....
    Good to see Ruth winning the day
    G, don't be a silly Billy , she is a third rate loser, scared to debate anything , an empty vessel and has more faces than the town clock.
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    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,291
    LordOfReason said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    At least six million passengers on UK-originating flights transferring in the continent would have to group through extra security and screening before embarking on their second journey.

    EU airports would not be ready, the industry warned, even though UK airports will be unaffected.

    https://news.sky.com/story/eu-airports-unable-to-cope-with-safety-risks-of-no-deal-brexit-leaked-memo-reveals-11502372

    This is only the start. When EU countries realise we could no deal Brexit the pressure on Barnier and the EU will be a crisis of their own making
    Totally disagree with you, you are becoming as over optimistic as the Daily Express on this. In fact the very opposite of what you are saying is actually happening, the EU negotiation is no longer properly based on avoiding pain to both sides, just deadlocked in political sticking points. Everything the EU now says smacks to me of “we are being as helpful and accommodating as we can, if it’s no deal definitely not our fault gov.”

    It’s beginning to stink of it. Can’t you smell it? Not only are they already winning the no deal blame game by getting to the microphones first, they have taken decision to only negotiate properly after a British General Election.

    The EU taking note of what Corbyn shadow cabinet, PLP, labour members, union backers and labour supporters saying, benchmarked against the failing bluster of Corbyns official position and the counterpoint to wriggle of any Tory leader, and this is hurting our Governments honest attempts at negotiation.

    Because of the better deal EU will get for themselves from a Labour (or lab/libdem) negotiating team, they are not going to properly negotiate with us this side of a GE. I am more convinced every hour, no deal and delay is EUs tactics playing out in front of our eyes. And they are going to sneak the blame on our government as best they can.

    Of course I haven't come to this conclusion reading the Daily Express. Down at the Express they seem to be swallowing all the EU lies and machination as positive progress at the moment. What’s wrong with the editorial team at the Express and yourselves don’t you read The Sun?
    I do not read the daily express, neither the sun, do not want a no deal Brexit, and do not accept your gloom about our negotiating position.
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,995
    Nigelb said:

    HYUFD said:

    What the polling shows is that any impeachment proceedings if the Democrats took the House would go on partisan lines exactly as the Clinton impeachment proceedings in 1998

    Until you’ve seen what evidence might be laid before Congress, that would be a premature judgment.
    Of course here will be a core of his support who stick with Trump whatever happens - but that was also true of Nixon.
    What gets presented to Congress is far likelier to be along Nixonian than Clintonian lines. And Mueller is, after all, a lifelong Republican.
    Nixon did not have around 90% of Republicans supporting him as Trump does now according to the Ashcroft poll
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,932
    CarlottaVance said:

    Scott_P said:

    https://twitter.com/HTScotPol/status/1042445973279125504

    To add insult to injury they don't even get his name right....
    what would you expect from Scottish media, they employ monkeys instead of journalists.
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,291
    Theuniondivvie said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Scott_P said:

    https://twitter.com/HTScotPol/status/1042445973279125504

    To add insult to injury they don't even get his name right....
    Good to see Ruth winning the day
    Since the SCon education spokesperson, their 2016 manifesto and Ruth herself have spoken in favour of P1 testing, it'll be fascinating to see the justifications for this umpteenth u turn.
    Politics isn't it
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,995
    LordOfReason said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    At least six million passengers on UK-originating flights transferring in the continent would have to group through extra security and screening before embarking on their second journey.

    EU airports would not be ready, the industry warned, even though UK airports will be unaffected.

    https://news.sky.com/story/eu-airports-unable-to-cope-with-safety-risks-of-no-deal-brexit-leaked-memo-reveals-11502372

    This is only the start. When EU countries realise we could no deal Brexit the pressure on Barnier and the EU will be a crisis of their own making
    Totally disagree with you, you are becoming as over optimistic as the Daily Express on this. In fact the very opposite of what you are saying is actually happening, the EU negotiation is no longer properly based on avoiding pain to both sides, just deadlocked in political sticking points. Everything the EU now says smacks to me of “we are being as helpful and accommodating as we can, if it’s no deal definitely not our fault gov.”

    It’s beginning to stink of it. Can’t you smell it? Not only are they already winning the no deal blame game by getting to the microphones first, they have taken decision to only negotiate properly after a British General Election.

    The EU taking note of what Corbyn shadow cabinet, PLP, labour members, union backers and labour supporters saying, benchmarked against the failing bluster of Corbyns official position and the counterpoint to wriggle of any Tory leader, and this is hurting our Governments honest attempts at negotiation.

    Because of the better deal EU will get for themselves from a Labour (or lab/libdem) negotiating team, they are not going to properly negotiate with us this side of a GE. I am more convinced every hour, no deal and delay is EUs tactics playing out in front of our eyes. And they are going to sneak the blame on our government as best they can.

    Of course I haven't come to this conclusion reading the Daily Express. Down at the Express they seem to be swallowing all the EU lies and machination as positive progress at the moment. What’s wrong with the editorial team at the Express and yourselves don’t you read The Sun?
    A Corbyn Brexit would be indistinguishable from a May Brexit in most areas
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,932
    MaxPB said:

    @rcs1000 just saw that Goldman is selling Simon, trouble brewing or just cashing in on an overvalued asset?

    If in trouble I doubt $100M valuation will do much to help
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,291
    malcolmg said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Scott_P said:

    https://twitter.com/HTScotPol/status/1042445973279125504

    To add insult to injury they don't even get his name right....
    Good to see Ruth winning the day
    G, don't be a silly Billy , she is a third rate loser, scared to debate anything , an empty vessel and has more faces than the town clock.
    Still she won this vote
  • Options
    LordOfReasonLordOfReason Posts: 457
    Nigelb said:

    HYUFD said:

    What the polling shows is that any impeachment proceedings if the Democrats took the House would go on partisan lines exactly as the Clinton impeachment proceedings in 1998

    Until you’ve seen what evidence might be laid before Congress, that would be a premature judgment.
    Of course here will be a core of his support who stick with Trump whatever happens - but that was also true of Nixon.
    What gets presented to Congress is far likelier to be along Nixonian than Clintonian lines. And Mueller is, after all, a lifelong Republican.
    On a life raft, sinking into a storm, about to die, an escape rope comes down to the Democrats and they impeach it? There is absolutely zero chance of Democrat’s impeaching Trump, he is mana from heaven to them in ballot boxes.

    Bread of heaven bread of heaven tweet me till I want no more
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,653
    LordOfReason said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    At least six million passengers on UK-originating flights transferring in the continent would have to group through extra security and screening before embarking on their second journey.

    EU airports would not be ready, the industry warned, even though UK airports will be unaffected.

    https://news.sky.com/story/eu-airports-unable-to-cope-with-safety-risks-of-no-deal-brexit-leaked-memo-reveals-11502372

    This is only the start. When EU countries realise we could no deal Brexit the pressure on Barnier and the EU will be a crisis of their own making
    Totally disagree with you
    Amsterdam's Schiphol would have to undergo "significant and expensive terminal infrastructure modifications", including a €100m (£88m) third level at one of its terminals.

    This would take three years and lead to a "highly degraded quality of service" with spillovers beyond UK flights, and require a more than doubling in its fleet of transfer buses from 21 to 46.

    "Yet the airport layout and roadways are not designed to accommodate this number of buses and thus there would be major disruption and a heightened safety risk on the airside of the airport," the document warns.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,932
    CarlottaVance said:

    Number 10 raising their game?

    https://twitter.com/10DowningStreet/status/1042454098795225088

    scraping the barrel more like, fiddling while Rome burns, that and trying to package up the social housing money as new money. They are near bottom big time.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,932
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Theuniondivvie said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Scott_P said:

    https://twitter.com/HTScotPol/status/1042445973279125504

    To add insult to injury they don't even get his name right....
    Good to see Ruth winning the day
    Since the SCon education spokesperson, their 2016 manifesto and Ruth herself have spoken in favour of P1 testing, it'll be fascinating to see the justifications for this umpteenth u turn.
    Politics isn't it
    G , Hopefully they will be treated with the contempt they deserve.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,932
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    malcolmg said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Scott_P said:

    https://twitter.com/HTScotPol/status/1042445973279125504

    To add insult to injury they don't even get his name right....
    Good to see Ruth winning the day
    G, don't be a silly Billy , she is a third rate loser, scared to debate anything , an empty vessel and has more faces than the town clock.
    Still she won this vote
    hardly , her small bunch of losers could only help Labour win it , with of course the remaining scumbags of LD's and greens
  • Options
    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,081
    https://twitter.com/LadPolitics/status/1042443461369192449?s=19
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,059
    edited September 2018
    CarlottaVance said:

    LordOfReason said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    At least six million passengers on UK-originating flights transferring in the continent would have to group through extra security and screening before embarking on their second journey.

    EU airports would not be ready, the industry warned, even though UK airports will be unaffected.

    https://news.sky.com/story/eu-airports-unable-to-cope-with-safety-risks-of-no-deal-brexit-leaked-memo-reveals-11502372

    This is only the start. When EU countries realise we could no deal Brexit the pressure on Barnier and the EU will be a crisis of their own making
    Totally disagree with you
    Amsterdam's Schiphol would have to undergo "significant and expensive terminal infrastructure modifications", including a €100m (£88m) third level at one of its terminals.

    This would take three years and lead to a "highly degraded quality of service" with spillovers beyond UK flights, and require a more than doubling in its fleet of transfer buses from 21 to 46.

    "Yet the airport layout and roadways are not designed to accommodate this number of buses and thus there would be major disruption and a heightened safety risk on the airside of the airport," the document warns.
    Mutually assured economic destructing is not a useful negotiation position, especially if you have a weak political position. The UK's threat of No Deal is less credible than Tsipras's threat to leave the Euro.
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,860
    Not a good look.


    @ChukaUmunna
    Follow Follow @ChukaUmunna
    More
    I've been speaking to EU diplomats ahead of the Salzburg Summit tomorrow. They are adamant that if the British people wanted a People's Vote, the door is always open and we would be granted the time to do so.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,896
    Pakistan fans leaving, only 30ovs to go...
  • Options
    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,081
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Theuniondivvie said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Scott_P said:

    https://twitter.com/HTScotPol/status/1042445973279125504

    To add insult to injury they don't even get his name right....
    Good to see Ruth winning the day
    Since the SCon education spokesperson, their 2016 manifesto and Ruth herself have spoken in favour of P1 testing, it'll be fascinating to see the justifications for this umpteenth u turn.
    Politics isn't it
    Certainly the defining element of SCon politics.
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,059
    https://twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/1042458687355408385
    https://twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/1042458912375615488
  • Options
    LordOfReasonLordOfReason Posts: 457
    CarlottaVance said:

    LordOfReason said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    At least six million passengers on UK-originating flights transferring in the continent would have to group through extra security and screening before embarking on their second journey.

    EU airports would not be ready, the industry warned, even though UK airports will be unaffected.

    https://news.sky.com/story/eu-airports-unable-to-cope-with-safety-risks-of-no-deal-brexit-leaked-memo-reveals-11502372

    This is only the start. When EU countries realise we could no deal Brexit the pressure on Barnier and the EU will be a crisis of their own making
    Totally disagree with you
    Amsterdam's Schiphol would have to undergo "significant and expensive terminal infrastructure modifications", including a €100m (£88m) third level at one of its terminals.

    This would take three years and lead to a "highly degraded quality of service" with spillovers beyond UK flights, and require a more than doubling in its fleet of transfer buses from 21 to 46.

    "Yet the airport layout and roadways are not designed to accommodate this number of buses and thus there would be major disruption and a heightened safety risk on the airside of the airport," the document warns.
    Dont be silly Carlo, this petty little issue, one of many others in pipeline I am sure, easily tidied here and there doesnt mean they cave in completely to us on the major sticking points! it’s not going to be troo no deal but a no deal plus, espiecilly on security.

    And I have told you your latest profile photo oversteps on what is acceptable? It makes my tongue go hard every time I stare at it.
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,291
    Vox pox on ITV Wales from a market in Swansea and very few have changed their mind, most wanting to leave. Quite surprised and certainly if I wanted a second referendum it would have concerned me
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,995
    edited September 2018
    EU airports tell Barnier they are not ready for a No Deal Brexit

    https://mobile.twitter.com/faisalislam/status/1042444401199525889
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,860
    williamglenn said:

    https://twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/1042458687355408385
    https://twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/1042458912375615488

    Shh dont mention a GE
  • Options
    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,081
    malcolmg said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Number 10 raising their game?

    https://twitter.com/10DowningStreet/status/1042454098795225088

    scraping the barrel more like, fiddling while Rome burns, that and trying to package up the social housing money as new money. They are near bottom big time.
    Tessy might get a couple of flash outfits out of it, which may be a mixed blessing.
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,653
    williamglenn said:

    https://twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/1042458687355408385
    https://twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/1042458912375615488

    The latest straw.....in a long line of straws.....
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,291
    CarlottaVance said:

    williamglenn said:

    https://twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/1042458687355408385
    https://twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/1042458912375615488

    The latest straw.....in a long line of straws.....
    They are mad as a March hare. TM going for another election, really, just utter desperation
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,860
    https://twitter.com/ChukaUmunna/status/1041997574356586496
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,860
    https://twitter.com/jlocke13/status/1042024266739445760
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited September 2018
    "18% of the population are disabled"

    https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-45572663

    I would be interested to know what they include to come up with that figure, and what is that figure if you exclude extremely old people (who wouldn't be looking for a job in the entertainment industry).

    1 in 5, that seems a very high figure, so I am presuming by disabled, they mean have a disability, so including things like mental health.

    Which then begs the question are the likes of the BBC going to go around asking people about "hidden" disabilities to ensure they make up their quota?
  • Options
    FregglesFreggles Posts: 3,486
    bigjohnowls said:

    https://twitter.com/jlocke13/status/1042024266739445760

    Good thing your hero Jez has never flip flopped on the EU....
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    Freggles said:

    bigjohnowls said:

    https://twitter.com/jlocke13/status/1042024266739445760

    Good thing your hero Jez has never flip flopped on the EU....
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/sep/19/momentum-wont-block-second-brexit-vote-debate-at-labour-conference

    Going to require some limbo dancing.
  • Options
    rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,908
    One of the areas where I disagree with what I think is the received wisdom on here, is I think Trump won't make it through his first term. There is a lot more Mueller evidence to come, the dominos are falling one by one, with Manafort now flipped.

    The case for Russian interference is proven in the court of public opinion. Already 43% of independents think Trump is guilty. That number is only going to get worse.
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    Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256
    williamglenn said:

    Mutually assured economic destructing is not a useful negotiation position, especially if you have a weak political position. The UK's threat of No Deal is less credible than Tsipras's threat to leave the Euro.

    The new secret strategy is to leave, placating the Leavers, but once out to unilaterally join Schengen and the Euro thus buying off the Remainers and solving all the transport and currency conversion issues in one fell swoop....

    What is not to like? :D:D
  • Options
    RobDRobD Posts: 58,967
    edited September 2018
    williamglenn said:

    https://twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/1042458687355408385
    https://twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/1042458912375615488

    Because it would be stupid to say there was going to be no referendum ever again on the topic. People really do read too much into things sometimes.
  • Options
    RobDRobD Posts: 58,967
    Beverley_C said:

    williamglenn said:

    Mutually assured economic destructing is not a useful negotiation position, especially if you have a weak political position. The UK's threat of No Deal is less credible than Tsipras's threat to leave the Euro.

    The new secret strategy is to leave, placating the Leavers, but once out to unilaterally join Schengen and the Euro thus buying off the Remainers and solving all the transport and currency conversion issues in one fell swoop....

    What is not to like? :D:D
    You'd like to be a member of the Euro? Madness!
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,291
    Beverley_C said:

    williamglenn said:

    Mutually assured economic destructing is not a useful negotiation position, especially if you have a weak political position. The UK's threat of No Deal is less credible than Tsipras's threat to leave the Euro.

    The new secret strategy is to leave, placating the Leavers, but once out to unilaterally join Schengen and the Euro thus buying off the Remainers and solving all the transport and currency conversion issues in one fell swoop....

    What is not to like? :D:D
    To be honest that is a perfectly fair option for those who want to campaign for it but we must leave first
  • Options
    LordOfReasonLordOfReason Posts: 457
    HYUFD said:

    LordOfReason said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    This is only the start. When EU countries realise we could no deal Brexit the pressure on Barnier and the EU will be a crisis of their own making
    Totally disagree with you, In fact the very opposite of what you are saying is actually happening, the EU negotiation is no longer properly based on avoiding pain to both sides, just deadlocked in political sticking points. Everything the EU now says smacks to me of “we are being as helpful and accommodating as we can, if it’s no deal definitely not our fault gov.”

    Not only are they already winning the no deal blame game by getting to the microphones first, they have taken decision to only negotiate properly after a British General Election.

    The EU taking note of what Corbyn shadow cabinet, PLP, labour members, union backers and labour supporters saying, benchmarked against the failing bluster of Corbyns official position and the counterpoint to wriggle of any Tory leader, and this is hurting our Governments honest attempts at negotiation.

    Because of the better deal EU will get for themselves from a Labour (or lab/libdem) negotiating team, they are not going to properly negotiate with us this side of a GE. I am more convinced every hour, no deal and delay is EUs tactics playing out in front of our eyes. And they are going to sneak the blame on our government as best they can.

    A Corbyn Brexit would be indistinguishable from a May Brexit in most areas
    Fascinating how you can know that, when Starmer and Corbyn have had years to clarify, yet no one is any the wiser on what Labours position actually is, except you. :) in a custom union, but not THE custom union? Can Anyone explain that?
    What we can be clear about, if Corbyns position is just as you say it is, indistinguishable from May’s, it’s probably in about 1 to 5 minority position in the labour movement, not even backed by the union masters or Momentum praetorian guards! In other words, even if Corbyn were to write in agreeing with what you said, it wouldn’t be worth the paper it was written on, not that he would, as “I would do the same as Tess” is hardly what he has been spinning.

    If there was a GE and Labour won it, EU would get a better deal for themselves out of us. fact. And it’s a fact that is now torpedoing May’s deal.
  • Options
    StereotomyStereotomy Posts: 4,092
    LordOfReason said:

    Nigelb said:

    HYUFD said:

    What the polling shows is that any impeachment proceedings if the Democrats took the House would go on partisan lines exactly as the Clinton impeachment proceedings in 1998

    Until you’ve seen what evidence might be laid before Congress, that would be a premature judgment.
    Of course here will be a core of his support who stick with Trump whatever happens - but that was also true of Nixon.
    What gets presented to Congress is far likelier to be along Nixonian than Clintonian lines. And Mueller is, after all, a lifelong Republican.
    On a life raft, sinking into a storm, about to die, an escape rope comes down to the Democrats and they impeach it? There is absolutely zero chance of Democrat’s impeaching Trump, he is mana from heaven to them in ballot boxes.

    Bread of heaven bread of heaven tweet me till I want no more
    Eh, impeaching plays to the base and it wouldn't actually remove him since the Senate would vote against (unless the GOP decides to ditch Trump)
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,667
    edited September 2018
    RobD said:

    williamglenn said:

    https://twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/1042458687355408385
    https://twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/1042458912375615488

    Because it would be stupid to say there was going to be no referendum ever again on the topic. People really do read too much into things sometimes.
    That's nonsense. May could quite happily put her name to a document 'promising that there will be no second vote on leaving the EU' without the caveat, if she wanted. After all, it would not tie her successors in any way would it, since they would not feel bound by it?
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,426
    Theuniondivvie said:

    https://twitter.com/LadPolitics/status/1042443461369192449?s=19

    If it wasn’t for my legendary modesty I’d be telling you all I tipped that and this.

    https://twitter.com/ladpolitics/status/1042450593510563840?s=21
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,995
    LordOfReason said:

    HYUFD said:

    LordOfReason said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    This is only the start. When EU countries realise we could no deal Brexit the pressure on Barnier and the EU will be a crisis of their own making
    Totally disagree with you, In fact the very opposite of what you are saying is actually happening, the EU negotiation is no longer properly based on avoiding pain to both sides, just deadlocked in political sticking points. Everything the EU now says smacks to me gotiate with us this side of a GE. I am more convinced every hour, no deal and delay is EUs tactics playing out in front of our eyes. And they are going to sneak the blame on our government as best they can.

    A Corbyn Brexit would be indistinguishable from a May Brexit in most areas
    Fascinating how you can know that, when Starmer and Corbyn have had years to clarify, yet no one is any the wiser on what Labours position actually is, except you. :) in a custom union, but not THE custom union? Can Anyone explain that?
    What we can be clear about, if Corbyns position is just as you say it is, indistinguishable from May’s, it’s probably in about 1 to 5 minority position in the labour movement, not even backed by the union masters or Momentum praetorian guards! In other words, even if Corbyn were to write in agreeing with what you said, it wouldn’t be worth the paper it was written on, not that he would, as “I would do the same as Tess” is hardly what he has been spinning.

    If there was a GE and Labour won it, EU would get a better deal for themselves out of us. fact. And it’s a fact that is now torpedoing May’s deal.
    A Corbyn Brexit would not be in the single market exactly as a May Brexit would, although the ultimate destination for both during any transition period would be effectively to be in the single market and customs union in all but name.

    It also assumes Corbyn would win a new general election, in fact based on Yougov yesterday May would win a small majority in a new general election
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    Benpointer said:

    RobD said:

    williamglenn said:

    https://twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/1042458687355408385
    https://twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/1042458912375615488

    Because it would be stupid to say there was going to be no referendum ever again on the topic. People really do read too much into things sometimes.
    That's nonsense. May could quite happily put her name to a document 'promising that there will be no second vote on leaving the EU' without the caveat, if she wanted. After all, it would not tie her successors in any way would it, since they would not feel bound by it?
    It would be natural to say "no second vote on leaving the EU *while I remain PM* to emphasize the point in her final sentence. "Within this parliament" is indeed weaselly.
  • Options
    LordOfReasonLordOfReason Posts: 457
    Stereotomy said:

    LordOfReason said:

    Nigelb said:

    HYUFD said:

    What the polling shows is that any impeachment proceedings if the Democrats took the House would go on partisan lines exactly as the Clinton impeachment proceedings in 1998

    Until you’ve seen what evidence might be laid before Congress, that would be a premature judgment.
    Of course here will be a core of his support who stick with Trump whatever happens - but that was also true of Nixon.
    What gets presented to Congress is far likelier to be along Nixonian than Clintonian lines. And Mueller is, after all, a lifelong Republican.
    On a life raft, sinking into a storm, about to die, an escape rope comes down to the Democrats and they impeach it? There is absolutely zero chance of Democrat’s impeaching Trump, he is mana from heaven to them in ballot boxes.

    Bread of heaven bread of heaven tweet me till I want no more
    Eh, impeaching plays to the base and it wouldn't actually remove him since the Senate would vote against (unless the GOP decides to ditch Trump)
    You what? If democrat house voted to impeach, what makes you sure democrat senate then blocks? The process will milk his weakness, but short of forcing his resignation.
    Say what you like about playing to the base, all Democrats smart enough to still want Trump there for elections in two years time. :) His wild policies havnt even trashed the economy yet.
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,667
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Vox pox on ITV Wales from a market in Swansea and very few have changed their mind, most wanting to leave. Quite surprised and certainly if I wanted a second referendum it would have concerned me

    It's a fair point Big_G but it only takes 'very few', in relative terms, to change their mind for it to be 52/48 the other way. Plus some, sadly, have shuffled off this mortal coil and I believe evidence suggests that the 16-18 year olds who have come onto the electoral roll in the past two years are overwhelmingly for Remain.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,896
    edited September 2018
    Well that was supposed to be a bucket-list sporting event to attend, but by the time the stadium filled up the result wasn’t in doubt and people started leaving. Back home two hours earlier than expected. Ho hum.
  • Options
    StereotomyStereotomy Posts: 4,092
    LordOfReason said:

    Stereotomy said:

    LordOfReason said:

    Nigelb said:

    HYUFD said:

    What the polling shows is that any impeachment proceedings if the Democrats took the House would go on partisan lines exactly as the Clinton impeachment proceedings in 1998

    Until you’ve seen what evidence might be laid before Congress, that would be a premature judgment.
    Of course here will be a core of his support who stick with Trump whatever happens - but that was also true of Nixon.
    What gets presented to Congress is far likelier to be along Nixonian than Clintonian lines. And Mueller is, after all, a lifelong Republican.
    On a life raft, sinking into a storm, about to die, an escape rope comes down to the Democrats and they impeach it? There is absolutely zero chance of Democrat’s impeaching Trump, he is mana from heaven to them in ballot boxes.

    Bread of heaven bread of heaven tweet me till I want no more
    Eh, impeaching plays to the base and it wouldn't actually remove him since the Senate would vote against (unless the GOP decides to ditch Trump)
    You what? If democrat house voted to impeach, what makes you sure democrat senate then blocks? The process will milk his weakness, but short of forcing his resignation.
    Say what you like about playing to the base, all Democrats smart enough to still want Trump there for elections in two years time. :) His wild policies havnt even trashed the economy yet.
    There aren't enough democrats in the senate to pass it without help from the GOP
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    LordOfReasonLordOfReason Posts: 457
    HYUFD said:

    LordOfReason said:

    HYUFD said:

    LordOfReason said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    European airports have privately warned that a "no-deal" Brexit would cause "major disruption and heightened safety risks", Sky News has learned.

    This is only the start. When EU countries realise we could no deal Brexit the pressure on Barnier and the EU will be a crisis of their own making
    Totally disagree with you, In fact the very opposite of what you are saying is actually happening, the EU negotiation is no longer properly based on avoiding pain to both sides, just deadlocked in political sticking points. Everything the EU now says smacks to me gotiate with us this side of a GE. I am more convinced every hour, no deal and delay is EUs tactics playing out in front of our eyes. And they are going to sneak the blame on our government as best they can.

    A Corbyn Brexit would be indistinguishable from a May Brexit in most areas
    Fascinating how you can know that, when Starmer and Corbyn have had years to clarify, yet no one is any the wiser on what Labours position actually is, except you. :) in a custom union, but not THE custom union? Can Anyone explain that?
    What we can be clear about, if Corbyns position is just as you say it is, indistinguishable from May’s, it’s probably in about 1 to 5 minority position in the labour movement, not even backed by the union masters or Momentum praetorian guards! In other words, even if Corbyn were to write in agreeing with what you said, it wouldn’t be worth the paper it was written on, not that he would, as “I would do the same as Tess” is hardly what he has been spinning.

    If there was a GE and Labour won it, EU would get a better deal for themselves out of us. fact. And it’s a fact that is now torpedoing May’s deal.
    A Corbyn Brexit would not be in the single market exactly as a May Brexit would, although the ultimate destination for both during any transition period would be effectively to be in the single market and customs union in all but name.

    It also assumes Corbyn would win a new general election, in fact based on Yougov yesterday May would win a small majority in a new general election
    The assumption is, there’s some crazy crazy game changing things hurtling down the tracks...
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    LordOfReasonLordOfReason Posts: 457
    Stereotomy said:

    LordOfReason said:

    Stereotomy said:

    LordOfReason said:

    Nigelb said:

    HYUFD said:

    What the polling shows is that any impeachment proceedings if the Democrats took the House would go on partisan lines exactly as the Clinton impeachment proceedings in 1998

    Until you’ve seen what evidence might be laid before Congress, that would be a premature judgment.
    Of course here will be a core of his support who stick with Trump whatever happens - but that was also true of Nixon.
    What gets presented to Congress is far likelier to be along Nixonian than Clintonian lines. And Mueller is, after all, a lifelong Republican.
    On a life raft, sinking into a storm, about to die, an escape rope comes down to the Democrats and they impeach it? There is absolutely zero chance of Democrat’s impeaching Trump, he is mana from heaven to them in ballot boxes.

    Bread of heaven bread of heaven tweet me till I want no more
    Eh, impeaching plays to the base and it wouldn't actually remove him since the Senate would vote against (unless the GOP decides to ditch Trump)
    You what? If democrat house voted to impeach, what makes you sure democrat senate then blocks? The process will milk his weakness, but short of forcing his resignation.
    Say what you like about playing to the base, all Democrats smart enough to still want Trump there for elections in two years time. :) His wild policies havnt even trashed the economy yet.
    There aren't enough democrats in the senate to pass it without help from the GOP
    Not yet. :) Keep watching.
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    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,667
    Given JRM has said the benefits might take 50 years to arrive maybe the 2nd referrendum should be limited to the under 50s, since those of us over 50 are never likely to see those 'benefits'. :smile:
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    Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256
    edited September 2018
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Beverley_C said:

    williamglenn said:

    Mutually assured economic destructing is not a useful negotiation position, especially if you have a weak political position. The UK's threat of No Deal is less credible than Tsipras's threat to leave the Euro.

    The new secret strategy is to leave, placating the Leavers, but once out to unilaterally join Schengen and the Euro thus buying off the Remainers and solving all the transport and currency conversion issues in one fell swoop....

    What is not to like? :D:D
    To be honest that is a perfectly fair option for those who want to campaign for it but we must leave first
    I thought I was being tongue-in-cheek... :open_mouth:

    I never realised this was govt policy
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