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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » How the next CON leader betting market has moved since last ye

SystemSystem Posts: 6,389
edited October 4 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » How the next CON leader betting market has moved since last year’s Conference

I love these historical charts of Betfair trades from Betdata.io and they are particularly interesting when you have events like the party conferences.

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Comments

  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 5,746
    first
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 30,975
    Second...
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 19,257
    Seems a fair summary. Raab is still a newbie, of course, and might improve as he gets more top-level experience.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 45,496
    Javid or Hunt both entirely possible, but think Mordaunt would clearly be the best.
  • Andy_CookeAndy_Cooke Posts: 1,038
    Whenever I write a longer comment, I think I'm going to end it with: "Oh, by the way, New Thread just coming..."
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 12,225
    Javid may well do well with the MP’s, but I’m not sure that the members are ready for him yet. Of course Disraeli was Conservative, so that might not be the case, although of course the membership had no role in leadership then.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 45,496
    King Cole, MPs will determine the final two. So it's a necessary but not sufficient step to get support from them.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 19,257

    Javid may well do well with the MP’s, but I’m not sure that the members are ready for him yet. Of course Disraeli was Conservative, so that might not be the case, although of course the membership had no role in leadership then.

    You seem to be accusing members of racism, which is both offensive and silly. Members would be fine with Javid in that respect, but have doubts about how effective he was as Business Sec. He seems to be doing better as Home Sec, though, so he's definitely a main contender. He's not the world's most inspiring speaker, however.
  • Has he forgotten Geoffrey Cox? :-)
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,955

    Javid may well do well with the MP’s, but I’m not sure that the members are ready for him yet. Of course Disraeli was Conservative, so that might not be the case, although of course the membership had no role in leadership then.

    You seem to be accusing members of racism, which is both offensive and silly. Members would be fine with Javid in that respect, but have doubts about how effective he was as Business Sec. He seems to be doing better as Home Sec, though, so he's definitely a main contender. He's not the world's most inspiring speaker, however.
    Perhaps he was referring to Javid’s baldness? :smiley:
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 12,225
    edited October 4

    King Cole, MPs will determine the final two. So it's a necessary but not sufficient step to get support from them.

    Of course. Didn’t suggest otherwise.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 19,257
    edited October 4
    RobD said:

    Javid may well do well with the MP’s, but I’m not sure that the members are ready for him yet. Of course Disraeli was Conservative, so that might not be the case, although of course the membership had no role in leadership then.

    You seem to be accusing members of racism, which is both offensive and silly. Members would be fine with Javid in that respect, but have doubts about how effective he was as Business Sec. He seems to be doing better as Home Sec, though, so he's definitely a main contender. He's not the world's most inspiring speaker, however.
    Perhaps he was referring to Javid’s baldness? :smiley:
    We're a party dedicated to eliminating all kinds of follicularism, embracing diversity from William Hague to Boris.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 46,127

    Seems a fair summary. Raab is still a newbie, of course, and might improve as he gets more top-level experience.
    I've got him as a red number in my book, that might be wrong but he doesn't particularly impress me.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 12,225

    RobD said:

    Javid may well do well with the MP’s, but I’m not sure that the members are ready for him yet. Of course Disraeli was Conservative, so that might not be the case, although of course the membership had no role in leadership then.

    You seem to be accusing members of racism, which is both offensive and silly. Members would be fine with Javid in that respect, but have doubts about how effective he was as Business Sec. He seems to be doing better as Home Sec, though, so he's definitely a main contender. He's not the world's most inspiring speaker, however.
    Perhaps he was referring to Javid’s baldness? :smiley:
    We're a party dedicated to eliminating all kinds of follicularism, embracing diversity from William Hague to Boris.
    Good point. I don’t recall a bald Labour leader, although Kinnock was heading that way.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 2,579

    RobD said:

    Javid may well do well with the MP’s, but I’m not sure that the members are ready for him yet. Of course Disraeli was Conservative, so that might not be the case, although of course the membership had no role in leadership then.

    You seem to be accusing members of racism, which is both offensive and silly. Members would be fine with Javid in that respect, but have doubts about how effective he was as Business Sec. He seems to be doing better as Home Sec, though, so he's definitely a main contender. He's not the world's most inspiring speaker, however.
    Perhaps he was referring to Javid’s baldness? :smiley:
    We're a party dedicated to eliminating all kinds of follicularism, embracing diversity from William Hague to Boris.
    Good point. I don’t recall a bald Labour leader, although Kinnock was heading that way.
    Attlee?
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 22,846
    He seems to be destined to be even less popular than Hollande, which is saying something.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 22,846

    RobD said:

    Javid may well do well with the MP’s, but I’m not sure that the members are ready for him yet. Of course Disraeli was Conservative, so that might not be the case, although of course the membership had no role in leadership then.

    You seem to be accusing members of racism, which is both offensive and silly. Members would be fine with Javid in that respect, but have doubts about how effective he was as Business Sec. He seems to be doing better as Home Sec, though, so he's definitely a main contender. He's not the world's most inspiring speaker, however.
    Perhaps he was referring to Javid’s baldness? :smiley:
    We're a party dedicated to eliminating all kinds of follicularism, embracing diversity from William Hague to Boris.
    He does rather resemble Dr. Evil.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 12,225
    dixiedean said:

    RobD said:

    Javid may well do well with the MP’s, but I’m not sure that the members are ready for him yet. Of course Disraeli was Conservative, so that might not be the case, although of course the membership had no role in leadership then.

    You seem to be accusing members of racism, which is both offensive and silly. Members would be fine with Javid in that respect, but have doubts about how effective he was as Business Sec. He seems to be doing better as Home Sec, though, so he's definitely a main contender. He's not the world's most inspiring speaker, however.
    Perhaps he was referring to Javid’s baldness? :smiley:
    We're a party dedicated to eliminating all kinds of follicularism, embracing diversity from William Hague to Boris.
    Good point. I don’t recall a bald Labour leader, although Kinnock was heading that way.
    Attlee?
    Yup. Ought have remembered him.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 21,371
    I doubt that the party conference has made the slightest difference to Theresa May's prospects or anyone else's. No one shone and no one in two weeks' time will remember or care.

    Disclosure: my only current red numbers on either next Prime Minister or next Conservative leader are Jeremy Corbyn, David Miliband and Jacob Rees-Mogg. Only Jeremy Corbyn causes me any concern and as I posted this morning I still see him as a clear lay at current prices.
  • tpfkartpfkar Posts: 1,053

    I doubt that the party conference has made the slightest difference to Theresa May's prospects or anyone else's. No one shone and no one in two weeks' time will remember or care.

    Disclosure: my only current red numbers on either next Prime Minister or next Conservative leader are Jeremy Corbyn, David Miliband and Jacob Rees-Mogg. Only Jeremy Corbyn causes me any concern and as I posted this morning I still see him as a clear lay at current prices.

    For next Conservative leader?! I should think so!
  • Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 4,877
    Sean_F said:

    RobD said:

    Javid may well do well with the MP’s, but I’m not sure that the members are ready for him yet. Of course Disraeli was Conservative, so that might not be the case, although of course the membership had no role in leadership then.

    You seem to be accusing members of racism, which is both offensive and silly. Members would be fine with Javid in that respect, but have doubts about how effective he was as Business Sec. He seems to be doing better as Home Sec, though, so he's definitely a main contender. He's not the world's most inspiring speaker, however.
    Perhaps he was referring to Javid’s baldness? :smiley:
    We're a party dedicated to eliminating all kinds of follicularism, embracing diversity from William Hague to Boris.
    He does rather resemble Dr. Evil.
    I have heard it said that US Presidents are usually elected on the basis of height (taller one wins) and then hairstyle. I presume Hilary was shorter than Trump because she had hair whereas Mr Trump appears to have a misplaced lemming or baby sloth on his head.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,955

    I doubt that the party conference has made the slightest difference to Theresa May's prospects or anyone else's. No one shone and no one in two weeks' time will remember or care.

    Disclosure: my only current red numbers on either next Prime Minister or next Conservative leader are Jeremy Corbyn, David Miliband and Jacob Rees-Mogg. Only Jeremy Corbyn causes me any concern and as I posted this morning I still see him as a clear lay at current prices.

    The only thing that is saving her is that her challengers all appear crap.
  • Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 4,877

    RobD said:

    Javid may well do well with the MP’s, but I’m not sure that the members are ready for him yet. Of course Disraeli was Conservative, so that might not be the case, although of course the membership had no role in leadership then.

    You seem to be accusing members of racism, which is both offensive and silly. Members would be fine with Javid in that respect, but have doubts about how effective he was as Business Sec. He seems to be doing better as Home Sec, though, so he's definitely a main contender. He's not the world's most inspiring speaker, however.
    Perhaps he was referring to Javid’s baldness? :smiley:
    We're a party dedicated to eliminating all kinds of follicularism, embracing diversity from William Hague to Boris.
    Good point. I don’t recall a bald Labour leader, although Kinnock was heading that way.
    Michael Foot did not lack hair, so being follically bumptious is obviously not a help given Foot's ... errr... "policies"
  • BannedInParisBannedInParis Posts: 1,846

    RobD said:

    Javid may well do well with the MP’s, but I’m not sure that the members are ready for him yet. Of course Disraeli was Conservative, so that might not be the case, although of course the membership had no role in leadership then.

    You seem to be accusing members of racism, which is both offensive and silly. Members would be fine with Javid in that respect, but have doubts about how effective he was as Business Sec. He seems to be doing better as Home Sec, though, so he's definitely a main contender. He's not the world's most inspiring speaker, however.
    Perhaps he was referring to Javid’s baldness? :smiley:
    We're a party dedicated to eliminating all kinds of follicularism, embracing diversity from William Hague to Boris.
    Good point. I don’t recall a bald Labour leader, although Kinnock was heading that way.
    ...
  • BannedInParisBannedInParis Posts: 1,846
    oh ... BALD.

    gotcha.
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 7,849
    538 have done another of their Democratic primary "drafts", always worth reading.

    The top 8 picks were:

    Elizabeth Warren
    Kamala Harris
    Kirsten Gillibrand
    Joe Biden
    Bernie Sanders
    Cory Booker
    Beto O’Rourke
    Eric Holder

    https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/our-third-ish-2020-democratic-primary-draft-got-weird/?ex_cid=538twitter
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,955

    oh ... BALD.

    gotcha.

    Your coat, sir. :D
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 22,846

    Sean_F said:

    RobD said:

    Javid may well do well with the MP’s, but I’m not sure that the members are ready for him yet. Of course Disraeli was Conservative, so that might not be the case, although of course the membership had no role in leadership then.

    You seem to be accusing members of racism, which is both offensive and silly. Members would be fine with Javid in that respect, but have doubts about how effective he was as Business Sec. He seems to be doing better as Home Sec, though, so he's definitely a main contender. He's not the world's most inspiring speaker, however.
    Perhaps he was referring to Javid’s baldness? :smiley:
    We're a party dedicated to eliminating all kinds of follicularism, embracing diversity from William Hague to Boris.
    He does rather resemble Dr. Evil.
    I have heard it said that US Presidents are usually elected on the basis of height (taller one wins) and then hairstyle. I presume Hilary was shorter than Trump because she had hair whereas Mr Trump appears to have a misplaced lemming or baby sloth on his head.
    https://i.pinimg.com/originals/3b/98/2b/3b982bd7ba9e9a92b61423bdd4502804.jpg
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 19,989
    Former head of World Customs Organisation, hired by the EU to work on NI border, says that a technological solution is perfectly feasible with existing infrastructure, and the only impediments are politics and ideology.
    https://eandt.theiet.org/content/articles/2018/04/ultra-hi-tech-invisible-irish-border-perfectly-doable-ex-customs-chief-says/
  • Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 4,877

    Has he forgotten Geoffrey Cox? :-)
    Who?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 23,420
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 23,420

    RobD said:

    Javid may well do well with the MP’s, but I’m not sure that the members are ready for him yet. Of course Disraeli was Conservative, so that might not be the case, although of course the membership had no role in leadership then.

    You seem to be accusing members of racism, which is both offensive and silly. Members would be fine with Javid in that respect, but have doubts about how effective he was as Business Sec. He seems to be doing better as Home Sec, though, so he's definitely a main contender. He's not the world's most inspiring speaker, however.
    Perhaps he was referring to Javid’s baldness? :smiley:
    We're a party dedicated to eliminating all kinds of follicularism, embracing diversity from William Hague to Boris.
    Good point. I don’t recall a bald Labour leader, although Kinnock was heading that way.
    He was using faux baldness to distract from being a finger.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,955
    Sandpit said:

    Former head of World Customs Organisation, hired by the EU to work on NI border, says that a technological solution is perfectly feasible with existing infrastructure, and the only impediments are politics and ideology.
    https://eandt.theiet.org/content/articles/2018/04/ultra-hi-tech-invisible-irish-border-perfectly-doable-ex-customs-chief-says/

    Who’d have thunk it?
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 30,975

    Has he forgotten Geoffrey Cox? :-)
    Who?
  • anothernickanothernick Posts: 1,502
    dixiedean said:

    RobD said:

    Javid may well do well with the MP’s, but I’m not sure that the members are ready for him yet. Of course Disraeli was Conservative, so that might not be the case, although of course the membership had no role in leadership then.

    You seem to be accusing members of racism, which is both offensive and silly. Members would be fine with Javid in that respect, but have doubts about how effective he was as Business Sec. He seems to be doing better as Home Sec, though, so he's definitely a main contender. He's not the world's most inspiring speaker, however.
    Perhaps he was referring to Javid’s baldness? :smiley:
    We're a party dedicated to eliminating all kinds of follicularism, embracing diversity from William Hague to Boris.
    Good point. I don’t recall a bald Labour leader, although Kinnock was heading that way.
    Attlee?
    John Smith
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 12,225

    dixiedean said:

    RobD said:

    Javid may well do well with the MP’s, but I’m not sure that the members are ready for him yet. Of course Disraeli was Conservative, so that might not be the case, although of course the membership had no role in leadership then.

    You seem to be accusing members of racism, which is both offensive and silly. Members would be fine with Javid in that respect, but have doubts about how effective he was as Business Sec. He seems to be doing better as Home Sec, though, so he's definitely a main contender. He's not the world's most inspiring speaker, however.
    Perhaps he was referring to Javid’s baldness? :smiley:
    We're a party dedicated to eliminating all kinds of follicularism, embracing diversity from William Hague to Boris.
    Good point. I don’t recall a bald Labour leader, although Kinnock was heading that way.
    Attlee?
    John Smith
    Indeed. Memory failing.
  • Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 4,877

    Has he forgotten Geoffrey Cox? :-)
    Who?
    www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y__GkNPKqeQ
    Perhaps I should have tagged it "[Sarcasm alert]"

    :/
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 30,264
    RobD said:

    I doubt that the party conference has made the slightest difference to Theresa May's prospects or anyone else's. No one shone and no one in two weeks' time will remember or care.

    Disclosure: my only current red numbers on either next Prime Minister or next Conservative leader are Jeremy Corbyn, David Miliband and Jacob Rees-Mogg. Only Jeremy Corbyn causes me any concern and as I posted this morning I still see him as a clear lay at current prices.

    The only thing that is saving her is that her challengers all appear crap.
    And also labour aren’t marching ahead in the polls because beardy grandpa act doesn’t work on the oldies.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 30,975

    Has he forgotten Geoffrey Cox? :-)
    Who?
    www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y__GkNPKqeQ
    Perhaps I should have tagged it "[Sarcasm alert]"

    :/
    Have you listened to his speech?
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,955

    RobD said:

    I doubt that the party conference has made the slightest difference to Theresa May's prospects or anyone else's. No one shone and no one in two weeks' time will remember or care.

    Disclosure: my only current red numbers on either next Prime Minister or next Conservative leader are Jeremy Corbyn, David Miliband and Jacob Rees-Mogg. Only Jeremy Corbyn causes me any concern and as I posted this morning I still see him as a clear lay at current prices.

    The only thing that is saving her is that her challengers all appear crap.
    And also labour aren’t marching ahead in the polls because beardy grandpa act doesn’t work on the oldies.
    Don’t worry, they’ll all shuffle off this mortal coil eventually.... or so we are constantly told.
  • Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 4,877
    RobD said:

    Sandpit said:

    Former head of World Customs Organisation, hired by the EU to work on NI border, says that a technological solution is perfectly feasible with existing infrastructure, and the only impediments are politics and ideology.
    https://eandt.theiet.org/content/articles/2018/04/ultra-hi-tech-invisible-irish-border-perfectly-doable-ex-customs-chief-says/

    Who’d have thunk it?
    "Allie Rennison, the Institute of Directors’ Brexit expert, told the conference, which was attended by figures from the region’s manufacturing sector, that avoiding a hard border with no physical infrastructure would “almost certainly require more heavy lifting and a higher cost burden [to be] borne by businesses"

    .... he [Karlsson] acknowledged that a fully operational smart border is not currently in use anywhere in the world"


    So, it is a costly but workable solution that no one has ever done yet?
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 4,634

    Has he forgotten Geoffrey Cox? :-)
    Who?
    He has a fantastic voice. Perhaps like a mixture of Brian Blessed and a newsreader from the 1960s.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,955

    RobD said:

    Sandpit said:

    Former head of World Customs Organisation, hired by the EU to work on NI border, says that a technological solution is perfectly feasible with existing infrastructure, and the only impediments are politics and ideology.
    https://eandt.theiet.org/content/articles/2018/04/ultra-hi-tech-invisible-irish-border-perfectly-doable-ex-customs-chief-says/

    Who’d have thunk it?
    "Allie Rennison, the Institute of Directors’ Brexit expert, told the conference, which was attended by figures from the region’s manufacturing sector, that avoiding a hard border with no physical infrastructure would “almost certainly require more heavy lifting and a higher cost burden [to be] borne by businesses"

    .... he [Karlsson] acknowledged that a fully operational smart border is not currently in use anywhere in the world"


    So, it is a costly but workable solution that no one has ever done yet?
    So because something hasn’t been done means it can’t be done?
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 6,299
    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Sandpit said:

    Former head of World Customs Organisation, hired by the EU to work on NI border, says that a technological solution is perfectly feasible with existing infrastructure, and the only impediments are politics and ideology.
    https://eandt.theiet.org/content/articles/2018/04/ultra-hi-tech-invisible-irish-border-perfectly-doable-ex-customs-chief-says/

    Who’d have thunk it?
    "Allie Rennison, the Institute of Directors’ Brexit expert, told the conference, which was attended by figures from the region’s manufacturing sector, that avoiding a hard border with no physical infrastructure would “almost certainly require more heavy lifting and a higher cost burden [to be] borne by businesses"

    .... he [Karlsson] acknowledged that a fully operational smart border is not currently in use anywhere in the world"


    So, it is a costly but workable solution that no one has ever done yet?
    So because something hasn’t been done means it can’t be done?
    ... in 5 months?
  • Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 4,877
    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Sandpit said:

    Former head of World Customs Organisation, hired by the EU to work on NI border, says that a technological solution is perfectly feasible with existing infrastructure, and the only impediments are politics and ideology.
    https://eandt.theiet.org/content/articles/2018/04/ultra-hi-tech-invisible-irish-border-perfectly-doable-ex-customs-chief-says/

    Who’d have thunk it?
    "Allie Rennison, the Institute of Directors’ Brexit expert, told the conference, which was attended by figures from the region’s manufacturing sector, that avoiding a hard border with no physical infrastructure would “almost certainly require more heavy lifting and a higher cost burden [to be] borne by businesses"

    .... he [Karlsson] acknowledged that a fully operational smart border is not currently in use anywhere in the world"


    So, it is a costly but workable solution that no one has ever done yet?
    So because something hasn’t been done means it can’t be done?
    Sometimes that is indeed the case. Things that cannot BE done do not GET done.

    Sometimes things can be done but are economically infeasiable.

    And sometimes no one has ever had the need and so the first attempt is likely to be a bit of a test case (to put it mildly)

    Never buy "Version zero" of anything is good advice in the technology business ;)
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,955

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Sandpit said:

    Former head of World Customs Organisation, hired by the EU to work on NI border, says that a technological solution is perfectly feasible with existing infrastructure, and the only impediments are politics and ideology.
    https://eandt.theiet.org/content/articles/2018/04/ultra-hi-tech-invisible-irish-border-perfectly-doable-ex-customs-chief-says/

    Who’d have thunk it?
    "Allie Rennison, the Institute of Directors’ Brexit expert, told the conference, which was attended by figures from the region’s manufacturing sector, that avoiding a hard border with no physical infrastructure would “almost certainly require more heavy lifting and a higher cost burden [to be] borne by businesses"

    .... he [Karlsson] acknowledged that a fully operational smart border is not currently in use anywhere in the world"


    So, it is a costly but workable solution that no one has ever done yet?
    So because something hasn’t been done means it can’t be done?
    ... in 5 months?
    After the transition, surely?
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,955

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Sandpit said:

    Former head of World Customs Organisation, hired by the EU to work on NI border, says that a technological solution is perfectly feasible with existing infrastructure, and the only impediments are politics and ideology.
    https://eandt.theiet.org/content/articles/2018/04/ultra-hi-tech-invisible-irish-border-perfectly-doable-ex-customs-chief-says/

    Who’d have thunk it?
    "Allie Rennison, the Institute of Directors’ Brexit expert, told the conference, which was attended by figures from the region’s manufacturing sector, that avoiding a hard border with no physical infrastructure would “almost certainly require more heavy lifting and a higher cost burden [to be] borne by businesses"

    .... he [Karlsson] acknowledged that a fully operational smart border is not currently in use anywhere in the world"


    So, it is a costly but workable solution that no one has ever done yet?
    So because something hasn’t been done means it can’t be done?
    Sometimes that is indeed the case. Things that cannot BE done do not GET done.

    Sometimes things can be done but are economically infeasiable.

    And sometimes no one has ever had the need and so the first attempt is likely to be a bit of a test case (to put it mildly)

    Never buy "Version zero" of anything is good advice in the technology business ;)
    But wasn’t one of his main conclusions that it can be done?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 16,952
    Cannot happen. Unless DUP cave in.

    They are known for 'never, never, never' rather than 'Oh go on then, why not...'
  • Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 4,877

    Has he forgotten Geoffrey Cox? :-)
    Who?
    www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y__GkNPKqeQ
    Perhaps I should have tagged it "[Sarcasm alert]"

    :/
    Have you listened to his speech?
    Yes.

    And what has that to do with me making a sarcastic reply to a rhetorical question from Gareth?
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 12,225
    rkrkrk said:

    Has he forgotten Geoffrey Cox? :-)
    Who?
    He has a fantastic voice. Perhaps like a mixture of Brian Blessed and a newsreader from the 1960s.
    Very, very good speaker. Of course he’s a barrister, with some interesting cases in his past.
  • Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 4,877
    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Sandpit said:

    Former head of World Customs Organisation, hired by the EU to work on NI border, says that a technological solution is perfectly feasible with existing infrastructure, and the only impediments are politics and ideology.
    https://eandt.theiet.org/content/articles/2018/04/ultra-hi-tech-invisible-irish-border-perfectly-doable-ex-customs-chief-says/

    Who’d have thunk it?
    "Allie Rennison, the Institute of Directors’ Brexit expert, told the conference, which was attended by figures from the region’s manufacturing sector, that avoiding a hard border with no physical infrastructure would “almost certainly require more heavy lifting and a higher cost burden [to be] borne by businesses"

    .... he [Karlsson] acknowledged that a fully operational smart border is not currently in use anywhere in the world"


    So, it is a costly but workable solution that no one has ever done yet?
    So because something hasn’t been done means it can’t be done?
    Sometimes that is indeed the case. Things that cannot BE done do not GET done.

    Sometimes things can be done but are economically infeasiable.

    And sometimes no one has ever had the need and so the first attempt is likely to be a bit of a test case (to put it mildly)

    Never buy "Version zero" of anything is good advice in the technology business ;)
    But wasn’t one of his main conclusions that it can be done?
    He SAYS it can be done, but it adds that no one has ever done. So it is an opinion not a fact and experts can be wrong.

    If he had said "Yes it can be done because it currently works well between country xxxx and country zzzz" then it would carry more force than a mere opinion.

    Besides, I thought we had had enough of experts? ;)
  • felixfelix Posts: 8,004

    RobD said:

    Javid may well do well with the MP’s, but I’m not sure that the members are ready for him yet. Of course Disraeli was Conservative, so that might not be the case, although of course the membership had no role in leadership then.

    You seem to be accusing members of racism, which is both offensive and silly. Members would be fine with Javid in that respect, but have doubts about how effective he was as Business Sec. He seems to be doing better as Home Sec, though, so he's definitely a main contender. He's not the world's most inspiring speaker, however.
    Perhaps he was referring to Javid’s baldness? :smiley:
    We're a party dedicated to eliminating all kinds of follicularism, embracing diversity from William Hague to Boris.
    So we're not ruling out OGH then?
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 21,371

    Cannot happen. Unless DUP cave in.

    They are known for 'never, never, never' rather than 'Oh go on then, why not...'
    It can if an alternative source of votes is found in Parliament. The bigger problem is that it would require large numbers of currently hostile Conservative MPs to cave in. That's much less likely.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 4,634

    rkrkrk said:

    Has he forgotten Geoffrey Cox? :-)
    Who?
    He has a fantastic voice. Perhaps like a mixture of Brian Blessed and a newsreader from the 1960s.
    Very, very good speaker. Of course he’s a barrister, with some interesting cases in his past.
    Yes. The speech was good too, although the bit at the end about Milton, eagles and methinks lost me a bit.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,955

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Sandpit said:

    Former head of World Customs Organisation, hired by the EU to work on NI border, says that a technological solution is perfectly feasible with existing infrastructure, and the only impediments are politics and ideology.
    https://eandt.theiet.org/content/articles/2018/04/ultra-hi-tech-invisible-irish-border-perfectly-doable-ex-customs-chief-says/

    Who’d have thunk it?
    "Allie Rennison, the Institute of Directors’ Brexit expert, told the conference, which was attended by figures from the region’s manufacturing sector, that avoiding a hard border with no physical infrastructure would “almost certainly require more heavy lifting and a higher cost burden [to be] borne by businesses"

    .... he [Karlsson] acknowledged that a fully operational smart border is not currently in use anywhere in the world"


    So, it is a costly but workable solution that no one has ever done yet?
    So because something hasn’t been done means it can’t be done?
    Sometimes that is indeed the case. Things that cannot BE done do not GET done.

    Sometimes things can be done but are economically infeasiable.

    And sometimes no one has ever had the need and so the first attempt is likely to be a bit of a test case (to put it mildly)

    Never buy "Version zero" of anything is good advice in the technology business ;)
    But wasn’t one of his main conclusions that it can be done?
    He SAYS it can be done, but it adds that no one has ever done. So it is an opinion not a fact and experts can be wrong.

    If he had said "Yes it can be done because it currently works well between country xxxx and country zzzz" then it would carry more force than a mere opinion.

    Besides, I thought we had had enough of experts? ;)
    So in his opinion, as an expert, it can be done? Glad we cleared that up.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 17,857

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Sandpit said:

    Former head of World Customs Organisation, hired by the EU to work on NI border, says that a technological solution is perfectly feasible with existing infrastructure, and the only impediments are politics and ideology.
    https://eandt.theiet.org/content/articles/2018/04/ultra-hi-tech-invisible-irish-border-perfectly-doable-ex-customs-chief-says/

    Who’d have thunk it?
    "Allie Rennison, the Institute of Directors’ Brexit expert, told the conference, which was attended by figures from the region’s manufacturing sector, that avoiding a hard border with no physical infrastructure would “almost certainly require more heavy lifting and a higher cost burden [to be] borne by businesses"

    .... he [Karlsson] acknowledged that a fully operational smart border is not currently in use anywhere in the world"


    So, it is a costly but workable solution that no one has ever done yet?
    So because something hasn’t been done means it can’t be done?
    Sometimes that is indeed the case. Things that cannot BE done do not GET done.

    Sometimes things can be done but are economically infeasiable.

    And sometimes no one has ever had the need and so the first attempt is likely to be a bit of a test case (to put it mildly)

    Never buy "Version zero" of anything is good advice in the technology business ;)
    all these claims lack numbers

    NI sends £4 bn to RoI and imports £1.3 bn

    looking at the volume of trade the RoI has the bigger problem

    together thats £5bn of trade which is less than 1% of UK EU trade

    half of it is farm goods

    https://fullfact.org/europe/irish-border-trade/
  • LordOfReasonLordOfReason Posts: 443

    Javid or Hunt both entirely possible, but think Mordaunt would clearly be the best.

    Hunt is so beta-male he makes Millifandom look like Bacchanalia.

    Javid is Nosferatu voiced by Amy Poehler.

    Either of those plays straight into hands of Labour, Hunts NHS record, and, well it’s established fact of all politics, no hair, no chance. If you have any doubt what I am saying, the smoking gun is their conference speeches, Javid declaring war on hope, Hunt channeling his inner Boris and making the biggest gaff of the entire rally.

    It has to be Patel. It will be Patel. From out between the tired and fading old big beasts of eurosceptism she will, with their endorsements, spring like a tiger. Imagine May v Ledsome, only it ain’t Leadsom it’s Patel, and she ain’t rolling over.

    If you have any respect or admiration for Margaret Thatcher, your vote has to go to Patel. Whatever Maggie had, Patel has in spades. Interviews, speeches, knows her subject, knows her mind, it all adds up to confidence, drive to win and smack of firm leadership. Imagine the day the Conservative Party make Patel PM, you can go to your cocoa and goodnights sleep knowing Britain has its Thatcher back. Just in time too.

    Some of you are pretty switched on, surely it can’t just be me who sees this?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 7,647

    538 have done another of their Democratic primary "drafts", always worth reading.

    The top 8 picks were:

    Elizabeth Warren
    Kamala Harris
    Kirsten Gillibrand
    Joe Biden
    Bernie Sanders
    Cory Booker
    Beto O’Rourke
    Eric Holder

    https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/our-third-ish-2020-democratic-primary-draft-got-weird/?ex_cid=538twitter

    Note how low Hickenlooper came...
    :smile:
  • Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 4,877
    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Sandpit said:

    Former head of World Customs Organisation, hired by the EU to work on NI border, says that a technological solution is perfectly feasible with existing infrastructure, and the only impediments are politics and ideology.
    https://eandt.theiet.org/content/articles/2018/04/ultra-hi-tech-invisible-irish-border-perfectly-doable-ex-customs-chief-says/

    Who’d have thunk it?
    "Allie Rennison, the Institute of Directors’ Brexit expert, told the conference, which was attended by figures from the region’s manufacturing sector, that avoiding a hard border with no physical infrastructure would “almost certainly require more heavy lifting and a higher cost burden [to be] borne by businesses"

    .... he [Karlsson] acknowledged that a fully operational smart border is not currently in use anywhere in the world"


    So, it is a costly but workable solution that no one has ever done yet?
    So because something hasn’t been done means it can’t be done?
    Sometimes that is indeed the case. Things that cannot BE done do not GET done.

    Sometimes things can be done but are economically infeasiable.

    And sometimes no one has ever had the need and so the first attempt is likely to be a bit of a test case (to put it mildly)

    Never buy "Version zero" of anything is good advice in the technology business ;)
    But wasn’t one of his main conclusions that it can be done?
    He SAYS it can be done, but it adds that no one has ever done. So it is an opinion not a fact and experts can be wrong.

    If he had said "Yes it can be done because it currently works well between country xxxx and country zzzz" then it would carry more force than a mere opinion.

    Besides, I thought we had had enough of experts? ;)
    So in his opinion, as an expert, it can be done? Glad we cleared that up.
    Suit yourself...

    If you think it is the answer to the NI problem, I wish you good luck with it, but I am not going waste any more time on pie-in-the-sky stuff.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 45,496
    Lord of Reason, I'd be peeved if it were Patel, as I'd previously backed her to succeed Cameron.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,955

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Sandpit said:

    Former head of World Customs Organisation, hired by the EU to work on NI border, says that a technological solution is perfectly feasible with existing infrastructure, and the only impediments are politics and ideology.
    https://eandt.theiet.org/content/articles/2018/04/ultra-hi-tech-invisible-irish-border-perfectly-doable-ex-customs-chief-says/

    Who’d have thunk it?
    "Allie Rennison, the Institute of Directors’ Brexit expert, told the conference, which was attended by figures from the region’s manufacturing sector, that avoiding a hard border with no physical infrastructure would “almost certainly require more heavy lifting and a higher cost burden [to be] borne by businesses"

    .... he [Karlsson] acknowledged that a fully operational smart border is not currently in use anywhere in the world"


    So, it is a costly but workable solution that no one has ever done yet?
    So because something hasn’t been done means it can’t be done?
    Sometimes that is indeed the case. Things that cannot BE done do not GET done.

    Sometimes things can be done but are economically infeasiable.

    And sometimes no one has ever had the need and so the first attempt is likely to be a bit of a test case (to put it mildly)

    Never buy "Version zero" of anything is good advice in the technology business ;)
    But wasn’t one of his main conclusions that it can be done?
    He SAYS it can be done, but it adds that no one has ever done. So it is an opinion not a fact and experts can be wrong.

    If he had said "Yes it can be done because it currently works well between country xxxx and country zzzz" then it would carry more force than a mere opinion.

    Besides, I thought we had had enough of experts? ;)
    So in his opinion, as an expert, it can be done? Glad we cleared that up.
    Suit yourself...

    If you think it is the answer to the NI problem, I wish you good luck with it, but I am not going waste any more time on pie-in-the-sky stuff.
    Luckily for everyone else, both sides are still actively considering it.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,955

    Javid or Hunt both entirely possible, but think Mordaunt would clearly be the best.

    Hunt is so beta-male he makes Millifandom look like Bacchanalia.

    Javid is Nosferatu voiced by Amy Poehler.

    Either of those plays straight into hands of Labour, Hunts NHS record, and, well it’s established fact of all politics, no hair, no chance. If you have any doubt what I am saying, the smoking gun is their conference speeches, Javid declaring war on hope, Hunt channeling his inner Boris and making the biggest gaff of the entire rally.

    It has to be Patel. It will be Patel. From out between the tired and fading old big beasts of eurosceptism she will, with their endorsements, spring like a tiger. Imagine May v Ledsome, only it ain’t Leadsom it’s Patel, and she ain’t rolling over.

    If you have any respect or admiration for Margaret Thatcher, your vote has to go to Patel. Whatever Maggie had, Patel has in spades. Interviews, speeches, knows her subject, knows her mind, it all adds up to confidence, drive to win and smack of firm leadership. Imagine the day the Conservative Party make Patel PM, you can go to your cocoa and goodnights sleep knowing Britain has its Thatcher back. Just in time too.

    Some of you are pretty switched on, surely it can’t just be me who sees this?
    A pity she isn’t in Cabinet, which might make things a bit more difficult?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 7,647
    edited October 4
    rkrkrk said:

    Has he forgotten Geoffrey Cox? :-)
    Who?
    He has a fantastic voice. Perhaps like a mixture of Brian Blessed and a newsreader from the 1960s.
    More like a throwback to the 50s...

    "If you have nothing to say, or, rather, something extremely stupid and obvious, say it, but in a 'plonking' tone of voice - ie roundly, but hollowly and dogmatically."—Stephen Potter, In a book called Lifemanship, written in 1950

    (Which is perhaps slightly unfair, particularly the 'stupid', but it nonetheless seems quite apposite.)
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 30,975
    rcs1000 said:
    Ho ho. That said he's very active on the phone bank operation and provides unfiltered feedback on what voters are saying.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 19,756
    Somebody tell him we might yet stay - if France leaves.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 4,634
    edited October 4

    Javid or Hunt both entirely possible, but think Mordaunt would clearly be the best.

    Hunt is so beta-male he makes Millifandom look like Bacchanalia.

    Javid is Nosferatu voiced by Amy Poehler.

    Either of those plays straight into hands of Labour, Hunts NHS record, and, well it’s established fact of all politics, no hair, no chance. If you have any doubt what I am saying, the smoking gun is their conference speeches, Javid declaring war on hope, Hunt channeling his inner Boris and making the biggest gaff of the entire rally.

    It has to be Patel. It will be Patel. From out between the tired and fading old big beasts of eurosceptism she will, with their endorsements, spring like a tiger. Imagine May v Ledsome, only it ain’t Leadsom it’s Patel, and she ain’t rolling over.

    If you have any respect or admiration for Margaret Thatcher, your vote has to go to Patel. Whatever Maggie had, Patel has in spades. Interviews, speeches, knows her subject, knows her mind, it all adds up to confidence, drive to win and smack of firm leadership. Imagine the day the Conservative Party make Patel PM, you can go to your cocoa and goodnights sleep knowing Britain has its Thatcher back. Just in time too.

    Some of you are pretty switched on, surely it can’t just be me who sees this?
    I honestly think Priti Patel is the weakest person mentioned as a potential leader by a long, long way. She is also disloyal as demonstrated by what kicked her out of government.

    Edit: And an incompetent liar based on her initial apology which was then easily shown to be a lie.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,955
    edited October 4
    From this tweet? I don’t see why myself.
  • Javid or Hunt both entirely possible, but think Mordaunt would clearly be the best.

    Hunt is so beta-male he makes Millifandom look like Bacchanalia.

    Javid is Nosferatu voiced by Amy Poehler.

    Either of those plays straight into hands of Labour, Hunts NHS record, and, well it’s established fact of all politics, no hair, no chance. If you have any doubt what I am saying, the smoking gun is their conference speeches, Javid declaring war on hope, Hunt channeling his inner Boris and making the biggest gaff of the entire rally.

    It has to be Patel. It will be Patel. From out between the tired and fading old big beasts of eurosceptism she will, with their endorsements, spring like a tiger. Imagine May v Ledsome, only it ain’t Leadsom it’s Patel, and she ain’t rolling over.

    If you have any respect or admiration for Margaret Thatcher, your vote has to go to Patel. Whatever Maggie had, Patel has in spades. Interviews, speeches, knows her subject, knows her mind, it all adds up to confidence, drive to win and smack of firm leadership. Imagine the day the Conservative Party make Patel PM, you can go to your cocoa and goodnights sleep knowing Britain has its Thatcher back. Just in time too.

    Some of you are pretty switched on, surely it can’t just be me who sees this?
    Do you mean Priti Patel?!

    Her performance on the death penalty question on QT is perhaps the most poorly constructed argument I've ever seen a politician give. For those that haven't seen it...


  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 30,975

    Has he forgotten Geoffrey Cox? :-)
    Who?
    www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y__GkNPKqeQ
    Perhaps I should have tagged it "[Sarcasm alert]"

    :/
    Have you listened to his speech?
    Yes.

    And what has that to do with me making a sarcastic reply to a rhetorical question from Gareth?
    Good. Always wise to 'know the enemy'! What did you think of it?
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 30,975

    I was more interested in the message than the messenger.

    If true, it might explain Macron's hard line stance in the belief he can force us to back down. That could end badly for all concerned.
  • JohnRussellJohnRussell Posts: 256

    Javid or Hunt both entirely possible, but think Mordaunt would clearly be the best.

    Hunt is so beta-male he makes Millifandom look like Bacchanalia.

    Javid is Nosferatu voiced by Amy Poehler.

    Either of those plays straight into hands of Labour, Hunts NHS record, and, well it’s established fact of all politics, no hair, no chance. If you have any doubt what I am saying, the smoking gun is their conference speeches, Javid declaring war on hope, Hunt channeling his inner Boris and making the biggest gaff of the entire rally.

    It has to be Patel. It will be Patel. From out between the tired and fading old big beasts of eurosceptism she will, with their endorsements, spring like a tiger. Imagine May v Ledsome, only it ain’t Leadsom it’s Patel, and she ain’t rolling over.

    If you have any respect or admiration for Margaret Thatcher, your vote has to go to Patel. Whatever Maggie had, Patel has in spades. Interviews, speeches, knows her subject, knows her mind, it all adds up to confidence, drive to win and smack of firm leadership. Imagine the day the Conservative Party make Patel PM, you can go to your cocoa and goodnights sleep knowing Britain has its Thatcher back. Just in time too.

    Some of you are pretty switched on, surely it can’t just be me who sees this?
    Do you mean Priti Patel?!

    Her performance on the death penalty question on QT is perhaps the most poorly constructed argument I've ever seen a politician give. For those that haven't seen it...


    No doubt if there were a referendum on the Death Penalty won by those in favour of reverting to it, the argument over whether to use firing squad, the gallows, electric chair or lethal injection would be interpreted by the anti brigade as conclusive proof the public didn't know what it was voting for
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 12,225
    rkrkrk said:

    Javid or Hunt both entirely possible, but think Mordaunt would clearly be the best.

    Hunt is so beta-male he makes Millifandom look like Bacchanalia.

    Javid is Nosferatu voiced by Amy Poehler.

    Either of those plays straight into hands of Labour, Hunts NHS record, and, well it’s established fact of all politics, no hair, no chance. If you have any doubt what I am saying, the smoking gun is their conference speeches, Javid declaring war on hope, Hunt channeling his inner Boris and making the biggest gaff of the entire rally.

    It has to be Patel. It will be Patel. From out between the tired and fading old big beasts of eurosceptism she will, with their endorsements, spring like a tiger. Imagine May v Ledsome, only it ain’t Leadsom it’s Patel, and she ain’t rolling over.

    If you have any respect or admiration for Margaret Thatcher, your vote has to go to Patel. Whatever Maggie had, Patel has in spades. Interviews, speeches, knows her subject, knows her mind, it all adds up to confidence, drive to win and smack of firm leadership. Imagine the day the Conservative Party make Patel PM, you can go to your cocoa and goodnights sleep knowing Britain has its Thatcher back. Just in time too.

    Some of you are pretty switched on, surely it can’t just be me who sees this?
    I honestly think Priti Patel is the weakest person mentioned as a potential leader by a long, long way. She is also disloyal as demonstrated by what kicked her out of government.
    Careful; she’s currently cosying up to the military in Colchester Garrison, as part of the Armed Forces Parliamentary Scheme.

    Also she thinks I’m a supporter!
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 19,756


    I was more interested in the message than the messenger.

    If true, it might explain Macron's hard line stance in the belief he can force us to back down. That could end badly for all concerned.
    Macron thinks himself The Last Jedi.

    He really is that crap.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 30,975

    Javid or Hunt both entirely possible, but think Mordaunt would clearly be the best.

    It has to be Patel. It will be Patel.
    An interesting view. Which of Patel's great ministerial achievements do you think in particular single her out for the top job?
  • I doubt that the party conference has made the slightest difference to Theresa May's prospects or anyone else's. No one shone and no one in two weeks' time will remember or care.

    Disclosure: my only current red numbers on either next Prime Minister or next Conservative leader are Jeremy Corbyn, David Miliband and Jacob Rees-Mogg. Only Jeremy Corbyn causes me any concern and as I posted this morning I still see him as a clear lay at current prices.

    I think you are safe with David Miliband...
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 14,807
    What do you mean "hastened our departure"? We triggered A50, we leave two years later. What had the initial timetable been which M. Macron has affected today?
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 21,371


    I was more interested in the message than the messenger.

    If true, it might explain Macron's hard line stance in the belief he can force us to back down. That could end badly for all concerned.
    One should not completely exclude the possibility that he's right. It's not as though any Leaver has got a brilliant plan. At some point, the absence of a brilliant plan is going to come under intense scrutiny.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,955
    TOPPING said:

    What do you mean "hastened our departure"? We triggered A50, we leave two years later. What had the initial timetable been which M. Macron has affected today?
    If I was to guess, I’d say he was talking about the initial decision to leave in 2016.
  • JohnRussellJohnRussell Posts: 256

    Javid or Hunt both entirely possible, but think Mordaunt would clearly be the best.

    Hunt is so beta-male he makes Millifandom look like Bacchanalia.

    Javid is Nosferatu voiced by Amy Poehler.

    Either of those plays straight into hands of Labour, Hunts NHS record, and, well it’s established fact of all politics, no hair, no chance. If you have any doubt what I am saying, the smoking gun is their conference speeches, Javid declaring war on hope, Hunt channeling his inner Boris and making the biggest gaff of the entire rally.

    It has to be Patel. It will be Patel. From out between the tired and fading old big beasts of eurosceptism she will, with their endorsements, spring like a tiger. Imagine May v Ledsome, only it ain’t Leadsom it’s Patel, and she ain’t rolling over.

    If you have any respect or admiration for Margaret Thatcher, your vote has to go to Patel. Whatever Maggie had, Patel has in spades. Interviews, speeches, knows her subject, knows her mind, it all adds up to confidence, drive to win and smack of firm leadership. Imagine the day the Conservative Party make Patel PM, you can go to your cocoa and goodnights sleep knowing Britain has its Thatcher back. Just in time too.

    Some of you are pretty switched on, surely it can’t just be me who sees this?
    Do you mean Priti Patel?!

    Her performance on the death penalty question on QT is perhaps the most poorly constructed argument I've ever seen a politician give. For those that haven't seen it...


    No doubt if there were a referendum on the Death Penalty won by those in favour of reverting to it, the argument over whether to use firing squad, the gallows, electric chair or lethal injection would be interpreted by the anti brigade as conclusive proof the public didn't know what it was voting for
    Theresa May could say "Death means Death" and commit to leaving all mass murderers to die of old age in prison
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 17,857


    I was more interested in the message than the messenger.

    If true, it might explain Macron's hard line stance in the belief he can force us to back down. That could end badly for all concerned.
    Macron thinks himself The Last Jedi.

    He really is that crap.
    I think its more than that.

    He realises no UK means theres nobody he can call on to stand up to Germany. France is just a a vassal and he has pissed off half of Europe while doing Merkels bidding.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 14,807
    RobD said:

    TOPPING said:

    What do you mean "hastened our departure"? We triggered A50, we leave two years later. What had the initial timetable been which M. Macron has affected today?
    If I was to guess, I’d say he was talking about the initial decision to leave in 2016.
    You mean a year before Macron was elected? Boy he is good.
  • oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 4,322
    edited October 4
    Dems are throwing their toys out of the pram over the additional FBI report.

    They agreed to have a limited further investigation. Which is what they got.

    Now it was the wrong kind of 'limited'

    It is clear what game they are playing. They will continue to move the goalposts as long as they possibly can.

    Feinstein hasn't even read it in full - but has still decided it isn't enough.

    For all the faults of the GOP, the Dems have played Dr Ford for political gain and have made it harder for other victims of abuse to come forward.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,955
    TOPPING said:

    RobD said:

    TOPPING said:

    What do you mean "hastened our departure"? We triggered A50, we leave two years later. What had the initial timetable been which M. Macron has affected today?
    If I was to guess, I’d say he was talking about the initial decision to leave in 2016.
    You mean a year before Macron was elected? Boy he is good.
    “Attitude of the likes of Macron”.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 30,975
    TOPPING said:

    What do you mean "hastened our departure"? We triggered A50, we leave two years later. What had the initial timetable been which M. Macron has affected today?
    I think you're missing "attitudes of the likes of".....
  • LordOfReasonLordOfReason Posts: 443

    Javid or Hunt both entirely possible, but think Mordaunt would clearly be the best.

    Hunt is so beta-male he makes Millifandom look like Bacchanalia.

    Javid is Nosferatu voiced by Amy Poehler.

    Either of those plays straight into hands of Labour, Hunts NHS record, and, well it’s established fact of all politics, no hair, no chance. If you have any doubt what I am saying, the smoking gun is their conference speeches, Javid declaring war on hope, Hunt channeling his inner Boris and making the biggest gaff of the entire rally.

    It has to be Patel. It will be Patel. From out between the tired and fading old big beasts of eurosceptism she will, with their endorsements, spring like a tiger. Imagine May v Ledsome, only it ain’t Leadsom it’s Patel, and she ain’t rolling over.

    If you have any respect or admiration for Margaret Thatcher, your vote has to go to Patel. Whatever Maggie had, Patel has in spades. Interviews, speeches, knows her subject, knows her mind, it all adds up to confidence, drive to win and smack of firm leadership. Imagine the day the Conservative Party make Patel PM, you can go to your cocoa and goodnights sleep knowing Britain has its Thatcher back. Just in time too.

    Some of you are pretty switched on, surely it can’t just be me who sees this?
    Do you mean Priti Patel?!

    Her performance on the death penalty question on QT is perhaps the most poorly constructed argument I've ever seen a politician give. For those that haven't seen it...


    I knew someone would post that and I’m ready for you. You only think it’s poorly constructed because you are on other side of it, if there’s a referendum on capital punishment you confident of winning it?

    The mistake you are making is just using that one piece of QT to make your point. We both know there’s a whole lot more to be said than that. :) It’s that particular clip that convinces me.

    I know why it’s Patel, a Thatcher style leader needed, because I know exactly what is wrong with the Tories at the moment, the reason why they are heading for the U bend and the great drain of opposition: they are listening to voters too much on the doorsteps. Simples.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 17,857
    Moscovici ramps it up again

    http://www.lastampa.it/2018/10/04/esteri/moscovici-lue-rischia-di-implodere-con-salvini-orban-e-le-pen-ml1xJhP4iRU8dOkU2ZOdeK/pagina.html

    the EU risks implosion with Salvini Orban and LePen

    Must be an election in the wind
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 7,895

    Dems are throwing their toys out of the pram over the additional FBI report.

    They agreed to have a limited further investigation. Which is what they got.

    Now it was the wrong kind of 'limited'

    It is clear what game they are playing. They will continue to move the goalposts as long as they possibly can.

    Feinstein hasn't even read it in full - but has still decided it isn't enough.

    For all the faults of the GOP, the Dems have played Dr Ford for political gain and have made it harder for other victims of abuse to come forward.

    The only people who have been played are the Dems, by a cynical Republican administration.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 30,975


    I was more interested in the message than the messenger.

    If true, it might explain Macron's hard line stance in the belief he can force us to back down. That could end badly for all concerned.
    Macron thinks himself The Last Jedi.

    He really is that crap.
    I think its more than that.

    He realises no UK means theres nobody he can call on to stand up to Germany. France is just a a vassal and he has pissed off half of Europe while doing Merkels bidding.
    France may well also doing more of the military heavy lifting for the EU if Britain disengages.

    Today's Press Conference in the Hague illustrates how much help European countries get from UK Intelligence - not that Druncker acknowledged that in his 'The EU is on top of this' statement.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 7,647

    Dems are throwing their toys out of the pram over the additional FBI report.

    They agreed to have a limited further investigation. Which is what they got.

    Now it was the wrong kind of 'limited'

    It is clear what game they are playing. They will continue to move the goalposts as long as they possibly can.

    Feinstein hasn't even read it in full - but has still decided it isn't enough.

    For all the faults of the GOP, the Dems have played Dr Ford for political gain and have made it harder for other victims of abuse to come forward.

    I think your frame is every bit as skewed by partisanship.

    It's pretty clear what game was played with the limits on the 'investigation', too, if they couldn't even talk to this guy:

    https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2018/10/brett-kavanaugh-college-roommate-jamie-roche.html
    In 1983, I was one of Brett Kavanaugh’s freshman roommates at Yale University. About two weeks ago I came forward to lend my support to my friend Deborah Ramirez, who says Brett sexually assaulted her at a party in a dorm suite. I did this because I believe Debbie.

    Now the FBI is investigating this incident. I am willing to speak with them about my experiences at Yale with both Debbie and Brett. I would tell them this: Brett Kavanaugh stood up under oath and lied about his drinking and about the meaning of words in his yearbook. He did so baldly, without hesitation or reservation…

  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 17,857


    I was more interested in the message than the messenger.

    If true, it might explain Macron's hard line stance in the belief he can force us to back down. That could end badly for all concerned.
    Macron thinks himself The Last Jedi.

    He really is that crap.
    I think its more than that.

    He realises no UK means theres nobody he can call on to stand up to Germany. France is just a a vassal and he has pissed off half of Europe while doing Merkels bidding.
    France may well also doing more of the military heavy lifting for the EU if Britain disengages.

    Today's Press Conference in the Hague illustrates how much help European countries get from UK Intelligence - not that Druncker acknowledged that in his 'The EU is on top of this' statement.
    Nah France uses the Foreign Legion better get foreigners in the body bags than the Gauloisers
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 4,634



    I knew someone would post that and I’m ready for you. You only think it’s poorly constructed because you are on other side of it, if there’s a referendum on capital punishment you confident of winning it?

    The mistake you are making is just using that one piece of QT to make your point. We both know there’s a whole lot more to be said than that. :) It’s that particular clip that convinces me.

    I know why it’s Patel, a Thatcher style leader needed, because I know exactly what is wrong with the Tories at the moment, the reason why they are heading for the U bend and the great drain of opposition: they are listening to voters too much on the doorsteps. Simples.

    I agree a single QT clip is not enough to condemn her. Her track record otherwise is hardly stellar though. Sacked for disloyalty and dishonesty, a lobbyist for big tobacco and alcohol and a background in PR.

    If you want a Thatcherite, I think you can do better. Liz Truss perhaps.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 30,975

    Moscovici ramps it up again

    http://www.lastampa.it/2018/10/04/esteri/moscovici-lue-rischia-di-implodere-con-salvini-orban-e-le-pen-ml1xJhP4iRU8dOkU2ZOdeK/pagina.html

    the EU risks implosion with Salvini Orban and LePen

    Must be an election in the wind

    And the solution is....More Europe!

    Whodathunkit?
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,955
    Nigelb said:

    Dems are throwing their toys out of the pram over the additional FBI report.

    They agreed to have a limited further investigation. Which is what they got.

    Now it was the wrong kind of 'limited'

    It is clear what game they are playing. They will continue to move the goalposts as long as they possibly can.

    Feinstein hasn't even read it in full - but has still decided it isn't enough.

    For all the faults of the GOP, the Dems have played Dr Ford for political gain and have made it harder for other victims of abuse to come forward.

    I think your frame is every bit as skewed by partisanship.

    It's pretty clear what game was played with the limits on the 'investigation', too, if they couldn't even talk to this guy:

    https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2018/10/brett-kavanaugh-college-roommate-jamie-roche.html
    In 1983, I was one of Brett Kavanaugh’s freshman roommates at Yale University. About two weeks ago I came forward to lend my support to my friend Deborah Ramirez, who says Brett sexually assaulted her at a party in a dorm suite. I did this because I believe Debbie.

    Now the FBI is investigating this incident. I am willing to speak with them about my experiences at Yale with both Debbie and Brett. I would tell them this: Brett Kavanaugh stood up under oath and lied about his drinking and about the meaning of words in his yearbook. He did so baldly, without hesitation or reservation…

    And you have to wonder about his partisanship, too.
This discussion has been closed.