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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » NEW PB / Polling Matters podcast. US midterms special (part tw

SystemSystem Posts: 6,389
edited November 1 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » NEW PB / Polling Matters podcast. US midterms special (part two) with Ariel Edwards-Levy

As part of the Polling Matters mini-series on the US midterms, Keiran Pedley talks to Ariel Edwards-Levy of The Huffington Post.

Read the full story here


«13

Comments

  • kle4kle4 Posts: 34,639
    edited November 1
    Another podcast so soon? You spoil us.
  • DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 70,028
    edited November 1
    Paging @HYUFD

    In a separate development, the ex-Tory boss’s old nemesis Boris Johnson has also told his friends he has given up hope of becoming the next Tory leader.

    But Boris still hopes to be “in the mix” for a Cabinet job under Mrs May’s successor.

    Political friends say the former London Mayor is unlikely to even enter the next leadership race.

    One said: “If Boris think the chances are against him, he won’t go for it. He deosn’t want to be humiliated by coming fourth or fifth”.
  • felixfelix Posts: 8,068

    Paging @HYUFD

    In a separate development, the ex-Tory boss’s old nemesis Boris Johnson has also told his friends he has given up hope of becoming the next Tory leader.

    But Boris still hopes to be “in the mix” for a Cabinet job under Mrs May’s successor.

    Political friends say the former London Mayor is unlikely to even enter the next leadership race.

    One said: “If Boris think the chances are against him, he won’t go for it. He deosn’t want to be humiliated by coming fourth or fifth”.

    Hmm - maybe if the Downing Street cat fluffs it.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 27,828
    Mikus Smithsonius: Are you ready to do your duty for PB?

    rcs1000: Yes, father.

    Mikus Smithsonius: You will not be Moderator.

    rcs1000: Which wiser, older man is to take my place?

    Mikus Smithsonius: My powers will pass to TSE, to hold in trust until the forum is ready to rule once more. PB is to be a republic again.

    rcs1000: TSE?

    Mikus Smithsonius: Yes.

    [Mikus Smithsonius tries to comfort rcs1000 by reaching out his hand to touch him on the face but rcs1000 pulls his head away from Mikus Smithsonius' hand in disgust]

    Mikus Smithsonius: My decision disappoints you?

    rcs1000: You wrote to me once, listing the four chief virtues: Wisdom, justice, fortitude and temperance. As I read the list, I knew I had none of them. But I have other virtues, father. Ambition. That can be a virtue when it drives us to excel. Resourcefulness, courage, perhaps not on Youtube, but... there are many forms of courage. Devotion, to my family and to you. But none of my virtues were on your list. Even then it was as if you didn't want me for your son.

    Mikus Smithsonius: Oh, rcs1000. You go too far.

    rcs1000: I search the faces of the gods... for ways to please you, to make you proud. One kind word, one full hug... where you pressed me to your chest and held me tight. Would have been like the sun on my heart for a thousand years. What is it in me that you hate so much?

    Mikus Smithsonius: Shh, rcs1000.

    rcs1000: All I've ever wanted was to live up to you, OGH. Father.

    Mikus Smithsonius: [gets down on his knees] rcs1000, your faults as a son is my failure as a father.

    [Mikus opens up his arms to rcs1000 and gives him a hug]

    rcs1000: [Commodus hugs Mikus and cries] Father. I would have Brexit the whole world... if you would only love me!

    [rcs1000 then goes off to unplug every single one of the PB servers...]
  • felixfelix Posts: 8,068

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    Surprised but it'd be great for the party image and positioning post Brexit.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 34,639

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    I have often thought it would be nice to have former PMs serve in the Cabinets of successors. I understand why that could prove difficult, but whether someone did a good job but there's only so long they could be at the top, or whether they were talented but just not right for the top job, it's be nice to think someone of talent could come back and serve in a high profile post in the modern era.

    But it would be way too soon as we are still in the middle of the divisive event which torpedoed Cameron's premiership and will be right in the thick of it for years to come (so even the 'some time after his memoirs are published' is suggesting way too soon I would think. Plus Foreign Secretary would just be silly. But he is young enough that if he wanted he could come back in 10 years or something.

    But it looks like a weak story anyway.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 34,639

    Paging @HYUFD

    In a separate development, the ex-Tory boss’s old nemesis Boris Johnson has also told his friends he has given up hope of becoming the next Tory leader.

    But Boris still hopes to be “in the mix” for a Cabinet job under Mrs May’s successor.

    Political friends say the former London Mayor is unlikely to even enter the next leadership race.

    One said: “If Boris think the chances are against him, he won’t go for it. He deosn’t want to be humiliated by coming fourth or fifth”.

    He'd be humiliated if he doesn't stand. You cannot so obviously pitch for the top job and wimp out twice. Once, maybe, but not twice. Being too chicken to go for it doesn't work when you cannot plausible deny you have worked toward it for so long, even as others who I am sure want it possibly could, because they have not been so obvious.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 34,639

    Mikus Smithsonius: Are you ready to do your duty for PB?

    rcs1000: Yes, father.

    Mikus Smithsonius: You will not be Moderator.

    rcs1000: Which wiser, older man is to take my place?

    Mikus Smithsonius: My powers will pass to TSE, to hold in trust until the forum is ready to rule once more. PB is to be a republic again.

    rcs1000: TSE?

    Mikus Smithsonius: Yes.

    [Mikus Smithsonius tries to comfort rcs1000 by reaching out his hand to touch him on the face but rcs1000 pulls his head away from Mikus Smithsonius' hand in disgust]

    Mikus Smithsonius: My decision disappoints you?

    rcs1000: You wrote to me once, listing the four chief virtues: Wisdom, justice, fortitude and temperance. As I read the list, I knew I had none of them. But I have other virtues, father. Ambition. That can be a virtue when it drives us to excel. Resourcefulness, courage, perhaps not on Youtube, but... there are many forms of courage. Devotion, to my family and to you. But none of my virtues were on your list. Even then it was as if you didn't want me for your son.

    Mikus Smithsonius: Oh, rcs1000. You go too far.

    rcs1000: I search the faces of the gods... for ways to please you, to make you proud. One kind word, one full hug... where you pressed me to your chest and held me tight. Would have been like the sun on my heart for a thousand years. What is it in me that you hate so much?

    Mikus Smithsonius: Shh, rcs1000.

    rcs1000: All I've ever wanted was to live up to you, OGH. Father.

    Mikus Smithsonius: [gets down on his knees] rcs1000, your faults as a son is my failure as a father.

    [Mikus opens up his arms to rcs1000 and gives him a hug]

    rcs1000: [Commodus hugs Mikus and cries] Father. I would have Brexit the whole world... if you would only love me!

    [rcs1000 then goes off to unplug every single one of the PB servers...]
    Brings a tear to the eye.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 34,639
    felix said:

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    Surprised but it'd be great for the party image and positioning post Brexit.
    I've generally been well disposed toward Cameron in an instinctive way which I recognise is probably not entirely logical, and I liked the Coalition, but would it be great for either? He would look like he sat out the trickiest years for no reason other than to avoid the hassle, and he presumably wouldn't be in for a top job unless the party were closer to a BINO than a Hard leave position, and him being in a position of influence seems like it would just aggravate the internal divisions already at breaking point. And if he was content to sit on the backbenches he'd still be in the Commons.

    I'd presume if and when he comes back it'd be through a peerage? Jumping the queue ahead of Major, Blair and Brown though (in fairness I do not know if any of those would want a peerage).
  • AnazinaAnazina Posts: 2,599
    How times change. Remarkable how the Mail has turned against the Brexiteers under the new editor.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 849
    kle4 said:

    felix said:

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    Surprised but it'd be great for the party image and positioning post Brexit.
    I've generally been well disposed toward Cameron in an instinctive way which I recognise is probably not entirely logical, and I liked the Coalition, but would it be great for either? He would look like he sat out the trickiest years for no reason other than to avoid the hassle, and he presumably wouldn't be in for a top job unless the party were closer to a BINO than a Hard leave position, and him being in a position of influence seems like it would just aggravate the internal divisions already at breaking point. And if he was content to sit on the backbenches he'd still be in the Commons.

    I'd presume if and when he comes back it'd be through a peerage? Jumping the queue ahead of Major, Blair and Brown though (in fairness I do not know if any of those would want a peerage).
    Major took a knighthood instead didn’t he?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 34,639

    kle4 said:

    felix said:

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    Surprised but it'd be great for the party image and positioning post Brexit.
    I've generally been well disposed toward Cameron in an instinctive way which I recognise is probably not entirely logical, and I liked the Coalition, but would it be great for either? He would look like he sat out the trickiest years for no reason other than to avoid the hassle, and he presumably wouldn't be in for a top job unless the party were closer to a BINO than a Hard leave position, and him being in a position of influence seems like it would just aggravate the internal divisions already at breaking point. And if he was content to sit on the backbenches he'd still be in the Commons.

    I'd presume if and when he comes back it'd be through a peerage? Jumping the queue ahead of Major, Blair and Brown though (in fairness I do not know if any of those would want a peerage).
    Major took a knighthood instead didn’t he?
    Surely many people have had knighthoods awarded and then later gone on to get a peerage? I'm not suggesting he is angling for one - I assume he'd have one already if he wanted it - but does it rule out that someone might?
  • Paging @HYUFD

    In a separate development, the ex-Tory boss’s old nemesis Boris Johnson has also told his friends he has given up hope of becoming the next Tory leader.

    But Boris still hopes to be “in the mix” for a Cabinet job under Mrs May’s successor.

    Political friends say the former London Mayor is unlikely to even enter the next leadership race.

    One said: “If Boris think the chances are against him, he won’t go for it. He deosn’t want to be humiliated by coming fourth or fifth”.

    Yesterday's man misses the limelight and wants a comeback. Such a shame his credibility is shot!
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 34,639
    The podcast does make me think how long ago the Kavanaugh stuff seems now.
  • OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 5,672

    kle4 said:

    felix said:

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    Surprised but it'd be great for the party image and positioning post Brexit.
    I've generally been well disposed toward Cameron in an instinctive way which I recognise is probably not entirely logical, and I liked the Coalition, but would it be great for either? He would look like he sat out the trickiest years for no reason other than to avoid the hassle, and he presumably wouldn't be in for a top job unless the party were closer to a BINO than a Hard leave position, and him being in a position of influence seems like it would just aggravate the internal divisions already at breaking point. And if he was content to sit on the backbenches he'd still be in the Commons.

    I'd presume if and when he comes back it'd be through a peerage? Jumping the queue ahead of Major, Blair and Brown though (in fairness I do not know if any of those would want a peerage).
    Major took a knighthood instead didn’t he?
    Yes, Thatcher was the most recent PM to take a peerage and might be the last. If any of the others had wanted one they would have it already.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 34,639
    rcs1000 said:
    Rough decision it looks like.
    Hovland refused to block the law’s application to these unlucky voters and their tribe, Spirit Lake. Hovland conceded that their claims gave him “great cause for concern.” But he cited the Supreme Court’s Purcell principle, which warns lower courts not to alter voting laws shortly before an election due to the risk of voter confusion. In a jab at the 8th Circuit, Hovland noted that the problems highlighted in this lawsuit “were clearly predictable and certain to occur.” Yet because early voting has already begun—and the election is five days away—Hovland concluded that a new injunction “will create as much confusion as it will alleviate
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 9,425
    kle4 said:

    felix said:

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    Surprised but it'd be great for the party image and positioning post Brexit.
    I've generally been well disposed toward Cameron in an instinctive way which I recognise is probably not entirely logical, and I liked the Coalition, but would it be great for either? He would look like he sat out the trickiest years for no reason other than to avoid the hassle, and he presumably wouldn't be in for a top job unless the party were closer to a BINO than a Hard leave position, and him being in a position of influence seems like it would just aggravate the internal divisions already at breaking point. And if he was content to sit on the backbenches he'd still be in the Commons.

    I'd presume if and when he comes back it'd be through a peerage? Jumping the queue ahead of Major, Blair and Brown though (in fairness I do not know if any of those would want a peerage).
    Cameron, the worst PM since Lord North, naturally wants to be the worst foreign secretary since Johnson.

    He has done enough harm. RIP. No flowers.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 34,639
    All this talk of the US midterms has me thinking - what other big elections are next in the pipeline?
  • kle4 said:

    All this talk of the US midterms has me thinking - what other big elections are next in the pipeline?

    The People's Vote.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 47,261

    Paging @HYUFD

    In a separate development, the ex-Tory boss’s old nemesis Boris Johnson has also told his friends he has given up hope of becoming the next Tory leader.

    But Boris still hopes to be “in the mix” for a Cabinet job under Mrs May’s successor.

    Political friends say the former London Mayor is unlikely to even enter the next leadership race.

    One said: “If Boris think the chances are against him, he won’t go for it. He deosn’t want to be humiliated by coming fourth or fifth”.

    Just as well the chances aren't against him then. Boris remains top of today's new ConHome Tory members next Tory leader poll, just ahead of Javid with Davis and Raab entering the top 5 and Hunt and Gove falling out of the top 5. Mogg rounds up the top tier in 4th

    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2018/11/conhomes-survey-davis-tears-a-chunk-off-johnson-who-now-leads-javid-by-less-than-a-point.html
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 70,028
    edited November 1
    HYUFD said:

    Paging @HYUFD

    In a separate development, the ex-Tory boss’s old nemesis Boris Johnson has also told his friends he has given up hope of becoming the next Tory leader.

    But Boris still hopes to be “in the mix” for a Cabinet job under Mrs May’s successor.

    Political friends say the former London Mayor is unlikely to even enter the next leadership race.

    One said: “If Boris think the chances are against him, he won’t go for it. He deosn’t want to be humiliated by coming fourth or fifth”.

    Just as well the chances aren't against him then. Boris remains top of today's new ConHome Tory members next Tory leader poll, just ahead of Javid with Davis and Raab entering the top 5 and Hunt and Gove falling out of the top 5. Mogg rounds up the top tier in 4th

    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2018/11/conhomes-survey-davis-tears-a-chunk-off-johnson-who-now-leads-javid-by-less-than-a-point.html
    Except Tory members don't get to choose who the final two are.

    Tory MPs get to do that, that's why Boris is buggered.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 34,639
    I cannot believe I forgot that one of the american Governors retiring this cycle is Butch Otter.
  • MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 4,743
    kle4 said:

    All this talk of the US midterms has me thinking - what other big elections are next in the pipeline?

    Bedford Mayoralty May 2019.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 12,589

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    'I think I'd be rather good at it.'
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 47,261
    edited November 1

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    There is a precedent, Home came back to frontline politics after being PM as Heath's Foreign Secretary from 1970 to 1974.


    'The friend who the ex-PM confided in said he is now “bored s***less”, two years on from walking out of No10 and then resigning as an MP....The source said: “David is dedicated to public service, and has often said he wouldn’t rule out a public role one day, domestically or internationally.
    “But he is only 52, and still a young man.'
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 34,639
    HYUFD said:

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    There is a precedent, Home came back to frontline politics after being PM as Heath's Foreign Secretary from 1970 to 1974
    There's precedent for a lot of political options that nonetheless don't happen anymore and likely never will. Is this one of those? Perhaps not, I feel there's a chance, but not for quite a long time given who the recent PMs are and/or what they have done since.
  • HYUFD said:

    Paging @HYUFD

    In a separate development, the ex-Tory boss’s old nemesis Boris Johnson has also told his friends he has given up hope of becoming the next Tory leader.

    But Boris still hopes to be “in the mix” for a Cabinet job under Mrs May’s successor.

    Political friends say the former London Mayor is unlikely to even enter the next leadership race.

    One said: “If Boris think the chances are against him, he won’t go for it. He deosn’t want to be humiliated by coming fourth or fifth”.

    Just as well the chances aren't against him then. Boris remains top of today's new ConHome Tory members next Tory leader poll, just ahead of Javid with Davis and Raab entering the top 5 and Hunt and Gove falling out of the top 5. Mogg rounds up the top tier in 4th

    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2018/11/conhomes-survey-davis-tears-a-chunk-off-johnson-who-now-leads-javid-by-less-than-a-point.html
    You are at it again. Conhome is not a poll and consists of 125,000 members. They are detached from conservative voters and members like myself who would never accept Boris as leader. And how do you appease those current conservative mps, especially woman, who would not stay in the party if he was leader
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 47,261

    HYUFD said:

    Paging @HYUFD

    In a separate development, the ex-Tory boss’s old nemesis Boris Johnson has also told his friends he has given up hope of becoming the next Tory leader.

    But Boris still hopes to be “in the mix” for a Cabinet job under Mrs May’s successor.

    Political friends say the former London Mayor is unlikely to even enter the next leadership race.

    One said: “If Boris think the chances are against him, he won’t go for it. He deosn’t want to be humiliated by coming fourth or fifth”.

    Just as well the chances aren't against him then. Boris remains top of today's new ConHome Tory members next Tory leader poll, just ahead of Javid with Davis and Raab entering the top 5 and Hunt and Gove falling out of the top 5. Mogg rounds up the top tier in 4th

    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2018/11/conhomes-survey-davis-tears-a-chunk-off-johnson-who-now-leads-javid-by-less-than-a-point.html
    You are at it again. Conhome is not a poll and consists of 125,000 members. They are detached from conservative voters and members like myself who would never accept Boris as leader. And how do you appease those current conservative mps, especially woman, who would not stay in the party if he was leader
    You may not accept Boris, that does not mean a majority of Conservative members and voters won't and the fact you voted for Blair in 1997 and 2001 confirms you are on the Blairite wing of the party anyway.

    If a few Blairites leave the party if Boris or Mogg become leader for the LDs it might give them a bit of much needed publicity but not much more than that
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 47,261

    HYUFD said:

    Paging @HYUFD

    In a separate development, the ex-Tory boss’s old nemesis Boris Johnson has also told his friends he has given up hope of becoming the next Tory leader.

    But Boris still hopes to be “in the mix” for a Cabinet job under Mrs May’s successor.

    Political friends say the former London Mayor is unlikely to even enter the next leadership race.

    One said: “If Boris think the chances are against him, he won’t go for it. He deosn’t want to be humiliated by coming fourth or fifth”.

    Just as well the chances aren't against him then. Boris remains top of today's new ConHome Tory members next Tory leader poll, just ahead of Javid with Davis and Raab entering the top 5 and Hunt and Gove falling out of the top 5. Mogg rounds up the top tier in 4th

    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2018/11/conhomes-survey-davis-tears-a-chunk-off-johnson-who-now-leads-javid-by-less-than-a-point.html
    Except Tory members don't get to choose who the final two are.

    Tory MPs get to do that, that's why Boris is buggered.
    Tory MPs even put Andrea Leadsom and IDS in the final 2!
  • asjohnstoneasjohnstone Posts: 896

    kle4 said:

    felix said:

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    Surprised but it'd be great for the party image and positioning post Brexit.
    I've generally been well disposed toward Cameron in an instinctive way which I recognise is probably not entirely logical, and I liked the Coalition, but would it be great for either? He would look like he sat out the trickiest years for no reason other than to avoid the hassle, and he presumably wouldn't be in for a top job unless the party were closer to a BINO than a Hard leave position, and him being in a position of influence seems like it would just aggravate the internal divisions already at breaking point. And if he was content to sit on the backbenches he'd still be in the Commons.

    I'd presume if and when he comes back it'd be through a peerage? Jumping the queue ahead of Major, Blair and Brown though (in fairness I do not know if any of those would want a peerage).
    Major took a knighthood instead didn’t he?
    Yes, Thatcher was the most recent PM to take a peerage and might be the last. If any of the others had wanted one they would have it already.
    A peerage brings the disclosure requirements of HoL membership. Which weigh yourself down with that when you can be getting rich?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 47,261
    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    There is a precedent, Home came back to frontline politics after being PM as Heath's Foreign Secretary from 1970 to 1974
    There's precedent for a lot of political options that nonetheless don't happen anymore and likely never will. Is this one of those? Perhaps not, I feel there's a chance, but not for quite a long time given who the recent PMs are and/or what they have done since.
    Cameron in the meantime can console himself as Joint co-chairman of the Pew Environment Bertarelli Foundation

    https://www.facebook.com/DavidCameronOfficial
  • HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Paging @HYUFD

    In a separate development, the ex-Tory boss’s old nemesis Boris Johnson has also told his friends he has given up hope of becoming the next Tory leader.

    But Boris still hopes to be “in the mix” for a Cabinet job under Mrs May’s successor.

    Political friends say the former London Mayor is unlikely to even enter the next leadership race.

    One said: “If Boris think the chances are against him, he won’t go for it. He deosn’t want to be humiliated by coming fourth or fifth”.

    Just as well the chances aren't against him then. Boris remains top of today's new ConHome Tory members next Tory leader poll, just ahead of Javid with Davis and Raab entering the top 5 and Hunt and Gove falling out of the top 5. Mogg rounds up the top tier in 4th

    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2018/11/conhomes-survey-davis-tears-a-chunk-off-johnson-who-now-leads-javid-by-less-than-a-point.html
    You are at it again. Conhome is not a poll and consists of 125,000 members. They are detached from conservative voters and members like myself who would never accept Boris as leader. And how do you appease those current conservative mps, especially woman, who would not stay in the party if he was leader
    You may not accept Boris, that does not mean a majority of Conservative members and voters won't and the fact you voted for Blair in 1997 and 2001 confirms you are on the Blairite wing of the party anyway.

    If a few Blairites leave the party if Boris or Mogg become leader for the LDs it might give them a bit of much needed publicity but not much more than that
    You do have a knack of talking utter rubbish

    I am going nowhere and neither is Boris. He is finished and I resent your arrogant nonsense about my politics and reference to liberals

    You would have the party led by a group that would destroy it
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 23,684

    HYUFD said:

    Paging @HYUFD

    In a separate development, the ex-Tory boss’s old nemesis Boris Johnson has also told his friends he has given up hope of becoming the next Tory leader.

    But Boris still hopes to be “in the mix” for a Cabinet job under Mrs May’s successor.

    Political friends say the former London Mayor is unlikely to even enter the next leadership race.

    One said: “If Boris think the chances are against him, he won’t go for it. He deosn’t want to be humiliated by coming fourth or fifth”.

    Just as well the chances aren't against him then. Boris remains top of today's new ConHome Tory members next Tory leader poll, just ahead of Javid with Davis and Raab entering the top 5 and Hunt and Gove falling out of the top 5. Mogg rounds up the top tier in 4th

    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2018/11/conhomes-survey-davis-tears-a-chunk-off-johnson-who-now-leads-javid-by-less-than-a-point.html
    You are at it again. Conhome is not a poll and consists of 125,000 members. They are detached from conservative voters and members like myself who would never accept Boris as leader. And how do you appease those current conservative mps, especially woman, who would not stay in the party if he was leader
    We don't need those stinkin' women.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 47,261
    edited November 1

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Paging @HYUFD

    In a separate development, the ex-Tory boss’s old nemesis Boris Johnson has also told his friends he has given up hope of becoming the next Tory leader.

    But Boris still hopes to be “in the mix” for a Cabinet job under Mrs May’s successor.

    Political friends say the former London Mayor is unlikely to even enter the next leadership race.

    One said: “If Boris think the chances are against him, he won’t go for it. He deosn’t want to be humiliated by coming fourth or fifth”.

    Just as well the chances aren't against him then. Boris remains top of today's new ConHome Tory members next Tory leader poll, just ahead of Javid with Davis and Raab entering the top 5 and Hunt and Gove falling out of the top 5. Mogg rounds up the top tier in 4th

    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2018/11/conhomes-survey-davis-tears-a-chunk-off-johnson-who-now-leads-javid-by-less-than-a-point.html
    You are at it again. Conhome is noas leader
    You may not accept Boris, that does not mean a majority of Conservative members and voters won't and the fact you voted for Blair in 1997 and 2001 confirms you are on the Blairite wing of the party anyway.

    If a few Blairites leave the party if Boris or Mogg become leader for the LDs it might give them a bit of much needed publicity but not much more than that
    You do have a knack of talking utter rubbish

    I am going nowhere and neither is Boris. He is finished and I resent your arrogant nonsense about my politics and reference to liberals

    You would have the party led by a group that would destroy it
    A man who leads the polling of Tory members who will have the final say on who the next leader is is by no means finished and I would suggest it is actually rather arrogant to suggest he is just because you dislike the ConHome survey results.

    The fact you voted Labour in 1997 and 2001 is a statement of fact, the Tories won 30% in 1997 and 31% in 2001. Given the Tories got 42% in 2017 you could say you make up only a minority of about 1/4 of the current Tory vote ie those who voted for Blair but have switched to the Tories to vote for Cameron and May, you are therefore in the minority rather than the majority of the party's vote.

    It is also a bit rich to complain of people wishing to 'destroy' the party when you did not even vote for the party in at least 2 general elections, those who loyally stuck to the party through bad times as well as good may I suggest have more grounds to lecture on that front
  • OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 5,672

    kle4 said:

    felix said:

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    Surprised but it'd be great for the party image and positioning post Brexit.
    I've generally been well disposed toward Cameron in an instinctive way which I recognise is probably not entirely logical, and I liked the Coalition, but would it be great for either? He would look like he sat out the trickiest years for no reason other than to avoid the hassle, and he presumably wouldn't be in for a top job unless the party were closer to a BINO than a Hard leave position, and him being in a position of influence seems like it would just aggravate the internal divisions already at breaking point. And if he was content to sit on the backbenches he'd still be in the Commons.

    I'd presume if and when he comes back it'd be through a peerage? Jumping the queue ahead of Major, Blair and Brown though (in fairness I do not know if any of those would want a peerage).
    Major took a knighthood instead didn’t he?
    Yes, Thatcher was the most recent PM to take a peerage and might be the last. If any of the others had wanted one they would have it already.
    A peerage brings the disclosure requirements of HoL membership. Which weigh yourself down with that when you can be getting rich?
    That's sadly a more plausible explanation than a principled opposition to the undemocratic nature of the House of Lords.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 34,326

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    Well, he's due an hereditary earldom. :p
  • sladeslade Posts: 634

    kle4 said:

    All this talk of the US midterms has me thinking - what other big elections are next in the pipeline?

    Bedford Mayoralty May 2019.
    Dave Hodgson nailed on.
  • HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Paging @HYUFD


    One said: “If Boris think the chances are against him, he won’t go for it. He deosn’t want to be humiliated by coming fourth or fifth”.


    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2018/11/conhomes-survey-davis-tears-a-chunk-off-johnson-who-now-leads-javid-by-less-than-a-point.html
    You are at it again. Conhome is noas leader

    If a t
    You do have a knack of talking utter rubbish

    I am going nowhere and neither is Boris. He is finished and I resent your arrogant nonsense about my politics and reference to liberals

    You would have the party led by a group that would destroy it
    A man who leads the polling of Tory members who will have the final say on who the next leader is is by no means finished and I would suggest it is actually rather arrogant to suggest he is just because you dislike the ConHome survey results.

    The fact you voted Labour in 1997 and 2001 is a statement of fact, the Tories won 30% in 1997 and 31% in 2001. Given the Tories got 42% in 2017 you could say you make up only a minority of about 1/4 of the current Tory vote ie those who voted for Blair but have switched to the Tories to vote for Cameron and May, you are therefore in the minority rather than the majority of the party's vote.

    It is also a bit rich to complain of people wishing to 'destroy' the party when you did not even vote for the party in at least 2 general elections, those who loyally stuck to the party through bad times as well as good may I suggest have more grounds to lecture on that front
    You do not get to judge my politics. I assume you are a voting member as well as myself so we will nulify Boris. The difficult part for me to accept is that you are so blind you cannot see how, not only Boris, but the rest of ERG are a minority in the HOC and their hard brexit is not going to happen

    Until recently you accepted Boris was over but your obsession with polls and surveys clouds even sensible debate. And to try to make out you are a superior conservative to my views is beyond arrogance. I was asked to be a conservative councillor in 1967 and even recently have been asked to consider the Welsh Assembly but of course that boat has sailed. I fought every GE for the party throughout the sixties, seventies and eighties, and was David Jones personal driver in 2010.

    When are you going to return to championing the prevention of no deal which you were recently until you fell under Boris spell again and realise some of us in the party do not share your views
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 47,261

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Paging @HYUFD


    One said: “If Boris think the chances are against him, he won’t go for it. He deosn’t want to be humiliated by coming fourth or fifth”.


    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2018/11/conhomes-survey-davis-tears-a-chunk-off-johnson-who-now-leads-javid-by-less-than-a-point.html
    You are at it again. Conhome is noas leader

    If a t
    You do have a knack of talking utter rubbish

    I am going nowhere and neither is Boris. He is finished and I resent your arrogant nonsense about my politics and reference to liberals

    You would have the party led by a group that would destroy it
    A man who leads the polling of Tory members who will have the final say on who the next leader is is by no meansor Cameron and May, you are therefore in the minority rather than the majority of the party's vote.

    It is ant
    You do not get to judge my politics. I assume you are a voting member as well as myself so we will nulify Boris. The difficult part for me to accept is that you are so blind you cannot see how, not only Boris, but the rest of ERG are a minority in the HOC and their hard brexit is not going to happen

    Until recently you accepted Boris was over but your obsession with polls and surveys clouds even sensible debate. And to try to make out you are a superior conservative to my views is beyond arrogance. I was asked to be a conservative councillor in 1967 and even recently have been asked to consider the Welsh Assembly but of course that boat has sailed. I fought every GE for the party throughout the sixties, seventies and eighties, and was David Jones personal driver in 2010.

    When are you going to return to championing the prevention of no deal which you were recently until you fell under Boris spell again and realise some of us in the party do not share your views
    As I said before I back May to get the Withdrawal Agreement and transition period but Boris to fight the next general election and try for a FTA.

    I have no doubt you lean more to the Tory side than the Labour side and as I said before respect your past service to the party but the fact you voted for Blair in 1997 and 2001 and New Labour shows you are very much on the left of the party, as confirmed by your Remain vote too, the majority of the party membership is both more rightwing than you are and more pro Leave and on that basis you cannot dismiss Boris
  • OchEyeOchEye Posts: 1,448

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    In a dead pig's mouth.....
  • HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Paging @HYUFD


    One said: “If Boris think the chances are against him, he won’t go for it. He deosn’t want to be humiliated by coming fourth or fifth”.


    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2018/11/conhomes-survey-davis-tears-a-chunk-off-johnson-who-now-leads-javid-by-less-than-a-point.html
    You are at it again. Conhome is noas leader

    If a t
    You do have a knack of talking utter rubbish

    I am going nowhere and neither is Boris. He is finished and I resent your arrogant nonsense about my politics and reference to liberals

    You would have the party led by a group that would destroy it
    A man who leads the polling of Tory members who will have the final say on who the next leader is is by no meansor Cameron and May, you are therefore in the minority rather than the majority of the party's vote.

    It is ant
    You do not get to judge my politics. I assume you are a voting member as well as myself so we will nulify Boris. The difficult part for me to accept is that you are so blind you cannot see how, not only Boris, but the rest of ERG are a minority in the HOC and their hard brexit is not going to happen

    Until recently you accepted Boris was over but your obsession with polls and surveys clouds even sensible debate. And to try to make out you are a superior conservative to my views is beyond arrogance. I was asked to be a conservative councillor in 1967 and even recently have been asked to consider the Welsh Assembly but of course that boat has sailed. I fought every GE for the party throughout the sixties, seventies and eighties, and was David Jones personal driver in 2010.

    When are you going to return to championing the prevention of no deal which you were recently until you fell under Boris spell again and realise some of us in the party do not share your views
    As I said before I back May to get the Withdrawal Agreement and transition period but Boris to fight the next general election and try for a FTA.

    I have no doubt you lean more to the Tory side than the Labour side and as I said before respect your past service to the party but the fact you voted for Blair in 1997 and 2001 and New Labour shows you are very much on the left of the party, as confirmed by your Remain vote too, the majority of the party membership is both more rightwing than you are and more pro Leave and on that basis you cannot dismiss Boris
    Yes I can
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 12,143
    Anazina said:

    How times change. Remarkable how the Mail has turned against the Brexiteers under the new editor.
    We wait to find out how much DM readers turn against the Mail...
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 23,684
    slade said:

    kle4 said:

    All this talk of the US midterms has me thinking - what other big elections are next in the pipeline?

    Bedford Mayoralty May 2019.
    Dave Hodgson nailed on.
    Aren't there term limits for such a politically sensitive role?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 47,063
    rcs1000 said:

    slade said:

    kle4 said:

    All this talk of the US midterms has me thinking - what other big elections are next in the pipeline?

    Bedford Mayoralty May 2019.
    Dave Hodgson nailed on.
    Aren't there term limits for such a politically sensitive role?
    The wall between Bedford and Luton just got 10 feet taller
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 3,738
    GIN1138 said:

    Anazina said:

    How times change. Remarkable how the Mail has turned against the Brexiteers under the new editor.
    We wait to find out how much DM readers turn against the Mail...
    I suspect Geordie has pitched it about right. Most Mail readers would sooner see Theresa triumph over the silly Brexit men like Boris and DD who now snipe from the sidelines having achieved bugger all in office. That might change if Theresa suddenly backed re-entry or a second referendum, but anything vaguely Brexity - even vassal statehood - should see her safely home.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 5,167
    Pulpstar said:

    rcs1000 said:

    slade said:

    kle4 said:

    All this talk of the US midterms has me thinking - what other big elections are next in the pipeline?

    Bedford Mayoralty May 2019.
    Dave Hodgson nailed on.
    Aren't there term limits for such a politically sensitive role?
    The wall between Bedford and Luton just got 10 feet taller
    And we are going to make Luton pay for it!
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 5,167
    GIN1138 said:

    Anazina said:

    How times change. Remarkable how the Mail has turned against the Brexiteers under the new editor.
    We wait to find out how much DM readers turn against the Mail...
    I don't think DM readers are keen on Russian influence on British politics. They are on the right track with that story.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 47,261
    edited November 2
    Bernie Sander's brother on This Week on BBC1 now
  • MikeLMikeL Posts: 4,614
    edited November 2
    Of course it's popular to have a go at Cameron - but if he was still in the Commons there's a decent chance he would be PM again right now.

    Remember what Clarke said at PMQs on his final day - he's the best performer there has been in his entire time as an MP - in a completely different league to anyone else around today.

    His electoral record in terms of MPs gained in 2010 and expectations in 2015 is also outstanding.

    If he did become Foreign Secretary he would then be hot favourite for next PM.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 5,943
    edited November 2
    MikeL said:

    Of course it's popular to have a go at Cameron - but if he was still in the Commons there's a decent chance he would be PM again right now.

    Remember what Clarke said at PMQs on his final day - he's the best performer there has been in his entire time as an MP - in a completely different league to anyone else around today.

    His electoral record in terms of MPs gained in 2010 and expectations in 2015 is also outstanding.

    If he did become Foreign Secretary he would then be hot favourite for next PM.

    I'm sorry, but this overlooks his inadequacies. He failed in his renegotiation, undertook a referendum with insufficient preparation, lost the argument, when it became apparent that LEAVE were winning he failed to adapt and continued with his failed approach, and when the referendum was lost he said "Why should I do all the hard s**t?" and fucked off to leave somebody else to clear up the mess. I appreciate that leavers were pleased with the outcome, but that doesn't alter the fact that Cameron failed catastrophically to achieve his goals.
  • May I belatedly express my admiration of the stance taken by Tracey Crouch concerning fixed odds machines. They have nothing to do with gambling and are little more than a legalised form of robbery.

    I wish she were my MP so I could vote for her.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 21,811
    HYUFD said:

    A man who leads the polling of Tory members who will have the final say on who the next leader is is by no means finished and I would suggest it is actually rather arrogant to suggest he is just because you dislike the ConHome survey results.

    The fact you voted Labour in 1997 and 2001 is a statement of fact, the Tories won 30% in 1997 and 31% in 2001. Given the Tories got 42% in 2017 you could say you make up only a minority of about 1/4 of the current Tory vote ie those who voted for Blair but have switched to the Tories to vote for Cameron and May, you are therefore in the minority rather than the majority of the party's vote.

    It is also a bit rich to complain of people wishing to 'destroy' the party when you did not even vote for the party in at least 2 general elections, those who loyally stuck to the party through bad times as well as good may I suggest have more grounds to lecture on that front

    "A man who leads the polling of Tory members..."

    It's a shame this has to be mentioned yet again, but ConHome surveys are not polls.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 31,358
    viewcode said:

    MikeL said:

    Of course it's popular to have a go at Cameron - but if he was still in the Commons there's a decent chance he would be PM again right now.

    Remember what Clarke said at PMQs on his final day - he's the best performer there has been in his entire time as an MP - in a completely different league to anyone else around today.

    His electoral record in terms of MPs gained in 2010 and expectations in 2015 is also outstanding.

    If he did become Foreign Secretary he would then be hot favourite for next PM.

    I'm sorry, but this overlooks his inadequacies. He failed in his renegotiation, undertook a referendum with insufficient preparation, lost the argument, when it became apparent that LEAVE were winning he failed to adapt and continued with his failed approach, and when the referendum was lost he said "Why should I do all the hard s**t?" and fucked off to leave somebody else to clear up the mess. I appreciate that leavers were pleased with the outcome, but that doesn't alter the fact that Cameron failed catastrophically to achieve his goals.
    I suspect history will be kind to Cameron's first term and pretty unforgiving of his second.

    How exactly is he going to be in the HoC to be Foreign Secretary? Or does he think he can do it from the Lords? I doubt the hard grind between him & the job (and no guarantee of getting it) are his cup of tea.

    On the Crouch resignation I suspect; i) The govt did not want (any more) headlines over job losses in April 2019 so shunted it back 6 months, ii) Crouch did a 'do it in April or I quit' iii) Pour encourage les autres May said 'there's the door'.

    If the decision had been to delay 'indefinitely' or for '18 months' I could understand it, but over a 6 month delay seems a tad excessive. Perhaps Ms Crouch overplayed her hand and backed herself into a corner.

    Boris will not stand at GE2020 and has risen as far as he will ever rise in politics. As Lilian Bayliss of the Old Vic once observed to an aspiring actress; 'Well, you had your chance my dear, and you've muffed it'
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 31,358

    HYUFD said:

    A man who leads the polling of Tory members who will have the final say on who the next leader is is by no means finished and I would suggest it is actually rather arrogant to suggest he is just because you dislike the ConHome survey results.

    The fact you voted Labour in 1997 and 2001 is a statement of fact, the Tories won 30% in 1997 and 31% in 2001. Given the Tories got 42% in 2017 you could say you make up only a minority of about 1/4 of the current Tory vote ie those who voted for Blair but have switched to the Tories to vote for Cameron and May, you are therefore in the minority rather than the majority of the party's vote.

    It is also a bit rich to complain of people wishing to 'destroy' the party when you did not even vote for the party in at least 2 general elections, those who loyally stuck to the party through bad times as well as good may I suggest have more grounds to lecture on that front

    "A man who leads the polling of Tory members..."

    It's a shame this has to be mentioned yet again, but ConHome surveys are not polls.
    And not for nothing was it once known as UKIPHome.....

    It's an interesting site, but their poll respondents are definitely on the UKIP/Hard Brexit wing of the party.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 2,329
    Are we all piling on Crouch for leader now? #teamtraytray4life
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 11,111

    viewcode said:

    MikeL said:

    Of course it's popular to have a go at Cameron - but if he was still in the Commons there's a decent chance he would be PM again right now.

    Remember what Clarke said at PMQs on his final day - he's the best performer there has been in his entire time as an MP - in a completely different league to anyone else around today.

    His electoral record in terms of MPs gained in 2010 and expectations in 2015 is also outstanding.

    If he did become Foreign Secretary he would then be hot favourite for next PM.

    I'm sorry, but this overlooks his inadequacies. He failed in his renegotiation, undertook a referendum with insufficient preparation, lost the argument, when it became apparent that LEAVE were winning he failed to adapt and continued with his failed approach, and when the referendum was lost he said "Why should I do all the hard s**t?" and fucked off to leave somebody else to clear up the mess. I appreciate that leavers were pleased with the outcome, but that doesn't alter the fact that Cameron failed catastrophically to achieve his goals.
    I suspect history will be kind to Cameron's first term and pretty unforgiving of his second.

    How exactly is he going to be in the HoC to be Foreign Secretary? Or does he think he can do it from the Lords? I doubt the hard grind between him & the job (and no guarantee of getting it) are his cup of tea.

    On the Crouch resignation I suspect; i) The govt did not want (any more) headlines over job losses in April 2019 so shunted it back 6 months, ii) Crouch did a 'do it in April or I quit' iii) Pour encourage les autres May said 'there's the door'.

    If the decision had been to delay 'indefinitely' or for '18 months' I could understand it, but over a 6 month delay seems a tad excessive. Perhaps Ms Crouch overplayed her hand and backed herself into a corner.

    Boris will not stand at GE2020 and has risen as far as he will ever rise in politics. As Lilian Bayliss of the Old Vic once observed to an aspiring actress; 'Well, you had your chance my dear, and you've muffed it'
    Perceptive points all round. I am too sleepy to add anything.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 11,111
    HYUFD said:

    Bernie Sander's brother on This Week on BBC1 now

    "Sanders's"

    Accuracy really isn't your thing.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 34,326
    IanB2 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Bernie Sander's brother on This Week on BBC1 now

    "Sanders's"

    Accuracy really isn't your thing.
    Isn't it Sanders'?

    *innocent face*
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 10,805
    edited November 2

    May I belatedly express my admiration of the stance taken by Tracey Crouch concerning fixed odds machines. They have nothing to do with gambling and are little more than a legalised form of robbery.

    I wish she were my MP so I could vote for her.

    Totally agree Peter.

    It was an easy win for the Govt, and to borrow Carlotta's phrase, they muffed it.

    The industry have known for at least a year that limiting the stake was under consideration. I see no justifiable defence for the delay. I am incredibly annoyed at the Govt., and full of admiration for Crouch.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 31,358
    edited November 2
    RobD said:

    IanB2 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Bernie Sander's brother on This Week on BBC1 now

    "Sanders's"

    Accuracy really isn't your thing.
    Isn't it Sanders'?

    *innocent face*
    It depends:

    https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/punctuation/apostrophe

    But it definitely isn’t Sander’s
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 10,805
    RobD said:

    IanB2 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Bernie Sander's brother on This Week on BBC1 now

    "Sanders's"

    Accuracy really isn't your thing.
    Isn't it Sanders'?

    *innocent face*
    Stylistically, I'd always go with Sanders' - s's just looks weird....
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 4,770
    Nice podcast again - enjoying the shorter length format.

    One thing that's striking to me on Presidents is that, at least since WWII and perhaps before that, successful Democratic candidates tend to be younger and Republicans older.

    Of the 14 Presidents from FDR onwards, Democrats make up the 5 youngest and Republicans the 5 oldest. The two who are out of order are Truman and Johnson, who of course both served as VP before and became President through a death.

    Does that have any relevance for 2020? Perhaps makes me just a bit more cautious on the idea that Biden and Warren are such frontrunners...
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 9,502

    viewcode said:

    MikeL said:

    Of course it's popular to have a go at Cameron - but if he was still in the Commons there's a decent chance he would be PM again right now.

    Remember what Clarke said at PMQs on his final day - he's the best performer there has been in his entire time as an MP - in a completely different league to anyone else around today.

    His electoral record in terms of MPs gained in 2010 and expectations in 2015 is also outstanding.

    If he did become Foreign Secretary he would then be hot favourite for next PM.

    I'm sorry, but this overlooks his inadequacies. He failed in his renegotiation, undertook a referendum with insufficient preparation, lost the argument, when it became apparent that LEAVE were winning he failed to adapt and continued with his failed approach, and when the referendum was lost he said "Why should I do all the hard s**t?" and fucked off to leave somebody else to clear up the mess. I appreciate that leavers were pleased with the outcome, but that doesn't alter the fact that Cameron failed catastrophically to achieve his goals.
    I suspect history will be kind to Cameron's first term and pretty unforgiving of his second.

    How exactly is he going to be in the HoC to be Foreign Secretary? Or does he think he can do it from the Lords? I doubt the hard grind between him & the job (and no guarantee of getting it) are his cup of tea.

    On the Crouch resignation I suspect; i) The govt did not want (any more) headlines over job losses in April 2019 so shunted it back 6 months, ii) Crouch did a 'do it in April or I quit' iii) Pour encourage les autres May said 'there's the door'.

    If the decision had been to delay 'indefinitely' or for '18 months' I could understand it, but over a 6 month delay seems a tad excessive. Perhaps Ms Crouch overplayed her hand and backed herself into a corner.

    Boris will not stand at GE2020 and has risen as far as he will ever rise in politics. As Lilian Bayliss of the Old Vic once observed to an aspiring actress; 'Well, you had your chance my dear, and you've muffed it'
    David Cameron could, in principle, be Foreign Secretary from the House of Lords. There are recent-ish precedents in Lords Douglas-Home and Carrington.

    Crouch resignation and FOBT-gate may have been due to the government's fear of Brexit-adjacent job losses but we should perhaps also wonder about Esther McVey, whose partner is the bookmakers' friend, Philip Davies, and who is said to have led the move in the spring to delay the stakes cut. Did the Prime Minister in effect have to choose which minister was the more disposable?

  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 9,132
    Jonathan said:

    kle4 said:

    felix said:

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    Surprised but it'd be great for the party image and positioning post Brexit.
    I've generally been well disposed toward Cameron in an instinctive way which I recognise is probably not entirely logical, and I liked the Coalition, but would it be great for either? He would look like he sat out the trickiest years for no reason other than to avoid the hassle, and he presumably wouldn't be in for a top job unless the party were closer to a BINO than a Hard leave position, and him being in a position of influence seems like it would just aggravate the internal divisions already at breaking point. And if he was content to sit on the backbenches he'd still be in the Commons.

    I'd presume if and when he comes back it'd be through a peerage? Jumping the queue ahead of Major, Blair and Brown though (in fairness I do not know if any of those would want a peerage).
    Cameron, the worst PM since Lord North, naturally wants to be the worst foreign secretary since Johnson.

    He has done enough harm. RIP. No flowers.
    They should make him an ambassador. We can have a referendum to decide which country.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 5,167
    MikeL said:

    Of course it's popular to have a go at Cameron - but if he was still in the Commons there's a decent chance he would be PM again right now.

    Remember what Clarke said at PMQs on his final day - he's the best performer there has been in his entire time as an MP - in a completely different league to anyone else around today.

    His electoral record in terms of MPs gained in 2010 and expectations in 2015 is also outstanding.

    If he did become Foreign Secretary he would then be hot favourite for next PM.

    Both Cameron and Osborne should have stayed as backbenchers for the May government if they wanted to continue political careers. I am not surprised that Cameron is bored. He is too young to retire.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 31,358

    viewcode said:

    MikeL said:

    Of course it's popular to have a go at Cameron - but if he was still i

    If he did become Foreign Secretary he would then be hot favourite for next PM.

    I'm sorry, but this overlooks his inadequacies. He failed in his renegotiation, undertook a referendum with insufficient preparation, lost the argument, when it became apparent that LEAVE were winning he failed to adapt and continued with his failed approach, and when the referendum was lost he said "Why should I do all the hard s**t?" and fucked off to leave somebody else to clear up the mess. I appreciate that leavers were pleased with the outcome, but that doesn't alter the fact that Cameron failed catastrophically to achieve his goals.
    I suspect history will be kind to Cameron's first term and pretty unforgiving of his second.

    How exactly is he going to be in the HoC to be Foreign Secretary? Or does he think he can do it from the Lords? I doubt the hard grind between him & the job (and no guarantee of getting it) are his cup of tea.

    On the Crouch resignation I suspect; i) The govt did not want (any more) headlines over job losses in April 2019 so shunted it back 6 months, ii) Crouch did a 'do it in April or I quit' iii) Pour encourage les autres May said 'there's the door'.

    If the decision had been to delay 'indefinitely' or for '18 months' I could understand it, but over a 6 month delay seems a tad excessive. Perhaps Ms Crouch overplayed her hand and backed herself into a corner.

    Boris will not stand at GE2020 and has risen as far as he will ever rise in politics. As Lilian Bayliss of the Old Vic once observed to an aspiring actress; 'Well, you had your chance my dear, and you've muffed it'
    David Cameron could, in principle, be Foreign Secretary from the House of Lords. There are recent-ish precedents in Lords Douglas-Home and Carrington.

    Crouch resignation and FOBT-gate may have been due to the government's fear of Brexit-adjacent job losses but we should perhaps also wonder about Esther McVey, whose partner is the bookmakers' friend, Philip Davies, and who is said to have led the move in the spring to delay the stakes cut. Did the Prime Minister in effect have to choose which minister was the more disposable.
    The Carrington precedent is 36 years ago, whicah may be recentish to both of us, Mrs May and Magic Grandpa, but I suspect for many voters would seem totally bizarre and Labour would make hay with it.

    Agree the McVey issue may have been a factor - Crouch alluded to it in her resignation letter.
  • Can't help but think that something that would have stopped Cameron getting bored would have been two years sorting out Brexit.

  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 6,415

    Jonathan said:

    kle4 said:

    felix said:

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    Surprised but it'd be great for the party image and positioning post Brexit.
    I've generally been well disposed toward Cameron in an instinctive way which I recognise is probably not entirely logical, and I liked the Coalition, but would it be great for either? He would look like he sat out the trickiest years for no reason other than to avoid the hassle, and he presumably wouldn't be in for a top job unless the party were closer to a BINO than a Hard leave position, and him being in a position of influence seems like it would just aggravate the internal divisions already at breaking point. And if he was content to sit on the backbenches he'd still be in the Commons.

    I'd presume if and when he comes back it'd be through a peerage? Jumping the queue ahead of Major, Blair and Brown though (in fairness I do not know if any of those would want a peerage).
    Cameron, the worst PM since Lord North, naturally wants to be the worst foreign secretary since Johnson.

    He has done enough harm. RIP. No flowers.
    They should make him an ambassador. We can have a referendum to decide which country.
    Would you like him for Japan?
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 9,425

    Jonathan said:

    kle4 said:

    felix said:

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    Surprised but it'd be great for the party image and positioning post Brexit.
    I've generally been well disposed toward Cameron in an instinctive way which I recognise is probably not entirely logical, and I liked the Coalition, but would it be great for either? He would look like he sat out the trickiest years for no reason other than to avoid the hassle, and he presumably wouldn't be in for a top job unless the party were closer to a BINO than a Hard leave position, and him being in a position of influence seems like it would just aggravate the internal divisions already at breaking point. And if he was content to sit on the backbenches he'd still be in the Commons.

    I'd presume if and when he comes back it'd be through a peerage? Jumping the queue ahead of Major, Blair and Brown though (in fairness I do not know if any of those would want a peerage).
    Cameron, the worst PM since Lord North, naturally wants to be the worst foreign secretary since Johnson.

    He has done enough harm. RIP. No flowers.
    They should make him an ambassador. We can have a referendum to decide which country.
    First a pig, then the country, now the world.

    Where to send him? France?
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 4,770

    Can't help but think that something that would have stopped Cameron getting bored would have been two years sorting out Brexit.

    Yep. Will be a bit awkward if he ends up working for Boris Johnson.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 13,523
    Douglas Home was still an MP until 1974. Carrington was I think, although I could be wrong, the only holder of a Great Office (other than Lord Chancellor) in the Lords since 1963.

    Until the 1940s it wasn't that unusual for ex-PMs to stay on in politics - Chamberlain, Baldwin, Macdonanld and Balfour all did (Balfour for 24 years under three Prime Ministers). Heath would probably have taken the Foreign Office if Thatcher had offered it to him. In the 19th century it was actually quite unusual for living and healthy ex-PMs not to serve under their successors.

    Since then the issue has generally been that they left office under a cloud having quarelled with their successor. But I also think that with the modern political system isn't terribly sympathetic to people with alternative power bases and a sense of their time having passed.

    I can't see Cameron coming back absent a war for those reasons.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 23,684
    If you want the Washington Post for almost nothing, then install Kindle for Android or iPhone, change your country to the US (it's OK, you can use a UK credit card still), and then go to subscriptions and choose Washington Post : you get six months free, and then about $4/month after. You can log in - using your Amazon account - on their website
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 23,684
    ydoethur said:

    Douglas Home was still an MP until 1974. Carrington was I think, although I could be wrong, the only holder of a Great Office (other than Lord Chancellor) in the Lords since 1963.

    Until the 1940s it wasn't that unusual for ex-PMs to stay on in politics - Chamberlain, Baldwin, Macdonanld and Balfour all did (Balfour for 24 years under three Prime Ministers). Heath would probably have taken the Foreign Office if Thatcher had offered it to him. In the 19th century it was actually quite unusual for living and healthy ex-PMs not to serve under their successors.

    Since then the issue has generally been that they left office under a cloud having quarelled with their successor. But I also think that with the modern political system isn't terribly sympathetic to people with alternative power bases and a sense of their time having passed.

    I can't see Cameron coming back absent a war for those reasons.

    Who do you think the war will be with?
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 11,180

    May I belatedly express my admiration of the stance taken by Tracey Crouch concerning fixed odds machines. They have nothing to do with gambling and are little more than a legalised form of robbery.

    I wish she were my MP so I could vote for her.

    The disagreement on thge facts is odd. Crouch clearly suggests that a decision was taken to introduce the change this month. May's frosty reply to her quite friendly letter says flatly that it's not the case. I suppose it's one of those cases where a decision is made in verbal discussion and subsequently overridden. But why May allowed it to become a major issue is really baffling.
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 9,502
    ydoethur said:

    Douglas Home was still an MP until 1974. Carrington was I think, although I could be wrong, the only holder of a Great Office (other than Lord Chancellor) in the Lords since 1963.

    Until the 1940s it wasn't that unusual for ex-PMs to stay on in politics - Chamberlain, Baldwin, Macdonanld and Balfour all did (Balfour for 24 years under three Prime Ministers). Heath would probably have taken the Foreign Office if Thatcher had offered it to him. In the 19th century it was actually quite unusual for living and healthy ex-PMs not to serve under their successors.

    Since then the issue has generally been that they left office under a cloud having quarelled with their successor. But I also think that with the modern political system isn't terribly sympathetic to people with alternative power bases and a sense of their time having passed.

    I can't see Cameron coming back absent a war for those reasons.

    Alec Douglas-Home had been Foreign Secretary in the House of Lords under Harold Macmillan before renouncing his (first) peerage (thanks to Tony Benn) in order to become Prime Minister.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 13,523
    rcs1000 said:

    ydoethur said:

    Douglas Home was still an MP until 1974. Carrington was I think, although I could be wrong, the only holder of a Great Office (other than Lord Chancellor) in the Lords since 1963.

    Until the 1940s it wasn't that unusual for ex-PMs to stay on in politics - Chamberlain, Baldwin, Macdonanld and Balfour all did (Balfour for 24 years under three Prime Ministers). Heath would probably have taken the Foreign Office if Thatcher had offered it to him. In the 19th century it was actually quite unusual for living and healthy ex-PMs not to serve under their successors.

    Since then the issue has generally been that they left office under a cloud having quarelled with their successor. But I also think that with the modern political system isn't terribly sympathetic to people with alternative power bases and a sense of their time having passed.

    I can't see Cameron coming back absent a war for those reasons.

    Who do you think the war will be with?
    Obviously with the Duchy of Grand Fenwick.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 13,523
    edited November 2

    Alec Douglas-Home had been Foreign Secretary in the House of Lords under Harold Macmillan before renouncing his (first) peerage (thanks to Tony Benn) in order to become Prime Minister.

    Yes, I know. That's why I said 'since 1963.' Somebody had wrongly claimed upthread that he was a peer during his second stint in 1970-74.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 13,523
    Surreal and tragic:

    Chongqing bus plunge caused by fight between driver and passenger
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-china-46068412
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 11,111
    Jonathan said:

    Jonathan said:

    kle4 said:

    felix said:

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    Surprised but it'd be great for the party image and positioning post Brexit.
    I've generally been well disposed toward Cameron in an instinctive way which I recognise is probably not entirely logical, and I liked the Coalition, but would it be great for either? He would look like he sat out the trickiest years for no reason other than to avoid the hassle, and he presumably wouldn't be in for a top job unless the party were closer to a BINO than a Hard leave position, and him being in a position of influence seems like it would just aggravate the internal divisions already at breaking point. And if he was content to sit on the backbenches he'd still be in the Commons.

    I'd presume if and when he comes back it'd be through a peerage? Jumping the queue ahead of Major, Blair and Brown though (in fairness I do not know if any of those would want a peerage).
    Cameron, the worst PM since Lord North, naturally wants to be the worst foreign secretary since Johnson.

    He has done enough harm. RIP. No flowers.
    They should make him an ambassador. We can have a referendum to decide which country.
    First a pig, then the country, now the world.

    Where to send him? France?
    Cameroon, of course.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 9,425
    IanB2 said:

    Jonathan said:

    Jonathan said:

    kle4 said:

    felix said:

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    Surprised but it'd be great for the party image and positioning post Brexit.
    I've generally been well disposed toward Cameron in an instinctive way which I recognise is probably not entirely logical, and I liked the Coalition, but would it be great for either? He would look like he sat out the trickiest years for no reason other than to avoid the hassle, and he presumably wouldn't be in for a top job unless the party were closer to a BINO than a Hard leave position, and him being in a position of influence seems like it would just aggravate the internal divisions already at breaking point. And if he was content to sit on the backbenches he'd still be in the Commons.

    I'd presume if and when he comes back it'd be through a peerage? Jumping the queue ahead of Major, Blair and Brown though (in fairness I do not know if any of those would want a peerage).
    Cameron, the worst PM since Lord North, naturally wants to be the worst foreign secretary since Johnson.

    He has done enough harm. RIP. No flowers.
    They should make him an ambassador. We can have a referendum to decide which country.
    First a pig, then the country, now the world.

    Where to send him? France?
    Cameroon, of course.
    Genius.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 11,111
    edited November 2

    viewcode said:

    MikeL said:

    Of course it's popular to have a go at Cameron - but if he was still in the Commons there's a decent chance he would be PM again right now.

    Remember what Clarke said at PMQs on his final day - he's the best performer there has been in his entire time as an MP - in a completely different league to anyone else around today.

    His electoral record in terms of MPs gained in 2010 and expectationsPM.

    I'm sorry, but this overlooks his inadequacies. He failed in his renegotiation, undertook a referendum with insufficient preparation, lost the argument, when it became apparent that LEAVE were winning he failed to adapt and continued with his failed approach, and when the referendum was lost he said "Why should I do all the hard s**t?" and fucked off to leave somebody else to clear up the mess. I appreciate that leavers were pleased with the outcome, but that doesn't alter the fact that Cameron failed catastrophically to achieve his goals.
    I suspect history will be kind to Cameron's first term and pretty unforgiving of his second.

    How exactly is he going to be in the HoC to be Foreign Secretary? Or does he think he can do it from the Lords? I doubt the hard grind between him & the job (and no guarantee of getting it) are his cup of tea.

    On the Crouch resignation I suspect; i) The govt did not want (any more) headlines over job losses in April 2019 so shunted it back 6 months, ii) Crouch did a 'do it in April or I quit' iii) Pour encourage les autres May said 'there's the door'.

    If the decision had been to delay 'indefinitely' or for '18 months' I could understand it, but over a 6 month delay seems a tad excessive. Perhaps Ms Crouch overplayed her hand and backed herself into a corner.

    Boris will not stand at GE2020 and has risen as far as he will ever rise in politics. As Lilian Bayliss of the Old Vic once observed to an aspiring actress; 'Well, you had your chance my dear, and you've muffed it'
    David Cameron could, in principle, be Foreign Secretary from the House of Lords. There are recent-ish precedents in Lords Douglas-Home and Carrington.

    Crouch resignation and FOBT-gate may have been due to the government's fear of Brexit-adjacent job losses but we should perhaps also wonder about Esther McVey, whose partner is the bookmakers' friend, Philip Davies, and who is said to have led the move in the spring to delay the stakes cut. Did the Prime Minister in effect have to choose which minister was the more disposable?

    McVey would have looked a right chump resigning over a personal hobby horse of her 'partner'. An one so unpopular.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 13,523
    IanB2 said:

    Jonathan said:

    Jonathan said:

    kle4 said:

    felix said:

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    Surprised but it'd be great for the party image and positioning post Brexit.
    I've generally been well disposed toward Cameron in an instinctive way which I recognise is probably not entirely logical, and I liked the Coalition, but would it be great for either? He would look like he sat out the trickiest years for no reason other than to avoid the hassle, and he presumably wouldn't be in for a top job unless the party were closer to a BINO than a Hard leave position, and him being in a position of influence seems like it would just aggravate the internal divisions already at breaking point. And if he was content to sit on the backbenches he'd still be in the Commons.

    I'd presume if and when he comes back it'd be through a peerage? Jumping the queue ahead of Major, Blair and Brown though (in fairness I do not know if any of those would want a peerage).
    Cameron, the worst PM since Lord North, naturally wants to be the worst foreign secretary since Johnson.

    He has done enough harm. RIP. No flowers.
    They should make him an ambassador. We can have a referendum to decide which country.
    First a pig, then the country, now the world.

    Where to send him? France?
    Cameroon, of course.
    *Applauds*
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 9,502
    IanB2 said:


    I suspect history will be kind to Cameron's first term and pretty unforgiving of his second.

    How exactly is he going to be in the HoC to be Foreign Secretary? Or does he think he can do it from the Lords? I doubt the hard grind between him & the job (and no guarantee of getting it) are his cup of tea.

    On the Crouch resignation I suspect; i) The govt did not want (any more) headlines over job losses in April 2019 so shunted it back 6 months, ii) Crouch did a 'do it in April or I quit' iii) Pour encourage les autres May said 'there's the door'.

    If the decision had been to delay 'indefinitely' or for '18 months' I could understand it, but over a 6 month delay seems a tad excessive. Perhaps Ms Crouch overplayed her hand and backed herself into a corner.

    Boris will not stand at GE2020 and has risen as far as he will ever rise in politics. As Lilian Bayliss of the Old Vic once observed to an aspiring actress; 'Well, you had your chance my dear, and you've muffed it'

    David Cameron could, in principle, be Foreign Secretary from the House of Lords. There are recent-ish precedents in Lords Douglas-Home and Carrington.

    Crouch resignation and FOBT-gate may have been due to the government's fear of Brexit-adjacent job losses but we should perhaps also wonder about Esther McVey, whose partner is the bookmakers' friend, Philip Davies, and who is said to have led the move in the spring to delay the stakes cut. Did the Prime Minister in effect have to choose which minister was the more disposable?

    McVey would have looked a right chump resigning over a personal hobby horse of her 'partner'. An one so unpopular.
    Perhaps but nonetheless it has been reported it was Esther McVey who forced the delay.
    See the nation's principal organ of record, the Times pb:
    http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2018/05/27/esther-mcveys-betting-problem-is-why-im-taking-the-20-1-on-her-as-next-out-of-the-cabinet/
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 2,329
    FPT...
    DavidL said:


    I feared as much. That's really appalling and must have significant knock on effects in the number of hours pilots get, ground crew get, etc etc. You'd like to think that the £1bn bunged to defence would focus on this but I doubt it. It's not glamorous enough for our Defence Secretary.

    There's no point getting excited about the Fireplace Salesman's Billion Pound Defence Bonanza. Most of it is unforecasted budget over-run on the Dreadnought (Trident replacement) program so it has no net positive effect on defence capability. The other part is to bring forward ASW and Cyber programs from 2020/2021 - very marginal improvement in defence capability.

    The Dreadnought program has been in full swing for a year and is 660m over budget. That feels like a good performance (compared to QEC and Typhoon) to me.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 11,111

    IanB2 said:


    I suspect history will be kind to Cameron's first term and pretty unforgiving of his second.

    How exactly is he going to be in the HoC to be Foreign Secretary? Or does he think he can do it from the Lords? I doubt the hard grind between him & the job (and no guarantee of getting it) are his cup of tea.

    On the Crouch resignation I suspect; i) The govt did not want (any more) headlines over job losses in April 2019 so shunted it back 6 months, ii) Crouch did a 'do it in April or I quit' iii) Pour encourage les autres May said 'there's the door'.

    If the decision had been to delay 'indefinitely' or for '18 months' I could understand it, but over a 6 month delay seems a tad excessive. Perhaps Ms Crouch overplayed her hand and backed herself into a corner.

    Boris will not stand at GE2020 and has risen as far as he will ever rise in politics. As Lilian Bayliss of the Old Vic once observed to an aspiring actress; 'Well, you had your chance my dear, and you've muffed it'

    David Cameron could, in principle, be Foreign Secretary from the House of Lords. There are recent-ish precedents in Lords Douglas-Home and Carrington.

    Crouch resignation and FOBT-gate may have been due to the government's fear of Brexit-adjacent job losses but we should perhaps also wonder about Esther McVey, whose partner is the bookmakers' friend, Philip Davies, and who is said to have led the move in the spring to delay the stakes cut. Did the Prime Minister in effect have to choose which minister was the more disposable?

    McVey would have looked a right chump resigning over a personal hobby horse of her 'partner'. An one so unpopular.
    Perhaps but nonetheless it has been reported it was Esther McVey who forced the delay.
    See the nation's principal organ of record, the Times pb:
    http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2018/05/27/esther-mcveys-betting-problem-is-why-im-taking-the-20-1-on-her-as-next-out-of-the-cabinet/
    Lol. OGH's speculation was that she would be out because of abusing her position, given a conflict of interest. If you are right it looks like she is doubling down...
  • Dura_Ace said:

    Are we all piling on Crouch for leader now? #teamtraytray4life

    some of us since 7/6/2017....
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 11,111
    ydoethur said:

    IanB2 said:

    Jonathan said:

    Jonathan said:

    kle4 said:

    felix said:

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    Surprised but it'd be great for the party image and positioning post Brexit.
    I've generally been well disposed toward Cameron in an instinctive way which I recognise is probably not entirely logical, and I liked the Coalition, but would it be great for either? He would look like he sat out the trickiest years for no reason other than to avoid the hassle, and he presumably wouldn't be in for a top job unless the party were closer to a BINO than a Hard leave position, and him being in a position of influence seems like it would just aggravate the internal divisions already at breaking point. And if he was content to sit on the backbenches he'd still be in the Commons.

    I'd presume if and when he comes back it'd be through a peerage? Jumping the queue ahead of Major, Blair and Brown though (in fairness I do not know if any of those would want a peerage).
    Cameron, the worst PM since Lord North, naturally wants to be the worst foreign secretary since Johnson.

    He has done enough harm. RIP. No flowers.
    They should make him an ambassador. We can have a referendum to decide which country.
    First a pig, then the country, now the world.

    Where to send him? France?
    Cameroon, of course.
    *Applauds*
    British Cameroon had a referendum where one half voted to join Nigeria and the other half voted to join French Cameroon. So he'd feel right at home. And he doesn't deserve anywhere too comfy, after all.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 46,004
    Good morning, everyone.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 18,435
    Wasn't McVey tipped as future Con leader by a few on here ?

    Not a good day for her chances yesterday.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 12,526
    IanB2 said:

    ydoethur said:

    IanB2 said:

    Jonathan said:

    Jonathan said:

    kle4 said:

    felix said:

    DAVID Cameron has told friends he is mulling a return to frontline politics, and fancies being Foreign Secretary.

    The former PM is hoping for a Cabinet recall after a new Tory leader succeeds Theresa May.


    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/#Echobox=1541110199

    Surprised but it'd be great for the party image and positioning post Brexit.
    I've generally been well disposed toward Cameron in an instinctive way which I recognise is probably not entirely logical, and I liked the Coalition, but would it be great for either? He would look like he sat out the trickiest years for no reason other than to avoid the hassle, and he presumably wouldn't be in for a top job unless the party were closer to a BINO than a Hard leave position, and him being in a position of influence seems like it would just aggravate the internal divisions already at breaking point. And if he was content to sit on the backbenches he'd still be in the Commons.

    I'd presume if and when he comes back it'd be through a peerage? Jumping the queue ahead of Major, Blair and Brown though (in fairness I do not know if any of those would want a peerage).
    Cameron, the worst PM since Lord North, naturally wants to be the worst foreign secretary since Johnson.

    He has done enough harm. RIP. No flowers.
    They should make him an ambassador. We can have a referendum to decide which country.
    First a pig, then the country, now the world.

    Where to send him? France?
    Cameroon, of course.
    *Applauds*
    British Cameroon had a referendum where one half voted to join Nigeria and the other half voted to join French Cameroon. So he'd feel right at home. And he doesn't deserve anywhere too comfy, after all.
    Ambassador to the EU would be appropriate. After all, he would be reminded of his ineptitude on a daily basis!
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 13,523
    TGOHF said:

    Wasn't McVey tipped as future Con leader by a few on here ?

    Not a good day for her chances yesterday.

    Arguably, she is now in a terminal fix.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 18,435
    ydoethur said:

    TGOHF said:

    Wasn't McVey tipped as future Con leader by a few on here ?

    Not a good day for her chances yesterday.

    Arguably, she is now in a terminal fix.
    Bets on her becoming PM should be limited to £2 immediately.
  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 5,847
    TGOHF said:

    ydoethur said:

    TGOHF said:

    Wasn't McVey tipped as future Con leader by a few on here ?

    Not a good day for her chances yesterday.

    Arguably, she is now in a terminal fix.
    Bets on her becoming PM should be limited to £2 immediately.
    2p
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 18,080
    what on earth is Camron thinking ? Presumably "Id make a vey good Foreign Secretary".

    Im afarid he's had his time in politics and should look for something else to do.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 22,620

    what on earth is Camron thinking ? Presumably "Id make a vey good Foreign Secretary".

    Im afarid he's had his time in politics and should look for something else to do.

    Perhaps a job with Twitter?
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 20,761
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Paging @HYUFD

    In a separate development, the ex-Tory boss’s old nemesis Boris Johnson has also told his friends he has given up hope of becoming the next Tory leader.

    But Boris still hopes to be “in the mix” for a Cabinet job under Mrs May’s successor.

    Political friends say the former London Mayor is unlikely to even enter the next leadership race.

    One said: “If Boris think the chances are against him, he won’t go for it. He deosn’t want to be humiliated by coming fourth or fifth”.

    Just as well the chances aren't against him then. Boris remains top of today's new ConHome Tory members next Tory leader poll, just ahead of Javid with Davis and Raab entering the top 5 and Hunt and Gove falling out of the top 5. Mogg rounds up the top tier in 4th

    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2018/11/conhomes-survey-davis-tears-a-chunk-off-johnson-who-now-leads-javid-by-less-than-a-point.html
    You are at it again. Conhome is noas leader
    You may not accept Boris, that does not mean a majority of Conservative members and voters won't and the fact you voted for Blair in 1997 and 2001 confirms you are on the Blairite wing of the party anyway.

    If a few Blairites leave the party if Boris or Mogg become leader for the LDs it might give them a bit of much needed publicity but not much more than that
    You do have a knack of talking utter rubbish

    I am going nowhere and neither is Boris. He is finished and I resent your arrogant nonsense about my politics and reference to liberals

    You would have the party led by a group that would destroy it
    A man who leads the polling of Tory members who will have the final say on who the next leader is is by no means finished and I would suggest it is actually rather arrogant to suggest he is just because you dislike the ConHome survey results.

    The fact you voted Labour in 1997 and 2001 is a statement of fact, the Tories won 30% in 1997 and 31% in 2001. Given the Tories got 42% in 2017 you could say you make up only a minority of about 1/4 of the current Tory vote ie those who voted for Blair but have switched to the Tories to vote for Cameron and May, you are therefore in the minority rather than the majority of the party's vote.

    It is also a bit rich to complain of people wishing to 'destroy' the party when you did not even vote for the party in at least 2 general elections, those who loyally stuck to the party through bad times as well as good may I suggest have more grounds to lecture on that front
    Remember winning election is about getting people to vote FOR you. Not chasing them away in the pursuit of purity
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