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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Now Corbyn and TMay are scrapping over whether the BBC or ITV

SystemSystem Posts: 6,666
edited November 29 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Now Corbyn and TMay are scrapping over whether the BBC or ITV hosts the Brexit debate

The BBC is reporting that both Corbyn and TMay have accepted invites to take part in a Brexit debate. Only problem is that the former wants it to be on ITV while the latter prefers the BBC.

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 9,675
    First.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 48,635
    Oh Just do both.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 46,598
    I think the only sensible and fair way to settle this is for Sophie Raworth and Julie Etchingham to enter the Thunderdome.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 5,973
    Given it's just after Strictly, could Tezza and Jezza have a dance-off instead?... suspect that would be more entertaining.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 18,088
    Really, Corbyn watches 'I’m A Celebrity…'?

    Give me a break.

    As Oscar Wilde said, the problem with socialism is that it takes up far too many of your evenings.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 48,635
    Possible other Brexit debates:

    Hoey vs Lammy - the ultimate Labour debate as to why the deal is terrible for completely opposing reasons.
    Foster vs Mary Lou McDonnell - Good one for NI
    Boris vs Soubry - the ultimate Tory debate as to why the deal is terrible for completely opposing reasons.
    Clarke vs Mogg grudge match
    Flint vs Grieve - Labour vs Tory debate with a few twists
    Cable vs Batten - Minor UK wide party debate
    Geordie Grieg vs Dacre - New Mail vs Old Mail.
  • Maybe the BBC could get an actor to play Jeremy Corbyn?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 48,635
    Sturgeon vs Davidson - It's not about independence, honest.
    Barnier vs Boris - "Non", "Non", "Non".
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 48,635
    Right so Corbyn is more concerned with a gameshow than a debate on the future of the nation...
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 5,973

    Maybe the BBC could get an actor to play Jeremy Corbyn?

    Maybe they could get Theresa May to play Theresa May?
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 5,973
    Pulpstar said:

    Right so Corbyn is more concerned with a gameshow than a debate on the future of the nation...

    I can see the Mail & Sun headlines already!
  • rpjsrpjs Posts: 1,460
    Pulpstar said:

    Possible other Brexit debates:

    Hoey vs Lammy - the ultimate Labour debate as to why the deal is terrible for completely opposing reasons.
    Foster vs Mary Lou McDonnell - Good one for NI
    Boris vs Soubry - the ultimate Tory debate as to why the deal is terrible for completely opposing reasons.
    Clarke vs Mogg grudge match
    Flint vs Grieve - Labour vs Tory debate with a few twists
    Cable vs Batten - Minor UK wide party debate
    Geordie Grieg vs Dacre - New Mail vs Old Mail.

    That last one would be awesome. but if Private Eye is to be believed it'd have to be well past the watershed or else the broadcasters' beep machines would melt down.

    (The Eye claims Dacre's daily editorial briefings were known at the Mail as "the Vagina Monologues" because of how much he used the c-word.)
  • marke09marke09 Posts: 846
    The solution to BBC or ITV? SKY News
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 48,635

    Maybe the BBC could get an actor to play Jeremy Corbyn?

    Maybe they could get Theresa May to play Theresa May?
    Amber Rudd played her last time didn't she ?
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 21,255
    Pulpstar said:

    Possible other Brexit debates:

    Hoey vs Lammy - the ultimate Labour debate as to why the deal is terrible for completely opposing reasons.
    Foster vs Mary Lou McDonnell - Good one for NI
    Boris vs Soubry - the ultimate Tory debate as to why the deal is terrible for completely opposing reasons.
    Clarke vs Mogg grudge match
    Flint vs Grieve - Labour vs Tory debate with a few twists
    Cable vs Batten - Minor UK wide party debate
    Geordie Grieg vs Dacre - New Mail vs Old Mail.

    Clegg and Farage?

    Too soon?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 31,449
    edited November 29
    Typical Corbyn isn't it...it is as if he has been a professional contrarian all his life.

    If May had agreed to ITV, he would want BBC as they are the gold standard, watched by the most people, yadda yadda yadda.

    I still haven't worked out why Team May thinks all of this is a good idea, it isn't as if she is a crack debater (more like cack debater) or overly confident in their ability e.g. Blair or Cameron.
  • not_on_firenot_on_fire Posts: 2,610

    Pulpstar said:

    Possible other Brexit debates:

    Hoey vs Lammy - the ultimate Labour debate as to why the deal is terrible for completely opposing reasons.
    Foster vs Mary Lou McDonnell - Good one for NI
    Boris vs Soubry - the ultimate Tory debate as to why the deal is terrible for completely opposing reasons.
    Clarke vs Mogg grudge match
    Flint vs Grieve - Labour vs Tory debate with a few twists
    Cable vs Batten - Minor UK wide party debate
    Geordie Grieg vs Dacre - New Mail vs Old Mail.

    Clegg and Farage?

    Too soon?
    How about pre-Referendum Boris vs post-Referendum Boris?
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 12,951

    Pulpstar said:

    Right so Corbyn is more concerned with a gameshow than a debate on the future of the nation...

    I can see the Mail & Sun headlines already!
    TBH he came across on ITV this morning as mild-mannered and reasonable about it. Not like TM at all.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 48,635

    Pulpstar said:

    Possible other Brexit debates:

    Hoey vs Lammy - the ultimate Labour debate as to why the deal is terrible for completely opposing reasons.
    Foster vs Mary Lou McDonnell - Good one for NI
    Boris vs Soubry - the ultimate Tory debate as to why the deal is terrible for completely opposing reasons.
    Clarke vs Mogg grudge match
    Flint vs Grieve - Labour vs Tory debate with a few twists
    Cable vs Batten - Minor UK wide party debate
    Geordie Grieg vs Dacre - New Mail vs Old Mail.

    Clegg and Farage?

    Too soon?
    A rematch ! Same evening as Chisora-Whyte ?
  • YorkcityYorkcity Posts: 3,592

    Pulpstar said:

    Right so Corbyn is more concerned with a gameshow than a debate on the future of the nation...

    I can see the Mail & Sun headlines already!
    May won the debate , they have already written it.
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 3,830
    edited November 29
    What does Theresa hope to achieve with this? Apart from supporters of her deal - who you could surely fit in a telephone box - everyone will be willing her to fail. I can't see here changing any minds, even if she has a blinder, and she runs a terrible risk.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 21,255

    Pulpstar said:

    Right so Corbyn is more concerned with a gameshow than a debate on the future of the nation...

    I can see the Mail & Sun headlines already!
    Corbyn panics - "get me out of here!"
  • eekeek Posts: 2,409
    Surely it's Sunday the 9th not Saturday...
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 18,088
    Yorkcity said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Right so Corbyn is more concerned with a gameshow than a debate on the future of the nation...

    I can see the Mail & Sun headlines already!
    May won the debate , they have already written it.
    Shame no one watching actually will be able to vote.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 21,255
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Possible other Brexit debates:

    Hoey vs Lammy - the ultimate Labour debate as to why the deal is terrible for completely opposing reasons.
    Foster vs Mary Lou McDonnell - Good one for NI
    Boris vs Soubry - the ultimate Tory debate as to why the deal is terrible for completely opposing reasons.
    Clarke vs Mogg grudge match
    Flint vs Grieve - Labour vs Tory debate with a few twists
    Cable vs Batten - Minor UK wide party debate
    Geordie Grieg vs Dacre - New Mail vs Old Mail.

    Clegg and Farage?

    Too soon?
    A rematch ! Same evening as Chisora-Whyte ?
    A new line in Facebook pay-per-view?
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 23,582

    What does Theresa hope to achieve with this? Apart from supporters of her deal - who you could surely fit in a telephone box - everyone will be willing her to fail. I can't see here changing any minds, even if she has a blinder, and she runs a terrible risk.

    She has a cunning plan and I think she could win the meaningful vote.
  • MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 4,809

    What does Theresa hope to achieve with this? Apart from supporters of her deal - who you could surely fit in a telephone box - everyone will be willing her to fail. I can't see here changing any minds, even if she has a blinder, and runs a terrible risk.

    Maybe but she's facing Corbyn who gets rattled when interviewers interrupt him.

  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 21,255

    Pulpstar said:

    Possible other Brexit debates:

    Hoey vs Lammy - the ultimate Labour debate as to why the deal is terrible for completely opposing reasons.
    Foster vs Mary Lou McDonnell - Good one for NI
    Boris vs Soubry - the ultimate Tory debate as to why the deal is terrible for completely opposing reasons.
    Clarke vs Mogg grudge match
    Flint vs Grieve - Labour vs Tory debate with a few twists
    Cable vs Batten - Minor UK wide party debate
    Geordie Grieg vs Dacre - New Mail vs Old Mail.

    Clegg and Farage?

    Too soon?
    How about pre-Referendum Boris vs post-Referendum Boris?
    The two pre-Referendum Borises?
  • eek said:

    Surely it's Sunday the 9th not Saturday...

    Yes it is Sunday...Mike pumping out the Fake News again.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 20,414

    What does Theresa hope to achieve with this? Apart from supporters of her deal - who you could surely fit in a telephone box - everyone will be willing her to fail. I can't see here changing any minds, even if she has a blinder, and she runs a terrible risk.

    What has she got to lose?
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 31,846
    Scott_P said:
    First in the Commons - Chris Smith while still an MP did in an interview in 2005 - and had been positive for 18 years by then.
  • NotchNotch Posts: 145
    FPT
    tpfkar said:

    Notch said:


    What voting system might Parliament agree for deciding by referendum? Realistic possibilities are five:

    1. AV.
    2. Leave - Yes or No, followed if "Yes" by round 2 asking Deal or No Deal.
    3. Same as 2 but with conditional question on ballot.
    4. Deal - Yes or No, followed if "No" by round 2 asking Remain or WTO.
    5. Same as 4, but with conditional question on ballot.

    You miss out the most obvious and the only one that had not already been asked.

    Deal or No Deal. It honours the first referendum because not leaving is not an option and it asks the public to decide the form of Brexit which is what everyone claims to have been complaining about.
    I fear that things have simply moved on from there.

    My view is that it has to be AV on three options. Any less than that and you disenfranchise a lot of people and present legitimacy issues. However any attempt to two stage it, or to have a second round of some form actually doesn't make the options equivalent or provide a fair comparison.

    However as I think Nick P stated way downthread, there needs to be a clear statement agreed with the EU about what remain means and what No Deal means. Are we remaining on same terms? What minimal or bare bones agreements would be kept in a no deal.
    @Richard - I was only listing possibilities for how @Carlotta's proposal to seek the electorate's decision among all three options might be implemented.

    @tpfkar - Completely agreed that the meaning of Remain and No Deal must be made at least as clear as the meaning of Deal. If I were a computer program I'd probably also agree that AV would be best because uniquely of the 5 it treats all options the same. In practice, though, Leave or Remain is a different kind of issue from what relationship to have with EU27 if it's Leave, a point which Remainers would be make if Deal were to win under AV.

    I don't even want to imagine how politicians would play politics with the various options for a 3-option referendum or pair of referendums. The best they can come up with on the substantive issue is No Deal. The Westminster blob of government plus Parliament has failed the country. That's going to take a long time to sort out, if it ever is sorted out. Let's have a referendum on what the blob HAS come up with, which is No Deal. The alternative has got to be Remain, for reasons that include the fact that it's consistently showing as more popular in the polls than either Deal or No Deal.

    Imagine if the electorate is allowed to choose Deal and they do. Do we want ANOTHER round of politicians sickmakingly saying "We don't agree with the people, but the people are our masters and so we must obey them", which we've put up with since 2016?
  • What does Theresa hope to achieve with this? Apart from supporters of her deal - who you could surely fit in a telephone box - everyone will be willing her to fail. I can't see here changing any minds, even if she has a blinder, and she runs a terrible risk.

    What has she got to lose?
    Precisely. Tbe Americans would call this a Hail Mary Pass.
  • OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 5,853

    What does Theresa hope to achieve with this? Apart from supporters of her deal - who you could surely fit in a telephone box - everyone will be willing her to fail. I can't see here changing any minds, even if she has a blinder, and she runs a terrible risk.

    What has she got to lose?
    An evening with Philip. Her dignity.

    Not much in the scheme of things with the fate of the nation at stake, but it's not like there's a strong likelihood of much upside.
  • YorkcityYorkcity Posts: 3,592

    Yorkcity said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Right so Corbyn is more concerned with a gameshow than a debate on the future of the nation...

    I can see the Mail & Sun headlines already!
    May won the debate , they have already written it.
    Shame no one watching actually will be able to vote.
    Yes seems pointless grandstanding to me.

    Both say we are honouring the 2016 referendum and we are leaving in March 2019.

    End of debate.
  • Awb683Awb683 Posts: 31
    The choice of Sunday evening viewing is nearly as bad as May's deal.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 31,449
    edited November 29
    Yorkcity said:

    Yorkcity said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Right so Corbyn is more concerned with a gameshow than a debate on the future of the nation...

    I can see the Mail & Sun headlines already!
    May won the debate , they have already written it.
    Shame no one watching actually will be able to vote.
    Yes seems pointless grandstanding to me.

    Both say we are honouring the 2016 referendum and we are leaving in March 2019.

    End of debate.
    If Corbyn had any sense, he would use it as a platform to announce he was backing a second referendum. Not because I want him to, but it seems like just a free hit.

    He can caveat it with all sorts of similar impossible red lines to the EU deal if he wants, but the media will go wild and it won't have mattered what RoboMay has said up to then.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 5,750

    Yorkcity said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Right so Corbyn is more concerned with a gameshow than a debate on the future of the nation...

    I can see the Mail & Sun headlines already!
    May won the debate , they have already written it.
    Shame no one watching actually will be able to vote.
    Surely some MPs will watch?

    Not that I will be. Staff Christmas party for me.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 46,598
    Mr. 683, mostly agree, but Dynasties, as with most nature documentaries, is rather engaging.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 31,449
    edited November 29
    Awb683 said:

    The choice of Sunday evening viewing is nearly as bad as May's deal.

    What are you talking about. NFL Red Zone...best sport tv show going. Premier league et al. would be wise to follow suit.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 20,414

    What does Theresa hope to achieve with this? Apart from supporters of her deal - who you could surely fit in a telephone box - everyone will be willing her to fail. I can't see here changing any minds, even if she has a blinder, and she runs a terrible risk.

    What has she got to lose?
    An evening with Philip. Her dignity.

    Not much in the scheme of things with the fate of the nation at stake, but it's not like there's a strong likelihood of much upside.
    There may not be a strong likelihood of much upside, but there's a small likelihood of an enormous upside - saving the country from a No Deal disaster or another damaging referendum, rescuing her reputation and legacy, and exposing Corbyn for the charlatan he is. At the very least she is going to get recognition for trying her hardest to sort out this mess.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 21,255

    What does Theresa hope to achieve with this? Apart from supporters of her deal - who you could surely fit in a telephone box - everyone will be willing her to fail. I can't see here changing any minds, even if she has a blinder, and she runs a terrible risk.

    She has a cunning plan and I think she could win the meaningful vote.
    ...in her mind.....

  • What does Theresa hope to achieve with this? Apart from supporters of her deal - who you could surely fit in a telephone box - everyone will be willing her to fail. I can't see here changing any minds, even if she has a blinder, and she runs a terrible risk.

    What has she got to lose?
    An evening with Philip. Her dignity.

    Not much in the scheme of things with the fate of the nation at stake, but it's not like there's a strong likelihood of much upside.
    There may not be a strong likelihood of much upside, but there's a small likelihood of an enormous upside - saving the country from a No Deal disaster or another damaging referendum, rescuing her reputation and legacy, and exposing Corbyn for the charlatan he is. At the very least she is going to get recognition for trying her hardest to sort out this mess.
    Just a shame she got us into this mess.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 21,255

    What does Theresa hope to achieve with this? Apart from supporters of her deal - who you could surely fit in a telephone box - everyone will be willing her to fail. I can't see here changing any minds, even if she has a blinder, and she runs a terrible risk.

    What has she got to lose?
    An evening with Philip. Her dignity.

    Not much in the scheme of things with the fate of the nation at stake, but it's not like there's a strong likelihood of much upside.
    There may not be a strong likelihood of much upside, but there's a small likelihood of an enormous upside - saving the country from a No Deal disaster or another damaging referendum, rescuing her reputation and legacy, and exposing Corbyn for the charlatan he is. At the very least she is going to get recognition for trying her hardest to sort out this her mess.
    Fixed

  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 18,088
    Awb683 said:

    The choice of Sunday evening viewing is nearly as bad as May's deal.

    Yep. Bonkers. Who the feck, apart from us anoraks, wants their Sunday evening ruined by having to switch channels to avoid this?
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 20,414

    What does Theresa hope to achieve with this? Apart from supporters of her deal - who you could surely fit in a telephone box - everyone will be willing her to fail. I can't see here changing any minds, even if she has a blinder, and she runs a terrible risk.

    What has she got to lose?
    An evening with Philip. Her dignity.

    Not much in the scheme of things with the fate of the nation at stake, but it's not like there's a strong likelihood of much upside.
    There may not be a strong likelihood of much upside, but there's a small likelihood of an enormous upside - saving the country from a No Deal disaster or another damaging referendum, rescuing her reputation and legacy, and exposing Corbyn for the charlatan he is. At the very least she is going to get recognition for trying her hardest to sort out this mess.
    Just a shame she got us into this mess.
    Except she didn't.
  • YorkcityYorkcity Posts: 3,592

    What does Theresa hope to achieve with this? Apart from supporters of her deal - who you could surely fit in a telephone box - everyone will be willing her to fail. I can't see here changing any minds, even if she has a blinder, and she runs a terrible risk.

    What has she got to lose?
    An evening with Philip. Her dignity.

    Not much in the scheme of things with the fate of the nation at stake, but it's not like there's a strong likelihood of much upside.
    There may not be a strong likelihood of much upside, but there's a small likelihood of an enormous upside - saving the country from a No Deal disaster or another damaging referendum, rescuing her reputation and legacy, and exposing Corbyn for the charlatan he is. At the very least she is going to get recognition for trying her hardest to sort out this mess.
    Richard she will always have your support.
    As would every Conservative leader.

    Shame you do not have a vote.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 8,775
    Regarding the Cohen plea, recall that Trump only just submitted a sworn open book reply to Mueller questions which included this one:

    What communication did you have with Michael D. Cohen, Felix Sater and others, including foreign nationals, about Russian real estate developments during the campaign?

    What odds that he lied, under penalty of perjury ?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 48,635

    Awb683 said:

    The choice of Sunday evening viewing is nearly as bad as May's deal.

    What are you talking about. NFL Red Zone...best sport tv show going. Premier league et al. would be wise to follow suit.
    On its own, an NFL game isn't actually the most exciting spectacle(*). Far too much downtime commercial breaks and nothing going on for plenty of time. Mesh 7 or 8 together though with Scott Hanson hosting though and it is bloody brilliant.

    *Except for Rams - Chiefs

    I don't think May is capable of flinging the needed Hail Mary though, but Corbyn won't pick six either.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 46,598
    Mr. B, if that's the case, will Trump go in 2019?

    Ladbrokes odds, Trump departure year:
    2018 - 34
    2019 - 5
    2020 - 11
    2021 - 2 [this could be by losing the next presidential election, of course]
  • grabcocquegrabcocque Posts: 3,243
    edited November 29
    We made it guys, the big 💯


    🚨 100 Tory MPs have now indicated they will not vote for Theresa May's Brexit deal 🚨

    Matthew Offord: "as the deal stands at the moment, I will vote against it"

  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 48,635
    Who is in more shit at the moment, Manafort or Cohen ?
  • YorkcityYorkcity Posts: 3,592

    Awb683 said:

    The choice of Sunday evening viewing is nearly as bad as May's deal.

    Yep. Bonkers. Who the feck, apart from us anoraks, wants their Sunday evening ruined by having to switch channels to avoid this?
    True , and nobody apart from MPs has a vote .

    They should put it on BBC 3 or ITV 4 for those that are interested.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 71,257
    edited November 29
    Pulpstar said:

    Who is in more shit at the moment, Manafort or Cohen ?

    Manafort. He’s going to be in either prison or the poor house for the rest of his life.

    Cohen will also do serious time and be disbarred but he can eventually move on.
  • grabcocquegrabcocque Posts: 3,243

    What does Theresa hope to achieve with this? Apart from supporters of her deal - who you could surely fit in a telephone box - everyone will be willing her to fail. I can't see here changing any minds, even if she has a blinder, and she runs a terrible risk.

    What has she got to lose?
    An evening with Philip. Her dignity.

    Not much in the scheme of things with the fate of the nation at stake, but it's not like there's a strong likelihood of much upside.
    There may not be a strong likelihood of much upside, but there's a small likelihood of an enormous upside - saving the country from a No Deal disaster or another damaging referendum, rescuing her reputation and legacy, and exposing Corbyn for the charlatan he is. At the very least she is going to get recognition for trying her hardest to sort out this mess.
    You know, we all think the jig is up, and and that she has nothing to lose.

    But I'm not convinced she does. If she actually believes she's in with a chance, then this becomes foolhardy.

    Conclusion: May knows it's a haily mary pass.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 9,504

    What does Theresa hope to achieve with this? Apart from supporters of her deal - who you could surely fit in a telephone box - everyone will be willing her to fail. I can't see here changing any minds, even if she has a blinder, and she runs a terrible risk.

    Tory members like Corbyn even less than they like her and they put pressure on MPs, so there's a benefit to making it look like the dispute is between her and Corbyn, rather than between her and half the parliamentary Conservative party.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 20,414
    edited November 29
    Yorkcity said:

    What does Theresa hope to achieve with this? Apart from supporters of her deal - who you could surely fit in a telephone box - everyone will be willing her to fail. I can't see here changing any minds, even if she has a blinder, and she runs a terrible risk.

    What has she got to lose?
    An evening with Philip. Her dignity.

    Not much in the scheme of things with the fate of the nation at stake, but it's not like there's a strong likelihood of much upside.
    There may not be a strong likelihood of much upside, but there's a small likelihood of an enormous upside - saving the country from a No Deal disaster or another damaging referendum, rescuing her reputation and legacy, and exposing Corbyn for the charlatan he is. At the very least she is going to get recognition for trying her hardest to sort out this mess.
    Richard she will always have your support.
    As would every Conservative leader.

    Shame you do not have a vote.
    I'm not sure that saying 'she hasn't much to lose' is an expression of support, but as a matter of simple fact it is not the case that every Conservative leader has had my support in the past, the current leader has my support only in a very limited sense, and it is certainly the case that several of the front-runners for her successor would not have my support in the future,
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 18,088

    We made it guys, the big 💯


    🚨 100 Tory MPs have now indicated they will not vote for Theresa May's Brexit deal 🚨

    Matthew Offord: "as the deal stands at the moment, I will vote against it"

    Yeh, but they haven't seen the TV debate yet. You wait until then...
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 8,775

    Pulpstar said:

    Who is in more shit at the moment, Manafort or Cohen ?

    Manafort. He’s going to be in either prison or the poor house for the rest of his life.

    Cohen will also do serious time and be disbarred but he can eventually move on.
    And Cohen probably doesn’t have the same worries about FSB direct action ....


  • Pulpstar said:

    Who is in more shit at the moment, Manafort or Cohen ?

    Manafort. He’s going to be in either prison or the poor house for the rest of his life.

    Cohen will also do serious time and be disbarred but he can eventually move on.
    In fairness describing Michael Cohen as a Lawyer is a little like describing Bruce Willis as a singer.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 48,635
    Turns out 538's model was amazingly accurate on the House:

  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 8,775

    Mr. B, if that's the case, will Trump go in 2019?

    Ladbrokes odds, Trump departure year:
    2018 - 34
    2019 - 5
    2020 - 11
    2021 - 2 [this could be by losing the next presidential election, of course]

    Well it is only one liar’s word against another.
    So far.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 5,973
    Pulpstar said:

    Who is in more shit at the moment, Manafort or Cohen ?

    May
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 21,255

    We made it guys, the big 💯


    🚨 100 Tory MPs have now indicated they will not vote for Theresa May's Brexit deal 🚨

    Matthew Offord: "as the deal stands at the moment, I will vote against it"

    Yeh, but they haven't seen the TV debate yet. You wait until then...
    120? 130?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 8,775

    Pulpstar said:

    Who is in more shit at the moment, Manafort or Cohen ?

    May
    That Donald May ?
    (FPT)

  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 48,635

    We made it guys, the big 💯


    🚨 100 Tory MPs have now indicated they will not vote for Theresa May's Brexit deal 🚨

    Matthew Offord: "as the deal stands at the moment, I will vote against it"

    Yeh, but they haven't seen the TV debate yet. You wait until then...
    120? 130?
    ONe huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuundred and aaaaaaaaaateeeeeeeeeyyyyyyyyyyyy
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 9,504
    Pulpstar said:

    Turns out 538's model was amazingly accurate on the House:

    Also hats off to the US pollsters, since 538 is basically a souped-up polling average.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 18,088

    We made it guys, the big 💯


    🚨 100 Tory MPs have now indicated they will not vote for Theresa May's Brexit deal 🚨

    Matthew Offord: "as the deal stands at the moment, I will vote against it"

    Yeh, but they haven't seen the TV debate yet. You wait until then...
    120? 130?
    You betcha.
  • Nigelb said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Who is in more shit at the moment, Manafort or Cohen ?

    Manafort. He’s going to be in either prison or the poor house for the rest of his life.

    Cohen will also do serious time and be disbarred but he can eventually move on.
    And Cohen probably doesn’t have the same worries about FSB direct action ....


    Michael Flynn is another one.

    Probably going to lose his military pension and be bankrupted even though he’s selling the family home.

    I have a bit of sympathy but then I remember this.

  • Just arrived in to hear Sky reporting TM and the BBC have agreed the debate with an independent panel cross examining the leaders and for them to say Corbyn is concened he doesn't know the detail and wants it on ITV

    That is labour's policy right there.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 24,031
    edited November 29
    Nigelb said:

    Regarding the Cohen plea, recall that Trump only just submitted a sworn open book reply to Mueller questions which included this one:

    What communication did you have with Michael D. Cohen, Felix Sater and others, including foreign nationals, about Russian real estate developments during the campaign?

    What odds that he lied, under penalty of perjury ?

    His replies will have been written by lawyers (and they will have been checked 100 times) who will have couched every response in ways that make them hard to be direct lies.

    There will be lots of "I do not recall" and "to the best of my knowledge".

    Much, much more possible is that Trump Jr will have lied under oath. And I think would be a big issue for the Trump Presidency. There's no way that the President can allow his son to plead guilty and go to jail, even for a few days. There's no way that he can end up in court. There's no way he can be pardoned. That's why the Trump administration has been getting increasingly frenzied and have been retweeting the image of Rosenstein, Clinton and Obama behind bars and suggesting they should be jailed for treason. (Which is pretty astonishing, when you think of it.)

    The assumption in the Trump camp had been - pre-Manafort - that trials would be seen to be politically motivated and a witchhunt, and therefore that there would always be at least one juror who would choose to ignore the evidence. That assumption has now changed.

    Interesting times.
  • grabcocquegrabcocque Posts: 3,243

    Pulpstar said:

    Turns out 538's model was amazingly accurate on the House:

    Also hats off to the US pollsters, since 538 is basically a souped-up polling average.
    NOT YOU, RASMUSSEN.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 6,985
    Out of respect for the person who got us to where we are now, shouldn't the TV debate be on Dave?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 24,031

    Mr. B, if that's the case, will Trump go in 2019?

    Ladbrokes odds, Trump departure year:
    2018 - 34
    2019 - 5
    2020 - 11
    2021 - 2 [this could be by losing the next presidential election, of course]

    The base loves Trump. He has exceptionally high favourables with Republican voters.

    The Republican Party establishment hate Trump. They see him as an electoral liability, a tarnisher of the brand, and frankly dangerous for America.

    Trump will not stand down willingly. I'm not even sure he'd acknowledge losing the 2020 Presidential election.
  • grabcocquegrabcocque Posts: 3,243

    Just arrived in to hear Sky reporting TM and the BBC have agreed the debate with an independent panel cross examining the leaders and for them to say Corbyn is concened he doesn't know the detail and wants it on ITV

    That is labour's policy right there.

    Theresa May proposed a head to head debate with Jeremy and is now trying to wiggle out of it.

    That is not a head-to-head debate, that's a job interview for the people's commissar for tractor statistics.

    If May is now scared of debating yer man Jez head on, then why in the name of ALL THAT IS GOOD AND HOLY did she challenge him to one?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 24,031
    Pulpstar said:

    Who is in more shit at the moment, Manafort or Cohen ?

    Manafort, because he's going to prison for the rest of his life, and there's really no way for him to avoid that.
  • Just arrived in to hear Sky reporting TM and the BBC have agreed the debate with an independent panel cross examining the leaders and for them to say Corbyn is concened he doesn't know the detail and wants it on ITV

    That is labour's policy right there.

    Theresa May proposed a head to head debate with Jeremy and is now trying to wiggle out of it.

    That is not a head-to-head debate, that's a job interview for the people's commissar for tractor statistics.

    If May is now scared of debating yer man Jez head on, then why in the name of ALL THAT IS GOOD AND HOLY did she challenge him to one?
    I do not understand your point and there is no need to shout

    She has agreed a one on one on BBC - it is upto Corbyn to accept
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 24,031

    What does Theresa hope to achieve with this? Apart from supporters of her deal - who you could surely fit in a telephone box - everyone will be willing her to fail. I can't see here changing any minds, even if she has a blinder, and she runs a terrible risk.

    Tory members like Corbyn even less than they like her and they put pressure on MPs, so there's a benefit to making it look like the dispute is between her and Corbyn, rather than between her and half the parliamentary Conservative party.
    +1
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 7,709

    What does Theresa hope to achieve with this? Apart from supporters of her deal - who you could surely fit in a telephone box - everyone will be willing her to fail. I can't see here changing any minds, even if she has a blinder, and she runs a terrible risk.

    What has she got to lose?
    You have to assume she wants a deal of some kind. Saying the chances of that ever happening are so low there's nothing to wreck doesn't seem like a plan to me.
  • grabcocquegrabcocque Posts: 3,243
    rcs1000 said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Who is in more shit at the moment, Manafort or Cohen ?

    Manafort, because he's going to prison for the rest of his life, and there's really no way for him to avoid that.
    There does seem to be a connection between "working for Trump" and "lengthy prison sentences".

    Makes u think.
  • Pulpstar said:

    Who is in more shit at the moment, Manafort or Cohen ?

    Manafort. He’s going to be in either prison or the poor house for the rest of his life.

    Cohen will also do serious time and be disbarred but he can eventually move on.
    In fairness describing Michael Cohen as a Lawyer is a little like describing Bruce Willis as a singer.
    Hush your mouth.

    Listen to this then recant.

  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 22,120
    You have to admire Mr Mueller. On his witch hunt he's managed to find a lot of self-confessed witches.
  • YorkcityYorkcity Posts: 3,592

    Just arrived in to hear Sky reporting TM and the BBC have agreed the debate with an independent panel cross examining the leaders and for them to say Corbyn is concened he doesn't know the detail and wants it on ITV

    That is labour's policy right there.

    Theresa May proposed a head to head debate with Jeremy and is now trying to wiggle out of it.

    That is not a head-to-head debate, that's a job interview for the people's commissar for tractor statistics.

    If May is now scared of debating yer man Jez head on, then why in the name of ALL THAT IS GOOD AND HOLY did she challenge him to one?
    I do not understand your point and there is no need to shout

    She has agreed a one on one on BBC - it is upto Corbyn to accept
    Corbyn prefers ITV , could May accept that ?

    If not why ?
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 20,414

    You have to admire Mr Mueller. On his witch hunt he's managed to find a lot of self-confessed witches.

    True, but then so did the mediaeval witch-hunters.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 34,780
    Yorkcity said:

    Just arrived in to hear Sky reporting TM and the BBC have agreed the debate with an independent panel cross examining the leaders and for them to say Corbyn is concened he doesn't know the detail and wants it on ITV

    That is labour's policy right there.

    Theresa May proposed a head to head debate with Jeremy and is now trying to wiggle out of it.

    That is not a head-to-head debate, that's a job interview for the people's commissar for tractor statistics.

    If May is now scared of debating yer man Jez head on, then why in the name of ALL THAT IS GOOD AND HOLY did she challenge him to one?
    I do not understand your point and there is no need to shout

    She has agreed a one on one on BBC - it is upto Corbyn to accept
    Corbyn prefers ITV , could May accept that ?

    If not why ?
    Why does Corbyn call the shots?
  • grabcocquegrabcocque Posts: 3,243

    You have to admire Mr Mueller. On his witch hunt he's managed to find a lot of self-confessed witches.

    True, but then so did the mediaeval witch-hunters.
    You know what happened to most people accused of witchcraft in the middle ages? They were acquitted.

    Mueller's not that amateurish.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 24,031
    edited November 29

    You have to admire Mr Mueller. On his witch hunt he's managed to find a lot of self-confessed witches.

    That is a great line. You should tweet that.
  • RobD said:

    Yorkcity said:

    Just arrived in to hear Sky reporting TM and the BBC have agreed the debate with an independent panel cross examining the leaders and for them to say Corbyn is concened he doesn't know the detail and wants it on ITV

    That is labour's policy right there.

    Theresa May proposed a head to head debate with Jeremy and is now trying to wiggle out of it.

    That is not a head-to-head debate, that's a job interview for the people's commissar for tractor statistics.

    If May is now scared of debating yer man Jez head on, then why in the name of ALL THAT IS GOOD AND HOLY did she challenge him to one?
    I do not understand your point and there is no need to shout

    She has agreed a one on one on BBC - it is upto Corbyn to accept
    Corbyn prefers ITV , could May accept that ?

    If not why ?
    Why does Corbyn call the shots?
    Because he won the last election
  • A woman whose ex-husband was convicted of rape and possessing child abuse images had to go to court to prevent him gaining access to her children, the BBC's Victoria Derbyshire programme has learned.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-46387043
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 24,031
    edited November 29
    Yorkcity said:

    Just arrived in to hear Sky reporting TM and the BBC have agreed the debate with an independent panel cross examining the leaders and for them to say Corbyn is concened he doesn't know the detail and wants it on ITV

    That is labour's policy right there.

    Theresa May proposed a head to head debate with Jeremy and is now trying to wiggle out of it.

    That is not a head-to-head debate, that's a job interview for the people's commissar for tractor statistics.

    If May is now scared of debating yer man Jez head on, then why in the name of ALL THAT IS GOOD AND HOLY did she challenge him to one?
    I do not understand your point and there is no need to shout

    She has agreed a one on one on BBC - it is upto Corbyn to accept
    Corbyn prefers ITV , could May accept that ?

    If not why ?
    Corbyn prefers a format where he's not actually talking to Mrs May.

    Edit to add: I think I'm actually completely wrong here...
  • RobD said:

    Yorkcity said:

    Just arrived in to hear Sky reporting TM and the BBC have agreed the debate with an independent panel cross examining the leaders and for them to say Corbyn is concened he doesn't know the detail and wants it on ITV

    That is labour's policy right there.

    Theresa May proposed a head to head debate with Jeremy and is now trying to wiggle out of it.

    That is not a head-to-head debate, that's a job interview for the people's commissar for tractor statistics.

    If May is now scared of debating yer man Jez head on, then why in the name of ALL THAT IS GOOD AND HOLY did she challenge him to one?
    I do not understand your point and there is no need to shout

    She has agreed a one on one on BBC - it is upto Corbyn to accept
    Corbyn prefers ITV , could May accept that ?

    If not why ?
    Why does Corbyn call the shots?
    He is concerned by BBC independent panel quering him on his brexit policy
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 24,031

    RobD said:

    Yorkcity said:

    Just arrived in to hear Sky reporting TM and the BBC have agreed the debate with an independent panel cross examining the leaders and for them to say Corbyn is concened he doesn't know the detail and wants it on ITV

    That is labour's policy right there.

    Theresa May proposed a head to head debate with Jeremy and is now trying to wiggle out of it.

    That is not a head-to-head debate, that's a job interview for the people's commissar for tractor statistics.

    If May is now scared of debating yer man Jez head on, then why in the name of ALL THAT IS GOOD AND HOLY did she challenge him to one?
    I do not understand your point and there is no need to shout

    She has agreed a one on one on BBC - it is upto Corbyn to accept
    Corbyn prefers ITV , could May accept that ?

    If not why ?
    Why does Corbyn call the shots?
    He is concerned by BBC independent panel quering him on his brexit policy
    Why? Surely he's got the ultimate hospital pass - "I'm sorry, I wasn't aware we had a Brexit policy."
  • RobDRobD Posts: 34,780

    RobD said:

    Yorkcity said:

    Just arrived in to hear Sky reporting TM and the BBC have agreed the debate with an independent panel cross examining the leaders and for them to say Corbyn is concened he doesn't know the detail and wants it on ITV

    That is labour's policy right there.

    Theresa May proposed a head to head debate with Jeremy and is now trying to wiggle out of it.

    That is not a head-to-head debate, that's a job interview for the people's commissar for tractor statistics.

    If May is now scared of debating yer man Jez head on, then why in the name of ALL THAT IS GOOD AND HOLY did she challenge him to one?
    I do not understand your point and there is no need to shout

    She has agreed a one on one on BBC - it is upto Corbyn to accept
    Corbyn prefers ITV , could May accept that ?

    If not why ?
    Why does Corbyn call the shots?
    Because he won the last election
    My bad.
  • grabcocquegrabcocque Posts: 3,243
    RobD said:


    Why does Corbyn call the shots?

    He doesn't, necessarily. But it's about the optics.

    May, apparently, wants a head to head debate. ITV are offering it and May's running scared.

    May wanted to "sell the deal to the people". ITV are offering an audience of real people, and May's running scared.

    Labour are going to say (with some justification) that she wants to go with the Brexit-horny BBC because she knows they'll soft-pedal her, and she's a coward, avoiding a head-to-head in front of real people.

    And we know May *is* a coward, so I think the charge will stick.
  • So BBC1 would show the Brexit debate in place of the Tiger documentary: a female who must protect her cubs while battling rivals who want to steal her lands. There's got to be a joke in there somewhere
  • ExiledInScotlandExiledInScotland Posts: 562
    edited November 29
    rcs1000 said:

    You have to admire Mr Mueller. On his witch hunt he's managed to find a lot of self-confessed witches.

    That is a great line. You should tweet that.
    Ah but do they float? Or weigh the same as a duck?
This discussion has been closed.