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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Dangerous corner. Where would we be now if Remain had won 52:4

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  • Andy_CookeAndy_Cooke Posts: 4,793



    All very good reasons that no deal is now the optimum course. Free trade agreements, if they take place, if they take place at all, should be about trade. Dragging Gibraltar and Cyprus is totally counterproductive and willingness to give up fishing just shows how out London based positions don’t care for either wealth creation in the rest of the country which is one of the reasons Leave won in the first place. Fishing is the only way to revitalise many of our coastal communities. It’s importance to the EU also shows how vacuous Remain arguments are that the UK has nothing of value for the EU and is doomed to be the beggar at the feast in any negotiations.

    Err, no. The way to absolutely guarantee a totally disastrous negotiation with the EU is to crash out and then have to come running back to them in panic to rescue us from the chaos. That really would be the worst of all possible worlds.
    Hardly. Trade will flow if it’s the interests of the buyer and seller. It might become more costly and time consuming but if the EU don’t want access to our markets and won’t allow access to UK companies to theirs then we made the right decision to Leave. Being held to political ransom for a trade agreement as worthless as the withdrawal agreement is not worth spending time on frankly. We had 40 years of being in the EU and it didn’t work for far too many parts of the country.
    Your second sentence and third sentence taken together give the answer.
    Making it more costly decreases the likelihood of it being in their mutual interests and would directly reduce it at the margins.
    Making it more time consuming decreases the likelihood of it being in their mutual interests and would directly reduce it at the margins.
    Doing both simultaneously gives a double whammy, and significantly broadens those margins.
    Reducing the trade in those margins can add to the costs and times for the other ones, further broadening those margins.
    It stabilises eventually, but only after you've sacrificed a chunk of British livelihoods and options to the British buyer.

    You then argue we made the right decision to Leave, if the disruption and costs incurred solely by Leaving have consequences, which is rather a self-referencing argument.
  • TheJezziahTheJezziah Posts: 3,840
    Donny43 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Excellent piece, really fun read!

    https://twitter.com/JimMFelton/status/1075871993482895361

    My favourite bit of this is Sam Gyimah's face as after she said it.

    She's 100% right and it works. Dogs do help prevent smuggling contraband into prisons via drones. It helps the guards be alert to the smuggling.

    Are you that ignorant the point goes over your head? How does it feel to not be as smart as Liz Truss?
    Yes I'm sure the barking deters the drones themselves...

    Gee, I wish I was as smart as you.

    MP says something stupid isn't a new headline it happens plenty to Labour MPs and other parties as well, Imagine it was Diane Abbott if it helps you take it less personally.
    Indeed it does deter drones. A drone plus the contraband it contains is worth thousands of pounds. If dogs result in the drone being captured by guards then smugglers won't be as quick to use drones. QED drones are deterred.
    No it doesn't, it can deter people who can control drones but drones themselves are mostly unbothered by barking...

    Just imagine it was Diane Abbott or another Black Labour MP then you just laugh at them messing up.
    What does "black" have to do with anything?
    I can't imagine such offence to people laughing being taken by the same people if Diane had made the mistake.
    That's because Abbott has form for saying incredibly stupid things. Not because of her skin colour.
    And offence was taken in this case as Truss is not known for saying silly things...

    Okay makes sense.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941

    Donny43 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Excellent piece, really fun read!

    https://twitter.com/JimMFelton/status/1075871993482895361

    My favourite bit of this is Sam Gyimah's face as after she said it.

    She's 100% right and it works. Dogs do help prevent smuggling contraband into prisons via drones. It helps the guards be alert to the smuggling.

    Are you that ignorant the point goes over your head? How does it feel to not be as smart as Liz Truss?
    Yes I'm sure the barking deters the drones themselves...

    Gee, I wish I was as smart as you.

    MP says something stupid isn't a new headline it happens plenty to Labour MPs and other parties as well, Imagine it was Diane Abbott if it helps you take it less personally.
    Indeed it does deter drones. A drone plus the contraband it contains is worth thousands of pounds. If dogs result in the drone being captured by guards then smugglers won't be as quick to use drones. QED drones are deterred.
    No it doesn't, it can deter people who can control drones but drones themselves are mostly unbothered by barking...

    Just imagine it was Diane Abbott or another Black Labour MP then you just laugh at them messing up.
    What does "black" have to do with anything?
    I can't imagine such offence to people laughing being taken by the same people if Diane had made the mistake.
    That's because Abbott has form for saying incredibly stupid things. Not because of her skin colour.
    And offence was taken in this case as Truss is not known for saying silly things...

    Okay makes sense.
    I don't think offence was taken, more that the tweet was trying to make something out of nothing.
  • TheJezziahTheJezziah Posts: 3,840
    RobD said:

    Donny43 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Excellent piece, really fun read!

    https://twitter.com/JimMFelton/status/1075871993482895361

    My favourite bit of this is Sam Gyimah's face as after she said it.

    She's 100% right and it works. Dogs do help prevent smuggling contraband into prisons via drones. It helps the guards be alert to the smuggling.

    Are you that ignorant the point goes over your head? How does it feel to not be as smart as Liz Truss?
    Yes I'm sure the barking deters the drones themselves...

    Gee, I wish I was as smart as you.

    MP says something stupid isn't a new headline it happens plenty to Labour MPs and other parties as well, Imagine it was Diane Abbott if it helps you take it less personally.
    Indeed it does deter drones. A drone plus the contraband it contains is worth thousands of pounds. If dogs result in the drone being captured by guards then smugglers won't be as quick to use drones. QED drones are deterred.
    No it doesn't, it can deter people who can control drones but drones themselves are mostly unbothered by barking...

    Just imagine it was Diane Abbott or another Black Labour MP then you just laugh at them messing up.
    What does "black" have to do with anything?
    I can't imagine such offence to people laughing being taken by the same people if Diane had made the mistake.
    That's because Abbott has form for saying incredibly stupid things. Not because of her skin colour.
    And offence was taken in this case as Truss is not known for saying silly things...

    Okay makes sense.
    I don't think offence was taken, more that the tweet was trying to make something out of nothing.
    'Are you that ignorant the point goes over your head? How does it feel to not be as smart as Liz Truss?'

    Sorta sounds like it touched a nerve..

    Anyway Donny cleared it up, Liz Truss doesn't usually say silly things like Diane Abbott so its different.
  • Donny43Donny43 Posts: 634

    RobD said:

    Donny43 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Excellent piece, really fun read!

    https://twitter.com/JimMFelton/status/1075871993482895361

    My favourite bit of this is Sam Gyimah's face as after she said it.

    She's 100% right and it works. Dogs do help prevent smuggling contraband into prisons via drones. It helps the guards be alert to the smuggling.

    Are you that ignorant the point goes over your head? How does it feel to not be as smart as Liz Truss?
    Yes I'm sure the barking deters the drones themselves...

    Gee, I wish I was as smart as you.

    MP says something stupid isn't a new headline it happens plenty to Labour MPs and other parties as well, Imagine it was Diane Abbott if it helps you take it less personally.
    Indeed it does deter drones. A drone plus the contraband it contains is worth thousands of pounds. If dogs result in the drone being captured by guards then smugglers won't be as quick to use drones. QED drones are deterred.
    No it doesn't, it can deter people who can control drones but drones themselves are mostly unbothered by barking...

    Just imagine it was Diane Abbott or another Black Labour MP then you just laugh at them messing up.
    What does "black" have to do with anything?
    I can't imagine such offence to people laughing being taken by the same people if Diane had made the mistake.
    That's because Abbott has form for saying incredibly stupid things. Not because of her skin colour.
    And offence was taken in this case as Truss is not known for saying silly things...

    Okay makes sense.
    I don't think offence was taken, more that the tweet was trying to make something out of nothing.
    'Are you that ignorant the point goes over your head? How does it feel to not be as smart as Liz Truss?'

    Sorta sounds like it touched a nerve..

    Anyway Donny cleared it up, Liz Truss doesn't usually say silly things like Diane Abbott so its different.
    My only point was that you immediately assumed racism when it's nothing of the sort.
  • Mr. 43, playing the race card means you don't have to actually respond to an argument.

    It worked brilliantly well when Labour did it over immigration.
  • TheJezziahTheJezziah Posts: 3,840
    Donny43 said:

    RobD said:

    Donny43 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Excellent piece, really fun read!

    https://twitter.com/JimMFelton/status/1075871993482895361

    My favourite bit of this is Sam Gyimah's face as after she said it.

    She's 100% right and it works. Dogs do help prevent smuggling contraband into prisons via drones. It helps the guards be alert to the smuggling.

    Are you that ignorant the point goes over your head? How does it feel to not be as smart as Liz Truss?
    Yes I'm sure the barking deters the drones themselves...

    Gee, I wish I was as smart as you.

    MP says something stupid isn't a new headline it happens plenty to Labour MPs and other parties as well, Imagine it was Diane Abbott if it helps you take it less personally.
    Indeed it does deter drones. A drone plus the contraband it contains is worth thousands of pounds. If dogs result in the drone being captured by guards then smugglers won't be as quick to use drones. QED drones are deterred.
    No it doesn't, it can deter people who can control drones but drones themselves are mostly unbothered by barking...

    Just imagine it was Diane Abbott or another Black Labour MP then you just laugh at them messing up.
    What does "black" have to do with anything?
    I can't imagine such offence to people laughing being taken by the same people if Diane had made the mistake.
    That's because Abbott has form for saying incredibly stupid things. Not because of her skin colour.
    And offence was taken in this case as Truss is not known for saying silly things...

    Okay makes sense.
    I don't think offence was taken, more that the tweet was trying to make something out of nothing.
    'Are you that ignorant the point goes over your head? How does it feel to not be as smart as Liz Truss?'

    Sorta sounds like it touched a nerve..

    Anyway Donny cleared it up, Liz Truss doesn't usually say silly things like Diane Abbott so its different.
    My only point was that you immediately assumed racism when it's nothing of the sort.
    You said its because she has form for saying incredibly stupid (I usually swap silly for stupid a little more polite) things which is a fair enough conclusion if you think so. Logical conclusion being that it's different with Truss because she doesn't say silly things.

    Seems a reasonable enough explanation to me.

  • Just imagine it was Diane Abbott or another Black Labour MP then you just laugh at them messing up.

    You're clearly jumping out of the way of invisible banana skins today.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,712
    Certainly the biggest change from a narrow win would have been a UKIP surge in a Leaves backlash as the article suggests. As it also points out though we might well have ended up with PM May anyway
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,712
    edited December 2018

    Very entertaining. Of course it doesn’t do anything to point a way forward but such was not it’s purpose. If a narrow win either way would get us similar paralysis, maybe politicians need to broaden their policy horizons. The Tories have forgotten how to run a free market economy for the benefit of the many rather than the few and have become just another tax and spend party. They better discover their capitalist credentials quickly if they want to keep Corbyn out of Downing St.

    It is precisely because pure capitalism increasingly does not benefit the many rather than the few the Tories cannot abandon completely tax and spend even if they do less off it than Labour
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,575
    HYUFD said:

    Very entertaining. Of course it doesn’t do anything to point a way forward but such was not it’s purpose. If a narrow win either way would get us similar paralysis, maybe politicians need to broaden their policy horizons. The Tories have forgotten how to run a free market economy for the benefit of the many rather than the few and have become just another tax and spend party. They better discover their capitalist credentials quickly if they want to keep Corbyn out of Downing St.

    It is precisely because pure capitalism increasingly does not benefit the many rather than the few the Tories cannot abandon completely tax and spend even if they do less off it than Labour
    And the evidence is that relying on the generosity of the few would mean a precarious existence for the many...
    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/dec/21/persimmons-former-ceo-jeff-fairburn-fails-to-set-up-charity-after-pledging-portion-of-75-million-bonus
    Jeff Fairburn, the former chief executive of the housebuilder Persimmon, has failed to set up a charity almost a year after pledging to do so in an attempt to assuage public and political anger at his “obscene” £75m bonus...
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,712
    edited December 2018
    Caller tells LBC he wants a second EU referendum after finding out he will need a pension of at least £30k a year and private health insurance to retire to Spain once free movement ends

    https://mobile.twitter.com/OldBobCyprus/status/1076001026426200065
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,712
    Nigelb said:

    HYUFD said:

    Very entertaining. Of course it doesn’t do anything to point a way forward but such was not it’s purpose. If a narrow win either way would get us similar paralysis, maybe politicians need to broaden their policy horizons. The Tories have forgotten how to run a free market economy for the benefit of the many rather than the few and have become just another tax and spend party. They better discover their capitalist credentials quickly if they want to keep Corbyn out of Downing St.

    It is precisely because pure capitalism increasingly does not benefit the many rather than the few the Tories cannot abandon completely tax and spend even if they do less off it than Labour
    And the evidence is that relying on the generosity of the few would mean a precarious existence for the many...
    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/dec/21/persimmons-former-ceo-jeff-fairburn-fails-to-set-up-charity-after-pledging-portion-of-75-million-bonus
    Jeff Fairburn, the former chief executive of the housebuilder Persimmon, has failed to set up a charity almost a year after pledging to do so in an attempt to assuage public and political anger at his “obscene” £75m bonus...
    Certainly relying on charity alone
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901
    In the alternative history, Trump lost, Putins attempts at interference were exposed on both sides of the Atlantic and the Leave movement was tarnished. A lucky escape.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Floater said:

    A slightly different take

    One says manufactured, one says sales
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 38,851

    playing the race card means you don't have to actually respond to an argument. It worked brilliantly well when Labour did it over immigration.

    But please note that playing the race card works both ways.

    (i) Shouting “racism!” at something that is not racist in order to shut down debate.

    (ii) Shouting “playing the race card!” at the calling out of genuine racism in order to shut down debate.

    Matter of opinion as to which is worse and which is the most common.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    Scott_P said:

    Floater said:

    A slightly different take

    One says manufactured, one says sales
    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/dec/21/uk-car-manufacturing-output-falls-by-a-fifth-as-demand-slumps

    lots more where that come from

  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 49,959
    Scott_P said:
    How about you spend your time working out ways to prevent those problems where lives could be at risk, rather than wasting valuable time going on the bloody media....
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    Scott_P said:

    Floater said:

    A slightly different take

    One says manufactured, one says sales
    Read the reasons ........
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195

    Scott_P said:
    How about you spend your time working out ways to prevent those problems where lives could be at risk, rather than wasting valuable time going on the bloody media....
    Just google "excess deaths and nhs"

  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    Also this

    https://www.smmt.co.uk/vehicle-data/manufacturing/

    but hey - Scott wants his nice doom porn headline to blame it all on brexit
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 47,789

    Scott_P said:
    How about you spend your time working out ways to prevent those problems where lives could be at risk, rather than wasting valuable time going on the bloody media....
    How long does it take to work out that sending a letter revoking Article 50 would do the trick?
  • The ingratitude of the public. Fancy not relishing the opportunity to die a glorious death, albeit through lack of medicines, in pursuit of the glittering prize that is no deal Brexit?
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195

    Scott_P said:
    How about you spend your time working out ways to prevent those problems where lives could be at risk, rather than wasting valuable time going on the bloody media....
    How long does it take to work out that sending a letter revoking Article 50 would do the trick?
    Good job there are no excess deaths in the nhs then


    oh

  • Hands up who is surprised... Minister for truth has been missing his own limelight...

    https://twitter.com/JewishChron/status/1076082227409231873?s=19

    The Labour Party now has policies that are aimed at extensive state intervention. Combine this with the general thuggery of Momentum followers and their anti-Semitism, and the cult like status of the "Leader" I suggest they get on with it and start having some good old marches dressed in black/brown shirts. Heil Corbyn!
  • RoyalBlueRoyalBlue Posts: 3,223

    The ingratitude of the public. Fancy not relishing the opportunity to die a glorious death, albeit through lack of medicines, in pursuit of the glittering prize that is no deal Brexit?

    We shall win honour for our House and our names shall be sung by our children’s children.

    That’s what I was thinking as I ticked the box.
  • Scott_P said:
    How about you spend your time working out ways to prevent those problems where lives could be at risk, rather than wasting valuable time going on the bloody media....
    That is precisely what she is doing you numpty.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 47,789
    RoyalBlue said:

    We shall win honour for our House and our names shall be sung by our children’s children.

    That’s what I was thinking as I ticked the box.

    Is this the Blue household anthem?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eS3uVUbx3Vc
  • HYUFD said:

    Very entertaining. Of course it doesn’t do anything to point a way forward but such was not it’s purpose. If a narrow win either way would get us similar paralysis, maybe politicians need to broaden their policy horizons. The Tories have forgotten how to run a free market economy for the benefit of the many rather than the few and have become just another tax and spend party. They better discover their capitalist credentials quickly if they want to keep Corbyn out of Downing St.

    It is precisely because pure capitalism increasingly does not benefit the many rather than the few the Tories cannot abandon completely tax and spend even if they do less off it than Labour
    That is rather illogical. If the Gov practised capitalism for the many, not the few they wouldn’t need to be so tax and spend.
  • RoyalBlueRoyalBlue Posts: 3,223

    RoyalBlue said:

    We shall win honour for our House and our names shall be sung by our children’s children.

    That’s what I was thinking as I ticked the box.

    Is this the Blue household anthem?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eS3uVUbx3Vc
    Erm...

    That’s a lot of hair.
  • I must say I'm puzzled as to why a no-deal Brexit might lead to medical shortages. Our EU friends aren't planning to refuse to export to us, as far as I know. Whilst I can see that there could well be problems with food imports, because of the volume, medicines are low-bulk items which could easily be flown in to the UK in the event of disruption at the ports, and given special accelerated clearance. Surely this is something entirely in our control?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842
    edited December 2018
    I think if we had voted to remain inside the EU, support for leaving would probably now be over 50% to exit. Those advocating and against a second referendum would 90+% have switched places.
  • Andy_CookeAndy_Cooke Posts: 4,793

    The ingratitude of the public. Fancy not relishing the opportunity to die a glorious death, albeit through lack of medicines, in pursuit of the glittering prize that is no deal Brexit?

    It may seem to be taking it too seriously, but the entire sequence of events seems to be outlining a certain aspect of the British psyche.

    Over in the US, the gun control debate is hampered by the issue that Americans have this fantasy of the Wild West as their identity and history, harking to a fictionalised time - a distorted retelling of history as fantasy. Every time the debate is run, it hits the same rocks that this fantasy is subsumed at a visceral level into the identity of many Americans.

    Over here, we have the entire attempt to reach a common outlook foundering on similar rocks of identity, again fuelled by a fictionalised time, of plucky little Britain standing alone, an exceptionalism, an idealisation of dogged stiff-upper-lippism and the cult of the amateur over the professional, and of pulling it out of the fire at the last moment without putting in the hard yards first. That "they" will comply with us, that all we need is the Dunkirk spirit, that it is difficult but "we" (an expanded and generic "we" that isn't actually our children, our colleagues, our family, ourselves, but a kind of mystical belongingness) just have to be strong, and we can be.

    There is a time and a place for standing firm and refusing to admit doubt. That time and place is not when things are complicated, we don't really know what's coming up, our pre-existing assumptions are shown to be completely wrong, and our loved ones are relying on us to actually get it right, because they're vulnerable to us getting it wrong.

    In short, sometimes getting it right is more important than ego.
  • Donny43 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Excellent piece, really fun read!

    https://twitter.com/JimMFelton/status/1075871993482895361

    My favourite bit of this is Sam Gyimah's face as after she said it.

    She's 100% right and it works. Dogs do help prevent smuggling contraband into prisons via drones. It helps the guards be alert to the smuggling.

    Are you that ignorant the point goes over your head? How does it feel to not be as smart as Liz Truss?
    Yes I'm sure the barking deters the drones themselves...

    Gee, I wish I was as smart as you.

    MP says something stupid isn't a new headline it happens plenty to Labour MPs and other parties as well, Imagine it was Diane Abbott if it helps you take it less personally.
    Indeed it does deter drones. A drone plus the contraband it contains is worth thousands of pounds. If dogs result in the drone being captured by guards then smugglers won't be as quick to use drones. QED drones are deterred.
    No it doesn't, it can deter people who can control drones but drones themselves are mostly unbothered by barking...

    Just imagine it was Diane Abbott or another Black Labour MP then you just laugh at them messing up.
    What does "black" have to do with anything?
    I can't imagine such offence to people laughing being taken by the same people if Diane had made the mistake.
    That's because Abbott has form for saying incredibly stupid things. Not because of her skin colour.
    I wonder whether "The Jezziah" is actually Diane Abbott. It would account for the blind loyalty of the posts defending the Arch thicko/Anti-Semite/misogynist and also the incoherence of much of what she/he writes
  • TheJezziahTheJezziah Posts: 3,840

    I must say I'm puzzled as to why a no-deal Brexit might lead to medical shortages. Our EU friends aren't planning to refuse to export to us, as far as I know. Whilst I can see that there could well be problems with food imports, because of the volume, medicines are low-bulk items which could easily be flown in to the UK in the event of disruption at the ports, and given special accelerated clearance. Surely this is something entirely in our control?

    Not an expert in any way but I imagine we could mostly get essential medicine through and where it needs to be, maybe some delays and some things will probably go wrong but I can imagine it would be prioritised.

    I think the more likely result is for another example a lack of variety in say food rather than actually running out of food altogether. Just maybe missing items on shelves rather than completely empty shelves. Although panic buying might make that a bit worse. Maybe a lot of money spent making sure the essentials get through that could possibly be used more effectively (by not being in the situation)

  • The ingratitude of the public. Fancy not relishing the opportunity to die a glorious death, albeit through lack of medicines, in pursuit of the glittering prize that is no deal Brexit?

    It may seem to be taking it too seriously, but the entire sequence of events seems to be outlining a certain aspect of the British psyche.

    Over in the US, the gun control debate is hampered by the issue that Americans have this fantasy of the Wild West as their identity and history, harking to a fictionalised time - a distorted retelling of history as fantasy. Every time the debate is run, it hits the same rocks that this fantasy is subsumed at a visceral level into the identity of many Americans.

    Over here, we have the entire attempt to reach a common outlook foundering on similar rocks of identity, again fuelled by a fictionalised time, of plucky little Britain standing alone, an exceptionalism, an idealisation of dogged stiff-upper-lippism and the cult of the amateur over the professional, and of pulling it out of the fire at the last moment without putting in the hard yards first. That "they" will comply with us, that all we need is the Dunkirk spirit, that it is difficult but "we" (an expanded and generic "we" that isn't actually our children, our colleagues, our family, ourselves, but a kind of mystical belongingness) just have to be strong, and we can be.

    There is a time and a place for standing firm and refusing to admit doubt. That time and place is not when things are complicated, we don't really know what's coming up, our pre-existing assumptions are shown to be completely wrong, and our loved ones are relying on us to actually get it right, because they're vulnerable to us getting it wrong.

    In short, sometimes getting it right is more important than ego.
    A very good post.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 50,772

    I must say I'm puzzled as to why a no-deal Brexit might lead to medical shortages. Our EU friends aren't planning to refuse to export to us, as far as I know. Whilst I can see that there could well be problems with food imports, because of the volume, medicines are low-bulk items which could easily be flown in to the UK in the event of disruption at the ports, and given special accelerated clearance. Surely this is something entirely in our control?

    Look, if Brexit can cause a shortage of water in Cumbria, of all places, causing shortages of medicines is going to be a piece of cake. You just need to go with the hysteria and try not to laugh.
  • Excellent piece, really fun read!

    https://twitter.com/JimMFelton/status/1075871993482895361

    My favourite bit of this is Sam Gyimah's face as after she said it.

    She's 100% right and it works. Dogs do help prevent smuggling contraband into prisons via drones. It helps the guards be alert to the smuggling.

    Are you that ignorant the point goes over your head? How does it feel to not be as smart as Liz Truss?
    Yes I'm sure the barking deters the drones themselves...

    Gee, I wish I was as smart as you.

    MP says something stupid isn't a new headline it happens plenty to Labour MPs and other parties as well, Imagine it was Diane Abbott if it helps you take it less personally.
    The barking alerts POs who then take action.
    Yep.....dumber than Liz Truss.....
  • It is very inconvenient that all this anti-Semitism and misogyny in the ranks of the Labour leadership keeps being spotted by the media. Come the revolution Brother .....no, not you Sister, get back to the f888ing kitchen you stupid woman...
  • TheJezziahTheJezziah Posts: 3,840

    Excellent piece, really fun read!

    She's 100% right and it works. Dogs do help prevent smuggling contraband into prisons via drones. It helps the guards be alert to the smuggling.

    Are you that ignorant the point goes over your head? How does it feel to not be as smart as Liz Truss?
    Yes I'm sure the barking deters the drones themselves...

    Gee, I wish I was as smart as you.

    MP says something stupid isn't a new headline it happens plenty to Labour MPs and other parties as well, Imagine it was Diane Abbott if it helps you take it less personally.
    The barking alerts POs who then take action.
    Yep.....dumber than Liz Truss.....
    Clearly I put the clip up to mock Sam Gyimah, smiling as if something funny was said at Liz's perfectly sensible comments...
  • So much to chew on today.

    "not confined to the jazz world" tops it mind.
  • DavidL said:

    I must say I'm puzzled as to why a no-deal Brexit might lead to medical shortages. Our EU friends aren't planning to refuse to export to us, as far as I know. Whilst I can see that there could well be problems with food imports, because of the volume, medicines are low-bulk items which could easily be flown in to the UK in the event of disruption at the ports, and given special accelerated clearance. Surely this is something entirely in our control?

    Look, if Brexit can cause a shortage of water in Cumbria, of all places, causing shortages of medicines is going to be a piece of cake. You just need to go with the hysteria and try not to laugh.
    Brexit was caused by a shortage of brain cells in 52% of the population
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 50,772

    DavidL said:

    I must say I'm puzzled as to why a no-deal Brexit might lead to medical shortages. Our EU friends aren't planning to refuse to export to us, as far as I know. Whilst I can see that there could well be problems with food imports, because of the volume, medicines are low-bulk items which could easily be flown in to the UK in the event of disruption at the ports, and given special accelerated clearance. Surely this is something entirely in our control?

    Look, if Brexit can cause a shortage of water in Cumbria, of all places, causing shortages of medicines is going to be a piece of cake. You just need to go with the hysteria and try not to laugh.
    Brexit was caused by a shortage of brain cells in 52% of the population
    Of course it was. LOL.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,758
    That's a very good question.

    Could it possibly be because he's an utter twat?
  • The use of dogs clearly deters the use of drones. This is some weak, weak gruel, people.
  • I must say I'm puzzled as to why a no-deal Brexit might lead to medical shortages. Our EU friends aren't planning to refuse to export to us, as far as I know. Whilst I can see that there could well be problems with food imports, because of the volume, medicines are low-bulk items which could easily be flown in to the UK in the event of disruption at the ports, and given special accelerated clearance. Surely this is something entirely in our control?

    I spotted one breathless #FBPE Twitter thread claiming shortage of a certain drug was due to Brexit and while there were generics available this was a harbinger of things to come.....subsequent tweets noted shortages in the US, Canada and Australia.....until someone pointed out the manufacture had been stopped, undercut by generics.....

    The biggest threat to European Medicines is the precipitous move of the EMA from London which has seriously degraded their capacity....
  • RoyalBlue said:

    The ingratitude of the public. Fancy not relishing the opportunity to die a glorious death, albeit through lack of medicines, in pursuit of the glittering prize that is no deal Brexit?

    We shall win honour for our House and our names shall be sung by our children’s children.

    That’s what I was thinking as I ticked the box.
    Well I suppose it is a relief that at least one or two people who voted Leave are familiar with a convenient quote from the Bard, though I don't think many younger people will be singing nice songs about those that signed away a large raft of their freedoms, and possibly prosperity too.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,084

    Donny43 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Excellent piece, really fun read!

    https://twitter.com/JimMFelton/status/1075871993482895361

    My favourite bit of this is Sam Gyimah's face as after she said it.

    She's 100% right and it works. Dogs do help prevent smuggling contraband into prisons via drones. It helps the guards be alert to the smuggling.

    Are you that ignorant the point goes over your head? How does it feel to not be as smart as Liz Truss?
    Yes I'm sure the barking deters the drones themselves...

    Gee, I wish I was as smart as you.

    MP says something stupid isn't a new headline it happens plenty to Labour MPs and other parties as well, Imagine it was Diane Abbott if it helps you take it less personally.
    Indeed it does deter drones. A drone plus the contraband it contains is worth thousands of pounds. If dogs result in the drone being captured by guards then smugglers won't be as quick to use drones. QED drones are deterred.
    No it doesn't, it can deter people who can control drones but drones themselves are mostly unbothered by barking...

    Just imagine it was Diane Abbott or another Black Labour MP then you just laugh at them messing up.
    What does "black" have to do with anything?
    I can't imagine such offence to people laughing being taken by the same people if Diane had made the mistake.
    That's because Abbott has form for saying incredibly stupid things. Not because of her skin colour.
    And offence was taken in this case as Truss is not known for saying silly things...

    Okay makes sense.
    Liz meant to say 'detect' but said 'deter' by mistake. Clearly a slip of the tongue. Dogs are very good at detecting drones approaching prisons.
  • ydoethur said:

    That's a very good question.

    Could it possibly be because he's an utter twat?
    Or possibly just an anti-Semite like so many in the Labour Party at the moment(um)
  • TheJezziahTheJezziah Posts: 3,840

    The use of dogs clearly deters the use of drones. This is some weak, weak gruel, people.

    I take it all back...

    https://twitter.com/mccanntb/status/1076031448153579520
  • JohnO said:

    Very classy stuff. Nigel Farage, My Struggle, chuckles...

    That had me giggling for hours as well.
    I had a quiet titter - fun counter factual.....and as we've seen in Scotland, once the genie is out of the bottle its very difficult to get it back in....
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,758

    The use of dogs clearly deters the use of drones. This is some weak, weak gruel, people.

    I take it all back...

    https://twitter.com/mccanntb/status/1076031448153579520
    Of course if Donald Trump sees that he'll just grab it...
  • The use of dogs clearly deters the use of drones. This is some weak, weak gruel, people.

    I take it all back...

    https://twitter.com/mccanntb/status/1076031448153579520
    christ on a bike
  • TheJezziahTheJezziah Posts: 3,840
    edited December 2018
    IanB2 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Indeed it does deter drones. A drone plus the contraband it contains is worth thousands of pounds. If dogs result in the drone being captured by guards then smugglers won't be as quick to use drones. QED drones are deterred.
    No it doesn't, it can deter people who can control drones but drones themselves are mostly unbothered by barking...

    Just imagine it was Diane Abbott or another Black Labour MP then you just laugh at them messing up.
    What does "black" have to do with anything?
    I can't imagine such offence to people laughing being taken by the same people if Diane had made the mistake.
    That's because Abbott has form for saying incredibly stupid things. Not because of her skin colour.
    And offence was taken in this case as Truss is not known for saying silly things...

    Okay makes sense.
    Liz meant to say 'detect' but said 'deter' by mistake. Clearly a slip of the tongue. Dogs are very good at detecting drones approaching prisons.
    To be clear I don't think Truss actually believes that Drones are scared of barking (or some variation on that), obviously she made a mistake, just quite an amusing one.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    DavidL said:

    I must say I'm puzzled as to why a no-deal Brexit might lead to medical shortages. Our EU friends aren't planning to refuse to export to us, as far as I know. Whilst I can see that there could well be problems with food imports, because of the volume, medicines are low-bulk items which could easily be flown in to the UK in the event of disruption at the ports, and given special accelerated clearance. Surely this is something entirely in our control?

    Look, if Brexit can cause a shortage of water in Cumbria, of all places, causing shortages of medicines is going to be a piece of cake. You just need to go with the hysteria and try not to laugh.
    It is very hard not to laugh

  • IanB2 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Indeed it does deter drones. A drone plus the contraband it contains is worth thousands of pounds. If dogs result in the drone being captured by guards then smugglers won't be as quick to use drones. QED drones are deterred.
    No it doesn't, it can deter people who can control drones but drones themselves are mostly unbothered by barking...

    Just imagine it was Diane Abbott or another Black Labour MP then you just laugh at them messing up.
    What does "black" have to do with anything?
    I can't imagine such offence to people laughing being taken by the same people if Diane had made the mistake.
    That's because Abbott has form for saying incredibly stupid things. Not because of her skin colour.
    And offence was taken in this case as Truss is not known for saying silly things...

    Okay makes sense.
    Liz meant to say 'detect' but said 'deter' by mistake. Clearly a slip of the tongue. Dogs are very good at detecting drones approaching prisons.
    To be clear I don't think Truss actually believes that Drones are scared of barking (or some variation on that), obviously she made a mistake.
    Quite.

  • IanB2 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Indeed it does deter drones. A drone plus the contraband it contains is worth thousands of pounds. If dogs result in the drone being captured by guards then smugglers won't be as quick to use drones. QED drones are deterred.
    No it doesn't, it can deter people who can control drones but drones themselves are mostly unbothered by barking...

    Just imagine it was Diane Abbott or another Black Labour MP then you just laugh at them messing up.
    What does "black" have to do with anything?
    I can't imagine such offence to people laughing being taken by the same people if Diane had made the mistake.
    That's because Abbott has form for saying incredibly stupid things. Not because of her skin colour.
    And offence was taken in this case as Truss is not known for saying silly things...

    Okay makes sense.
    Liz meant to say 'detect' but said 'deter' by mistake. Clearly a slip of the tongue. Dogs are very good at detecting drones approaching prisons.
    To be clear I don't think Truss actually believes that Drones are scared of barking (or some variation on that), obviously she made a mistake, just quite an amusing one.
    Stupid woman, sorry, people
  • TheJezziahTheJezziah Posts: 3,840
    ydoethur said:

    The use of dogs clearly deters the use of drones. This is some weak, weak gruel, people.

    I take it all back...

    https://twitter.com/mccanntb/status/1076031448153579520
    Of course if Donald Trump sees that he'll just grab it...
    Trump molesting a flying cat on TV could just about make his (one term) presidency worthwhile...
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    edited December 2018

    IanB2 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Indeed it does deter drones. A drone plus the contraband it contains is worth thousands of pounds. If dogs result in the drone being captured by guards then smugglers won't be as quick to use drones. QED drones are deterred.
    No it doesn't, it can deter people who can control drones but drones themselves are mostly unbothered by barking...

    Just imagine it was Diane Abbott or another Black Labour MP then you just laugh at them messing up.
    What does "black" have to do with anything?
    I can't imagine such offence to people laughing being taken by the same people if Diane had made the mistake.
    That's because Abbott has form for saying incredibly stupid things. Not because of her skin colour.
    And offence was taken in this case as Truss is not known for saying silly things...

    Okay makes sense.
    Liz meant to say 'detect' but said 'deter' by mistake. Clearly a slip of the tongue. Dogs are very good at detecting drones approaching prisons.
    To be clear I don't think Truss actually believes that Drones are scared of barking (or some variation on that), obviously she made a mistake, just quite an amusing one.
    To be honest, in that clip, she reminded me of an under-prepared uni student in the middle of a presentation, you get a couple of flashbacks to some words from your panicked read of your notes that morning ("patrol dogs are being used for....something") and you just throw the words out before you've checked if they make sense. You can even see the flash of fear in her eyes before she says the "helps deter drones" bit.
  • NemtynakhtNemtynakht Posts: 2,311

    IanB2 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Indeed it does deter drones. A drone plus the contraband it contains is worth thousands of pounds. If dogs result in the drone being captured by guards then smugglers won't be as quick to use drones. QED drones are deterred.
    No it doesn't, it can deter people who can control drones but drones themselves are mostly unbothered by barking...

    Just imagine it was Diane Abbott or another Black Labour MP then you just laugh at them messing up.
    What does "black" have to do with anything?
    I can't imagine such offence to people laughing being taken by the same people if Diane had made the mistake.
    That's because Abbott has form for saying incredibly stupid things. Not because of her skin colour.
    And offence was taken in this case as Truss is not known for saying silly things...

    Okay makes sense.
    Liz meant to say 'detect' but said 'deter' by mistake. Clearly a slip of the tongue. Dogs are very good at detecting drones approaching prisons.
    To be clear I don't think Truss actually believes that Drones are scared of barking (or some variation on that), obviously she made a mistake, just quite an amusing one.
    Surely if dogs are good at detecting drones approaching prisons, then logically that would be a deterrent so they are also deterring drones by their presence (passive) rather than actively shooting them down With doggy eye laser beams!

    As noted above Liz Truss has said plenty of stupid things but you are letting your dislike of the woman cloud your judgement as to what she meant.
  • ydoethur said:

    The use of dogs clearly deters the use of drones. This is some weak, weak gruel, people.

    I take it all back...

    https://twitter.com/mccanntb/status/1076031448153579520
    Of course if Donald Trump sees that he'll just grab it...
    Trump molesting a flying cat on TV could just about make his (one term) presidency worthwhile...
    I wonder who would come out with the highest IQ. Liz Truss, The Donald, or Corbyn? My money would not be on Jeremy
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,758

    ydoethur said:

    The use of dogs clearly deters the use of drones. This is some weak, weak gruel, people.

    I take it all back...

    https://twitter.com/mccanntb/status/1076031448153579520
    Of course if Donald Trump sees that he'll just grab it...
    Trump molesting a flying cat on TV could just about make his (one term) presidency worthwhile...
    Well, he has form for grabbing pusssies.
  • TheJezziahTheJezziah Posts: 3,840
    edited December 2018
    Danny565 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Donny43 said:

    No it doesn't, it can deter people who can control drones but drones themselves are mostly unbothered by barking...

    Just imagine it was Diane Abbott or another Black Labour MP then you just laugh at them messing up.
    What does "black" have to do with anything?
    I can't imagine such offence to people laughing being taken by the same people if Diane had made the mistake.
    That's because Abbott has form for saying incredibly stupid things. Not because of her skin colour.
    And offence was taken in this case as Truss is not known for saying silly things...

    Okay makes sense.
    Liz meant to say 'detect' but said 'deter' by mistake. Clearly a slip of the tongue. Dogs are very good at detecting drones approaching prisons.
    To be clear I don't think Truss actually believes that Drones are scared of barking (or some variation on that), obviously she made a mistake, just quite an amusing one.
    To be honest, in that clip, she reminded me of an under-prepared uni student in the middle of a presentation, you get a couple of flashbacks to some words from your panicked read of your notes that morning ("patrol dogs are being used for....something") and you just throw the words out before you've checked if they make sense. You can even see the flash of fear in her eyes before she says the "barking" bit.
    To be honest the pause just added to it, it was almost as if it was done intentionally for comic effect!

    @Nemtynakht

    I wouldn't say I dislike her, if offered the choice between say May or her with no other differences but speeches and personality I would pick her. She can say silly things occasionally which can be funny but I'd say I find it more endearing than inspiring dislike.

    Now if she had the personality of say Daniel Hannan on the other hand...
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,047
    Remainers are going to cause No Deal just like they caused Brexit with their idiotic doom-laden predictions. They just do not learn. And they persist in thinking that they're the clever ones! It's exquisite.
  • RoyalBlueRoyalBlue Posts: 3,223

    RoyalBlue said:

    The ingratitude of the public. Fancy not relishing the opportunity to die a glorious death, albeit through lack of medicines, in pursuit of the glittering prize that is no deal Brexit?

    We shall win honour for our House and our names shall be sung by our children’s children.

    That’s what I was thinking as I ticked the box.
    Well I suppose it is a relief that at least one or two people who voted Leave are familiar with a convenient quote from the Bard, though I don't think many younger people will be singing nice songs about those that signed away a large raft of their freedoms, and possibly prosperity too.
    I was channeling the Klingons more than Shakespeare with that comment :wink:
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Charles said:

    There is a difference between applying the result of a referendum (in this case the Cameron deal) and after a few years arguing for a new vote and not applying the result of a referendum and arguing for a new vote.

    So, for example, Jeremy Corbyn could hold a referendum on leaving the capitalist system, and if 52% voted for it, it wouldn't be legitimate to question the proposition until full communism was achieved?
    There isn’t “a capitalist system” to leave. But if he won a general election then yes he could implement his policies
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Nigelb said:

    Nigelb said:

    Charles said:

    Charles said:

    JohnO said:

    Very classy stuff. Nigel Farage, My Struggle, chuckles...

    Disagree. I think it’s tasteless and unnecessary and diminishes the rest of a fun and interesting article.

    It’s arguably libellous.

    At a minimum I’m calling Godwin.
    Well the Board of Deputies have criticised Farage for repeating a well known anti Semitic trope that Hitler used.
    Sure. I think Farage is a contemptible and unpleasant man.

    But at best your argument is “you’re like Hitler you are” and I suspect the libel courts wouldn’t give much weight to “oh but X said he said something naughty”
    I’m not convinced libel is possible in something clearly flagged as alternate reality fiction.
    Is there caselaw ?
    Chill everyone. Farage may wince but he'll probably laugh too. He's not without a sense of humour. Plus: he'll be aware of the Streisand effect.
    I’m entirely chilled.
    Just trying to cool Charles down - and curious about the technical point.
    I’m not fussed - it May more of an editorial comment that it negatively impacted on an otherwise good piece
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    eek said:

    That's either incredibly libellous or incredibly serious.
    Is it?

    It’s putting your money where your mouth is.

    I’d guess Damian lost money on the 2015 general election but that’s not a sexy story?
    It depends - if he uses Betfair and bet based on the survey prior to it being published then he would have an unfair advantage compared to other bettors.
    But no more than someone else who commissioned a survey.

    My guess is it’s poor business practice and will cause reputations damage but not actually illegal
  • RoyalBlue said:

    RoyalBlue said:

    The ingratitude of the public. Fancy not relishing the opportunity to die a glorious death, albeit through lack of medicines, in pursuit of the glittering prize that is no deal Brexit?

    We shall win honour for our House and our names shall be sung by our children’s children.

    That’s what I was thinking as I ticked the box.
    Well I suppose it is a relief that at least one or two people who voted Leave are familiar with a convenient quote from the Bard, though I don't think many younger people will be singing nice songs about those that signed away a large raft of their freedoms, and possibly prosperity too.
    I was channeling the Klingons more than Shakespeare with that comment :wink:
    Ah, OK. I don't speak their language. Maybe one day when they join the federation perhaps
  • Carolus_RexCarolus_Rex Posts: 1,414

    RoyalBlue said:

    RoyalBlue said:

    The ingratitude of the public. Fancy not relishing the opportunity to die a glorious death, albeit through lack of medicines, in pursuit of the glittering prize that is no deal Brexit?

    We shall win honour for our House and our names shall be sung by our children’s children.

    That’s what I was thinking as I ticked the box.
    Well I suppose it is a relief that at least one or two people who voted Leave are familiar with a convenient quote from the Bard, though I don't think many younger people will be singing nice songs about those that signed away a large raft of their freedoms, and possibly prosperity too.
    I was channeling the Klingons more than Shakespeare with that comment :wink:
    Ah, OK. I don't speak their language. Maybe one day when they join the federation perhaps
    No doubt a few years after that there will be a Klingon version of Brexit.

    UKIP = United Klingon Independence Party?
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    A great piece by Alastair.

    Unfortunately, just as a narrow Remain win wouldn't have closed down the issue, it looks very much as though we'll be stuck with agonising over the EU in any of the future scenarios. I was particularly struck by Sir Ivan Rogers' prognosis of how the trade negotiations over the next two or three years are likely to go:

    This may be the first Anglo-Irish negotiation in history where the greater leverage is not on London’s side of the table. And the vituperation aimed at Dublin politicians tells one just how well that has gone down with politicians and apparatchiks who had not bothered to work out that this was no longer a bilateral business, and are now appalled to find they are cornered.

    Well, just wait till the trade negotiations. The solidarity of the remaining Member States will be with the major fishing Member States, not with the U.K. The solidarity will be with Spain, not the U.K., when Madrid makes Gibraltar-related demands in the trade negotiation endgame. The solidarity will be with Cyprus when it says it wants to avoid precedents which might be applied to Turkey.

    I could go on. And on… The Free Trade Agreement talks will be tougher than anything we have seen to date.
    .....
    We already see in the Withdrawal Agreement the clear signs that, having succeeded with its negotiating plans in this phase, the EU will repeat the clock and cliff edge pressures in the run up the next U.K. election, knowing it can and will exact concessions as the deadline looms. But walking away to a “no deal” outcome, managed or not, does not escape that pressure..


    Not an attractive prospect!

    https://news.liverpool.ac.uk/2018/12/13/full-speech-sir-ivan-rogers-on-brexit/

    All very good reasons that no deal is now the optimum course. Free trade agreements, if they take place, if they take place at all, should be about trade. Dragging Gibraltar and Cyprus is totally counterproductive and willingness to give up fishing just shows how out London based positions don’t care for either wealth creation in the rest of the country which is one of the reasons Leave won in the first place. Fishing is the only way to revitalise many of our coastal communities. It’s importance to the EU also shows how vacuous Remain arguments are that the UK has nothing of value for the EU and is doomed to be the beggar at the feast in any negotiations.
    Err, no. The way to absolutely guarantee a totally disastrous negotiation with the EU is to crash out and then have to come running back to them in panic to rescue us from the chaos. That really would be the worst of all possible worlds.
    But the government should use the transition period to continue to work for an exit without a trade deal.
  • Labour supporters who are mocking the stupidity of Liz Truss might want to read this (warning: contains big words!)

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/2017/05/whether-you-look-at-leaders-or-voters-labour-is-now-the-stupidest-party/
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,517
    The side effects of the drone chaos ...

    I've just spent the morning at a play centre, and whilst there I met a woman I know whose husband is an airline pilot. The chaos has led to him being 'out of position' somewhere abroad, and he's in the middle of a mandatory rest period. He's got plenty of time to get back for Christmas, but he called his wife yesterday, saying his airline has asked him if he could change his schedule so he'd work over the Christmas period as everything's out of sync.

    With three young daughters under four to look after, his missus isn't best pleased ...
  • RoyalBlue said:

    RoyalBlue said:

    The ingratitude of the public. Fancy not relishing the opportunity to die a glorious death, albeit through lack of medicines, in pursuit of the glittering prize that is no deal Brexit?

    We shall win honour for our House and our names shall be sung by our children’s children.

    That’s what I was thinking as I ticked the box.
    Well I suppose it is a relief that at least one or two people who voted Leave are familiar with a convenient quote from the Bard, though I don't think many younger people will be singing nice songs about those that signed away a large raft of their freedoms, and possibly prosperity too.
    I was channeling the Klingons more than Shakespeare with that comment :wink:
    Ah, OK. I don't speak their language. Maybe one day when they join the federation perhaps
    No doubt a few years after that there will be a Klingon version of Brexit.

    UKIP = United Klingon Independence Party?
    I imagine many UKIP voters are worried that they are already among us
  • Charles said:

    But the government should use the transition period to continue to work for an exit without a trade deal.

    That would extremely eccentric, given that one the main 'reasons' given for exiting in the first place was supposed to be that it allowed us to enter trade deals. (I know, I know - that argument was always utter garbage, but that's what they said!)
  • Good afternoon, everyone.

    Of Trump's original senior appointments, who is left? Pence?
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 47,789
    Hannan has decided on the Leave tactics if there's a people's vote - turn it into what he calls "an African referendum":

    https://twitter.com/PropertySpot/status/1076081081097564161
  • Hannan has decided on the Leave tactics if there's a people's vote - turn it into what he calls "an African referendum":

    https://twitter.com/PropertySpot/status/1076081081097564161

    That would give a nice clear result.
  • Trouble for Khan on Crossrail?

    When Mr Khan became mayor two years ago he dismissed TfL’s representative on the Crossrail board, Daniel Moylan, a Conservative politician who had kept a close eye on costs, and asked all “the difficult questions” according to one individual close to the board. 

    “Sadiq’s attitude was to give him a call when it’s time to cut the ribbon,” says another source close to the board.


    https://www.ft.com/content/0d020876-ffc4-11e8-aebf-99e208d3e521
  • Donny43Donny43 Posts: 634

    Hannan has decided on the Leave tactics if there's a people's vote - turn it into what he calls "an African referendum":

    https://twitter.com/PropertySpot/status/1076081081097564161

    That would give a nice clear result.
    Might as well. If the politicians won't leave after the first referendum they won't leave after any number of referendums.
  • Hannan has decided on the Leave tactics if there's a people's vote - turn it into what he calls "an African referendum":

    https://twitter.com/PropertySpot/status/1076081081097564161

    That would give a nice clear result.
    And he is supposed to be one of the more cerebral leavers! It would be funny if it were not so serious
  • NemtynakhtNemtynakht Posts: 2,311

    Danny565 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Donny43 said:

    Donny43 said:
    .
    And offence was taken in this case as Truss is not known for saying silly things...

    Okay makes sense.
    Liz meant to say 'detect' but said 'deter' by mistake. Clearly a slip of the tongue. Dogs are very good at detecting drones approaching prisons.
    To be clear I don't think Truss actually believes that Drones are scared of barking (or some variation on that), obviously she made a mistake, just quite an amusing one.
    To be honest, in that clip, she reminded me of an under-prepared uni student in the middle of a presentation, you get a couple of flashbacks to some words from your panicked read of your notes that morning ("patrol dogs are being used for....something") and you just throw the words out before you've checked if they make sense. You can even see the flash of fear in her eyes before she says the "barking" bit.
    To be honest the pause just added to it, it was almost as if it was done intentionally for comic effect!

    @Nemtynakht

    I wouldn't say I dislike her, if offered the choice between say May or her with no other differences but speeches and personality I would pick her. She can say silly things occasionally which can be funny but I'd say I find it more endearing than inspiring dislike.

    Now if she had the personality of say Daniel Hannan on the other hand...
    One thing I find very interesting about politics is inconsistency. First Ed Milliband was Red Ed with terrible policies, and now May and her acolytes have introduced the self same things like the energy price cap. Corbyn and Trump are the best for this. Trump can’t seemingly make any statement that a red blooded socialist can’t be against - he could say “ we need better housing and more financial assistance for the poor”. And people spin it their own way - he actually means tax cuts for the rich, or he means he’ll do it by not allowing immigrants in. Corbyn does the same to right wingers, by which I obviously mean anyone from the centre left rightwards!!!
  • Good afternoon, everyone.

    Of Trump's original senior appointments, who is left? Pence?

    I don't think Pence is technically a Trump appointee :)
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820
    edited December 2018
    Donny43 said:

    Hannan has decided on the Leave tactics if there's a people's vote - turn it into what he calls "an African referendum":

    https://twitter.com/PropertySpot/status/1076081081097564161

    That would give a nice clear result.
    Might as well. If the politicians won't leave after the first referendum they won't leave after any number of referendums.
    Well, Dan Hannan is one of those leavers who doesn't want the government to sign the deal that would implement leaving, so I suppose he's at least being consistent with his new position.
  • I'm unconvinced that a collective refusal to vote is a powerful way to achieve victory in a democratic process.

    But, I've long said that a referendum between May's Deal and Remain would see Leaver turnout depressed.

    Mr. Nakht, I consistently slammed Miliband's stupid price cap policy, and attacked May for the same thing. Whilst political partisanship does exist, it isn't universal.
  • theProletheProle Posts: 948
    DavidL said:

    I must say I'm puzzled as to why a no-deal Brexit might lead to medical shortages. Our EU friends aren't planning to refuse to export to us, as far as I know. Whilst I can see that there could well be problems with food imports, because of the volume, medicines are low-bulk items which could easily be flown in to the UK in the event of disruption at the ports, and given special accelerated clearance. Surely this is something entirely in our control?

    Look, if Brexit can cause a shortage of water in Cumbria, of all places, causing shortages of medicines is going to be a piece of cake. You just need to go with the hysteria and try not to laugh.
    Some of the Brexit derangement syndrome sufferers have managed to make really simple problems sound incredibly complex.

    I read something today where Irish Gov was apparently worried about the NI police's ability to deal with criminals who fled to the RoI after Brexit as the NI police couldn't use the EAW to get them back. This struck me as a particularly easy problem for the Irish government to solve, given they are free to set any terms for extradition the like!
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