A woman being excluded from a winners' podium or sexually assaulted in prison is material in my book.
I'm not opposed to trans rights, though it's not clear which rights trans people are being denied. I most certainly am opposed to biological sex being erased as a real and legally important concept.
What I mean is, it's clear that safeguards are required in certain areas - e.g. to protect the integrity of women's sport - but this does not mean that the statement being floated that "there is no material conflict between women's rights and trans rights" is obviously false.
IMO a reasonable adult could either object or sign up to it, depending on their attitude to the matter.
Fair enough, but I think you're taking a much more nuanced and reasonable view than, say, the Labour Campaign for Trans Rights. To acknowledge any distinction between 'trans' and 'cis' whatsoever is a hate crime in their eyes.
Hm. 1) Yes, ideally. But the BBC aren't particularly giod at impartial. That said, we will miss 'trying but failing to be impartial' when we're only left with 'not even trying'. 2) Disagree. ITV can do that just as well. In the absence of the BBC other providers will. 3) Disagree. Like abive, only more so. 4) Perhaps. Or again, oerhaps other free-to-air providers can do it. Whispee it, but BBC sport on the telly isn't that good any more. Arguably, ITV is now better. Though England will never win a football match again inan International tournament if ITV are left to televise it. And the BBC still have the best sporting theme tunes. And I would miss Test Match Special. 5) As above, with fewer redeeming features.
Not sure this adds up to an argument for the BBC's continued existence.
It does. You're with me, but a debate required to finalize the detail.
Quick comment on the light entertainment. A lot of people value this as a protection against loneliness. Sad, perhaps, but true.
One of the items on the pledge RLB and others have signed up to is "Accept that there is no material conflict between trans rights and women's rights." - no reasonable adult could look at what is going on in women's prisons and athletics and agree with that. This is cult-like.
Key word is bolded.
And I would suggest that there is something of a Cult about the frenzy of opposition to "Trans Rights".
A woman being excluded from a winners' podium or sexually assaulted in prison is material in my book.
I'm not opposed to trans rights, though it's not clear which rights trans people are being denied. I most certainly am opposed to biological sex being erased as a real and legally important concept.
How many women in prison need to have been raped by the penis of a follow ‘woman’ in prison with them, before it becomes necessary to separate ‘women’ from women who are there involuntarily?
There’s a decade of work for human rights lawyers coming up on this issue. At least one of the prison rapists was inside for a rape committed when they identified as male.
I'm sure that you've already seen @MaxPB but the Chinese GP has been officially postponed - and comments already about struggling to put it somewhere else.
The reason they’re saying ‘postponed’ is because neither the local promoter nor F1 can be allowed to be the person cancelling the event - a very large race fee paid by the former to the latter depends on this. The logistics of the modern F1 season make it very unlikely that the race can be rescheduled, so what will happen is that the teams will refuse to agree to a rescheduled date, and the promoter and F1 will split the difference on the race fee.
They are saying the inaugural Vietnam GP might be postponed too.
Plus there's the olympics this year...
Yep, Vietnam must be close to being cancelled also. It’s a street circuit right in the middle of Hanoi, there’s no way they’re going to want 50,000 international visitors. The teams also might not want to travel, but in the absence of eg Foreign Office advice not to go there, they will have no choice about it.
The Tokyo Olympic Committee must be checking their insurance policy very carefully right now - a future pub quiz question could be about why the 2020 Summer Games took place in 2021.
Tokyo is as far from Wuhan as London is from Moscow, so unless there is much wider spread by then, the Olympics can probably go ahead but when must decisions be made?
A very good question. I imagine that qualifying tournaments in some sports are already underway for the Olympics.
I think the next couple of weeks are key, when we will see if there’s genuine spread of this virus across Asia, or if it’s mostly contained within China.
If the Olympics are to be postponed, it would make sense to take the decision as early as possible, so that hundreds of thousands of people directly involved can make alternative plans. It’s a seriously difficult call to make, I wouldn’t want to be in the room.
One of the items on the pledge RLB and others have signed up to is "Accept that there is no material conflict between trans rights and women's rights." - no reasonable adult could look at what is going on in women's prisons and athletics and agree with that. This is cult-like.
Key word is bolded.
And I would suggest that there is something of a Cult about the frenzy of opposition to "Trans Rights".
There shouldn't be, in principle. But anyone who supports self-ID is necessarily inviting a material conflict. Because it makes it physically impossible to monitor progress against almost all issues that feminists care about.
Take Board representation, for example. How do you determine the percentage of FTSE 350 Board members who are female, when companies can claim it changes from day to day? What happens to the law that companies have to report on gender pay gaps, when companies start claiming that they've discussed the issue with their Diversity committee, and they now on principle do not hold data on their employee's gender identity?
This is real Emperor's new clothes territory, now. When do we turn round and decide we're just not going to take this seriously any more, 'cause it's just plain daft? People are people, sex is biological; if folks want to self-identify wrt gender, good on them, but it makes it a meaningless descriptor.
There shouldn't be, in principle. But anyone who supports self-ID is necessarily inviting a material conflict. Because it makes it physically impossible to monitor progress against almost all issues that feminists care about.
Take Board representation, for example. How do you determine the percentage of FTSE 350 Board members who are female, when companies can claim it changes from day to day? What happens to the law that companies have to report on gender pay gaps, when companies start claiming that they've discussed the issue with their Diversity committee, and they now on principle do not hold data on their employee's gender identity?
This is getting detached from reality. There are very few trans people. Gender dysphoria is rare. And those people do not go flitting from M to F and back again every Wednesday. It's a grave thing to transition. Not one embarked upon lightly. I see a parallel here with the argument about late abortions. Many of those who get most exercised about this seem to think that women given the chance will do this - abort a viable, close to birth baby - regularly and casually, simply because they suddenly don't feel like having it. In fact, as with transitioning, it would be highly uncommon and done for compelling reasons. People need to settle down and back off a little bit on this sort of stuff, IMO. And, yes, it's fair enough to apply the sentiment to both sides.
Hm. 1) Yes, ideally. But the BBC aren't particularly giod at impartial. That said, we will miss 'trying but failing to be impartial' when we're only left with 'not even trying'. 2) Disagree. ITV can do that just as well. In the absence of the BBC other providers will. 3) Disagree. Like abive, only more so. 4) Perhaps. Or again, oerhaps other free-to-air providers can do it. Whispee it, but BBC sport on the telly isn't that good any more. Arguably, ITV is now better. Though England will never win a football match again inan International tournament if ITV are left to televise it. And the BBC still have the best sporting theme tunes. And I would miss Test Match Special. 5) As above, with fewer redeeming features.
Not sure this adds up to an argument for the BBC's continued existence.
It does. You're with me, but a debate required to finalize the detail.
Quick comment on the light entertainment. A lot of people value this as a protection against loneliness. Sad, perhaps, but true.
@kinbalu - many of your views are diametrically opposite to mine but you're such an agreeable chap that I suspect we would, in person, find much to agree about.
On your second point - sad but true indeed. Personally I find the telly a very poor antidote to loneliness. The internet is better, the radio better still.
I've got a great idea. Let's allow people to be nominated for the citizen's assembly (you have to collect a number of signatures from your local area), then let the people of that local area gather together to freely vote on who represents them from those nominees. Those elected can have the significant decision making power in a citizen's assembly, or "council".
Those who want citizens assemblies know exactly what they are doing and know their agenda is not widely supported. But those that do support it are the type of people who 'participate' in this kind of thing.
I was at a pre election hustings. The ukip candidate was getting heckled, she stopped and asked who voted to leave in the audience, of about a hundred, two raised their arms. The constituency was 60% leave, the conservative MP, who was also heckled and booed by the audience won the seat by more than 8,000.
These are the people who will make sure only the right sort participate in a citizens assembly.
"The invitees to Climate Assembly UK have been selected at random from across the UK. From those who respond, 110 people will be chosen as a representative sample of the population." https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-50264797
But that doesn't mean that you could be right, maybe there is a conspiracy.
A complete and utter fix. From start to finish. You can be guaranteed the 'right response' will come out.
That is it. You're a lying dog-faced pony soldier and I claim my £5. Europe as a continent has plenty of sporting competitions. Just because they are not specifically under the #EU's remit does not mean they aren't supported by it's policies and it's member states.
Thank goodness somebody has finally piped up on this. I was wondering whether all those "European Championships" I've been glued to for decades in all of those various sports had been a symptom of some sort of fugue state I've been slipping in and out of. What a relief (!) to discover that this is not the case.
Except for the football one they're a bit shit compared to the Commonwealth Games, but if that's the best of your aspirations then so be it.
The Commonwealth Games are better than the Champions League?
What are the viewing figures?
Edit: I see you said "except for the football". Slightly Mrs Lincoln tbh.
Football is its own sporting world. Football World Cup v Football in the Olympics for example. Hence why I separated it.
The Commonwealth Games is comparable to the Olympics, the "European Games" are not.
2018 Commonwealth Games - 45% of gold medals won by top 2 of the 71 participating national associations.
2016 Olympic Games - 24% of gold medals won by top 2 of the 86 participating national associations.
I know which I'd rather watch - even with separate Scottish participation in the former.
There shouldn't be, in principle. But anyone who supports self-ID is necessarily inviting a material conflict. Because it makes it physically impossible to monitor progress against almost all issues that feminists care about.
Take Board representation, for example. How do you determine the percentage of FTSE 350 Board members who are female, when companies can claim it changes from day to day? What happens to the law that companies have to report on gender pay gaps, when companies start claiming that they've discussed the issue with their Diversity committee, and they now on principle do not hold data on their employee's gender identity?
This is getting detached from reality. There are very few trans people. Gender dysphoria is rare. And those people do not go flitting from M to F and back again every Wednesday. It's a grave thing to transition. Not one embarked upon lightly. I see a parallel here with the argument about late abortions. Many of those who get most exercised about this seem to think that women given the chance will do this - abort a viable, close to birth baby - regularly and casually, simply because they suddenly don't feel like having it. In fact, as with transitioning, it would be highly uncommon and done for compelling reasons. People need to settle down and back off a little bit on this sort of stuff, IMO. And, yes, it's fair enough to apply the sentiment to both sides.
I agree for genuine trans people but then again I don't see the issue with saying one who has transitioned legally after consulting with qualified physicians is the gender they identify as.
Self-ID without medical consultation seems to be the issue and is one that can be embarked upon lightly.
Comments
Quick comment on the light entertainment. A lot of people value this as a protection against loneliness. Sad, perhaps, but true.
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I think the next couple of weeks are key, when we will see if there’s genuine spread of this virus across Asia, or if it’s mostly contained within China.
If the Olympics are to be postponed, it would make sense to take the decision as early as possible, so that hundreds of thousands of people directly involved can make alternative plans. It’s a seriously difficult call to make, I wouldn’t want to be in the room.
On your second point - sad but true indeed.
Personally I find the telly a very poor antidote to loneliness. The internet is better, the radio better still.
You can write it now.
2016 Olympic Games - 24% of gold medals won by top 2 of the 86 participating national associations.
I know which I'd rather watch - even with separate Scottish participation in the former.
Self-ID without medical consultation seems to be the issue and is one that can be embarked upon lightly.