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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The betting for Biden’s VP pick is getting tighter

SystemSystem Posts: 11,018
edited April 2020 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The betting for Biden’s VP pick is getting tighter

While we have all been focused on the pandemic there’s been some big movement in the Dems VP nomination betting with Kamala Harris sinking sharply and Warren moving up strongly.,

Read the full story here


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    peter_from_putneypeter_from_putney Posts: 6,875
    edited April 2020
    First ... yet again!
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    MysticroseMysticrose Posts: 4,688

    First ... yet again!

    The really artful thing is to post that and then spend the allotted 6 minutes editing it into something useful ;)

    #Curmudgeonly me
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    TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052
    When are VPs normally picked date wise ?
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,114
    Fourth is the new first....
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    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,977
    Good morning everybody. Another bright sunny morning, and a taken opportunity for walk yesterday; I wonder how lockdown will feel in the rain!
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    MysticroseMysticrose Posts: 4,688
    On topic, I thought for a long time that Trump was a shoo-in for November. Then came the virus. His initial approval surge has very quickly evaporated.

    He needs a shot in the arm ...

    Dettol, obvs.
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    eristdooferistdoof Posts: 4,891
    edited April 2020
    "Her successor as one of the Senators for Massachusetts would be chosen by the state governor who is a Republican."

    So senators are elected, but any replacements are just appointed by the governor with no restriction to what party the replacement comes from? Potentially remaining in place for possibly over 5 years? Wow. I never knew that.
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,114

    Good morning everybody. Another bright sunny morning, and a taken opportunity for walk yesterday; I wonder how lockdown will feel in the rain!

    We had four months when we never had 48 hours without rain, sleet, hail, drizzle. If that had been lockdown, I reckon it would have had serious impact on my mental health.

    As it is, apart from an easterly wind, the lockdown weather has been solidly lovely.
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    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,355
    edited April 2020
    OT OGH is up early. Another side-effect of the apocalypse lockdown?
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    edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,150
    edited April 2020
    Kamala Harris was kind of a bubble IMHO, there was no good reason for her to be that strong a favourite. She's competent but doesn't deliver a swing state, her campaign was pretty flat, and she's not particularly popular among black voters. There's an argument that Biden may have promised Jim Clyburn that he'd pick a black woman, but if you believe that then maybe look at some of the other black candidates.

    I don't really see the point in picking Warren, the Bernie Bros have an enduring grudge against her and the rest of the left should get behind Biden anyhow. Gretchen Whitmer is starting to look like value, she's coming out well in the battle against her obliging comedy-villain Trumpist protestors.

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    Good morning everybody. Another bright sunny morning, and a taken opportunity for walk yesterday; I wonder how lockdown will feel in the rain!

    We had four months when we never had 48 hours without rain, sleet, hail, drizzle. If that had been lockdown, I reckon it would have had serious impact on my mental health.

    As it is, apart from an easterly wind, the lockdown weather has been solidly lovely.
    Yes, indeed the number of hours of seemingly unbroken sunshine this month has been quite extraordinary - even it it completely clouded over for the next week, I guess it would still amount to a record for April.
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    eristdooferistdoof Posts: 4,891
    Scott_xP said:
    A-political advisors to the government have known this for a long time. It means that almost all of those who agree to this role are no longer in the "because I can make a difference crowd" but in the "I fully support Trump crowd"
    I'm sure this is a deliberate approach from Trump, and he has probably been doing this all through his career.

    The end result is that the experts you really need in those positions are either driven out or keep away, and you end up being advised by a bunch of incompetent yes-men.
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    kamskikamski Posts: 4,250

    On topic, I thought for a long time that Trump was a shoo-in for November. Then came the virus. His initial approval surge has very quickly evaporated.

    He needs a shot in the arm ...

    Dettol, obvs.

    I can't see how anybody paying attention could have thought Trump was a shoo-in (or that he was bound to lose, for that matter). Trump is the most consistently unpopular president in recent times.

    Apart from the first 2 weeks after inauguration Trump has failed to reach positive territory in his average net approval ratings, something no other president has come remotely close to since at least 1945:
    https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/trump-approval-ratings/?ex_cid=rrpromo

    I think the recent brief and relatively small coronavirus rally-round effect shows the absolute upper limit of his support (roughly 46% approve, 50% disapprove). Enough for him to win, but hardly enough to make him a shoo-in.

    I think the election was always likely to be close, and still is, but if there is a big win it is (and always was) way more likely to be for his opponent. Just as there is large group of voters who are going to vote for him no matter what, there's a larger group who are never going to vote for him no matter what. Trump's main hope is that enough of the majority who really don't like him don't vote for the Democrat candidate.
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    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,355

    Kamala Harris was kind of a bubble IMHO, there was no good reason for her to be that strong a favourite. She's competent but doesn't deliver a swing state, her campaign was pretty flat, and she's not particularly popular among black voters. There's an argument that Biden may have promised Jim Clyburn that he'd pick a black woman, but if you believe that then maybe look at some of the other black candidates.

    I don't really see the point in picking Warren, the Bernie Bros have an enduring grudge against her and the rest of the left should get behind Biden anyhow. Gretchen Whitmer is starting to look like value, she's coming out well in the battle against her obliging comedy-villain Trumpist protestors.

    I don't think the Senate vacancy thing is an issue - CA would elect a donkey with a blue badge, MA should also be safe despite that special election with the "this is my truck" dude which was a bit of a freak result, and either MI is a safe enough Dem state not to worry or it's a serious swing state, and if it's a serious swing state then Biden needs KLOBUCHAR on the ticket to make sure he holds it.

    The swing state argument is overblown. Did Obama really need Joe Biden to win in Delaware that had previously voted for Gore and Kerry? Did GHW Bush need Dan Quayle to win Idaho? GW Bush need Dick Cheney for Montana? McCain and Sarah Palin for Alaska? Regardless of whether presidential candidates should pick running mates from swing states, is there any evidence they actually do?
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    prh47bridgeprh47bridge Posts: 441
    eristdoof said:

    "Her successor as one of the Senators for Massachusetts would be chosen by the state governor who is a Republican."

    So senators are elected, but any replacements are just appointed by the governor with no restriction to what party the replacement comes from? Potentially remaining in place for possibly over 5 years? Wow. I never knew that.

    Depends on the state. There are 36 states where the governor appoints the replacement who serves until the next state-wide general election (so not over 5 years). The remaining 14 hold a special election. Of the 36 states, 6 require the governor to appoint someone from the same party as the previous senator. Massachusetts is actually one of the states that holds a special election.

    Of the 14 states that hold a special election, 10 allow the governor to make an interim appointment. Massachusetts is one of those. The rules for Massachusetts special election are that it must happen 145-160 days after vacancy occurs. If a vacancy occurs after April 10 but on or before the 70th day before the regular state primary, the office will appear on the regular state primary ballot. If a vacancy occurs after that time, the office will appear on the state election ballot that November.
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    Gabs3Gabs3 Posts: 836
    This is the sort of people we have teaching our kids in London. Someone who describes Lenin's slaughter the kulaks letter as "an excellent letter"

    https://mobile.twitter.com/Lewis181278/status/1253315161353449473

    Surprise surprise, he's a union rep. No wonder free schools are so popular.
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    MysticroseMysticrose Posts: 4,688
    kamski said:

    On topic, I thought for a long time that Trump was a shoo-in for November. Then came the virus. His initial approval surge has very quickly evaporated.

    He needs a shot in the arm ...

    Dettol, obvs.

    I can't see how anybody paying attention could have thought Trump was a shoo-in (or that he was bound to lose, for that matter). Trump is the most consistently unpopular president in recent times.

    .
    Utterly untrue. He was popular, especially in states he needed to win and clearly on course until the virus.
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    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,930
    This is a really fascinating insight into how we are seen inside the Trump administration. It is dripping with nostalgia, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21
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    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,355
    eristdoof said:

    Scott_xP said:
    A-political advisors to the government have known this for a long time. It means that almost all of those who agree to this role are no longer in the "because I can make a difference crowd" but in the "I fully support Trump crowd"
    I'm sure this is a deliberate approach from Trump, and he has probably been doing this all through his career.

    The end result is that the experts you really need in those positions are either driven out or keep away, and you end up being advised by a bunch of incompetent yes-men.
    Same here isn't it? Even senior ministers judged insufficiently loyal to Boris and Dominic Cummings are removed. Ask the Saj, whose fellow former Conservative Chancellors Ken Clarke and Phil Hammond had the whip removed and were thus forced out.
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    kamskikamski Posts: 4,250
    eristdoof said:

    "Her successor as one of the Senators for Massachusetts would be chosen by the state governor who is a Republican."

    So senators are elected, but any replacements are just appointed by the governor with no restriction to what party the replacement comes from? Potentially remaining in place for possibly over 5 years? Wow. I never knew that.

    I don't think that's right. Depending on states the appointed senators serve until a special election, or until "the next regularly-scheduled, statewide general election"
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    Kamala Harris was kind of a bubble IMHO, there was no good reason for her to be that strong a favourite. She's competent but doesn't deliver a swing state, her campaign was pretty flat, and she's not particularly popular among black voters. There's an argument that Biden may have promised Jim Clyburn that he'd pick a black woman, but if you believe that then maybe look at some of the other black candidates.

    I don't really see the point in picking Warren, the Bernie Bros have an enduring grudge against her and the rest of the left should get behind Biden anyhow. Gretchen Whitmer is starting to look like value, she's coming out well in the battle against her obliging comedy-villain Trumpist protestors.

    I don't think the Senate vacancy thing is an issue - CA would elect a donkey with a blue badge, MA should also be safe despite that special election with the "this is my truck" dude which was a bit of a freak result, and either MI is a safe enough Dem state not to worry or it's a serious swing state, and if it's a serious swing state then Biden needs KLOBUCHAR on the ticket to make sure he holds it.

    There's an obsession on PB with VP picks who "deliver" a particular swing state. VP picks who do that are neither common nor particularly effective. Most VP picks in recent elections either haven't represented swing states at all, or haven't obviously benefited the ticket in the swing state.

    Biden in particular has a much bigger picture to look at because "heartbeat from the Presidency" means so much more when the candidate is as old as him. That's why I don't buy into Whitmer as a choice (who has been a Governor for five minutes) or someone like Abrams. Similarly, I don't buy into the idea of Warren, who is so obviously not on his wing of the party (what type of Presidency should voters then expect?)

    He really needs a somewhat "safe" choice who is in line with his pragmatic position within the party - someone who it iis easy to imagine stepping into the Oval Office. That speaks to Klobuchar or Harris as experienced senators.

    On senator replacements, I think the point with Warren is less the Special Election (although there's recent history or a Republican winning one) and more the fact that the crucial first 100 days - when the President has most goodwill and wants to get achievements under his belt - would be that bit harder with a Republican appointed temporary replacement to Warren.

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    kamskikamski Posts: 4,250
    kamski said:

    eristdoof said:

    "Her successor as one of the Senators for Massachusetts would be chosen by the state governor who is a Republican."

    So senators are elected, but any replacements are just appointed by the governor with no restriction to what party the replacement comes from? Potentially remaining in place for possibly over 5 years? Wow. I never knew that.

    I don't think that's right. Depending on states the appointed senators serve until a special election, or until "the next regularly-scheduled, statewide general election"
    Also some states do have a rule that the replacement must of the same party
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    eristdooferistdoof Posts: 4,891

    Kamala Harris was kind of a bubble IMHO, there was no good reason for her to be that strong a favourite. She's competent but doesn't deliver a swing state, her campaign was pretty flat, and she's not particularly popular among black voters. There's an argument that Biden may have promised Jim Clyburn that he'd pick a black woman, but if you believe that then maybe look at some of the other black candidates.

    I don't really see the point in picking Warren, the Bernie Bros have an enduring grudge against her and the rest of the left should get behind Biden anyhow. Gretchen Whitmer is starting to look like value, she's coming out well in the battle against her obliging comedy-villain Trumpist protestors.

    I don't think the Senate vacancy thing is an issue - CA would elect a donkey with a blue badge, MA should also be safe despite that special election with the "this is my truck" dude which was a bit of a freak result, and either MI is a safe enough Dem state not to worry or it's a serious swing state, and if it's a serious swing state then Biden needs KLOBUCHAR on the ticket to make sure he holds it.

    The swing state argument is overblown. Did Obama really need Joe Biden to win in Delaware that had previously voted for Gore and Kerry? Did GHW Bush need Dan Quayle to win Idaho? GW Bush need Dick Cheney for Montana? McCain and Sarah Palin for Alaska? Regardless of whether presidential candidates should pick running mates from swing states, is there any evidence they actually do?
    I always wonder, who actually wants the VP job? Your role as speaker ot the senate rarely has influence, and you are out of the political spotlight for 8 years or so. If you are lucky you get made head of a pandemic response team. The supposed route into the presidency is way too risky. In my lifetime only one VP has made it to president (I exclude Gerald Ford as he was not elected as VP).

    I suspect that considerations like "coming from a swing state" are greatly diminished by finding anyone you want and is competent.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,191
    I have just been rewatching the Novaro Media election coverage, to cheer myself up (given the unintentional humour of their unselfaware pomposity).

    I have just noticed that John McDonnell, in his interview with Andrew Neil, said of his and Corbyn’s impending resignations, ‘we will always make decisions in the best interests of our party.’

    Leaving aside the fact that their judgement was perhaps not all it might have been, surely anyone aspiring to government should always make decisions in the best interests of the country?

    Not that we actually had one of those on offer in 2019, of course, but it did just sum up for me the kind of narrow and small-minded selfishness that characterised Corbynism and goes a long way towards explaining its bizarre policy offering and casual racism.
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    TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we are seen inside the Trump administration. It is dripping with nostalgia, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    You long for a time where the US ambassador is as repulsed by the Uk as you are ?
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    MysticroseMysticrose Posts: 4,688
    edited April 2020

    Good morning everybody. Another bright sunny morning, and a taken opportunity for walk yesterday; I wonder how lockdown will feel in the rain!

    We had four months when we never had 48 hours without rain, sleet, hail, drizzle. If that had been lockdown, I reckon it would have had serious impact on my mental health.

    As it is, apart from an easterly wind, the lockdown weather has been solidly lovely.
    Yes, indeed the number of hours of seemingly unbroken sunshine this month has been quite extraordinary - even it it completely clouded over for the next week, I guess it would still amount to a record for April.
    In recent data April has been the driest month of the year in London (depending which sources you use).

    My father-in-law used to tell me it was often the best month in Devon. I frequently dismissed the suggestion but year after year he has proven right.

    I think there's a reasonably sound line of reasoning behind the notion. In the autumn the jetstream typically fires up off the eastern seaboard, fuelled by large sea temperature anomalies around the world. Winter often sees the jet begin to abate but it can still produce high precipitation. Summer, ideally, sees the Azores high ridging north and extending over the UK but storms can be frequent and heavy.

    April is an isthmus month: it lies between the jet-fuelled winter and the summer storms.
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    kamskikamski Posts: 4,250

    kamski said:

    On topic, I thought for a long time that Trump was a shoo-in for November. Then came the virus. His initial approval surge has very quickly evaporated.

    He needs a shot in the arm ...

    Dettol, obvs.

    I can't see how anybody paying attention could have thought Trump was a shoo-in (or that he was bound to lose, for that matter). Trump is the most consistently unpopular president in recent times.

    .
    Utterly untrue. He was popular, especially in states he needed to win and clearly on course until the virus.
    You say it's "utterly untrue" based on what?

    You can look for yourself at the evidence here
    https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/?ex_cid=irpromo

    Or any of the other sites that collect polling results.


    "He was popular, especially in states he needed to win and clearly on course until the virus" my arse.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,983
    Good morning, everyone.

    Is Trump bounce to stick with Pence or might he look elsewhere?
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    It may be that the main consideration for the American voter come November is that the VP is only a heartbeat away from a 78 year-old President and on that basis Warren may be considered too far left to be offered the ticket, not to mention being too old herself at 71 by then. I can't help but think if it was going to he be her then the deal would be sewn up by now. For my money it's going to be Kamala Harris, although the value bet is probably Amy Klobuchar at 7/2 (various).
    DYOR.
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    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,355
    ydoethur said:

    I have just been rewatching the Novaro Media election coverage, to cheer myself up (given the unintentional humour of their unselfaware pomposity).

    I have just noticed that John McDonnell, in his interview with Andrew Neil, said of his and Corbyn’s impending resignations, ‘we will always make decisions in the best interests of our party.’

    Leaving aside the fact that their judgement was perhaps not all it might have been, surely anyone aspiring to government should always make decisions in the best interests of the country?

    Not that we actually had one of those on offer in 2019, of course, but it did just sum up for me the kind of narrow and small-minded selfishness that characterised Corbynism and goes a long way towards explaining its bizarre policy offering and casual racism.

    I'd imagine McDonnell thinks the interests of his party and country are indistinguishable, and the same, mutatis mutandis, for Boris or Nicola Sturgeon or any leading politician.
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    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,930
    TGOHF666 said:

    This is into how we are seen inside the Trump. It is dripping with nostalgia, laden with the past. with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    You long for a time where the US ambassador is as repulsed by the Uk as you are ?
    England is not the UK. And I am English, why would England repulse me? I just know there’s a lot more to it than white cliffs, steam trains and churches.

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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,114
    Moth du Jour: Buff-tip. Starting to emerge now through to June, their camouflage as a piece of beech twig is remarkable.


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    kamskikamski Posts: 4,250

    Good morning, everyone.

    Is Trump bounce to stick with Pence or might he look elsewhere?

    Interesting question. Probably stick. Pence has been loyal, and if he switched he would need to find someone who would help do what Pence helped to do: keep the conservative evangelical vote rock solid. Trump may be a moron but he's not stupid, he knows where most (well, half) of his votes come from.
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,328

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we are seen inside the Trump administration. It is dripping with nostalgia, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
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    edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,150
    edited April 2020
    FPT
    alex_ said:

    EiT - what is actually going on in Japan? There’s the fact they declared a “national emergency”. The very low levels of testing. “Reports” that hospitals are being overwhelmed with sick patients. Lack of PPE. And yet the numbers of recorded COVID deaths continue to bump along at pretty low levels.

    Misreporting, or misrecording (or stricter definitions for recording)? Or a bit of both?

    OK, here goes. The story is too complicated for Western media, so they're mostly writing cultural fluff and bollocks. Here goes:

    Phase 1 (Feb): Cruise ship clown-shoes. Quarantine chaos, inspectors get infected and aren't tested, forget to test some of the passengers, put negative-testing people on trains home then they test again as infected.
    Phase 2 (Mar 1st-ish): Early action. About 100 non-cruise-ship cases, move fast with WFH restrictions and voluntary call to cancel events, pass a law allowing the declaration of a state of emergency (but don't declare it). My town sent me a pack of masks with pictures of frogs and road safety messages on them.
    Phase 3: (Mid-to-late March): Complacency. Phase 2 worked. Cases are flat around 50 per day. Schools to reopen. People take that as a sign the crisis is over. Unrestricted incoming travel from EU/US.
    Phase 4: (Late March / Early April): Cases from the Complacency phase now getting detected all over the place, especially big/international cities. Olympics cancelled, ambitious Tokyo governor immediately flips from "everything is fine" to "this is a terrible crisis and I will save you". Govt calls state of emergency, which gives some extra powers to local government, but the response is still almost entirely voluntary. In practical terms we've got a lot more working from home, some restaurants are changing to takeaway only, some shops are reducing their hours. Pachinko places are still open, the Tokyo government is trying to shame them into closing, good luck with that. The central government is sending every household two (2) washable masks, with no pictures of frogs, many of which are apparently moldy.

    Here's the data showing Tokyo traffic changes, which shows you these phases with actual data (as opposed to the preferred metrics used by the NYT or BBC journalists, walking around and seeing if you can see a lot of people in the park).
    image

    [1\2]
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    edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,150
    edited April 2020
    [2/2]

    Where we are now is that detected cases are flat again, around 400 against a very short peak of 700. Testing is pretty weak, but it's been belatedly ramping up, and the increased number of tests doesn't seem to be showing an increased number of cases, so it doesn't look like there were absolute *loads* of infected people who weren't in the numbers for lack of testing. (Japan does a *lot* of CT scans which seem to be a good way to filter for covid19, so it may be that they were already quite good at getting the right people to PCR tests.) There was a law that said that if you were found infected you had to be hospitalized, which risked flooding the hospitals with infectious-but-not-sick people, but at least in Tokyo they've now started putting these people in hotels, which may have been reducing the incentive to go easy on testing.

    Hospitals are short of PPE, like everywhere else, since demand has gone up and supply has gone down. Some hospitals are hurriedly setting up wards for covid19, most of the others won't accept covid19 cases. This means that if someone gets covid19, it can be hard to find a hospital that can take them nearby. There was always a little bit of chaos in Tokyo and some other places when someone gets picked up in an ambulance (which is a free, public service run by the fire brigade) and they have to find a (independently-run) hospital that will take them, which seems to be a ridiculous manual process involving phoning around, and that's now worse both for covid19 patients (since most hospitals won't take them) and for regular patients (since some of the capacity is being cleared out to handle covid19). Some doctors in Tokyo and Osaka have been saying things like "if this crisis keeps getting worse hospitals won't be able to cope", which is true and is the whole point of the social distancing stuff, and the western media obviously report as "Japanese medical systems on the brink of collapse" or something.

    I guess the next question is whether the current, apparently successful voluntary response can be sustained, or whether we go into another Complacency phase and the whole cycle repeats.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,191
    edited April 2020

    ydoethur said:

    I have just been rewatching the Novaro Media election coverage, to cheer myself up (given the unintentional humour of their unselfaware pomposity).

    I have just noticed that John McDonnell, in his interview with Andrew Neil, said of his and Corbyn’s impending resignations, ‘we will always make decisions in the best interests of our party.’

    Leaving aside the fact that their judgement was perhaps not all it might have been, surely anyone aspiring to government should always make decisions in the best interests of the country?

    Not that we actually had one of those on offer in 2019, of course, but it did just sum up for me the kind of narrow and small-minded selfishness that characterised Corbynism and goes a long way towards explaining its bizarre policy offering and casual racism.

    I'd imagine McDonnell thinks the interests of his party and country are indistinguishable, and the same, mutatis mutandis, for Boris or Nicola Sturgeon or any leading politician.
    Your second point is why I said ‘none of them were on offer.’

    The first one may be why he said it, but doesn’t in any way invalidate my conclusion.
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,328
    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we are seen inside the Trump administration. It is dripping with nostalgia, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    You long for a time where the US ambassador is as repulsed by the Uk as you are ?
    The view of the Left on that would be it's not representative and they'd prefer to see inner city hip-hop, football practice in Burnley by a different demographic group, brand new architecture or art by a right-on creator, and a clip of a gay pride march.

    That's how they think.
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    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,930

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we are seen insidIt will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    I see a lot more in England than that. But I do think nostalgia is deeply ingrained in the English psyche.

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    TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

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    edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,150


    He really needs a somewhat "safe" choice who is in line with his pragmatic position within the party - someone who it iis easy to imagine stepping into the Oval Office. That speaks to Klobuchar or Harris as experienced senators.

    That makes sense, but maybe it's also worth looking outside the Senate at people who have actually worked in the administration - Susan Rice?
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,328
    Is it true that Biden is delegating responsibility for his pick to a committee that's going to report back to him in a couple of months with 2-3 options?

    Despite being deeply weird it's also a total abrogation of leadership so I hope (for his sake) it's not true.

    It could lead to the accusation he can't even put his own socks on without help.

    If he can't make a simply (although important) decision like that, why should he be President?
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,114
    ydoethur said:

    I have just been rewatching the Novaro Media election coverage, to cheer myself up ...

    We need to end this lockdown now, on humanitarian grounds.

    Look what it is doing to people, Boris!
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,328
    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    The Left are only interested in history and heritage to the extent it can be leveraged to support their present day political objectives.

    Otherwise it should be dismissed, ignored or totally re-written.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,191
    edited April 2020
    kamski said:

    Good morning, everyone.

    Is Trump bounce to stick with Pence or might he look elsewhere?

    Interesting question. Probably stick. Pence has been loyal, and if he switched he would need to find someone who would help do what Pence helped to do: keep the conservative evangelical vote rock solid. Trump may be a moron but he's not stupid, he knows where most (well, half) of his votes come from.
    Keeping the CEV rock solid would be straightforward enough. There are plenty of candidates who can do that.

    The much harder trick is somebody who does that WITHOUT horrifying marginal voters into the arms of Biden or whoever the Dems eventually pick. And there Pence is perfect, because he’s quite low profile, Plus he’s fairly softly spoken and articulate. So you may not listen at all, and if you do, if you don’t actually pay attention to what he’s saying you’re just left with a vague grey impression.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,328

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we are seen insidIt will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    I see a lot more in England than that. But I do think nostalgia is deeply ingrained in the English psyche.

    You've spoken before of your love for England, with examples.

    So what's missing for you?
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,191

    ydoethur said:

    I have just been rewatching the Novaro Media election coverage, to cheer myself up ...

    We need to end this lockdown now, on humanitarian grounds.

    Look what it is doing to people, Boris!
    Oh, come on. It’s hilarious.

    The dawning realisation as the results come in that all the people they arrogantly presumed to speak for think they’re ‘a bunch of posh ####s who don’t understand ordinary people’ is pure comedy gold.

    Ashley Sarker’s face as she tried to explain how the exit poll didn’t show Labour had lost the working class and that ‘the red wave is still coming’ is if anything even better.
  • Options
    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,060
    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    Poor old Harry, unable to distinguish between England and the UK. Presumably Scotland is the merest discomfitting skelf in your identity.
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,355
    Twitter is taking down a fake Joe Biden ad amplified by Trump campaign staffers
    https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/23/21233006/joe-biden-trump-fake-ad-campaign-hillary-clinton-twitter-tumblr-reddit
  • Options
    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,930

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we are seen insidIt will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lothere in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    I see a lot more in England than that. But I do think nostalgia is deeply ingrained in the English psyche.

    You've spoken before of your love for England, with examples.

    So what's missing for you?
    Our cities, our people, our invention, our entrepreneurialism, our multiculturalism, for starters. There is a whole lot more to us than our past.

  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,114

    Is it true that Biden is delegating responsibility for his pick to a committee that's going to report back to him in a couple of months with 2-3 options?

    Despite being deeply weird it's also a total abrogation of leadership so I hope (for his sake) it's not true.

    It could lead to the accusation he can't even put his own socks on without help.

    If he can't make a simply (although important) decision like that, why should he be President?

    Who are Biden's "handlers"? And what will their role be if he is elected?
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,191

    Is it true that Biden is delegating responsibility for his pick to a committee that's going to report back to him in a couple of months with 2-3 options?

    Despite being deeply weird it's also a total abrogation of leadership so I hope (for his sake) it's not true.

    It could lead to the accusation he can't even put his own socks on without help.

    If he can't make a simply (although important) decision like that, why should he be President?

    Many Presidential candidates do that. George W. Bush did, for example. It was chaired by Dick Cheney...

    Not that Bush is necessarily a good example. But I think Reagan did it too.
  • Options
    TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    Poor old Union D - unable to read a tweet with long words in in. 😂😂.


    Poor old Harry, unable to distinguish between England and the UK. Presumably Scotland is the merest discomfitting skelf in your identity.
  • Options
    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,930
    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    Can you point me to any criticism in my original post?

  • Options
    JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 6,010

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we are seen inside the Trump administration. It is dripping with nostalgia, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    England is the oldest unified nation-state in Europe. We had a central government long before the Norman Conquest
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,328

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    Poor old Harry, unable to distinguish between England and the UK. Presumably Scotland is the merest discomfitting skelf in your identity.
    This is about England because it related to St. George's Day.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,328

    Is it true that Biden is delegating responsibility for his pick to a committee that's going to report back to him in a couple of months with 2-3 options?

    Despite being deeply weird it's also a total abrogation of leadership so I hope (for his sake) it's not true.

    It could lead to the accusation he can't even put his own socks on without help.

    If he can't make a simply (although important) decision like that, why should he be President?

    Who are Biden's "handlers"? And what will their role be if he is elected?
    Feeding time and bath time, I think.
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,114
    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    I have just been rewatching the Novaro Media election coverage, to cheer myself up ...

    We need to end this lockdown now, on humanitarian grounds.

    Look what it is doing to people, Boris!
    Oh, come on. It’s hilarious.

    The dawning realisation as the results come in that all the people they arrogantly presumed to speak for think they’re ‘a bunch of posh ####s who don’t understand ordinary people’ is pure comedy gold.

    Ashley Sarker’s face as she tried to explain how the exit poll didn’t show Labour had lost the working class and that ‘the red wave is still coming’ is if anything even better.
    It should be buried in a grave with the simple headstone inscribed "Private Grief".

    No-one needs to lay flowers.
  • Options

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    The Left are only interested in history and heritage to the extent it can be leveraged to support their present day political objectives.

    Otherwise it should be dismissed, ignored or totally re-written.
    That surely also applies to the Right, possibly to a greater degree. The association of the Right with nationalism means that there is always a tendency from that wing to view the UK's past through rose-tinted glasses, airbrushing away any distasteful episodes.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,206
    ydoethur said:

    Is it true that Biden is delegating responsibility for his pick to a committee that's going to report back to him in a couple of months with 2-3 options?

    Despite being deeply weird it's also a total abrogation of leadership so I hope (for his sake) it's not true.

    It could lead to the accusation he can't even put his own socks on without help.

    If he can't make a simply (although important) decision like that, why should he be President?

    Many Presidential candidates do that. George W. Bush did, for example. It was chaired by Dick Cheney...

    Not that Bush is necessarily a good example. But I think Reagan did it too.
    A lot of it is vetting presumably. And you can't do too much of that these days.

    The pick has to be bombproof.
  • Options
    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,060
    TGOHF666 said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    Poor old Union D - unable to read a tweet with long words in in. 😂😂.


    Poor old Harry, unable to distinguish between England and the UK. Presumably Scotland is the merest discomfitting skelf in your identity.
    Not sure your inability to use the quote system is helping your zinger.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,599
    Gabs3 said:

    This is the sort of people we have teaching our kids in London. Someone who describes Lenin's slaughter the kulaks letter as "an excellent letter"

    https://mobile.twitter.com/Lewis181278/status/1253315161353449473

    Surprise surprise, he's a union rep. No wonder free schools are so popular.

    Yes clearly the wrong sort of eugenics being taught.
  • Options
    kjhkjh Posts: 10,626
    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    That is such a depressing post by you. CR and SO make positive posts and you have to bring negativity to it. The irony being you are criticing lefties for being negative!
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,114

    Is it true that Biden is delegating responsibility for his pick to a committee that's going to report back to him in a couple of months with 2-3 options?

    Despite being deeply weird it's also a total abrogation of leadership so I hope (for his sake) it's not true.

    It could lead to the accusation he can't even put his own socks on without help.

    If he can't make a simply (although important) decision like that, why should he be President?

    Who are Biden's "handlers"? And what will their role be if he is elected?
    Feeding time and bath time, I think.
    Ouch!
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,206
    Prof Isaac Ben-Israel's ideas have made the Telegraph:

    "But one Israeli professor claims that all efforts will lead to the same result, because the disease is self-limiting, and largely vanishes after 70 days, with or without any interventions."
  • Options
    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,060

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    Poor old Harry, unable to distinguish between England and the UK. Presumably Scotland is the merest discomfitting skelf in your identity.
    This is about England because it related to St. George's Day.
    It wasn't me who brought the UK into it.
  • Options
    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,930

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old cnfluence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all theoutlet.

    The Left are only interested in history and heritage to the extent it can be leveraged to support their present day political objectives.

    Otherwise it should be dismissed, ignored or totally re-written.
    Marvellous. The right will not tolerate any view of the past that does not chime with their own. See how easy this game is to play?

  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,191

    ydoethur said:

    Is it true that Biden is delegating responsibility for his pick to a committee that's going to report back to him in a couple of months with 2-3 options?

    Despite being deeply weird it's also a total abrogation of leadership so I hope (for his sake) it's not true.

    It could lead to the accusation he can't even put his own socks on without help.

    If he can't make a simply (although important) decision like that, why should he be President?

    Many Presidential candidates do that. George W. Bush did, for example. It was chaired by Dick Cheney...

    Not that Bush is necessarily a good example. But I think Reagan did it too.
    A lot of it is vetting presumably. And you can't do too much of that these days.

    The pick has to be bombproof.
    John McCain’s ghost is nodding in hearty agreement.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,328

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we are seen insidIt will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lothere in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    I see a lot more in England than that. But I do think nostalgia is deeply ingrained in the English psyche.

    You've spoken before of your love for England, with examples.

    So what's missing for you?
    Our cities, our people, our invention, our entrepreneurialism, our multiculturalism, for starters. There is a whole lot more to us than our past.

    Let me let you into a little secret: no-one cares about multiculturalism. It's an obsession of sociologists and politicians but every major Western nation has it and it's totally indistinctive.

    I saw clips of beautiful scenery, towns, villages, coastline and fishing villages. I also saw modern architecture in the Shard.

    It was an aesthetically pleasing tour of what's beautiful in England.

    I think you're reading too much into it because it was posted by Trump's ambassador.
  • Options
    TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    Can you point me to any criticism in my original post?

    " It is dripping with nostalgia, laden with the past"

    I can hear the sneer from here - "its so passe darling"..

    I repeat - he was doing a good thing - showcasing stuff normal Americans would like to see in England.

    And your first instinct is to call our American guest out for being old fashioned.

    At best its snobbery..
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,191
    Gabs3 said:

    This is the sort of people we have teaching our kids in London. Someone who describes Lenin's slaughter the kulaks letter as "an excellent letter"

    https://mobile.twitter.com/Lewis181278/status/1253315161353449473

    Surprise surprise, he's a union rep. No wonder free schools are so popular.

    Oi! Do you mind not generalising about union reps please?
  • Options
    TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052
    kjh said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    That is such a depressing post by you. CR and SO make positive posts and you have to bring negativity to it. The irony being you are criticing lefties for being negative!
    There wasn't anything positive in his sneer.
  • Options
    squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,347

    Good morning, everyone.

    Is Trump bounce to stick with Pence or might he look elsewhere?

    Not being an expert on American politics, how often have Presidents dumped their Vice President for the second selection race?
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,328

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old cnfluence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all theoutlet.

    The Left are only interested in history and heritage to the extent it can be leveraged to support their present day political objectives.

    Otherwise it should be dismissed, ignored or totally re-written.
    Marvellous. The right will not tolerate any view of the past that does not chime with their own. See how easy this game is to play?

    Nope. Not at all.

    Your objection was on views of the past - period - so you've already surrendered on that argument.
  • Options
    squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,347

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is into how we are seen inside the Trump. It is dripping with nostalgia, laden with the past. with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    You long for a time where the US ambassador is as repulsed by the Uk as you are ?
    England is not the UK. And I am English, why would England repulse me? I just know there’s a lot more to it than white cliffs, steam trains and churches.

    Eastenders, Ccoronation street ?
  • Options
    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,930
    TGOHF666 said:

    Poomakes a outlet.


    Can in my original post?



    " It is dripping with nostalgia, laden with the past"

    I can hear the sneer from here - "its so passe darling"..

    I repeat - he was doing a good thing - showcasing stuff normal Americans would like to see in England.

    And your first instinct is to call our American guest out for being old fashioned.

    At best its snobbery..

    That is world class projection. Just because you want something to be true doesn’t make it true.

  • Options
    kjhkjh Posts: 10,626
    TGOHF666 said:

    kjh said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    That is such a depressing post by you. CR and SO make positive posts and you have to bring negativity to it. The irony being you are criticing lefties for being negative!
    There wasn't anything positive in his sneer.
    I think you will find from his response you have completely misread those posts. It might be worth considering whether you have a biased and cynical view of others with different politics to you.
  • Options
    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,333

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we are seen inside the Trump administration. It is dripping with nostalgia, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Not really, but it's clearly well-meaning and nice of him to make the effort - I wouldn't criticise him for that myself. The fact that we have lots of attractive landscape and historic buildings is one of our many strengths, though we don't want to be seen as a historical theme park and have more to offer than that. I'm afraid, though, that SO is right that it's how we're seen in the US, and not just by the administration.

    Most people have a mental sketch of other countries which they can't be bothered to nuance, like the idea that the US is New York+Hollywood+rednecks. or Russia is Moscow+peasants. Britain's USP for many tourists is that we have loads of visual history - that's why London is such a draw and you don't see many foreign tourists wandering round the Highlands.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,328
    TGOHF666 said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    Can you point me to any criticism in my original post?

    " It is dripping with nostalgia, laden with the past"

    I can hear the sneer from here - "its so passe darling"..

    I repeat - he was doing a good thing - showcasing stuff normal Americans would like to see in England.

    And your first instinct is to call our American guest out for being old fashioned.

    At best its snobbery..
    If I went America I'd want to see it's great national parks, its scenery, its nature, experience jazz in New Orleans, the casinos in Las Vegas and go and see Hollywood in LA. I'd want to go to monument valley. I'd also want to see battlesites of the revolution and civil wars, see original colonial towns, and visit the beautiful old quarters of Savannah and Charleston.

    So yes, I'd say history, landscape and heritage would be high on my list of visiting America too - it's what allows you to get under the skin of what really made a country.
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,328

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    Poor old Harry, unable to distinguish between England and the UK. Presumably Scotland is the merest discomfitting skelf in your identity.
    This is about England because it related to St. George's Day.
    It wasn't me who brought the UK into it.
    Maybe I've missed it but I can't see where Harry mentioned the UK either?
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,274

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we are seen insidIt will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lothere in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    I see a lot more in England than that. But I do think nostalgia is deeply ingrained in the English psyche.

    You've spoken before of your love for England, with examples.

    So what's missing for you?
    Our cities, our people, our invention, our entrepreneurialism, our multiculturalism, for starters. There is a whole lot more to us than our past.

    Let me let you into a little secret: no-one cares about multiculturalism. It's an obsession of sociologists and politicians but every major Western nation has it and it's totally indistinctive.

    I saw clips of beautiful scenery, towns, villages, coastline and fishing villages. I also saw modern architecture in the Shard.

    It was an aesthetically pleasing tour of what's beautiful in England.

    I think you're reading too much into it because it was posted by Trump's ambassador.
    It was posted here by SO. Just thank him and move on?
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    edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,150

    Good morning, everyone.

    Is Trump bounce to stick with Pence or might he look elsewhere?

    Not being an expert on American politics, how often have Presidents dumped their Vice President for the second selection race?
    Recently, hardly ever, apparently. However, Trump's staff turnover is insane, and you're fired is his catchphrase, so I think it's totally plausible that he'd dump Pence.
  • Options
    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,930

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all theoutlet.
    The ignored or totally re-written.
    Marvellous. The right will not game is to play?
    Nope. Not at all.

    Your objection was on views of the past - period - so you've already surrendered on that argument.
    I’m afraid that makes absolutely no sense at all. I had no objection. I was observing that the US Ambassador’s view of England was nostalgic and backward looking. That is not a rewriting of history. It is not a judgement of history. It is an observation.

  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,328
    ydoethur said:

    Is it true that Biden is delegating responsibility for his pick to a committee that's going to report back to him in a couple of months with 2-3 options?

    Despite being deeply weird it's also a total abrogation of leadership so I hope (for his sake) it's not true.

    It could lead to the accusation he can't even put his own socks on without help.

    If he can't make a simply (although important) decision like that, why should he be President?

    Many Presidential candidates do that. George W. Bush did, for example. It was chaired by Dick Cheney...

    Not that Bush is necessarily a good example. But I think Reagan did it too.
    Quite amusing that the Chair decided it should be.. err.. himself then!
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    TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    Poor old Harry, unable to distinguish between England and the UK. Presumably Scotland is the merest discomfitting skelf in your identity.
    This is about England because it related to St. George's Day.
    It wasn't me who brought the UK into it.
    Maybe I've missed it but I can't see where Harry mentioned the UK either?
    It was St Georges day - why would he post about Wales or Ulster etc ?
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,060

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    Poor old Harry, unable to distinguish between England and the UK. Presumably Scotland is the merest discomfitting skelf in your identity.
    This is about England because it related to St. George's Day.
    It wasn't me who brought the UK into it.
    Maybe I've missed it but I can't see where Harry mentioned the UK either?
    Post at 7.32am.
  • Options
    Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 12,995

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we are seen insidIt will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lothere in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    I see a lot more in England than that. But I do think nostalgia is deeply ingrained in the English psyche.

    You've spoken before of your love for England, with examples.

    So what's missing for you?
    Our cities, our people, our invention, our entrepreneurialism, our multiculturalism, for starters. There is a whole lot more to us than our past.

    The stupid old twat's video is basically what Americans who have never been the UK think it's like. I can't imagine he was the one driving Final Cut Pro to make it so it's probably just been churned by some Beltway PR firm.
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,328
    TGOHF666 said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    Poor old Harry, unable to distinguish between England and the UK. Presumably Scotland is the merest discomfitting skelf in your identity.
    This is about England because it related to St. George's Day.
    It wasn't me who brought the UK into it.
    Maybe I've missed it but I can't see where Harry mentioned the UK either?
    It was St Georges day - why would he post about Wales or Ulster etc ?
    I can only assume it's his knee-jerk insecurity and inferiority complex kicking in.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,328

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all theoutlet.
    The ignored or totally re-written.
    Marvellous. The right will not game is to play?
    Nope. Not at all.

    Your objection was on views of the past - period - so you've already surrendered on that argument.
    I’m afraid that makes absolutely no sense at all. I had no objection. I was observing that the US Ambassador’s view of England was nostalgic and backward looking. That is not a rewriting of history. It is not a judgement of history. It is an observation.

    I don't see anything backward looking about it. That's how much of the English landscape looks today, and will do so (hopefully) long into the future.

    It's rather sad that you do.
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    felixfelix Posts: 15,124
    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    It's like the stupid 'Oxford teacher' worried that a vaccine might be created by Oxford white men. That is to say she's insane.
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    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,912
    ydoethur said:

    I have just been rewatching the Novaro Media election coverage, to cheer myself up (given the unintentional humour of their unselfaware pomposity).

    I have just noticed that John McDonnell, in his interview with Andrew Neil, said of his and Corbyn’s impending resignations, ‘we will always make decisions in the best interests of our party.’

    Leaving aside the fact that their judgement was perhaps not all it might have been, surely anyone aspiring to government should always make decisions in the best interests of the country?

    Not that we actually had one of those on offer in 2019, of course, but it did just sum up for me the kind of narrow and small-minded selfishness that characterised Corbynism and goes a long way towards explaining its bizarre policy offering and casual racism.

    That defines exactly what is wrong with the UK, both Tories and Labour are in it for themselves, they care not a jot for the country.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,328
    IanB2 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we are seen insidIt will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lothere in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    I see a lot more in England than that. But I do think nostalgia is deeply ingrained in the English psyche.

    You've spoken before of your love for England, with examples.

    So what's missing for you?
    Our cities, our people, our invention, our entrepreneurialism, our multiculturalism, for starters. There is a whole lot more to us than our past.

    Let me let you into a little secret: no-one cares about multiculturalism. It's an obsession of sociologists and politicians but every major Western nation has it and it's totally indistinctive.

    I saw clips of beautiful scenery, towns, villages, coastline and fishing villages. I also saw modern architecture in the Shard.

    It was an aesthetically pleasing tour of what's beautiful in England.

    I think you're reading too much into it because it was posted by Trump's ambassador.
    It was posted here by SO. Just thank him and move on?
    The tweet was from the US ambassador. SO posted it on here and started a debate.

    I'm disagreeing with his conclusions.
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    kjhkjh Posts: 10,626
    IanB2 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we are seen insidIt will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lothere in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    I see a lot more in England than that. But I do think nostalgia is deeply ingrained in the English psyche.

    You've spoken before of your love for England, with examples.

    So what's missing for you?
    Our cities, our people, our invention, our entrepreneurialism, our multiculturalism, for starters. There is a whole lot more to us than our past.

    Let me let you into a little secret: no-one cares about multiculturalism. It's an obsession of sociologists and politicians but every major Western nation has it and it's totally indistinctive.

    I saw clips of beautiful scenery, towns, villages, coastline and fishing villages. I also saw modern architecture in the Shard.

    It was an aesthetically pleasing tour of what's beautiful in England.

    I think you're reading too much into it because it was posted by Trump's ambassador.
    It was posted here by SO. Just thank him and move on?
    Agree. God we can turn anything in to an argument.
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    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,930

    TGOHF666 said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of hiinfluence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” thoutlet.

    Poor old Harry, unable to distinguish between England and the UK. Presumably Scotland is the merest discomfitting skelf in your identity.
    This is about England because it related to St. George's Day.
    It wasn't me who brought the UK into it.
    Maybe I've missed it but I can't see where Harry mentioned the UK either?

    It was St Georges day - why would he post about Wales or Ulster etc ?
    I can only assume it's his knee-jerk insecurity and inferiority complex kicking in.
    Not sure who Harry is, but TGOHF accused me if hating the UK.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,983
    Mr. Observer, TGOHF = The Ghost of Harry Flashman.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,912

    TGOHF666 said:

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Poor old US ambassador - makes a video of all the stuff he likes in England and then is scolded by woke lefties for not “liking” the right stuff.

    He’s giving the future tourist industry a boost that it wouldn’t get if he tweeted a video of Luton high street, the Durham miners rally or an XR demo outside of a chainsaw outlet.

    Poor old Harry, unable to distinguish between England and the UK. Presumably Scotland is the merest discomfitting skelf in your identity.
    This is about England because it related to St. George's Day.
    It wasn't me who brought the UK into it.
    Maybe I've missed it but I can't see where Harry mentioned the UK either?
    You can always trust Harry to try and prove how English he has become after having had to move there as he could not cut it in Scotland. He missed out the North British bit and went full English please, with a union jack on the side.
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,328

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we are seen inside the Trump administration. It is dripping with nostalgia, laden with the past. It will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lot of history and heritage. America doesn't have that. And a lot the rest of world also value that here too - it's why tourists come here in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    Not really, but it's clearly well-meaning and nice of him to make the effort - I wouldn't criticise him for that myself. The fact that we have lots of attractive landscape and historic buildings is one of our many strengths, though we don't want to be seen as a historical theme park and have more to offer than that. I'm afraid, though, that SO is right that it's how we're seen in the US, and not just by the administration.

    Most people have a mental sketch of other countries which they can't be bothered to nuance, like the idea that the US is New York+Hollywood+rednecks. or Russia is Moscow+peasants. Britain's USP for many tourists is that we have loads of visual history - that's why London is such a draw and you don't see many foreign tourists wandering round the Highlands.
    Yes, but we already know there's nothing patriotic about you.

    It's the most objectionable part of your rather bizzare "suite" of political views, IMHO.
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    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,930

    This is a really fascinating insight into how we are seen insidIt will resonate with many here, too.
    https://twitter.com/usambuk/status/1253229648546324480?s=21

    Yes, England is an old country with a lothere in their droves and we have so much soft power and cultural influence.

    Much of that does reasonate with me and is deeply moving.

    Does it not for you too?
    I see a lot more in England than that. But I do think nostalgia is deeply ingrained in the English psyche.

    You've spoken before of your love for England, with examples.

    So what's missing for you?
    Our cities, our people, our invention, our entrepreneurialism, our multiculturalism, for starters. There is a whole lot more to us than our past.

    Let me let you into a little secret: no-one cares about multiculturalism. It's an obsession of sociologists and politicians but every major Western nation has it and it's totally indistinctive.

    I saw clips of beautiful scenery, towns, villages, coastline and fishing villages. I also saw modern architecture in the Shard.

    It was an aesthetically pleasing tour of what's beautiful in England.

    I think you're reading too much into it because it was posted by Trump's ambassador.
    I think England has embraced and managed multiculturalism better than almost any place on earth. I am proud of that. If others aren’t, so be it. You asked me what I thought was missing.



This discussion has been closed.