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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » And to take you gently into the weekend (remember those?) the

SystemSystem Posts: 11,002
edited May 2020 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » And to take you gently into the weekend (remember those?) the PB NightHawks Cafe

The lockdown continues with no real idea when this is going to come to an end. So while it remains the PB Nighthawks cafe will continue – a place to interact without worrying about physical differences.

Read the full story here


«13

Comments

  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,584
    Evening all.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,044
    2nd. Like Trump.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,288
    Night all. Play fair!
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    The King is not dead, long live the king.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    edited May 2020
    If people are looking for something more terrifying than our current grim circumstances to serve as a distraction, they could do worse than this book I'm currently reading - not content with being post apocalyptic, it's post apocalyptic sci fi with giant, sentient spiders. Cheery. The blurb talked rather obliquely of 'new masters have turned [planet] from a refuge into mankind's worst nightmare'. I call that burying the truth in vagueness!
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,774
    There's not a lot of detail in that, is there?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,584
    kle4 said:

    If people are looking for something more terrifying than our current grim circumstances to serve as a distraction, they could do worse than this book I'm currently reading - not content with being post apocalyptic, it's post apocalyptic sci fi with giant, sentient spiders. Cheery.

    Someone to chat with, then.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,774
    eadric said:
    And if you want, you can earn 7% if you lend money to the Spanish government for 10 years.

    That's not 7% a year.

    That's 7% over 10 years. That's 0.7%.

    If you were to buy Microsoft shares, by contrast, you'd get almost twice the yield.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,153
    kle4 said:

    If people are looking for something more terrifying than our current grim circumstances to serve as a distraction, they could do worse than this book I'm currently reading - not content with being post apocalyptic, it's post apocalyptic sci fi with giant, sentient spiders. Cheery.

    OH, what is it? I'm on Banks's Algebraist myself - giant, sentient planktike echinoderm-analogues.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,774
    eadric said:

    rcs1000 said:

    eadric said:
    And if you want, you can earn 7% if you lend money to the Spanish government for 10 years.

    That's not 7% a year.

    That's 7% over 10 years. That's 0.7%.

    If you were to buy Microsoft shares, by contrast, you'd get almost twice the yield.
    I thought the Spanish and Italians were adamant they didn't want ESM assistance, as it would turn them into ECB colonies like Greece.
    Spain has had ESM assistance historically. See: https://www.esm.europa.eu/assistance/spain
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    Carnyx said:

    kle4 said:

    If people are looking for something more terrifying than our current grim circumstances to serve as a distraction, they could do worse than this book I'm currently reading - not content with being post apocalyptic, it's post apocalyptic sci fi with giant, sentient spiders. Cheery.

    OH, what is it? I'm on Banks's Algebraist myself - giant, sentient planktike echinoderm-analogues.
    Children of Time by Adrian Tchaikovsky. It might well turn out to be a hopeful story, but I just loved how the reference on the back to 'mankind's worst nightmare' was not, as I thought, mere colourful language.

    Have to admit I've never gotten into Banks. I read Consider Phlebas and thought it ok, and read Excession after rave reviews on here, but thought it was crap.

    Been trying to read more sci-fi this year though. Neal Asher was fun, and I finally read the Foundation trilogy.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 43,625
    edited May 2020
    rcs1000 said:

    eadric said:
    And if you want, you can earn 7% if you lend money to the Spanish government for 10 years.

    That's not 7% a year.

    That's 7% over 10 years. That's 0.7%.

    If you were to buy Microsoft shares, by contrast, you'd get almost twice the yield.
    Buy Tesla instead.

    This message was not approved by -

    image
  • QuincelQuincel Posts: 3,949
    edited May 2020
    rcs1000 said:

    eadric said:
    And if you want, you can earn 7% if you lend money to the Spanish government for 10 years.

    That's not 7% a year.

    That's 7% over 10 years. That's 0.7%.

    If you were to buy Microsoft shares, by contrast, you'd get almost twice the yield.
    Rather atrociously there's also almost 7% return in just 3 months if you bet against the Dem Nominee being Hillary Clinton!


  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,774
    For an off the wall - but far from impossible - Biden VP pick, how about:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keisha_Lance_Bottoms
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408

    It is interesting how virtually non of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 98k, it would be front and centre.

    'Target reached but with some spin' being the most negative possible approach would not make for a particularly effective headline. If genuine skuldeggery exists it will be 'Minister lied about 100k' so since that has not occurred, I presume, it obviously hasn't unravelled as a story yet.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,774
    Quincel said:

    rcs1000 said:

    eadric said:
    And if you want, you can earn 7% if you lend money to the Spanish government for 10 years.

    That's not 7% a year.

    That's 7% over 10 years. That's 0.7%.

    If you were to buy Microsoft shares, by contrast, you'd get almost twice the yield.
    Rather atrociously there's also almost 7% return in just 3 months if you bet against the Dem Nominee being Hillary Clinton!


    So, 7% in ten years with Spanish government bonds... or 7% in three months betting against Hillary.

    The crazy bit is that the Hillary bet is far, far more certain.
  • QuincelQuincel Posts: 3,949
    rcs1000 said:

    For an off the wall - but far from impossible - Biden VP pick, how about:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keisha_Lance_Bottoms

    Not the craziest idea, but I think she's rightly a big outsider. Hard to argue she's ready to be one heartbeat away from the Presidency.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,153
    kle4 said:

    Carnyx said:

    kle4 said:

    If people are looking for something more terrifying than our current grim circumstances to serve as a distraction, they could do worse than this book I'm currently reading - not content with being post apocalyptic, it's post apocalyptic sci fi with giant, sentient spiders. Cheery.

    OH, what is it? I'm on Banks's Algebraist myself - giant, sentient planktike echinoderm-analogues.
    Children of Time by Adrian Tchaikovsky. It might well turn out to be a hopeful story, but I just loved how the reference on the back to 'mankind's worst nightmare' was not, as I thought, mere colourful language.

    Have to admit I've never gotten into Banks. I read Consider Phlebas and thought it ok, and read Excession after rave reviews on here, but thought it was crap.

    Been trying to read more sci-fi this year though. Neal Asher was fun, and I finally read the Foundation trilogy.
    Ah! Thank you. Duly noted to acquire. Haven't tried Tchaikovsky - I do like Banks myself, just personal taste I suppose!
  • kle4 said:

    It is interesting how virtually non of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 98k, it would be front and centre.

    'Target reached but with some spin' being the most negative possible approach would not make for a particularly effective headline. If genuine skuldeggery exists it will be 'Minister lied about 100k' so since that has not occurred, I presume, it obviously hasn't unravelled as a story yet.
    https://twitter.com/afneil/status/1256274736243453954?s=20
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,774
    Quincel said:

    rcs1000 said:

    For an off the wall - but far from impossible - Biden VP pick, how about:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keisha_Lance_Bottoms

    Not the craziest idea, but I think she's rightly a big outsider. Hard to argue she's ready to be one heartbeat away from the Presidency.
    She does, however, have a lot more experience than Stacey Abrams, who is one of the favourites.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    kle4 said:

    It is interesting how virtually non of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 98k, it would be front and centre.

    'Target reached but with some spin' being the most negative possible approach would not make for a particularly effective headline. If genuine skuldeggery exists it will be 'Minister lied about 100k' so since that has not occurred, I presume, it obviously hasn't unravelled as a story yet.
    This lot would bury D-Day from the front pages, leading instead with Maureen from Margate is complaining there is a shortage of Spam in this week's rations and there is a dance planned in village halls for two weeks time.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 43,625
    kle4 said:

    Carnyx said:

    kle4 said:

    If people are looking for something more terrifying than our current grim circumstances to serve as a distraction, they could do worse than this book I'm currently reading - not content with being post apocalyptic, it's post apocalyptic sci fi with giant, sentient spiders. Cheery.

    OH, what is it? I'm on Banks's Algebraist myself - giant, sentient planktike echinoderm-analogues.
    Children of Time by Adrian Tchaikovsky. It might well turn out to be a hopeful story, but I just loved how the reference on the back to 'mankind's worst nightmare' was not, as I thought, mere colourful language.

    Have to admit I've never gotten into Banks. I read Consider Phlebas and thought it ok, and read Excession after rave reviews on here, but thought it was crap.

    Been trying to read more sci-fi this year though. Neal Asher was fun, and I finally read the Foundation trilogy.
    Banks is tough to get into - and rather un-even. Use of Weapons is a fascinating construction, though.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408

    kle4 said:

    It is interesting how virtually non of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 98k, it would be front and centre.

    'Target reached but with some spin' being the most negative possible approach would not make for a particularly effective headline. If genuine skuldeggery exists it will be 'Minister lied about 100k' so since that has not occurred, I presume, it obviously hasn't unravelled as a story yet.
    https://twitter.com/afneil/status/1256274736243453954?s=20
    I said 'yet'. I'm pretty unmoved. I didn't think they'd even get close, and take out the caveating and its still a large increase, and it's only a political wonk disagreement between government and opposition over spin.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited May 2020

    kle4 said:

    It is interesting how virtually non of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 98k, it would be front and centre.

    'Target reached but with some spin' being the most negative possible approach would not make for a particularly effective headline. If genuine skuldeggery exists it will be 'Minister lied about 100k' so since that has not occurred, I presume, it obviously hasn't unravelled as a story yet.
    https://twitter.com/afneil/status/1256274736243453954?s=20
    The 100k people thing is based on one tweet that looks like a mistake. The official website on the day of the announcement and the man himself said 100k tests...

    https://twitter.com/RockboltG/status/1256276939800752139?s=20

    The whole you did people twice is also horseshit, that happens every day and is a good thing. Trying to make it sound like it was a cunning plan just for today is totally disingenuous.

    Disappointing from Neil. He is normally straight shooter. The jiggery-pokery with home tests is a fair comment, but still gets you up to 80-90k, which I think is fine in terms of the target, but 122k is spin.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941

    It is interesting how virtually none of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 90k, it would be front and centre, as a massive failure, heads must roll, etc etc etc.

    Regardless of some jiggery-pokery, clearly a lot of people have worked really hard on ramping up the testing capacity. From the army squaddies to the lab tech, etc. They at least deserve a bit of bloody credit.

    It's well established they are only out for gotcha moments. Who cares about reporting good news?
  • ExiledInScotlandExiledInScotland Posts: 1,501

    rcs1000 said:

    eadric said:
    And if you want, you can earn 7% if you lend money to the Spanish government for 10 years.

    That's not 7% a year.

    That's 7% over 10 years. That's 0.7%.

    If you were to buy Microsoft shares, by contrast, you'd get almost twice the yield.
    Buy Tesla instead.

    This message was not approved by -

    image
    I would never buy shares in a firm where he has a Twitter account (see tonight: Elon Musk tweet wipes $14bn off Tesla's value https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52504187)

    However he is the closest thing we have to a modern Isembard Kingdom Brunel.

  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,281

    kle4 said:

    It is interesting how virtually non of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 98k, it would be front and centre.

    'Target reached but with some spin' being the most negative possible approach would not make for a particularly effective headline. If genuine skuldeggery exists it will be 'Minister lied about 100k' so since that has not occurred, I presume, it obviously hasn't unravelled as a story yet.
    https://twitter.com/afneil/status/1256274736243453954?s=20
    Jeez - those cynical Guardianista journos eh?
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,603

    It is interesting how virtually none of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 90k, it would be front and centre, as a massive failure, heads must roll, etc etc etc.

    Regardless of some jiggery-pokery, clearly a lot of people have worked really hard on ramping up the testing capacity. From the army squaddies to the lab tech, etc. They at least deserve a bit of bloody credit.

    Papers and media bitter about not having a story for the weekend.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    MaxPB said:

    It is interesting how virtually none of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 90k, it would be front and centre, as a massive failure, heads must roll, etc etc etc.

    Regardless of some jiggery-pokery, clearly a lot of people have worked really hard on ramping up the testing capacity. From the army squaddies to the lab tech, etc. They at least deserve a bit of bloody credit.

    Papers and media bitter about not having a story for the weekend.
    Probably hoping for a big spike in deaths now.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941

    kle4 said:

    It is interesting how virtually non of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 98k, it would be front and centre.

    'Target reached but with some spin' being the most negative possible approach would not make for a particularly effective headline. If genuine skuldeggery exists it will be 'Minister lied about 100k' so since that has not occurred, I presume, it obviously hasn't unravelled as a story yet.
    https://twitter.com/afneil/status/1256274736243453954?s=20
    Jeez - those cynical Guardianista journos eh?
    He's wrong, it was always tests not people.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited May 2020

    kle4 said:

    It is interesting how virtually non of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 98k, it would be front and centre.

    'Target reached but with some spin' being the most negative possible approach would not make for a particularly effective headline. If genuine skuldeggery exists it will be 'Minister lied about 100k' so since that has not occurred, I presume, it obviously hasn't unravelled as a story yet.
    https://twitter.com/afneil/status/1256274736243453954?s=20
    Jeez - those cynical Guardianista journos eh?
    Neil's spin is even worse than Hancock's. He knows if he checked the footage / website he said tests, and testing people multiple times is totally normal procedure and happens every day.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408

    kle4 said:

    It is interesting how virtually non of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 98k, it would be front and centre.

    'Target reached but with some spin' being the most negative possible approach would not make for a particularly effective headline. If genuine skuldeggery exists it will be 'Minister lied about 100k' so since that has not occurred, I presume, it obviously hasn't unravelled as a story yet.
    https://twitter.com/afneil/status/1256274736243453954?s=20
    Jeez - those cynical Guardianista journos eh?
    Don't jest, it'll be one of those great 'people who usually love to praise/complain about X will suddenly criticise/like them' moments

    Anyway, pleasant dreams all. I think I'll have to distract from thoughts of sentient spiders by further adventures of Richard Sharpe in the Penninsula, nothing horrifying went on there.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 11,059
    kle4 said:

    Carnyx said:

    kle4 said:

    If people are looking for something more terrifying than our current grim circumstances to serve as a distraction, they could do worse than this book I'm currently reading - not content with being post apocalyptic, it's post apocalyptic sci fi with giant, sentient spiders. Cheery.

    OH, what is it? I'm on Banks's Algebraist myself - giant, sentient planktike echinoderm-analogues.
    Children of Time by Adrian Tchaikovsky. It might well turn out to be a hopeful story, but I just loved how the reference on the back to 'mankind's worst nightmare' was not, as I thought, mere colourful language.

    Have to admit I've never gotten into Banks. I read Consider Phlebas and thought it ok, and read Excession after rave reviews on here, but thought it was crap.

    Been trying to read more sci-fi this year though. Neal Asher was fun, and I finally read the Foundation trilogy.
    I'm trying to read all of these - https://faroutmagazine.co.uk/david-bowie-100-favourite-books-ever/
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    MaxPB said:

    It is interesting how virtually none of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 90k, it would be front and centre, as a massive failure, heads must roll, etc etc etc.

    Regardless of some jiggery-pokery, clearly a lot of people have worked really hard on ramping up the testing capacity. From the army squaddies to the lab tech, etc. They at least deserve a bit of bloody credit.

    Papers and media bitter about not having a story for the weekend.
    I am sure with a weekend there will be a dip, so then it will be two days of see the government lied, yadda yadda yadda.

    The genuine test for this is next week. If they can't keep up the 100k, then it is going to look suspect.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 49,961
    rcs1000 said:

    For an off the wall - but far from impossible - Biden VP pick, how about:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keisha_Lance_Bottoms

    Cue TSE with his Minions gif.....
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 47,789
    RobD said:

    kle4 said:

    It is interesting how virtually non of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 98k, it would be front and centre.

    'Target reached but with some spin' being the most negative possible approach would not make for a particularly effective headline. If genuine skuldeggery exists it will be 'Minister lied about 100k' so since that has not occurred, I presume, it obviously hasn't unravelled as a story yet.
    https://twitter.com/afneil/status/1256274736243453954?s=20
    Jeez - those cynical Guardianista journos eh?
    He's wrong, it was always tests not people.
    https://twitter.com/10DowningStreet/status/1246710511053475840
  • kle4 said:

    kle4 said:

    It is interesting how virtually non of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 98k, it would be front and centre.

    'Target reached but with some spin' being the most negative possible approach would not make for a particularly effective headline. If genuine skuldeggery exists it will be 'Minister lied about 100k' so since that has not occurred, I presume, it obviously hasn't unravelled as a story yet.
    https://twitter.com/afneil/status/1256274736243453954?s=20
    I said 'yet'. I'm pretty unmoved. I didn't think they'd even get close, and take out the caveating and its still a large increase, and it's only a political wonk disagreement between government and opposition over spin.
    Yes, it was a bit dumb and entirely unnecessary. Probably doesn't do much good, but not much bad either.

    What will happen on the ground will depend on the overall concept and its implementation.

    Dishing tests out that liberally might backfire a little bit in a week or so, when the tests are back. There's a chance that new cases found might jump from 6k/day into five figure territory. People will ask questions, other people will scream that the stupid, evil and corrupt journos need to be silenced.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    DougSeal said:

    kle4 said:

    Carnyx said:

    kle4 said:

    If people are looking for something more terrifying than our current grim circumstances to serve as a distraction, they could do worse than this book I'm currently reading - not content with being post apocalyptic, it's post apocalyptic sci fi with giant, sentient spiders. Cheery.

    OH, what is it? I'm on Banks's Algebraist myself - giant, sentient planktike echinoderm-analogues.
    Children of Time by Adrian Tchaikovsky. It might well turn out to be a hopeful story, but I just loved how the reference on the back to 'mankind's worst nightmare' was not, as I thought, mere colourful language.

    Have to admit I've never gotten into Banks. I read Consider Phlebas and thought it ok, and read Excession after rave reviews on here, but thought it was crap.

    Been trying to read more sci-fi this year though. Neal Asher was fun, and I finally read the Foundation trilogy.
    I'm trying to read all of these - https://faroutmagazine.co.uk/david-bowie-100-favourite-books-ever/
    Hope you've allotted plenty of time! It's an...interesting list.

    I cannot even imagine trying to list my 100 favourite books. I'd certainly end up putting large numbers from a few authors in there.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 11,059
    kle4 said:

    DougSeal said:

    kle4 said:

    Carnyx said:

    kle4 said:

    If people are looking for something more terrifying than our current grim circumstances to serve as a distraction, they could do worse than this book I'm currently reading - not content with being post apocalyptic, it's post apocalyptic sci fi with giant, sentient spiders. Cheery.

    OH, what is it? I'm on Banks's Algebraist myself - giant, sentient planktike echinoderm-analogues.
    Children of Time by Adrian Tchaikovsky. It might well turn out to be a hopeful story, but I just loved how the reference on the back to 'mankind's worst nightmare' was not, as I thought, mere colourful language.

    Have to admit I've never gotten into Banks. I read Consider Phlebas and thought it ok, and read Excession after rave reviews on here, but thought it was crap.

    Been trying to read more sci-fi this year though. Neal Asher was fun, and I finally read the Foundation trilogy.
    I'm trying to read all of these - https://faroutmagazine.co.uk/david-bowie-100-favourite-books-ever/
    Hope you've allotted plenty of time! It's an...interesting list.

    I cannot even imagine trying to list my 100 favourite books. I'd certainly end up putting large numbers from a few authors in there.
    I'm about a third of the way through. Some I had read before I started...including Viz!
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 49,961
    The media have spent today looking en masse like surly teenage kids, discovering that their Christmas presents did come from Santa after all.

    "WTAF??? That can't be right...."
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited May 2020

    RobD said:

    kle4 said:

    It is interesting how virtually non of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 98k, it would be front and centre.

    'Target reached but with some spin' being the most negative possible approach would not make for a particularly effective headline. If genuine skuldeggery exists it will be 'Minister lied about 100k' so since that has not occurred, I presume, it obviously hasn't unravelled as a story yet.
    https://twitter.com/afneil/status/1256274736243453954?s=20
    Jeez - those cynical Guardianista journos eh?
    He's wrong, it was always tests not people.
    twitter.com/10DowningStreet/status/1246710511053475840
    Here is the official website (and I have checked using wayback machine, the claim hasn't been altered since it was published).

    The UK will carry out 100,000 tests for coronavirus every day by the end of this month, Health Secretary Matt Hancock pledged today.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/news/health-secretary-sets-out-plan-to-carry-out-100000-coronavirus-tests-a-day

    Its odd how the media don't seem to be able to find this website or the actual footage of Hancock speaking, but can find one incorrect tweet. Fact checking, hey....
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 47,789
    "David Icke says Nicola Sturgeon is too "moronic" to grasp truth about Covid-19"

    https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/18421834.david-icke-says-nicola-sturgeon-moronic-grasp-truth-covid-19/

    The conspiracy theorist David Icke has claimed Scotland's First Minister Nicola Sturgeon "lacks the brainpower" to understand the coronavirus pandemic is part of a megalomaniacal global elite's secret plan for world domination.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842
    Tesla is a great stock to have bought a while back, even at $420. But it is overvalued on fundamentals.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941

    RobD said:

    kle4 said:

    It is interesting how virtually non of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 98k, it would be front and centre.

    'Target reached but with some spin' being the most negative possible approach would not make for a particularly effective headline. If genuine skuldeggery exists it will be 'Minister lied about 100k' so since that has not occurred, I presume, it obviously hasn't unravelled as a story yet.
    https://twitter.com/afneil/status/1256274736243453954?s=20
    Jeez - those cynical Guardianista journos eh?
    He's wrong, it was always tests not people.
    https://twitter.com/10DowningStreet/status/1246710511053475840
    That tweet is simply wrong. Watch the press conference where it was announced.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,281
    edited May 2020
    I'm defintely not a supporter of this government in general but credit to Hancock & co for delivering on the 100k test commitment. Just by making the commitment they have upped the test numbers.

    In my career I always found the way to achieve the maximum was to set an ambitious target and challenge everyone involved to find ways to meet it. There's a time and place for the 'under-promise and over-deliver' approach but this is neither the time nor the place.
  • novanova Posts: 525

    It is interesting how virtually none of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 90k, it would be front and centre, as a massive failure, heads must roll, etc etc etc.

    Regardless of some jiggery-pokery, clearly a lot of people have worked really hard on ramping up the testing capacity. From the army squaddies to the lab tech, etc. They at least deserve a bit of bloody credit.

    Given how fast it's ramped up over the last week, I think if he'd just been honest and announced the actual figure, alongside how much is in the pipeline, it would be accepted - but which newspaper is going to splash on that, now we know it's a daft fudge.

    Saying 100k and only hitting 50k with no obvious way to increase is a headline, but not what they've actually achieved. Bizarrely, pretending that you've hit the target, when you'll actually hit it within days looks much worse. Can't understand the thinking behind it at all.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408

    "David Icke says Nicola Sturgeon is too "moronic" to grasp truth about Covid-19"

    https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/18421834.david-icke-says-nicola-sturgeon-moronic-grasp-truth-covid-19/

    The conspiracy theorist David Icke has claimed Scotland's First Minister Nicola Sturgeon "lacks the brainpower" to understand the coronavirus pandemic is part of a megalomaniacal global elite's secret plan for world domination.

    I'm with her on that one - I thought the elite had already successfully enacted their plan for world domination decades ago.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited May 2020

    I'm defintely not a supporter of this government in general but credit to Hancock & co for delivering on the 100k test commitment. Just by making the commitment they have upped the test numbers.

    In my career I always found the way to achieve the maximum was to set an ambitious target and challenge everyone involved to find ways to meet it. There's a time and place for the 'under-promise and over-deliver' approach but this is neither the time nor the place.

    If only Wales and Scotland had upped their game as well....This can't continue. Wales ditched their 5k target really quickly, they just threw in the towel, yet not a word of criticism.

    To get out of lockdown, they have to start doing this. If they are struggling with capacity etc, they need to ask for help.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,286

    "David Icke says Nicola Sturgeon is too "moronic" to grasp truth about Covid-19"

    https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/18421834.david-icke-says-nicola-sturgeon-moronic-grasp-truth-covid-19/

    The conspiracy theorist David Icke has claimed Scotland's First Minister Nicola Sturgeon "lacks the brainpower" to understand the coronavirus pandemic is part of a megalomaniacal global elite's secret plan for world domination.

    David Icke was banned from Facebook earlier today.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,756
    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    kle4 said:

    It is interesting how virtually non of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 98k, it would be front and centre.

    'Target reached but with some spin' being the most negative possible approach would not make for a particularly effective headline. If genuine skuldeggery exists it will be 'Minister lied about 100k' so since that has not occurred, I presume, it obviously hasn't unravelled as a story yet.
    https://twitter.com/afneil/status/1256274736243453954?s=20
    Jeez - those cynical Guardianista journos eh?
    He's wrong, it was always tests not people.
    https://twitter.com/10DowningStreet/status/1246710511053475840
    That tweet is simply wrong. Watch the press conference where it was announced.
    The UK pm and Andra Neil are wrong?

    The foundations of PB Torydom are quivering.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited May 2020
    nova said:

    It is interesting how virtually none of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 90k, it would be front and centre, as a massive failure, heads must roll, etc etc etc.

    Regardless of some jiggery-pokery, clearly a lot of people have worked really hard on ramping up the testing capacity. From the army squaddies to the lab tech, etc. They at least deserve a bit of bloody credit.

    Given how fast it's ramped up over the last week, I think if he'd just been honest and announced the actual figure, alongside how much is in the pipeline, it would be accepted - but which newspaper is going to splash on that, now we know it's a daft fudge.

    Saying 100k and only hitting 50k with no obvious way to increase is a headline, but not what they've actually achieved. Bizarrely, pretending that you've hit the target, when you'll actually hit it within days looks much worse. Can't understand the thinking behind it at all.
    Personally I would have just announced the 80-90k figure. The problem is we have this ridiculous stand-off, the government have pissed off the media and the media are just in constant gotcha mode.

    This disingenuous false claim that it was 100k people (when 2 sec google search shows you it wasn't) and trying to make it sound like testing people multiple times in a day is so new sneaky shit way of boosting numbers (when in fact we haven't been doing it enough).

    Given that you can see why Hancock has spun his number.
  • TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052

    "David Icke says Nicola Sturgeon is too "moronic" to grasp truth about Covid-19"

    https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/18421834.david-icke-says-nicola-sturgeon-moronic-grasp-truth-covid-19/

    The conspiracy theorist David Icke has claimed Scotland's First Minister Nicola Sturgeon "lacks the brainpower" to understand the coronavirus pandemic is part of a megalomaniacal global elite's secret plan for world domination.

    A broken clock is right twice a day.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,286
    "The government is facing a challenge to the legality of the coronavirus lockdown by a wealthy businessman who fears it will kill more people than it saves.

    Simon Dolan, whose Jota Aviation company has been delivering personal protective equipment (PPE) to the NHS, has put the health secretary on notice that he intends to issue proceedings for a judicial review, unless the government reverses some of the lockdown measures and reinstates freedom of movement."

    https://www.theguardian.com/law/2020/may/01/uk-government-faces-legal-challenge-coronavirus-lockdown-businessman-simon-dolan
  • not_on_firenot_on_fire Posts: 4,340
    rcs1000 said:

    For an off the wall - but far from impossible - Biden VP pick, how about:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keisha_Lance_Bottoms

    Imagine if w’d had a Buttigieg-Bottoms ticket
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,047

    nova said:

    It is interesting how virtually none of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 90k, it would be front and centre, as a massive failure, heads must roll, etc etc etc.

    Regardless of some jiggery-pokery, clearly a lot of people have worked really hard on ramping up the testing capacity. From the army squaddies to the lab tech, etc. They at least deserve a bit of bloody credit.

    Given how fast it's ramped up over the last week, I think if he'd just been honest and announced the actual figure, alongside how much is in the pipeline, it would be accepted - but which newspaper is going to splash on that, now we know it's a daft fudge.

    Saying 100k and only hitting 50k with no obvious way to increase is a headline, but not what they've actually achieved. Bizarrely, pretending that you've hit the target, when you'll actually hit it within days looks much worse. Can't understand the thinking behind it at all.
    Personally I would have just announced the 80-90k figure. The problem is we have this ridiculous stand-off, the government have pissed off the media and the media are just in constant gotcha mode.

    This disingenuous false claim that it was 100k people (when 2 sec google search shows you it wasn't) and trying to make it sound like testing people multiple times in a day is so new sneaky shit way of boosting numbers (when in fact we haven't been doing it enough).

    Given that you can see why Hancock has spun his number.
    He should have done as you suggested. We like a tryer. A nearly got there failure would probably have gone down better than a success - especially followed up by a 'but look, we've sent out all these extra tests, so if you count those...'.

    At any rate, it is good that we are testing so much more.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited May 2020
    Andy_JS said:

    "The government is facing a challenge to the legality of the coronavirus lockdown by a wealthy businessman who fears it will kill more people than it saves.

    Simon Dolan, whose Jota Aviation company has been delivering personal protective equipment (PPE) to the NHS, has put the health secretary on notice that he intends to issue proceedings for a judicial review, unless the government reverses some of the lockdown measures and reinstates freedom of movement."

    https://www.theguardian.com/law/2020/may/01/uk-government-faces-legal-challenge-coronavirus-lockdown-businessman-simon-dolan

    Wait until they find out about what information the tracking app collects....
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,603

    MaxPB said:

    It is interesting how virtually none of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 90k, it would be front and centre, as a massive failure, heads must roll, etc etc etc.

    Regardless of some jiggery-pokery, clearly a lot of people have worked really hard on ramping up the testing capacity. From the army squaddies to the lab tech, etc. They at least deserve a bit of bloody credit.

    Papers and media bitter about not having a story for the weekend.
    I am sure with a weekend there will be a dip, so then it will be two days of see the government lied, yadda yadda yadda.

    The genuine test for this is next week. If they can't keep up the 100k, then it is going to look suspect.
    Going by the Times article from this afternoon they want to be at 200k by the end of next week so I doubt there will be any drop off. All of the postal obsessives are going to be feeling stupid by Tuesday when we see 140-150k sustained.
  • Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905
    Nit-picking over whether or not the 100k target was fully achieved, reached by fiddling the numbers or only just missed is a largely futile exercise. The thing to look out for, until such time as the authorities hopefully put a lid on this damned disease, is the numbers of tests continuing to increase.

    If it's up to 200k or 250k a day in a weeks' time then the original target will be quickly forgotten. If, on the other hand, it stalls, well...
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    Most of the people questioning the 100k claim, are probably the same people arguing that it was a meaningless/pointless pledge in the first place. The latter which i instinctively agree with, although i suppose it could be said that whilst the value of the 100k tests at present is minimal, and ultimately just a PR thing, the knock on effect of demonstrating the ability to conduct mass testing is important. Having demonstrated the capacity, the challenge shouldn't necessarily be to increase the numbers further, but rather to target the testing more effectively.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,281
    edited May 2020
    From the daily .gov update:

    "Pillar 4 [testing]: serology and swab testing: a national surveillance programme supported by PHE, ONS and Biobank to learn more about the prevalence and spread of the virus"

    Pillar 4 cumulative tests = 12,771. Pillar 4 positive tests = 0 (zilch, none)

    So much for all those asymptomatic cases then.

    https://www.gov.uk/guidance/coronavirus-covid-19-information-for-the-public
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited May 2020
    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    It is interesting how virtually none of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 90k, it would be front and centre, as a massive failure, heads must roll, etc etc etc.

    Regardless of some jiggery-pokery, clearly a lot of people have worked really hard on ramping up the testing capacity. From the army squaddies to the lab tech, etc. They at least deserve a bit of bloody credit.

    Papers and media bitter about not having a story for the weekend.
    I am sure with a weekend there will be a dip, so then it will be two days of see the government lied, yadda yadda yadda.

    The genuine test for this is next week. If they can't keep up the 100k, then it is going to look suspect.
    Going by the Times article from this afternoon they want to be at 200k by the end of next week so I doubt there will be any drop off. All of the postal obsessives are going to be feeling stupid by Tuesday when we see 140-150k sustained.
    What I find most disturbing about the whole coronavirus coverage is just how the media keep getting factual information wrong. No issue with people saying, ok I looked at this data and my politician view of the world says, what we need to do is e.g. Guardian saying more money to poor areas to improve health.

    But for weeks we keep getting absolute horse crap, stuff you can check in 2 seconds. The death numbers, the PPE delboys, Prof Peston bollocks on chemicals, this "100k people", Times story claiming an academic was present at a meeting and said he disagreed (and he wasn't there and didn't say anything of the sort).

    It is just f##king basic fact checking. At a time when disseminating correct information is crucial, they have more incompetent than the government.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,047

    rcs1000 said:

    For an off the wall - but far from impossible - Biden VP pick, how about:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keisha_Lance_Bottoms

    Imagine if w’d had a Buttigieg-Bottoms ticket
    Quite who thought it was a clever idea to double-barrel the word 'lance' with the word 'bottoms' is unfathomable.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,756

    rcs1000 said:

    For an off the wall - but far from impossible - Biden VP pick, how about:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keisha_Lance_Bottoms

    Imagine if w’d had a Buttigieg-Bottoms ticket
    Do the Yanks have an equivalent to our 2 cheeks of the same arse?
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518

    Andy_JS said:

    "The government is facing a challenge to the legality of the coronavirus lockdown by a wealthy businessman who fears it will kill more people than it saves.

    Simon Dolan, whose Jota Aviation company has been delivering personal protective equipment (PPE) to the NHS, has put the health secretary on notice that he intends to issue proceedings for a judicial review, unless the government reverses some of the lockdown measures and reinstates freedom of movement."

    https://www.theguardian.com/law/2020/may/01/uk-government-faces-legal-challenge-coronavirus-lockdown-businessman-simon-dolan

    Wait until they find out about what information the tracking app collects....
    The cynic might suggest that his company has a vested interest in lockdown measures being loosened, leading to increases in infection and greater demand on the NHS. Bonus if loosening the lockdown leads to additional shortages due to revised govt guidance on wearing masks etc.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 43,625

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    It is interesting how virtually none of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 90k, it would be front and centre, as a massive failure, heads must roll, etc etc etc.

    Regardless of some jiggery-pokery, clearly a lot of people have worked really hard on ramping up the testing capacity. From the army squaddies to the lab tech, etc. They at least deserve a bit of bloody credit.

    Papers and media bitter about not having a story for the weekend.
    I am sure with a weekend there will be a dip, so then it will be two days of see the government lied, yadda yadda yadda.

    The genuine test for this is next week. If they can't keep up the 100k, then it is going to look suspect.
    Going by the Times article from this afternoon they want to be at 200k by the end of next week so I doubt there will be any drop off. All of the postal obsessives are going to be feeling stupid by Tuesday when we see 140-150k sustained.
    What I find most disturbing about the whole coronavirus coverage is just how the media keep getting factual information wrong. No issue with people saying, ok I looked at this data and my politician view of the world says, what we need to do is e.g. Guardian saying more money to poor areas to improve health.

    But for weeks we keep getting absolute horse crap, stuff you can check in 2 seconds. The death numbers, the PPE delboys, Prof Peston bollocks on chemicals, this "100k people", Times story claiming an academic was present at a meeting and said he disagreed (and he wasn't there and didn't say anything of the sort).

    It is just f##king basic fact checking.
    At CNN they actually called checking stories to find out they weren't true and hence unusable - "F^&king the story".

    After you hear that, what are you surprised by?
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518

    "David Icke says Nicola Sturgeon is too "moronic" to grasp truth about Covid-19"

    https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/18421834.david-icke-says-nicola-sturgeon-moronic-grasp-truth-covid-19/

    The conspiracy theorist David Icke has claimed Scotland's First Minister Nicola Sturgeon "lacks the brainpower" to understand the coronavirus pandemic is part of a megalomaniacal global elite's secret plan for world domination.


    Surely the whole point of a global elite is that they already hold effective world domination. They wouldn't be much of an elite if they didn't.

  • isamisam Posts: 40,731
    edited May 2020
    Check out the get up Cummings is sporting in Downing St yesterday! I have no big opinion on him one way or the other, but other countries must think we are way leftfield to have someone looking like that at the heart of the government’s operation



    Slightly strange story too

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8256109/Social-distancing-two-metres-apart-based-figure-says-government-adviser.html
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,281
    TGOHF666 said:

    "David Icke says Nicola Sturgeon is too "moronic" to grasp truth about Covid-19"

    https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/18421834.david-icke-says-nicola-sturgeon-moronic-grasp-truth-covid-19/

    The conspiracy theorist David Icke has claimed Scotland's First Minister Nicola Sturgeon "lacks the brainpower" to understand the coronavirus pandemic is part of a megalomaniacal global elite's secret plan for world domination.

    A broken clock is right twice a day.
    A broken digital clock isn't. Just saying.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,774
    alex_ said:

    "David Icke says Nicola Sturgeon is too "moronic" to grasp truth about Covid-19"

    https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/18421834.david-icke-says-nicola-sturgeon-moronic-grasp-truth-covid-19/

    The conspiracy theorist David Icke has claimed Scotland's First Minister Nicola Sturgeon "lacks the brainpower" to understand the coronavirus pandemic is part of a megalomaniacal global elite's secret plan for world domination.


    Surely the whole point of a global elite is that they already hold effective world domination. They wouldn't be much of an elite if they didn't.

    The really smart bit about the global elite is how they actually told David Icke about their plans. In this way, a completely deranged idiot that no-one will take seriously spreads the story, thus discrediting it.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820

    From the daily .gov update:

    "Pillar 4 [testing]: serology and swab testing: a national surveillance programme supported by PHE, ONS and Biobank to learn more about the prevalence and spread of the virus"

    Pillar 4 cumulative tests = 12,771. Pillar 4 positive tests = 0 (zilch, none)

    So much for all those asymptomatic cases then.

    https://www.gov.uk/guidance/coronavirus-covid-19-information-for-the-public

    I'm not sure that you can draw that conclusion, I think it's more likely that they are not (yet?) reporting the Pillar 4 results because they are still work in progress. IANAE, however.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    It is interesting how virtually none of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 90k, it would be front and centre, as a massive failure, heads must roll, etc etc etc.

    Regardless of some jiggery-pokery, clearly a lot of people have worked really hard on ramping up the testing capacity. From the army squaddies to the lab tech, etc. They at least deserve a bit of bloody credit.

    Papers and media bitter about not having a story for the weekend.
    I am sure with a weekend there will be a dip, so then it will be two days of see the government lied, yadda yadda yadda.

    The genuine test for this is next week. If they can't keep up the 100k, then it is going to look suspect.
    Going by the Times article from this afternoon they want to be at 200k by the end of next week so I doubt there will be any drop off. All of the postal obsessives are going to be feeling stupid by Tuesday when we see 140-150k sustained.
    What I find most disturbing about the whole coronavirus coverage is just how the media keep getting factual information wrong. No issue with people saying, ok I looked at this data and my politician view of the world says, what we need to do is e.g. Guardian saying more money to poor areas to improve health.

    But for weeks we keep getting absolute horse crap, stuff you can check in 2 seconds. The death numbers, the PPE delboys, Prof Peston bollocks on chemicals, this "100k people", Times story claiming an academic was present at a meeting and said he disagreed (and he wasn't there and didn't say anything of the sort).

    It is just f##king basic fact checking. At a time when disseminating correct information is crucial, they have more incompetent than the government.
    Whether their analysis was correct or not, why the hell were the IFS all over the news this morning for some study they had apparently done on effect of Coronavirus on BAME communities? Obviously all quoting them as "well respected". What does being "well respected" in their specialist field have to do with analysis of Coronavirus??? Why were they even conducting such an analysis?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    Andy_JS said:

    "The government is facing a challenge to the legality of the coronavirus lockdown by a wealthy businessman who fears it will kill more people than it saves.

    Simon Dolan, whose Jota Aviation company has been delivering personal protective equipment (PPE) to the NHS, has put the health secretary on notice that he intends to issue proceedings for a judicial review, unless the government reverses some of the lockdown measures and reinstates freedom of movement."

    https://www.theguardian.com/law/2020/may/01/uk-government-faces-legal-challenge-coronavirus-lockdown-businessman-simon-dolan

    Given how sweeping the Coronavirus Act is I'd think it difficult to prove the government has acted unlawfully.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842

    From the daily .gov update:

    "Pillar 4 [testing]: serology and swab testing: a national surveillance programme supported by PHE, ONS and Biobank to learn more about the prevalence and spread of the virus"

    Pillar 4 cumulative tests = 12,771. Pillar 4 positive tests = 0 (zilch, none)

    So much for all those asymptomatic cases then.

    https://www.gov.uk/guidance/coronavirus-covid-19-information-for-the-public

    I'm not sure it's zero amongst the population, I think it means the results aren't back perhaps ?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited May 2020
    isam said:

    Check out the get up Cummings is sporting in Downing St yesterday! I have no big opinion on him one way or the other, but other countries must think we are way leftfield to have someone looking like that at the heart of the government’s operation



    Slightly strange story too

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8256109/Social-distancing-two-metres-apart-based-figure-says-government-adviser.html

    If you think that is bad, you should have seen the state of my PhD supervisor....most of the time, he looked worse than a homeless guy, who had rolled around on a chalk board.
  • MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 7,382
    I wonder what Tim Shipman will have this weekend



  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,774

    From the daily .gov update:

    "Pillar 4 [testing]: serology and swab testing: a national surveillance programme supported by PHE, ONS and Biobank to learn more about the prevalence and spread of the virus"

    Pillar 4 cumulative tests = 12,771. Pillar 4 positive tests = 0 (zilch, none)

    So much for all those asymptomatic cases then.

    https://www.gov.uk/guidance/coronavirus-covid-19-information-for-the-public

    That just means all the asymptomatic people are now over it :smile:
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 14,093
    nova said:

    It is interesting how virtually none of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 90k, it would be front and centre, as a massive failure, heads must roll, etc etc etc.

    Regardless of some jiggery-pokery, clearly a lot of people have worked really hard on ramping up the testing capacity. From the army squaddies to the lab tech, etc. They at least deserve a bit of bloody credit.

    Given how fast it's ramped up over the last week, I think if he'd just been honest and announced the actual figure, alongside how much is in the pipeline, it would be accepted - but which newspaper is going to splash on that, now we know it's a daft fudge.

    Saying 100k and only hitting 50k with no obvious way to increase is a headline, but not what they've actually achieved. Bizarrely, pretending that you've hit the target, when you'll actually hit it within days looks much worse. Can't understand the thinking behind it at all.
    Absolutely. It's a real achievement, spoilt by mucking around with spin. Just give the component numbers and let pundits quibble about whether to add them together or not. If you want grim possibilities for the thinking, here are two.

    One is that it's like the "£350 million per week." Even if it's a somewhat dodgy number, it gets people talking. If they question the details, they're broadcasting your talking points and sounding like carping moaners. "Outside the SW1 media bubble, people are just glad that testing is being done so well..."

    The other is that parts of the government are at the "making their own reality" stage of things.

    The fact that one can't automatically dismiss either of these possibilities is a problem in itself.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,165
    isam said:

    Check out the get up Cummings is sporting in Downing St yesterday! I have no big opinion on him one way or the other, but other countries must think we are way leftfield to have someone looking like that at the heart of the government’s operation



    Slightly strange story too

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8256109/Social-distancing-two-metres-apart-based-figure-says-government-adviser.html

    Didn’t he used to take the piss out of Craig Oliver for wearing headphones like that?
  • MyBurningEarsMyBurningEars Posts: 3,651
    edited May 2020

    From the daily .gov update:

    "Pillar 4 [testing]: serology and swab testing: a national surveillance programme supported by PHE, ONS and Biobank to learn more about the prevalence and spread of the virus"

    Pillar 4 cumulative tests = 12,771. Pillar 4 positive tests = 0 (zilch, none)

    So much for all those asymptomatic cases then.

    https://www.gov.uk/guidance/coronavirus-covid-19-information-for-the-public

    That's a misinterpretation of the figures, I believe. Note how it doesn't say zero, it just puts a dash. And similarly for number of people tested, it just puts a dash.

    These are the samples that have been sent to Porton Down. The explanatory text says For serology testing (pillar 4), some protocols allow for samples to be tested repeatedly. Samples are anonymised prior to sending to the lab for testing, therefore the identification of individuals tested is not possible in the current reporting process, and so the number of people tested is not reported.

    In other words, they've taken almost thirteen thousand samples (starting in February, it's not just that these results "aren't back yet") but those samples are going to be subjected to multiple "tests". Partly because they're trying to see if the different tests agree with each other when given a sample from the same source. For that reason, I don't think it makes sense to state the number of "positive test results" for the pillar 4 samples.

    See also https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/878121/coronavirus-covid-19-testing-strategy.pdf
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842
    The latest reports from state media could not be independently confirmed and no pictures were provided.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,774

    I wonder what Tim Shipman will have this weekend



    A kebab?
  • isamisam Posts: 40,731

    TGOHF666 said:

    "David Icke says Nicola Sturgeon is too "moronic" to grasp truth about Covid-19"

    https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/18421834.david-icke-says-nicola-sturgeon-moronic-grasp-truth-covid-19/

    The conspiracy theorist David Icke has claimed Scotland's First Minister Nicola Sturgeon "lacks the brainpower" to understand the coronavirus pandemic is part of a megalomaniacal global elite's secret plan for world domination.

    A broken clock is right twice a day.
    A broken digital clock isn't. Just saying.
    It’s a stopped clock that is right twice a day, not a broken one! But, yes a stopped digital one, if set to the 24hr clock, is only right once a day
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 49,961
    kle4 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "The government is facing a challenge to the legality of the coronavirus lockdown by a wealthy businessman who fears it will kill more people than it saves.

    Simon Dolan, whose Jota Aviation company has been delivering personal protective equipment (PPE) to the NHS, has put the health secretary on notice that he intends to issue proceedings for a judicial review, unless the government reverses some of the lockdown measures and reinstates freedom of movement."

    https://www.theguardian.com/law/2020/may/01/uk-government-faces-legal-challenge-coronavirus-lockdown-businessman-simon-dolan

    Given how sweeping the Coronavirus Act is I'd think it difficult to prove the government has acted unlawfully.
    And how many lives have been saved by the reduction in air pollution during lockdown? 64,000 deaths were attribuatble to it in 2015, says this:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/air-pollution-smoking-deaths-compare-a8818851.html
  • MyBurningEarsMyBurningEars Posts: 3,651
    Re pillar 4, this Telegraph article from a few weeks back is pretty informative I believe: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/science-and-disease/coronavirus-tests-never-heard-hold-key-exit-lockdown/
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    It is interesting how virtually none of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 90k, it would be front and centre, as a massive failure, heads must roll, etc etc etc.

    Regardless of some jiggery-pokery, clearly a lot of people have worked really hard on ramping up the testing capacity. From the army squaddies to the lab tech, etc. They at least deserve a bit of bloody credit.

    Papers and media bitter about not having a story for the weekend.
    I am sure with a weekend there will be a dip, so then it will be two days of see the government lied, yadda yadda yadda.

    The genuine test for this is next week. If they can't keep up the 100k, then it is going to look suspect.
    Going by the Times article from this afternoon they want to be at 200k by the end of next week so I doubt there will be any drop off. All of the postal obsessives are going to be feeling stupid by Tuesday when we see 140-150k sustained.
    What I find most disturbing about the whole coronavirus coverage is just how the media keep getting factual information wrong. No issue with people saying, ok I looked at this data and my politician view of the world says, what we need to do is e.g. Guardian saying more money to poor areas to improve health.

    But for weeks we keep getting absolute horse crap, stuff you can check in 2 seconds. The death numbers, the PPE delboys, Prof Peston bollocks on chemicals, this "100k people", Times story claiming an academic was present at a meeting and said he disagreed (and he wasn't there and didn't say anything of the sort).

    It is just f##king basic fact checking.
    At CNN they actually called checking stories to find out they weren't true and hence unusable - "F^&king the story".

    After you hear that, what are you surprised by?
    Modern "journalism". It's more important to get the story out there, to be shot down if it's wrong, than to only publish based on certain facts. The funny thing is that journalists would probably cite "All the Presidents Men" as an inspirational film, even though the modus operandi is an anaethema to the operation of the media in the present day world. ie. only publish what you can prove, and only give a story prominence when it is both justifying of front page/headline coverage AND the facts stack up.
  • alteregoalterego Posts: 1,100
    Pulpstar said:

    The latest reports from state media could not be independently confirmed and no pictures were provided.
    Not even touched up body doubles? Isn't he supposed to have loads more of these than Churchill had?
  • alteregoalterego Posts: 1,100

    kle4 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "The government is facing a challenge to the legality of the coronavirus lockdown by a wealthy businessman who fears it will kill more people than it saves.

    Simon Dolan, whose Jota Aviation company has been delivering personal protective equipment (PPE) to the NHS, has put the health secretary on notice that he intends to issue proceedings for a judicial review, unless the government reverses some of the lockdown measures and reinstates freedom of movement."

    https://www.theguardian.com/law/2020/may/01/uk-government-faces-legal-challenge-coronavirus-lockdown-businessman-simon-dolan

    Given how sweeping the Coronavirus Act is I'd think it difficult to prove the government has acted unlawfully.
    And how many lives have been saved by the reduction in air pollution during lockdown? 64,000 deaths were attribuatble to it in 2015, says this:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/air-pollution-smoking-deaths-compare-a8818851.html
    I detect the whiff of self interest above all else with the backing of the Grauniad?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    Got to love the Mail....

    ------------
    Main Headline
    ------------

    What a fiddle! Matt Hancock boasts he has hit 100,000-a-day testing target but only if you don't mind counting multiple tests on the same person

    -------------
    Secondary Story
    --------------

    Health Secretary Matt Hancock claims the Government carried out 122,000 tests yesterday but they were done on 73,191 people - so WHY are some people tested more than once?

    Dr Paul Hunter, a medicine lecturer at the University of East Anglia, said it was 'valid' for people to be tested more than once and that tests are not perfect so may have to be repeated.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 48,926
    isam said:



    image
  • Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 4,572
    alex_ said:

    Most of the people questioning the 100k claim, are probably the same people arguing that it was a meaningless/pointless pledge in the first place. The latter which i instinctively agree with, although i suppose it could be said that whilst the value of the 100k tests at present is minimal, and ultimately just a PR thing, the knock on effect of demonstrating the ability to conduct mass testing is important. Having demonstrated the capacity, the challenge shouldn't necessarily be to increase the numbers further, but rather to target the testing more effectively.

    Of the two posts at 11.15 making diametrically opposite points, yours is the one I agree with. Very late in the day, the UK has at last put in place significant testing capacity. Now it's a question of using that capacity in an effective prioritised way within an integrated strategy. Provided that is done, the numbers don't really matter and indeed a focus on increasing the numbers further would probably detract from such prioritisation.
  • alteregoalterego Posts: 1,100
    alex_ said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    It is interesting how virtually none of the front pages are mentioning the 100k tests. Zero credit. I bet if he had announced 90k, it would be front and centre, as a massive failure, heads must roll, etc etc etc.

    Regardless of some jiggery-pokery, clearly a lot of people have worked really hard on ramping up the testing capacity. From the army squaddies to the lab tech, etc. They at least deserve a bit of bloody credit.

    Papers and media bitter about not having a story for the weekend.
    I am sure with a weekend there will be a dip, so then it will be two days of see the government lied, yadda yadda yadda.

    The genuine test for this is next week. If they can't keep up the 100k, then it is going to look suspect.
    Going by the Times article from this afternoon they want to be at 200k by the end of next week so I doubt there will be any drop off. All of the postal obsessives are going to be feeling stupid by Tuesday when we see 140-150k sustained.
    What I find most disturbing about the whole coronavirus coverage is just how the media keep getting factual information wrong. No issue with people saying, ok I looked at this data and my politician view of the world says, what we need to do is e.g. Guardian saying more money to poor areas to improve health.

    But for weeks we keep getting absolute horse crap, stuff you can check in 2 seconds. The death numbers, the PPE delboys, Prof Peston bollocks on chemicals, this "100k people", Times story claiming an academic was present at a meeting and said he disagreed (and he wasn't there and didn't say anything of the sort).

    It is just f##king basic fact checking.
    At CNN they actually called checking stories to find out they weren't true and hence unusable - "F^&king the story".

    After you hear that, what are you surprised by?
    Modern "journalism". It's more important to get the story out there, to be shot down if it's wrong, than to only publish based on certain facts. The funny thing is that journalists would probably cite "All the Presidents Men" as an inspirational film, even though the modus operandi is an anaethema to the operation of the media in the present day world. ie. only publish what you can prove, and only give a story prominence when it is both justifying of front page/headline coverage AND the facts stack up.
    Weren't there polls where Corbyn was much more popular than "journalists"? Everyone understands "me, me, me"
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    edited May 2020
    I suspect the biggest challenge with the ramping up of testing has been to make it available to a large enough group of people to allow capacity to be fully utilised, whilst not making it available to so many people that the testing facilities would be overwhelmed. Which includes estimating how many people that the test was available for would actually take up the offer.
  • FeersumEnjineeyaFeersumEnjineeya Posts: 3,867
    edited May 2020

    kle4 said:

    Carnyx said:

    kle4 said:

    If people are looking for something more terrifying than our current grim circumstances to serve as a distraction, they could do worse than this book I'm currently reading - not content with being post apocalyptic, it's post apocalyptic sci fi with giant, sentient spiders. Cheery.

    OH, what is it? I'm on Banks's Algebraist myself - giant, sentient planktike echinoderm-analogues.
    Children of Time by Adrian Tchaikovsky. It might well turn out to be a hopeful story, but I just loved how the reference on the back to 'mankind's worst nightmare' was not, as I thought, mere colourful language.

    Have to admit I've never gotten into Banks. I read Consider Phlebas and thought it ok, and read Excession after rave reviews on here, but thought it was crap.

    Been trying to read more sci-fi this year though. Neal Asher was fun, and I finally read the Foundation trilogy.
    Banks is tough to get into - and rather un-even. Use of Weapons is a fascinating construction, though.
    No prizes for guessing my favourite Banks book :-) In other news I've just finished watching Devs. Amazing imagery, slow plot in places, and requires substantial suspension of physical reality, but entertaining and a reasonably satisfying ending.

    Edit: When the one character looked at the code and was physically sick, I commented to my other half that it must be written in PHP. I just got a pitying look.
This discussion has been closed.