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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Starmer’s ratings are generally getting better as the number o

SystemSystem Posts: 8,258
edited May 20 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Starmer’s ratings are generally getting better as the number of don’t knows declines

We are now in the 7th week of Keir Starmer’s leadership of the Labour Party and he could take some comfort about the general direction of his leader ratings which historically have been a better guide to election outcomes than voting intention polling.

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • TomsToms Posts: 1,887
    Sorry to start this on a low note, but Trump says he is taking hydroxychloroquine. Should we believe him?
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 26,150
    Second
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 26,150
    Whether he is or isn’t, Trump’s comment will lead to a surge in demand for that drug and probably to some deaths.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 3,199
    PMQs -- after last week, when the Prime Minister seemed to miss what he was being asked, will Team Boris get his PPS to work the folder for him?
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 40,167
    FIRST (on topic) Yes it’s difficult for the LotO to get much traction at the best of times outside an election - let alone a time like this. SKS will partly be benefitting from being “Not Corbyn” (as Obama did wrt Bush) but so far his approach on anti-semitism has been robust and on COVID he’s trod a tricky line (critical friend) well - while PMQs does not have much impact outside the back benches it’s impact there should not be underestimated.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 53,424
    Good morning, everyone.

    Starmer benefits greatly from not being Corbyn, and the PM being a buffoon.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 40,167

    PMQs -- after last week, when the Prime Minister seemed to miss what he was being asked, will Team Boris get his PPS to work the folder for him?


    Tricky with social distancing
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 15,656
    Toms said:

    Sorry to start this on a low note, but Trump says he is taking hydroxychloroquine. Should we believe him?

    Yes, I believe him. HCQ side effects are pretty rare, hence its widespread use as an antimalarial.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 14,537
    Starmer needs to watch the hype. Expectations should not run too high. He shouldn’t overreach or aim for some kind of massive victory every week. It’s a marathon, not a sprint. Just keep asking the questions the country wants answered.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 2,221
    I worried about Starmer lacking the showbiz element - I met him once and he comes across as super smart, focused and friendly, but doesn't set the room on fire. Perhaps that kind of sobriety is what is needed right now. Johnson's default frivolity and shiftiness certainly seems out of kilter with the current situation. But Starmer clearly has a mountain to climb. As always, I think governments lose elections rather than opposition's winning them, and the government seems to be doing its utmost to be a clusterfuck of criminal incompetence right now. All power to SKS.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 40,167
    An illustration of the Care Home problem across the British Isles - a single Care Home in the Isle of Man has had 20 out of the Islands 24 deaths.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-isle-of-man-52684620
  • StockyStocky Posts: 2,615
    edited May 20
    Foxy said:

    Toms said:

    Sorry to start this on a low note, but Trump says he is taking hydroxychloroquine. Should we believe him?

    Yes, I believe him. HCQ side effects are pretty rare, hence its widespread use as an antimalarial.
    Foxy, regarding discharge of hospital patients to care homes, gov is taking flack for this.

    How does it work exactly? Isn`t each person`s discharge a clinical decision? Care homes get most of their residents via hospitals I believe.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 35,323

    An illustration of the Care Home problem across the British Isles - a single Care Home in the Isle of Man has had 20 out of the Islands 24 deaths.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-isle-of-man-52684620

    Who's ever going to put their parents into Care Homes again after this?

    It's all getting a bit Boer War internment camp for me.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 35,323
    More Washington Post too though.

    The WHO has a lot to answer for.
  • philiphphiliph Posts: 4,247
    edited May 20
    @Stocky FPT

    Set your mobile to

    Desk top site

    in the browser settings, on mine three little dots top right.

    Then phone is no problem
  • BannedinnParisBannedinnParis Posts: 766

    PMQs -- after last week, when the Prime Minister seemed to miss what he was being asked, will Team Boris get his PPS to work the folder for him?

    probably

    -_-
  • StockyStocky Posts: 2,615
    philiph said:

    @Stocky FPT

    Set your mobile to

    Desk top site

    in the browser settings, on mine three little dots top right.

    Then phone is no problem

    Is "browser settings" part of the PB site or do you mean the normal phone "settings" icon? Sorry, I`m rubbish at this.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 5,069
    Rees Mogg wants to stop the virtual parliament and bring all MPs back to Westminster.

    Seems a very strange call at this stage given they cant get more than 50 in the chamber anyway.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 53,424
    Mr. Jonathan, are you suggesting Starmer should not adopt the policy of unilaterally reversing our departure from the EU if he wins the next election?

    :p
  • TomsToms Posts: 1,887
    Foxy said:

    Toms said:

    Sorry to start this on a low note, but Trump says he is taking hydroxychloroquine. Should we believe him?

    Yes, I believe him. HCQ side effects are pretty rare, hence its widespread use as an antimalarial.
    Its widespread use notwithstanding, I just don't believe Trump as far as I could throw him, i.e. not very far.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 3,199

    I worried about Starmer lacking the showbiz element - I met him once and he comes across as super smart, focused and friendly, but doesn't set the room on fire. Perhaps that kind of sobriety is what is needed right now. Johnson's default frivolity and shiftiness certainly seems out of kilter with the current situation. But Starmer clearly has a mountain to climb. As always, I think governments lose elections rather than opposition's winning them, and the government seems to be doing its utmost to be a clusterfuck of criminal incompetence right now. All power to SKS.

    If people stop listening, they won't hear what he has to say. SKS needs to take a leaf out of Mrs Thatcher's book and get some coaching. Drama schools like RADA offer courses along these lines and something bespoke could be lined up for the summer recess.
    https://www.radabusiness.com/courses-individuals/

    CCHQ sent Theresa May to Africa to teach her to loosen up around people; same sort of thing.

  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 26,150
    Foxy said:

    Toms said:

    Sorry to start this on a low note, but Trump says he is taking hydroxychloroquine. Should we believe him?

    Yes, I believe him. HCQ side effects are pretty rare, hence its widespread use as an antimalarial.
    Foxy said:

    Toms said:

    Sorry to start this on a low note, but Trump says he is taking hydroxychloroquine. Should we believe him?

    Yes, I believe him. HCQ side effects are pretty rare, hence its widespread use as an antimalarial.
    But doesnt the suggested dosage for Corona involve taking the weekly antimalarial every day?
  • philiphphiliph Posts: 4,247

    An illustration of the Care Home problem across the British Isles - a single Care Home in the Isle of Man has had 20 out of the Islands 24 deaths.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-isle-of-man-52684620

    Who's ever going to put their parents into Care Homes again after this?

    It's all getting a bit Boer War internment camp for me.
    Another way of looking at it is:
    Are your children going to put you in one?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 35,323
    philiph said:

    An illustration of the Care Home problem across the British Isles - a single Care Home in the Isle of Man has had 20 out of the Islands 24 deaths.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-isle-of-man-52684620

    Who's ever going to put their parents into Care Homes again after this?

    It's all getting a bit Boer War internment camp for me.
    Another way of looking at it is:
    Are your children going to put you in one?
    Hopefully I'm some years away from that.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 3,199

    Rees Mogg wants to stop the virtual parliament and bring all MPs back to Westminster.

    Seems a very strange call at this stage given they cant get more than 50 in the chamber anyway.

    Ironically, it would help Boris if the entire chamber became virtual so he could hide a dozen assistants off screen at PMQs.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 26,150

    An illustration of the Care Home problem across the British Isles - a single Care Home in the Isle of Man has had 20 out of the Islands 24 deaths.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-isle-of-man-52684620

    Yesterday it was reported that nearly 6,000 UK care homes are reporting cases. Multiply up and they must account for a significant proportion of current live infections.
  • philiphphiliph Posts: 4,247
    edited May 20
    Stocky said:

    philiph said:

    @Stocky FPT

    Set your mobile to

    Desk top site

    in the browser settings, on mine three little dots top right.

    Then phone is no problem

    Is "browser settings" part of the PB site or do you mean the normal phone "settings" icon? Sorry, I`m rubbish at this.
    It is a part of the browser, google as standard in most non iphones.

    Scroll up, you can see the address bar where the site address is. A button to the right of that
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 5,069

    Rees Mogg wants to stop the virtual parliament and bring all MPs back to Westminster.

    Seems a very strange call at this stage given they cant get more than 50 in the chamber anyway.

    Ironically, it would help Boris if the entire chamber became virtual so he could hide a dozen assistants off screen at PMQs.
    For some reason thats got me remembering Polly miming to try and prompt Basil Fawlty to say Dragonfly to Sybil. I am not sure off screen mimes are actually going to help, even a dozen of them.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 26,150

    I worried about Starmer lacking the showbiz element - I met him once and he comes across as super smart, focused and friendly, but doesn't set the room on fire. Perhaps that kind of sobriety is what is needed right now. Johnson's default frivolity and shiftiness certainly seems out of kilter with the current situation. But Starmer clearly has a mountain to climb. As always, I think governments lose elections rather than opposition's winning them, and the government seems to be doing its utmost to be a clusterfuck of criminal incompetence right now. All power to SKS.

    If people stop listening, they won't hear what he has to say. SKS needs to take a leaf out of Mrs Thatcher's book and get some coaching. Drama schools like RADA offer courses along these lines and something bespoke could be lined up for the summer recess.
    https://www.radabusiness.com/courses-individuals/

    CCHQ sent Theresa May to Africa to teach her to loosen up around people; same sort of thing.

    Always sad to see a good argument destroyed by a bad example.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 3,199
    Another day, another cock-up as Serco carelessly reveals contact tracers' email addresses.
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52732818
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 7,304
    IanB2 said:

    Foxy said:

    Toms said:

    Sorry to start this on a low note, but Trump says he is taking hydroxychloroquine. Should we believe him?

    Yes, I believe him. HCQ side effects are pretty rare, hence its widespread use as an antimalarial.
    Foxy said:

    Toms said:

    Sorry to start this on a low note, but Trump says he is taking hydroxychloroquine. Should we believe him?

    Yes, I believe him. HCQ side effects are pretty rare, hence its widespread use as an antimalarial.
    But doesnt the suggested dosage for Corona involve taking the weekly antimalarial every day?
    Whether he is taking it or not, the reason for mentioning it publicly is simply to distract from the mess he has made of handling the Virus crisis. He knows HCQ doesn't work, but is probably harmless. Gets people talking though.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 1,244

    philiph said:

    An illustration of the Care Home problem across the British Isles - a single Care Home in the Isle of Man has had 20 out of the Islands 24 deaths.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-isle-of-man-52684620

    Who's ever going to put their parents into Care Homes again after this?

    It's all getting a bit Boer War internment camp for me.
    Another way of looking at it is:
    Are your children going to put you in one?
    Hopefully I'm some years away from that.
    Do many people put their parents into care homes out of choice now?
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 5,069

    Another day, another cock-up as Serco carelessly reveals contact tracers' email addresses.
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52732818

    Given the number of times this keeps happening an easy way to significantly reduce this would be for the email firms to put in place a big warning whenever someone is sending an email to more than say 25 named recipients in the to column, and offering to change it to bcc.

    Once you are sending to that many people it is generally better to bcc unless its a close group who all know each other.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 2,327

  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 7,304
    IanB2 said:

    Whether he is or isn’t, Trump’s comment will lead to a surge in demand for that drug and probably to some deaths.

    I expect Trump's cronies are heavily invested in companies that make and supply the drug, and that will be part of the reason for him advertising it. Shouldn't be too many deaths though.

    His handling of the crisis however has already been responsible for thousands of unnecessary deaths and that will continue for a while yet, probably until November.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 3,199
    HMG's twitter war with the MSM.

  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 26,150

    IanB2 said:

    Whether he is or isn’t, Trump’s comment will lead to a surge in demand for that drug and probably to some deaths.

    I expect Trump's cronies are heavily invested in companies that make and supply the drug, and that will be part of the reason for him advertising it. Shouldn't be too many deaths though.

    His handling of the crisis however has already been responsible for thousands of unnecessary deaths and that will continue for a while yet, probably until November.
    Result of the US veteran study: Rates of death in the HC, HC+AZ, and no HC groups were 27.8%, 22.1%, 11.4%, respectively

    After the last Trump pump of CHQ:

    On Monday, an Arizona man in his sixties died after self-medicating with chloroquine phosphate.

    Nigeria reported two fatal overdoses after Trump’s remarks, and asked people not to take the drug without a doctor’s orders
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 18,502

    I worried about Starmer lacking the showbiz element - I met him once and he comes across as super smart, focused and friendly, but doesn't set the room on fire. Perhaps that kind of sobriety is what is needed right now. Johnson's default frivolity and shiftiness certainly seems out of kilter with the current situation. But Starmer clearly has a mountain to climb. As always, I think governments lose elections rather than opposition's winning them, and the government seems to be doing its utmost to be a clusterfuck of criminal incompetence right now. All power to SKS.

    If people stop listening, they won't hear what he has to say. SKS needs to take a leaf out of Mrs Thatcher's book and get some coaching. Drama schools like RADA offer courses along these lines and something bespoke could be lined up for the summer recess.
    https://www.radabusiness.com/courses-individuals/

    CCHQ sent Theresa May to Africa to teach her to loosen up around people; same sort of thing.

    That worked well!
    Whoever was Maggie's voice coach did a good job though.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 1,244
    edited May 20

    Rees Mogg wants to stop the virtual parliament and bring all MPs back to Westminster.

    Seems a very strange call at this stage given they cant get more than 50 in the chamber anyway.

    Ironically, it would help Boris if the entire chamber became virtual so he could hide a dozen assistants off screen at PMQs.
    For some reason thats got me remembering Polly miming to try and prompt Basil Fawlty to say Dragonfly to Sybil. I am not sure off screen mimes are actually going to help, even a dozen of them.
    Other way around! :) (Basil was doing the miming)
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 2,327
    Bozo, the man who gets things done !

  • StockyStocky Posts: 2,615
    philiph said:

    Stocky said:

    philiph said:

    @Stocky FPT

    Set your mobile to

    Desk top site

    in the browser settings, on mine three little dots top right.

    Then phone is no problem

    Is "browser settings" part of the PB site or do you mean the normal phone "settings" icon? Sorry, I`m rubbish at this.
    It is a part of the browser, google as standard in most non iphones.

    Scroll up, you can see the address bar where the site address is. A button to the right of that
    I have iphone. I`ll get my daughter to take a look. Thanks for your help.
  • NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 556

    An illustration of the Care Home problem across the British Isles - a single Care Home in the Isle of Man has had 20 out of the Islands 24 deaths.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-isle-of-man-52684620

    The care home problem is across Europe, even yesterday the BBC News website was carrying a story about Swedens care home problems. They have done similar stories about France, Italy and Spain. Even Germany has a significant problem in Care Homes.

    https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2020/05/12/germ-m12.html
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 7,304
    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Whether he is or isn’t, Trump’s comment will lead to a surge in demand for that drug and probably to some deaths.

    I expect Trump's cronies are heavily invested in companies that make and supply the drug, and that will be part of the reason for him advertising it. Shouldn't be too many deaths though.

    His handling of the crisis however has already been responsible for thousands of unnecessary deaths and that will continue for a while yet, probably until November.
    Result of the US veteran study: Rates of death in the HC, HC+AZ, and no HC groups were 27.8%, 22.1%, 11.4%, respectively

    After the last Trump pump of CHQ:

    On Monday, an Arizona man in his sixties died after self-medicating with chloroquine phosphate.

    Nigeria reported two fatal overdoses after Trump’s remarks, and asked people not to take the drug without a doctor’s orders
    Yeah but it's small potatoes compared the deaths caused by his mishandling of the crisis. And at least it's better than recommending bleach. That has just about a 100% fatality rate.

    Cut the Donald some slack please.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 18,502

    philiph said:

    An illustration of the Care Home problem across the British Isles - a single Care Home in the Isle of Man has had 20 out of the Islands 24 deaths.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-isle-of-man-52684620

    Who's ever going to put their parents into Care Homes again after this?

    It's all getting a bit Boer War internment camp for me.
    Another way of looking at it is:
    Are your children going to put you in one?
    Hopefully I'm some years away from that.
    I've told this story before; some years ago I had a contract to review medicine use, handling etc, etc in a group of Care Homes. Went in one, opened a cupboard in the 'Medicine Handling Room' and found it full of gin, whisky, rum and so on. Apparently the residents had a weekly party.
    It was quite a few years ago, and I can't recall which one, I'm afraid!

    But back in the day I went round quite a lot; some I'd trust to do their best.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 35,323
    My nursery and early years school is reopening on 3rd June.

    However, it's a private school so I'm not sure how representative it is.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 35,323
    alex_ said:

    philiph said:

    An illustration of the Care Home problem across the British Isles - a single Care Home in the Isle of Man has had 20 out of the Islands 24 deaths.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-isle-of-man-52684620

    Who's ever going to put their parents into Care Homes again after this?

    It's all getting a bit Boer War internment camp for me.
    Another way of looking at it is:
    Are your children going to put you in one?
    Hopefully I'm some years away from that.
    Do many people put their parents into care homes out of choice now?
    I don't know but I think in the UK some choose that over looking after them themselves in a granny annexe or similar when both parents are still working.

    Overseas this is less common
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 1,244
    For those who get frustrated about people quoting deaths as per worldometer site as a reliable indicator - France brought a large number of people back to life yesterday - and the site faithfully reported this in its figures!
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 26,150
    alex_ said:

    For those who get frustrated about people quoting deaths as per worldometer site as a reliable indicator - France brought a large number of people back to life yesterday - and the site faithfully reported this in its figures!

    Why is the UK the only country where no-one seems to recover?
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 13,729
    alex_ said:

    For those who get frustrated about people quoting deaths as per worldometer site as a reliable indicator - France brought a large number of people back to life yesterday - and the site faithfully reported this in its figures!

    :lol:
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 40,167

    IanB2 said:

    Foxy said:

    Toms said:

    Sorry to start this on a low note, but Trump says he is taking hydroxychloroquine. Should we believe him?

    Yes, I believe him. HCQ side effects are pretty rare, hence its widespread use as an antimalarial.
    Foxy said:

    Toms said:

    Sorry to start this on a low note, but Trump says he is taking hydroxychloroquine. Should we believe him?

    Yes, I believe him. HCQ side effects are pretty rare, hence its widespread use as an antimalarial.
    But doesnt the suggested dosage for Corona involve taking the weekly antimalarial every day?
    Whether he is taking it or not, the reason for mentioning it publicly is simply to distract from the mess he has made of handling the Virus crisis. He knows HCQ doesn't work, but is probably harmless. Gets people talking though.
    Classic “dead cat”.....
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 3,788
    alex_ said:

    For those who get frustrated about people quoting deaths as per worldometer site as a reliable indicator - France brought a large number of people back to life yesterday - and the site faithfully reported this in its figures!

    Vive la France!

  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 3,199
    Scott_xP said:
    Testing redux. Pluck an arbitrary target out of thin air and proclaim a triumph when everyone talks about not meeting it.
  • andypetukandypetuk Posts: 28
    Stocky said:

    philiph said:

    Stocky said:

    philiph said:

    @Stocky FPT

    Set your mobile to

    Desk top site

    in the browser settings, on mine three little dots top right.

    Then phone is no problem

    Is "browser settings" part of the PB site or do you mean the normal phone "settings" icon? Sorry, I`m rubbish at this.
    It is a part of the browser, google as standard in most non iphones.

    Scroll up, you can see the address bar where the site address is. A button to the right of that
    I have iphone. I`ll get my daughter to take a look. Thanks for your help.
    On iPhone you should have AA on the left of the address bar. Click on that to bring up menu and select Request Desktop Site.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 30,655
    tlg86 said:

    alex_ said:

    For those who get frustrated about people quoting deaths as per worldometer site as a reliable indicator - France brought a large number of people back to life yesterday - and the site faithfully reported this in its figures!

    :lol:
    No wonder people are disappointed with Boris if Macron can get the dead to rise again.
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 2,602

    kinabalu said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Fantastic isn't it!

    Celebrating treating people "based on their skills, not where they're from" is a very good thing.

    Or would you rather treat people based on where they're from, not their skills?

    We are losing freedoms. That is the point. As from 1st January 2021, UK businesses and citizens (who do not hold dual nationality) will enjoy fewer freedoms than they do today.
    Every year in the EU we lost "freedoms" as new regulations came in too.

    Win some lose some.
    Yes, one the one hand, I can no longer go and live in France or retire to Spain. But I am no longer enslaved by the EU directive governing the use of pallets in the building sector. Freedom!
    (Note to Brexiteers, I am being sarcastic. You have stolen my European birthright and that of my children, and you will feel my wrath until the day you die).
    People lived and retired in France and Spain before we joined the EU. Non EU nationals stills do.
    Yawn. I have no interest in fighting the Brexit battles again, you morons have won. You should be out there enjoying your freedoms instead of still trying to convince us that you've not done something stupid. But what you're turning this country into, it's not really my country anymore.
    The victors seem to be the most exercised I'm done with it. I wish it had never happened, I will never forgive Dave for allowing it to happen, but we are where we are.

    Attack being the best form of defence, victorious Leave freedom fighters getting their excuses in early?

    I believe in their heart of hearts they understand it will be a false dawn.
    Does Big Daddy himself (BJ) believe Brexit is in the national interest? I sense not.
    England’s greatest unforced error since the Middle Ages.
    Id have said getting involved in World War 1 myself
    Personally, I concur. However, that the First World War error was “unforced” is not universally accepted. I think it was, but many fine historians think that the UK had no choice. Or, if it did have a choice, it was only possible to delay, not stop the horrific armed conflict.

    The Brexit fiasco was entirely unforced and self-inflicted.
    Arguably the Flashman Option was the best plan for WWI.
    Thanks! It is decades since I last read MacDonald Fraser, and Mr American and its “Flashman Option” was unknown to me. My library has no copy, so I’ll have to fork out.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 53,424
    Any word yet on whether there'll be an exemption for F1 in the UK?
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/52723200

    It doesn't sound unreasonable given the efforts the sport is going to.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 18,502
    IanB2 said:

    alex_ said:

    For those who get frustrated about people quoting deaths as per worldometer site as a reliable indicator - France brought a large number of people back to life yesterday - and the site faithfully reported this in its figures!

    Why is the UK the only country where no-one seems to recover?
    We've had one or two contributors do so, haven't we? And I know directly someone who has and of others as friends of friends.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,097
    Scott_xP said:
    He’s been getting feedback from MPs I’d guess. I’ve been asking the parents in my social group in a non-leading way about this and even the most government-friendly ones are very wary. Compelling parents to put their children in what they perceive as harm’s way would be hugely unpopular.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 53,424
    Mr. L, maybe the PM will start singing je ne resurrect rien?
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 1,244
    If schools aren’t going to reopen then they need to start making serious efforts to provide for effective remote learning. And not just falling back (as it appears most state schools are) of not doing anything because it puts some pupils at a disadvantage.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 35,323

    philiph said:

    An illustration of the Care Home problem across the British Isles - a single Care Home in the Isle of Man has had 20 out of the Islands 24 deaths.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-isle-of-man-52684620

    Who's ever going to put their parents into Care Homes again after this?

    It's all getting a bit Boer War internment camp for me.
    Another way of looking at it is:
    Are your children going to put you in one?
    Hopefully I'm some years away from that.
    I've told this story before; some years ago I had a contract to review medicine use, handling etc, etc in a group of Care Homes. Went in one, opened a cupboard in the 'Medicine Handling Room' and found it full of gin, whisky, rum and so on. Apparently the residents had a weekly party.
    It was quite a few years ago, and I can't recall which one, I'm afraid!

    But back in the day I went round quite a lot; some I'd trust to do their best.
    There will of course be many excellent ones.

    It's the brand damage to the industry overall that I fear may be fatal.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 26,150

    IanB2 said:

    alex_ said:

    For those who get frustrated about people quoting deaths as per worldometer site as a reliable indicator - France brought a large number of people back to life yesterday - and the site faithfully reported this in its figures!

    Why is the UK the only country where no-one seems to recover?
    We've had one or two contributors do so, haven't we? And I know directly someone who has and of others as friends of friends.
    Yes, but every other country except us is reporting statistics on it.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 35,323

    Scott_xP said:
    He’s been getting feedback from MPs I’d guess. I’ve been asking the parents in my social group in a non-leading way about this and even the most government-friendly ones are very wary. Compelling parents to put their children in what they perceive as harm’s way would be hugely unpopular.
    Or so they say in a social group.

    In my experience (on a 1:1 basis) opinion is very mixed.

    One of my colleagues I spoke to yesterday is sending his back on Day One, same as me.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 5,035

    Any word yet on whether there'll be an exemption for F1 in the UK?
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/52723200

    It doesn't sound unreasonable given the efforts the sport is going to.

    How about an exemption for everyone? Given that it is bollocks.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 1,244
    It is interesting that when the schools were first closed probably the last justification for it was “risk to children”. And now (despite the evidence of risk to children being scanty at best) perceived risk to children seems to be growing as a major obstacle to restarting.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,097
    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    alex_ said:

    For those who get frustrated about people quoting deaths as per worldometer site as a reliable indicator - France brought a large number of people back to life yesterday - and the site faithfully reported this in its figures!

    Why is the UK the only country where no-one seems to recover?
    We've had one or two contributors do so, haven't we? And I know directly someone who has and of others as friends of friends.
    Yes, but every other country except us is reporting statistics on it.
    Britain is correctly prioritising death statistics. Its series on excess deaths is probably the single most important and gives us a much fuller picture than most have as to what is going on.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 13,729
    alex_ said:

    It is interesting that when the schools were first closed probably the last justification for it was “risk to children”. And now (despite the evidence of risk to children being scanty at best) perceived risk to children seems to be growing as a major obstacle to restarting.

    I had TalkSPORT on last night and Jason Cundy said something along the lines of "look what's happened in care homes. That could happen in schools."

    I suspect Cundy is quite representative of the population and that's the kind of thing that some parents will be worrying about, even if it's utterly stupid.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 30,655
    Inflation down to 0.8%: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52735240

    Classic deflation after a collapse in the velocity of money. I got my monthly credit card bill yesterday. It was £70, one tank of fuel in the month and I haven't filled up this month. Normally I would be more like £1500 including accommodation for several nights in Edinburgh.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,097

    Scott_xP said:
    He’s been getting feedback from MPs I’d guess. I’ve been asking the parents in my social group in a non-leading way about this and even the most government-friendly ones are very wary. Compelling parents to put their children in what they perceive as harm’s way would be hugely unpopular.
    Or so they say in a social group.

    In my experience (on a 1:1 basis) opinion is very mixed.

    One of my colleagues I spoke to yesterday is sending his back on Day One, same as me.
    I don’t have children and I sympathise with your approach (indeed, I have been encouraging parents to send them back to school when the time comes, not least because most of the parents look knackered).

    The fear of many about the health risks is clear. The studies about something like Kawasaki syndrome have been picked up on a lot.
  • NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 556
    Scott_xP said:
    Why is that a surprise? They were preparing the NHS for a wave of infections. They saw what happened in Italy and were trying to avoid that happening here. Thats why that decision was taken.
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 2,602
    Starmer is doing well in Scotland thus far: he’s in a +5 to +10 range, which is approximately where Ruth Davidson used to poll before she got the boot.

    Starmer is certainly miles ahead of Richard Leonard, and galaxies ahead of Boris Johnson, Theresa May and Jeremy Corbyn ratings.

    The problem is he is well behind Sturgeon.

    The missing man is Jackson Carlaw, who theoretically is the main Unionist candidate to be Next FM. In reality he is nothing of the sort.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 32,966
    Morning all,

    Grim news at Rolls Royce this morning.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 35,323
    IanB2 said:

    My nursery and early years school is reopening on 3rd June.

    However, it's a private school so I'm not sure how representative it is.

    It's clearly well above average, given the standard of literacy you seem to have achieved so young.
    You get what you pay for.
  • SockySocky Posts: 404
    Scott_xP said:

    [Stuff about focusing on the NHS]

    The answer doesn't align with the question.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 1,914

    Starmer is doing well in Scotland thus far: he’s in a +5 to +10 range, which is approximately where Ruth Davidson used to poll before she got the boot.

    Starmer is certainly miles ahead of Richard Leonard, and galaxies ahead of Boris Johnson, Theresa May and Jeremy Corbyn ratings.

    The problem is he is well behind Sturgeon.

    The missing man is Jackson Carlaw, who theoretically is the main Unionist candidate to be Next FM. In reality he is nothing of the sort.

    Give it time.. Nicola's rating are heading for a fall. Shit and fan shortly >?
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 40,167
    No doubt the first of many uncomfortable reports for the governments & administrations of the UK:

  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,097

    Starmer is doing well in Scotland thus far: he’s in a +5 to +10 range, which is approximately where Ruth Davidson used to poll before she got the boot.

    Starmer is certainly miles ahead of Richard Leonard, and galaxies ahead of Boris Johnson, Theresa May and Jeremy Corbyn ratings.

    The problem is he is well behind Sturgeon.

    The missing man is Jackson Carlaw, who theoretically is the main Unionist candidate to be Next FM. In reality he is nothing of the sort.

    At the risk of sounding like a cybernat, this is good news for the SNP. The more split the opposition, the better for them.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 30,655

    Scott_xP said:
    He’s been getting feedback from MPs I’d guess. I’ve been asking the parents in my social group in a non-leading way about this and even the most government-friendly ones are very wary. Compelling parents to put their children in what they perceive as harm’s way would be hugely unpopular.
    Or so they say in a social group.

    In my experience (on a 1:1 basis) opinion is very mixed.

    One of my colleagues I spoke to yesterday is sending his back on Day One, same as me.
    If my son's school opens he will be there day 1. He is desperately missing his friends and his girlfriend. Facetime etc have limits. It would be more for his social health than any education tbh because his remote learning is actually going pretty well. Don't think it is going to happen in Scotland though.

    It has been really noticeable over the last week when out on my walks that you see more and more groups of teenagers who have met up in parks etc. They are not causing any trouble, they just need the social contact. They would be better at school where there would be more structure to the social distancing than there is currently.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 1,244
    edited May 20
    Scott_xP said:
    It’s pretty obvious that the assessment was that the biggest threat from the virus came from an overwhelmed health service. Everything was done in that context (cancelling routine and non emergency hospital treatment and cancellations, clearing the beds, and indeed the lockdown policy itself etc etc). It wasn’t an irrational position but it didn’t help clearly that Care homes fall outside of the jurisdiction and direct responsibility of those planning and implementing this policy. Since the health service wasn’t overwhelmed it’s difficult to know if that was ultimately justified. I think also perhaps there was, particularly in respect of care homes, to much thought about PPE being needed to protect care staff, rather than care home residents. So workers “prepared to take the risk” were just endangering those under their care.

    It may be the case that age and vulnerability is far far more important than ability to access hospital care and most of the approach was therefore misguided.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 20,990
    edited May 20

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    alex_ said:

    For those who get frustrated about people quoting deaths as per worldometer site as a reliable indicator - France brought a large number of people back to life yesterday - and the site faithfully reported this in its figures!

    Why is the UK the only country where no-one seems to recover?
    We've had one or two contributors do so, haven't we? And I know directly someone who has and of others as friends of friends.
    Yes, but every other country except us is reporting statistics on it.
    Britain is correctly prioritising death statistics. Its series on excess deaths is probably the single most important and gives us a much fuller picture than most have as to what is going on.
    hmmmm

    HMG should pick a structured sample of 1000 say of people who have died from CV19 and get an actuary to run the statistics on how much longer the person was forecast to live.

  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 32,966
    Scott_xP said:
    If that isn't an isolated incident then there is some awful trouble coming for NHS managers and politicians.

    As an aside, perhaps she should have called the police?
  • NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 556
    alex_ said:

    Scott_xP said:
    It’s pretty obvious that the assessment was that the biggest threat from the virus came from an overwhelmed health service. Everything was done in that context (cancelling routine and non emergency hospital treatment and cancellations, clearing the beds, and indeed the lockdown policy itself etc etc). It didn’t help clearly that Care homes fall outside of the jurisdiction of those planning and implementing this policy. Since the health service wasn’t overwhelmed it’s difficult to know if that was ultimately justified.

    It may be the case that age and vulnerability is far far more important than ability to access hospital care and most of the approach was therefore misguided.
    The point is that they did not know that the health service was not going to be overwhelmed. Imagine if they did not clear hospitals out and then the NHS was overrun. How many retweets would there be from Scott about the Governments failure to protect the NHS?
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 13,729
    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:
    He’s been getting feedback from MPs I’d guess. I’ve been asking the parents in my social group in a non-leading way about this and even the most government-friendly ones are very wary. Compelling parents to put their children in what they perceive as harm’s way would be hugely unpopular.
    Or so they say in a social group.

    In my experience (on a 1:1 basis) opinion is very mixed.

    One of my colleagues I spoke to yesterday is sending his back on Day One, same as me.
    If my son's school opens he will be there day 1. He is desperately missing his friends and his girlfriend. Facetime etc have limits. It would be more for his social health than any education tbh because his remote learning is actually going pretty well. Don't think it is going to happen in Scotland though.

    It has been really noticeable over the last week when out on my walks that you see more and more groups of teenagers who have met up in parks etc. They are not causing any trouble, they just need the social contact. They would be better at school where there would be more structure to the social distancing than there is currently.
    My local park is full of pot smoking teenagers.
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 2,602

    Morning all,

    Grim news at Rolls Royce this morning.

    I note that the words “depression” and “1930s” are cropping up more and more often. Once mighty brands like RR may not exist in ten years time.

    We all know what happened roughly a decade after the last Great Depression. We ought to start planning for a new worst case scenario. Trump, Bolsonaro, Putin, Johnson, Orbán, Erdoğan, Farage. The pattern does not inspire confidence. God knows what serpents the next ten years will bring out from under rocks.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,097

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    alex_ said:

    For those who get frustrated about people quoting deaths as per worldometer site as a reliable indicator - France brought a large number of people back to life yesterday - and the site faithfully reported this in its figures!

    Why is the UK the only country where no-one seems to recover?
    We've had one or two contributors do so, haven't we? And I know directly someone who has and of others as friends of friends.
    Yes, but every other country except us is reporting statistics on it.
    Britain is correctly prioritising death statistics. Its series on excess deaths is probably the single most important and gives us a much fuller picture than most have as to what is going on.
    hmmmm

    HMG should pick a structured sample of 1000 say of people who have died from CV19 and get an actuary to run the statistics on how much longer the person was forecast to live.

    There has been quite a lot of work done on this by the actuarial profession off their own bat. The short answer is: longer than most people would expect.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 35,323

    Scott_xP said:
    He’s been getting feedback from MPs I’d guess. I’ve been asking the parents in my social group in a non-leading way about this and even the most government-friendly ones are very wary. Compelling parents to put their children in what they perceive as harm’s way would be hugely unpopular.
    Or so they say in a social group.

    In my experience (on a 1:1 basis) opinion is very mixed.

    One of my colleagues I spoke to yesterday is sending his back on Day One, same as me.
    I don’t have children and I sympathise with your approach (indeed, I have been encouraging parents to send them back to school when the time comes, not least because most of the parents look knackered).

    The fear of many about the health risks is clear. The studies about something like Kawasaki syndrome have been picked up on a lot.
    It is fear. I remember similar fears about AIDS and therefore unprotected sex in the early 90s and I was terrified of eating beef for a couple of years in case I got mad cow disease.

    It's largely irrational.
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 2,602

    Starmer is doing well in Scotland thus far: he’s in a +5 to +10 range, which is approximately where Ruth Davidson used to poll before she got the boot.

    Starmer is certainly miles ahead of Richard Leonard, and galaxies ahead of Boris Johnson, Theresa May and Jeremy Corbyn ratings.

    The problem is he is well behind Sturgeon.

    The missing man is Jackson Carlaw, who theoretically is the main Unionist candidate to be Next FM. In reality he is nothing of the sort.

    Give it time.. Nicola's rating are heading for a fall. Shit and fan shortly >?
    Heard it all ten thousand times before. Mind you, stopped clock and all that: sometime a Unionist will actually get it right. By pure fluke.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 1,244

    alex_ said:

    Scott_xP said:
    It’s pretty obvious that the assessment was that the biggest threat from the virus came from an overwhelmed health service. Everything was done in that context (cancelling routine and non emergency hospital treatment and cancellations, clearing the beds, and indeed the lockdown policy itself etc etc). It didn’t help clearly that Care homes fall outside of the jurisdiction of those planning and implementing this policy. Since the health service wasn’t overwhelmed it’s difficult to know if that was ultimately justified.

    It may be the case that age and vulnerability is far far more important than ability to access hospital care and most of the approach was therefore misguided.
    The point is that they did not know that the health service was not going to be overwhelmed. Imagine if they did not clear hospitals out and then the NHS was overrun. How many retweets would there be from Scott about the Governments failure to protect the NHS?
    Well yes - that’s the point I made in my penultimate paragraph. Which then brings us back to the larger question of how much spare capacity should our health and care system be designed to carry on a routine basis.
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 2,219
    alex_ said:

    If schools aren’t going to reopen then they need to start making serious efforts to provide for effective remote learning. And not just falling back (as it appears most state schools are) of not doing anything because it puts some pupils at a disadvantage.

    I’m not sure how representative we are, but at the state school I teach at we are running lessons via Teams at the usual time each day. Some teachers are “live teaching” lessons. I record what I would describe as animated notes: I use a program that lets me draw or type notes on a screen while I talk. We also have a variety of resources for online assessment and as teachers we are keeping track of pupils that are not engaging and sending emails to parents were needed.
    In fact I need to go and prepare some notes for an introduction to circular motion now...
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 32,966
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 35,323
    tlg86 said:

    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:
    He’s been getting feedback from MPs I’d guess. I’ve been asking the parents in my social group in a non-leading way about this and even the most government-friendly ones are very wary. Compelling parents to put their children in what they perceive as harm’s way would be hugely unpopular.
    Or so they say in a social group.

    In my experience (on a 1:1 basis) opinion is very mixed.

    One of my colleagues I spoke to yesterday is sending his back on Day One, same as me.
    If my son's school opens he will be there day 1. He is desperately missing his friends and his girlfriend. Facetime etc have limits. It would be more for his social health than any education tbh because his remote learning is actually going pretty well. Don't think it is going to happen in Scotland though.

    It has been really noticeable over the last week when out on my walks that you see more and more groups of teenagers who have met up in parks etc. They are not causing any trouble, they just need the social contact. They would be better at school where there would be more structure to the social distancing than there is currently.
    My local park is full of pot smoking teenagers.
    We have a lockdown in name only now.

    It ended on the last bank holiday weekend.

    It isn't coming back anytime soon - short of a disaster.
  • StockyStocky Posts: 2,615
    andypetuk said:

    Stocky said:

    philiph said:

    Stocky said:

    philiph said:

    @Stocky FPT

    Set your mobile to

    Desk top site

    in the browser settings, on mine three little dots top right.

    Then phone is no problem

    Is "browser settings" part of the PB site or do you mean the normal phone "settings" icon? Sorry, I`m rubbish at this.
    It is a part of the browser, google as standard in most non iphones.

    Scroll up, you can see the address bar where the site address is. A button to the right of that
    I have iphone. I`ll get my daughter to take a look. Thanks for your help.
    On iPhone you should have AA on the left of the address bar. Click on that to bring up menu and select Request Desktop Site.
    I have no AA in address bar. Neither does my wife on her iphone. Pissed off with this. The new site was supposed to be an improvement. Now I have to go to my desktop to access PB.com.
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