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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » GE2019 Tory remainers – the key voting group who are giving St

SystemSystem Posts: 11,002
edited June 2020 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » GE2019 Tory remainers – the key voting group who are giving Starmer positive ratings

We are just over 3 years and 10 months from May 2nd 2024 which is the final date that the next general election can be held. That’s the time that the new Labour leader, Keir Starmer, has got in order to put himself into position where LAB can take enough seats to make the party electorally competitive.

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Comments

  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 3,853
    edited June 2020
    They might be positive about Starmer, but will they vote for him? I don't think they will.

    I think he's getting good ratings as a leader of the opposition, not as a potential PM.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,004
    First
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,879
    Best they vote LibDem, to be honest.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,004
    As Starmer has refused to back a transition period I cannot see Brexit even being in the mix in 2024
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,591

    First

    I don't think you've quite got the hang of this, Big_G.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    FPT:
    Mr. T, I hadn't heard the anosmia one.

    Interestingly, the axon sheaths of myelin are thinner in psychopaths, but psychopathology is very much a male thing (there are female psychopaths but they're much rarer). yet women have thinner myelin sheaths than men as standard. I always wondered why that was.
  • Ave_itAve_it Posts: 2,411

    Best they vote LibDem, to be honest.

    Vote Layla - it's the future!
  • MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 7,382

    They might be positive about Starmer, but will they vote for him? I don't think they will.

    I think he's getting good ratings as a leader of the opposition, not as a potential PM.

    The polling numbers otherwise. Generally incumbents have a huge advantage in Best PM ratings. The latest has Starmer just 1% behind
  • MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 7,382
    Ave_it said:

    Best they vote LibDem, to be honest.

    Vote Layla - it's the future!
    You mean like the Championship is for Watford
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842
    Not sure Johnson will be the runner for the Tories in 2024.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941
    Nigelb said:

    First

    I don't think you've quite got the hang of this, Big_G.
    He's a firm believer in zero-indexing.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 38,865
    edited June 2020
    Nigelb said:

    First

    I don't think you've quite got the hang of this, Big_G.
    There was something poignant about that.

    I think those 1st 2 posts should be swapped around if that is possible?
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,415
    kinabalu said:
    » show previous quotes
    A total absence of empathy is the single most defining characteristic. The glib charm and/or high intelligence is typically present in those who are 'high functioning' but there are thick, obnoxious psychos. Or let me put it this way, if you meet a thick, obnoxious individual do not go assuming they are not a psychopath. It could save your life.
    The thick ones tend to be in and out of jail and are easy to spot. It's the clever ones you need to avoid. Surgeons and CEOs have a high prevalence.

    I think its good life advice in general to try and avoid surgeons and CEOs!!
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,288
    It wasn't me. I am a Tory remainer and i would not give Starmer a positive vote. He is a shit of the first order. ..playing politics over people dying... Revolting.
  • BromBrom Posts: 3,760
    Has Starmer killed off the Lib Dems? For my money there is enough far left energy within the party to make a few Liberals steer clear and keep hold of a few seats for the yellows.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,288

    First

    Runner up 😀😀😀😀😀
  • Ave_itAve_it Posts: 2,411

    Ave_it said:

    Best they vote LibDem, to be honest.

    Vote Layla - it's the future!
    You mean like the Championship is for Watford
    Hopefully not. Looking forward to collecting the 3 points off Burnley soon :lol:
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,004
    Nigelb said:

    First

    I don't think you've quite got the hang of this, Big_G.
    Looks like it
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 38,865

    FPT:
    Mr. T, I hadn't heard the anosmia one.

    Interestingly, the axon sheaths of myelin are thinner in psychopaths, but psychopathology is very much a male thing (there are female psychopaths but they're much rarer). yet women have thinner myelin sheaths than men as standard. I always wondered why that was.

    The one I knew was male. And tall, he was quite tall. And indeed Austrian.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,591
    kinabalu said:

    Nigelb said:

    First

    I don't think you've quite got the hang of this, Big_G.
    There was something poignant about that.

    I think those 1st 2 posts should be swapped around if that is possible?
    I'd vote for that, but it would be setting a precedent of incalculable proportions.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 24,603
    Brom said:

    Has Starmer killed off the Lib Dems? For my money there is enough far left energy within the party to make a few Liberals steer clear and keep hold of a few seats for the yellows.

    Starmer needs the LDs in the West Country and the South East to run the Tories down into hung parliament territory.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842

    It wasn't me. I am a Tory remainer and i would not give Starmer a positive vote. He is a shit of the first order. ..playing politics over people dying... Revolting.

    The temerity to ask difficult questions of the government in a pandemic where we've been one of the worst performing nations on earth.
    The horror !
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    Pulpstar said:

    Not sure Johnson will be the runner for the Tories in 2024.

    The mutterings are getting louder. Tories are noting the recent comments of Patel and now Sunak after this offensive from the left.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,165
    Pulpstar said:

    It wasn't me. I am a Tory remainer and i would not give Starmer a positive vote. He is a shit of the first order. ..playing politics over people dying... Revolting.

    The temerity to ask difficult questions of the government in a pandemic where we've been one of the worst performing nations on earth.
    The horror !
    The big test for the government and the opposition is still to come. If he is grown up about the decisions to come, I'll have a lot of respect for him. I wouldn't put much money on Labour being grown up about it, though.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,004

    Pulpstar said:

    Not sure Johnson will be the runner for the Tories in 2024.

    The mutterings are getting louder. Tories are noting the recent comments of Patel and now Sunak after this offensive from the left.
    Nothing to do with the left.

    All to do with his mishandling of Cummings and he lost me over that
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 24,603

    It wasn't me. I am a Tory remainer and i would not give Starmer a positive vote. He is a shit of the first order. ..playing politics over people dying... Revolting.

    He has done nothing of the sort. He was generally supportive until the wheels came off Johnson's wagon. It is Starmer's job to call the government to account in order to prevent more people dying as a result of government complacency.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,591
    Is the quality of Russian propaganda declining... or do they just know their market ?

    https://twitter.com/MattGertz/status/1270335685514403840
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 14,775

    They might be positive about Starmer, but will they vote for him? I don't think they will.

    I think he's getting good ratings as a leader of the opposition, not as a potential PM.

    One is a necessary first step towards the other.

    The subsequent steps might not be taken, Starmer might not be good enough, but taking the first step is as good as he could hope for two months into the job after the debacle of GE2019.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,288
    Pulpstar said:

    It wasn't me. I am a Tory remainer and i would not give Starmer a positive vote. He is a shit of the first order. ..playing politics over people dying... Revolting.

    The temerity to ask difficult questions of the government in a pandemic where we've been one of the worst performing nations on earth.
    The horror !
    We dont know that we have been the worst. I think there has been a lot of duplicity about the figures. Look at Russia for starters.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,048
    Very hard to do without it looking like a creepy masonic initiation of some kind isn't it? Not wholly successful, but decent attempt to look human doing it by Kier and Angela. The democrats in the scarves and masks looked truly horrifying.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 24,603

    Pulpstar said:

    It wasn't me. I am a Tory remainer and i would not give Starmer a positive vote. He is a shit of the first order. ..playing politics over people dying... Revolting.

    The temerity to ask difficult questions of the government in a pandemic where we've been one of the worst performing nations on earth.
    The horror !
    We dont know that we have been the worst. I think there has been a lot of duplicity about the figures. Look at Russia for starters.
    Well that must make it alright then.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842
    He seems to have triggered both the right and the left in the comments below, so I'm not going to complain.
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 3,853

    They might be positive about Starmer, but will they vote for him? I don't think they will.

    I think he's getting good ratings as a leader of the opposition, not as a potential PM.

    The polling numbers otherwise. Generally incumbents have a huge advantage in Best PM ratings. The latest has Starmer just 1% behind
    Agreed, but is it real? Some people might just be relieved not to see Corbyn there and will be inclined to be positive, especially if they are remainers, as you say. Votes, though? I don't know about that.

    He'll eventually have to say more about what he'd do rather than picking holes in what the government is doing, which is where it gets more difficult.


  • BromBrom Posts: 3,760
    Yeah that image wont go down well with moderates. Cringe worthy.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,603
    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 43,633
    England case numbers out - by specimen date we have -

    image
    image
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,780
    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,780
    RobD said:

    Nigelb said:

    First

    I don't think you've quite got the hang of this, Big_G.
    He's a firm believer in zero-indexing.
    https://xkcd.com/163/
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 24,603
    Nigelb said:

    First

    I don't think you've quite got the hang of this, Big_G.
    I just wish he had added...like Boris in 2024!
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited June 2020
    We’re guided by a commitment to dismantle imperialism, capitalism, white-supremacy, patriarchy and the state structures that disproportionately harm black people in Britain and around the world. We build deep relationships across the diaspora and strategise to challenge the rise of the authoritarian right-wing across the world, from Brazil to Britain.

    https://www.gofundme.com/f/ukblm-fund

    Marxism...
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    All racism is equal, but some is more equal than the rest.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 12,884

    Pulpstar said:

    Not sure Johnson will be the runner for the Tories in 2024.

    The mutterings are getting louder. Tories are noting the recent comments of Patel and now Sunak after this offensive from the left.
    Nothing to do with the left.

    All to do with his mishandling of Cummings and he lost me over that
    How has he "lost" you? You would still vote tory in a hypothetical Johnson vs Starmer GE next week.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941
    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    It does seem like an odd qualifier, certainly. Hard to do these photo ops without it looking forced though.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    His first real mistake?

    we shall see.
  • BromBrom Posts: 3,760
    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    Apparently you can't say all racism is bad or all lives matter, think he's hoping someone might fall into the trap and let the twitter mob eat them up.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,004
    Dura_Ace said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Not sure Johnson will be the runner for the Tories in 2024.

    The mutterings are getting louder. Tories are noting the recent comments of Patel and now Sunak after this offensive from the left.
    Nothing to do with the left.

    All to do with his mishandling of Cummings and he lost me over that
    How has he "lost" you? You would still vote tory in a hypothetical Johnson vs Starmer GE next week.
    I am a conservative and will vote conservative but that does not mean I support Boris anymore than millions who voted labour supported Corbyn
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,603
    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    Is racism against black people worse than racism against Jews? I thought Labour had moved beyond this kind of stuff. I have to say this is incredibly disappointing.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    His first real mistake?

    we shall see.
    Na, it's fluff.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 43,633
    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    Shades of Livingstone after the London bombings - "It was aimed at ordinary, working-class Londoners..."
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,603
    RobD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    His first real mistake?

    we shall see.
    Na, it's fluff.
    Not if you're Asian or Jewish.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941

    We’re guided by a commitment to dismantle imperialism, capitalism, white-supremacy, patriarchy and the state structures that disproportionately harm black people in Britain and around the world. We build deep relationships across the diaspora and strategise to challenge the rise of the authoritarian right-wing across the world, from Brazil to Britain.

    https://www.gofundme.com/f/ukblm-fund

    From Brazil to Britain. It's the new axis, isn't it?
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,669
    https://verify-it-c19data.co.uk
    updated on Tuesday 9 June 2020 at 4:31pm
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mostly been impressed by Starmer, excepting his stupid (though not yet fleshed out) ideas on devolution.

    Not sure his capitulation photo-op will age well. A leader doesn't get on his knees before a mob of vandals.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941
    edited June 2020
    MaxPB said:

    RobD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    His first real mistake?

    we shall see.
    Na, it's fluff.
    Not if you're Asian or Jewish.
    Sorry, that sounded very insensitive. I think a better description would have been a bubble story.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    Someone should write him a letter.
  • BromBrom Posts: 3,760
    RobD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    His first real mistake?

    we shall see.
    Na, it's fluff.
    It's a bit like Theresa in the 'feminist t-shirt'. But I'd imagine this image is a bit more damaging to his brand as a level headed individual. The centre ground was crying out for Labour to move away from identity politics rather than embrace it.

  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,288

    Pulpstar said:

    It wasn't me. I am a Tory remainer and i would not give Starmer a positive vote. He is a shit of the first order. ..playing politics over people dying... Revolting.

    The temerity to ask difficult questions of the government in a pandemic where we've been one of the worst performing nations on earth.
    The horror !
    We dont know that we have been the worst. I think there has been a lot of duplicity about the figures. Look at Russia for starters.
    Well that must make it alright then.
    No it doesnt make it alright but i question the veracity of other countries figures...
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 24,603
    Brom said:

    Yeah that image wont go down well with moderates. Cringe worthy.
    It looks like s misstep to me too. Maybe that is what it is and he just stumbled, otherwise he does look like a bit of a knob!

    Happily, Johnson has made a career of looking a bit of a knob.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,165
    RobD said:

    MaxPB said:

    RobD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    His first real mistake?

    we shall see.
    Na, it's fluff.
    Not if you're Asian or Jewish.
    Sorry, that sounded very insensitive. I think a better description would have been a bubble story.
    Indeed. If you're not surfing sites like this you won't see it. Unless the Tories kick off about it - perhaps Boris goes for Starmer at PMQs - then it won't leave the internet.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited June 2020
    Like the eco-fascists organizers, the BLM movement organizers are about much more than having some statues removed and raising awareness of racism. They are very clear this is about overthrowing the capitalist system. No amount of extra electric cars, planting some trees and relocating some statues in museums will be anywhere near enough.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 24,603

    Pulpstar said:

    It wasn't me. I am a Tory remainer and i would not give Starmer a positive vote. He is a shit of the first order. ..playing politics over people dying... Revolting.

    The temerity to ask difficult questions of the government in a pandemic where we've been one of the worst performing nations on earth.
    The horror !
    We dont know that we have been the worst. I think there has been a lot of duplicity about the figures. Look at Russia for starters.
    Well that must make it alright then.
    No it doesnt make it alright but i question the veracity of other countries figures...
    For the most part they are conveniently inacurate, as it would seem are ours.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,603
    tlg86 said:

    RobD said:

    MaxPB said:

    RobD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    His first real mistake?

    we shall see.
    Na, it's fluff.
    Not if you're Asian or Jewish.
    Sorry, that sounded very insensitive. I think a better description would have been a bubble story.
    Indeed. If you're not surfing sites like this you won't see it. Unless the Tories kick off about it - perhaps Boris goes for Starmer at PMQs - then it won't leave the internet.
    Boris needs to absolutely nail him to the wall on this tomorrow and force Starmer into an unequivocal stand against all racism, not just racism against black people. Honestly I'm actually pretty mad about this, and usually these things don't bother me.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941
    tlg86 said:

    RobD said:

    MaxPB said:

    RobD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    His first real mistake?

    we shall see.
    Na, it's fluff.
    Not if you're Asian or Jewish.
    Sorry, that sounded very insensitive. I think a better description would have been a bubble story.
    Indeed. If you're not surfing sites like this you won't see it. Unless the Tories kick off about it - perhaps Boris goes for Starmer at PMQs - then it won't leave the internet.
    That is what I was trying to say, in an extremely ham-fisted way. :D
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,669

    Like the eco-fascists organizers, the BLM movement organizers are about much more than having some statues removed and raising awareness of racism. They are very clear this is about overthrowing the capitalist system. No amount of extra electric cars, planting some trees and relocating some statues in museums will be anywhere near enough.

    Maybe some don't like being killed by policemen?
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 19,620

    Very hard to do without it looking like a creepy masonic initiation of some kind isn't it? Not wholly successful, but decent attempt to look human doing it by Kier and Angela. The democrats in the scarves and masks looked truly horrifying.
    K E I R

    K – E – I - R

    Why can't PBers spell the Loto's name FFS?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited June 2020
    MaxPB said:

    tlg86 said:

    RobD said:

    MaxPB said:

    RobD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    His first real mistake?

    we shall see.
    Na, it's fluff.
    Not if you're Asian or Jewish.
    Sorry, that sounded very insensitive. I think a better description would have been a bubble story.
    Indeed. If you're not surfing sites like this you won't see it. Unless the Tories kick off about it - perhaps Boris goes for Starmer at PMQs - then it won't leave the internet.
    Boris needs to absolutely nail him to the wall on this tomorrow and force Starmer into an unequivocal stand against all racism, not just racism against black people. Honestly I'm actually pretty mad about this, and usually these things don't bother me.
    Boris problem attacking on this is his long laundry list of insensitive stuff he wrote in the past. I imagine PMQ is going to be very tricky for Boris as it doesn't take a lawyer to dig out a load of those comments and paint him as a racist.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941

    Very hard to do without it looking like a creepy masonic initiation of some kind isn't it? Not wholly successful, but decent attempt to look human doing it by Kier and Angela. The democrats in the scarves and masks looked truly horrifying.
    K E I R

    K – E – I - R

    Why can't PBers spell the Loto's name FFS?
    I'm 98% sure it is intentional at this point. And it really should be Sir Keir. ;)
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540

    Brazil to Britain.

    Only Brazil to Britain? If they're doing it alphabetically that's only Brazil and Britain.....
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    edited June 2020

    Like the eco-fascists organizers, the BLM movement organizers are about much more than having some statues removed and raising awareness of racism. They are very clear this is about overthrowing the capitalist system. No amount of extra electric cars, planting some trees and relocating some statues in museums will be anywhere near enough.

    I think it was Orwell who said that severing a people from its history is an absolutely key cornerstone for the erection of a communist state.

    Year zero, and all that
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,559

    Very hard to do without it looking like a creepy masonic initiation of some kind isn't it? Not wholly successful, but decent attempt to look human doing it by Kier and Angela. The democrats in the scarves and masks looked truly horrifying.
    K E I R

    K – E – I - R

    Why can't PBers spell the Loto's name FFS?
    Probably because we don't Kier that much
  • BromBrom Posts: 3,760

    MaxPB said:

    tlg86 said:

    RobD said:

    MaxPB said:

    RobD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    His first real mistake?

    we shall see.
    Na, it's fluff.
    Not if you're Asian or Jewish.
    Sorry, that sounded very insensitive. I think a better description would have been a bubble story.
    Indeed. If you're not surfing sites like this you won't see it. Unless the Tories kick off about it - perhaps Boris goes for Starmer at PMQs - then it won't leave the internet.
    Boris needs to absolutely nail him to the wall on this tomorrow and force Starmer into an unequivocal stand against all racism, not just racism against black people. Honestly I'm actually pretty mad about this, and usually these things don't bother me.
    Boris problem attacking on this is his long laundry list of insensitive stuff he wrote in the past. I imagine PMQ is going to be very tricky for Boris as it doesn't take a lawyer to dig out a load of those comments and paint him as a racist.
    After yesterday's barnstorming speech I know just the woman for the job...
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    Mr Duns has stuck his head above the parapet with predictable results.....

    https://twitter.com/JeremyDuns/status/1270292119001972738?s=20
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,780

    They might be positive about Starmer, but will they vote for him? I don't think they will.

    I think he's getting good ratings as a leader of the opposition, not as a potential PM.

    The polling numbers otherwise. Generally incumbents have a huge advantage in Best PM ratings. The latest has Starmer just 1% behind
    Agreed, but is it real? Some people might just be relieved not to see Corbyn there and will be inclined to be positive, especially if they are remainers, as you say. Votes, though? I don't know about that.

    He'll eventually have to say more about what he'd do rather than picking holes in what the government is doing, which is where it gets more difficult.


    I would have gone and campaigned against Corbyn (assuming I was in the UK, of course). I despised the man, and all he stood for.

    I am not in any hurry to vote Starmer. But could I? Yes, absolutely. There's nothing about him that would trouble my conscience. And if I didn't like any of the other candidates much (say if Claire-Louise Leyland or David Tredinnick was the alternative), then he's not someone I'd actively vote against.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941

    Brazil to Britain.

    Only Brazil to Britain? If they're doing it alphabetically that's only Brazil and Britain.....
    Those are the two bastions of authoritarian right wing governments, aren't they?
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,415
    RobD said:

    Brazil to Britain.

    Only Brazil to Britain? If they're doing it alphabetically that's only Brazil and Britain.....
    Those are the two bastions of authoritarian right wing governments, aren't they?
    Could have gone on to Brunei -missed a trick
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,559
    rcs1000 said:

    They might be positive about Starmer, but will they vote for him? I don't think they will.

    I think he's getting good ratings as a leader of the opposition, not as a potential PM.

    The polling numbers otherwise. Generally incumbents have a huge advantage in Best PM ratings. The latest has Starmer just 1% behind
    Agreed, but is it real? Some people might just be relieved not to see Corbyn there and will be inclined to be positive, especially if they are remainers, as you say. Votes, though? I don't know about that.

    He'll eventually have to say more about what he'd do rather than picking holes in what the government is doing, which is where it gets more difficult.


    I would have gone and campaigned against Corbyn (assuming I was in the UK, of course). I despised the man, and all he stood for.

    I am not in any hurry to vote Starmer. But could I? Yes, absolutely. There's nothing about him that would trouble my conscience. And if I didn't like any of the other candidates much (say if Claire-Louise Leyland or David Tredinnick was the alternative), then he's not someone I'd actively vote against.
    That's the trouble, "Theres nothing about him". You could stick him on a plinth in the middle of Bristol and no-one would notice.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,288

    Pulpstar said:

    It wasn't me. I am a Tory remainer and i would not give Starmer a positive vote. He is a shit of the first order. ..playing politics over people dying... Revolting.

    The temerity to ask difficult questions of the government in a pandemic where we've been one of the worst performing nations on earth.
    The horror !
    We dont know that we have been the worst. I think there has been a lot of duplicity about the figures. Look at Russia for starters.
    Well that must make it alright then.
    No it doesnt make it alright but i question the veracity of other countries figures...
    For the most part they are conveniently inacurate, as it would seem are ours.
    Typically we play by the rules ..other countries have no such scruples.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,603

    MaxPB said:

    tlg86 said:

    RobD said:

    MaxPB said:

    RobD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    His first real mistake?

    we shall see.
    Na, it's fluff.
    Not if you're Asian or Jewish.
    Sorry, that sounded very insensitive. I think a better description would have been a bubble story.
    Indeed. If you're not surfing sites like this you won't see it. Unless the Tories kick off about it - perhaps Boris goes for Starmer at PMQs - then it won't leave the internet.
    Boris needs to absolutely nail him to the wall on this tomorrow and force Starmer into an unequivocal stand against all racism, not just racism against black people. Honestly I'm actually pretty mad about this, and usually these things don't bother me.
    Boris problem attacking on this is his long laundry list of insensitive stuff he wrote in the past. I imagine PMQ is going to be very tricky for Boris as it doesn't take a lawyer to dig out a load of those comments and paint him as a racist.
    I think a helpful question from someone like Javid (though I'm not sure how many favours he will be willing to give Boris) on whether he agrees with Starmer that the government stands against only racism against black people or against racism across the board.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited June 2020

    Like the eco-fascists organizers, the BLM movement organizers are about much more than having some statues removed and raising awareness of racism. They are very clear this is about overthrowing the capitalist system. No amount of extra electric cars, planting some trees and relocating some statues in museums will be anywhere near enough.

    Maybe some don't like being killed by policemen?
    In the UK? There are thankfully very few instances of the police killing people full stop, and since the case of Stephen Lawrence 27 years ago, the police have undergone a lot of reform. Jean Charles de Menezes is obviously the one where the police actions are seriously questionable.

    We aren't the US, gunning down a 1000 members of the public a year.
  • brokenwheelbrokenwheel Posts: 3,352
    I'm still of the view that most people are barely aware of Starmer.

    Even in polling, which tends to be full of political obsessives, Starmer's ratings have a significant "don't know" percentage.

    At the moment I'm taking leader ratings with a huge dose of salt.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 24,603
    Brom said:

    MaxPB said:

    tlg86 said:

    RobD said:

    MaxPB said:

    RobD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    His first real mistake?

    we shall see.
    Na, it's fluff.
    Not if you're Asian or Jewish.
    Sorry, that sounded very insensitive. I think a better description would have been a bubble story.
    Indeed. If you're not surfing sites like this you won't see it. Unless the Tories kick off about it - perhaps Boris goes for Starmer at PMQs - then it won't leave the internet.
    Boris needs to absolutely nail him to the wall on this tomorrow and force Starmer into an unequivocal stand against all racism, not just racism against black people. Honestly I'm actually pretty mad about this, and usually these things don't bother me.
    Boris problem attacking on this is his long laundry list of insensitive stuff he wrote in the past. I imagine PMQ is going to be very tricky for Boris as it doesn't take a lawyer to dig out a load of those comments and paint him as a racist.
    After yesterday's barnstorming speech I know just the woman for the job...
    It was a barnstormin' speech. But one speech does not a party leader make!
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408

    We’re guided by a commitment to dismantle imperialism, capitalism, white-supremacy, patriarchy and the state structures that disproportionately harm black people in Britain and around the world. We build deep relationships across the diaspora and strategise to challenge the rise of the authoritarian right-wing across the world, from Brazil to Britain.

    https://www.gofundme.com/f/ukblm-fund

    Marxism...

    It's a bit like being green - why is it necessary to come with so much anti capitalist stuff? It isn't in other countries.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 14,775

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    His first real mistake?

    we shall see.
    Oh, I'm sure he's made several. Legions of errors.

    Another fairly large one was not following the advice of @MaxPB over Cummings and taking the high road of appealing to people to follow government Coronavirus advice regardless of the failure of government advisers to do the same. He preferred to restrict himself to blaming the government for that consequence then to try to prevent it.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 43,633

    Very hard to do without it looking like a creepy masonic initiation of some kind isn't it? Not wholly successful, but decent attempt to look human doing it by Kier and Angela. The democrats in the scarves and masks looked truly horrifying.
    K E I R

    K – E – I - R

    Why can't PBers spell the Loto's name FFS?
    We collectively apologise to you and Lord Keith, the LOTO
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408

    We’re guided by a commitment to dismantle imperialism, capitalism, white-supremacy, patriarchy and the state structures that disproportionately harm black people in Britain and around the world. We build deep relationships across the diaspora and strategise to challenge the rise of the authoritarian right-wing across the world, from Brazil to Britain.

    https://www.gofundme.com/f/ukblm-fund

    Marxism...

    At least they are honest about only worrying about the wrong kind of authoritarian.
  • AndrewAndrew Posts: 2,900
    Trump -11 approval ......... with Rasmussen (44-55)

    All historical here:
    https://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/trump_administration/trump_approval_index_history



  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited June 2020
    kle4 said:

    We’re guided by a commitment to dismantle imperialism, capitalism, white-supremacy, patriarchy and the state structures that disproportionately harm black people in Britain and around the world. We build deep relationships across the diaspora and strategise to challenge the rise of the authoritarian right-wing across the world, from Brazil to Britain.

    https://www.gofundme.com/f/ukblm-fund

    Marxism...

    It's a bit like being green - why is it necessary to come with so much anti capitalist stuff? It isn't in other countries.
    It isn't everybody, but the organizers. You don't have to look that hard to find that the eco-fascists lot have a very long history of far left extremism. What they have found is a cause that have wider public support and can use that agenda to promote their wider vision.

    And shock horror, you read an article by one of the founders and it is again all British Empire, white-supremacy, patriacrchy, class stuff.

    Extinction Rebellion isn’t about the Climate

    https://medium.com/extinction-rebellion/extinction-rebellion-isnt-about-the-climate-42a0a73d9d49
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,235
    edited June 2020
    I wonder what the Right's reaction will be when Boris 'takes the knee' (as I reckon he will).
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842

    I wonder the Right's reaction will be when Boris 'takes the knee' (as I reckon he will).
    Starmer's got his knee in first. A big power play in the virtue games.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    tlg86 said:

    RobD said:

    MaxPB said:

    RobD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    His first real mistake?

    we shall see.
    Na, it's fluff.
    Not if you're Asian or Jewish.
    Sorry, that sounded very insensitive. I think a better description would have been a bubble story.
    Indeed. If you're not surfing sites like this you won't see it. Unless the Tories kick off about it - perhaps Boris goes for Starmer at PMQs - then it won't leave the internet.
    Boris needs to absolutely nail him to the wall on this tomorrow and force Starmer into an unequivocal stand against all racism, not just racism against black people. Honestly I'm actually pretty mad about this, and usually these things don't bother me.
    Boris problem attacking on this is his long laundry list of insensitive stuff he wrote in the past. I imagine PMQ is going to be very tricky for Boris as it doesn't take a lawyer to dig out a load of those comments and paint him as a racist.
    I think a helpful question from someone like Javid (though I'm not sure how many favours he will be willing to give Boris) on whether he agrees with Starmer that the government stands against only racism against black people or against racism across the board.
    I think it would be wiser and less risky not to overplay it. Corbyn had a litany of past unsavoury associations to anchor that kind of attack, Wheras as some have said here its Starmers first mistake.
  • BannedinnParisBannedinnParis Posts: 1,884

    We’re guided by a commitment to dismantle imperialism, capitalism, white-supremacy, patriarchy and the state structures that disproportionately harm black people in Britain and around the world. We build deep relationships across the diaspora and strategise to challenge the rise of the authoritarian right-wing across the world, from Brazil to Britain.

    https://www.gofundme.com/f/ukblm-fund

    Marxism...

    fire up the Well quite klaxon
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556

    Very hard to do without it looking like a creepy masonic initiation of some kind isn't it? Not wholly successful, but decent attempt to look human doing it by Kier and Angela. The democrats in the scarves and masks looked truly horrifying.
    K E I R

    K – E – I - R

    Why can't PBers spell the Loto's name FFS?
    We collectively apologise to you and Lord Keith, the LOTO
    Sir Keira Knightly, please!
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818

    I wonder what the Right's reaction will be when Boris 'takes the knee' (as I reckon he will).
    Oh he will
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 38,865
    So anyway - I just wanted to post up a suggested answer to the burning question of the last few days regarding statues - the famous "where do we draw the line?"

    There can be no single answer to this since people will have different takes on it (as we have seen). Therefore we need a template and I think the following works.

    Category 1 - Statues we are utterly repulsed by and we applaud "the mob" pulling them down whilst accepting that charges should probably follow since after all the law is the law.

    Category 2 - Statues we would quite like to see the back of but not so much as to applaud "the mob" pulling them down and charges really ought to follow because, you know, the law is the law.

    Category 3 - Statues we are fine with and if "the mob" were to pull them down we would condemn it - the action and the mob - and be calling out for charges asap because we simply cannot tolerate this sort of thing.

    Category 4 - Statues we love and mean a great deal to us whereby if "the mob" were to pull them down we would be looking to form a mob of our own to give the mob a taste of what's coming to them.

    Category 5 - Churchill.

    :smile:
  • BannedinnParisBannedinnParis Posts: 1,884

    I wonder what the Right's reaction will be when Boris 'takes the knee' (as I reckon he will).
    I genuinely fear he might not be able to get back up again if he does.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 12,884

    I wonder what the Right's reaction will be when Boris 'takes the knee' (as I reckon he will).
    They'll love it. Tories are right into identity politics these days.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,603
    kle4 said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    tlg86 said:

    RobD said:

    MaxPB said:

    RobD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    "Anti-Black racism" Starmer shows that Asians are no longer considered worthy.

    I'm now of the belief that if you gave Starmer enough wine he'd start explaining how racism against Asians isn't as bad as racism against black people.

    It's actually quite a shocking statement for all Asians in the UK that we're not considered worth protesting for by the Labour leader. I hope Patel, Javid and Sunak pick up on this.
    What a stupid thing for Starmer to say. He could just have gone with "We kneel with all those opposing racism."
    His first real mistake?

    we shall see.
    Na, it's fluff.
    Not if you're Asian or Jewish.
    Sorry, that sounded very insensitive. I think a better description would have been a bubble story.
    Indeed. If you're not surfing sites like this you won't see it. Unless the Tories kick off about it - perhaps Boris goes for Starmer at PMQs - then it won't leave the internet.
    Boris needs to absolutely nail him to the wall on this tomorrow and force Starmer into an unequivocal stand against all racism, not just racism against black people. Honestly I'm actually pretty mad about this, and usually these things don't bother me.
    Boris problem attacking on this is his long laundry list of insensitive stuff he wrote in the past. I imagine PMQ is going to be very tricky for Boris as it doesn't take a lawyer to dig out a load of those comments and paint him as a racist.
    I think a helpful question from someone like Javid (though I'm not sure how many favours he will be willing to give Boris) on whether he agrees with Starmer that the government stands against only racism against black people or against racism across the board.
    I think it would be wiser and less risky not to overplay it. Corbyn had a litany of past unsavoury associations to anchor that kind of attack, Wheras as some have said here its Starmers first mistake.
    Tbh, the best attack would be to challenge Asian and Jewish Labour MPs to distance themselves from this statement.
This discussion has been closed.