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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Let us not forget how much Corbyn contributed to Johnson’s GE2

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  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    DavidL said:

    Johnson is objectively unpopular as per polling.

    If you think he's unpopular now wait until the winter.
    I think you greatly overestimate what change is coming.

    Furlough through lockdown has worked to avoid the worst of what could have happened.
    Now there's a hostage to fortune. We are a long, long way from being out of this yet, medically or economically, economically especially.
    Oh absolutely but for all those predicting calamity (of which contrarian certainly is one) I think it is vastly overestimated.

    It will be bad, economically it will get worse before it gets better. But it's not going to be awful.
    It is going to be terrible.

    The question is *how long* the terrible bit will last. If we have an extreme V shape recovery to a level not far from where the economy was...

    I rather think we will see an extreme V shape, but not to the level of where the economy was. So, we will end up with a recession, rather than a long depression.
    I agree. But I also think that necessity is the mother of invention and businesses are making a decades worth of efficiency innovations in a few months now.

    So after the recession I expect we will see rapid growth due to improved efficiency. I'm hopeful the UK will be booming by 2024.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 4,556



    I think it is fair to describe Margaret Thatcher as both a Europhile and a Eurosceptic PM too.

    I agree. Because the Common Market itself changed during her premiership. She was phile when it was moderate, phobe when it started to overreach.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Johnson is objectively unpopular as per polling.

    If you think he's unpopular now wait until the winter.
    I think you greatly overestimate what change is coming.

    Furlough through lockdown has worked to avoid the worst of what could have happened.
    How would that work? Furlough has ameliorated things over the past three months, but what effect could it possibly have on the availability of jobs this coming autumn/winter?
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    IshmaelZ said:

    Johnson is objectively unpopular as per polling.

    If you think he's unpopular now wait until the winter.
    I think you greatly overestimate what change is coming.

    Furlough through lockdown has worked to avoid the worst of what could have happened.
    How would that work? Furlough has ameliorated things over the past three months, but what effect could it possibly have on the availability of jobs this coming autumn/winter?
    Without it even healthy businesses that can reopen now and through winter would have gone bust.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,584
    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Are there really that many people on a baseball team?!

    That's both teams
    I know, but even just on one side it looked like a long line.
    Squad size is 25. Pitchers don't pitch every day. There are usually 5 starters who rotate every 4 to 5 days. But they very rarely complete a full 9 innings. So there is a bullpen of relievers who come on as and when needed.
    8 position players plus subs for injuries etc.
    So 9 on the field. Remember they play 162 3 hour plus games a season normally.
    Baseball is a great game to watch. The best of American Stadium sports, and so much better than cricket.
    Moderators for goodness sake. Is there no limits on the outrageousness of opinions on this site anymore?
    @Foxy is normally such a polite and sensible chap, so I think they gave him a pass this time.
    A sensible chap who doesn't like cricket? I am going to need to think about that, its a 3 patch problem as Sherlock used to say.
    Yes, I am not a cricket fan. Perhaps it is my teenage years in the USA that meant I never played either cricket or rugby at school, so never developed the taste. Baseball was the sport that I enjoyed most at school, and even at Little League level it is a good game to play and watch.
    Fair enough - though baseball has always seemed to me like cricket, but with an entire dimension removed.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 40,950

    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Are there really that many people on a baseball team?!

    That's both teams
    I know, but even just on one side it looked like a long line.
    Squad size is 25. Pitchers don't pitch every day. There are usually 5 starters who rotate every 4 to 5 days. But they very rarely complete a full 9 innings. So there is a bullpen of relievers who come on as and when needed.
    8 position players plus subs for injuries etc.
    So 9 on the field. Remember they play 162 3 hour plus games a season normally.
    Baseball is a great game to watch. The best of American Stadium sports, and so much better than cricket.
    Moderators for goodness sake. Is there no limits on the outrageousness of opinions on this site anymore?
    @Foxy is normally such a polite and sensible chap, so I think they gave him a pass this time.
    A sensible chap who doesn't like cricket? I am going to need to think about that, its a 3 patch problem as Sherlock used to say.
    Yes, I am not a cricket fan. Perhaps it is my teenage years in the USA that meant I never played either cricket or rugby at school, so never developed the taste. Baseball was the sport that I enjoyed most at school, and even at Little League level it is a good game to play and watch.
    If I lived in the States and had to pick a US sport to get into it would be that one - baseball. It seems to have more to it than the other two.
    From American sports it'd be that or NASCAR for me. Followed by watching paint dry.
    whaat? Gotta be hockey.

    And not the limey hockey either.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Fishing said:



    I think it is fair to describe Margaret Thatcher as both a Europhile and a Eurosceptic PM too.

    I agree. Because the Common Market itself changed during her premiership. She was phile when it was moderate, phobe when it started to overreach.
    100%

    Pre and post Jacques Delors Europe was very different. As is said when the facts change I change my mind and that is what she did.

    I thought until Cameron it'd be possible to negotiate back to some form of Common Market arrangement. Cameron showed that was impossible with his failed negotiations.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 38,852

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Are there really that many people on a baseball team?!

    That's both teams
    I know, but even just on one side it looked like a long line.
    Squad size is 25. Pitchers don't pitch every day. There are usually 5 starters who rotate every 4 to 5 days. But they very rarely complete a full 9 innings. So there is a bullpen of relievers who come on as and when needed.
    8 position players plus subs for injuries etc.
    So 9 on the field. Remember they play 162 3 hour plus games a season normally.
    Baseball is a great game to watch. The best of American Stadium sports, and so much better than cricket.
    Moderators for goodness sake. Is there no limits on the outrageousness of opinions on this site anymore?
    @Foxy is normally such a polite and sensible chap, so I think they gave him a pass this time.
    A sensible chap who doesn't like cricket? I am going to need to think about that, its a 3 patch problem as Sherlock used to say.
    Yes, I am not a cricket fan. Perhaps it is my teenage years in the USA that meant I never played either cricket or rugby at school, so never developed the taste. Baseball was the sport that I enjoyed most at school, and even at Little League level it is a good game to play and watch.
    If I lived in the States and had to pick a US sport to get into it would be that one - baseball. It seems to have more to it than the other two.
    From American sports it'd be that or NASCAR for me. Followed by watching paint dry.
    NASCAR very right wing - so I can see you becoming a big fan.
    I don't like the American right though.

    Reagan right yes. Arnold Schwarzenegger right yes. Mitt Romney right yes.

    But the religious right? Dubya? Today's GOP? No thanks.

    Until the GOP regains sanity I'd rather vote Democrat.
    I believe NASCAR is "working class libertarian right" but there is less nuttery than you might expect from that term - although very pro gun needless to say - and it is largely free of evangelicalism. So on the whole I think you'll be OK with it. The great news is it used to be big for Trump but no more. Health care is important to NASCAR and it can see what a pig's ear he's made of that.
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,060
    On the subject of US sports in there a market on the Washington Football Team’s new name? If so this might be interesting: https://loweringthebar.net/2020/07/whos-trying-to-trademark-every-name.html
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941
    DavidL said:
    Australia is for sure. ;)
  • NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 3,346
    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,584
    This is a far better version of a header I was toying with the idea of writing.

    8 Big Reasons Election Day 2020 Could Be a Disaster
    https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2020/07/24/2020-election-disaster-perfect-storm-372778

    (If you’re interested in US politics, the Politico Magazine section regularly has some good articles.)
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    Johnson is objectively unpopular as per polling.

    If you think he's unpopular now wait until the winter.
    I think you greatly overestimate what change is coming.

    Furlough through lockdown has worked to avoid the worst of what could have happened.
    Doesn’t that depend on the Brexit deal?
    No probably not. The significance of a Brexit deal is greatly overestimated too.
  • MonkeysMonkeys Posts: 755
    DavidL said:
    No, but no-one said it was.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. Teacher, the Edmonton Eskimos very recently (few days ago, I think) dropped their name. They're currently known as Edmonton Football Team, I believe, until a permanent alternative is found.
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,060
    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Are there really that many people on a baseball team?!

    That's both teams
    I know, but even just on one side it looked like a long line.
    Squad size is 25. Pitchers don't pitch every day. There are usually 5 starters who rotate every 4 to 5 days. But they very rarely complete a full 9 innings. So there is a bullpen of relievers who come on as and when needed.
    8 position players plus subs for injuries etc.
    So 9 on the field. Remember they play 162 3 hour plus games a season normally.
    Baseball is a great game to watch. The best of American Stadium sports, and so much better than cricket.
    Moderators for goodness sake. Is there no limits on the outrageousness of opinions on this site anymore?
    @Foxy is normally such a polite and sensible chap, so I think they gave him a pass this time.
    A sensible chap who doesn't like cricket? I am going to need to think about that, its a 3 patch problem as Sherlock used to say.
    Yes, I am not a cricket fan. Perhaps it is my teenage years in the USA that meant I never played either cricket or rugby at school, so never developed the taste. Baseball was the sport that I enjoyed most at school, and even at Little League level it is a good game to play and watch.
    If I lived in the States and had to pick a US sport to get into it would be that one - baseball. It seems to have more to it than the other two.
    From American sports it'd be that or NASCAR for me. Followed by watching paint dry.
    NASCAR very right wing - so I can see you becoming a big fan.
    I don't like the American right though.

    Reagan right yes. Arnold Schwarzenegger right yes. Mitt Romney right yes.

    But the religious right? Dubya? Today's GOP? No thanks.

    Until the GOP regains sanity I'd rather vote Democrat.
    I believe NASCAR is "working class libertarian right" but there is less nuttery than you might expect from that term - although very pro gun needless to say - and it is largely free of evangelicalism. So on the whole I think you'll be OK with it. The great news is it used to be big for Trump but no more. Health care is important to NASCAR and it can see what a pig's ear he's made of that.
    I’m surprised you think NASCAR is right wing: I thought that on most circuits they only turned left...
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 38,852

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Are there really that many people on a baseball team?!

    That's both teams
    I know, but even just on one side it looked like a long line.
    Squad size is 25. Pitchers don't pitch every day. There are usually 5 starters who rotate every 4 to 5 days. But they very rarely complete a full 9 innings. So there is a bullpen of relievers who come on as and when needed.
    8 position players plus subs for injuries etc.
    So 9 on the field. Remember they play 162 3 hour plus games a season normally.
    Baseball is a great game to watch. The best of American Stadium sports, and so much better than cricket.
    Moderators for goodness sake. Is there no limits on the outrageousness of opinions on this site anymore?
    @Foxy is normally such a polite and sensible chap, so I think they gave him a pass this time.
    A sensible chap who doesn't like cricket? I am going to need to think about that, its a 3 patch problem as Sherlock used to say.
    Yes, I am not a cricket fan. Perhaps it is my teenage years in the USA that meant I never played either cricket or rugby at school, so never developed the taste. Baseball was the sport that I enjoyed most at school, and even at Little League level it is a good game to play and watch.
    If I lived in the States and had to pick a US sport to get into it would be that one - baseball. It seems to have more to it than the other two.
    From American sports it'd be that or NASCAR for me. Followed by watching paint dry.
    NASCAR very right wing - so I can see you becoming a big fan.
    I don't like contrived sports and US sports generally are very contrived (and hyped) . For me the best sports to watch and participate are the purest one - athletics , swimming , boxing ,horse racing etc. Anything with loads of rules bores me (as do rules generally in life) . I like individual sports best .
    I'll probably shock the blog with this but my favourite sport is golf.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,768

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Are there really that many people on a baseball team?!

    That's both teams
    I know, but even just on one side it looked like a long line.
    Squad size is 25. Pitchers don't pitch every day. There are usually 5 starters who rotate every 4 to 5 days. But they very rarely complete a full 9 innings. So there is a bullpen of relievers who come on as and when needed.
    8 position players plus subs for injuries etc.
    So 9 on the field. Remember they play 162 3 hour plus games a season normally.
    Baseball is a great game to watch. The best of American Stadium sports, and so much better than cricket.
    Moderators for goodness sake. Is there no limits on the outrageousness of opinions on this site anymore?
    @Foxy is normally such a polite and sensible chap, so I think they gave him a pass this time.
    A sensible chap who doesn't like cricket? I am going to need to think about that, its a 3 patch problem as Sherlock used to say.
    Yes, I am not a cricket fan. Perhaps it is my teenage years in the USA that meant I never played either cricket or rugby at school, so never developed the taste. Baseball was the sport that I enjoyed most at school, and even at Little League level it is a good game to play and watch.
    If I lived in the States and had to pick a US sport to get into it would be that one - baseball. It seems to have more to it than the other two.
    From American sports it'd be that or NASCAR for me. Followed by watching paint dry.
    NASCAR very right wing - so I can see you becoming a big fan.
    I don't like the American right though.

    Reagan right yes. Arnold Schwarzenegger right yes. Mitt Romney right yes.

    But the religious right? Dubya? Today's GOP? No thanks.

    Until the GOP regains sanity I'd rather vote Democrat.
    I believe NASCAR is "working class libertarian right" but there is less nuttery than you might expect from that term - although very pro gun needless to say - and it is largely free of evangelicalism. So on the whole I think you'll be OK with it. The great news is it used to be big for Trump but no more. Health care is important to NASCAR and it can see what a pig's ear he's made of that.
    I’m surprised you think NASCAR is right wing: I thought that on most circuits they only turned left...
    Like Brexit negotiations, they keep going round in pointless circles to get back to where they started.
  • Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 4,572
    IshmaelZ said:

    Johnson is objectively unpopular as per polling.

    If you think he's unpopular now wait until the winter.
    I think you greatly overestimate what change is coming.

    Furlough through lockdown has worked to avoid the worst of what could have happened.
    How would that work? Furlough has ameliorated things over the past three months, but what effect could it possibly have on the availability of jobs this coming autumn/winter?
    Speaking only for the leisure business which I help manage, we have just agreed redundancy terms with one of our employees as part of a plan for staff savings as we restructure. Part of the package being that he'll remain on furlough until the end of October when he formally leaves. It's no coincidence that furlough ends at the same date. The government is effectively subsidising the redundancy package through furlough for the next 3 months.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 40,950

    Johnson is objectively unpopular as per polling.

    If you think he's unpopular now wait until the winter.
    I think you greatly overestimate what change is coming.

    Furlough through lockdown has worked to avoid the worst of what could have happened.
    Doesn’t that depend on the Brexit deal?
    No probably not. The significance of a Brexit deal is greatly overestimated too.
    And in answer to your question about Stormont. Yes they do get a vote in 4yrs. But as has been pointed out to you repeatedly, it is a fiction to think that something, anything, will come out of that vote that is not the same as the several options we have now.

    Either a border between NI & GB as we have now (and which Boris Johnson said...oh well you know what he said).

    Or the entire UK in a customs union with the EU.

    The idea that a reject vote will somehow allow the UK to cut free of the EU and have done with it is, I'm afraid to say, exactly what Boris wanted the idiots to think could happen. But it can't.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 12,883
    felix said:



    You assume people's views under 40 remian the same by the time they are 50, 60, etc. History suggests they change.

    Lots of people don't change as well. The tory has been forced, time after time, to adopt increasingly progressive positions on the environment, marriage equality, etc. because all their daft old voters keep dying and the next crop don't share the same prejudices. It'll be the same with not being a twat about European integration.
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,060

    Mr. Teacher, the Edmonton Eskimos very recently (few days ago, I think) dropped their name. They're currently known as Edmonton Football Team, I believe, until a permanent alternative is found.

    I wonder if the Braves and the Chiefs will also have to change? I’m not sure those terms are ethnic slurs in the same way as the Washington team name was, but there may be some questions asked.

    Are there any UK team names that might be problematic? I know that a few pub names have been changed over the years.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 38,852
    HYUFD said:
    This means that if you get 5 students in a room over there the chances are that one of them supports Donald Trump. Quite an uneasy thought. Especially if there's no way to spot which one it is.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818

    DavidL said:

    Johnson is objectively unpopular as per polling.

    If you think he's unpopular now wait until the winter.
    I think you greatly overestimate what change is coming.

    Furlough through lockdown has worked to avoid the worst of what could have happened.
    Now there's a hostage to fortune. We are a long, long way from being out of this yet, medically or economically, economically especially.
    Oh absolutely but for all those predicting calamity (of which contrarian certainly is one) I think it is vastly overestimated.

    It will be bad, economically it will get worse before it gets better. But it's not going to be awful.
    It is going to be terrible.

    The question is *how long* the terrible bit will last. If we have an extreme V shape recovery to a level not far from where the economy was...

    I rather think we will see an extreme V shape, but not to the level of where the economy was. So, we will end up with a recession, rather than a long depression.
    I agree. But I also think that necessity is the mother of invention and businesses are making a decades worth of efficiency innovations in a few months now.

    So after the recession I expect we will see rapid growth due to improved efficiency. I'm hopeful the UK will be booming by 2024.
    There are far too many obstacles in the way of a decent recovery, now and in the medium term. Call it COVID, call it lockdown, doesn't matter in effect. And the mask thing maintains the horrible climate of fear, intimidation and acrimony.

    Its the least business friendly environment I can remember.
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,060
    edited July 2020
    ydoethur said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Are there really that many people on a baseball team?!

    That's both teams
    I know, but even just on one side it looked like a long line.
    Squad size is 25. Pitchers don't pitch every day. There are usually 5 starters who rotate every 4 to 5 days. But they very rarely complete a full 9 innings. So there is a bullpen of relievers who come on as and when needed.
    8 position players plus subs for injuries etc.
    So 9 on the field. Remember they play 162 3 hour plus games a season normally.
    Baseball is a great game to watch. The best of American Stadium sports, and so much better than cricket.
    Moderators for goodness sake. Is there no limits on the outrageousness of opinions on this site anymore?
    @Foxy is normally such a polite and sensible chap, so I think they gave him a pass this time.
    A sensible chap who doesn't like cricket? I am going to need to think about that, its a 3 patch problem as Sherlock used to say.
    Yes, I am not a cricket fan. Perhaps it is my teenage years in the USA that meant I never played either cricket or rugby at school, so never developed the taste. Baseball was the sport that I enjoyed most at school, and even at Little League level it is a good game to play and watch.
    If I lived in the States and had to pick a US sport to get into it would be that one - baseball. It seems to have more to it than the other two.
    From American sports it'd be that or NASCAR for me. Followed by watching paint dry.
    NASCAR very right wing - so I can see you becoming a big fan.
    I don't like the American right though.

    Reagan right yes. Arnold Schwarzenegger right yes. Mitt Romney right yes.

    But the religious right? Dubya? Today's GOP? No thanks.

    Until the GOP regains sanity I'd rather vote Democrat.
    I believe NASCAR is "working class libertarian right" but there is less nuttery than you might expect from that term - although very pro gun needless to say - and it is largely free of evangelicalism. So on the whole I think you'll be OK with it. The great news is it used to be big for Trump but no more. Health care is important to NASCAR and it can see what a pig's ear he's made of that.
    I’m surprised you think NASCAR is right wing: I thought that on most circuits they only turned left...
    Like Brexit negotiations, they keep going round in pointless circles to get back to where they started.
    My classes tend not to believe me when I tell them my average velocity walking to school is higher than the average velocity of Lewis Hamilton winning a Grand Prix...

    Edit: that is until after I’ve explained the difference between velocity and speed.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,712
    edited July 2020

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Are there really that many people on a baseball team?!

    That's both teams
    I know, but even just on one side it looked like a long line.
    Squad size is 25. Pitchers don't pitch every day. There are usually 5 starters who rotate every 4 to 5 days. But they very rarely complete a full 9 innings. So there is a bullpen of relievers who come on as and when needed.
    8 position players plus subs for injuries etc.
    So 9 on the field. Remember they play 162 3 hour plus games a season normally.
    Baseball is a great game to watch. The best of American Stadium sports, and so much better than cricket.
    Moderators for goodness sake. Is there no limits on the outrageousness of opinions on this site anymore?
    @Foxy is normally such a polite and sensible chap, so I think they gave him a pass this time.
    A sensible chap who doesn't like cricket? I am going to need to think about that, its a 3 patch problem as Sherlock used to say.
    Yes, I am not a cricket fan. Perhaps it is my teenage years in the USA that meant I never played either cricket or rugby at school, so never developed the taste. Baseball was the sport that I enjoyed most at school, and even at Little League level it is a good game to play and watch.
    If I lived in the States and had to pick a US sport to get into it would be that one - baseball. It seems to have more to it than the other two.
    From American sports it'd be that or NASCAR for me. Followed by watching paint dry.
    NASCAR very right wing - so I can see you becoming a big fan.
    I don't like the American right though.

    Reagan right yes. Arnold Schwarzenegger right yes. Mitt Romney right yes.

    But the religious right? Dubya? Today's GOP? No thanks.

    Until the GOP regains sanity I'd rather vote Democrat.
    Romney lost, Trump and Dubya won.

    The GOP goes where the US voters send it and there are far more evangelicals in the USA than there are libertarians
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. Teacher, not sure, but it wouldn't surprise me.

    I don't actually follow Canadian football (shocking, I know) just happened to learn about Edmonton for reasons that are strange and mysterious. Seems odd to drop a name without one lined up to replace it.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Are there really that many people on a baseball team?!

    That's both teams
    I know, but even just on one side it looked like a long line.
    Squad size is 25. Pitchers don't pitch every day. There are usually 5 starters who rotate every 4 to 5 days. But they very rarely complete a full 9 innings. So there is a bullpen of relievers who come on as and when needed.
    8 position players plus subs for injuries etc.
    So 9 on the field. Remember they play 162 3 hour plus games a season normally.
    Baseball is a great game to watch. The best of American Stadium sports, and so much better than cricket.
    Moderators for goodness sake. Is there no limits on the outrageousness of opinions on this site anymore?
    @Foxy is normally such a polite and sensible chap, so I think they gave him a pass this time.
    A sensible chap who doesn't like cricket? I am going to need to think about that, its a 3 patch problem as Sherlock used to say.
    Yes, I am not a cricket fan. Perhaps it is my teenage years in the USA that meant I never played either cricket or rugby at school, so never developed the taste. Baseball was the sport that I enjoyed most at school, and even at Little League level it is a good game to play and watch.
    If I lived in the States and had to pick a US sport to get into it would be that one - baseball. It seems to have more to it than the other two.
    From American sports it'd be that or NASCAR for me. Followed by watching paint dry.
    NASCAR very right wing - so I can see you becoming a big fan.
    I don't like the American right though.

    Reagan right yes. Arnold Schwarzenegger right yes. Mitt Romney right yes.

    But the religious right? Dubya? Today's GOP? No thanks.

    Until the GOP regains sanity I'd rather vote Democrat.
    Romney lost, Trump and Dubya won.

    The GOP goes where the US voters send it
    The democrats would have you believe there are republicans that they 'like' and republicans they can 'work with'

    What they mean by that is Republicans they expect to beat.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 43,625
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-53523682

    Retail sales V shaped recovery - though a big transfer between sectors within retail.

    Interesting.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,074

    Carnyx said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    nichomar said:



    Johnson is the kind of male I avoid having anything to do with, his blokey humor and faux toff image is not my cup of tea, his attitude to marriage and fidelity don’t help I do wonder though if those appear to love him actually switched votes in the election as they appear to be natural tories.

    His book on cars is the worst thing ever written in the entire history of English prose composition.
    His thoughts on gearboxes, or his use of gerunds?
    I have never read his book on cars, but have read his Churchill book and it was awful. It was as though he watching the X-factor and thought, "oh I ought to get that into the title to make it a bit more populist", and so about half way through there is an attempt to refer to the book's title as an after thought. The rest of the book has no fresh research and no particular slant or insight. It was definitely the worst political bio I have ever read, well almost read, as I gave up 3/4 of the way through it's tedious pages.
    Worth reading Richard Evans’ review - https://www.newstatesman.com/books/2014/11/one-man-who-made-history-another-who-seems-just-make-it-boris-churchill.

    Very scathing and funny.
  • NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 3,346
    A political decision not a medical/scientific one

    https://twitter.com/deb_cohen/status/1282244773030633473
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 23,934
    HYUFD said:

    Foxy said:

    HYUFD said:

    isam said:

    Pulpstar said:

    On topic, it is interesting to see how people continue to underestimate Boris.

    "He only won because of Corbyn". Despite the fact that Corbyn took seats from Theresa May in 2017
    "He only won in London because of Ken Livingstone". Despite the fact that Livingstone beat Steve Norris twice
    "Brexit only won because of a lie on a bus" etc etc

    Too many clever people still fall for the bumbling buffoon act and can't understand why he keeps winning.

    i Wonder why Mike doesnt post a poll of why Millions switched to Lab in 2017?


    Corbyn's 2017 Brexit strategy wasn't a bad one.
    How people buy this nonsense of Corbyn being a drag on the Labour vote when they have the 2017 GE staring them in the face is quite unsettling
    I've said many times disregarding the 2017 result is very silly.

    Something happened in that election for Corbyn to do so unexpectedly well and I can't believe "not May" did it.
    Large numbers of people voted for Labour - despite Corbyn - in the belief that a coalition in parliament would stop Brexit?
    Then why didn't that happen in 2019?

    My theory is that Corbyn was neutral in 2017 and by 2019 he was hated.

    Therefore if Starmer is either neutral or liked, he should do the same or better.

    What we know is that Labour can achieve 40% of the vote.
    From 2017 to 2019 the Labour vote fell by 8%, the LD vote rose by 4% and the Tory vote rose by 1% and the SNP and Green vote each rose by 1% and the Brexit Party got 2% compared to 1% for UKIP in 2017.

    So basically in 2017 Corbyn got Remainers on board by suggesting he would fight to stop a hard Brexit while keeping Leavers on board by suggesting he would deliver Brexit.

    In the end he did neither and thus in 2019 he lost Remainers to the LDs and Greens and SNP and Leavers to the Tories and Brexit Party
    Nope, very little to do with Brexit as shown in the headline. Even though you didn't vote for Brexit, you seem obsessed by it's effect on Tory votes as the most committed Brexit believer!

    The reality is that in 2017 no-one thought Corbyn would win, indeed for some time it looked like a TMay landslide. By 2019 even the most apolitical knew what Corbyn was about; that he was fundamentally stupid and to many peoples' sensibilities, very unpatriotic. At that point many people feared he could win.

    Also let us remember, it wasn't that long ago politically that people voted for Blair by landslide. He was probably the only genuinely "Europhile" PM in history and all the red wall voters loved him. Europe and Brexit are a lot less important to the average voter than Brexiters fantasise about. 2019 was a vote to stop Corbyn, and while I loathe the fat charlatan, I am slightly grateful we do not have a Corbyn government.
    I think it fair to describe Ted Heath as a Europhile PM.
    Indeed in the late 1960s and early 1970s under Heath the Tories were more pro EEC than Labour under Wilson, with a few exceptions like Enoch Powell
    Even through the 1980s. Roy Jenkins and the Gang of Four had split to bring down Labour's average, while the Conservatives enthusiastically joined (and even created) the Single Market, Maastricht and the ERM.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 50,776
    I am getting some free articles from the Economist at the moment which is something of a mixed blessing but I thought that this one was a good summary of where we are at in terms of macroeconomic thinking: https://www.economist.com/briefing/2020/07/25/the-covid-19-pandemic-is-forcing-a-rethink-in-macroeconomics?fsrc=newsletter&utm_campaign=the-economist-today&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_source=salesforce-marketing-cloud&utm_term=2020-07-23&utm_content=article-link-1

    The implications of the genuinely radical responses to Covid for future government and economic policy may be far more long lasting than is often assumed.
  • brokenwheelbrokenwheel Posts: 3,352
    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:
    This means that if you get 5 students in a room over there the chances are that one of them supports Donald Trump. Quite an uneasy thought. Especially if there's no way to spot which one it is.
    How about red triangles?
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,060
    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:
    This means that if you get 5 students in a room over there the chances are that one of them supports Donald Trump. Quite an uneasy thought. Especially if there's no way to spot which one it is.
    The one with the MAGA hat would be my guess.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,712

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Are there really that many people on a baseball team?!

    That's both teams
    I know, but even just on one side it looked like a long line.
    Squad size is 25. Pitchers don't pitch every day. There are usually 5 starters who rotate every 4 to 5 days. But they very rarely complete a full 9 innings. So there is a bullpen of relievers who come on as and when needed.
    8 position players plus subs for injuries etc.
    So 9 on the field. Remember they play 162 3 hour plus games a season normally.
    Baseball is a great game to watch. The best of American Stadium sports, and so much better than cricket.
    Moderators for goodness sake. Is there no limits on the outrageousness of opinions on this site anymore?
    @Foxy is normally such a polite and sensible chap, so I think they gave him a pass this time.
    A sensible chap who doesn't like cricket? I am going to need to think about that, its a 3 patch problem as Sherlock used to say.
    Yes, I am not a cricket fan. Perhaps it is my teenage years in the USA that meant I never played either cricket or rugby at school, so never developed the taste. Baseball was the sport that I enjoyed most at school, and even at Little League level it is a good game to play and watch.
    If I lived in the States and had to pick a US sport to get into it would be that one - baseball. It seems to have more to it than the other two.
    From American sports it'd be that or NASCAR for me. Followed by watching paint dry.
    NASCAR very right wing - so I can see you becoming a big fan.
    I don't like the American right though.

    Reagan right yes. Arnold Schwarzenegger right yes. Mitt Romney right yes.

    But the religious right? Dubya? Today's GOP? No thanks.

    Until the GOP regains sanity I'd rather vote Democrat.
    Romney lost, Trump and Dubya won.

    The GOP goes where the US voters send it
    The democrats would have you believe there are republicans that they 'like' and republicans they can 'work with'

    What they mean by that is Republicans they expect to beat.
    Indeed, the last Republican moderate to win was Bush Snr in 1988 but he lost in 1992.

    Since then of Republican moderate nominees for president Dole in 1996, McCain in 2008 and Romney in 2012 all lost, however the 2 populist conservative nominees ie George W Bush in 2000 and 2004 and Trump in 2016 all won
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    HYUFD said:
    Just wait until his chancellor sends tory middle England the bill for all this
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,153
    Cyclefree said:

    Carnyx said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    nichomar said:



    Johnson is the kind of male I avoid having anything to do with, his blokey humor and faux toff image is not my cup of tea, his attitude to marriage and fidelity don’t help I do wonder though if those appear to love him actually switched votes in the election as they appear to be natural tories.

    His book on cars is the worst thing ever written in the entire history of English prose composition.
    His thoughts on gearboxes, or his use of gerunds?
    I have never read his book on cars, but have read his Churchill book and it was awful. It was as though he watching the X-factor and thought, "oh I ought to get that into the title to make it a bit more populist", and so about half way through there is an attempt to refer to the book's title as an after thought. The rest of the book has no fresh research and no particular slant or insight. It was definitely the worst political bio I have ever read, well almost read, as I gave up 3/4 of the way through it's tedious pages.
    Worth reading Richard Evans’ review - https://www.newstatesman.com/books/2014/11/one-man-who-made-history-another-who-seems-just-make-it-boris-churchill.

    Very scathing and funny.
    Indeed (though I need my Staggers sub to get at it):

    "Not for him the subtleties of the complex interplay of historical forces and individual personalities. Subtlety is not Boris’s strong point. Winston Churchill alone, he writes, “saved our civilisation”. He “invented the RAF and the tank”. He founded the welfare state (although Boris gives David Lloyd George a bit of credit for this, as well)."
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 38,852

    Mr. Teacher, the Edmonton Eskimos very recently (few days ago, I think) dropped their name. They're currently known as Edmonton Football Team, I believe, until a permanent alternative is found.

    I'm guessing no Eskimos in the team. Or even on the bench.
  • OllyTOllyT Posts: 4,911
    edited July 2020

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Are there really that many people on a baseball team?!

    That's both teams
    I know, but even just on one side it looked like a long line.
    Squad size is 25. Pitchers don't pitch every day. There are usually 5 starters who rotate every 4 to 5 days. But they very rarely complete a full 9 innings. So there is a bullpen of relievers who come on as and when needed.
    8 position players plus subs for injuries etc.
    So 9 on the field. Remember they play 162 3 hour plus games a season normally.
    Baseball is a great game to watch. The best of American Stadium sports, and so much better than cricket.
    Moderators for goodness sake. Is there no limits on the outrageousness of opinions on this site anymore?
    @Foxy is normally such a polite and sensible chap, so I think they gave him a pass this time.
    A sensible chap who doesn't like cricket? I am going to need to think about that, its a 3 patch problem as Sherlock used to say.
    Yes, I am not a cricket fan. Perhaps it is my teenage years in the USA that meant I never played either cricket or rugby at school, so never developed the taste. Baseball was the sport that I enjoyed most at school, and even at Little League level it is a good game to play and watch.
    If I lived in the States and had to pick a US sport to get into it would be that one - baseball. It seems to have more to it than the other two.
    From American sports it'd be that or NASCAR for me. Followed by watching paint dry.
    NASCAR very right wing - so I can see you becoming a big fan.
    I don't like the American right though.

    Reagan right yes. Arnold Schwarzenegger right yes. Mitt Romney right yes.

    But the religious right? Dubya? Today's GOP? No thanks.

    Until the GOP regains sanity I'd rather vote Democrat.
    Romney lost, Trump and Dubya won.

    The GOP goes where the US voters send it
    The democrats would have you believe there are republicans that they 'like' and republicans they can 'work with'

    What they mean by that is Republicans they expect to beat.
    Indeed, the last Republican moderate to win was Bush Snr in 1988 but he lost in 1992.

    Since then of Republican moderate nominees for president Dole in 1996, McCain in 2008 and Romney in 2012 all lost, however the 2 populist conservative nominees ie George W Bush in 2000 and 2004 and Trump in 2016 all won
    The one that makes me laugh is Reagan, who seems to have been rehabilitated by the Dems.

    When he was in power, Reagan was 100% loathed by the Dems. Loathed. Reviled.
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,060
    HYUFD said:
    Is “no deal Brexit” just a cunning way of reducing obesity levels by putting up the price of food?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,584

    ydoethur said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Are there really that many people on a baseball team?!

    That's both teams
    I know, but even just on one side it looked like a long line.
    Squad size is 25. Pitchers don't pitch every day. There are usually 5 starters who rotate every 4 to 5 days. But they very rarely complete a full 9 innings. So there is a bullpen of relievers who come on as and when needed.
    8 position players plus subs for injuries etc.
    So 9 on the field. Remember they play 162 3 hour plus games a season normally.
    Baseball is a great game to watch. The best of American Stadium sports, and so much better than cricket.
    Moderators for goodness sake. Is there no limits on the outrageousness of opinions on this site anymore?
    @Foxy is normally such a polite and sensible chap, so I think they gave him a pass this time.
    A sensible chap who doesn't like cricket? I am going to need to think about that, its a 3 patch problem as Sherlock used to say.
    Yes, I am not a cricket fan. Perhaps it is my teenage years in the USA that meant I never played either cricket or rugby at school, so never developed the taste. Baseball was the sport that I enjoyed most at school, and even at Little League level it is a good game to play and watch.
    If I lived in the States and had to pick a US sport to get into it would be that one - baseball. It seems to have more to it than the other two.
    From American sports it'd be that or NASCAR for me. Followed by watching paint dry.
    NASCAR very right wing - so I can see you becoming a big fan.
    I don't like the American right though.

    Reagan right yes. Arnold Schwarzenegger right yes. Mitt Romney right yes.

    But the religious right? Dubya? Today's GOP? No thanks.

    Until the GOP regains sanity I'd rather vote Democrat.
    I believe NASCAR is "working class libertarian right" but there is less nuttery than you might expect from that term - although very pro gun needless to say - and it is largely free of evangelicalism. So on the whole I think you'll be OK with it. The great news is it used to be big for Trump but no more. Health care is important to NASCAR and it can see what a pig's ear he's made of that.
    I’m surprised you think NASCAR is right wing: I thought that on most circuits they only turned left...
    Like Brexit negotiations, they keep going round in pointless circles to get back to where they started.
    My classes tend not to believe me when I tell them my average velocity walking to school is higher than the average velocity of Lewis Hamilton winning a Grand Prix...

    Edit: that is until after I’ve explained the difference between velocity and speed.
    Would that not depend upon which circuit ?
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,060
    edited July 2020
    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Are there really that many people on a baseball team?!

    That's both teams
    I know, but even just on one side it looked like a long line.
    Squad size is 25. Pitchers don't pitch every day. There are usually 5 starters who rotate every 4 to 5 days. But they very rarely complete a full 9 innings. So there is a bullpen of relievers who come on as and when needed.
    8 position players plus subs for injuries etc.
    So 9 on the field. Remember they play 162 3 hour plus games a season normally.
    Baseball is a great game to watch. The best of American Stadium sports, and so much better than cricket.
    Moderators for goodness sake. Is there no limits on the outrageousness of opinions on this site anymore?
    @Foxy is normally such a polite and sensible chap, so I think they gave him a pass this time.
    A sensible chap who doesn't like cricket? I am going to need to think about that, its a 3 patch problem as Sherlock used to say.
    Yes, I am not a cricket fan. Perhaps it is my teenage years in the USA that meant I never played either cricket or rugby at school, so never developed the taste. Baseball was the sport that I enjoyed most at school, and even at Little League level it is a good game to play and watch.
    If I lived in the States and had to pick a US sport to get into it would be that one - baseball. It seems to have more to it than the other two.
    From American sports it'd be that or NASCAR for me. Followed by watching paint dry.
    NASCAR very right wing - so I can see you becoming a big fan.
    I don't like the American right though.

    Reagan right yes. Arnold Schwarzenegger right yes. Mitt Romney right yes.

    But the religious right? Dubya? Today's GOP? No thanks.

    Until the GOP regains sanity I'd rather vote Democrat.
    I believe NASCAR is "working class libertarian right" but there is less nuttery than you might expect from that term - although very pro gun needless to say - and it is largely free of evangelicalism. So on the whole I think you'll be OK with it. The great news is it used to be big for Trump but no more. Health care is important to NASCAR and it can see what a pig's ear he's made of that.
    I’m surprised you think NASCAR is right wing: I thought that on most circuits they only turned left...
    Like Brexit negotiations, they keep going round in pointless circles to get back to where they started.
    My classes tend not to believe me when I tell them my average velocity walking to school is higher than the average velocity of Lewis Hamilton winning a Grand Prix...

    Edit: that is until after I’ve explained the difference between velocity and speed.
    Would that not depend upon which circuit ?
    I was working on the assumption that all circuits had the same start/finish line: if that isn’t true can you let me know which circuits I could give as examples?

    Edit: I don’t mean exactly the same line for each circuit, but that in each circuit the start line (or front of the grid) is at the finish line.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 50,776

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:
    This means that if you get 5 students in a room over there the chances are that one of them supports Donald Trump. Quite an uneasy thought. Especially if there's no way to spot which one it is.
    How about red triangles?
    Silly hats? They already wear them from choice so should be easy.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 43,625

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Are there really that many people on a baseball team?!

    That's both teams
    I know, but even just on one side it looked like a long line.
    Squad size is 25. Pitchers don't pitch every day. There are usually 5 starters who rotate every 4 to 5 days. But they very rarely complete a full 9 innings. So there is a bullpen of relievers who come on as and when needed.
    8 position players plus subs for injuries etc.
    So 9 on the field. Remember they play 162 3 hour plus games a season normally.
    Baseball is a great game to watch. The best of American Stadium sports, and so much better than cricket.
    Moderators for goodness sake. Is there no limits on the outrageousness of opinions on this site anymore?
    @Foxy is normally such a polite and sensible chap, so I think they gave him a pass this time.
    A sensible chap who doesn't like cricket? I am going to need to think about that, its a 3 patch problem as Sherlock used to say.
    Yes, I am not a cricket fan. Perhaps it is my teenage years in the USA that meant I never played either cricket or rugby at school, so never developed the taste. Baseball was the sport that I enjoyed most at school, and even at Little League level it is a good game to play and watch.
    If I lived in the States and had to pick a US sport to get into it would be that one - baseball. It seems to have more to it than the other two.
    From American sports it'd be that or NASCAR for me. Followed by watching paint dry.
    NASCAR very right wing - so I can see you becoming a big fan.
    I don't like the American right though.

    Reagan right yes. Arnold Schwarzenegger right yes. Mitt Romney right yes.

    But the religious right? Dubya? Today's GOP? No thanks.

    Until the GOP regains sanity I'd rather vote Democrat.
    Romney lost, Trump and Dubya won.

    The GOP goes where the US voters send it
    The democrats would have you believe there are republicans that they 'like' and republicans they can 'work with'

    What they mean by that is Republicans they expect to beat.
    Indeed, the last Republican moderate to win was Bush Snr in 1988 but he lost in 1992.

    Since then of Republican moderate nominees for president Dole in 1996, McCain in 2008 and Romney in 2012 all lost, however the 2 populist conservative nominees ie George W Bush in 2000 and 2004 and Trump in 2016 all won
    The one that makes me laugh is Reagan, who seems to have been rehabilitated by the Dems.

    When he was in power, Reagan was 100% loathed by the Dems. Loathed. Reviled.
    To the point where Senator Edward Kennedy tried to make a deal with the Soviets to influence the 1984 elections...
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    OllyT said:

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
    The mask thing was clearly brought in by wonks who have never run a business in their lives.

    The rules turn the functioning relationship of business owner and customer on its head.

    The notion that businesses can dictate terms to customers and still prosper in a free market is for the birds. Businesses must run, but customers can choose, and so the customer is always right.

    10-year olds understand this. But not, it appears people who make these rules, who think in terms of monopolies and authoritarianism.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 50,776
    kinabalu said:

    Mr. Teacher, the Edmonton Eskimos very recently (few days ago, I think) dropped their name. They're currently known as Edmonton Football Team, I believe, until a permanent alternative is found.

    I'm guessing no Eskimos in the team. Or even on the bench.
    Maybe in the chill box?
  • NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 3,346
    OllyT said:

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
    In the UK we have bought Covid under control with the use of hand washing and social distancing,not by the use of masks. Why introduce them now? There is no evidence that they work in the settings that they are now going to be used in and until political pressure the WHO said they could well be detrimental.

    To use Surgeons as an example is just ridiculous as that is a completly different setting and a completly different type of mask. (face fitted).

    We have been told all the way along to not touch our faces and now we are being instructed to do something which means that peeple will touch their face all the time.

    Just stand outside a Tesco Express and watch what people do.
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,387

    HYUFD said:
    Just wait until his chancellor sends tory middle England the bill for all this
    Bill for the advertising ban?
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 43,625

    OllyT said:

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
    The mask thing was clearly brought in by wonks who have never run a business in their lives.

    The rules turn the functioning relationship of business owner and customer on its head.

    The notion that businesses can dictate terms to customers and still prosper in a free market is for the birds. Businesses must run, but customers can choose, and so the customer is always right.

    10-year olds understand this. But not, it appears people who make these rules, who think in terms of monopolies and authoritarianism.
    Businesses limit what their customers can do all the time.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941

    OllyT said:

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
    In the UK we have bought Covid under control with the use of hand washing and social distancing,not by the use of masks. Why introduce them now? There is no evidence that they work in the settings that they are now going to be used in and until political pressure the WHO said they could well be detrimental.

    To use Surgeons as an example is just ridiculous as that is a completly different setting and a completly different type of mask. (face fitted).

    We have been told all the way along to not touch our faces and now we are being instructed to do something which means that peeple will touch their face all the time.

    Just stand outside a Tesco Express and watch what people do.
    Why introduce them now? Because there will be less social distancing now that half the population isn't cooped up at home.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 24,588

    HYUFD said:
    Just wait until his chancellor sends tory middle England the bill for all this
    It doesn't matter. See below.

    Interesting vox Pop from the Royal Dyche pub in Burnley on WATO to celebrate Johnson's year in office. Labour far too left wing. Boris and the Conservative Party have done an excellent job over the last 12 months. Support for business and individuals cited as key.

    Other than my gratitude for "free" money, I must be living in a parallel universe.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,584
    edited July 2020

    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Are there really that many people on a baseball team?!

    That's both teams
    I know, but even just on one side it looked like a long line.
    Squad size is 25. Pitchers don't pitch every day. There are usually 5 starters who rotate every 4 to 5 days. But they very rarely complete a full 9 innings. So there is a bullpen of relievers who come on as and when needed.
    8 position players plus subs for injuries etc.
    So 9 on the field. Remember they play 162 3 hour plus games a season normally.
    Baseball is a great game to watch. The best of American Stadium sports, and so much better than cricket.
    Moderators for goodness sake. Is there no limits on the outrageousness of opinions on this site anymore?
    @Foxy is normally such a polite and sensible chap, so I think they gave him a pass this time.
    A sensible chap who doesn't like cricket? I am going to need to think about that, its a 3 patch problem as Sherlock used to say.
    Yes, I am not a cricket fan. Perhaps it is my teenage years in the USA that meant I never played either cricket or rugby at school, so never developed the taste. Baseball was the sport that I enjoyed most at school, and even at Little League level it is a good game to play and watch.
    If I lived in the States and had to pick a US sport to get into it would be that one - baseball. It seems to have more to it than the other two.
    From American sports it'd be that or NASCAR for me. Followed by watching paint dry.
    NASCAR very right wing - so I can see you becoming a big fan.
    I don't like the American right though.

    Reagan right yes. Arnold Schwarzenegger right yes. Mitt Romney right yes.

    But the religious right? Dubya? Today's GOP? No thanks.

    Until the GOP regains sanity I'd rather vote Democrat.
    I believe NASCAR is "working class libertarian right" but there is less nuttery than you might expect from that term - although very pro gun needless to say - and it is largely free of evangelicalism. So on the whole I think you'll be OK with it. The great news is it used to be big for Trump but no more. Health care is important to NASCAR and it can see what a pig's ear he's made of that.
    I’m surprised you think NASCAR is right wing: I thought that on most circuits they only turned left...
    Like Brexit negotiations, they keep going round in pointless circles to get back to where they started.
    My classes tend not to believe me when I tell them my average velocity walking to school is higher than the average velocity of Lewis Hamilton winning a Grand Prix...

    Edit: that is until after I’ve explained the difference between velocity and speed.
    Would that not depend upon which circuit ?
    I was working on the assumption that all circuits had the same start/finish line: if that isn’t true can you let me know which circuits I could give as examples?

    Edit: I don’t mean exactly the same line for each circuit, but that in each circuit the start line (or front of the grid) is at the finish line.
    I was thinking rather that the speeds in one direction can be greatly in excess of those in another, depending on the layout. Though that is probably misguided, too.

    You can, of course, win a race starting from the pit lane.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 38,852
    edited July 2020

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:
    This means that if you get 5 students in a room over there the chances are that one of them supports Donald Trump. Quite an uneasy thought. Especially if there's no way to spot which one it is.
    The one with the MAGA hat would be my guess.
    That would be OK. Forewarned is forearmed. The nightmare would be if you can't spot him - let's assume it's a he - and by the time you find out you've become pals, hanging out, going for a shake and a slice of pie together after classes. That would be a tough gig. You'd have to cancel him but in a way that doesn't make you look like a zealot trying to stifle free expression.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,265



    The one that makes me laugh is Reagan, who seems to have been rehabilitated by the Dems.

    When he was in power, Reagan was 100% loathed by the Dems. Loathed. Reviled.

    To the point where Senator Edward Kennedy tried to make a deal with the Soviets to influence the 1984 elections...
    Praising past leaders of opposing parties is so routine it gets boring. Micheal Foot, such a patriot. Neil Kinnock, so brave. Harold Macmillan, what a one-nation Tory. And so on. At the time, their opponents reviled them, but it's convenient to say the current ones are worse.
  • NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 3,346
    RobD said:

    OllyT said:

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
    In the UK we have bought Covid under control with the use of hand washing and social distancing,not by the use of masks. Why introduce them now? There is no evidence that they work in the settings that they are now going to be used in and until political pressure the WHO said they could well be detrimental.

    To use Surgeons as an example is just ridiculous as that is a completly different setting and a completly different type of mask. (face fitted).

    We have been told all the way along to not touch our faces and now we are being instructed to do something which means that peeple will touch their face all the time.

    Just stand outside a Tesco Express and watch what people do.
    Why introduce them now? Because there will be less social distancing now that half the population isn't cooped up at home.
    Sorry are there new rules on Social Distancing released today?
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 43,625
    NHS Hospital numbers out

    Headline - 16
    7 days - 12
    Yesterday - 0

    image
    image
    image
    image
    image
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941

    RobD said:

    OllyT said:

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
    In the UK we have bought Covid under control with the use of hand washing and social distancing,not by the use of masks. Why introduce them now? There is no evidence that they work in the settings that they are now going to be used in and until political pressure the WHO said they could well be detrimental.

    To use Surgeons as an example is just ridiculous as that is a completly different setting and a completly different type of mask. (face fitted).

    We have been told all the way along to not touch our faces and now we are being instructed to do something which means that peeple will touch their face all the time.

    Just stand outside a Tesco Express and watch what people do.
    Why introduce them now? Because there will be less social distancing now that half the population isn't cooped up at home.
    Sorry are there new rules on Social Distancing released today?
    No, but if you think people are going to be stay as far apart as they were during the lockdown you have another thing coming. A large fraction of the population stayed at home all the time, that's not the case any more.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 50,776

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Are there really that many people on a baseball team?!

    That's both teams
    I know, but even just on one side it looked like a long line.
    Squad size is 25. Pitchers don't pitch every day. There are usually 5 starters who rotate every 4 to 5 days. But they very rarely complete a full 9 innings. So there is a bullpen of relievers who come on as and when needed.
    8 position players plus subs for injuries etc.
    So 9 on the field. Remember they play 162 3 hour plus games a season normally.
    Baseball is a great game to watch. The best of American Stadium sports, and so much better than cricket.
    Moderators for goodness sake. Is there no limits on the outrageousness of opinions on this site anymore?
    @Foxy is normally such a polite and sensible chap, so I think they gave him a pass this time.
    A sensible chap who doesn't like cricket? I am going to need to think about that, its a 3 patch problem as Sherlock used to say.
    Yes, I am not a cricket fan. Perhaps it is my teenage years in the USA that meant I never played either cricket or rugby at school, so never developed the taste. Baseball was the sport that I enjoyed most at school, and even at Little League level it is a good game to play and watch.
    If I lived in the States and had to pick a US sport to get into it would be that one - baseball. It seems to have more to it than the other two.
    From American sports it'd be that or NASCAR for me. Followed by watching paint dry.
    NASCAR very right wing - so I can see you becoming a big fan.
    I don't like the American right though.

    Reagan right yes. Arnold Schwarzenegger right yes. Mitt Romney right yes.

    But the religious right? Dubya? Today's GOP? No thanks.

    Until the GOP regains sanity I'd rather vote Democrat.
    Romney lost, Trump and Dubya won.

    The GOP goes where the US voters send it
    The democrats would have you believe there are republicans that they 'like' and republicans they can 'work with'

    What they mean by that is Republicans they expect to beat.
    Indeed, the last Republican moderate to win was Bush Snr in 1988 but he lost in 1992.

    Since then of Republican moderate nominees for president Dole in 1996, McCain in 2008 and Romney in 2012 all lost, however the 2 populist conservative nominees ie George W Bush in 2000 and 2004 and Trump in 2016 all won
    The one that makes me laugh is Reagan, who seems to have been rehabilitated by the Dems.

    When he was in power, Reagan was 100% loathed by the Dems. Loathed. Reviled.
    Not just Democrats:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jmWLJmbytkk
  • NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 3,346
    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    OllyT said:

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
    In the UK we have bought Covid under control with the use of hand washing and social distancing,not by the use of masks. Why introduce them now? There is no evidence that they work in the settings that they are now going to be used in and until political pressure the WHO said they could well be detrimental.

    To use Surgeons as an example is just ridiculous as that is a completly different setting and a completly different type of mask. (face fitted).

    We have been told all the way along to not touch our faces and now we are being instructed to do something which means that peeple will touch their face all the time.

    Just stand outside a Tesco Express and watch what people do.
    Why introduce them now? Because there will be less social distancing now that half the population isn't cooped up at home.
    Sorry are there new rules on Social Distancing released today?
    No, but if you think people are going to be stay as far apart as they were during the lockdown you have another thing coming. A large fraction of the population stayed at home all the time, that's not the case any more.
    The 1 meter rule was introduced 3 weeks ago and has not led to an increase in cases.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818



    The one that makes me laugh is Reagan, who seems to have been rehabilitated by the Dems.

    When he was in power, Reagan was 100% loathed by the Dems. Loathed. Reviled.

    To the point where Senator Edward Kennedy tried to make a deal with the Soviets to influence the 1984 elections...
    Praising past leaders of opposing parties is so routine it gets boring. Micheal Foot, such a patriot. Neil Kinnock, so brave. Harold Macmillan, what a one-nation Tory. And so on. At the time, their opponents reviled them, but it's convenient to say the current ones are worse.
    I did not like Foot until he, quite bizarrely, turned up on a panel programme about Jonathan Swift. One of those Don-ish broadcasts that simply do not exist anywhere on TV any more.

    Foot was clearly both an enthusiast and an expert. A superb analysis.
  • LadyGLadyG Posts: 2,221
    eek said:

    Johnson is objectively unpopular as per polling.

    If you think he's unpopular now wait until the winter.
    I think you greatly overestimate what change is coming.

    Furlough through lockdown has worked to avoid the worst of what could have happened.
    I really, really hope you are correct. Genuinely.
    +1 the problem is my linkedIn feed and general enquiries from people looking for work tells me that it's going to be bad out there.
    It is going to be the worst economic downturn in living memory. No one alive has experienced what is about to hit us.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408



    The one that makes me laugh is Reagan, who seems to have been rehabilitated by the Dems.

    When he was in power, Reagan was 100% loathed by the Dems. Loathed. Reviled.

    To the point where Senator Edward Kennedy tried to make a deal with the Soviets to influence the 1984 elections...
    Praising past leaders of opposing parties is so routine it gets boring. Micheal Foot, such a patriot. Neil Kinnock, so brave. Harold Macmillan, what a one-nation Tory. And so on. At the time, their opponents reviled them, but it's convenient to say the current ones are worse.
    There seem to be exceptions, given the obsession people have about Thatcher. You'd think she was still around eating babies the way some get emotional about her time in office.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941
    edited July 2020

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    OllyT said:

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
    In the UK we have bought Covid under control with the use of hand washing and social distancing,not by the use of masks. Why introduce them now? There is no evidence that they work in the settings that they are now going to be used in and until political pressure the WHO said they could well be detrimental.

    To use Surgeons as an example is just ridiculous as that is a completly different setting and a completly different type of mask. (face fitted).

    We have been told all the way along to not touch our faces and now we are being instructed to do something which means that peeple will touch their face all the time.

    Just stand outside a Tesco Express and watch what people do.
    Why introduce them now? Because there will be less social distancing now that half the population isn't cooped up at home.
    Sorry are there new rules on Social Distancing released today?
    No, but if you think people are going to be stay as far apart as they were during the lockdown you have another thing coming. A large fraction of the population stayed at home all the time, that's not the case any more.
    The 1 meter rule was introduced 3 weeks ago and has not led to an increase in cases.
    Your claim was that the virus was bought under control with hand washing and social distancing. I was trying to make the point that the social distancing was quite extreme, with people simply staying at home and not interacting. That is no longer the case, so it seems sensible to bring in additional precautions to keep the transmission low.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,153

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    OllyT said:

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
    In the UK we have bought Covid under control with the use of hand washing and social distancing,not by the use of masks. Why introduce them now? There is no evidence that they work in the settings that they are now going to be used in and until political pressure the WHO said they could well be detrimental.

    To use Surgeons as an example is just ridiculous as that is a completly different setting and a completly different type of mask. (face fitted).

    We have been told all the way along to not touch our faces and now we are being instructed to do something which means that peeple will touch their face all the time.

    Just stand outside a Tesco Express and watch what people do.
    Why introduce them now? Because there will be less social distancing now that half the population isn't cooped up at home.
    Sorry are there new rules on Social Distancing released today?
    No, but if you think people are going to be stay as far apart as they were during the lockdown you have another thing coming. A large fraction of the population stayed at home all the time, that's not the case any more.
    The 1 meter rule was introduced 3 weeks ago and has not led to an increase in cases.
    Not yet.

    And are you American? Commenting on British precautions in 'meters' is unusual.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    LadyG said:

    eek said:

    Johnson is objectively unpopular as per polling.

    If you think he's unpopular now wait until the winter.
    I think you greatly overestimate what change is coming.

    Furlough through lockdown has worked to avoid the worst of what could have happened.
    I really, really hope you are correct. Genuinely.
    +1 the problem is my linkedIn feed and general enquiries from people looking for work tells me that it's going to be bad out there.
    It is going to be the worst economic downturn in living memory. No one alive has experienced what is about to hit us.
    Well, not in this country at any rate. People we can ask for tips from people who have lived in economic catastrophes around the globe.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,603

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    OllyT said:

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
    In the UK we have bought Covid under control with the use of hand washing and social distancing,not by the use of masks. Why introduce them now? There is no evidence that they work in the settings that they are now going to be used in and until political pressure the WHO said they could well be detrimental.

    To use Surgeons as an example is just ridiculous as that is a completly different setting and a completly different type of mask. (face fitted).

    We have been told all the way along to not touch our faces and now we are being instructed to do something which means that peeple will touch their face all the time.

    Just stand outside a Tesco Express and watch what people do.
    Why introduce them now? Because there will be less social distancing now that half the population isn't cooped up at home.
    Sorry are there new rules on Social Distancing released today?
    No, but if you think people are going to be stay as far apart as they were during the lockdown you have another thing coming. A large fraction of the population stayed at home all the time, that's not the case any more.
    The 1 meter rule was introduced 3 weeks ago and has not led to an increase in cases.
    It has stalled the fall in the infection rate. I think it's a trade off worth making given the economic benefits gained from reducing distancing but let's not pretend it comes at no public health cost.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,753
    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.

    Wake up, sheeple!
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,060
    Nigelb said:

    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Are there really that many people on a baseball team?!

    That's both teams
    I know, but even just on one side it looked like a long line.
    Squad size is 25. Pitchers don't pitch every day. There are usually 5 starters who rotate every 4 to 5 days. But they very rarely complete a full 9 innings. So there is a bullpen of relievers who come on as and when needed.
    8 position players plus subs for injuries etc.
    So 9 on the field. Remember they play 162 3 hour plus games a season normally.
    Baseball is a great game to watch. The best of American Stadium sports, and so much better than cricket.
    Moderators for goodness sake. Is there no limits on the outrageousness of opinions on this site anymore?
    @Foxy is normally such a polite and sensible chap, so I think they gave him a pass this time.
    A sensible chap who doesn't like cricket? I am going to need to think about that, its a 3 patch problem as Sherlock used to say.
    Yes, I am not a cricket fan. Perhaps it is my teenage years in the USA that meant I never played either cricket or rugby at school, so never developed the taste. Baseball was the sport that I enjoyed most at school, and even at Little League level it is a good game to play and watch.
    If I lived in the States and had to pick a US sport to get into it would be that one - baseball. It seems to have more to it than the other two.
    From American sports it'd be that or NASCAR for me. Followed by watching paint dry.
    NASCAR very right wing - so I can see you becoming a big fan.
    I don't like the American right though.

    Reagan right yes. Arnold Schwarzenegger right yes. Mitt Romney right yes.

    But the religious right? Dubya? Today's GOP? No thanks.

    Until the GOP regains sanity I'd rather vote Democrat.
    I believe NASCAR is "working class libertarian right" but there is less nuttery than you might expect from that term - although very pro gun needless to say - and it is largely free of evangelicalism. So on the whole I think you'll be OK with it. The great news is it used to be big for Trump but no more. Health care is important to NASCAR and it can see what a pig's ear he's made of that.
    I’m surprised you think NASCAR is right wing: I thought that on most circuits they only turned left...
    Like Brexit negotiations, they keep going round in pointless circles to get back to where they started.
    My classes tend not to believe me when I tell them my average velocity walking to school is higher than the average velocity of Lewis Hamilton winning a Grand Prix...

    Edit: that is until after I’ve explained the difference between velocity and speed.
    Would that not depend upon which circuit ?
    I was working on the assumption that all circuits had the same start/finish line: if that isn’t true can you let me know which circuits I could give as examples?

    Edit: I don’t mean exactly the same line for each circuit, but that in each circuit the start line (or front of the grid) is at the finish line.
    I was thinking rather that the speeds in one direction can be greatly in excess of those in another, depending on the layout. Though that is probably misguided, too.

    You can, of course, win a race starting from the pit lane.
    Average velocity is total displacement from the start divided by total time taken. If you end up back where you started then your average velocity is zero, as the total displacement is zero.

    Even if you start from the pit lane the usual time taken is 90 minutes or so, so the pit lane would need to be 4 or 5 km away to beat my average velocity walking to school.

    A car that crashes half way round on the first lap on the other hand will have a much higher average velocity.
  • NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 3,346
    MaxPB said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    OllyT said:

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
    In the UK we have bought Covid under control with the use of hand washing and social distancing,not by the use of masks. Why introduce them now? There is no evidence that they work in the settings that they are now going to be used in and until political pressure the WHO said they could well be detrimental.

    To use Surgeons as an example is just ridiculous as that is a completly different setting and a completly different type of mask. (face fitted).

    We have been told all the way along to not touch our faces and now we are being instructed to do something which means that peeple will touch their face all the time.

    Just stand outside a Tesco Express and watch what people do.
    Why introduce them now? Because there will be less social distancing now that half the population isn't cooped up at home.
    Sorry are there new rules on Social Distancing released today?
    No, but if you think people are going to be stay as far apart as they were during the lockdown you have another thing coming. A large fraction of the population stayed at home all the time, that's not the case any more.
    The 1 meter rule was introduced 3 weeks ago and has not led to an increase in cases.
    It has stalled the fall in the infection rate. I think it's a trade off worth making given the economic benefits gained from reducing distancing but let's not pretend it comes at no public health cost.
    Have you seen the hospital inpatient and admission figures? They are falling quickly
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,712

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Are there really that many people on a baseball team?!

    That's both teams
    I know, but even just on one side it looked like a long line.
    Squad size is 25. Pitchers don't pitch every day. There are usually 5 starters who rotate every 4 to 5 days. But they very rarely complete a full 9 innings. So there is a bullpen of relievers who come on as and when needed.
    8 position players plus subs for injuries etc.
    So 9 on the field. Remember they play 162 3 hour plus games a season normally.
    Baseball is a great game to watch. The best of American Stadium sports, and so much better than cricket.
    Moderators for goodness sake. Is there no limits on the outrageousness of opinions on this site anymore?
    @Foxy is normally such a polite and sensible chap, so I think they gave him a pass this time.
    A sensible chap who doesn't like cricket? I am going to need to think about that, its a 3 patch problem as Sherlock used to say.
    Yes, I am not a cricket fan. Perhaps it is my teenage years in the USA that meant I never played either cricket or rugby at school, so never developed the taste. Baseball was the sport that I enjoyed most at school, and even at Little League level it is a good game to play and watch.
    If I lived in the States and had to pick a US sport to get into it would be that one - baseball. It seems to have more to it than the other two.
    From American sports it'd be that or NASCAR for me. Followed by watching paint dry.
    NASCAR very right wing - so I can see you becoming a big fan.
    I don't like the American right though.

    Reagan right yes. Arnold Schwarzenegger right yes. Mitt Romney right yes.

    But the religious right? Dubya? Today's GOP? No thanks.

    Until the GOP regains sanity I'd rather vote Democrat.
    Romney lost, Trump and Dubya won.

    The GOP goes where the US voters send it
    The democrats would have you believe there are republicans that they 'like' and republicans they can 'work with'

    What they mean by that is Republicans they expect to beat.
    Indeed, the last Republican moderate to win was Bush Snr in 1988 but he lost in 1992.

    Since then of Republican moderate nominees for president Dole in 1996, McCain in 2008 and Romney in 2012 all lost, however the 2 populist conservative nominees ie George W Bush in 2000 and 2004 and Trump in 2016 all won
    The one that makes me laugh is Reagan, who seems to have been rehabilitated by the Dems.

    When he was in power, Reagan was 100% loathed by the Dems. Loathed. Reviled.
    Indeed, now he does not even make the top 3 of most loathed Republican presidents by Democrats, Trump, George W Bush and Nixon take those places
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,712

    HYUFD said:
    Just wait until his chancellor sends tory middle England the bill for all this
    He won't he will mainly borrow despite a few tweaks to capital gains tax
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,768
    Clunk.

    Being hit on the helmet by Kemar Roach must be a highly unpleasant experience.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 50,776



    The one that makes me laugh is Reagan, who seems to have been rehabilitated by the Dems.

    When he was in power, Reagan was 100% loathed by the Dems. Loathed. Reviled.

    To the point where Senator Edward Kennedy tried to make a deal with the Soviets to influence the 1984 elections...
    Praising past leaders of opposing parties is so routine it gets boring. Micheal Foot, such a patriot. Neil Kinnock, so brave. Harold Macmillan, what a one-nation Tory. And so on. At the time, their opponents reviled them, but it's convenient to say the current ones are worse.
    In fairness I think Corbyn may well break this trend.
  • NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 3,346
    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    OllyT said:

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
    In the UK we have bought Covid under control with the use of hand washing and social distancing,not by the use of masks. Why introduce them now? There is no evidence that they work in the settings that they are now going to be used in and until political pressure the WHO said they could well be detrimental.

    To use Surgeons as an example is just ridiculous as that is a completly different setting and a completly different type of mask. (face fitted).

    We have been told all the way along to not touch our faces and now we are being instructed to do something which means that peeple will touch their face all the time.

    Just stand outside a Tesco Express and watch what people do.
    Why introduce them now? Because there will be less social distancing now that half the population isn't cooped up at home.
    Sorry are there new rules on Social Distancing released today?
    No, but if you think people are going to be stay as far apart as they were during the lockdown you have another thing coming. A large fraction of the population stayed at home all the time, that's not the case any more.
    The 1 meter rule was introduced 3 weeks ago and has not led to an increase in cases.
    Your claim was that the virus was bought under control with hand washing and social distancing. I was trying to make the point that the social distancing was quite extreme, with people simply staying at home and not interacting. That is no longer the case, so it seems sensible to bring in additional precautions to keep the transmission low.
    I would agree with that, but i don't think that mask wearing by the general public whilst shopping will work. There will be so much face touching going on that any potential and yet unproven benefits of masks in that environment will be outweighed by the face touching.
  • LadyGLadyG Posts: 2,221
    kle4 said:

    LadyG said:

    eek said:

    Johnson is objectively unpopular as per polling.

    If you think he's unpopular now wait until the winter.
    I think you greatly overestimate what change is coming.

    Furlough through lockdown has worked to avoid the worst of what could have happened.
    I really, really hope you are correct. Genuinely.
    +1 the problem is my linkedIn feed and general enquiries from people looking for work tells me that it's going to be bad out there.
    It is going to be the worst economic downturn in living memory. No one alive has experienced what is about to hit us.
    Well, not in this country at any rate. People we can ask for tips from people who have lived in economic catastrophes around the globe.
    Yes. Of nations similar to us, perhaps Greece provides the best example.

    The economy shrank 20-30%, debt soared, entire town centres closed down.

    But that happened over a period of years, this is going to happen in 12 months.
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,060
    ydoethur said:

    Clunk.

    Being hit on the helmet by Kemar Roach must be a highly unpleasant experience.

    Now if that were baseball he would be able to go to first base...
  • NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 3,346
    Carnyx said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    OllyT said:

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
    In the UK we have bought Covid under control with the use of hand washing and social distancing,not by the use of masks. Why introduce them now? There is no evidence that they work in the settings that they are now going to be used in and until political pressure the WHO said they could well be detrimental.

    To use Surgeons as an example is just ridiculous as that is a completly different setting and a completly different type of mask. (face fitted).

    We have been told all the way along to not touch our faces and now we are being instructed to do something which means that peeple will touch their face all the time.

    Just stand outside a Tesco Express and watch what people do.
    Why introduce them now? Because there will be less social distancing now that half the population isn't cooped up at home.
    Sorry are there new rules on Social Distancing released today?
    No, but if you think people are going to be stay as far apart as they were during the lockdown you have another thing coming. A large fraction of the population stayed at home all the time, that's not the case any more.
    The 1 meter rule was introduced 3 weeks ago and has not led to an increase in cases.
    Not yet.

    And are you American? Commenting on British precautions in 'meters' is unusual.
    Im an electrician by trade, I write meter a lot.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941
    edited July 2020

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    OllyT said:

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
    In the UK we have bought Covid under control with the use of hand washing and social distancing,not by the use of masks. Why introduce them now? There is no evidence that they work in the settings that they are now going to be used in and until political pressure the WHO said they could well be detrimental.

    To use Surgeons as an example is just ridiculous as that is a completly different setting and a completly different type of mask. (face fitted).

    We have been told all the way along to not touch our faces and now we are being instructed to do something which means that peeple will touch their face all the time.

    Just stand outside a Tesco Express and watch what people do.
    Why introduce them now? Because there will be less social distancing now that half the population isn't cooped up at home.
    Sorry are there new rules on Social Distancing released today?
    No, but if you think people are going to be stay as far apart as they were during the lockdown you have another thing coming. A large fraction of the population stayed at home all the time, that's not the case any more.
    The 1 meter rule was introduced 3 weeks ago and has not led to an increase in cases.
    Your claim was that the virus was bought under control with hand washing and social distancing. I was trying to make the point that the social distancing was quite extreme, with people simply staying at home and not interacting. That is no longer the case, so it seems sensible to bring in additional precautions to keep the transmission low.
    I would agree with that, but i don't think that mask wearing by the general public whilst shopping will work. There will be so much face touching going on that any potential and yet unproven benefits of masks in that environment will be outweighed by the face touching.
    So defeatist. You just said that we got it under control through hand washing. Are they going to stop doing that now?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,768
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:
    Just wait until his chancellor sends tory middle England the bill for all this
    He won't he will mainly borrow despite a few tweaks to capital gains tax
    How are we planning to pay off this mountain of debt we have accumulated over the last 18 years?

    We have a sluggish economy, where growth is going to be at best stagnant. We have low productivity. We seem to have a number of sacred cows that must be paid for. We refuse to consider higher taxes.

    You don’t have to be batshit crazy like Corbyn to see that borrowing passim ad nauseam is a model that won’t work for ever.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,768
    Short.

    Short.

    Bowled.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 38,852
    kle4 said:



    The one that makes me laugh is Reagan, who seems to have been rehabilitated by the Dems.

    When he was in power, Reagan was 100% loathed by the Dems. Loathed. Reviled.

    To the point where Senator Edward Kennedy tried to make a deal with the Soviets to influence the 1984 elections...
    Praising past leaders of opposing parties is so routine it gets boring. Micheal Foot, such a patriot. Neil Kinnock, so brave. Harold Macmillan, what a one-nation Tory. And so on. At the time, their opponents reviled them, but it's convenient to say the current ones are worse.
    There seem to be exceptions, given the obsession people have about Thatcher. You'd think she was still around eating babies the way some get emotional about her time in office.
    That's logical though. The one thing everyone agrees about Maggie Thatcher is she was transformational. She transformed the country, i.e. her impact is felt strongly to this day. So there is every reason to still love/hate her depending on your politics.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 47,789

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    OllyT said:

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
    In the UK we have bought Covid under control with the use of hand washing and social distancing,not by the use of masks. Why introduce them now? There is no evidence that they work in the settings that they are now going to be used in and until political pressure the WHO said they could well be detrimental.

    To use Surgeons as an example is just ridiculous as that is a completly different setting and a completly different type of mask. (face fitted).

    We have been told all the way along to not touch our faces and now we are being instructed to do something which means that peeple will touch their face all the time.

    Just stand outside a Tesco Express and watch what people do.
    Why introduce them now? Because there will be less social distancing now that half the population isn't cooped up at home.
    Sorry are there new rules on Social Distancing released today?
    No, but if you think people are going to be stay as far apart as they were during the lockdown you have another thing coming. A large fraction of the population stayed at home all the time, that's not the case any more.
    The 1 meter rule was introduced 3 weeks ago and has not led to an increase in cases.
    You have the most amazing command and control view of society. Do you think everyone is following the guidance to the letter?
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,060

    Carnyx said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    OllyT said:

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
    In the UK we have bought Covid under control with the use of hand washing and social distancing,not by the use of masks. Why introduce them now? There is no evidence that they work in the settings that they are now going to be used in and until political pressure the WHO said they could well be detrimental.

    To use Surgeons as an example is just ridiculous as that is a completly different setting and a completly different type of mask. (face fitted).

    We have been told all the way along to not touch our faces and now we are being instructed to do something which means that peeple will touch their face all the time.

    Just stand outside a Tesco Express and watch what people do.
    Why introduce them now? Because there will be less social distancing now that half the population isn't cooped up at home.
    Sorry are there new rules on Social Distancing released today?
    No, but if you think people are going to be stay as far apart as they were during the lockdown you have another thing coming. A large fraction of the population stayed at home all the time, that's not the case any more.
    The 1 meter rule was introduced 3 weeks ago and has not led to an increase in cases.
    Not yet.

    And are you American? Commenting on British precautions in 'meters' is unusual.
    Im an electrician by trade, I write meter a lot.
    I’m glad someone is using them.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 43,625

    MaxPB said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    OllyT said:

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
    In the UK we have bought Covid under control with the use of hand washing and social distancing,not by the use of masks. Why introduce them now? There is no evidence that they work in the settings that they are now going to be used in and until political pressure the WHO said they could well be detrimental.

    To use Surgeons as an example is just ridiculous as that is a completly different setting and a completly different type of mask. (face fitted).

    We have been told all the way along to not touch our faces and now we are being instructed to do something which means that peeple will touch their face all the time.

    Just stand outside a Tesco Express and watch what people do.
    Why introduce them now? Because there will be less social distancing now that half the population isn't cooped up at home.
    Sorry are there new rules on Social Distancing released today?
    No, but if you think people are going to be stay as far apart as they were during the lockdown you have another thing coming. A large fraction of the population stayed at home all the time, that's not the case any more.
    The 1 meter rule was introduced 3 weeks ago and has not led to an increase in cases.
    It has stalled the fall in the infection rate. I think it's a trade off worth making given the economic benefits gained from reducing distancing but let's not pretend it comes at no public health cost.
    Have you seen the hospital inpatient and admission figures? They are falling quickly
    The 111 numbers are also falling.

    I will need to double check - but I believe that every single metric apart from infections is falling.

    I *think* that the levelling off of the infection rate is due to heavy Pillar 2 testing around the hotspot areas. Really looking forward to getting separated Pillar 1 and Pillar 2 daily data.

    I have heard, for example, that on the farm in Hereford, 10 or so people actually got symptoms. All the others tested positive didn't.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,768
    Ollie Pope isn’t in great form at the moment, he hasn’t had a decent score all series.

    Meanwhile, our two in-form batsmen - Stokes and Sibley - are back in the hutch and the other to get 50 - Zak Crawley - isn’t even playing.

    And after Pope we’re into the tail.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 50,776
    ydoethur said:

    Short.

    Short.

    Bowled.

    England down to the tail already.
  • NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 3,346

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    OllyT said:

    OllyT said:

    slade said:

    Just returned from my weekly trip to Morrisons. 100% mask wearing amongst customers and all the mobile staff too.


    Similar experience - went into John Lewis Home (100%), Pets at Home (100%) Boots ( 1 couple without a mask)

    Encouraging early signs, I really expected it to be 50/50 at best.
    I have just witnessed why wearing masks for shopping will be detrimental. People were putting on their masks at the door of the shop and then removing them as soon as they left. Hands all over their faces after touching loads of surfaces and products in the shop. This mask wearing for shopping will lead to an increase in cases.
    I agree that not treating the mask properly limits its effectiveness but the answer is to try to educate people to do it properly not say f*ck it, let's not bother.
    In the UK we have bought Covid under control with the use of hand washing and social distancing,not by the use of masks. Why introduce them now? There is no evidence that they work in the settings that they are now going to be used in and until political pressure the WHO said they could well be detrimental.

    To use Surgeons as an example is just ridiculous as that is a completly different setting and a completly different type of mask. (face fitted).

    We have been told all the way along to not touch our faces and now we are being instructed to do something which means that peeple will touch their face all the time.

    Just stand outside a Tesco Express and watch what people do.
    Why introduce them now? Because there will be less social distancing now that half the population isn't cooped up at home.
    Sorry are there new rules on Social Distancing released today?
    No, but if you think people are going to be stay as far apart as they were during the lockdown you have another thing coming. A large fraction of the population stayed at home all the time, that's not the case any more.
    The 1 meter rule was introduced 3 weeks ago and has not led to an increase in cases.
    You have the most amazing command and control view of society. Do you think everyone is following the guidance to the letter?
    Of course not, I just look at the figures and witness peoples behaviour.
  • kamskikamski Posts: 4,199
    There seem to be some people (only on this website tho) disappointed that telling people to cover their mouth and nose while going round Tescos hasn't started a revolution, and that instead people are wearing masks.

    I suppose most people are actually willing to follow a rule that causes them a minor inconvenience when the aim of the rule is to make a resurgence of a deadly epidemic less likely. Who would've guessed?
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 38,852
    edited July 2020
    ydoethur said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:
    Just wait until his chancellor sends tory middle England the bill for all this
    He won't he will mainly borrow despite a few tweaks to capital gains tax
    How are we planning to pay off this mountain of debt we have accumulated over the last 18 years?

    We have a sluggish economy, where growth is going to be at best stagnant. We have low productivity. We seem to have a number of sacred cows that must be paid for. We refuse to consider higher taxes.

    You don’t have to be batshit crazy like Corbyn to see that borrowing passim ad nauseam is a model that won’t work for ever.
    You are still throwing in these gratuitous Corbyn riders, I see, despite my pleas of a while ago. But otherwise a strong point. You DO have to be batshit crazy like ... a batshit crazy person ... to think that the model WILL work for ever.
This discussion has been closed.