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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Opinium’s Tory lead down from 26% at the start of Starmer’s LA

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  • Options
    justin124justin124 Posts: 11,527

    In ACTUAL national polling:

    23 May, 2019: Conservatives achieve 8.8% under Theresa May

    12 December, 2019: Conservatives achieve 43.6% under Boris Johnson.

    An increase of 34.8%.


    That's the bar.

    That qualifies for PB Bollocks post of the week. Congratulations.
    I agree - though the Tories polled 44.7% across GB last December so their support is down 3.7% in this particular poll. There was a 2% Tory lead with Redfield & Wilton on 11th June and another 3% with Opinium a week earlier.
  • Options
    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,190

    Cyclefree said:

    In ACTUAL national polling:

    23 May, 2019: Conservatives achieve 8.8% under Theresa May

    12 December, 2019: Conservatives achieve 43.6% under Boris Johnson.

    An increase of 34.8%.


    That's the bar.

    Tsk. Comparing a Euro election with a General Election.

    What’s the increase when you compare the 2017 and 2019 General Elections?
    The increase was a net change of 100 seats in the majority. From a minus 20 majority to a majority of 80.
    And the percentage increase was what, precisely? Since @MarqueeMark started with that 34.8% figure.
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,317
    edited August 2020

    Carnyx said:

    algarkirk said:

    Carnyx said:

    ukpaul said:

    Third?

    I posted this on the previous thread, a gov.scot official calculator of your age equivalent to check your covid risk. Worth a look, I think.

    https://bit.ly/3gmCLw1

    I did, thank you very much. Very interesting. (Unfortunately, but at least I can do something about it and am ...).
    For most people the greatest factor by far is age, which is hard to do much about. Age constituted over 98% of my score I am sorry to say.

    Exactly so. But if one is overweight, like me, then that is something to be done.
    @Carnyx thanks for the stew recipe: I’ve just made it and it worked really well. I’d be doing that again.

    Not sure how much it will help my waist-line but it is so much better than giving up and getting Deliveroo to take the strain.
    Not from the point of view of the Deliveroo driver you've heartlessly condemned to the scrapheap. :smile:
  • Options

    Carnyx said:

    algarkirk said:

    Carnyx said:

    ukpaul said:

    Third?

    I posted this on the previous thread, a gov.scot official calculator of your age equivalent to check your covid risk. Worth a look, I think.

    https://bit.ly/3gmCLw1

    I did, thank you very much. Very interesting. (Unfortunately, but at least I can do something about it and am ...).
    For most people the greatest factor by far is age, which is hard to do much about. Age constituted over 98% of my score I am sorry to say.

    Exactly so. But if one is overweight, like me, then that is something to be done.
    @Carnyx thanks for the stew recipe: I’ve just made it and it worked really well. I’d be doing that again.

    Not sure how much it will help my waist-line but it is so much better than giving up and getting Deliveroo to take the strain.
    Not from the point of view of the Deliveroo driver you've heartlessly condemned to the scrapheap. :smile:
    Trust me, they’ve had a lot of money from me already...
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,649

    Carnyx said:

    algarkirk said:

    Carnyx said:

    ukpaul said:

    Third?

    I posted this on the previous thread, a gov.scot official calculator of your age equivalent to check your covid risk. Worth a look, I think.

    https://bit.ly/3gmCLw1

    I did, thank you very much. Very interesting. (Unfortunately, but at least I can do something about it and am ...).
    For most people the greatest factor by far is age, which is hard to do much about. Age constituted over 98% of my score I am sorry to say.

    Exactly so. But if one is overweight, like me, then that is something to be done.
    @Carnyx thanks for the stew recipe: I’ve just made it and it worked really well. I’d be doing that again.

    Not sure how much it will help my waist-line but it is so much better than giving up and getting Deliveroo to take the strain.
    Very pleased you enjoyed it. I wonder if you mopped up the juice with some bread? I always do.

    Actually this evening my partner turned out to have bought a couple of really thick chops of hogget (1-2 year old sheep, in this case 1 and a bit) so we deboned them and had turnips, carrots and home grown peas and (separately) new potatoes with them.

    My experience is that abandoning supermarkets and takeaways and pub dinners has caused an unexpected reduction in weight, even when cooking 'normal' meals like this, with a fair bit of wine. But my partner has been careful to ease off on things like ground rice puddings.
  • Options
    Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905
    The Labour Movement appears to be doing too well at the moment, and must therefore self-sabotage in order to atone. From The Observer:

    Labour’s biggest union backer will review its political donations in light of Keir Starmer’s decision to pay damages to ex-staffers who claimed the party had not dealt with antisemitism, its general secretary has warned.

    In an interview with the Observer, Unite leader Len McCluskey said there was “no doubt” the union’s ruling executive would be demanding a review of the millions it donates to the Labour party in the wake of the six-figure settlements.

    “It’s an abuse of members’ money,” he said. “A lot of it is Unite’s money and I’m already being asked all kinds of questions by my executive. It’s as though a huge sign has been put up outside the Labour party with ‘queue here with your writ and get your payment over there’.


    The likelihood of bankruptcy has just ticked upwards a little...
  • Options
    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 19,939
    Sean_F said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Carnyx said:

    algarkirk said:

    Carnyx said:

    ukpaul said:

    Third?

    I posted this on the previous thread, a gov.scot official calculator of your age equivalent to check your covid risk. Worth a look, I think.

    https://bit.ly/3gmCLw1

    I did, thank you very much. Very interesting. (Unfortunately, but at least I can do something about it and am ...).
    For most people the greatest factor by far is age, which is hard to do much about. Age constituted over 98% of my score I am sorry to say.

    Exactly so. But if one is overweight, like me, then that is something to be done.
    Even if I lose weight I remain in the same risk category. I am still trying to do so, mind. But the social distancing from the fridge is not going as well as it should.

    Honestly, there are days when I think my family would be better off were I to die. My children would have an inheritance at least to see them through the next few years. What is the point of a half-life at best staring at sheep, hiding from everyone, with all your interests - artistic, cultural, creative - closed down or too risky and watching your children have their hopes and futures destroyed?

    I suppose Johnson can take some comfort from the fact that things this winter are going to be rotten everywhere in the West.

    His problems will really start if other countries begin to pull out of this.

    Are other countries in Europe closing down restaurants to open schools?
    Is there any point in causing deaths, by shutting down the economy, as opposed to causing deaths, by not shutting down the economy?

    Covid is just something we're going to have live with, I think.
    I think that’s broadly right Sean.

    Vigilance yes, destructive lockdowns, no.
  • Options
    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    algarkirk said:

    Carnyx said:

    ukpaul said:

    Third?

    I posted this on the previous thread, a gov.scot official calculator of your age equivalent to check your covid risk. Worth a look, I think.

    https://bit.ly/3gmCLw1

    I did, thank you very much. Very interesting. (Unfortunately, but at least I can do something about it and am ...).
    For most people the greatest factor by far is age, which is hard to do much about. Age constituted over 98% of my score I am sorry to say.

    Exactly so. But if one is overweight, like me, then that is something to be done.
    @Carnyx thanks for the stew recipe: I’ve just made it and it worked really well. I’d be doing that again.

    Not sure how much it will help my waist-line but it is so much better than giving up and getting Deliveroo to take the strain.
    Very pleased you enjoyed it. I wonder if you mopped up the juice with some bread? I always do.

    Actually this evening my partner turned out to have bought a couple of really thick chops of hogget (1-2 year old sheep, in this case 1 and a bit) so we deboned them and had turnips, carrots and home grown peas and (separately) new potatoes with them.

    My experience is that abandoning supermarkets and takeaways and pub dinners has caused an unexpected reduction in weight, even when cooking 'normal' meals like this, with a fair bit of wine. But my partner has been careful to ease off on things like ground rice puddings.
    I didn’t have new potatoes so I had mashed instead which had the same effect.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,649

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    algarkirk said:

    Carnyx said:

    ukpaul said:

    Third?

    I posted this on the previous thread, a gov.scot official calculator of your age equivalent to check your covid risk. Worth a look, I think.

    https://bit.ly/3gmCLw1

    I did, thank you very much. Very interesting. (Unfortunately, but at least I can do something about it and am ...).
    For most people the greatest factor by far is age, which is hard to do much about. Age constituted over 98% of my score I am sorry to say.

    Exactly so. But if one is overweight, like me, then that is something to be done.
    @Carnyx thanks for the stew recipe: I’ve just made it and it worked really well. I’d be doing that again.

    Not sure how much it will help my waist-line but it is so much better than giving up and getting Deliveroo to take the strain.
    Very pleased you enjoyed it. I wonder if you mopped up the juice with some bread? I always do.

    Actually this evening my partner turned out to have bought a couple of really thick chops of hogget (1-2 year old sheep, in this case 1 and a bit) so we deboned them and had turnips, carrots and home grown peas and (separately) new potatoes with them.

    My experience is that abandoning supermarkets and takeaways and pub dinners has caused an unexpected reduction in weight, even when cooking 'normal' meals like this, with a fair bit of wine. But my partner has been careful to ease off on things like ground rice puddings.
    I didn’t have new potatoes so I had mashed instead which had the same effect.
    I don't think it needs any stock cubes or gravy browning ...
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,181

    The Labour Movement appears to be doing too well at the moment, and must therefore self-sabotage in order to atone. From The Observer:

    Labour’s biggest union backer will review its political donations in light of Keir Starmer’s decision to pay damages to ex-staffers who claimed the party had not dealt with antisemitism, its general secretary has warned.

    In an interview with the Observer, Unite leader Len McCluskey said there was “no doubt” the union’s ruling executive would be demanding a review of the millions it donates to the Labour party in the wake of the six-figure settlements.

    “It’s an abuse of members’ money,” he said. “A lot of it is Unite’s money and I’m already being asked all kinds of questions by my executive. It’s as though a huge sign has been put up outside the Labour party with ‘queue here with your writ and get your payment over there’.


    The likelihood of bankruptcy has just ticked upwards a little...

    So, it’s wrong for a Labour to pay up for a load of people the party has libelled, but it’s fine for McCluskey to hand over as much as £2 million to support Steven Walker after he parroted a lot of lies from Unite about an MP?

    I hope the new general secretary’s first act next year is a full audit.
  • Options
    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    algarkirk said:

    Carnyx said:

    ukpaul said:

    Third?

    I posted this on the previous thread, a gov.scot official calculator of your age equivalent to check your covid risk. Worth a look, I think.

    https://bit.ly/3gmCLw1

    I did, thank you very much. Very interesting. (Unfortunately, but at least I can do something about it and am ...).
    For most people the greatest factor by far is age, which is hard to do much about. Age constituted over 98% of my score I am sorry to say.

    Exactly so. But if one is overweight, like me, then that is something to be done.
    @Carnyx thanks for the stew recipe: I’ve just made it and it worked really well. I’d be doing that again.

    Not sure how much it will help my waist-line but it is so much better than giving up and getting Deliveroo to take the strain.
    Very pleased you enjoyed it. I wonder if you mopped up the juice with some bread? I always do.

    Actually this evening my partner turned out to have bought a couple of really thick chops of hogget (1-2 year old sheep, in this case 1 and a bit) so we deboned them and had turnips, carrots and home grown peas and (separately) new potatoes with them.

    My experience is that abandoning supermarkets and takeaways and pub dinners has caused an unexpected reduction in weight, even when cooking 'normal' meals like this, with a fair bit of wine. But my partner has been careful to ease off on things like ground rice puddings.
    I didn’t have new potatoes so I had mashed instead which had the same effect.
    I don't think it needs any stock cubes or gravy browning ...
    No, it didn’t. I did put some rosemary in; it’s the only home grown ingredient I could manage.
  • Options
    WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 8,503
    edited August 2020
    Cyclefree said:

    Carnyx said:

    algarkirk said:

    Carnyx said:

    ukpaul said:

    Third?

    I posted this on the previous thread, a gov.scot official calculator of your age equivalent to check your covid risk. Worth a look, I think.

    https://bit.ly/3gmCLw1

    I did, thank you very much. Very interesting. (Unfortunately, but at least I can do something about it and am ...).
    For most people the greatest factor by far is age, which is hard to do much about. Age constituted over 98% of my score I am sorry to say.

    Exactly so. But if one is overweight, like me, then that is something to be done.
    Even if I lose weight I remain in the same risk category. I am still trying to do so, mind. But the social distancing from the fridge is not going as well as it should.

    Honestly, there are days when I think my family would be better off were I to die. My children would have an inheritance at least to see them through the next few years. What is the point of a half-life at best staring at sheep, hiding from everyone, with all your interests - artistic, cultural, creative - closed down or too risky and watching your children have their hopes and futures destroyed?

    I suppose Johnson can take some comfort from the fact that things this winter are going to be rotten everywhere in the West.

    His problems will really start if other countries begin to pull out of this.

    Are other countries in Europe closing down restaurants to open schools?
    I'm sorry to hear things are looking so bleak, Cyclefree, for me life is always living as far as possible. One thing I would add, from your posts, is that your are clearly someone who must offer much more to your family than your own personal and artistic interests - moral, intellectual, organisational, of overall fortitude.

    Back to the RCP, and also to reply more fully to a previous point, RCP/Spiked are also responsible for the concept that emerged on their pages in around 2017, that any wavering from the path of an uncompromising Brexit would represent a travesty of the working- class experiment in radical democracy that is Brexit ; by wealthy people in the South. There's no precedent for anything like this in any previous Tory populism.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,649

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    algarkirk said:

    Carnyx said:

    ukpaul said:

    Third?

    I posted this on the previous thread, a gov.scot official calculator of your age equivalent to check your covid risk. Worth a look, I think.

    https://bit.ly/3gmCLw1

    I did, thank you very much. Very interesting. (Unfortunately, but at least I can do something about it and am ...).
    For most people the greatest factor by far is age, which is hard to do much about. Age constituted over 98% of my score I am sorry to say.

    Exactly so. But if one is overweight, like me, then that is something to be done.
    @Carnyx thanks for the stew recipe: I’ve just made it and it worked really well. I’d be doing that again.

    Not sure how much it will help my waist-line but it is so much better than giving up and getting Deliveroo to take the strain.
    Very pleased you enjoyed it. I wonder if you mopped up the juice with some bread? I always do.

    Actually this evening my partner turned out to have bought a couple of really thick chops of hogget (1-2 year old sheep, in this case 1 and a bit) so we deboned them and had turnips, carrots and home grown peas and (separately) new potatoes with them.

    My experience is that abandoning supermarkets and takeaways and pub dinners has caused an unexpected reduction in weight, even when cooking 'normal' meals like this, with a fair bit of wine. But my partner has been careful to ease off on things like ground rice puddings.
    I didn’t have new potatoes so I had mashed instead which had the same effect.
    I don't think it needs any stock cubes or gravy browning ...
    No, it didn’t. I did put some rosemary in; it’s the only home grown ingredient I could manage.
    Ditto.
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,202
    England cruise home again after a significant wobble. Once again the problem of not being able to take wickets in the middle overs undoes a team that played well but just didn't have enough runs.

    I think a part of the problem for Ireland and indeed anyone else who plays England is that they know that the likes of Bairstow and Roy will give England an absolute flyer so they feel a need to play expansively in the powerplay which all too often costs wickets. Even with a number of their best players elsewhere this is a frighteningly good team.
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,639
    What to make of this?

    Coronavirus: Russia plans mass vaccination campaign in October

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-53621708

    Are they brave? Foolish? Bullshitting?

    (Then again, I would hope someone in the UK is planning an mass vaccination campaign for the autumn to cover the possibility that there is be an approved vaccine by October.)
  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/08/01/bookings-greece-surge-summer-holidays-jet2-spain/

    33 out of 160 crew on cruise liner test positive immediately after 7 day cruise with 177 passengers on board.

    This is where we came in.
  • Options
    nichomar said:

    Essexit said:

    Starmer is playing the long game and playing it well.

    His personal popularity remains high but he is not yet converting that entirely into Labour votes. To do that he must prove that Labour has really changed - the EHRC investigation will give him the ability to do that.

    If Corbyn and co are implicated in that - as I suspect they are - then they should lose the Whip.

    Agree that would be the right thing to do, but goodness knows what consequences it could unleash. If Corbyn's inner circle lost the whip, some of the newer, Corbynite MPs could follow of their own accord. If they formed a new party and took some members with them, they could split the Labour vote in winnable constituencies in GE2024. Or maybe they'd have about as much impact as Change UK/TIG/whatever.
    Corbyn and co will be looking into who owns the labour brand, that’s what his fundraising is probably for. I assume it’s who holds the registrations for the various required names for the electoral commission.
    I understand the plan now:
    1. Realise you are losing control of Labour and will never be rid of the evil centrist Tories
    2. Do stupid shit that gets the Labour Party sued into bankruptsy
    3. Buy the name and refound the party in His own image, allowing evil centrist Tories to fuck off and join the Tories as they always wanted
    4. Win a majority of 704 at the next election. Chris Williamson Secretary of State for Culture
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,202
    IshmaelZ said:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/08/01/bookings-greece-surge-summer-holidays-jet2-spain/

    33 out of 160 crew on cruise liner test positive immediately after 7 day cruise with 177 passengers on board.

    This is where we came in.

    The reluctance to accept that the world has changed is truly remarkable.
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,254
    (CNN) - Lamenting his plunging popularity this week, a self-pitying President Donald Trump wondered how it all went wrong.

    "Nobody likes me," he said, confounded at how his administration's health experts could be receiving accolades while he is accused of ignoring and denying the raging public health crisis.

    "It can only be my personality," Trump said, "that's all."

    https://edition.cnn.com/2020/08/01/politics/donald-trump-allies-election/index.html
  • Options
    Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905

    What to make of this?

    Coronavirus: Russia plans mass vaccination campaign in October

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-53621708

    Are they brave? Foolish? Bullshitting?

    (Then again, I would hope someone in the UK is planning an mass vaccination campaign for the autumn to cover the possibility that there is be an approved vaccine by October.)

    Brave? Foolish? Bullshitting? Could easily be all three! It's possible they've got something ready to go but that they've cut corners in order to get it ready to roll out that quick. If it turns out to have a useful effect and not to do anything nasty to people then they get an enormous propaganda coup; failing that they attempt to cover up the adverse consequences.

    The Government must already be ramping up to deliver free flu vaccines to over half the population later this Autumn. If it just so happens that a Covid shot clears all the regulatory hurdles and can start being rolled out then they'll presumably use all the same staff to lance the priority patients twice? Indeed, depending on the timing it might be possible to administer both vaccines at once.
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,254
    The extent of quarantine and other restrictions on inter-state travel within the US is remarkable

    https://us.cnn.com/travel/article/us-state-travel-restrictions-covid-19/index.html

    I bet Americans never imagined a world when they couldn’t travel freely between one state and another.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,649

    What to make of this?

    Coronavirus: Russia plans mass vaccination campaign in October

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-53621708

    Are they brave? Foolish? Bullshitting?

    (Then again, I would hope someone in the UK is planning an mass vaccination campaign for the autumn to cover the possibility that there is be an approved vaccine by October.)

    Brave? Foolish? Bullshitting? Could easily be all three! It's possible they've got something ready to go but that they've cut corners in order to get it ready to roll out that quick. If it turns out to have a useful effect and not to do anything nasty to people then they get an enormous propaganda coup; failing that they attempt to cover up the adverse consequences.

    The Government must already be ramping up to deliver free flu vaccines to over half the population later this Autumn. If it just so happens that a Covid shot clears all the regulatory hurdles and can start being rolled out then they'll presumably use all the same staff to lance the priority patients twice? Indeed, depending on the timing it might be possible to administer both vaccines at once.
    You do mean the "English", Welsh, NI and Scottish Governments, not Russia?
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,952
    DavidL said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/08/01/bookings-greece-surge-summer-holidays-jet2-spain/

    33 out of 160 crew on cruise liner test positive immediately after 7 day cruise with 177 passengers on board.

    This is where we came in.

    The reluctance to accept that the world has changed is truly remarkable.
    Indeed. And that Telegraph live blog appears to be entirely holiday related.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,649
    IanB2 said:

    The extent of quarantine and other restrictions on inter-state travel within the US is remarkable

    https://us.cnn.com/travel/article/us-state-travel-restrictions-covid-19/index.html

    I bet Americans never imagined a world when they couldn’t travel freely between one state and another.

    THat is very interesting. Thank you for pointing this out.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,182

    IanB2 said:
    Trump supporter. "Yeah but he's our Cretin"
    But Hillary's emails!
    She is rubbish at golf too.

    Apparently he is a huge cheat:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INxGbTHybvc
    Who would want to be that journalist. Trying to control himself from saying: "you fcking kidding me, how the hell did an idiot like you become our president."
  • Options
    SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,704

    What to make of this?

    Coronavirus: Russia plans mass vaccination campaign in October

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-53621708

    Are they brave? Foolish? Bullshitting?

    (Then again, I would hope someone in the UK is planning an mass vaccination campaign for the autumn to cover the possibility that there is be an approved vaccine by October.)

    Probably vaccination with Vodka. It'll be about as good as anything else by October.
  • Options
    StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    DavidL said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/08/01/bookings-greece-surge-summer-holidays-jet2-spain/

    33 out of 160 crew on cruise liner test positive immediately after 7 day cruise with 177 passengers on board.

    This is where we came in.

    The reluctance to accept that the world has changed is truly remarkable.
    Scottish Tories never change, and yet you are surprised when other people don’t.
  • Options
    WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 8,503
    edited August 2020
    As a final point, and also very minor correction, on Spiked and the associated gang, the radical-democratic and also class-war rhetoric on Brexit, which is now central and standard for the current administration, began to be promoted in print very late in 2016 and early in 2017, before it reached the Spiked website.

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Revolting-Establishment-Undermining-Democracy-Theyre/dp/0008220824
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,639

    Truly sad to read @Cyclefree ’s post.

    I desperately hope things improve for her.

    Agree totally.

    Stick with it @Cyclefree - it won't be forever! My scientist friends are all confident there will be a vaccine (and they were mostly sceptical two months ago).
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,649
    dixiedean said:

    DavidL said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/08/01/bookings-greece-surge-summer-holidays-jet2-spain/

    33 out of 160 crew on cruise liner test positive immediately after 7 day cruise with 177 passengers on board.

    This is where we came in.

    The reluctance to accept that the world has changed is truly remarkable.
    Indeed. And that Telegraph live blog appears to be entirely holiday related.
    There is a link on that page to an Edinburgh page on that site which is dated 25 June and yet ignores the bug. I can't work my way through it all (some of the links are paywalled) but I do know that at least one recommended attraction is closed.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,952

    Truly sad to read @Cyclefree ’s post.

    I desperately hope things improve for her.

    Agree totally.

    Stick with it @Cyclefree - it won't be forever! My scientist friends are all confident there will be a vaccine (and they were mostly sceptical two months ago).
    Indeed. Much empathy with @Cyclefree. And others feeling as if there is no light in this tunnel.
    May seem trite, but this too will pass. It always does.
  • Options
    Re: Golf, years ago in late 70s - early 80s while working way through school driving cab in Baton Rouge, we used to get some business from merchant sailors, BR being a major ocean-going port. From number of nationalities, but the ones that stuck out were the Japanese and the Norwegians.

    > the Japanese sailors were AVID golfers, which is NOT exactly what you think of when you think "merchant marine"; some had the own clubs, and went to municipally-owned golf course.

    > the Norwegians were NOT golfers; instead, they went to a small town south of Baton Rouge which featured a block of whorehouses operating via an "arrangement" with local officials & police.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,182
    Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    "The Roots Of Wokeness
    It's time we looked more closely at the philosophy behind the movement.

    Andrew Sullivan"

    https://andrewsullivan.substack.com/p/the-roots-of-wokeness

    Thanks. Excellent explanation of things.

    "Within critical theory, the very concept of a “diversity of ideas” is a function of oppression."

    This struck me. Basically exactly what a Lab MP (from Nottingham I think - one of the new Jezza ones) said about debates in the House of Commons.
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    edited August 2020
    nichomar said:

    Cyclefree said:

    In ACTUAL national polling:

    23 May, 2019: Conservatives achieve 8.8% under Theresa May

    12 December, 2019: Conservatives achieve 43.6% under Boris Johnson.

    An increase of 34.8%.


    That's the bar.

    Tsk. Comparing a Euro election with a General Election.

    What’s the increase when you compare the 2017 and 2019 General Elections?
    The increase was a net change of 100 seats in the majority. From a minus 20 majority to a majority of 80.
    Only because of the corrupt electoral system in the UK
    Our electoral system is the best in the world and mainstream. Billions of people vote worldwide using our system because it works. There is no electoral system used by more people.
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    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,879
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    LadyGLadyG Posts: 2,221

    IanB2 said:

    In ACTUAL national polling:

    23 May, 2019: Conservatives achieve 8.8% under Theresa May

    12 December, 2019: Conservatives achieve 43.6% under Boris Johnson.

    An increase of 34.8%.


    That's the bar.

    That qualifies for PB Bollocks post of the week. Congratulations.
    Mr Mark should be proud to win such a hotly contested title. And congratulations, for at least showing that Sean doesn’t win every week.
    Sean, erh LadyG, has some good posts
    I wish I could match SeanT for verve, wit and tha,t extraordinary sexually compelling intellect, but sadly I am a mere mortal in comparison. But thanks.
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    WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 8,503
    edited August 2020

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    "The Roots Of Wokeness
    It's time we looked more closely at the philosophy behind the movement.

    Andrew Sullivan"

    https://andrewsullivan.substack.com/p/the-roots-of-wokeness

    Thanks. Excellent explanation of things.

    "Within critical theory, the very concept of a “diversity of ideas” is a function of oppression."

    This struck me. Basically exactly what a Lab MP (from Nottingham I think - one of the new Jezza ones) said about debates in the House of Commons.
    There's some reasonable moments, but he conflates and mixes up quite a few things too here. Critical theory predates post-modernism, and there are several branches of critical theory which wouldn't exclude a diversity of ideas at all ; Haberman is in the tradition of critical theory, for instance, and is a key figure behind modern ideas about pluralism. Not looking too carefully at a very complex field can sometimes risk a conspiracy mindset of the "It's all Cultural Marxism ! " variety.
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    TimTTimT Posts: 6,328

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    "The Roots Of Wokeness
    It's time we looked more closely at the philosophy behind the movement.

    Andrew Sullivan"

    https://andrewsullivan.substack.com/p/the-roots-of-wokeness

    Thanks. Excellent explanation of things.

    "Within critical theory, the very concept of a “diversity of ideas” is a function of oppression."

    This struck me. Basically exactly what a Lab MP (from Nottingham I think - one of the new Jezza ones) said about debates in the House of Commons.
    I am stumped by what that means. Does that mean that, to allow someone to think differently to yourself is to oppress them?
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,181
    edited August 2020
    Scott_xP said:
    If that’s who I think it is, then Boris Johnson has some very hard questions to answer about why the whip wasn’t withdrawn four months ago.

    Edit - although it might not be, given the dates mentioned.
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    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,879
    ydoethur said:

    If that’s who I think it is, then Boris Johnson has some very hard questions to answer about why the whip wasn’t withdrawn four months ago.

    In the latest case, a fellow Conservative MP first raised the woman’s allegation with Mark Spencer, the chief whip, and Jacob Rees-Mogg, the leader of the House of Commons, after speaking to the alleged victim a month ago.

    The woman also spoke to Spencer directly. However, no action was taken. A spokesman for Spencer said: “The chief whip takes all allegations of harassment and abuse extremely seriously and has strongly encouraged anybody who has approached him to contact the appropriate authorities, including parliament’s independent complaints and grievance scheme.”

    It is understood that Spencer does not believe a sexual assault was reported to him in his conversation with the complainant, but acknowledges that she reported abusive behaviour and threats.
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    RobDRobD Posts: 58,961

    nichomar said:

    Cyclefree said:

    In ACTUAL national polling:

    23 May, 2019: Conservatives achieve 8.8% under Theresa May

    12 December, 2019: Conservatives achieve 43.6% under Boris Johnson.

    An increase of 34.8%.


    That's the bar.

    Tsk. Comparing a Euro election with a General Election.

    What’s the increase when you compare the 2017 and 2019 General Elections?
    The increase was a net change of 100 seats in the majority. From a minus 20 majority to a majority of 80.
    Only because of the corrupt electoral system in the UK
    Our electoral system is the best in the world and mainstream. Billions of people vote worldwide using our system because it works. There is no electoral system used by more people.
    Corrupt = doesn't give me the result I want.
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    RobDRobD Posts: 58,961
    It's almost as if they think they've identified a frequent mode of transmission and are trying to reduce it rather than imposing blanket restrictions.
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    MattWMattW Posts: 18,468

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    "The Roots Of Wokeness
    It's time we looked more closely at the philosophy behind the movement.

    Andrew Sullivan"

    https://andrewsullivan.substack.com/p/the-roots-of-wokeness

    Thanks. Excellent explanation of things.

    "Within critical theory, the very concept of a “diversity of ideas” is a function of oppression."

    This struck me. Basically exactly what a Lab MP (from Nottingham I think - one of the new Jezza ones) said about debates in the House of Commons.
    That would be Nadia Whittome. She's a sort of equally mad Corbynista version of Mhairi Black.
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    Re: coping with Covid, think we are getting a taste of what WWII and other wars were (and in some cases still are) like, when "civilians" are in the firing line, both directly (as in Blitz) and indirectly witnessing the suffering & worse of family, friends, coworkers & entire community.

    What we appear to lack, is any semblance of leadership capable of uniting, inspiring, encouraging, persuading - things that came (as it seems) naturally to Winston S. Churchill and Franklin D. Roosevelt.
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    fox327fox327 Posts: 366
    edited August 2020

    What to make of this?

    Coronavirus: Russia plans mass vaccination campaign in October

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-53621708

    Are they brave? Foolish? Bullshitting?

    (Then again, I would hope someone in the UK is planning an mass vaccination campaign for the autumn to cover the possibility that there is be an approved vaccine by October.)

    Brave? Foolish? Bullshitting? Could easily be all three! It's possible they've got something ready to go but that they've cut corners in order to get it ready to roll out that quick. If it turns out to have a useful effect and not to do anything nasty to people then they get an enormous propaganda coup; failing that they attempt to cover up the adverse consequences.

    The Government must already be ramping up to deliver free flu vaccines to over half the population later this Autumn. If it just so happens that a Covid shot clears all the regulatory hurdles and can start being rolled out then they'll presumably use all the same staff to lance the priority patients twice? Indeed, depending on the timing it might be possible to administer both vaccines at once.
    It is possible that they have done human challenge trials, possibly on a large scale with hundreds or thousands of participants. If so, they could have a lot of data on the vaccine making it in a sense adequately tested, although there is always some unavoidable uncertainty in the launch of a new drug. India is also trying to get a vaccine into production before the end of this year.

    The situation can be compared to the space race in the 1960s when President Kennedy said in a speech "We choose to go to the Moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard ... ". This resulted in a huge acceleration in the technological progress in rocket science due to superpower rivalry. There was a similar situation in the 1940s: the Manhattan Project, which developed the first atomic weapons. The development of a coronavirus vaccine is potentially a similar situation, in terms of a global technological race.
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    Habermas, that should say below, not Haberman.
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    LadyGLadyG Posts: 2,221

    Truly sad to read @Cyclefree ’s post.

    I desperately hope things improve for her.

    Agree totally.

    Stick with it @Cyclefree - it won't be forever! My scientist friends are all confident there will be a vaccine (and they were mostly sceptical two months ago).
    I am also sad to read @Cyclefree so down.

    Every morning, at the moment, I have to consciously steer myself away from the rocks of black despair. Like it is a choice: I can either read the news, the runes, and the tea-leaves, and think: sweet Jesus, this is terrible, and it's not getting better. What about my poor children??

    Or I can choose to have a coffee, do something mildly constructive, live in the moment.

    It's difficult, but I go for the latter. The key is not to look ahead, the same way you don't look down when you're on a tightrope. Ahead there is only danger and peril. Nothing good. So don't look ahead.

    Shut your eyes and enjoy the coffee. And thus you get through. Another day.
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    stodgestodge Posts: 12,841
    RobD said:


    Our electoral system is the best in the world and mainstream. Billions of people vote worldwide using our system because it works. There is no electoral system used by more people.

    Corrupt = doesn't give me the result I want.
    Best in the World = gives me the result I want.

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    LadyGLadyG Posts: 2,221

    Re: coping with Covid, think we are getting a taste of what WWII and other wars were (and in some cases still are) like, when "civilians" are in the firing line, both directly (as in Blitz) and indirectly witnessing the suffering & worse of family, friends, coworkers & entire community.

    What we appear to lack, is any semblance of leadership capable of uniting, inspiring, encouraging, persuading - things that came (as it seems) naturally to Winston S. Churchill and Franklin D. Roosevelt.

    I said the exact same thing in a family Whatsapp group today.

    Finally, I now feel exactly what it must have been like for people going into a global war. This IS that bad. Even if one is personally doing OK, very few of us are more than a couple of connections away from someone seriously ill, or dying, or going bankrupt, or suddenly unemployed, or facing mental health issues, and so on. The universality of the pain is brutal. And winter is coming.
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    algarkirk said:

    Slightly OT, but re; the earlier discussion on Andy Beckett's article on RCP / Spiked.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/aug/01/why-johnsons-tories-fell-for-a-tiny-sect-of-libertarian-provocateurs-rcp

    The fascinating thing is how many of these have maintained a continuity of view since the late 1980's. It's not just a typical tale of leftwingers moving to the right with age, but in fact of how some of the very specific issues linked to this confident, often largely unchanged group have influenced the right. The fusion of anti-elite and vanguardist rhetoric, for instance, rooted in Marxism, with classical liberalism from far elsewhere, is there right as we speak in Cumming's and Johnson's populist vocabulary.

    Some have asked of examples of links to specific policies ; but in politics, as many will know, rhetoric, emphasis and direction can be as important as individual policies.

    A line on the actual policies, beliefs and practice of these phenomena, with boring detail attached, would be helpful. The Grauniad article + the comments so far have been filled with mystical abstractions.

    I see opportunists being opportunistic and no change from the usual form for modern power seekers. Enjoy the show.

    Just had (socially distanced) coffee with a couple of OC teachers.

    Apparently the teaching unions over here have decided they won’t reopen schools until Sacramento defunds the police

    🤣
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    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,078

    nichomar said:

    Cyclefree said:

    In ACTUAL national polling:

    23 May, 2019: Conservatives achieve 8.8% under Theresa May

    12 December, 2019: Conservatives achieve 43.6% under Boris Johnson.

    An increase of 34.8%.


    That's the bar.

    Tsk. Comparing a Euro election with a General Election.

    What’s the increase when you compare the 2017 and 2019 General Elections?
    The increase was a net change of 100 seats in the majority. From a minus 20 majority to a majority of 80.
    Only because of the corrupt electoral system in the UK
    Our electoral system is the best in the world and mainstream. Billions of people vote worldwide using our system because it works. There is no electoral system used by more people.
    Are you just making up facts again? Please show your working.
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    ydoethur said:

    IanB2 said:

    I suspect by January we will see some quite big labour leads.

    Winter looks awful for the tories.

    And winter is, inexorably, coming.
    The Tories face Stark choices.

    The question is, Arya sure they can handle it?

    And Vince misses a straight one again. Honestly, he’s more unconvincing than Dominic Cummings.
    Should we be surprised that Vince is useless?

    Apart from the Stalin to Mr Bean jibe, what did Vince ever achieve?
    He correctly predicted 8 of the last 3 recessions
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,017
    edited August 2020
    Scott_xP said:
    I think we can safely say whoever wins the candidacy will take the seat.

    On that note, has there been any word who will be stepping into Ruth's sweaty, Nat-kicking boots as the SCon candidate?
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    LadyG said:

    Re: coping with Covid, think we are getting a taste of what WWII and other wars were (and in some cases still are) like, when "civilians" are in the firing line, both directly (as in Blitz) and indirectly witnessing the suffering & worse of family, friends, coworkers & entire community.

    What we appear to lack, is any semblance of leadership capable of uniting, inspiring, encouraging, persuading - things that came (as it seems) naturally to Winston S. Churchill and Franklin D. Roosevelt.

    I said the exact same thing in a family Whatsapp group today.

    Finally, I now feel exactly what it must have been like for people going into a global war. This IS that bad. Even if one is personally doing OK, very few of us are more than a couple of connections away from someone seriously ill, or dying, or going bankrupt, or suddenly unemployed, or facing mental health issues, and so on. The universality of the pain is brutal. And winter is coming.
    Think the silver lining of this dark cloud, is that our fore-mothers & -fathers endured worse than us (most of us anyway) are going through, and came out (again mostly) on the other side.

    IF we pull up our socks, maybe WE can do as well - almost, anyway.
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    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,879

    I think we can safely say whoever wins the candidacy will take the seat.

    On that note, has there been any word who will be stepping into Ruth's sweaty, Nat-kicking boots as the SCon candidate?

    https://twitter.com/kezdugdale/status/1289646469679480833
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    FPT - GOLFING TRUMPSKY

    Golf has a political connotations for American presidents best AVOIDED. These can be summed up as:
    > playing instead of working; and
    > upper-class (rather upper-middle-class) snobbery.

    IIRC Woodrow Wilson was first golfing president, followed by Harding who was a typical duffer-golfer fanatic. Harding's reputation for spending large amounts of time on the links enhanced neither his reputation nor that of the golf. One reason why Coolidge & Hoover avoided the game, as of course did FDR for other reasons.

    Harry Truman liked to play golf, but he was NOT in same league as Dwight Eisenhower. Indeed, Ike's passion for the game and time he spend on the links because political arguments against him. Of course he was re-elected anyway, but did NOT enhance his image.

    Kennedy, LBJ & Nixon lacked Ike's golf mania. Gerry Ford was fairly avid golfer, but kept it under wraps until AFTER he lost 1976 election.

    Wasn't until Bill Clinton that presidential golf again because a thing, as it was with Obama. By their time, sport had democratized somewhat, but still retained some tinge & taint of classes versus masses (as in "Caddyshack"). Which is why Trumpsky made such a deal about Obama's golfing.

    Golf - best avoided IF you are President of United States. Hardly bar sinister - but NOT helpful politically.

    This is the U.K. equivalent

    http://www.tntmagazine.com/news/uk/david-cameron-did-ride-rebekah-brookss-police-horse
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    RobD said:

    It's almost as if they think they've identified a frequent mode of transmission and are trying to reduce it rather than imposing blanket restrictions.
    Huh? So its being transmitted between different households meeting indoors.
    1. Where have the infected caught the virus? From other people in pubs shops restaurants work etc
    2. "Do not meet with people from other households" in pubs restaurants etc. Unless the place is on an exclusive hire and I am doing my own food/ drinks thats not physically possible.

    Its nonsense on stilts
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    geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,144
    "The key is not to look ahead, the same way you don't look down when you're on a tightrope."
    That's a great simile @LadyG.
    Many normal options are ruled out - for everybody, young or old. The future cannot be planned so we have to live in the moment.
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    Sean_F said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Carnyx said:

    algarkirk said:

    Carnyx said:

    ukpaul said:

    Third?

    I posted this on the previous thread, a gov.scot official calculator of your age equivalent to check your covid risk. Worth a look, I think.

    https://bit.ly/3gmCLw1

    I did, thank you very much. Very interesting. (Unfortunately, but at least I can do something about it and am ...).
    For most people the greatest factor by far is age, which is hard to do much about. Age constituted over 98% of my score I am sorry to say.

    Exactly so. But if one is overweight, like me, then that is something to be done.
    Even if I lose weight I remain in the same risk category. I am still trying to do so, mind. But the social distancing from the fridge is not going as well as it should.

    Honestly, there are days when I think my family would be better off were I to die. My children would have an inheritance at least to see them through the next few years. What is the point of a half-life at best staring at sheep, hiding from everyone, with all your interests - artistic, cultural, creative - closed down or too risky and watching your children have their hopes and futures destroyed?

    I suppose Johnson can take some comfort from the fact that things this winter are going to be rotten everywhere in the West.

    His problems will really start if other countries begin to pull out of this.

    Are other countries in Europe closing down restaurants to open schools?
    Is there any point in causing deaths, by shutting down the economy, as opposed to causing deaths, by not shutting down the economy?

    Covid is just something we're going to have live with, I think.
    I think that’s broadly right Sean.

    Vigilance yes, destructive lockdowns, no.
    The East Asian experience seems to show that, if you start with a very low level of infection, and the public are super-hygienic, and your contact tracing is top-notch, you can keep the infection level very low and life can continue in a normal-ish (but muffled) way. And you have to aim to keep the level low, because otherwise exponential growth devours you in a month or two.

    The failure of Europe in general, and the UK in particular, to manage that control in February and March meant that the infection rate got totally out of hand. Then the choice was lockdown or lots of dead people. Yes, lockdown was destructive, but we were in a "well, I wouldn't have started from here" situation by mid-March.

    But how close are we to the East Asian model now? The ONS survey is implying about 4000 new cases a day, and a lot of those aren't being picked up by the targeted testing. And there's still a lot of quibbling about things like masks, which really ought to be a no-brainer at the moment.

    I hope we're going to be OK, but there's not much margin for confidence.

    Anyway, the night is warm and the hedgehogs in the garden won't watch themselves...
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    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,078
    I want to know why we STILL don't have a functioning track and trace app. What the hell are they playing at?
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,379
    Cyclefree said:

    Carnyx said:

    algarkirk said:

    Carnyx said:

    ukpaul said:

    Third?

    I posted this on the previous thread, a gov.scot official calculator of your age equivalent to check your covid risk. Worth a look, I think.

    https://bit.ly/3gmCLw1

    I did, thank you very much. Very interesting. (Unfortunately, but at least I can do something about it and am ...).
    For most people the greatest factor by far is age, which is hard to do much about. Age constituted over 98% of my score I am sorry to say.

    Exactly so. But if one is overweight, like me, then that is something to be done.
    Even if I lose weight I remain in the same risk category. I am still trying to do so, mind. But the social distancing from the fridge is not going as well as it should.

    Honestly, there are days when I think my family would be better off were I to die. My children would have an inheritance at least to see them through the next few years. What is the point of a half-life at best staring at sheep, hiding from everyone, with all your interests - artistic, cultural, creative - closed down or too risky and watching your children have their hopes and futures destroyed?

    I suppose Johnson can take some comfort from the fact that things this winter are going to be rotten everywhere in the West.

    His problems will really start if other countries begin to pull out of this.

    Are other countries in Europe closing down restaurants to open schools?
    It's important to remember that this will pass - as so many other similar occurrences have, leaving us unchanged a lot more than perhaps we feel it will at the moment.
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    LadyGLadyG Posts: 2,221

    LadyG said:

    Re: coping with Covid, think we are getting a taste of what WWII and other wars were (and in some cases still are) like, when "civilians" are in the firing line, both directly (as in Blitz) and indirectly witnessing the suffering & worse of family, friends, coworkers & entire community.

    What we appear to lack, is any semblance of leadership capable of uniting, inspiring, encouraging, persuading - things that came (as it seems) naturally to Winston S. Churchill and Franklin D. Roosevelt.

    I said the exact same thing in a family Whatsapp group today.

    Finally, I now feel exactly what it must have been like for people going into a global war. This IS that bad. Even if one is personally doing OK, very few of us are more than a couple of connections away from someone seriously ill, or dying, or going bankrupt, or suddenly unemployed, or facing mental health issues, and so on. The universality of the pain is brutal. And winter is coming.
    Think the silver lining of this dark cloud, is that our fore-mothers & -fathers endured worse than us (most of us anyway) are going through, and came out (again mostly) on the other side.

    IF we pull up our socks, maybe WE can do as well - almost, anyway.
    My very aged parents reckon this is the worst global/national crisis and enormity since the 2nd world war, which they both just about recall.

    Which makes it a once in a century thing, pretty much.

    The worst of it is the unpredictability. Major plagues tend to evolve into wars, coups, revolutions, and so forth.

    This is my favourite interview from the early days of Covid.

    Watch to the end.


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quBBlYRlDOs
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,538

    I want to know why we STILL don't have a functioning track and trace app. What the hell are they playing at?

    The government doesn't know what it's doing. Time for new leadership.
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,017
    Scott_xP said:

    I think we can safely say whoever wins the candidacy will take the seat.

    On that note, has there been any word who will be stepping into Ruth's sweaty, Nat-kicking boots as the SCon candidate?

    https://twitter.com/kezdugdale/status/1289646469679480833
    Kezia fluffing for SCons again. That worked out well last time.

    Happy to take a punt with you on the party of the winner of the seat. £50?
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    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,578
    Cyclefree said:

    Carnyx said:

    algarkirk said:

    Carnyx said:

    ukpaul said:

    Third?

    I posted this on the previous thread, a gov.scot official calculator of your age equivalent to check your covid risk. Worth a look, I think.

    https://bit.ly/3gmCLw1

    I did, thank you very much. Very interesting. (Unfortunately, but at least I can do something about it and am ...).
    For most people the greatest factor by far is age, which is hard to do much about. Age constituted over 98% of my score I am sorry to say.

    Exactly so. But if one is overweight, like me, then that is something to be done.
    Even if I lose weight I remain in the same risk category. I am still trying to do so, mind. But the social distancing from the fridge is not going as well as it should.

    Honestly, there are days when I think my family would be better off were I to die. My children would have an inheritance at least to see them through the next few years. What is the point of a half-life at best staring at sheep, hiding from everyone, with all your interests - artistic, cultural, creative - closed down or too risky and watching your children have their hopes and futures destroyed?
    Everyone is getting cheesed off with it, not least in Leicester, where Fox jr lives with his lovely partner, not 5 miles away, but we are not permitted to meet up even in the garden. Fox jr is working, but that leaves her alone in a terraced house all day. She is getting a bit down about it all. No holidays or able to see her parents, and laid off too.

    Inheriting may solve some financial problems, but what she or Fox jr gained would not make up for the far more serious human losses. I am sure it is true of the young @Cyclefree brood too.

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    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,078
    Juicy by-election incoming?
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,597
    Here's a question. Suppose that you are travelling on a train. Wearing a face covering like a model citizen. You feel a sneeze coming on. Are you supposed to:

    A) Sneeze into your mask?
    B) Slip off your mask and use a tissue?

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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,182
    Blimey.

    I humbly would suggest speculation on here would be a really bad idea from the legal point of view.
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    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,190
    Before I go, a response to @MattW - see https://twitter.com/mattwardman/status/1289542313312575489?s=21.

    Bilberries are also known as blueberries.

    Partial shade, acid soil ie ericaceous, keep well-watered - especially in summer - but not water-logged and prune to keep the bush in shape. Don’t crowd as they can suffer from mildew if they don’t get air to the plant.

    And don’t forget to pick the fruits before the birds steal them!
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Re: Golf, years ago in late 70s - early 80s while working way through school driving cab in Baton Rouge, we used to get some business from merchant sailors, BR being a major ocean-going port. From number of nationalities, but the ones that stuck out were the Japanese and the Norwegians.

    > the Japanese sailors were AVID golfers, which is NOT exactly what you think of when you think "merchant marine"; some had the own clubs, and went to municipally-owned golf course.

    > the Norwegians were NOT golfers; instead, they went to a small town south of Baton Rouge which featured a block of whorehouses operating via an "arrangement" with local officials & police.

    Nice to see that men globally share an interest of getting balls in holes
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,182
    Scott_xP said:
    This is just getting increasingly bonkers.

    Sweden. Sweden. Sweden.
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    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,879

    Happy to take a punt with you on the party of the winner of the seat.

    You would have to specify which faction of the SNP you think will get the nod.

    It's impressive that they didn't think Angus could beat Joanna, so they tried a stitch-up. Now they don't think he can beat Marco, so they need to unwind it...
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    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,952

    Here's a question. Suppose that you are travelling on a train. Wearing a face covering like a model citizen. You feel a sneeze coming on. Are you supposed to:

    A) Sneeze into your mask?
    B) Slip off your mask and use a tissue?

    Er. Into the mask.
    It is literally why you'd be wearing one.
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,182
    Scott_xP said:
    "PM approved travel restrictions in and out of the M25"

    Excepting travel to his grace and favour pad in the countryside of course.

    And no doubt Barnard Castle and Durham will be excluded from the rules for some reason.
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    algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 10,511

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    "The Roots Of Wokeness
    It's time we looked more closely at the philosophy behind the movement.

    Andrew Sullivan"

    https://andrewsullivan.substack.com/p/the-roots-of-wokeness

    Thanks. Excellent explanation of things.

    "Within critical theory, the very concept of a “diversity of ideas” is a function of oppression."

    This struck me. Basically exactly what a Lab MP (from Nottingham I think - one of the new Jezza ones) said about debates in the House of Commons.
    There's some reasonable moments, but he conflates and mixes up quite a few things too here. Critical theory predates post-modernism, and there are several branches of critical theory which wouldn't exclude a diversity of ideas at all ; Haberman is in the tradition of critical theory, for instance, and is a key figure behind modern ideas about pluralism. Not looking too carefully at a very complex field can sometimes risk a conspiracy mindset of the "It's all Cultural Marxism ! " variety.
    I am reminded of Wittgenstein's lapidary remark that "What can be said at all can be said clearly."

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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,182
    LadyG said:

    LadyG said:

    Re: coping with Covid, think we are getting a taste of what WWII and other wars were (and in some cases still are) like, when "civilians" are in the firing line, both directly (as in Blitz) and indirectly witnessing the suffering & worse of family, friends, coworkers & entire community.

    What we appear to lack, is any semblance of leadership capable of uniting, inspiring, encouraging, persuading - things that came (as it seems) naturally to Winston S. Churchill and Franklin D. Roosevelt.

    I said the exact same thing in a family Whatsapp group today.

    Finally, I now feel exactly what it must have been like for people going into a global war. This IS that bad. Even if one is personally doing OK, very few of us are more than a couple of connections away from someone seriously ill, or dying, or going bankrupt, or suddenly unemployed, or facing mental health issues, and so on. The universality of the pain is brutal. And winter is coming.
    Think the silver lining of this dark cloud, is that our fore-mothers & -fathers endured worse than us (most of us anyway) are going through, and came out (again mostly) on the other side.

    IF we pull up our socks, maybe WE can do as well - almost, anyway.
    My very aged parents reckon this is the worst global/national crisis and enormity since the 2nd world war, which they both just about recall.

    Which makes it a once in a century thing, pretty much.

    The worst of it is the unpredictability. Major plagues tend to evolve into wars, coups, revolutions, and so forth.

    This is my favourite interview from the early days of Covid.

    Watch to the end.


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quBBlYRlDOs
    There'll be a bloody coup if Johnson thinks he send everyone over 50 into house arrest which seems to being discussed according to S Times.
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    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,879

    Blimey.

    I humbly would suggest speculation on here would be a really bad idea from the legal point of view.

    Indeed, but a story about a scandal engulfing the Government is a handy distraction from BoZo's honours list...

    4D chess.

    OODA loop completely destroyed
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    nichomar said:

    Cyclefree said:

    In ACTUAL national polling:

    23 May, 2019: Conservatives achieve 8.8% under Theresa May

    12 December, 2019: Conservatives achieve 43.6% under Boris Johnson.

    An increase of 34.8%.


    That's the bar.

    Tsk. Comparing a Euro election with a General Election.

    What’s the increase when you compare the 2017 and 2019 General Elections?
    The increase was a net change of 100 seats in the majority. From a minus 20 majority to a majority of 80.
    Only because of the corrupt electoral system in the UK
    Our electoral system is the best in the world and mainstream. Billions of people vote worldwide using our system because it works. There is no electoral system used by more people.
    Are you just making up facts again? Please show your working.
    Presumably India makes a big difference. Add in the US, Canada, etc you must be over 1.5bn hence “billions”
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    LadyGLadyG Posts: 2,221

    Scott_xP said:
    This is just getting increasingly bonkers.

    Sweden. Sweden. Sweden.
    It is. Just let those who must die, die.

    This way we will kill each other with poverty, violence, riots and destruction, which is far worse.

    Let us go to the pub and those who are scared can stay home.
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    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,190

    Cyclefree said:

    Carnyx said:

    algarkirk said:

    Carnyx said:

    ukpaul said:

    Third?

    I posted this on the previous thread, a gov.scot official calculator of your age equivalent to check your covid risk. Worth a look, I think.

    https://bit.ly/3gmCLw1

    I did, thank you very much. Very interesting. (Unfortunately, but at least I can do something about it and am ...).
    For most people the greatest factor by far is age, which is hard to do much about. Age constituted over 98% of my score I am sorry to say.

    Exactly so. But if one is overweight, like me, then that is something to be done.
    Even if I lose weight I remain in the same risk category. I am still trying to do so, mind. But the social distancing from the fridge is not going as well as it should.

    Honestly, there are days when I think my family would be better off were I to die. My children would have an inheritance at least to see them through the next few years. What is the point of a half-life at best staring at sheep, hiding from everyone, with all your interests - artistic, cultural, creative - closed down or too risky and watching your children have their hopes and futures destroyed?

    I suppose Johnson can take some comfort from the fact that things this winter are going to be rotten everywhere in the West.

    His problems will really start if other countries begin to pull out of this.

    Are other countries in Europe closing down restaurants to open schools?
    It's important to remember that this will pass - as so many other similar occurrences have, leaving us unchanged a lot more than perhaps we feel it will at the moment.
    It’ll pass because in the end we all end up dead, some of us sooner than others.
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,017
    Scott_xP said:

    Happy to take a punt with you on the party of the winner of the seat.

    You would have to specify which faction of the SNP you think will get the nod.

    It's impressive that they didn't think Angus could beat Joanna, so they tried a stitch-up. Now they don't think he can beat Marco, so they need to unwind it...
    So that's a no then.

    My flabber remains un-gasted.
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    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,078
    Charles said:

    nichomar said:

    Cyclefree said:

    In ACTUAL national polling:

    23 May, 2019: Conservatives achieve 8.8% under Theresa May

    12 December, 2019: Conservatives achieve 43.6% under Boris Johnson.

    An increase of 34.8%.


    That's the bar.

    Tsk. Comparing a Euro election with a General Election.

    What’s the increase when you compare the 2017 and 2019 General Elections?
    The increase was a net change of 100 seats in the majority. From a minus 20 majority to a majority of 80.
    Only because of the corrupt electoral system in the UK
    Our electoral system is the best in the world and mainstream. Billions of people vote worldwide using our system because it works. There is no electoral system used by more people.
    Are you just making up facts again? Please show your working.
    Presumably India makes a big difference. Add in the US, Canada, etc you must be over 1.5bn hence “billions”
    Whilst that point is technically correct, it's incredibly misleading. Only 1/3rd of countries use FPTP according to Wikipedia.

    "Best in world" is also an opinion, not a fact.
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    I want to know why we STILL don't have a functioning track and trace app. What the hell are they playing at?

    Because it’s not that important. And I don’t believe it works that well anywhere.

    It just sounds sexy and modern which is why politicians and the media talk about it
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,538
    edited August 2020
    LadyG said:

    LadyG said:

    Re: coping with Covid, think we are getting a taste of what WWII and other wars were (and in some cases still are) like, when "civilians" are in the firing line, both directly (as in Blitz) and indirectly witnessing the suffering & worse of family, friends, coworkers & entire community.

    What we appear to lack, is any semblance of leadership capable of uniting, inspiring, encouraging, persuading - things that came (as it seems) naturally to Winston S. Churchill and Franklin D. Roosevelt.

    I said the exact same thing in a family Whatsapp group today.

    Finally, I now feel exactly what it must have been like for people going into a global war. This IS that bad. Even if one is personally doing OK, very few of us are more than a couple of connections away from someone seriously ill, or dying, or going bankrupt, or suddenly unemployed, or facing mental health issues, and so on. The universality of the pain is brutal. And winter is coming.
    Think the silver lining of this dark cloud, is that our fore-mothers & -fathers endured worse than us (most of us anyway) are going through, and came out (again mostly) on the other side.

    IF we pull up our socks, maybe WE can do as well - almost, anyway.
    My very aged parents reckon this is the worst global/national crisis and enormity since the 2nd world war, which they both just about recall.

    Which makes it a once in a century thing, pretty much.

    The worst of it is the unpredictability. Major plagues tend to evolve into wars, coups, revolutions, and so forth.

    This is my favourite interview from the early days of Covid.

    Watch to the end.


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quBBlYRlDOs
    And yet the 1957 and 1968 flu epidemics killed tens of thousands and very few people from the time can remember them. Strange.
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    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,952

    Scott_xP said:
    This is just getting increasingly bonkers.

    Sweden. Sweden. Sweden.
    Am not usually one for being fair to Johnson and his merry band, but this is described as a "war game."
    I for one am happy as many scenarios as possible are being war gamed.
    Beats sloping off for a fortnight's how's your father like before the first wave.
  • Options

    I want to know why we STILL don't have a functioning track and trace app. What the hell are they playing at?

    There was an outbreak of COVID in a Scottish call centre handling track and trace for England.
  • Options
    LadyGLadyG Posts: 2,221
    In context, the idea this is a HUGE STORY is particularly and delightfully absurd.

    Prince Andrew is accused of underage rape, FFS, and yet no one gives a feck (which is sad). The world approaches ruin and war. The revelation an ex-minister did something criminally bad is. shall we say, Somewhat Overshadowed By Events.
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    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,078
    Charles said:

    I want to know why we STILL don't have a functioning track and trace app. What the hell are they playing at?

    Because it’s not that important. And I don’t believe it works that well anywhere.

    It just sounds sexy and modern which is why politicians and the media talk about it
    Oh come off it Charles. It's certainly better than relying on pubs and restaurants to write down names and numbers on little pieces of paper.

    There is literally ready made off-the-shelf options available. The fact we don't have one just shows complete incompetence.
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    TimTTimT Posts: 6,328
    Cyclefree said:

    Before I go, a response to @MattW - see https://twitter.com/mattwardman/status/1289542313312575489?s=21.

    Bilberries are also known as blueberries.

    Partial shade, acid soil ie ericaceous, keep well-watered - especially in summer - but not water-logged and prune to keep the bush in shape. Don’t crowd as they can suffer from mildew if they don’t get air to the plant.

    And don’t forget to pick the fruits before the birds steal them!

    Explains my lack of success - clay soil, full sun, no attention.
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