I mean, people did get worked up about Wetherspoons.
CR and others are simply saying they'll take their business elsewhere which is exactly what people said bout Wetherspoons.
No, they are not just saying that, they are saying they were insulted. I've no idea why.
I think you do. If the managing director of one of your favourite clubs says, in their editorial, that the way you voted was a direct attack on their establishment, and then ended with a insulting limerick, would you feel welcome any more?
I go there to get away from it all, to relax, and I felt this was two giant fingers to me. Of course, you can argue i shouldn't of felt like that, or get upset, but I did and I found the whole tone rude and unnecessary. I think it felt personal because to me it's a very personal place. A sanctuary away from the world.
I can't make it any clearer than that. Some people understand, including some Remainers - like Nick Palmer and viewcode - who've been very kind about it. Others have taken the piss or hurled 'serves you right' lines back. But I think I've been very clear about why.
Seriously, you've an opinion - that's it. Stop arguing. We aren't interested, no one is changing their view. Your point has been made.
And I'm not interested in much of what you post, which often has little or no relation to the subject of the thread. But you post what you like.
I will do the same, thank you.
I think my post was buggered by Vanilla - I've just seen how it's played out.
Ignore the entire thing as it ended up pointed at you - I've no idea how we ended up here.
Using the BAU CSI model - it wasn't intentional.
My apologies, Plato. And sorry for my slightly caustic response.
I rarely FPT myself - but frankly, I've had a total skinful of liberal men on PB and elsewhere handwaving waving the cultural behaviour that's been imported by no knowledge nitwits, virtue signalling to stroke their own egos. You'd never accept this impinging on your daily lives. Ever. Oh, and have a burkah - black or maybe sky blue.
TBH, my entire experience of Morocco was hmm bar buying a nice camel leather handbag.
I'm a tough bird, and the misogyny/grabby behaviour was appalling. My handful of female fellow Landies were left so intimidated that they gave me shopping lists as they couldn't cope with the local men.
I was leered at/asked for sex/grabbed walking down the street for merely being white. I was covered head to foot and followed everywhere by creepy men/my chest commented on/assumed to be a prostitute.
I was on rural Morocco/Algerian border - any liberal inclined man in the UK has NO IDEA about the behaviour of men in these areas and what Europe has invited in. I was one of a party of 12 Land Rover/Toyota drivers who were exploring a new Paris/Dhaka rally parallel route. We spent 3 weeks driving 14hrs a day across the Sahara/establishing rest points/mechanics on the way - so no shrinking violets.
One of our convoy caught fire and they ended up in my Toyota as I was solo. We seriously considered pushing their broke Landy over the edge of a cliff in the Atlas mountains, as getting her down seemed impossible/insurance was easier. After much discussion, we decided to take her back down thousands of feet by roping her between mine and another.
This isn't tourist stuff - it's alternative life - anyone with a spec of knowledge of this culture has held up their hands and said WTF?
I am sure that it was just locker room behaviour, nothing wrong with a little pussy grabbing is there?
Dr Fox, you let yourself down a bit there old fella
Golly, what a very stupid comment from @foxinsoxuk
Still, I guess being a guy he knows all about being female.
This isn't the first time I've cited my experience here. How inconvenient to his trite political position, rather than actually make an argument.
I look forward to light, and logical positioning.
You seem to have missed Foxinsoxuk's irony. There is a bit of hypocrisy here.
And why would we agree to this? If they want to live under EU law, move to the EU.
Paywalled, but it looks from what I can read as though it's the catch in UK citizens' obtaining individual EU citizenship. UK/EU citizens would of course be under EU law in the UK.
Justin was right, the 16 point lead in the last ICM was clearly a rogue. Extrapolating from this Jezza will have closed the gap by the end of March, drawing to a 20-20 tie. UKIP will be on 28% by then but under FPTP they are no threat to Labour.
The Tory graph could look like this over the next few years if Brexit goes sour. The Labour one won't. There will be a big vacuum in the soft centre for the Lib Dems to exploit.
Not really, the one thing I've learned in my time is that the Tories will always adapt and do whatever it takes to win. Now that the centre ground has moved to the right, the Tories have a more right wing leader. If it moves back to the centre then I expect people like Kwasi Kwarteng will get a good look.
Always? Sometimes it takes them a very, very long time to adjust. Following the period shown in that graph they chose Hague and then IDS to be leader.
If, in my thesis, today is 1992 for the Conservatives, it could be 2030 before they get back on track after it goes south.
A better parallel might be 1992 *before* the general election. Yes, the Tories screwed up mightily over the economy and the Poll Tax, and were divided on Europe, but they still won because the alternative was unelectable (indeed, Corbyn is a good deal less electable than Kinnock was).
If Brexit does turn bad, the Conservatives will still win but the public will hold the grudge for a time when they can make use of it.
Not sure what your problem is understanding this, flower.
My problem understanding it is very simple: some normally sensible people seem to be reacting in an utterly ludicrous way, seeing 'personal insults' where there aren't any. It is, by any objective standard, astonishing, especially given that they were on the winning side, so they haven't even got the excuse that they were cheated of victory.
Are people who voted Remain supposed to get all het up about comments made by Tim Martin or Peter Hargreaves?
Err. The manager of a business that I have supported personalised it; he chose to portray a vote that he personally disagreed with as a "direct attack" on his business, and to reach out and tell his customers so.
I am simply complaining to the business about his behaviour. I see no problem with that.
But suddenly we have a parade of remainers flapping away about "safe spaces". Bizarre :-D .
Did Tim Martin or Peter Hargreaves accuse their customers of "attacking their businesses" by voting the wrong way? I suspect that they are both too grownup.
How on earth is that personalising it? He's simply telling you the impact on the business which he sees as entirely negative.
You don't like hearing that. Tough shit. Grow up.
Stop digging, Alistair. You'll end up in Australia.
The chappie said "a vote to leave the EU was a direct attack on Ronnie Scott’s". That is personalising.
Then he said the increased fees he would have to pay to Americans would damage his business, which is pure humbug. He turns over £10m and pays nearly 100 service staff. The Living Wage will have a far greater impact than a marginal change in the fees of a relatively small portion of his artistes.
Anyway, the Brexit fall in the £ has put it where a lot of them were demanding they wanted it, and there has been a tourist boom = more customer for RS. Perhaps he should sell some tickets in dollars.
And why would we agree to this? If they want to live under EU law, move to the EU.
Paywalled, but it looks from what I can read as though it's the catch in UK citizens' obtaining individual EU citizenship. UK/EU citizens would of course be under EU law in the UK.
It's called ultramontanism and has been the bane of English/British and European relationships since the 1500s.
(And yes, for pedants among you, I know that the term "ultramontanism" wasn't coined until the 19th century...)
Not sure what your problem is understanding this, flower.
My problem understanding it is very simple: some normally sensible people seem to be reacting in an utterly ludicrous way, seeing 'personal insults' where there aren't any. It is, by any objective standard, astonishing, especially given that they were on the winning side, so they haven't even got the excuse that they were cheated of victory.
Are people who voted Remain supposed to get all het up about comments made by Tim Martin or Peter Hargreaves?
Err. The manager of a business that I have supported personalised it; he chose to portray a vote that he personally disagreed with as a "direct attack" on his business, and to reach out and tell his customers so.
I am simply complaining to the business about his behaviour. I see no problem with that.
But suddenly we have a parade of remainers flapping away about "safe spaces". Bizarre :-D .
Did Tim Martin or Peter Hargreaves accuse their customers of "attacking their businesses" by voting the wrong way? I suspect that they are both too grownup.
How on earth is that personalising it? He's simply telling you the impact on the business which he sees as entirely negative.
You don't like hearing that. Tough shit. Grow up.
Stop digging, Alistair. You'll end up in Australia.
The chappie said "a vote to leave the EU was a direct attack on Ronnie Scott’s". That is personalising.
Then he said the increased fees he would have to pay to Americans would damage his business, which is pure humbug. He turns over £10m and pays nearly 100 service staff. The Living Wage will have a far greater impact than a marginal change in the fees of a relatively small portion of his artistes.
Anyway, the Brexit fall in the £ has put it where a lot of them were demanding they wanted it, and there has been a tourist boom = more customer for RS. Perhaps he should sell some tickets in dollars.
Enough of this, however.
Oh what rot. It's astonishing what fragile flowers so many Leavers are, incapable of accepting that others may have a different view of the world and that they are entitled to express it.
Instead of trying to silence them, try listening to them. You might learn something (though in many cases I suspect that's beyond Leavers because they're stuck on transmit rather than receive mode).
And why would we agree to this? If they want to live under EU law, move to the EU.
Paywalled, but it looks from what I can read as though it's the catch in UK citizens' obtaining individual EU citizenship. UK/EU citizens would of course be under EU law in the UK.
It would be win/win for the EU to have both. Not sure that they fully understand the concept of negotiation if it is the catch.
Mr. Price, indeed. UKIP and the Lib Dems, if the former hold, could become a weird sort of yin/yang, mutually beneficial yet utterly opposed, acting as tug of war teams with Labour playing the part of the rope.
Dr. Foxinsox, there's a difference between words and action, and I'm not sure mocking someone for raising grope as a cultural issue is justified.
Not just words though was it? Leering at your female employees when they're naked, hands like an octopus...
I mean, people did get worked up about Wetherspoons.
CR and others are simply saying they'll take their business elsewhere which is exactly what people said bout Wetherspoons.
No, they are not just saying that, they are saying they were insulted. I've no idea why.
I think you do. If the managing director of one of your favourite clubs says, in their editorial, that the way you voted was a direct attack on their establishment, and then ended with a insulting limerick, would you feel welcome any more?
I go there to get away from it all, to relax, and I felt this was two giant fingers to me. Of course, you can argue i shouldn't of felt like that, or get upset, but I did and I found the whole tone rude and unnecessary. I think it felt personal because to me it's a very personal place. A sanctuary away from the world.
I can't make it any clearer than that. Some people understand, including some Remainers - like Nick Palmer and viewcode - who've been very kind about it. Others have taken the piss or hurled 'serves you right' lines back. But I think I've been very clear about why.
Seriously, you've an opinion - that's it. Stop arguing. We aren't interested, no one is changing their view. Your point has been made.
And I'm not interested in much of what you post, which often has little or no relation to the subject of the thread. But you post what you like.
I will do the same, thank you.
I wonder if some of these responses are getting a bit muddled or did i step through the looking glass
@MSmithsonPB: New Ipsos poll finds there has been a drop among Britons saying things are going in the right direction - now 37%, down from 44% in Sept
As becomes apparent if you look at the report, all this does is place the UK in mid-table, right on average in terms of global pessimism amongst the variety of countries surveyed - not as gloomy as Germany or the US, and much less so than Italy or France.
And why would we agree to this? If they want to live under EU law, move to the EU.
Paywalled, but it looks from what I can read as though it's the catch in UK citizens' obtaining individual EU citizenship. UK/EU citizens would of course be under EU law in the UK.
It's called ultramontanism and has been the bane of English/British and European relationships since the 1500s.
(And yes, for pedants among you, I know that the term "ultramontanism" wasn't coined until the 19th century...)
Ultramontanism - The Canadian Encyclopedia www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/ultramontanism/ 11 Jun 2015 - Ultramontanism in Canada, as in Europe where it began during the French Revolution, was the theory of those who rejected any compromise ... by CATHOLICISM with modern thought, and demanded the supremacy of religious over civil society.
So the EU will not be content with becoming a state like other states; they have their sights set on jurisdiction over people in other sovereign states.
What price someone with US/EU double citizenship? I can see EU authority going down well in the US.
And why would we agree to this? If they want to live under EU law, move to the EU.
Paywalled, but it looks from what I can read as though it's the catch in UK citizens' obtaining individual EU citizenship. UK/EU citizens would of course be under EU law in the UK.
It would be win/win for the EU to have both. Not sure that they fully understand the concept of negotiation if it is the catch.
Oh, they do. They probably believe that the UK people don't. And if I may say so, with good reason.
And why would we agree to this? If they want to live under EU law, move to the EU.
Paywalled, but it looks from what I can read as though it's the catch in UK citizens' obtaining individual EU citizenship. UK/EU citizens would of course be under EU law in the UK.
It would be win/win for the EU to have both. Not sure that they fully understand the concept of negotiation if it is the catch.
I believe the EU are trying to 'have their cake and eat it'. I can't imagine where they got that idea from.
A bit unusual for YouGov to be showing a bigger Tory lead than ICM - though the fieldwork for the latter is a week later.The ICM figures imply a Tory majority of 74 with Labour just managing to stay above 200 seats.
A bit unusual for YouGov to be showing a bigger Tory lead than ICM - though the fieldwork for the latter is a week later.The ICM figures imply a Tory majority of 74 with Labour just managing to stay above 200 seats.
I'm not sure at this point in the parliament we have to worry about a couple of points either way.
Depends what arrangements (particularly if they are bilateral - i.e. we retains some market access temporarily). It is quite obvious for example we won't be starting the mass deportations immediately!
And why would we agree to this? If they want to live under EU law, move to the EU.
Paywalled, but it looks from what I can read as though it's the catch in UK citizens' obtaining individual EU citizenship. UK/EU citizens would of course be under EU law in the UK.
It's called ultramontanism and has been the bane of English/British and European relationships since the 1500s.
(And yes, for pedants among you, I know that the term "ultramontanism" wasn't coined until the 19th century...)
Ultramontanism - The Canadian Encyclopedia www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/ultramontanism/ 11 Jun 2015 - Ultramontanism in Canada, as in Europe where it began during the French Revolution, was the theory of those who rejected any compromise ... by CATHOLICISM with modern thought, and demanded the supremacy of religious over civil society.
So the EU will not be content with becoming a state like other states; they have their sights set on jurisdiction over people in other sovereign states.
What price someone with US/EU double citizenship? I can see EU authority going down well in the US.
The original reference is to the Alps - Frenchmen recognising the authority of those "over the mountains"
Mr. Charles, Alonso at Mercedes would be entertaining. But not profitable (immediately, at least).
Fiction writing, for the moment. I may seek to expand that to grunt-work (news writing) or add something else in the near future. The money situation is not splendid.
Mr. Charles, Alonso at Mercedes would be entertaining. But not profitable (immediately, at least).
Fiction writing, for the moment. I may seek to expand that to grunt-work (news writing) or add something else in the near future. The money situation is not splendid.
I didn't mean to pry... I was wondering if you would spontaneously combust or something on losing a bet
OT Someone mentioned Netflix show Designated Survivor - FFS it's awful. I've watched 8 shows as filler/fall asleep to = and it's beyond terrible cliche crap nonsense cast rubbish. The ensemble supposedly covering the script is hilariously poor.
Netflix watchers wasting their time on that should do Shooter instead - it's much more credible and smart viewing.
A bit unusual for YouGov to be showing a bigger Tory lead than ICM - though the fieldwork for the latter is a week later.The ICM figures imply a Tory majority of 74 with Labour just managing to stay above 200 seats.
I'm not sure at this point in the parliament we have to worry about a couple of points either way.
Well - we have now reached the 32% mark of this Parliament!
Mr. Saddened, yes but how then can we differentiate between those who think things aren't going right because it's complicated, and those who think things aren't going right because they're sick of all the faffing about?
A bit unusual for YouGov to be showing a bigger Tory lead than ICM - though the fieldwork for the latter is a week later.The ICM figures imply a Tory majority of 74 with Labour just managing to stay above 200 seats.
I'm not sure at this point in the parliament we have to worry about a couple of points either way.
Well - we have now reached the 32% mark of this Parliament!
All we need to know is that going from Milliband to Corbyn is like going from Kinnock to Foot.
A bit unusual for YouGov to be showing a bigger Tory lead than ICM - though the fieldwork for the latter is a week later.The ICM figures imply a Tory majority of 74 with Labour just managing to stay above 200 seats.
I'm not sure at this point in the parliament we have to worry about a couple of points either way.
Well - we have now reached the 32% mark of this Parliament!
All we need to know is that going from Milliband to Corbyn is like going from Kinnock to Foot.
Notice Watson, Bryant, Miliband et al having a meltdown in HOC re 21st Century Fox bid for Sky and the possibilty Murdoch may have influence on Sky and Sky news
A bit unusual for YouGov to be showing a bigger Tory lead than ICM - though the fieldwork for the latter is a week later.The ICM figures imply a Tory majority of 74 with Labour just managing to stay above 200 seats.
I'm not sure at this point in the parliament we have to worry about a couple of points either way.
Well - we have now reached the 32% mark of this Parliament!
All we need to know is that going from Milliband to Corbyn is like going from Kinnock to Foot.
Jeremy Corbyn is going to make Ed Miliband look like Tony Blair
I'm probably going to regret posting this, but here goes..
It's Christmas. The season of goodwill. A time to put away the troubles of the year and come together as families, friends and communities. To celebrate the relationships we share, the warmth of the human spirit, to show generosity to one other, relax and have fun.
Yet this Christmas, all I've seen and heard is: Brexit, referendum, Brexit, referendum, Brexit, Brexit.. I've had arguments at catch-ups with close friends, it's created tensions within my family, and cordial relationships I've previously had with some of my peers at work have either loosened, or been soured. I totally underestimated how divisive this referendum would be. I thought after the vote, we'd all largely move on, and come together, but it hasn't been like that. Not at all. In fact, in many respects, it's got worse. The debate, such as it is, is relentless, and there is no end to it. It is often tense, it can be unpleasant, and, not on occasion, it can get nasty.
Have I contributed to this?
Yes, I have - absolutely. And I'm not proud of that. Not at all. I've been prickly, quick to judge and slow to listen. And I'm ashamed of that - if I could turn the clock back, and change my behaviour over the last six months, I would.
I'm not saying this to make a "Remain" or "Leave" point on either side. Yes, I want to Leave. Others equally want - just as strongly - to Remain. We all have strong views. The referendum split the country in half, and it is still splitting the country in half. But, honestly, can't we find it in ourselves to give all of us a bit of a break over the next couple of weeks? To rediscover what else we liked about each other, once?
To be honest, I'm tired of it all. Part of me just wants a break. I know some may think I don't deserve one, but I know none of us are really bad people at heart. We are all Britons, and we all want the best for the country.
I will - from now on - do my level best to try and stick to this, at the very least until the New Year. Because there's more to life than just our membership of the EU, and I don't want it to define my personal, or online, relationships for the rest of my life.
Not my best post. Not very coherent. But that's how I feel.
I mean, people did get worked up about Wetherspoons.
CR and others are simply saying they'll take their business elsewhere which is exactly what people said bout Wetherspoons.
No, they are not just saying that, they are saying they were insulted. I've no idea why.
I think you do. If the managing director of one of your favourite clubs says, in their editorial, that the way you voted was a direct attack on their establishment, and then ended with a insulting limerick, would you feel welcome any more?
I go there to get away from it all, to relax, and I felt this was two giant fingers to me. Of course, you can argue i shouldn't of felt like that, or get upset, but I did and I found the whole tone rude and unnecessary. I think it felt personal because to me it's a very personal place. A sanctuary away from the world.
I can't make it any clearer than that. Some people understand, including some Remainers - like Nick Palmer and viewcode - who've been very kind about it. Others have taken the piss or hurled 'serves you right' lines back. But I think I've been very clear about why.
Seriously, you've an opinion - that's it. Stop arguing. We aren't interested, no one is changing their view. Your point has been made.
And I'm not interested in much of what you post, which often has little or no relation to the subject of the thread. But you post what you like.
I will do the same, thank you.
I wonder if some of these responses are getting a bit muddled or did i step through the looking glass
A blue on blue handbagging.
All in all a wonderfully revealing exchange - i begin to see why Ken Clarke likes jazz.
Notice Watson, Bryant, Miliband et al having a meltdown in HOC re 21st Century Fox bid for Sky and the possibilty Murdoch may have influence on Sky and Sky news
It takes a truly stupendous salesman to sell a message that is as poor as Corbyn's.
I doubt that David Prescott has anywhere near the skills required to make an extra ten to twenty percent of the population swing over to a Corbynista-led Labour.
His experience seems awfully safe for the son of a prominent Labour politician. The BBC, followed by a communications company? I fear he has the same problem that Corbyn suffers from: he has little real idea of the lives of the people he claims to want to help.
I suppose everybody over the age of about 50 has real-life experience of what Mr Corbyn stands for, witness his standing in opinion polls.
It's a tremendously hard ask to sell an old & rejected product to the people who knew it only too well & rejected it decades ago. I doubt whether even a 'New Improved, Recipe' approach would work.
What was that car with the square-ish steering wheel? Austin Allegro? Not highly regarded at the time, imagine trying to push that now as the newest, most up-to-date thing on wheels.
My biggest issue with Corbyn's Labour isn't their ideology: it's the fact they're not opposing. The government are getting a pretty free ride.
As it happens that's probably for the best: the last thing we need is a Major-style chaotic government in charge during Brexit. But there are many non-Brexit matters where the government needs stronger opposition.
Whilst my mind's firmly set against Corbyn, I still don't know what to make of May. I'd been hoping that the conference would make things clearer, but it didn't. This leads to perhaps the most important political question at the moment:
Is May a leader? Is she directing our side of Brexit as a leader should, or is she a leaf blowing in the Three Brexiteers' wind?
I fear we will not discover for some time.
I mostly agree with most of this, but I suspect that what we'll end up doing is muddling through followed up by making the best of a bad job and then being surprised that things have turned out as well as they do, for everybody on all sides.
After that, of course, everyone will start to say how that successful outcome was always inevitable.
Mr. Royale, though (being a recluse who lives in a cave on a small island in the North Sea) it's not soured any relationships for me, it has been quite bitter.
This won't cheer you up, but things may well get worse. The EU seeking to have UK citizens opt out of UK law and into EU law will not win them many friends beyond EU-philes.
That said, I do agree with your sentiment and hope that, once things get under way, the country can accept the situation and move on.
Miss Plato, I'm also cool, although that's due to poor circulation and having an abnormally low body temperature.
Notice Watson, Bryant, Miliband et al having a meltdown in HOC re 21st Century Fox bid for Sky and the possibilty Murdoch may have influence on Sky and Sky news
It's beyond silly. They're freaking out because they think the only conservative cable news outlet that challenges them is being slightly more influential. And that's wrong.
The fear of the 96% who donated to Hillary vs a mere cable news channel is weird.
Why are they so scared and over-reacting like this? Who doesn't think it's peculiar?
I'm probably going to regret posting this, but here goes..
It's Christmas. The season of goodwill. A time to put away the troubles of the year and come together as families, friends and communities. To celebrate the relationships we share, the warmth of the human spirit, to show generosity to one other, relax and have fun.
Yet this Christmas, all I've seen and heard is: Brexit, referendum, Brexit, referendum, Brexit, Brexit.. I've had arguments at catch-ups with close friends, it's created tensions within my family, and cordial relationships I've previously had with some of my peers at work have either loosened, or been soured. I totally underestimated how divisive this referendum would be. I thought after the vote, we'd all largely move on, and come together, but it hasn't been like that. Not at all. In fact, in many respects, it's got worse. The debate, such as it is, is relentless, and there is no end to it. It is often tense, it can be unpleasant, and, not on occasion, it can get nasty.
Have I contributed to this?
Yes, I have - absolutely. And I'm not proud of that. Not at all. I've been prickly, quick to judge and slow to listen. And I'm ashamed of that - if I could turn the clock back, and change my behaviour over the last six months, I would.
I'm not saying this to make a "Remain" or "Leave" point on either side. Yes, I want to Leave. Others equally want - just as strongly - to Remain. We all have strong views. The referendum split the country in half, and it is still splitting the country in half. But, honestly, can't we find it in ourselves to give all of us a bit of a break over the next couple of weeks? To rediscover what else we liked about each other, once?
To be honest, I'm tired of it all. Part of me just wants a break. I know some may think I don't deserve one, but I know none of us are really bad people at heart. We are all Britons, and we all want the best for the country.
I will - from now on - do my level best to try and stick to this, at the very least until the New Year. Because there's more to life than just our membership of the EU, and I don't want it to define my personal, or online, relationships for the rest of my life.
Not my best post. Not very coherent. But that's how I feel.
A good post.
I suspect the difference between this referendum and most of the GEs of the past 20 years is that it results in a real change of direction for the whole country and has the potential to create a lot of losers.
That nothing has happened yet, only allows people's uncertainty and worry to simmer.
Also, regretfully there has been no leadership shown in trying to reunite the country. No effort to bring people together to build a better future. Simply banal generalities.
And why would we agree to this? If they want to live under EU law, move to the EU.
Paywalled, but it looks from what I can read as though it's the catch in UK citizens' obtaining individual EU citizenship. UK/EU citizens would of course be under EU law in the UK.
It's called ultramontanism and has been the bane of English/British and European relationships since the 1500s.
(And yes, for pedants among you, I know that the term "ultramontanism" wasn't coined until the 19th century...)
Ultramontanism - The Canadian Encyclopedia www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/ultramontanism/ 11 Jun 2015 - Ultramontanism in Canada, as in Europe where it began during the French Revolution, was the theory of those who rejected any compromise ... by CATHOLICISM with modern thought, and demanded the supremacy of religious over civil society.
So the EU will not be content with becoming a state like other states; they have their sights set on jurisdiction over people in other sovereign states.
What price someone with US/EU double citizenship? I can see EU authority going down well in the US.
The original reference is to the Alps - Frenchmen recognising the authority of those "over the mountains"
Mr. Charles, Alonso at Mercedes would be entertaining. But not profitable (immediately, at least).
Fiction writing, for the moment. I may seek to expand that to grunt-work (news writing) or add something else in the near future. The money situation is not splendid.
Jenson would be seriously annoyed. You try and resign, then instead sign up for a PR role with added backup driver status (not expecting it to go anywhere) then Alonso leaves and you end up back at Mclaren .
I'm probably going to regret posting this, but here goes..
It's Christmas. The season of goodwill. A time to put away the troubles of the year and come together as families, friends and communities. To celebrate the relationships we share, the warmth of the human spirit, to show generosity to one other, relax and have fun.
Yet this Christmas, all I've seen and heard is: Brexit, referendum, Brexit, referendum, Brexit, Brexit.. I've had arguments at catch-ups with close friends, it's created tensions within my family, and cordial relationships I've previously had with some of my peers at work have either loosened, or been soured. I totally underestimated how divisive this referendum would be. I thought after the vote, we'd all largely move on, and come together, but it hasn't been like that. Not at all. In fact, in many respects, it's got worse. The debate, such as it is, is relentless, and there is no end to it. It is often tense, it can be unpleasant, and, not on occasion, it can get nasty.
Have I contributed to this?
Yes, I have - absolutely. And I'm not proud of that. Not at all. I've been prickly, quick to judge and slow to listen. And I'm ashamed of that - if I could turn the clock back, and change my behaviour over the last six months, I would.
I'm not saying this to make a "Remain" or "Leave" point on either side. Yes, I want to Leave. Others equally want - just as strongly - to Remain. We all have strong views. The referendum split the country in half, and it is still splitting the country in half. But, honestly, can't we find it in ourselves to give all of us a bit of a break over the next couple of weeks? To rediscover what else we liked about each other, once?
To be honest, I'm tired of it all. Part of me just wants a break. I know some may think I don't deserve one, but I know none of us are really bad people at heart. We are all Britons, and we all want the best for the country.
I will - from now on - do my level best to try and stick to this, at the very least until the New Year. Because there's more to life than just our membership of the EU, and I don't want it to define my personal, or online, relationships for the rest of my life.
Not my best post. Not very coherent. But that's how I feel.
I'd post a cat video, but that'd get me banned - some subjects annoy us beyond sense.
Also, regretfully there has been no leadership shown in trying to reunite the country. No effort to bring people together to build a better future. Simply banal generalities.
I admit I am surprised by that. Theresa May did, as far as we know, vote Remain. You would think she would have some empathy for those that supposedly voted the same way as she did. Maybe with a 14% lead over Labour, she doesn't bother with them.
I'm probably going to regret posting this, but here goes..
It's Christmas. The season of goodwill. A time to put away the troubles of the year and come together as families, friends and communities. To celebrate the relationships we share, the warmth of the human spirit, to show generosity to one other, relax and have fun.
Yet this Christmas, all I've seen and heard is: Brexit, referendum, Brexit, referendum, Brexit, Brexit.. I've had arguments at catch-ups with close friends, it's created tensions within my family, and cordial relationships I've previously had with some of my peers at work have either loosened, or been soured. I totally underestimated how divisive this referendum would be. I thought after the vote, we'd all largely move on, and come together, but it hasn't been like that. Not at all. In fact, in many respects, it's got worse. The debate, such as it is, is relentless, and there is no end to it. It is often tense, it can be unpleasant, and, not on occasion, it can get nasty.
Have I contributed to this?
Yes, I have - absolutely. And I'm not proud of that. Not at all. I've been prickly, quick to judge and slow to listen. And I'm ashamed of that - if I could turn the clock back, and change my behaviour over the last six months, I would.
I'm not saying this to make a "Remain" or "Leave" point on either side. Yes, I want to Leave. Others equally want - just as strongly - to Remain. We all have strong views. The referendum split the country in half, and it is still splitting the country in half. But, honestly, can't we find it in ourselves to give all of us a bit of a break over the next couple of weeks? To rediscover what else we liked about each other, once?
To be honest, I'm tired of it all. Part of me just wants a break. I know some may think I don't deserve one, but I know none of us are really bad people at heart. We are all Britons, and we all want the best for the country.
I will - from now on - do my level best to try and stick to this, at the very least until the New Year. Because there's more to life than just our membership of the EU, and I don't want it to define my personal, or online, relationships for the rest of my life.
Not my best post. Not very coherent. But that's how I feel.
Excellent post. The level of vitriol really is reaching ridiculous and frankly dangerous levels. The BBC could help by giving QT a nice xmas break of say three months and see if everyone calms down a bit.
We certainly need Xmas as a rest, as it looks like 2017 will be another roller-coaster with Italy and France.
Also, regretfully there has been no leadership shown in trying to reunite the country. No effort to bring people together to build a better future. Simply banal generalities.
I admit I am surprised by that. Theresa May did, as far as we know, vote Remain. You would think she would have some empathy for those that supposedly voted the same way as she did. Maybe with a 14% lead over Labour, she doesn't bother with them.
It's been said several times on here that Mrs May isn't a people-person. (No idea how true or false it is, but it has been said.)
I'm probably going to regret posting this, but here goes..
It's Christmas. The season of goodwill. A time to put away the troubles of the year and come together as families, friends and communities. To celebrate the relationships we share, the warmth of the human spirit, to show generosity to one other, relax and have fun.
Yet this Christmas, all I've seen and heard is: Brexit, referendum, Brexit, referendum, Brexit, Brexit.. I've had arguments at catch-ups with close friends, it's created tensions within my family, and cordial relationships I've previously had with some of my peers at work have either loosened, or been soured. I totally underestimated how divisive this referendum would be. I thought after the vote, we'd all largely move on, and come together, but it hasn't been like that. Not at all. In fact, in many respects, it's got worse. The debate, such as it is, is relentless, and there is no end to it. It is often tense, it can be unpleasant, and, not on occasion, it can get nasty.
Have I contributed to this?
Yes, I have - absolutely. And I'm not proud of that. Not at all. I've been prickly, quick to judge and slow to listen. And I'm ashamed of that - if I could turn the clock back, and change my behaviour over the last six months, I would.
I'm not saying this to make a "Remain" or "Leave" point on either side. Yes, I want to Leave. Others equally want - just as strongly - to Remain. We all have strong views. The referendum split the country in half, and it is still splitting the country in half. But, honestly, can't we find it in ourselves to give all of us a bit of a break over the next couple of weeks? To rediscover what else we liked about each other, once?
To be honest, I'm tired of it all. Part of me just wants a break. I know some may think I don't deserve one, but I know none of us are really bad people at heart. We are all Britons, and we all want the best for the country.
I will - from now on - do my level best to try and stick to this, at the very least until the New Year. Because there's more to life than just our membership of the EU, and I don't want it to define my personal, or online, relationships for the rest of my life.
Not my best post. Not very coherent. But that's how I feel.
Justin was right, the 16 point lead in the last ICM was clearly a rogue. Extrapolating from this Jezza will have closed the gap by the end of March, drawing to a 20-20 tie. UKIP will be on 28% by then but under FPTP they are no threat to Labour.
The Tory graph could look like this over the next few years if Brexit goes sour. The Labour one won't. There will be a big vacuum in the soft centre for the Lib Dems to exploit.
Not really, the one thing I've learned in my time is that the Tories will always adapt and do whatever it takes to win. Now that the centre ground has moved to the right, the Tories have a more right wing leader. If it moves back to the centre then I expect people like Kwasi Kwarteng will get a good look.
Always? Sometimes it takes them a very, very long time to adjust. Following the period shown in that graph they chose Hague and then IDS to be leader.
If, in my thesis, today is 1992 for the Conservatives, it could be 2030 before they get back on track after it goes south.
A better parallel might be 1992 *before* the general election. Yes, the Tories screwed up mightily over the economy and the Poll Tax, and were divided on Europe, but they still won because the alternative was unelectable (indeed, Corbyn is a good deal less electable than Kinnock was).
If Brexit does turn bad, the Conservatives will still win but the public will hold the grudge for a time when they can make use of it.
But that only holds true if Corbyn stays in place!
There is much that I could say in response to @Casino_Royale's post (and some of the points that it sheds a sidelight on go to the heart of much of British politics today), but it has clearly been composed with the best of intentions so for now I will simply wish him a Merry Christmas.
I'm probably going to regret posting this, but here goes..
It's Christmas. The season of goodwill. A time to put away the troubles of the year and come together as families, friends and communities. To celebrate the relationships we share, the warmth of the human spirit, to show generosity to one other, relax and have fun.
Yet this Christmas, all I've seen and heard is: Brexit, referendum, Brexit, referendum, Brexit, Brexit.. I've had arguments at catch-ups with close friends, it's created tensions within my family, and cordial relationships I've previously had with some of my peers at work have either loosened, or been soured. I totally underestimated how divisive this referendum would be. I thought after the vote, we'd all largely move on, and come together, but it hasn't been like that. Not at all. In fact, in many respects, it's got worse. The debate, such as it is, is relentless, and there is no end to it. It is often tense, it can be unpleasant, and, not on occasion, it can get nasty.
Have I contributed to this?
Yes, I have - absolutely. And I'm not proud of that. Not at all. I've been prickly, quick to judge and slow to listen. And I'm ashamed of that - if I could turn the clock back, and change my behaviour over the last six months, I would.
I'm not saying this to make a "Remain" or "Leave" point on either side. Yes, I want to Leave. Others equally want - just as strongly - to Remain. We all have strong views. The referendum split the country in half, and it is still splitting the country in half. But, honestly, can't we find it in ourselves to give all of us a bit of a break over the next couple of weeks? To rediscover what else we liked about each other, once?
To be honest, I'm tired of it all. Part of me just wants a break. I know some may think I don't deserve one, but I know none of us are really bad people at heart. We are all Britons, and we all want the best for the country.
I will - from now on - do my level best to try and stick to this, at the very least until the New Year. Because there's more to life than just our membership of the EU, and I don't want it to define my personal, or online, relationships for the rest of my life.
Not my best post. Not very coherent. But that's how I feel.
I'm probably going to regret posting this, but here goes..
It's Christmas. The season of goodwill. A time to put away the troubles of the year and come together as families, friends and communities. To celebrate the relationships we share, the warmth of the human spirit, to show generosity to one other, relax and have fun.
Yet this Christmas, all I've seen and heard is: Brexit, referendum, Brexit, referendum, Brexit, Brexit.. I've had arguments at catch-ups with close friends, it's created tensions within my family, and cordial relationships I've previously had with some of my peers at work have either loosened, or been soured. I totally underestimated how divisive this referendum would be. I thought after the vote, we'd all largely move on, and come together, but it hasn't been like that. Not at all. In fact, in many respects, it's got worse. The debate, such as it is, is relentless, and there is no end to it. It is often tense, it can be unpleasant, and, not on occasion, it can get nasty.
Have I contributed to this?
Yes, I have - absolutely. And I'm not proud of that. Not at all. I've been prickly, quick to judge and slow to listen. And I'm ashamed of that - if I could turn the clock back, and change my behaviour over the last six months, I would.
I'm not saying this to make a "Remain" or "Leave" point on either side. Yes, I want to Leave. Others equally want - just as strongly - to Remain. We all have strong views. The referendum split the country in half, and it is still splitting the country in half. But, honestly, can't we find it in ourselves to give all of us a bit of a break over the next couple of weeks? To rediscover what else we liked about each other, once?
To be honest, I'm tired of it all. Part of me just wants a break. I know some may think I don't deserve one, but I know none of us are really bad people at heart. We are all Britons, and we all want the best for the country.
I will - from now on - do my level best to try and stick to this, at the very least until the New Year. Because there's more to life than just our membership of the EU, and I don't want it to define my personal, or online, relationships for the rest of my life.
Not my best post. Not very coherent. But that's how I feel.
Can you imagine what it has been like in Scotland for the past four years? Referendums are always divisive. They are black and white, take it or leave it, pig in a poke, zero sum affairs. There is never a maybe, an upto a point, a bit of both.
I'm probably going to regret posting this, but here goes..
It's Christmas. The season of goodwill. A time to put away the troubles of the year and come together as families, friends and communities. To celebrate the relationships we share, the warmth of the human spirit, to show generosity to one other, relax and have fun.
Yet this Christmas, all I've seen and heard is: Brexit, referendum, Brexit, referendum, Brexit, Brexit.. I've had arguments at catch-ups with close friends, it's created tensions within my family, and cordial relationships I've previously had with some of my peers at work have either loosened, or been soured. I totally underestimated how divisive this referendum would be. I thought after the vote, we'd all largely move on, and come together, but it hasn't been like that. Not at all. In fact, in many respects, it's got worse. The debate, such as it is, is relentless, and there is no end to it. It is often tense, it can be unpleasant, and, not on occasion, it can get nasty.
Have I contributed to this?
Yes, I have - absolutely. And I'm not proud of that. Not at all. I've been prickly, quick to judge and slow to listen. And I'm ashamed of that - if I could turn the clock back, and change my behaviour over the last six months, I would.
I'm not saying this to make a "Remain" or "Leave" point on either side. Yes, I want to Leave. Others equally want - just as strongly - to Remain. We all have strong views. The referendum split the country in half, and it is still splitting the country in half. But, honestly, can't we find it in ourselves to give all of us a bit of a break over the next couple of weeks? To rediscover what else we liked about each other, once?
To be honest, I'm tired of it all. Part of me just wants a break. I know some may think I don't deserve one, but I know none of us are really bad people at heart. We are all Britons, and we all want the best for the country.
I will - from now on - do my level best to try and stick to this, at the very least until the New Year. Because there's more to life than just our membership of the EU, and I don't want it to define my personal, or online, relationships for the rest of my life.
Not my best post. Not very coherent. But that's how I feel.
Can you imagine what it has been like in Scotland for the past four years? Referendums are always divisive. They are black and white, take it or leave it, pig in a poke, zero sum affairs. There is never a maybe, an upto a point, a bit of both.
They are more accepted if there is a big enough win. E.g. 65-35 either way would have seen it settled.
Notice Watson, Bryant, Miliband et al having a meltdown in HOC re 21st Century Fox bid for Sky and the possibilty Murdoch may have influence on Sky and Sky news
Did Tom Watson speak?
Not sure as I didn't watch it all - but he was sitting on the front bench showing great interest
I rarely FPT myself - but frankly, I've had a total skinful of liberal men on PB and elsewhere handwaving waving the cultural behaviour that's been imported by no knowledge nitwits, virtue signalling to stroke their own egos. You'd never accept this impinging on your daily lives. Ever. Oh, and have a burkah - black or maybe sky blue.
TBH, my entire experience of Morocco was hmm bar buying a nice camel leather handbag.
I'm a tough bird, and the misogyny/grabby behaviour was appalling. My handful of female fellow Landies were left so intimidated that they gave me shopping lists as they couldn't cope with the local men.
I was leered at/asked for sex/grabbed walking down the street for merely being white. I was covered head to foot and followed everywhere by creepy men/my chest commented on/assumed to be a prostitute.
I was on rural Morocco/Algerian border - any liberal inclined man in the UK has NO IDEA about the behaviour of men in these areas and what Europe has invited in. I was one of a party of 12 Land Rover/Toyota drivers who were exploring a new Paris/Dhaka rally parallel route. We spent 3 weeks driving 14hrs a day across the Sahara/establishing rest points/mechanics on the way - so no shrinking violets.
One of our convoy caught fire and they ended up in my Toyota as I was solo. We seriously considered pushing their broke Landy over the edge of a cliff in the Atlas mountains, as getting her down seemed impossible/insurance was easier. After much discussion, we decided to take her back down thousands of feet by roping her between mine and another.
This isn't tourist stuff - it's alternative life - anyone with a spec of knowledge of this culture has held up their hands and said WTF?
I agree with you. The impact on women of these attitudes is something that it is all too easy for men to ignore.
Ed Conwy reporting that Phil Hammond has told the Treasury Select Committee today that he is in favour of a transitional deal with the EU to lessen the disruption of Brexit
He went on to say that Phil Hammond had referred to the 'more thoughtful politicians', which seems like a subtle barb at David Davis and Barnier whom are not interested in transitional relief and that he may well have included the Prime Minister in his reference to 'more thoughtful politicians'
He said that Hammond was quite explicit that the Government are moving towards this position.
@CourtNewsUK: Pensioner cleared of molesting woman outside Buckingham Palace - he claimed he was just trying to find a good spot to watch the guards.
Sexual assault charges were brought after cops watched the retired holidaymaker move among the crowd.
There was no complainant.
Wow! Seems almost unbelievable. My girlfriend of the time on her birthday asked me to take a picture of her and friends on a bridge late at night. I then got stopped by police askig why I was taking pictures of women at a distance and was pretty worried until she came back!
I'm probably going to regret posting this, but here goes..
It's Christmas. The season of goodwill. A time to put away the troubles of the year and come together as families, friends and communities. To celebrate the relationships we share, the warmth of the human spirit, to show generosity to one other, relax and have fun.
Yet this Christmas, all I've seen and heard is: Brexit, referendum, Brexit, referendum, Brexit, Brexit.. I've had arguments at catch-ups with close friends, it's created tensions within my family, and cordial relationships I've previously had with some of my peers at work have either loosened, or been soured. I totally underestimated how divisive this referendum would be. I thought after the vote, we'd all largely move on, and come together, but it hasn't been like that. Not at all. In fact, in many respects, it's got worse. The debate, such as it is, is relentless, and there is no end to it. It is often tense, it can be unpleasant, and, not on occasion, it can get nasty.
Have I contributed to this?
Yes, I have - absolutely. And I'm not proud of that. Not at all. I've been prickly, quick to judge and slow to listen. And I'm ashamed of that - if I could turn the clock back, and change my behaviour over the last six months, I would.
I'm not saying this to make a "Remain" or "Leave" point on either side. Yes, I want to Leave. Others equally want - just as strongly - to Remain. We all have strong views. The referendum split the country in half, and it is still splitting the country in half. But, honestly, can't we find it in ourselves to give all of us a bit of a break over the next couple of weeks? To rediscover what else we liked about each other, once?
To be honest, I'm tired of it all. Part of me just wants a break. I know some may think I don't deserve one, but I know none of us are really bad people at heart. We are all Britons, and we all want the best for the country.
I will - from now on - do my level best to try and stick to this, at the very least until the New Year. Because there's more to life than just our membership of the EU, and I don't want it to define my personal, or online, relationships for the rest of my life.
Not my best post. Not very coherent. But that's how I feel.
There is much that I could say in response to @Casino_Royale's post (and some of the points that it sheds a sidelight on go to the heart of much of British politics today), but it has clearly been composed with the best of intentions so for now I will simply wish him a Merry Christmas.
Thank you very much, Alastair. That means a lot to me coming from your good self.
He said that Hammond was quite explicit that the Government are moving towards this position.
Seems quite a significant statement
@GuardianAnushka: AND sd Brexit deal cd mean need for us and others to build "sign physical infrastructure at ports" & train folk for intensive customs checks
Notice Watson, Bryant, Miliband et al having a meltdown in HOC re 21st Century Fox bid for Sky and the possibilty Murdoch may have influence on Sky and Sky news
Did Tom Watson speak?
Not sure as I didn't watch it all - but he was sitting on the front bench showing great interest
So that's your evidence for a meltdown by Tom Watson.
@faisalislam: There are limits on "cumulative capacity to make significant changes" says Hammond citing customs "much more intensive process at borders"
He said that Hammond was quite explicit that the Government are moving towards this position.
Seems quite a significant statement
@GuardianAnushka: AND sd Brexit deal cd mean need for us and others to build "sign physical infrastructure at ports" & train folk for intensive customs checks
Please could someone translate that into English for me?
I rarely FPT myself - but frankly, I've had a total skinful of liberal men on PB and elsewhere handwaving waving the cultural behaviour that's been imported by no knowledge nitwits, virtue signalling to stroke their own egos. You'd never accept this impinging on your daily lives. Ever. Oh, and have a burkah - black or maybe sky blue.
TBH, my entire experience of Morocco was hmm bar buying a nice camel leather handbag.
I'm a tough bird, and the misogyny/grabby behaviour was appalling. My handful of female fellow Landies were left so intimidated that they gave me shopping lists as they couldn't cope with the local men.
I was leered at/asked for sex/grabbed walking down the street for merely being white. I was covered head to foot and followed everywhere by creepy men/my chest commented on/assumed to be a prostitute.
I was on rural Morocco/Algerian border - any liberal inclined man in the UK has NO IDEA about the behaviour of men in these areas and what Europe has invited in. I was one of a party of 12 Land Rover/Toyota drivers who were exploring a new Paris/Dhaka rally parallel route. We spent 3 weeks driving 14hrs a day across the Sahara/establishing rest points/mechanics on the way - so no shrinking violets.
[Snipped]
This isn't tourist stuff - it's alternative life - anyone with a spec of knowledge of this culture has held up their hands and said WTF?
I am sure that it was just locker room behaviour, nothing wrong with a little pussy grabbing is there?
If you'd ever been the victim of sexual assault - and I have - you'd never say something like that.
I am sick to the back teeth of men, or indeed anyone, demeaning women's experience in this way. It is awful behavior; it happens far far too often; it is excused far too often. It's not locker room behaviour or amusing or something we should have to just put up with or laugh of, even though we have to do that just to get on with our lives. It's not a sideshow or an adjunct to more serious crimes. Sexual assault of women is a serious crime. And it happens to all women everywhere, whether its women in war zones, women out celebrating at night, or young girls in Africa, going to school and forced to provide sexual favours to get good marks or young vulnerable girls groomed by the manipulative and ignored by the powerful because they don't count or are not seen as "nice girls".
Welcome to our world, chaps. It's repellent and it needs to stop. A man who treats a woman like a piece of meat, with a lack of respect and courtesy, is no gentleman, no matter how much he may protest about honour.
Notice Watson, Bryant, Miliband et al having a meltdown in HOC re 21st Century Fox bid for Sky and the possibilty Murdoch may have influence on Sky and Sky news
Did Tom Watson speak?
Not sure as I didn't watch it all - but he was sitting on the front bench showing great interest
So that's your evidence for a meltdown by Tom Watson.
Okay.
If Murdoch takes over Sky are you saying Watson wont go into meltdown
Ed Conwy reporting that Phil Hammond has told the Treasury Select Committee today that he is in favour of a transitional deal with the EU to lessen the disruption of Brexit
He went on to say that Phil Hammond had referred to the 'more thoughtful politicians', which seems like a subtle barb at David Davis and Barnier whom are not interested in transitional relief and that he may well have included the Prime Minister in his reference to 'more thoughtful politicians'
He said that Hammond was quite explicit that the Government are moving towards this position.
Seems quite a significant statement
It also suggests we are very likely to leave the EU Customs Union, as putting all the infrastructure in for customs check is time consuming.
I'm probably going to regret posting this, but here goes..
It's Christmas. The season of goodwill. A time to put away the troubles of the year and come together as families, friends and communities. To celebrate the relationships we share, the warmth of the human spirit, to show generosity to one other, relax and have fun.
Yet this Christmas, all I've seen and heard is: Brexit, referendum, Brexit, referendum, Brexit, Brexit.. I've had arguments at catch-ups with close friends, it's created tensions within my family, and cordial relationships I've previously had with some of my peers at work have either loosened, or been soured. I totally underestimated how divisive this referendum would be. I thought after the vote, we'd all largely move on, and come together, but it hasn't been like that. Not at all. In fact, in many respects, it's got worse. The debate, such as it is, is relentless, and there is no end to it. It is often tense, it can be unpleasant, and, not on occasion, it can get nasty.
Have I contributed to this?
Yes, I have - absolutely. And I'm not proud of that. Not at all. I've been prickly, quick to judge and slow to listen. And I'm ashamed of that - if I could turn the clock back, and change my behaviour over the last six months, I would.
I'm not saying this to make a "Remain" or "Leave" point on either side. Yes, I want to Leave. Others equally want - just as strongly - to Remain. We all have strong views. The referendum split the country in half, and it is still splitting the country in half. But, honestly, can't we find it in ourselves to give all of us a bit of a break over the next couple of weeks? To rediscover what else we liked about each other, once?
To be honest, I'm tired of it all. Part of me just wants a break. I know some may think I don't deserve one, but I know none of us are really bad people at heart. We are all Britons, and we all want the best for the country.
I will - from now on - do my level best to try and stick to this, at the very least until the New Year. Because there's more to life than just our membership of the EU, and I don't want it to define my personal, or online, relationships for the rest of my life.
Not my best post. Not very coherent. But that's how I feel.
A good post and one with which I sympathize. Likely however to fall on deaf ears sadly. The problem is not the result it is simply the time it will take to implement it and that is something none of us can control. I am reconciled to it but like many others face continuing uncertainty regarding the future of Brits abroad. Either way my future is settled to stay in Spain but there are many who I know will not have that option if the terms are very hard.
He said that Hammond was quite explicit that the Government are moving towards this position.
Seems quite a significant statement
@GuardianAnushka: AND sd Brexit deal cd mean need for us and others to build "sign physical infrastructure at ports" & train folk for intensive customs checks
Please could someone translate that into English for me?
Comments
Withdrawn.
Presumably they would also allow UK citizens to be under British law while living in the EU?
If Brexit does turn bad, the Conservatives will still win but the public will hold the grudge for a time when they can make use of it.
The chappie said "a vote to leave the EU was a direct attack on Ronnie Scott’s". That is personalising.
Then he said the increased fees he would have to pay to Americans would damage his business, which is pure humbug. He turns over £10m and pays nearly 100 service staff. The Living Wage will have a far greater impact than a marginal change in the fees of a relatively small portion of his artistes.
Anyway, the Brexit fall in the £ has put it where a lot of them were demanding they wanted it, and there has been a tourist boom = more customer for RS. Perhaps he should sell some tickets in dollars.
Enough of this, however.
That's clearly not on.
Mr. Hopkins, unless that were allowed, that is (but it'd be bloody odd).
(And yes, for pedants among you, I know that the term "ultramontanism" wasn't coined until the 19th century...)
In other words both sides are becoming disenchanted
Instead of trying to silence them, try listening to them. You might learn something (though in many cases I suspect that's beyond Leavers because they're stuck on transmit rather than receive mode).
I'd prefer it if he didn't get the seat, on a financial basis. As a spectator, it would probably be rather good.
One certainly does not excuse the other.
www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/ultramontanism/
11 Jun 2015 - Ultramontanism in Canada, as in Europe where it began during the French Revolution, was the theory of those who rejected any compromise ... by CATHOLICISM with modern thought, and demanded the supremacy of religious over civil society.
So the EU will not be content with becoming a state like other states; they have their sights set on jurisdiction over people in other sovereign states.
What price someone with US/EU double citizenship? I can see EU authority going down well in the US.
Leavers should be happy.
These things take time they don't work to a 24-hr news cycle.
*The civil service is like an oil tanker trying to do a u-turn underneath Hammersmith Bridge, that said.
Fiction writing, for the moment. I may seek to expand that to grunt-work (news writing) or add something else in the near future. The money situation is not splendid.
Netflix watchers wasting their time on that should do Shooter instead - it's much more credible and smart viewing.
*Excepting the peculiar delight of a flukey 250/1 winner.
It's Christmas. The season of goodwill. A time to put away the troubles of the year and come together as families, friends and communities. To celebrate the relationships we share, the warmth of the human spirit, to show generosity to one other, relax and have fun.
Yet this Christmas, all I've seen and heard is: Brexit, referendum, Brexit, referendum, Brexit, Brexit.. I've had arguments at catch-ups with close friends, it's created tensions within my family, and cordial relationships I've previously had with some of my peers at work have either loosened, or been soured. I totally underestimated how divisive this referendum would be. I thought after the vote, we'd all largely move on, and come together, but it hasn't been like that. Not at all. In fact, in many respects, it's got worse. The debate, such as it is, is relentless, and there is no end to it. It is often tense, it can be unpleasant, and, not on occasion, it can get nasty.
Have I contributed to this?
Yes, I have - absolutely. And I'm not proud of that. Not at all. I've been prickly, quick to judge and slow to listen. And I'm ashamed of that - if I could turn the clock back, and change my behaviour over the last six months, I would.
I'm not saying this to make a "Remain" or "Leave" point on either side. Yes, I want to Leave. Others equally want - just as strongly - to Remain. We all have strong views. The referendum split the country in half, and it is still splitting the country in half. But, honestly, can't we find it in ourselves to give all of us a bit of a break over the next couple of weeks? To rediscover what else we liked about each other, once?
To be honest, I'm tired of it all. Part of me just wants a break. I know some may think I don't deserve one, but I know none of us are really bad people at heart. We are all Britons, and we all want the best for the country.
I will - from now on - do my level best to try and stick to this, at the very least until the New Year. Because there's more to life than just our membership of the EU, and I don't want it to define my personal, or online, relationships for the rest of my life.
Not my best post. Not very coherent. But that's how I feel.
After that, of course, everyone will start to say how that successful outcome was always inevitable.
This won't cheer you up, but things may well get worse. The EU seeking to have UK citizens opt out of UK law and into EU law will not win them many friends beyond EU-philes.
That said, I do agree with your sentiment and hope that, once things get under way, the country can accept the situation and move on.
Miss Plato, I'm also cool, although that's due to poor circulation and having an abnormally low body temperature.
Good on 'yer. Remember that real life is far more important than politics.
The fear of the 96% who donated to Hillary vs a mere cable news channel is weird.
Why are they so scared and over-reacting like this? Who doesn't think it's peculiar?
Sexual assault charges were brought after cops watched the retired holidaymaker move among the crowd.
There was no complainant.
I suspect the difference between this referendum and most of the GEs of the past 20 years is that it results in a real change of direction for the whole country and has the potential to create a lot of losers.
That nothing has happened yet, only allows people's uncertainty and worry to simmer.
Also, regretfully there has been no leadership shown in trying to reunite the country. No effort to bring people together to build a better future. Simply banal generalities.
Many of us understand, Merry Christmas.
We certainly need Xmas as a rest, as it looks like 2017 will be another roller-coaster with Italy and France.
https://twitter.com/WTHRcom/status/808352368173740032
Mr. B, not that near. Yorkshire's quite big.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-38290932
Witnesses said they saw a man attack another on the train then run out of the station shouting "he wanted to kill Muslims".
They are more accepted if there is a big enough win. E.g. 65-35 either way would have seen it settled.
Sometimes debate on t'Internet focus too much on what divides us and not on what unites us.
He went on to say that Phil Hammond had referred to the 'more thoughtful politicians', which seems like a subtle barb at David Davis and Barnier whom are not interested in transitional relief and that he may well have included the Prime Minister in his reference to 'more thoughtful politicians'
He said that Hammond was quite explicit that the Government are moving towards this position.
Seems quite a significant statement
My girlfriend of the time on her birthday asked me to take a picture of her and friends on a bridge late at night. I then got stopped by police askig why I was taking pictures of women at a distance and was pretty worried until she came back!
Merry Christmas to you and your family too.
Okay.
FFS it would be nice if the plod actually dealt with real crimes
I am sick to the back teeth of men, or indeed anyone, demeaning women's experience in this way. It is awful behavior; it happens far far too often; it is excused far too often. It's not locker room behaviour or amusing or something we should have to just put up with or laugh of, even though we have to do that just to get on with our lives. It's not a sideshow or an adjunct to more serious crimes. Sexual assault of women is a serious crime. And it happens to all women everywhere, whether its women in war zones, women out celebrating at night, or young girls in Africa, going to school and forced to provide sexual favours to get good marks or young vulnerable girls groomed by the manipulative and ignored by the powerful because they don't count or are not seen as "nice girls".
Welcome to our world, chaps. It's repellent and it needs to stop. A man who treats a woman like a piece of meat, with a lack of respect and courtesy, is no gentleman, no matter how much he may protest about honour.
The Irish will be really chuffed...
Sorry.. on tube and now train with patchy reception!
Blah blah blah, blah blah blah. Brexit bad.