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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Those who think the SNP are a busted flush might be surprised

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  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,273
    Pulpstar said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    How much would https://www.tesco.com/groceries/en-GB/products/272515844 5 litres of veg oil cost with its 41265 calories cost under your plan ?
    £44.76. An extreme example, but it contains the average person's calorie requrements for 23 days.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    So Leavers are loving the union to death.
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,704

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    All packaged food. Fresh food doesn't have to - but that could be a good exemption then.

    However there's "good" and "bad" calories.

    EDIT: Sadly while your idea is reasonable in theory I can just imagine it won't be long before some nanny from the other extreme starts screaming about how the government is encouraging bulimia and anorexia.
    I like your fresh food exemption. I agree some calorie dense foods (olive oil?) are better than others (white sugar) but to keep it simple just tax all calories the same.

    Maybe some of the funds raised could go to boost support for eating disorders.

    A tax of 0.1p per kCal would raise about £64bn pa and cost each person £2.70 per day if I have got my maths right. (Edit: a bit less given the fresh food exemption.)
    If we eat celery do we get a rebate?
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,273

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    All packaged food. Fresh food doesn't have to - but that could be a good exemption then.

    However there's "good" and "bad" calories.

    EDIT: Sadly while your idea is reasonable in theory I can just imagine it won't be long before some nanny from the other extreme starts screaming about how the government is encouraging bulimia and anorexia.
    I like your fresh food exemption. I agree some calorie dense foods (olive oil?) are better than others (white sugar) but to keep it simple just tax all calories the same.

    Maybe some of the funds raised could go to boost support for eating disorders.

    A tax of 0.1p per kCal would raise about £64bn pa and cost each person £2.70 per day if I have got my maths right. (Edit: a bit less given the fresh food exemption.)
    If we eat celery do we get a rebate?
    Haha - no, but it's tax free!
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,841

    So Leavers are loving the union to death.

    Beyond the pale.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Eating celery is its own punishment.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340

    Pulpstar said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    How much would https://www.tesco.com/groceries/en-GB/products/272515844 5 litres of veg oil cost with its 41265 calories cost under your plan ?
    £44.76. An extreme example, but it contains the average person's calorie requrements for 23 days.
    Pity the poor customs officers having to get the latex gloves out to check whether pensioners were trying to smuggle in Werther's Originals.
  • sarissasarissa Posts: 1,749
    The aspect that never seems to be mentioned is the assumption that the opinion poll figures for the Scottish Greens and UKIP will be achieved at a general election.
    The Greens are unlikely to put up more than a token few candidates, like they did in 2017 when achieving 0.2% of the vote, as did UKIP who are now a busted flush.

    This leaves a crucial 2-2.5% of the vote share up for grabs.

    As the sweet spot for the SNP starts at about a 40% SNP/26.5% Con/25% Lab split, picking the low hanging fruit could deliver them 40-45 seats and crucially, a renewed mandate to keep Indyref 2 on the agenda.
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,669
    Trump the Fatalist
    https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/06/08/donald-trump-beliefs-what-matters-fatalism-218663
    Trump quotes:
    "What will be will be", "We'll see", “Nothing scares me. Nothing,” he answered. “I’m a great fatalist—whatever happens, happens, and you just have to go along with it.

    https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/06/08/donald-trump-beliefs-what-matters-fatalism-218663
    "Trump is giving voice to one of the least talked-about but most abiding convictions of his long, loud, public life—his unambiguous belief in the inherent meaningless of human existence, and his repeated self-identification as a fatalist."
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,881

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    All packaged food. Fresh food doesn't have to - but that could be a good exemption then.

    However there's "good" and "bad" calories.

    EDIT: Sadly while your idea is reasonable in theory I can just imagine it won't be long before some nanny from the other extreme starts screaming about how the government is encouraging bulimia and anorexia.
    I like your fresh food exemption. I agree some calorie dense foods (olive oil?) are better than others (white sugar) but to keep it simple just tax all calories the same.

    Maybe some of the funds raised could go to boost support for eating disorders.

    A tax of 0.1p per kCal would raise about £64bn pa and cost each person £2.70 per day if I have got my maths right. (Edit: a bit less given the fresh food exemption.)
    Sounds pretty expensive!
    A family of 5 looking at paying an extra 3 and half grand a year.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,841
    edited June 2018

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    All packaged food. Fresh food doesn't have to - but that could be a good exemption then.

    However there's "good" and "bad" calories.

    EDIT: Sadly while your idea is reasonable in theory I can just imagine it won't be long before some nanny from the other extreme starts screaming about how the government is encouraging bulimia and anorexia.
    I like your fresh food exemption. I agree some calorie dense foods (olive oil?) are better than others (white sugar) but to keep it simple just tax all calories the same.

    Maybe some of the funds raised could go to boost support for eating disorders.

    A tax of 0.1p per kCal would raise about £64bn pa and cost each person £2.70 per day if I have got my maths right. (Edit: a bit less given the fresh food exemption.)
    If we eat celery do we get a rebate?
    Haha - no, but it's tax free!
    The problem is it would be absolubtely brutal on a family of four with say a couple of 11 year old kids where there is a household income of ~ £30k. It's the poll tax by another name ;)
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    The eagerness of some for puritanical meddling is beyond me. (In related news, I need to gain some weight).
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,123
    justin124 said:

    felix said:

    We await Justin, Surby and other Labour analysis with interest. Not much sign here of the Scottish Corbyn breakthrough we heard so much about a few months ago.

    Polls in Scotland have been overstating SNP support levels for several years now. Also the crossbreak for Scotland in the most recent national poll came up with SNP 38 Lab 30 Con 26.
    ROFL - we resort to sub-sample against a national Scottish poll. Null points for effort.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,123
    edited June 2018

    So come on, who's is going to labour live next weekend....

    Sadly it's my day for smearing lard on the cat's boil!
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,273

    Pulpstar said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    How much would https://www.tesco.com/groceries/en-GB/products/272515844 5 litres of veg oil cost with its 41265 calories cost under your plan ?
    £44.76. An extreme example, but it contains the average person's calorie requrements for 23 days.
    Pity the poor customs officers having to get the latex gloves out to check whether pensioners were trying to smuggle in Werther's Originals.
    57p calorie tax on a 135g pack by my reckoning. Not sure it's going to start a trend in 'chews-cruises' tbh. :smile:
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,517
    Cyclefree said:

    Morning all from a very sunny Cumbria.

    I find it odd that the Tories are increasing their poll lead, if polls are to be believed. They seem to me to be an absolute shower but maybe most people don’t follow the ins and outs much.

    One word of caution though: Corbyn is a good campaigner and quite shameless when it comes to offering all sorts of goodies as we saw last year so even if the polls are right now we should not assume that they will stay this way during a GE. And by then something will have happened with Brexit, though I haven’t the faintest idea what.

    Anyway well done to @JosiasJessop for his walks, though he should really get to the Lakes. Some wonderful walks here.

    (Snip)

    Thanks. I quite like the Lakes, but it's a little too far away from me to go to regularly. It also seems to rain whenever I'm there ...
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,841

    Pulpstar said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    How much would https://www.tesco.com/groceries/en-GB/products/272515844 5 litres of veg oil cost with its 41265 calories cost under your plan ?
    £44.76. An extreme example, but it contains the average person's calorie requrements for 23 days.
    Pity the poor customs officers having to get the latex gloves out to check whether pensioners were trying to smuggle in Werther's Originals.
    57p calorie tax on a 135g pack by my reckoning. Not sure it's going to start a trend in 'chews-cruises' tbh. :smile:
    How does a hard working family with both mum and Dad employed as NHS auxilliaries afford this :) ?
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,273
    rkrkrk said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    All packaged food. Fresh food doesn't have to - but that could be a good exemption then.

    However there's "good" and "bad" calories.

    EDIT: Sadly while your idea is reasonable in theory I can just imagine it won't be long before some nanny from the other extreme starts screaming about how the government is encouraging bulimia and anorexia.
    I like your fresh food exemption. I agree some calorie dense foods (olive oil?) are better than others (white sugar) but to keep it simple just tax all calories the same.

    Maybe some of the funds raised could go to boost support for eating disorders.

    A tax of 0.1p per kCal would raise about £64bn pa and cost each person £2.70 per day if I have got my maths right. (Edit: a bit less given the fresh food exemption.)
    Sounds pretty expensive!
    A family of 5 looking at paying an extra 3 and half grand a year.
    They could always eat a bit less.


  • sarissasarissa Posts: 1,749
    Also worth remembering the popularity of Sturgeon, Davidson and Leonard are not judged on the same basis.

    Nicola is being judged on her performance as First Minister, whereas Ruth and Richard (as a political nerd I do know about him) are only being judged on leading their party group.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,881
    TOPPING said:

    rkrkrk said:

    MaxPB said:

    Well Trump grabbed 'em by the p**** and got away with it...
    Trump supporters don't care, but Trudeau supporters really will.
    Thing is, it is or was in the public domain when it happened,and he apologised for it then. There is I think an element of double jeopardy about dragging it up again to accuse him, even though, as the Buzzfeed article points out, that he says politicians should be responsible for their actions whenever they happened.
    Ah - apologies, I didn't read the article. I think you're probably right about double jeopardy.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,273

    The eagerness of some for puritanical meddling is beyond me. (In related news, I need to gain some weight).


    It's not really about nannying people. Tbh if individuals want to eat (or drink, or smoke, or drug) themselves to an early grave, that's up to them. It's about covering the cost of their choices on our shared health services.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/health-matters-obesity-and-the-food-environment/health-matters-obesity-and-the-food-environment--2
  • David_EvershedDavid_Evershed Posts: 6,506
    edited June 2018
    rkrkrk said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    All packaged food. Fresh food doesn't have to - but that could be a good exemption then.

    However there's "good" and "bad" calories.

    EDIT: Sadly while your idea is reasonable in theory I can just imagine it won't be long before some nanny from the other extreme starts screaming about how the government is encouraging bulimia and anorexia.
    I like your fresh food exemption. I agree some calorie dense foods (olive oil?) are better than others (white sugar) but to keep it simple just tax all calories the same.

    Maybe some of the funds raised could go to boost support for eating disorders.

    A tax of 0.1p per kCal would raise about £64bn pa and cost each person £2.70 per day if I have got my maths right. (Edit: a bit less given the fresh food exemption.)
    Sounds pretty expensive!
    A family of 5 looking at paying an extra 3 and half grand a year.

    Or changing their eating habits.

    Let them eat asparagus.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709
    edited June 2018
    sarissa said:

    The aspect that never seems to be mentioned is the assumption that the opinion poll figures for the Scottish Greens and UKIP will be achieved at a general election.
    The Greens are unlikely to put up more than a token few candidates, like they did in 2017 when achieving 0.2% of the vote, as did UKIP who are now a busted flush.

    This leaves a crucial 2-2.5% of the vote share up for grabs.

    As the sweet spot for the SNP starts at about a 40% SNP/26.5% Con/25% Lab split, picking the low hanging fruit could deliver them 40-45 seats and crucially, a renewed mandate to keep Indyref 2 on the agenda.

    The next general election is irrelevant to indyref2 as the next Holyrood election is due the year before and on today's Yougov would produce a unionist majority
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,841

    rkrkrk said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    All packaged food. Fresh food doesn't have to - but that could be a good exemption then.

    However there's "good" and "bad" calories.

    EDIT: Sadly while your idea is reasonable in theory I can just imagine it won't be long before some nanny from the other extreme starts screaming about how the government is encouraging bulimia and anorexia.
    I like your fresh food exemption. I agree some calorie dense foods (olive oil?) are better than others (white sugar) but to keep it simple just tax all calories the same.

    Maybe some of the funds raised could go to boost support for eating disorders.

    A tax of 0.1p per kCal would raise about £64bn pa and cost each person £2.70 per day if I have got my maths right. (Edit: a bit less given the fresh food exemption.)
    Sounds pretty expensive!
    A family of 5 looking at paying an extra 3 and half grand a year.
    They could always eat a bit less.


    They're eating 1917 calories per day each on these sums. That's below average.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. Pointer, are you going to charge people for doing charity sky diving for the NHS? According to QI (admittedly, not impeccable) the costs of treating resultant injuries exceeds the money raised.

    Will mountain climbers be taxed?

    How far does the green-eyed taxman's reach extend, in your perfect world?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709
    rkrkrk said:

    MaxPB said:

    Well Trump grabbed 'em by the p**** and got away with it...
    Trump supporters don't care, but Trudeau supporters really will.
    No they won't this is 1 allegation 18 years ago and Democrats rallied around Bill Clinton for far worse
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,005
    Perhaps a sugar tax is unfair because it targets those with a sweet tooth as opposed to other gastronomic weaknesses. But the government is never going to be entirely fair in what it puts sin taxes on. I don't really see it as nanny statism. These taxes have been bringing in less money in recent years.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,881
    HYUFD said:

    rkrkrk said:

    MaxPB said:

    Well Trump grabbed 'em by the p**** and got away with it...
    Trump supporters don't care, but Trudeau supporters really will.
    No they won't this is 1 allegation 18 years ago and Democrats rallied around Bill Clinton for far worse
    Bill Clinton was a different era. The tolerance now is much lower - especially for a politician like Trudeau who goes on about being a feminist etc. That said - I didn't realise the allegations had surfaced already, which i think does limit their impact.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,881

    rkrkrk said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    All packaged food. Fresh food doesn't have to - but that could be a good exemption then.

    However there's "good" and "bad" calories.

    EDIT: Sadly while your idea is reasonable in theory I can just imagine it won't be long before some nanny from the other extreme starts screaming about how the government is encouraging bulimia and anorexia.
    I like your fresh food exemption. I agree some calorie dense foods (olive oil?) are better than others (white sugar) but to keep it simple just tax all calories the same.

    Maybe some of the funds raised could go to boost support for eating disorders.

    A tax of 0.1p per kCal would raise about £64bn pa and cost each person £2.70 per day if I have got my maths right. (Edit: a bit less given the fresh food exemption.)
    Sounds pretty expensive!
    A family of 5 looking at paying an extra 3 and half grand a year.

    Or changing their eating habits.

    Let them eat asparagus.
    Even then I think fresh food tends to be more expensive than processed without the tax so there will be a significant increase in food expenditure... I don't think the idea is workable at that level of taxation, it will hit the poor too hard.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709
    rkrkrk said:

    HYUFD said:

    rkrkrk said:

    MaxPB said:

    Well Trump grabbed 'em by the p**** and got away with it...
    Trump supporters don't care, but Trudeau supporters really will.
    No they won't this is 1 allegation 18 years ago and Democrats rallied around Bill Clinton for far worse
    Bill Clinton was a different era. The tolerance now is much lower - especially for a politician like Trudeau who goes on about being a feminist etc. That said - I didn't realise the allegations had surfaced already, which i think does limit their impact.
    There is a difference for Weinstein scale allegations but sexual allegations tend to not make much difference as most voters are tribal and will rally around their candidate.

    As you state it was reported in the press at the time anyway and has just resurfaced, it is nothing new
  • David_EvershedDavid_Evershed Posts: 6,506
    Barnesian said:

    Scott_P said:
    The churn in the LibDem share is interesting too.

    On the surface the LibDems look to be static. 98 LibDems in today's weighted sample. 99 voted LibDem in 2017.

    But the LibDems lost a net 15 to the Tories and gained a net 15 from Labour leaving them basically all square. Small sample of course. Why would they be losing to the Tories and gaining from Labour? If it is true, it explains 1% point of the gain in Tory share and loss in Labour share.
    Leave Lib Dems moving to Conservative and

    Remain Labour moving to Lib Dem

    Result - Lib Dems becoming more social liberal and less economic liberal
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,841
    @Benpointer I think a modified version of your proposed calorie tax could work - instead of simply taking all the revenue from high calorie foods, balance it up by subsidising foods of lower calorific density (vegetables basically). That way healthy eating families wouldn't be clobbered.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,273
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    How much would https://www.tesco.com/groceries/en-GB/products/272515844 5 litres of veg oil cost with its 41265 calories cost under your plan ?
    £44.76. An extreme example, but it contains the average person's calorie requrements for 23 days.
    Pity the poor customs officers having to get the latex gloves out to check whether pensioners were trying to smuggle in Werther's Originals.
    57p calorie tax on a 135g pack by my reckoning. Not sure it's going to start a trend in 'chews-cruises' tbh. :smile:
    How does a hard working family with both mum and Dad employed as NHS auxilliaries afford this :) ?
    Well for a start some of the money raised could go towards paying NHS staff better.

    I acknowledge it's a regressive tax, like VAT (which of course is not currently charged on food). As such I'd see it alongside other measures to support those on lower incomes.

    Also I quickly plucked out a rate of 0.1p per kCal from thin air to do the maths. We don'e need to raise £64bn to boost the NHS - a rate of 0.015p (£0.00015) per kCal giving £9bn would be sufficient to cover the proijected costs of obesity

    That would be a circa 10% increase on average food bills (assuming people don't eat less or eat more healthily.)
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,273
    Pulpstar said:

    @Benpointer I think a modified version of your proposed calorie tax could work - instead of simply taking all the revenue from high calorie foods, balance it up by subsidising foods of lower calorific density (vegetables basically). That way healthy eating families wouldn't be clobbered.

    Yes I like that. I am sure their Lordships will suitably review and amend my bill when it comes before them :lol:
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Dost thou think, because thou art virtuous, there shall be no more cakes and ale?
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,273

    Mr. Pointer, are you going to charge people for doing charity sky diving for the NHS? According to QI (admittedly, not impeccable) the costs of treating resultant injuries exceeds the money raised.

    Will mountain climbers be taxed?

    How far does the green-eyed taxman's reach extend, in your perfect world?


    Not that far - now stop being so silly!
  • David_EvershedDavid_Evershed Posts: 6,506
    rkrkrk said:

    rkrkrk said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    All packaged food. Fresh food doesn't have to - but that could be a good exemption then.

    However there's "good" and "bad" calories.

    EDIT: Sadly while your idea is reasonable in theory I can just imagine it won't be long before some nanny from the other extreme starts screaming about how the government is encouraging bulimia and anorexia.
    I like your fresh food exemption. I agree some calorie dense foods (olive oil?) are better than others (white sugar) but to keep it simple just tax all calories the same.

    Maybe some of the funds raised could go to boost support for eating disorders.

    A tax of 0.1p per kCal would raise about £64bn pa and cost each person £2.70 per day if I have got my maths right. (Edit: a bit less given the fresh food exemption.)
    Sounds pretty expensive!
    A family of 5 looking at paying an extra 3 and half grand a year.

    Or changing their eating habits.

    Let them eat asparagus.
    Even then I think fresh food tends to be more expensive than processed without the tax so there will be a significant increase in food expenditure... I don't think the idea is workable at that level of taxation, it will hit the poor too hard.

    The less well educated people are too short of time/lazy to prepare meals from fresh food. Also they snack.

    Result - obesity
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,748
    justin124 said:

    felix said:

    We await Justin, Surby and other Labour analysis with interest. Not much sign here of the Scottish Corbyn breakthrough we heard so much about a few months ago.

    Polls in Scotland have been overstating SNP support levels for several years now. Also the crossbreak for Scotland in the most recent national poll came up with SNP 38 Lab 30 Con 26.
    I forget, is it over 20 or over 25 seats that you think SLab are going to gain at the next GE?
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,273
    Pulpstar said:

    rkrkrk said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    All packaged food. Fresh food doesn't have to - but that could be a good exemption then.

    However there's "good" and "bad" calories.

    EDIT: Sadly while your idea is reasonable in theory I can just imagine it won't be long before some nanny from the other extreme starts screaming about how the government is encouraging bulimia and anorexia.
    I like your fresh food exemption. I agree some calorie dense foods (olive oil?) are better than others (white sugar) but to keep it simple just tax all calories the same.

    Maybe some of the funds raised could go to boost support for eating disorders.

    A tax of 0.1p per kCal would raise about £64bn pa and cost each person £2.70 per day if I have got my maths right. (Edit: a bit less given the fresh food exemption.)
    Sounds pretty expensive!
    A family of 5 looking at paying an extra 3 and half grand a year.
    They could always eat a bit less.


    They're eating 1917 calories per day each on these sums. That's below average.
    65m people at 2700 cals per day, I think.
  • David_EvershedDavid_Evershed Posts: 6,506

    The eagerness of some for puritanical meddling is beyond me. (In related news, I need to gain some weight).


    It's not really about nannying people. Tbh if individuals want to eat (or drink, or smoke, or drug) themselves to an early grave, that's up to them. It's about covering the cost of their choices on our shared health services.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/health-matters-obesity-and-the-food-environment/health-matters-obesity-and-the-food-environment--2

    The eagerness of some for puritanical meddling is beyond me. (In related news, I need to gain some weight).


    It's not really about nannying people. Tbh if individuals want to eat (or drink, or smoke, or drug) themselves to an early grave, that's up to them. It's about covering the cost of their choices on our shared health services.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/health-matters-obesity-and-the-food-environment/health-matters-obesity-and-the-food-environment--2
    If we want the cost of health care to fall on those who use the service then we should not provide it free at the point of delivery but charge.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Foxy said:

    One of my swim team a young teacher just announced last night that she has quit her job and is going to Spain to work at a private school for less money. She mentioned Brexit and the general sxxt culture as the reason. The political discussion that followed showed a general gloom. The Scots think the English are talking to themselves as usual, ignoring everyone else and up their own a**e. In this environment only strong Scots will be supported.

    The Ruth Davidson factor is still an important part of the final Brexit outcome. Without her support the Scottish Tory mps will not vote for the deal. People vote conservative here for Ruth and the union not for Brexit.

    On the other hand Davidson did get the Unionist voters who were amongst the 30% of Scots for Brexit.

    I share the gloom of your young teacher friend. The future of Britain looks grim, negative and unappealing. If I were a recent graduate I too would emigrate.
    So little faith in your countryfolk
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,748
    Purple said:

    On the first poll: people in NI will vote to keep the NHS. Shocker.

    On the second: one begins to despair when so many people think the Scottish economy would fare better under independence. Many are reasoning that Brexit will be such a shambles that Scotland should stay out of it, of course, but they are too stupid to realise what having Scotland inside the CU and England outside would do to Scotland. I wonder how many realise that an independent Scotland inside the EU would NOT control its own borders, and would NOT be allowed to trade freely with England? (Nor, when jungle-like settlements built up north of the Tweed, would they be able to demand successfully that England open its borders.) Many Scottish nationalists are so infantile and drunk on sunshine that they don't realise EU membership brings responsibilities.

    You can almost hear a few very well-connected people in both NI and Scotland salivating at the thought of benefiting from the opportunities that Armageddon will bring.
    Lol, 'jungle-like settlements built up north of the Tweed'!

    Only 102 posts in and already well versed in the dumbass memes practiced 100s of times on PB - fast work.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,517

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    How much would https://www.tesco.com/groceries/en-GB/products/272515844 5 litres of veg oil cost with its 41265 calories cost under your plan ?
    £44.76. An extreme example, but it contains the average person's calorie requrements for 23 days.
    Pity the poor customs officers having to get the latex gloves out to check whether pensioners were trying to smuggle in Werther's Originals.
    57p calorie tax on a 135g pack by my reckoning. Not sure it's going to start a trend in 'chews-cruises' tbh. :smile:
    How does a hard working family with both mum and Dad employed as NHS auxilliaries afford this :) ?
    Well for a start some of the money raised could go towards paying NHS staff better.

    I acknowledge it's a regressive tax, like VAT (which of course is not currently charged on food). As such I'd see it alongside other measures to support those on lower incomes.

    Also I quickly plucked out a rate of 0.1p per kCal from thin air to do the maths. We don'e need to raise £64bn to boost the NHS - a rate of 0.015p (£0.00015) per kCal giving £9bn would be sufficient to cover the proijected costs of obesity

    That would be a circa 10% increase on average food bills (assuming people don't eat less or eat more healthily.)
    Since exercise is the other side of the equation (the more exercise you do, the less the heath problems from eating nice things), can I get a tax rebate? Firstly I walk a great deal myself, and I've also encouraged many others to go out for a walk. (Mainly by entering a room) ;)
  • David_EvershedDavid_Evershed Posts: 6,506

    Jonathan said:

    GIN1138 said:

    GIN1138 said:


    Well given the Tories have become the part of remain who would be surprised by that?
    Tory Remain
    Voters gain
    Well at the moment Tories are holding on Leavers and gaining Remainers.

    Leave voters haven't realized they are being sold down the river and there's no genuine Brexit Party to vote for at the moment anyway,

    I'm sure both those things won't last much longer...
    Leave voters currently have nowhere to go.
    In which case they simply won't vote.
    I'd suggest that for most 'Leave' (and 'Remain') voters, Brexit is not their sole reason for voting in a GE, and for many it's not likely to be in the top half-a-dozen reasons for voting.

    We are an odd Brexit-obsessed minority on PB. :smile:
    In Scotland the SNP lost the vote on independence but did not disappear as expected but got stronger. Labour and Lib Dems dithered and the Tories took a big chunk of the unionist vote. This allowed them to move from the 4th party in Scotland to a strong 2nd.

    I am surprised that the Lib Dems have not done better so far in England. Their position is logical.

    Lin Dems may be logical but .................

    the electorate are emotional.
  • ElliotElliot Posts: 1,516
    Purple said:

    SeanT said:

    BoJo is completely right, of course. A Mad Hatter approach - fuck you, we're capable of anything, look I have a knife, and I will cut off my own testicles, AND your nose, HAH - would have been better than May's cautious, turgid, idiotic Red Line which is then immediately crossed approach.

    The EU is mugging us. If a blade-flashing mugger is about to mug you, the best bet is to make yourself look so loony and weird and dangerous he think it ain't worth the uncertainty and risk: is he armed too? Why is he acting so strangely? (...)

    We should have Trumped the EU. Too late now.

    You're buying in to Trump's self-description. He went bankrupt several times. It won't end well.

    What do you mean by "too late now"?

    And can you specify some British testicles that Britain can threaten to cut off? When I did, Richard Tyndall said I was coming over as "utterly deranged". They include peace in Ireland, British sovereignty over NI, British sovereignty over Scotland, and uninterrupted food supply:
    Purple said:

    I do wonder how far the Brexit lunacy can go. When the present stage of dogwhistling stops, the following will take its place:

    * F*** the Irish border; we want Brexit;
    * F*** empty shelves in Aldi and Lidl; we want Brexit;
    * F*** whether or not we keep NI; we want Brexit;
    * F*** whether or not we keep Scotland; we want Brexit;
    * F*** a collapse of the food and retail banking systems; everyone who's anyone has got a home or three abroad;
    * F*** the left, the chavs, schoolteachers, and gentlemen of a Windrush and Oriental persuasion; we're going to remove kebab.

    Then there's the question of what will serve as the EU's "nose". The most available "nose" has got to be in the financial system somewhere.
    You forgot to mention the plague of locusts and the collapse of Western civilization.
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    Pulpstar said:

    @Benpointer I think a modified version of your proposed calorie tax could work - instead of simply taking all the revenue from high calorie foods, balance it up by subsidising foods of lower calorific density (vegetables basically). That way healthy eating families wouldn't be clobbered.

    Yes I like that. I am sure their Lordships will suitably review and amend my bill when it comes before them :lol:
    The best part of your calorie tax is that it hits tallest people hardest, and thus compensates for their unfair advantages when it comes to getting the best jobs and more sex.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/men/the-filter/11615756/Tall-men-earn-more-are-more-attractive-and-have-healthier-hearts.html
  • ElliotElliot Posts: 1,516

    Perhaps a sugar tax is unfair because it targets those with a sweet tooth as opposed to other gastronomic weaknesses. But the government is never going to be entirely fair in what it puts sin taxes on. I don't really see it as nanny statism. These taxes have been bringing in less money in recent years.

    I don't get why nanny state taxes are worse than employment taxes, which everyone accepts. Better to tax bad things than good things.
  • justin124justin124 Posts: 11,527
    I have no clear idea as to what might be happening re-the national polls at the moment. Prima facie it seems a bit odd. On the other hand, the Tories may be benefitting from something akin to 'the party conference' effect in that parties tend to receive a polling boost at conference time to a large extent because other parties are frozen out of media coverage etc.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    Elliot said:

    Perhaps a sugar tax is unfair because it targets those with a sweet tooth as opposed to other gastronomic weaknesses. But the government is never going to be entirely fair in what it puts sin taxes on. I don't really see it as nanny statism. These taxes have been bringing in less money in recent years.

    I don't get why nanny state taxes are worse than employment taxes, which everyone accepts. Better to tax bad things than good things.
    But most of the advocates for taxes on the bad things see them as additions to, rather than replacements for, the taxes on good things.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. Elliot, because puritanism is the creed of joyless ascetics and greedy socialists.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    How much would https://www.tesco.com/groceries/en-GB/products/272515844 5 litres of veg oil cost with its 41265 calories cost under your plan ?
    £44.76. An extreme example, but it contains the average person's calorie requrements for 23 days.
    Pity the poor customs officers having to get the latex gloves out to check whether pensioners were trying to smuggle in Werther's Originals.
    57p calorie tax on a 135g pack by my reckoning. Not sure it's going to start a trend in 'chews-cruises' tbh. :smile:
    How does a hard working family with both mum and Dad employed as NHS auxilliaries afford this :) ?
    Well for a start some of the money raised could go towards paying NHS staff better.

    I acknowledge it's a regressive tax, like VAT (which of course is not currently charged on food). As such I'd see it alongside other measures to support those on lower incomes.

    Also I quickly plucked out a rate of 0.1p per kCal from thin air to do the maths. We don'e need to raise £64bn to boost the NHS - a rate of 0.015p (£0.00015) per kCal giving £9bn would be sufficient to cover the proijected costs of obesity

    That would be a circa 10% increase on average food bills (assuming people don't eat less or eat more healthily.)
    Since exercise is the other side of the equation (the more exercise you do, the less the heath problems from eating nice things), can I get a tax rebate? Firstly I walk a great deal myself, and I've also encouraged many others to go out for a walk. (Mainly by entering a room) ;)
    Just saw your website on last night’s thread. An awesome achievement, not only in all the walking but in taking the time to document everything you’ve done. :+1:
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Not into Formula E especially, but this sounds like a fantastic idea:
    https://twitter.com/FIAFormulaE/status/1005030424584867840
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,559
    Austrian government closes 7 mosques and says there is no room for a parallel society in their country.


    https://www.welt.de/politik/ausland/article177185002/Sebastian-Kurz-Kein-Platz-fuer-Parallelgesellschaften-Oesterreich-schliesst-sieben-Moscheen.html
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    kle4 said:

    YouGov Times GB wide Poll

    Con 44 (+2)

    Labour 37 (-2)

    LD 8 (-1)

    Largest Tory lead since the GE.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/may-heads-off-brexit-revolt-with-backstop-concession-fbg5hbmv3

    How?!

    The cabinet are openly divided and all the news is about how badly Brexit is going, even from the pro brexit side. How on that situation do they rise?
    Electorate saying “we’ve given you a tough gig and Barnier is beating you with a shitty stick but we appreciate your efforts so have some moral support”?
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,722
    CON: 44% (+2)
    LAB: 37% (-2)
    LDEM: 8% (-1)
    UKIP: 3% (-)
    GRN: 3% (+1)

    via @YouGov, 04 - 05 Jun

    Time for a GE?
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362

    GIN1138 said:


    Well given the Tories have become the part of remain who would be surprised by that?
    Tory Remain
    Voters gain
    Easy one - Con's = Con's.
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    Austrian government closes 7 mosques and says there is no room for a parallel society in their country.


    https://www.welt.de/politik/ausland/article177185002/Sebastian-Kurz-Kein-Platz-fuer-Parallelgesellschaften-Oesterreich-schliesst-sieben-Moscheen.html

    They'll never win the Ashes with that attitude.
    https://t.co/KW9rubdlR0
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,841

    CON: 44% (+2)
    LAB: 37% (-2)
    LDEM: 8% (-1)
    UKIP: 3% (-)
    GRN: 3% (+1)

    via @YouGov, 04 - 05 Jun

    Time for a GE?

    Not just yet, need to see how big the kitty is once we've got the new house fully furnished.
  • justin124justin124 Posts: 11,527

    CON: 44% (+2)
    LAB: 37% (-2)
    LDEM: 8% (-1)
    UKIP: 3% (-)
    GRN: 3% (+1)

    via @YouGov, 04 - 05 Jun

    Time for a GE?

    Too late for this side of Summer break!
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    PClipp said:

    Scott_P said:
    I don`t understand how any self-respecting Conservative can bear to be in the same party as Boris Johnson.
    I don't understand why sarah wollaston joined the conservative party,her views match the lib dems.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    YouGov Times GB wide Poll

    Con 44 (+2)

    Labour 37 (-2)

    LD 8 (-1)

    Largest Tory lead since the GE.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/may-heads-off-brexit-revolt-with-backstop-concession-fbg5hbmv3

    This is a bloody awful poll for us. But we're organising a music festival. So that's OK then.
    Where Jezza goes, mini me SLab follows. Having Hugh 'diversity training' Gaffney as special guest is brave.

    https://twitter.com/CentralCLP/status/1003674045815115776
    Why do they need to add “and members of the Labour Party”? Are they not members of the public too?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,053
    Charles said:

    Foxy said:

    One of my swim team a young teacher just announced last night that she has quit her job and is going to Spain to work at a private school for less money. She mentioned Brexit and the general sxxt culture as the reason. The political discussion that followed showed a general gloom. The Scots think the English are talking to themselves as usual, ignoring everyone else and up their own a**e. In this environment only strong Scots will be supported.

    The Ruth Davidson factor is still an important part of the final Brexit outcome. Without her support the Scottish Tory mps will not vote for the deal. People vote conservative here for Ruth and the union not for Brexit.

    On the other hand Davidson did get the Unionist voters who were amongst the 30% of Scots for Brexit.

    I share the gloom of your young teacher friend. The future of Britain looks grim, negative and unappealing. If I were a recent graduate I too would emigrate.
    So little faith in your countryfolk
    As one of the many PB Leavers who have left, I am surprised that you are surprised.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,748
    Bugger, quite liked him.

    'CNN's Anthony Bourdain dead at 61'

    https://edition.cnn.com/2018/06/08/us/anthony-bourdain-obit/index.html
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,123
    Charles said:

    YouGov Times GB wide Poll

    Con 44 (+2)

    Labour 37 (-2)

    LD 8 (-1)

    Largest Tory lead since the GE.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/may-heads-off-brexit-revolt-with-backstop-concession-fbg5hbmv3

    This is a bloody awful poll for us. But we're organising a music festival. So that's OK then.
    Where Jezza goes, mini me SLab follows. Having Hugh 'diversity training' Gaffney as special guest is brave.

    https://twitter.com/CentralCLP/status/1003674045815115776
    Why do they need to add “and members of the Labour Party”? Are they not members of the public too?
    there's nowt so queer as [Scotslab] folk?
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:

    So despite endless trawling you still find every new poll backing staying in the UK in both Scotland and NI and of course the SNP is projected to use its Holyrood majority with the Greens with yougov today too
    You seem a little garbled. Some punctuation and syntax please.
    Those are symbols of the Liberal elite!
    If you join all of the full stops on Page 7 of today's Guardian it reveals a secret map showing the location of the most pretentious coffee shop in Camden.
    :lol:
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,559

    PClipp said:

    Scott_P said:
    I don`t understand how any self-respecting Conservative can bear to be in the same party as Boris Johnson.
    I don't understand why sarah wollaston joined the conservative party,her views match the lib dems.
    she's just one of those preachy middle class I know whats best for you types

    since religion died in England we've gone from God botherers to just plain botherers
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,053

    Dost thou think, because thou art virtuous, there shall be no more cakes and ale?

    No but a Calorie tax is an excellent proposal. Cake and tax it too :)
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,881

    Not into Formula E especially, but this sounds like a fantastic idea:
    https://twitter.com/FIAFormulaE/status/1005030424584867840

    That's really cool.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    MaxPB said:

    The data from Europe keeps getting worse.

    German industrial production down 1% MoM, yearly growth down to just 2%. Construction down by 6.9% YoY. French industrial production down 0.5% MoM.

    The Eurozone recovery turned out to be very short indeed.

    Was t it caused by a QE splurge anyway?

    People forget that the US is unwinding QE, the U.K. is static at least and only the EU has the taps on
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,704

    Bugger, quite liked him.

    'CNN's Anthony Bourdain dead at 61'

    https://edition.cnn.com/2018/06/08/us/anthony-bourdain-obit/index.html

    Yeah, always seemed like a cool guy. Very shocking.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Pulpstar said:

    Does Canada really stick a 300% tariff on US dairy ?

    Yes but it is not specific to American milk -- it is just that everyone else is too far away.
    It’s more of an issue that - until recently - most US milk was made with cows that had been dosed with rBST
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. rkrkrk, it is indeed super cool. And I say that as someone not into Formula E, or online gaming, and who's only played a couple of F1 games.

    It could even help the sport itself. If you've got a 13 year old who's very competitive, they might end up becoming either an e-sport star, or being diverted onto the path of actual motor racing.
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    Charles said:

    MaxPB said:

    The data from Europe keeps getting worse.

    German industrial production down 1% MoM, yearly growth down to just 2%. Construction down by 6.9% YoY. French industrial production down 0.5% MoM.

    The Eurozone recovery turned out to be very short indeed.

    Was t it caused by a QE splurge anyway?

    People forget that the US is unwinding QE, the U.K. is static at least and only the EU has the taps on
    Snow -- the beast from the East -- would explain why construction is worst hit.
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,669

    PClipp said:

    Scott_P said:
    I don`t understand how any self-respecting Conservative can bear to be in the same party as Boris Johnson.
    I don't understand why sarah wollaston joined the conservative party,her views match the lib dems.
    she's just one of those preachy middle class I know whats best for you types

    since religion died in England we've gone from God botherers to just plain botherers
    But what about what she said?
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    edited June 2018

    PClipp said:

    Scott_P said:
    I don`t understand how any self-respecting Conservative can bear to be in the same party as Boris Johnson.
    I don't understand why sarah wollaston joined the conservative party,her views match the lib dems.
    she's just one of those preachy middle class I know whats best for you types

    since religion died in England we've gone from God botherers to just plain botherers
    Very true Alan.

    I remember wollaston just before the EU referendum jumping ship from leave to remain hoping to cause maximum damage.

    Lucky the British public saw straight through her bull.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614

    Mr. rkrkrk, it is indeed super cool. And I say that as someone not into Formula E, or online gaming, and who's only played a couple of F1 games.

    It could even help the sport itself. If you've got a 13 year old who's very competitive, they might end up becoming either an e-sport star, or being diverted onto the path of actual motor racing.

    Mr, Dancer, since you were asking the other day, the kind FIA have published everyone’s power unit component usage up until now. Renault and Ferrari are apparently making new ICEs available this weekend, but Mercedes have delayed theirs until the next event in France in a fortnight. Hamilton is still on the first of all his components.
    https://www.motorsportweek.com/news/id/18522
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    Crickey...

    Anthony Bourdain has died aged 61. The popular US television personality - who had worked for CNN since 2013 - committed suicide in a hotel room in France where he was filming an upcoming episode of his TV series.

    His Parts Unknown Series on CNN was really rather good.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. Sandpit, cheers. Handy advantage for Hamilton. Is there not also a new Honda engine?
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Barnesian said:

    Scott_P said:
    The churn in the LibDem share is interesting too.

    On the surface the LibDems look to be static. 98 LibDems in today's weighted sample. 99 voted LibDem in 2017.

    But the LibDems lost a net 15 to the Tories and gained a net 15 from Labour leaving them basically all square. Small sample of course. Why would they be losing to the Tories and gaining from Labour? If it is true, it explains 1% point of the gain in Tory share and loss in Labour share.
    Easier

    Right wing Remainers move from LD to Tories because of softer tone

    Left wing Remainers realising Corbyn is a Leaver move to the Lib Dems

    It’s only a small percentage of the population that cares enough about Brexit for it to drive their vote, but that group tends to be more politically engaged
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Got to be off, but shall return (probably). F1 practice starts at 3pm. I think.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    Highly regressive tax.

    Food is a larger part of poorer people’s budgets and they (in general) eat less healthily as well
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    TOPPING said:

    rkrkrk said:

    MaxPB said:

    Well Trump grabbed 'em by the p**** and got away with it...
    Trump supporters don't care, but Trudeau supporters really will.
    Thing is, it is or was in the public domain when it happened,and he apologised for it then. There is I think an element of double jeopardy about dragging it up again to accuse him, even though, as the Buzzfeed article points out, that he says politicians should be responsible for their actions whenever they happened.
    Did you read the “apology”?!!

    “If I had known you were working for a national newspaper I wouldn’t have been so forward”
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614

    Mr. Sandpit, cheers. Handy advantage for Hamilton. Is there not also a new Honda engine?

    Yes, it’s surprising that only four cars, all Mercedes powered, are under par for PU component usage at this stage. Yes, I think there are new Honda engines for Canada too, but the table shows their reliability is still clearly the worst of the lot.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,559
    Charles said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    Highly regressive tax.

    Food is a larger part of poorer people’s budgets and they (in general) eat less healthily as well
    If we want a progressive tax we should tax Twitter. £1 a tweet
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 40,950
    Charles said:

    TOPPING said:

    rkrkrk said:

    MaxPB said:

    Well Trump grabbed 'em by the p**** and got away with it...
    Trump supporters don't care, but Trudeau supporters really will.
    Thing is, it is or was in the public domain when it happened,and he apologised for it then. There is I think an element of double jeopardy about dragging it up again to accuse him, even though, as the Buzzfeed article points out, that he says politicians should be responsible for their actions whenever they happened.
    Did you read the “apology”?!!

    “If I had known you were working for a national newspaper I wouldn’t have been so forward”
    haha yes that was a shocker but howsoever he apologised, it's done and dusted in most people's minds IMO.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709
    Charles said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    Highly regressive tax.

    Food is a larger part of poorer people’s budgets and they (in general) eat less healthily as well
    Perhaps a lobster, truffle, caviar and champagne tax then?
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Foxy said:

    Charles said:

    Foxy said:

    One of my swim team a young teacher just announced last night that she has quit her job and is going to Spain to work at a private school for less money. She mentioned Brexit and the general sxxt culture as the reason. The political discussion that followed showed a general gloom. The Scots think the English are talking to themselves as usual, ignoring everyone else and up their own a**e. In this environment only strong Scots will be supported.

    The Ruth Davidson factor is still an important part of the final Brexit outcome. Without her support the Scottish Tory mps will not vote for the deal. People vote conservative here for Ruth and the union not for Brexit.

    On the other hand Davidson did get the Unionist voters who were amongst the 30% of Scots for Brexit.

    I share the gloom of your young teacher friend. The future of Britain looks grim, negative and unappealing. If I were a recent graduate I too would emigrate.
    So little faith in your countryfolk
    As one of the many PB Leavers who have left, I am surprised that you are surprised.
    I left Zone 1... not the U.K.!

    Wanted to get out of the bubble :wink:
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,876
    Greetings from pre-dawn San Francisco. Happy to say that BA have upgraded their business class service. So much better than it was last time I flew with them.

    In other news, I see that Oh, Jeremy Corbyn continues to guarantee the worst government of my lifetime perpetual power. Lovely to think that, thanks to the far left, deceitful, xenophobic charlatans like Johnson, Rees Mogg and co will be shaping my childrens’ futures.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,392
    HYUFD said:

    Charles said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    Highly regressive tax.

    Food is a larger part of poorer people’s budgets and they (in general) eat less healthily as well
    Perhaps a lobster, truffle, caviar and champagne tax then?
    Avocado tax.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709
    Charles said:

    Foxy said:

    Charles said:

    Foxy said:

    One of my swim team a young teacher just announced last night that she has quit her job and is going to Spain to work at a private school for less money. She mentioned Brexit and the general sxxt culture as the reason. The political discussion that followed showed a general gloom. The Scots think the English are talking to themselves as usual, ignoring everyone else and up their own a**e. In this environment only strong Scots will be supported.

    The Ruth Davidson factor is still an important part of the final Brexit outcome. Without her support the Scottish Tory mps will not vote for the deal. People vote conservative here for Ruth and the union not for Brexit.

    On the other hand Davidson did get the Unionist voters who were amongst the 30% of Scots for Brexit.

    I share the gloom of your young teacher friend. The future of Britain looks grim, negative and unappealing. If I were a recent graduate I too would emigrate.
    So little faith in your countryfolk
    As one of the many PB Leavers who have left, I am surprised that you are surprised.
    I left Zone 1... not the U.K.!

    Wanted to get out of the bubble :wink:
    Zone 1 is basically a mini United Nations of the world's super rich anyway
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709

    HYUFD said:

    Charles said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    Highly regressive tax.

    Food is a larger part of poorer people’s budgets and they (in general) eat less healthily as well
    Perhaps a lobster, truffle, caviar and champagne tax then?
    Avocado tax.
    That too and add guacomale as well, after all only the likes of Mandelson could confuse it with mushy peas
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,392

    Greetings from pre-dawn San Francisco. Happy to say that BA have upgraded their business class service. So much better than it was last time I flew with them.

    In other news, I see that Oh, Jeremy Corbyn continues to guarantee the worst government of my lifetime perpetual power. Lovely to think that, thanks to the far left, deceitful, xenophobic charlatans like Johnson, Rees Mogg and co will be shaping my childrens’ futures.

    "...far left, deceitful, xenophobic charlatans like Johnson..."

    So now we know - he is a deep-cover North Korean agent!
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    TOPPING said:

    Charles said:

    TOPPING said:

    rkrkrk said:

    MaxPB said:

    Well Trump grabbed 'em by the p**** and got away with it...
    Trump supporters don't care, but Trudeau supporters really will.
    Thing is, it is or was in the public domain when it happened,and he apologised for it then. There is I think an element of double jeopardy about dragging it up again to accuse him, even though, as the Buzzfeed article points out, that he says politicians should be responsible for their actions whenever they happened.
    Did you read the “apology”?!!

    “If I had known you were working for a national newspaper I wouldn’t have been so forward”
    haha yes that was a shocker but howsoever he apologised, it's done and dusted in most people's minds IMO.
    Most people won’t have heard about it and it won’t get traction in the media
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    HYUFD said:

    Charles said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    Highly regressive tax.

    Food is a larger part of poorer people’s budgets and they (in general) eat less healthily as well
    Perhaps a lobster, truffle, caviar and champagne tax then?
    That’s fine. Don’t like lobster and champagbe anyway
  • PClippPClipp Posts: 2,138
    felix said:

    J. Forsyth: The disconnect between the mood at Westminster, where nearly all Tories--regardless of where they stand on Brexit--are very worried, and the polls is really quite striking

    Whisper it - the pundits have not got a clue.

    Whisper it - but a bit more loudly - the Tories don`t have a clue either.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709
    Charles said:

    HYUFD said:

    Charles said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    Highly regressive tax.

    Food is a larger part of poorer people’s budgets and they (in general) eat less healthily as well
    Perhaps a lobster, truffle, caviar and champagne tax then?
    That’s fine. Don’t like lobster and champagbe anyway
    What a man of the people you are!
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    HYUFD said:

    Charles said:

    Foxy said:

    Charles said:

    Foxy said:

    One of my swim team a young teacher just announced last night that she has quit her job and is going to Spain to work at a private school for less money. She mentioned Brexit and the general sxxt culture as the reason. The political discussion that followed showed a general gloom. The Scots think the English are talking to themselves as usual, ignoring everyone else and up their own a**e. In this environment only strong Scots will be supported.

    The Ruth Davidson factor is still an important part of the final Brexit outcome. Without her support the Scottish Tory mps will not vote for the deal. People vote conservative here for Ruth and the union not for Brexit.

    On the other hand Davidson did get the Unionist voters who were amongst the 30% of Scots for Brexit.

    I share the gloom of your young teacher friend. The future of Britain looks grim, negative and unappealing. If I were a recent graduate I too would emigrate.
    So little faith in your countryfolk
    As one of the many PB Leavers who have left, I am surprised that you are surprised.
    I left Zone 1... not the U.K.!

    Wanted to get out of the bubble :wink:
    Zone 1 is basically a mini United Nations of the world's super rich anyway
    It’s been fascinating to watch Argyll Road over the last 40 years

    Originally doctors and architects
    Then lawyers
    The bankers
    Then hedgies
    Now only oligarchs can afford it
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,841
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Charles said:

    Mr. Clipp, all parties are broad churches. If you only stay in a party that thinks precisely as you do, that's more of a cult.

    That said, Wollaston's a hectoring nanny state puritanical meddler. She's not exactly a splendid advert for the party herself. As a silly commentator suggested:
    https://twitter.com/HeroOfHornska/status/1003550076097134592

    Haha, very good. However, I do think we should tax all food calories - to help pay for the cost of obesity on health services. Not just sugar, all calories. It would be easy to implement since pretty much all food has to display its calories now.
    Highly regressive tax.

    Food is a larger part of poorer people’s budgets and they (in general) eat less healthily as well
    Perhaps a lobster, truffle, caviar and champagne tax then?
    Avocado tax.
    That too and add guacomale as well, after all only the likes of Mandelson could confuse it with mushy peas
    Very representative of his constituency, Hartlepool

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7p8hfaVz6E
This discussion has been closed.