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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Britain’s brittle stalemate

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  • BigRichBigRich Posts: 3,489
    WRT Labor Live, do we know how many people have turned up?

    As I understand it, about 3,000 tickets were sold at full price. from a target of 20,000. the rest seem to have been given away, but how many have actually gone?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842
    But there is barely anyone there. Journalists must be a thirsty bunch :)
  • Roger said:

    Hell, looks like a good chance the the Mackintosh may be a complete goner this time.
    Written in the heat of the moment, so hopefully over pessimistic.

    'Lost Glasgow

    Having tried, and failed, to get near the site, the latest, tragic word, comes from site fan John Pollock, who writes: "I’ve just left and the floors inside are falling and the buildings going in on itself.

    "I can guarantee that it’s the end for the building. Even the fire brigade were saying they’re not saving the building - now it’s a case of damage limitation to the surrounding buildings"

    I am weeping here...

    And, for all you amateur 'fire investigators', already claiming it's an 'insurance job'; shame on you - men and women are still risking their lives...'

    I used the Mackintosh building to create an art studio for a commercial I shot in Glasgow in about 2000. It was one of the finest and most interesting Scottish buildings I've been in. Anyone who hasn't visited has missed a treat. I was recreating something that looked like one of Degas' dancing classes and it looked almost perfect. A very sad day for Glasgow and if it was deliberately started I can only blame Brexit for creating the red mist that seems to be affecting us all.
    Have a lie down, Rog. The sun in the South of France must have got to you.
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,387
    Foxy said:

    Pulpstar said:
    It looks like it could be Jezzas #Edstone. Should have pulled the plug a few weeks back.
    Someone should have pointed out that, without the words, the Red Flag is just "O Christmas tree"...!
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,741
    edited June 2018
    Pulpstar said:

    But there is barely anyone there. Journalists must be a thirsty bunch :)
    Ian Lavery seems to have downed a very large amount, judging by his comments earlier about a Corbyn government.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,038
    Lavery says they will do it again next year.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842

    Foxy said:

    Pulpstar said:
    It looks like it could be Jezzas #Edstone. Should have pulled the plug a few weeks back.
    Someone should have pointed out that, without the words, the Red Flag is just "O Christmas tree"...!
    O Tannenbaum
    O Tannenbaum
    Wie grunst in deine blatte
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,274
    That was a top-notch penalty miss btw.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 18,891

    Roger said:

    Hell, looks like a good chance the the Mackintosh may be a complete goner this time.
    Written in the heat of the moment, so hopefully over pessimistic.

    'Lost Glasgow

    Having tried, and failed, to get near the site, the latest, tragic word, comes from site fan John Pollock, who writes: "I’ve just left and the floors inside are falling and the buildings going in on itself.

    "I can guarantee that it’s the end for the building. Even the fire brigade were saying they’re not saving the building - now it’s a case of damage limitation to the surrounding buildings"

    I am weeping here...

    And, for all you amateur 'fire investigators', already claiming it's an 'insurance job'; shame on you - men and women are still risking their lives...'

    I used the Mackintosh building to create an art studio for a commercial I shot in Glasgow in about 2000. It was one of the finest and most interesting Scottish buildings I've been in. Anyone who hasn't visited has missed a treat. I was recreating something that looked like one of Degas' dancing classes and it looked almost perfect. A very sad day for Glasgow and if it was deliberately started I can only blame Brexit for creating the red mist that seems to be affecting us all.
    Have a lie down, Rog. The sun in the South of France must have got to you.
    A grave insult particularly after I'd strongly defended Britain's finest against accusations of dereliction of duty at Grenfell Tower
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,741
    Roger said:

    Roger said:

    Hell, looks like a good chance the the Mackintosh may be a complete goner this time.
    Written in the heat of the moment, so hopefully over pessimistic.

    'Lost Glasgow

    Having tried, and failed, to get near the site, the latest, tragic word, comes from site fan John Pollock, who writes: "I’ve just left and the floors inside are falling and the buildings going in on itself.

    "I can guarantee that it’s the end for the building. Even the fire brigade were saying they’re not saving the building - now it’s a case of damage limitation to the surrounding buildings"

    I am weeping here...

    And, for all you amateur 'fire investigators', already claiming it's an 'insurance job'; shame on you - men and women are still risking their lives...'

    I used the Mackintosh building to create an art studio for a commercial I shot in Glasgow in about 2000. It was one of the finest and most interesting Scottish buildings I've been in. Anyone who hasn't visited has missed a treat. I was recreating something that looked like one of Degas' dancing classes and it looked almost perfect. A very sad day for Glasgow and if it was deliberately started I can only blame Brexit for creating the red mist that seems to be affecting us all.
    Have a lie down, Rog. The sun in the South of France must have got to you.
    A grave insult particularly after I'd strongly defended Britain's finest against accusations of dereliction of duty at Grenfell Tower
    Strange non-sequitur there.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    Tony Lennon, a retired stage manager from Shropshire, is unconcerned: “Its not about making money,”

    Hmmm....
  • Roger said:

    Roger said:

    Hell, looks like a good chance the the Mackintosh may be a complete goner this time.
    Written in the heat of the moment, so hopefully over pessimistic.

    'Lost Glasgow

    Having tried, and failed, to get near the site, the latest, tragic word, comes from site fan John Pollock, who writes: "I’ve just left and the floors inside are falling and the buildings going in on itself.

    "I can guarantee that it’s the end for the building. Even the fire brigade were saying they’re not saving the building - now it’s a case of damage limitation to the surrounding buildings"

    I am weeping here...

    And, for all you amateur 'fire investigators', already claiming it's an 'insurance job'; shame on you - men and women are still risking their lives...'

    I used the Mackintosh building to create an art studio for a commercial I shot in Glasgow in about 2000. It was one of the finest and most interesting Scottish buildings I've been in. Anyone who hasn't visited has missed a treat. I was recreating something that looked like one of Degas' dancing classes and it looked almost perfect. A very sad day for Glasgow and if it was deliberately started I can only blame Brexit for creating the red mist that seems to be affecting us all.
    Have a lie down, Rog. The sun in the South of France must have got to you.
    A grave insult particularly after I'd strongly defended Britain's finest against accusations of dereliction of duty at Grenfell Tower
    Finest are the coppers, we're the Bravest. But only if you think Chicago Fire is a documentary.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,748
    edited June 2018

    Roger said:

    Hell, looks like a good chance the the Mackintosh may be a complete goner this time.
    Written in the heat of the moment, so hopefully over pessimistic.

    'Lost Glasgow

    Having tried, and failed, to get near the site, the latest, tragic word, comes from site fan John Pollock, who writes: "I’ve just left and the floors inside are falling and the buildings going in on itself.

    "I can guarantee that it’s the end for the building. Even the fire brigade were saying they’re not saving the building - now it’s a case of damage limitation to the surrounding buildings"

    I am weeping here...

    And, for all you amateur 'fire investigators', already claiming it's an 'insurance job'; shame on you - men and women are still risking their lives...'

    I used the Mackintosh building to create an art studio for a commercial I shot in Glasgow in about 2000. It was one of the finest and most interesting Scottish buildings I've been in. Anyone who hasn't visited has missed a treat. I was recreating something that looked like one of Degas' dancing classes and it looked almost perfect. A very sad day for Glasgow and if it was deliberately started I can only blame Brexit for creating the red mist that seems to be affecting us all.
    I read something on Facebook that said "most of the salvaged & restored fixtures are off site". Hope, however small, springs eternal!
    And I am going to ask a rather difficult question: if it has been totally destroyed, should the building be rebuilt as it was (*), or should something else replace it?

    (*) With the addition of better fire-suppression systems ...
    Rebuilt I think with as much of the original material as possible, it was the most complete expression of CRM's genius. I believe it suffered slightly from being not being able to be seen as a whole because of the built up surroundings, but it was an amazing structure.

    As I mentioned previously they were already going to restore it largely as a museum, the building itself being the main exhibit; most of the teaching to be moved to other buildings. Of course you then get into the Ship of Theseus conundrum. Part of the charm of the Mackintosh was the brass polished by students' hands, the paint spattered floorboards, the wood literally soaked in the DNA of thousands of students and their teachers. Hopefully salvaged & restored fixtures would give some sense of that.

    https://twitter.com/nikkidarling/status/1007779184779898882
  • Roger said:

    Roger said:

    Hell, looks like a good chance the the Mackintosh may be a complete goner this time.
    Written in the heat of the moment, so hopefully over pessimistic.

    'Lost Glasgow

    Having tried, and failed, to get near the site, the latest, tragic word, comes from site fan John Pollock, who writes: "I’ve just left and the floors inside are falling and the buildings going in on itself.

    "I can guarantee that it’s the end for the building. Even the fire brigade were saying they’re not saving the building - now it’s a case of damage limitation to the surrounding buildings"

    I am weeping here...

    And, for all you amateur 'fire investigators', already claiming it's an 'insurance job'; shame on you - men and women are still risking their lives...'

    I used the Mackintosh building to create an art studio for a commercial I shot in Glasgow in about 2000. It was one of the finest and most interesting Scottish buildings I've been in. Anyone who hasn't visited has missed a treat. I was recreating something that looked like one of Degas' dancing classes and it looked almost perfect. A very sad day for Glasgow and if it was deliberately started I can only blame Brexit for creating the red mist that seems to be affecting us all.
    Have a lie down, Rog. The sun in the South of France must have got to you.
    A grave insult particularly after I'd strongly defended Britain's finest against accusations of dereliction of duty at Grenfell Tower
    I'd guess there will be all sorts of "lessons to be learnt", but we will only learn the ones that don't cost too much money.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Pulpstar said:

    Foxy said:

    Pulpstar said:
    It looks like it could be Jezzas #Edstone. Should have pulled the plug a few weeks back.
    Someone should have pointed out that, without the words, the Red Flag is just "O Christmas tree"...!
    O Tannenbaum
    O Tannenbaum
    Wie grunst in deine blatte
    The ice cream van sells dairy treats
    And vegan stuff for picky peeps
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    BigRich said:

    Sandpit said:

    ydoethur said:

    RobD said:

    Labour Live... embarrassing, embarrassing, embarrassing.... :D

    Probably not as embarrassing as William Hague's baseball cap even though it shows a far bigger failure of decision-making because there must have been many occasions when Labour Live could have been killed. Otoh Hague's hat featured in almost every story about him. The same with Neil Kinnock tripping at the seaside. Ain't life unfair.
    Or the Sheffield Rally. Or that pop video he made. Or the fight he was involved in.

    But this looks like a combination of the lot.
    Yes but however laughable this is, and however inept it shows Jezza's aides to be, it will not be personally embarrassing for Corbyn in the way the baseball cap was for Hague, to take one example. It's the personal link.
    Cost of baseball cap == £2 to £30 on amazon.

    Cost of Labour Live == unknown, but estimates are between £ 10^5 to 10^6.

    True, Hague looked like a wanker, trying to get down with the kidz.

    But Corbyn looks like he can't organise a piss-up, even if he's nationalised the breweries.

    Hard to say which is more damaging, but Labour Live is certainly more costly.
    Socialism Capitalism in action!
    https://twitter.com/JBickertonUK/status/1007966828851859458
    What is a Power Bank for £9?

    (The value of Barclays Bank after it has been nationalized?)
    A couple of AA batteries and a phone adaptor?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,009
    AndyJS said:

    By "humiliating", do they mean that we wont, after all, be having cake and eating it?

    I'm shocked, I tell you, shocked.
    If the EU decides to humiliate the UK for having the temerity to leave I would have thought that will only increase support for leaving with UK voters.
    It will. The EU - and their enthusiastic British kowtowers, egging them on - seem to be operating under some strange belief that making a humiliating example of the UK will bring us to heel, and grovelling back under their umbrella in time.

    They are getting it very badly wrong. The anger will not be solely directed at Theresa May, and they risk driving support for a much harder Brexit in the longer term.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,009
    Mortimer said:

    ydoethur said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    He absolutely nails May's strategy. She is going to play for time until October, fuck the RoI and then hope the other 26 tell Varadkar to bend over and take it out of fear of no deal.
    The contradictory EU concern that there isn’t a time limit for the backstop and that the backstop isn’t the end state is entirely illogical.

    The obvious solution is a time limited UK wide backstop.

    This sentence is very telling:
    ‘The concern is that a huge economy like the UK’s, sitting on the edge of the EU, but not fully bound by the rules and obligations of the single market, could significantly undercut the EU economy.’

    The idea of British divergence terrifies the EU.
    This article analyses that claim.

    Parts of it haven't aged well - prepare to laugh at the bit about the 2020 election.

    https://www.politico.eu/article/britains-singapore-threat-philip-hammond-may-brexit/
    A crash Brexit is the shortest way to divergence. If the EU had any sense they'd propose a time limited, strung out transition.

    Because it gives them what they want, gives us what we need, and makes long-term co-operation likely.
    The EU are showing next to zero interest in long-term co-operation.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,741
    Australia's hopes have been Shaun from them. They are in a Marsh. They have Paine coming next, and then it's all over.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,009
    That's fantastic.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,741
    The faithful appear to be determined to turn themselves into Trump-style fake news advocates:

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jun/16/labour-live-jezfest-london-jeremy-corbyn-scepticism
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,009
    DavidL said:

    malcolmg said:

    Sandpit said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    That quoted sentence nails the EU’s attitude. They’re shit-scared of a divergent UK being a success.
    LOL, keep imagining anyone thinks UK will be a success.
    I have been thinking seriously about offering a thread about this but for me this article was one of the most significant for the UK's future for some time: https://www.businessleader.co.uk/london-tech-week-is-here-how-does-the-uk-shape-up-when-it-comes-to-tech-investment/46358/

    The investment in IT in London is more than the 9 next European Cities put together. At this rate of growth you can see IT being a competitor with the City within 5-10 years. it will drive UK growth higher, probably higher than the EZ.

    The more depressing point, Malcolm, is that London also got more than 80% of all the investment in tech in the UK. How does Scotland share in this growth potential? How does the nascent tech companies of Edinburgh and Dundee stop talent draining south?

    I was delighted to see the SNP so clearly behind the expansion of Heathrow. We urgently need better connectivity to where the UK's growth is going to be for the foreseeable future. But we need to think about how we share this growth around a bit more.
    Whisper it, but in the very long term, I could see the UK losing most of its remaining manufacturing industry (except the really high-end stuff, and critical national security stuff) and becoming an IT/financial/professional services hub.

    Regardless of whether we're a member of the EU or not, which may simply affect the rate at which that happens, but not the trend.
  • FregglesFreggles Posts: 3,486

    AndyJS said:

    By "humiliating", do they mean that we wont, after all, be having cake and eating it?

    I'm shocked, I tell you, shocked.
    If the EU decides to humiliate the UK for having the temerity to leave I would have thought that will only increase support for leaving with UK voters.
    It will. The EU - and their enthusiastic British kowtowers, egging them on - seem to be operating under some strange belief that making a humiliating example of the UK will bring us to heel, and grovelling back under their umbrella in time.

    They are getting it very badly wrong. The anger will not be solely directed at Theresa May, and they risk driving support for a much harder Brexit in the longer term.
    I'll bet they are quaking in their boots.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 18,891

    Mortimer said:

    ydoethur said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    He absolutely nails May's strategy. She is going to play for time until October, fuck the RoI and then hope the other 26 tell Varadkar to bend over and take it out of fear of no deal.
    The contradictory EU concern that there isn’t a time limit for the backstop and that the backstop isn’t the end state is entirely illogical.

    The obvious solution is a time limited UK wide backstop.

    This sentence is very telling:
    ‘The concern is that a huge economy like the UK’s, sitting on the edge of the EU, but not fully bound by the rules and obligations of the single market, could significantly undercut the EU economy.’

    The idea of British divergence terrifies the EU.
    This article analyses that claim.

    Parts of it haven't aged well - prepare to laugh at the bit about the 2020 election.

    https://www.politico.eu/article/britains-singapore-threat-philip-hammond-may-brexit/
    A crash Brexit is the shortest way to divergence. If the EU had any sense they'd propose a time limited, strung out transition.

    Because it gives them what they want, gives us what we need, and makes long-term co-operation likely.
    The EU are showing next to zero interest in long-term co-operation.
    they have realised that they will ultimately be much more successful without British obstructionism. As a bonus they'll enjoy the schadenfreude of watching us fail
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,009

    Elliot said:

    By "humiliating", do they mean that we wont, after all, be having cake and eating it?

    I'm shocked, I tell you, shocked.
    The only way Brexit will be humiliating is if we have vassal status, and the deal is overseen by a court from just one side. I think May is smart enough to realise that would be idiotic.
    She is. But she's also unwilling to accept no deal, the other side know we won't go to no deal so therefore that's all they're willing to offer us. Between no deal and vassal she's going to take vassal.

    It's almost as if the idiots who ensured zero preparation was done for no deal have never heard of Game Theory.
    Yes, but here's the thing: even then, we'd have to be prepared to go through with no deal too if things didn't turn out the way we wanted.

    It's no good putting on a good show, even if that's better than putting on no show at all, because there's always the risk the other side will call your bluff.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709
    edited June 2018

    AndyJS said:

    By "humiliating", do they mean that we wont, after all, be having cake and eating it?

    I'm shocked, I tell you, shocked.
    If the EU decides to humiliate the UK for having the temerity to leave I would have thought that will only increase support for leaving with UK voters.
    It will. The EU - and their enthusiastic British kowtowers, egging them on - seem to be operating under some strange belief that making a humiliating example of the UK will bring us to heel, and grovelling back under their umbrella in time.

    They are getting it very badly wrong. The anger will not be solely directed at Theresa May, and they risk driving support for a much harder Brexit in the longer term.
    Plus of course the EU's two biggest export markets are the post Brexit UK and the USA, with Trump already imposing tariffs on their exports to the US do they really want to add heavy UK tariffs to that to?
  • FregglesFreggles Posts: 3,486
    If only someone could have warned us that the EU were not going to accede to a deal that would challenge the fairness of the single market and cause more countries to leave.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,057

    DavidL said:

    malcolmg said:

    Sandpit said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    That quoted sentence nails the EU’s attitude. They’re shit-scared of a divergent UK being a success.
    LOL, keep imagining anyone thinks UK will be a success.
    I have been thinking seriously about offering a thread about this but for me this article was one of the most significant for the UK's future for some time: https://www.businessleader.co.uk/london-tech-week-is-here-how-does-the-uk-shape-up-when-it-comes-to-tech-investment/46358/

    The investment in IT in London is more than the 9 next European Cities put together. At this rate of growth you can see IT being a competitor with the City within 5-10 years. it will drive UK growth higher, probably higher than the EZ.

    The more depressing point, Malcolm, is that London also got more than 80% of all the investment in tech in the UK. How does Scotland share in this growth potential? How does the nascent tech companies of Edinburgh and Dundee stop talent draining south?

    I was delighted to see the SNP so clearly behind the expansion of Heathrow. We urgently need better connectivity to where the UK's growth is going to be for the foreseeable future. But we need to think about how we share this growth around a bit more.
    Whisper it, but in the very long term, I could see the UK losing most of its remaining manufacturing industry (except the really high-end stuff, and critical national security stuff) and becoming an IT/financial/professional services hub.

    Regardless of whether we're a member of the EU or not, which may simply affect the rate at which that happens, but not the trend.
    The more urban and flexible knowledge economy of Remania will cope much better than Leaverstan with Brexit. Particularly with Javid junking the migration target, taking out students and boosting Tier 2 Visas.

    A couple of good saves by Kasper of Leicester City...
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    Pulpstar said:

    But there is barely anyone there. Journalists must be a thirsty bunch :)
    So the 3,000 people they’d thought were coming last weekend were allocated three socialist beers each, and no-one expected that 2,000 free ticket holders and however many £10 on-the-door-ers might also want a beer?

    Socialism in action!
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941
    Roger said:

    Mortimer said:

    ydoethur said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    He absolutely nails May's strategy. She is going to play for time until October, fuck the RoI and then hope the other 26 tell Varadkar to bend over and take it out of fear of no deal.
    The contradictory EU concern that there isn’t a time limit for the backstop and that the backstop isn’t the end state is entirely illogical.

    The obvious solution is a time limited UK wide backstop.

    This sentence is very telling:
    ‘The concern is that a huge economy like the UK’s, sitting on the edge of the EU, but not fully bound by the rules and obligations of the single market, could significantly undercut the EU economy.’

    The idea of British divergence terrifies the EU.
    This article analyses that claim.

    Parts of it haven't aged well - prepare to laugh at the bit about the 2020 election.

    https://www.politico.eu/article/britains-singapore-threat-philip-hammond-may-brexit/
    A crash Brexit is the shortest way to divergence. If the EU had any sense they'd propose a time limited, strung out transition.

    Because it gives them what they want, gives us what we need, and makes long-term co-operation likely.
    The EU are showing next to zero interest in long-term co-operation.
    they have realised that they will ultimately be much more successful without British obstructionism. As a bonus they'll enjoy the schadenfreude of watching us fail
    And people are saying we should stay in this organisation?
  • RogerRoger Posts: 18,891

    Tony Lennon, a retired stage manager from Shropshire, is unconcerned: “Its not about making money,”

    Hmmm....
    How many exactly would you expect to watch Len McCluskey on vocals?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    Sandpit said:

    Pulpstar said:

    But there is barely anyone there. Journalists must be a thirsty bunch :)
    So the 3,000 people they’d thought were coming last weekend were allocated three socialist beers each, and no-one expected that 2,000 free ticket holders and however many £10 on-the-door-ers might also want a beer?

    Socialism in action!
    They didn't have it in the 5 year plan...
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    Are we sure that England have qualified for next years rugby world cup in Japan ?

    Just saying .... :sunglasses:
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 47,787

    Mortimer said:

    ydoethur said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    He absolutely nails May's strategy. She is going to play for time until October, fuck the RoI and then hope the other 26 tell Varadkar to bend over and take it out of fear of no deal.
    The contradictory EU concern that there isn’t a time limit for the backstop and that the backstop isn’t the end state is entirely illogical.

    The obvious solution is a time limited UK wide backstop.

    This sentence is very telling:
    ‘The concern is that a huge economy like the UK’s, sitting on the edge of the EU, but not fully bound by the rules and obligations of the single market, could significantly undercut the EU economy.’

    The idea of British divergence terrifies the EU.
    This article analyses that claim.

    Parts of it haven't aged well - prepare to laugh at the bit about the 2020 election.

    https://www.politico.eu/article/britains-singapore-threat-philip-hammond-may-brexit/
    A crash Brexit is the shortest way to divergence. If the EU had any sense they'd propose a time limited, strung out transition.

    Because it gives them what they want, gives us what we need, and makes long-term co-operation likely.
    The EU are showing next to zero interest in long-term co-operation.
    By which you mean they show no interest in long-term cooperation with irredentist nationalism, which is completely understandable.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    The EU simply has more pressing problems right now than sorting out its long term relationship with Britain. They’re making some major mistakes in my view as a result but given the offensive stupidity Britain has displayed over the last couple of years, it’s easy to understand why.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    Roger said:

    Tony Lennon, a retired stage manager from Shropshire, is unconcerned: “Its not about making money,”

    Hmmm....
    How many exactly would you expect to watch Len McCluskey on vocals?
    Probably more than most of the musical acts they booked.
  • FregglesFreggles Posts: 3,486
    Leavers currently going through all five stages of grief at once. Something to behold.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,263
    BigRich said:

    WRT Labor Live, do we know how many people have turned up?

    As I understand it, about 3,000 tickets were sold at full price. from a target of 20,000. the rest seem to have been given away, but how many have actually gone?

    Stadium capacity is 20,000. They sold 13,000 tickets at various prices, and some will have turned up on the day, but some who bought tickets won't turn up, so overall ptobably 70-75% of capacity. Not amazing but not too bad in the end.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,393
    Sandpit said:

    ydoethur said:

    RobD said:

    Labour Live... embarrassing, embarrassing, embarrassing.... :D

    Probably not as embarrassing as William Hague's baseball cap even though it shows a far bigger failure of decision-making because there must have been many occasions when Labour Live could have been killed. Otoh Hague's hat featured in almost every story about him. The same with Neil Kinnock tripping at the seaside. Ain't life unfair.
    Or the Sheffield Rally. Or that pop video he made. Or the fight he was involved in.

    But this looks like a combination of the lot.
    Yes but however laughable this is, and however inept it shows Jezza's aides to be, it will not be personally embarrassing for Corbyn in the way the baseball cap was for Hague, to take one example. It's the personal link.
    Cost of baseball cap == £2 to £30 on amazon.

    Cost of Labour Live == unknown, but estimates are between £ 10^5 to 10^6.

    True, Hague looked like a wanker, trying to get down with the kidz.

    But Corbyn looks like he can't organise a piss-up, even if he's nationalised the breweries.

    Hard to say which is more damaging, but Labour Live is certainly more costly.
    Socialism Capitalism in action!
    https://twitter.com/JBickertonUK/status/1007966828851859458

    'FTM Lanyard ' - looks like the event has been infiltrated by Mackems!

    (F*** The Mags, for those unaware)
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941

    Sandpit said:

    ydoethur said:

    RobD said:

    Labour Live... embarrassing, embarrassing, embarrassing.... :D

    Probably not as embarrassing as William Hague's baseball cap even though it shows a far bigger failure of decision-making because there must have been many occasions when Labour Live could have been killed. Otoh Hague's hat featured in almost every story about him. The same with Neil Kinnock tripping at the seaside. Ain't life unfair.
    Or the Sheffield Rally. Or that pop video he made. Or the fight he was involved in.

    But this looks like a combination of the lot.
    Yes but however laughable this is, and however inept it shows Jezza's aides to be, it will not be personally embarrassing for Corbyn in the way the baseball cap was for Hague, to take one example. It's the personal link.
    Cost of baseball cap == £2 to £30 on amazon.

    Cost of Labour Live == unknown, but estimates are between £ 10^5 to 10^6.

    True, Hague looked like a wanker, trying to get down with the kidz.

    But Corbyn looks like he can't organise a piss-up, even if he's nationalised the breweries.

    Hard to say which is more damaging, but Labour Live is certainly more costly.
    Socialism Capitalism in action!
    https://twitter.com/JBickertonUK/status/1007966828851859458

    'FTM Lanyard ' - looks like the event has been infiltrated by Mackems!

    (F*** The Mags, for those unaware)
    Are you sure it's not F The Mogg? :p
  • rural_voterrural_voter Posts: 2,038

    DavidL said:

    malcolmg said:

    Sandpit said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    That quoted sentence nails the EU’s attitude. They’re shit-scared of a divergent UK being a success.
    LOL, keep imagining anyone thinks UK will be a success.
    I have been thinking seriously about offering a thread about this but for me this article was one of the most significant for the UK's future for some time: https://www.businessleader.co.uk/london-tech-week-is-here-how-does-the-uk-shape-up-when-it-comes-to-tech-investment/46358/

    The investment in IT in London is more than the 9 next European Cities put together. At this rate of growth you can see IT being a competitor with the City within 5-10 years. it will drive UK growth higher, probably higher than the EZ.

    The more depressing point, Malcolm, is that London also got more than 80% of all the investment in tech in the UK. How does Scotland share in this growth potential? How does the nascent tech companies of Edinburgh and Dundee stop talent draining south?

    I was delighted to see the SNP so clearly behind the expansion of Heathrow. We urgently need better connectivity to where the UK's growth is going to be for the foreseeable future. But we need to think about how we share this growth around a bit more.
    Whisper it, but in the very long term, I could see the UK losing most of its remaining manufacturing industry (except the really high-end stuff, and critical national security stuff) and becoming an IT/financial/professional services hub.

    Regardless of whether we're a member of the EU or not, which may simply affect the rate at which that happens, but not the trend.
    I'm dismayed at the UK increasingly developing into two halves, broadly N and S of the Severn-Wash line.

    North: little public investment, not getting much richer
    South: getting richer, lots of public investment and, following on, private investment.
    N.B. The line's very tilted in the far west. Dorset's just about in the South but Cornwall's the North ... very poor.

    Government investment used to be concentrated in poor regions. The 2018 policy puts most public money into London-Surrey-Berks-Oxon-Bucks (aka Remainia), where the growth already is. Elsewhere stagnates or grows only slowly. Typical of the new pro-south bias, Cross Rail goes from Berkshire to East London.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited June 2018

    BigRich said:

    WRT Labor Live, do we know how many people have turned up?

    As I understand it, about 3,000 tickets were sold at full price. from a target of 20,000. the rest seem to have been given away, but how many have actually gone?

    They sold 13,000 tickets at various prices, and some will have turned up on the day, but some who bought tickets won't turn up, so overall ptobably 70-75% of capacity. Not amazing but not too bad in the end.
    That would include all the ones they gave away, including 6 to a Mr Tony Blair etc etc etc.

    https://twitter.com/idvck/status/1007238589841903616

    https://twitter.com/idvck/status/1007282848418721794
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709
    Freggles said:

    If only someone could have warned us that the EU were not going to accede to a deal that would challenge the fairness of the single market and cause more countries to leave.

    There is no reason the EU cannot do a Free Trade deal with the UK as they have done with Canada or Mexico or South Korea for example even if the UK leaves the single market and the customs union
  • RogerRoger Posts: 18,891

    Roger said:

    Roger said:

    Hell, looks like a good chance the the Mackintosh may be a complete goner this time.
    Written in the heat of the moment, so hopefully over pessimistic.

    'Lost Glasgow

    Having tried, and failed, to get near the site, the latest, tragic word, comes from site fan John Pollock, who writes: "I’ve just left and the floors inside are falling and the buildings going in on itself.

    "I can guarantee that it’s the end for the building. Even the fire brigade were saying they’re not saving the building - now it’s a case of damage limitation to the surrounding buildings"

    I am weeping here...

    And, for all you amateur 'fire investigators', already claiming it's an 'insurance job'; shame on you - men and women are still risking their lives...'

    I used the Mackintosh building to create an art studio for a commercial I shot in Glasgow in about 2000. It was one of the finest and most interesting Scottish buildings I've been in. Anyone who hasn't visited has missed a treat. I was recreating something that looked like one of Degas' dancing classes and it looked almost perfect. A very sad day for Glasgow and if it was deliberately started I can only blame Brexit for creating the red mist that seems to be affecting us all.
    Have a lie down, Rog. The sun in the South of France must have got to you.
    A grave insult particularly after I'd strongly defended Britain's finest against accusations of dereliction of duty at Grenfell Tower
    Finest are the coppers, we're the Bravest. But only if you think Chicago Fire is a documentary.
    I defended you as the finest. I'm not sure I'd go as far as the bravest
    ydoethur said:

    Roger said:

    Roger said:

    Hell, looks like a good chance the the Mackintosh may be a complete goner this time.
    Written in the heat of the moment, so hopefully over pessimistic.

    I am weeping here...

    And, for all you amateur 'fire investigators', already claiming it's an 'insurance job'; shame on you - men and women are still risking their lives...'

    .
    Have a lie down, Rog. The sun in the South of France must have got to you.
    A grave insult particularly after I'd strongly defended Britain's finest against accusations of dereliction of duty at Grenfell Tower
    Strange non-sequitur there.
    The recently unsuccessful 'Fire Stopper' knows what I'm talking about
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    Anyone good at estimating crowd numbers?
    I reckon about 1,500 in this photo
    https://twitter.com/lewiscomptonuk/status/1008038852840382465
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941
    Sandpit said:

    Anyone good at estimating crowd numbers?
    I reckon about 1,500 in this photo
    twitter.com/lewiscomptonuk/status/1008038852840382465

    Bloody main stream media!
  • TheJezziahTheJezziah Posts: 3,840
    edited June 2018
    Anyone else cheering on Peru?

    Cueva's an entertaining player to watch
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    Sandpit said:

    Anyone good at estimating crowd numbers?
    I reckon about 1,500 in this photo
    https://twitter.com/lewiscomptonuk/status/1008038852840382465

    More than that. But nowhere near 70% capacity or whatever Nick is trying to spin,
  • Anyone else cheering on Peru?

    Cueva's an entertaining player to watch

    NO!
    I've got Denmark in the station sweep. Pays out on 1st, 3rd and last! I'm aiming for 3rd!
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    Are they not live streaming JezFest on Youtube?
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787

    Anyone else cheering on Peru?

    Cueva's an entertaining player to watch

    A certain lost bear of polite disposition ....
  • surbysurby Posts: 1,227
    edited June 2018
    HYUFD said:

    Freggles said:

    If only someone could have warned us that the EU were not going to accede to a deal that would challenge the fairness of the single market and cause more countries to leave.

    There is no reason the EU cannot do a Free Trade deal with the UK as they have done with Canada or Mexico or South Korea for example even if the UK leaves the single market and the customs union
    Do they want to ? Do they really want to reward a recent wrecker ? I was in Madrid at a meeting the whole week. Brexit is probably no even #9 in their list of priorities / problems.
  • surbysurby Posts: 1,227
    JackW said:

    Are we sure that England have qualified for next years rugby world cup in Japan ?

    Just saying .... :sunglasses:

    Normally, a qualifier has to win a few matches. Let's start with one.
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    JackW said:

    Anyone else cheering on Peru?

    Cueva's an entertaining player to watch

    A certain lost bear of polite disposition ....
    "F*ck we lost" exclaimed Paddington bear. Mrs Brown presented the bear with a marmalade sandwich and commiserated "Never mind it could be worse you might be an England rugby supporter"
    "Sod that" said Paddington bear "I had a pony on a Peru/England double .. useless bastards !!"
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 24,967

    DavidL said:

    malcolmg said:

    Sandpit said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    That quoted sentence nails the EU’s attitude. They’re shit-scared of a divergent UK being a success.
    LOL, keep imagining anyone thinks UK will be a success.
    I have been thinking seriously about offering a thread about this but for me this article was one of the most significant for the UK's future for some time: https://www.businessleader.co.uk/london-tech-week-is-here-how-does-the-uk-shape-up-when-it-comes-to-tech-investment/46358/

    The investment in IT in London is more than the 9 next European Cities put together. At this rate of growth you can see IT being a competitor with the City within 5-10 years. it will drive UK growth higher, probably higher than the EZ.

    The more depressing point, Malcolm, is that London also got more than 80% of all the investment in tech in the UK. How does Scotland share in this growth potential? How does the nascent tech companies of Edinburgh and Dundee stop talent draining south?

    I was delighted to see the SNP so clearly behind the expansion of Heathrow. We urgently need better connectivity to where the UK's growth is going to be for the foreseeable future. But we need to think about how we share this growth around a bit more.
    Whisper it, but in the very long term, I could see the UK losing most of its remaining manufacturing industry (except the really high-end stuff, and critical national security stuff) and becoming an IT/financial/professional services hub.

    Regardless of whether we're a member of the EU or not, which may simply affect the rate at which that happens, but not the trend.
    The problem with that theory is that the UK's exports of goods are higher than its exports of services and that's without taking into account the UK manufacturing which is for the UK market.

    And the UK is already a country which runs a long term and large scale trade deficit and an even longer term and larger current account deficit.

    To put some figures to that in 2017 UK exports of goods excluding oil were over £300bn while the UK trade deficit was less than £30bn.

    Now as manufacturing is about 10% of the UK economy you could make an estimate of what effect losing most of it would have to the UK's ability to pay its way in the world.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 47,787

    DavidL said:

    malcolmg said:

    Sandpit said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    That quoted sentence nails the EU’s attitude. They’re shit-scared of a divergent UK being a success.
    LOL, keep imagining anyone thinks UK will be a success.
    I have been thinking seriously about offering a thread about this but for me this article was one of the most significant for the UK's future for some time: https://www.businessleader.co.uk/london-tech-week-is-here-how-does-the-uk-shape-up-when-it-comes-to-tech-investment/46358/

    The investment in IT in London is more than the 9 next European Cities put together. At this rate of growth you can see IT being a competitor with the City within 5-10 years. it will drive UK growth higher, probably higher than the EZ.

    The more depressing point, Malcolm, is that London also got more than 80% of all the investment in tech in the UK. How does Scotland share in this growth potential? How does the nascent tech companies of Edinburgh and Dundee stop talent draining south?

    I was delighted to see the SNP so clearly behind the expansion of Heathrow. We urgently need better connectivity to where the UK's growth is going to be for the foreseeable future. But we need to think about how we share this growth around a bit more.
    Whisper it, but in the very long term, I could see the UK losing most of its remaining manufacturing industry (except the really high-end stuff, and critical national security stuff) and becoming an IT/financial/professional services hub.

    Regardless of whether we're a member of the EU or not, which may simply affect the rate at which that happens, but not the trend.
    Government investment used to be concentrated in poor regions. The 2018 policy puts most public money into London-Surrey-Berks-Oxon-Bucks (aka Remainia), where the growth already is. Elsewhere stagnates or grows only slowly. Typical of the new pro-south bias, Cross Rail goes from Berkshire to East London.
    The characterisation of the Home Counties as Remainia is wide of the mark. Without Brexit voters in those areas Remain would have won.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709
    edited June 2018
    surby said:

    HYUFD said:

    Freggles said:

    If only someone could have warned us that the EU were not going to accede to a deal that would challenge the fairness of the single market and cause more countries to leave.

    There is no reason the EU cannot do a Free Trade deal with the UK as they have done with Canada or Mexico or South Korea for example even if the UK leaves the single market and the customs union
    Do they want to ? Do they really want to reward a recent wrecker ? I was in Madrid at a meeting the whole week. Brexit is probably no even #9 in their list of priorities / problems.
    As I have stated the EU's current biggest export destination is the USA and Trump has just imposed heavy tariffs on EU imports in the US, post Brexit the EU's biggest export destination will then be the UK and if the EU refuse to do a free trade deal with the UK and want heavy tariffs on EU imports to the UK too just to prove a point then that is up to them!

    In any case, their biggest problem is probably migration currently, which was a key reason for the Brexit vote anyway, followed by trying to balance the needs of the German and southern European economies in the Eurozone, something we sensibly stayed out of
  • TheJezziahTheJezziah Posts: 3,840

    Anyone else cheering on Peru?

    Cueva's an entertaining player to watch

    NO!
    I've got Denmark in the station sweep. Pays out on 1st, 3rd and last! I'm aiming for 3rd!
    Spoil sport!

    This is part of the reason I don't like betting or playing fantasy football affects my ability to enjoy the match.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    Convicts are 4.7 to make 90 runs from 9 overs with 5 wkts in hand.
  • AnazinaAnazina Posts: 3,487
    Another dismal capitulation by the England rugby team.

    Jones’ days ought to be numbered. There is no passion or zip in this side.

    We look demoralised.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 24,967
    Anazina said:

    Another dismal capitulation by the England rugby team.

    Jones’ days ought to be numbered. There is no passion or zip in this side.

    We look demoralised.

    It would be interesting to know how often teams which have leads of 10+ points go on to lose.

    Whatever it is its certainly not a trait of teams which win tournaments.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Sandpit said:

    Convicts are 4.7 to make 90 runs from 9 overs with 5 wkts in hand.

    4 wickets.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709
    Anazina said:

    Another dismal capitulation by the England rugby team.

    Jones’ days ought to be numbered. There is no passion or zip in this side.

    We look demoralised.

    On current form the England soccer team looks better than the England rugby team but we shall see how the next few weeks pan out
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614

    Sandpit said:

    Convicts are 4.7 to make 90 runs from 9 overs with 5 wkts in hand.

    4 wickets.
    They’re conspiring to lose me money!
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited June 2018
    JackW said:

    JackW said:

    Anyone else cheering on Peru?

    Cueva's an entertaining player to watch

    A certain lost bear of polite disposition ....
    "F*ck we lost" exclaimed Paddington bear. Mrs Brown presented the bear with a marmalade sandwich and commiserated "Never mind it could be worse you might be an England rugby supporter"
    "Sod that" said Paddington bear "I had a pony on a Peru/England double .. useless bastards !!"
    While another bear has been spotted at Labour Live,

    image
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,263

    Sandpit said:

    Anyone good at estimating crowd numbers?
    I reckon about 1,500 in this photo
    https://twitter.com/lewiscomptonuk/status/1008038852840382465

    More than that. But nowhere near 70% capacity or whatever Nick is trying to spin,
    Well, I'm not there, so what do I know? But the Guardian report has it at 13K sold and 20K capacity. I gather the site is more than the field and a lot of people there are more interested in perusing books etc rather than listening to the music.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,274
    HYUFD said:

    Anazina said:

    Another dismal capitulation by the England rugby team.

    Jones’ days ought to be numbered. There is no passion or zip in this side.

    We look demoralised.

    On current form the England soccer team looks better than the England rugby team but we shall see how the next few weeks pan out
    Blimey, now you've put the mockers on the the footie :disappointed:
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 48,916

    DavidL said:

    malcolmg said:

    Sandpit said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    That quoted sentence nails the EU’s attitude. They’re shit-scared of a divergent UK being a success.
    LOL, keep imagining anyone thinks UK will be a success.
    I have been thinking seriously about offering a thread about this but for me this article was one of the most significant for the UK's future for some time: https://www.businessleader.co.uk/london-tech-week-is-here-how-does-the-uk-shape-up-when-it-comes-to-tech-investment/46358/

    The investment in IT in London is more than the 9 next European Cities put together. At this rate of growth you can see IT being a competitor with the City within 5-10 years. it will drive UK growth higher, probably higher than the EZ.

    The more depressing point, Malcolm, is that London also got more than 80% of all the investment in tech in the UK. How does Scotland share in this growth potential? How does the nascent tech companies of Edinburgh and Dundee stop talent draining south?

    I was delighted to see the SNP so clearly behind the expansion of Heathrow. We urgently need better connectivity to where the UK's growth is going to be for the foreseeable future. But we need to think about how we share this growth around a bit more.
    Whisper it, but in the very long term, I could see the UK losing most of its remaining manufacturing industry (except the really high-end stuff, and critical national security stuff) and becoming an IT/financial/professional services hub.

    Regardless of whether we're a member of the EU or not, which may simply affect the rate at which that happens, but not the trend.
    I'm dismayed at the UK increasingly developing into two halves, broadly N and S of the Severn-Wash line.

    North: little public investment, not getting much richer
    South: getting richer, lots of public investment and, following on, private investment.
    N.B. The line's very tilted in the far west. Dorset's just about in the South but Cornwall's the North ... very poor.

    Government investment used to be concentrated in poor regions. The 2018 policy puts most public money into London-Surrey-Berks-Oxon-Bucks (aka Remainia), where the growth already is. Elsewhere stagnates or grows only slowly. Typical of the new pro-south bias, Cross Rail goes from Berkshire to East London.
    No, Remainia is Scotland plus the Nationalist bits of NI
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited June 2018

    Sandpit said:

    Anyone good at estimating crowd numbers?
    I reckon about 1,500 in this photo
    https://twitter.com/lewiscomptonuk/status/1008038852840382465

    More than that. But nowhere near 70% capacity or whatever Nick is trying to spin,
    Well, I'm not there, so what do I know? But the Guardian report has it at 13K sold and 20K capacity. I gather the site is more than the field and a lot of people there are more interested in perusing books etc rather than listening to the music.
    Do you have a doctor issued sick note? Names will be taken.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    The EU simply has more pressing problems right now than sorting out its long term relationship with Britain.

    Well indeed, same during Cameron's renegotiation. That's why we're leaving, they've not prioritised dealing with out interests in about 30 years.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842
    I had a strong feeling Hammond would be the next chancellor after Osborne. I have the same feeling about Javid becoming the next Tory leader and probably PM.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 24,967
    Sandpit said:

    Convicts are 4.7 to make 90 runs from 9 overs with 5 wkts in hand.

    They're criminals but not convicts.

    Unless it was all the idea of three batsmen and nobody else knew anything about anything.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 48,916
    Anazina said:

    Another dismal capitulation by the England rugby team.

    Jones’ days ought to be numbered. There is no passion or zip in this side.

    We look demoralised.

    REAL football is played with the feet :)
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,723
    edited June 2018
    Australia
    Stake: £20.00 / Pot. Payout: £250.00

    Cashed out £107
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,392
    Anazina said:

    Another dismal capitulation by the England rugby team.

    Jones’ days ought to be numbered. There is no passion or zip in this side.

    We look demoralised.

    It's odd - they looked unbeatable under him for almost a year.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340

    The EU simply has more pressing problems right now than sorting out its long term relationship with Britain.

    Well indeed, same during Cameron's renegotiation. That's why we're leaving, they've not prioritised dealing with out interests in about 30 years.
    The usual unhinged nonsense from Leavers. Britain had far more influence and was far more interesting to the EU when it was a long term member. Now it’s just a neighbour to be handled from time to time.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709

    DavidL said:

    malcolmg said:

    Sandpit said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    That quoted sentence nails the EU’s attitude. They’re shit-scared of a divergent UK being a success.
    LOL, keep imagining anyone thinks UK will be a success.
    I have been thinking seriously about offering a thread about this but for me this article was one of the most significant for the UK's future for some time: https://www.businessleader.co.uk/london-tech-week-is-here-how-does-the-uk-shape-up-when-it-comes-to-tech-investment/46358/

    The investment in IT in London is more than the 9 next European Cities put together. At this rate of growth you can see IT being a competitor with the City within 5-10 years. it will drive UK growth higher, probably higher than the EZ.

    The more depressing point, Malcolm, is that London also got more than 80% of all the investment in tech in the UK. How does Scotland share in this growth potential? How does the nascent tech companies of Edinburgh and Dundee stop talent draining south?

    I was delighted to see the SNP so clearly behind the expansion of Heathrow. We urgently need better connectivity to where the UK's growth is going to be for the foreseeable future. But we need to think about how we share this growth around a bit more.
    Whisper it, but in the very long term, I could see the UK losing most of its remaining manufacturing industry (except the really high-end stuff, and critical national security stuff) and becoming an IT/financial/professional services hub.

    Regardless of whether we're a member of the EU or not, which may simply affect the rate at which that happens, but not the trend.
    I'm dismayed at the UK increasingly developing into two halves, broadly N and S of the Severn-Wash line.

    North: little public investment, not getting much richer
    South: getting richer, lots of public investment and, following on, private investment.
    N.B. The line's very tilted in the far west. Dorset's just about in the South but Cornwall's the North ... very poor.

    Government investment used to be concentrated in poor regions. The 2018 policy puts most public money into London-Surrey-Berks-Oxon-Bucks (aka Remainia), where the growth already is. Elsewhere stagnates or grows only slowly. Typical of the new pro-south bias, Cross Rail goes from Berkshire to East London.
    No, Remainia is Scotland plus the Nationalist bits of NI
    Plus London
  • ralphmalphralphmalph Posts: 2,201
    Pulpstar said:

    I had a strong feeling Hammond would be the next chancellor after Osborne. I have the same feeling about Javid becoming the next Tory leader and probably PM.

    IMO any candidate in the last 2 that actively campaigned for leave would beat him with the members vote. The real question that I admit I can not answer is who does JRM thenk should be the next PM. With 120 odd ERG votes that candidate will make the last 2 and JRM will let the members know they have his support. I am also thinking of putting money on JRM as next CoE.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614

    Australia
    Stake: £20.00 / Pot. Payout: £250.00

    Cashed out £107

    Good shout!
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,392
    edited June 2018
    Good debate as ever in reply on twitter

    People have had a vote numpties.

    Jo Richards

    Two years ago.
    People have changed their minds.
    #StopBrexit

    BenBeasant

    So Corbyn is elected at next general election are you happy to have another 1 two years later just in case people change their mind?


    (In fairness it isn't actually any worse than debate anywhere else)
  • murali_smurali_s Posts: 3,037

    DavidL said:

    malcolmg said:

    Sandpit said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    That quoted sentence nails the EU’s attitude. They’re shit-scared of a divergent UK being a success.
    LOL, keep imagining anyone thinks UK will be a success.
    I have been thinking seriously about offering a thread about this but for me this article was one of the most significant for the UK's future for some time: https://www.businessleader.co.uk/london-tech-week-is-here-how-does-the-uk-shape-up-when-it-comes-to-tech-investment/46358/

    The investment in IT in London is more than the 9 next European Cities put together. At this rate of growth you can see IT being a competitor with the City within 5-10 years. it will drive UK growth higher, probably higher than the EZ.

    The more depressing point, Malcolm, is that London also got more than 80% of all the investment in tech in the UK. How does Scotland share in this growth potential? How does the nascent tech companies of Edinburgh and Dundee stop talent draining south?

    I was delighted to see the SNP so clearly behind the expansion of Heathrow. We urgently need better connectivity to where the UK's growth is going to be for the foreseeable future. But we need to think about how we share this growth around a bit more.
    Whisper it, but in the very long term, I could see the UK losing most of its remaining manufacturing industry (except the really high-end stuff, and critical national security stuff) and becoming an IT/financial/professional services hub.

    Regardless of whether we're a member of the EU or not, which may simply affect the rate at which that happens, but not the trend.
    I'm dismayed at the UK increasingly developing into two halves, broadly N and S of the Severn-Wash line.

    North: little public investment, not getting much richer
    South: getting richer, lots of public investment and, following on, private investment.
    N.B. The line's very tilted in the far west. Dorset's just about in the South but Cornwall's the North ... very poor.

    Government investment used to be concentrated in poor regions. The 2018 policy puts most public money into London-Surrey-Berks-Oxon-Bucks (aka Remainia), where the growth already is. Elsewhere stagnates or grows only slowly. Typical of the new pro-south bias, Cross Rail goes from Berkshire to East London.
    No, Remainia is Scotland plus the Nationalist bits of NI
    London overwhelmingly voted Remain. We are in general smart, sophisticated, liberal and not one of the below:
    - xenophobic
    - thick
    - Little Englander
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842

    Pulpstar said:

    I had a strong feeling Hammond would be the next chancellor after Osborne. I have the same feeling about Javid becoming the next Tory leader and probably PM.

    IMO any candidate in the last 2 that actively campaigned for leave would beat him with the members vote. The real question that I admit I can not answer is who does JRM thenk should be the next PM. With 120 odd ERG votes that candidate will make the last 2 and JRM will let the members know they have his support. I am also thinking of putting money on JRM as next CoE.
    Nah He clearly believes in Brexit now, plus he is constantly pushing newsworthy items. The cannabis for that poor kid looks the mark of a potential leader to me
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941
    murali_s said:



    London overwhelmingly voted Remain. We are in general smart, sophisticated, liberal and not one of the below:
    - xenophobic
    - thick
    - Little Englander

    I think you are mistaken. Those are PB Tory membership criteria.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,274

    Pulpstar said:

    I had a strong feeling Hammond would be the next chancellor after Osborne. I have the same feeling about Javid becoming the next Tory leader and probably PM.

    IMO any candidate in the last 2 that actively campaigned for leave would beat him with the members vote. The real question that I admit I can not answer is who does JRM thenk should be the next PM. With 120 odd ERG votes that candidate will make the last 2 and JRM will let the members know they have his support. I am also thinking of putting money on JRM as next CoE.
    What? 120 MPs will just vote for a new leader as JRM tells them to? I thought there were only 60-70 in the ERG and even they surely don't just do what JRM tells them.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I had a strong feeling Hammond would be the next chancellor after Osborne. I have the same feeling about Javid becoming the next Tory leader and probably PM.

    IMO any candidate in the last 2 that actively campaigned for leave would beat him with the members vote. The real question that I admit I can not answer is who does JRM thenk should be the next PM. With 120 odd ERG votes that candidate will make the last 2 and JRM will let the members know they have his support. I am also thinking of putting money on JRM as next CoE.
    Nah He clearly believes in Brexit now, plus he is constantly pushing newsworthy items. The cannabis for that poor kid looks the mark of a potential leader to me
    I wonder if Labour will go with legalizing cannabis (in some form) at the next GE?
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I had a strong feeling Hammond would be the next chancellor after Osborne. I have the same feeling about Javid becoming the next Tory leader and probably PM.

    IMO any candidate in the last 2 that actively campaigned for leave would beat him with the members vote. The real question that I admit I can not answer is who does JRM thenk should be the next PM. With 120 odd ERG votes that candidate will make the last 2 and JRM will let the members know they have his support. I am also thinking of putting money on JRM as next CoE.
    Nah He clearly believes in Brexit now, plus he is constantly pushing newsworthy items. The cannabis for that poor kid looks the mark of a potential leader to me
    Depressing times that someone making a sensible decision makes them a potential leader.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709

    HYUFD said:

    Anazina said:

    Another dismal capitulation by the England rugby team.

    Jones’ days ought to be numbered. There is no passion or zip in this side.

    We look demoralised.

    On current form the England soccer team looks better than the England rugby team but we shall see how the next few weeks pan out
    Blimey, now you've put the mockers on the the footie :disappointed:
    The England rugby team came 5th in this year's 6 nations and failed to even make the quarter finals at the 2015 rugby world cup despite it being at home.

    The England soccer team topped their world cup qualification group and have beaten Costa Rica, Nigeria and the Netherlands and drawn with Italy so far this year.


    Of course we will see what happens in the tournament but to me the soccer team looks far better than many of their overhyped predecessors while the rugby team is a pale shadow of the 2003 world cup winners
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,392
    edited June 2018
    Sandpit said:

    Anyone good at estimating crowd numbers?
    I reckon about 1,500 in this photo
    https://twitter.com/lewiscomptonuk/status/1008038852840382465

    It's enough of a crowd to make for a good photo, but my gods the whinge in that tweet is pathetic. Were they wanting or expecting the mainstream media to care about a political party holding a music event? Political events are only interesting if they are a disaster, or can be said to be racist or sexist in some way, and thus controversial.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 48,916
    RobD said:

    murali_s said:



    London overwhelmingly voted Remain. We are in general smart, sophisticated, liberal and not one of the below:
    - xenophobic
    - thick
    - Little Englander

    I think you are mistaken. Those are PB Tory membership criteria.
    Even I voted Leave and I've got a PhD :p
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 30,846

    Sandpit said:

    Anyone good at estimating crowd numbers?
    I reckon about 1,500 in this photo
    https://twitter.com/lewiscomptonuk/status/1008038852840382465

    More than that. But nowhere near 70% capacity or whatever Nick is trying to spin,
    Well, I'm not there, so what do I know? But the Guardian report has it at 13K sold and 20K capacity. I gather the site is more than the field and a lot of people there are more interested in perusing books etc rather than listening to the music.
    Sky News said that many of those 13,000 sold were bought en masse by the Unite Union to boost sales. The reporter estimates there are around 5,000 at the event. So less than half of those tickets sold and a quarter of the venue capacity.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited June 2018

    Sandpit said:

    Anyone good at estimating crowd numbers?
    I reckon about 1,500 in this photo
    https://twitter.com/lewiscomptonuk/status/1008038852840382465

    More than that. But nowhere near 70% capacity or whatever Nick is trying to spin,
    Well, I'm not there, so what do I know? But the Guardian report has it at 13K sold and 20K capacity. I gather the site is more than the field and a lot of people there are more interested in perusing books etc rather than listening to the music.
    Sky News said that many of those 13,000 sold were bought en masse by the Unite Union to boost sales. The reporter estimates there are around 5,000 at the event. So less than half of those tickets sold and a quarter of the venue capacity.
    4-5k looks about right for the number of cult members on show in that photo.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    RobD said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I had a strong feeling Hammond would be the next chancellor after Osborne. I have the same feeling about Javid becoming the next Tory leader and probably PM.

    IMO any candidate in the last 2 that actively campaigned for leave would beat him with the members vote. The real question that I admit I can not answer is who does JRM thenk should be the next PM. With 120 odd ERG votes that candidate will make the last 2 and JRM will let the members know they have his support. I am also thinking of putting money on JRM as next CoE.
    Nah He clearly believes in Brexit now, plus he is constantly pushing newsworthy items. The cannabis for that poor kid looks the mark of a potential leader to me
    Depressing times that someone making a sensible decision makes them a potential leader.
    But compared to what we have now it does.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709
    murali_s said:

    DavidL said:

    malcolmg said:

    Sandpit said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    That quoted sentence nails the EU’s attitude. They’re shit-scared of a divergent UK being a success.
    LOL, keep imagining anyone thinks UK will be a success.
    I have been thinking seriously about offering a thread about this but for me this article was one of the most significant for the UK's future for some time: https://www.businessleader.co.uk/london-tech-week-is-here-how-does-the-uk-shape-up-when-it-comes-to-tech-investment/46358/

    The investment in IT in London is more than the 9 next European Cities put together. At this rate of growth you can see IT being a competitor with the City within 5-10 years. it will drive UK growth higher, probably higher than the EZ.

    The more depressing point, Malcolm, is that London also got more than 80% of all the investment in tech in the UK. How does Scotland share in this growth potential? How does the nascent tech companies of Edinburgh and Dundee stop talent draining south?

    I was delighted to see the SNP so clearly behind the expansion of Heathrow. We urgently need better connectivity to where the UK's growth is going to be for the foreseeable future. But we need to think about how we share this growth around a bit more.
    Whisper it, but in the very long term, I could see the UK losing most of its remaining manufacturing industry (except the really high-end stuff, and critical national security stuff) and becoming an IT/financial/professional services hub.

    Regardless of whether we're a member of the EU or not, which may simply affect the rate at which that happens, but not the trend.
    I'm dismayed ament used to be concentrated in poor regions. The 2018 policy puts most public money into London-Surrey-Berks-Oxon-Bucks (aka Remainia), where the growth already is. Elsewhere stagnates or grows only slowly. Typical of the new pro-south bias, Cross Rail goes from Berkshire to East London.
    No, Remainia is Scotland plus the Nationalist bits of NI
    London overwhelmingly voted Remain. We are in general smart, sophisticated, liberal and not one of the below:
    - xenophobic
    - thick
    - Little Englander
    Presume you have never been to Bexley, Barking or Havering then? Though I prefer patriotic and no nonsense rather than xenophobic and thick
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,392

    Sandpit said:

    Anyone good at estimating crowd numbers?
    I reckon about 1,500 in this photo
    https://twitter.com/lewiscomptonuk/status/1008038852840382465

    More than that. But nowhere near 70% capacity or whatever Nick is trying to spin,
    Well, I'm not there, so what do I know? But the Guardian report has it at 13K sold and 20K capacity. I gather the site is more than the field and a lot of people there are more interested in perusing books etc rather than listening to the music.
    Sky News said that many of those 13,000 sold were bought en masse by the Unite Union to boost sales. The reporter estimates there are around 5,000 at the event. So less than half of those tickets sold and a quarter of the venue capacity.
    Sounds a bit meh then - they overestimated the heights they could reach (something which they could advertise as being 'sold out' would probably make for a good story) but it's a good many thousands, hardly a disaster from a PR point I'd have thought.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    The EU simply has more pressing problems right now than sorting out its long term relationship with Britain.

    Well indeed, same during Cameron's renegotiation. That's why we're leaving, they've not prioritised dealing with out interests in about 30 years.
    The usual unhinged nonsense from Leavers. Britain had far more influence and was far more interesting to the EU when it was a long term member. Now it’s just a neighbour to be handled from time to time.
    It had so much influence that Cameron couldn't get a single meaningful reform and was interesting in the sense that we paid hundreds of millions net per week to fund their project.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941
    Fake news. Nobody said nobody turned up....
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited June 2018

    twitter.com/ToryFibs/status/1008037611968122880

    Coming from Dr Bullshit...the man who has had to apologize more times than I have had hot dinners for lying.

    That crowd looks like a good turn out...compared to my local village fete. We will probably get a few more though.
This discussion has been closed.