He succeeded in delivering Brexit, for good or ill, and just won a thumping 80-seat majority after 9 years of Conservative government.
I'm all for kicking the tories but not when it's rather misplaced.
It is likely that in future times, “delivering Brexit” will be seen in the same light as “delivering Suez”.
And the 80-seat majority will be of interest only to psephologists.
It is of course too early to place Boris in the PM rankings.
What does seem clear is that he is the most callow PM of the modern age. You have to go back before living memory I assume to find someone with his general lack of fitness for office.
I've not been following the site today. Am I reading right now that the story is that Cummings has made multiple trips?
If so he should go.
I was willing yesterday to give the benefit of the doubt if it was for the welfare of a three year old. As a father of a three year old myself their safety must always come first.
However multiple trips without reasonable reasons is simply inexcusable if true.
I hope that's clear enough.
Looks like two. The first one we discussed yesterday, and one one at Easter to Barnard Castle that has not been denied - a witness is also on the record as having seen him there. Another allegation, of a trip on the 14th April, has been denied. I think we can assume that the 14/4 trip didn’t happen given the express denial, but there is strong evidence for the 31/3 (obviously) and the Easter trips (no denial, witness on the record) happening.
1. If my wife caught this I would consider myself absolutely nailed on to get it. We do not maintain social distancing, not even in lockdown. Sometimes we get very close indeed. Spreading in families is, unsurprisingly, the most common method of transmission. Of course he considered, correctly, that there was a high probability that he would get it too.
2. Pure speculation. Are you seriously saying that the guidance should not have provided for exceptional steps being taken by a parent charged with looking after a child? I mean, really?
3. Just maybe Boris had other things to worry about. Like being ill, having a child, running the country, trying to give some sort of direction to a fairly aimless Cabinet, that sort of thing.
4. Cummings has not provided any of the guidance or moralising to the public. He will not do so in the future either. And, subject to a possible second wave, most of this is going to be relaxation measures anyway. It's not great but this is being massively oversold.
Don't get me wrong. I really don't like the one rule for them and one for us aspect of this. I don't much care for the arrogance. If he has lied or had others lie on his behalf he should probably go. But this is a twitter storm at its maddest right now. Boris has to weigh up his utility in delivering the program he wants to deliver notwithstanding the virus against the embarrassment. He should do so coolly.
I shall now return to not commenting on this.
Good to see that you're avoiding the complete omerta of your fellow Scottish Tories, if only by a smidgeon. Silence is golden, what a shower.
Carlaw is emulating Boris with his disappearing act, he must have a right redneck to match his red face after his constant self righteous whinging about Calderwood
I've not been following the site today. Am I reading right now that the story is that Cummings has made multiple trips?
If so he should go.
I was willing yesterday to give the benefit of the doubt if it was for the welfare of a three year old. As a father of a three year old myself their safety must always come first.
However multiple trips without reasonable reasons is simply inexcusable if true.
I hope that's clear enough.
I dont think we are sure about multiple trips TBH.
A 2nd to Durham is being denied,
It does appear an Easter Sunday trip to Barnard Castle when we were told to stay at home for Easter happened though
I'm confused. Easter Sunday from memory was during lockdown wasn't it? So that would be two trips?
If the Easter Sunday trip was during lockdown and without a good reason then he should go. Just as he should have for the Durham trip if it was without good reason.
If all trips have a good reason (eg if he was giving essential supplies to someone shielding that's a good reason) or weren't during the lockdown he can stay. If he broke the rules without a good reason be should go. I think that's fair.
1. If my wife caught this I would consider myself absolutely nailed on to get it. We do not maintain social distancing, not even in lockdown. Sometimes we get very close indeed. Spreading in families is, unsurprisingly, the most common method of transmission. Of course he considered, correctly, that there was a high probability that he would get it too.
2. Pure speculation. Are you seriously saying that the guidance should not have provided for exceptional steps being taken by a parent charged with looking after a child? I mean, really?
3. Just maybe Boris had other things to worry about. Like being ill, having a child, running the country, trying to give some sort of direction to a fairly aimless Cabinet, that sort of thing.
4. Cummings has not provided any of the guidance or moralising to the public. He will not do so in the future either. And, subject to a possible second wave, most of this is going to be relaxation measures anyway. It's not great but this is being massively oversold.
Don't get me wrong. I really don't like the one rule for them and one for us aspect of this. I don't much care for the arrogance. If he has lied or had others lie on his behalf he should probably go. But this is a twitter storm at its maddest right now. Boris has to weigh up his utility in delivering the program he wants to deliver notwithstanding the virus against the embarrassment. He should do so coolly.
I shall now return to not commenting on this.
Good to see that you're avoiding the complete omerta of your fellow Scottish Tories, if only by a smidgeon. Silence is golden, what a shower.
Best not to use the words "golden" and "shower" in such close proximity to each other, or at least not at lunchtime.
Starsports have cut Boris further to 4/1 to front this afternoon's briefing.
Dominic Raab 7/2 Grant Shapps 7/2 Boris Johnson 4/1 Robert Jenrick 5/1 Alok Sharma 11/2 George Eustice 8/1 Michael Gove 8/1 Gavin Williamson 12/1 Oliver Dowden 12/1 Amanda Milling 14/1 Matthew Hancock 16/1 Priti Patel 16/1 Rishi Sunak 40/1
I can't see it being Jenrick who also faced questions about driving round Britain in search of a bed for the night. Gove might be seen as too close to Cummings. Sunak would be a good choice but his enormous price suggests the odds compilers know him not to be in London.
How wise of him!
Sunak also potentially has enough political capital in the bank to tell Johnson to *** off if he thinks he's accepting that commission.
Sunak made a mistake in tweeting in support of Cummings as he did yesterday. He did not need to and he will need all his political capital in the weeks ahead.
Sunak will survive that - he tweeted what everyone was asked to tweet. If Cummings is forced out, he can always say "new information came to light... Dominic hadn't been straight with us and I feel terribly let down, as do we all".
Johnson's position is more difficult in that there is certainly a risk that Cummings HAS told him the full story. That's the impression the defence is giving (i.e. if Johnson didn;t know, they just should've said "Dominic made a dreadful mistake but the PM has given him a dressing down and forgiven him". It's incredibly dangerous if Johnson knew.
Not all Cabinet Ministers tweeted their support. Notably Priti Patel stayed quiet. She has a certain low cunning I suspect. Or maybe less of a tin ear for the public mood.
I've not been following the site today. Am I reading right now that the story is that Cummings has made multiple trips?
If so he should go.
I was willing yesterday to give the benefit of the doubt if it was for the welfare of a three year old. As a father of a three year old myself their safety must always come first.
However multiple trips without reasonable reasons is simply inexcusable if true.
I hope that's clear enough.
I dont think we are sure about multiple trips TBH.
A 2nd to Durham is being denied,
It does appear an Easter Sunday trip to Barnard Castle when we were told to stay at home for Easter happened though
I'm confused. Easter Sunday from memory was during lockdown wasn't it? So that would be two trips?
If the Easter Sunday trip was during lockdown and without a good reason then he should go. Just as he should have for the Durham trip if it was without good reason.
If all trips have a good reason (eg if he was giving essential supplies to someone shielding that's a good reason) or weren't during the lockdown he can stay. If he broke the rules without a good reason be should go. I think that's fair.
Shapps deliberately confused self-isolation and lockdown, claiming that Cummings had had the necessary 14 day self-isolation, in Durham, by Easter Sunday.
“every person who has ached with loneliness missing loved ones has been told that those at the highest levels of government are swanning around without a care in the world. Many of them are now in a cold fury.”
Are they going to try an apology! That will be sincere.....
I have been thinking that they might. But I am not sure Cummings has the vocabulary and it will have to be taught.
First draft:
Look, Im really sorry I got caught, now will you lot bugger off, whoever you are, Ive got far more important things to do and missing my weekly trip to the NE for this.
way, way too late for an apology. Might have worked on Friday, but then the additional trips would have come out.
An apology would have been the right move if he knew there were additional trips that could come out. If additional trips come out after an apology has been issued it blends into one issue and you can simply say "I've already apologised and am being more careful now" or something along those lines. The apology for one essentially covers the others.
Trying to make an excuse for one if there's another is silly because then they all need justification.
On 15th June, I will be made redundant from the job I still enjoy after 25 years of service. Redundancy notices are to be issued to 43,000 of my colleagues: the entire workforce. Yes, you read correctly! 31,000 "lucky" former employees will then be offered re-employement on a far inferior contract that the company has wanted to enforce since 2010. For me, this would represent a 50% pay cut.
This is to be accompanied by an increase in productivity of 25%, not to mention far inferior T&Cs and, basically, a zero-hours contract.
All of this is with a backdrop of our CEO's bonus of £3.2 million in March this year; he’s been paid £33 million over the last 9 years. For the financial year '19/'20, the company I work for made a near record-breaking operating profit of £1.9 billion. I received no bonus; not a penny.
The company I work for has the biggest cash reserves of any airline on this planet: £9 billion. During this "fight for survival", the company I work for is in the process of spending £1billion buying another airline, Air Europa. All this whilst taking cash handouts from both the UK & Spanish governments & the UK taxpayer paying 80% of the current wage bill....
Nobody is saying we shouldn't all do our bit and take a shared responsibility approach as we ride this storm. However the company I currently work for absolutely refuses to negotiate. #BAbetrayal
He succeeded in delivering Brexit, for good or ill, and just won a thumping 80-seat majority after 9 years of Conservative government.
I'm all for kicking the tories but not when it's rather misplaced.
It is likely that in future times, “delivering Brexit” will be seen in the same light as “delivering Suez”.
And the 80-seat majority will be of interest only to psephologists.
It is of course too early to place Boris in the PM rankings.
What does seem clear is that he is the most callow PM of the modern age. You have to go back before living memory I assume to find someone with his general lack of fitness for office.
Many people that voted for Boris as leader and PM were aware that he was not up to the job but they decided that it didn't matter as long as Brexit was delivered. Now we are paying the price.
I've not been following the site today. Am I reading right now that the story is that Cummings has made multiple trips?
If so he should go.
I was willing yesterday to give the benefit of the doubt if it was for the welfare of a three year old. As a father of a three year old myself their safety must always come first.
However multiple trips without reasonable reasons is simply inexcusable if true.
I hope that's clear enough.
I dont think we are sure about multiple trips TBH.
A 2nd to Durham is being denied,
It does appear an Easter Sunday trip to Barnard Castle when we were told to stay at home for Easter happened though
I'm confused. Easter Sunday from memory was during lockdown wasn't it? So that would be two trips?
If the Easter Sunday trip was during lockdown and without a good reason then he should go. Just as he should have for the Durham trip if it was without good reason.
If all trips have a good reason (eg if he was giving essential supplies to someone shielding that's a good reason) or weren't during the lockdown he can stay. If he broke the rules without a good reason be should go. I think that's fair.
Shapps deliberately confused self-isolation and lockdown, claiming that Cummings had had the necessary 14 day self-isolation, in Durham, by Easter Sunday.
Odd to say 14 days. It should have been 7, shouldn't it?
There are all sorts of comments - including a few here this morning - that make it clear that Cummings runs the country. He turns up at SAGE meetings, he appointed the Chancellor and fired the previous one, he tells Boris (the front man) what to do, he decides who can have which SPADs.
I am enjoying the irony of the "take back control of our sovereign govt" Tories supinely submitting to what appears to be an unelected dictator.
It is a lovely sunny day, and I have decided that I have a need to go out and do whatever the hell I like.
I've not been following the site today. Am I reading right now that the story is that Cummings has made multiple trips?
If so he should go.
I was willing yesterday to give the benefit of the doubt if it was for the welfare of a three year old. As a father of a three year old myself their safety must always come first.
However multiple trips without reasonable reasons is simply inexcusable if true.
I hope that's clear enough.
And, in addition, despite apparently rushing to family members to secure childcare before both parents fell ill, they unaccountably kept their child with them in any case, even as Dom became completely prostrate.
Starts to smack of “excuse” rather than reason and playing the rest of us for fools: “Tell them it was for the child; any parent will fall for that”
He succeeded in delivering Brexit, for good or ill, and just won a thumping 80-seat majority after 9 years of Conservative government.
I'm all for kicking the tories but not when it's rather misplaced.
It is likely that in future times, “delivering Brexit” will be seen in the same light as “delivering Suez”.
And the 80-seat majority will be of interest only to psephologists.
It is of course too early to place Boris in the PM rankings.
What does seem clear is that he is the most callow PM of the modern age. You have to go back before living memory I assume to find someone with his general lack of fitness for office.
Many people that voted for Boris as leader and PM were aware that he was not up to the job but they decided that it didn't matter as long as Brexit was delivered. Now we are paying the price.
Or for many of them not so much that Brexit was delivered but that their seats were.
I've not been following the site today. Am I reading right now that the story is that Cummings has made multiple trips?
If so he should go.
I was willing yesterday to give the benefit of the doubt if it was for the welfare of a three year old. As a father of a three year old myself their safety must always come first.
However multiple trips without reasonable reasons is simply inexcusable if true.
I hope that's clear enough.
I dont think we are sure about multiple trips TBH.
A 2nd to Durham is being denied,
It does appear an Easter Sunday trip to Barnard Castle when we were told to stay at home for Easter happened though
I'm confused. Easter Sunday from memory was during lockdown wasn't it? So that would be two trips?
If the Easter Sunday trip was during lockdown and without a good reason then he should go. Just as he should have for the Durham trip if it was without good reason.
If all trips have a good reason (eg if he was giving essential supplies to someone shielding that's a good reason) or weren't during the lockdown he can stay. If he broke the rules without a good reason be should go. I think that's fair.
Shapps deliberately confused self-isolation and lockdown, claiming that Cummings had had the necessary 14 day self-isolation, in Durham, by Easter Sunday.
Odd to say 14 days. It should have been 7, shouldn't it?
No, if you have contact with a household member it's 14 days. It includes the incubation period and a possible asymptomatic-but-infectious period
1. If my wife caught this I would consider myself absolutely nailed on to get it. We do not maintain social distancing, not even in lockdown. Sometimes we get very close indeed. Spreading in families is, unsurprisingly, the most common method of transmission. Of course he considered, correctly, that there was a high probability that he would get it too.
2. Pure speculation. Are you seriously saying that the guidance should not have provided for exceptional steps being taken by a parent charged with looking after a child? I mean, really?
3. Just maybe Boris had other things to worry about. Like being ill, having a child, running the country, trying to give some sort of direction to a fairly aimless Cabinet, that sort of thing.
4. Cummings has not provided any of the guidance or moralising to the public. He will not do so in the future either. And, subject to a possible second wave, most of this is going to be relaxation measures anyway. It's not great but this is being massively oversold.
Don't get me wrong. I really don't like the one rule for them and one for us aspect of this. I don't much care for the arrogance. If he has lied or had others lie on his behalf he should probably go. But this is a twitter storm at its maddest right now. Boris has to weigh up his utility in delivering the program he wants to deliver notwithstanding the virus against the embarrassment. He should do so coolly.
I shall now return to not commenting on this.
Good to see that you're avoiding the complete omerta of your fellow Scottish Tories, if only by a smidgeon. Silence is golden, what a shower.
Best not to use the words "golden" and "shower" in such close proximity to each other, or at least not at lunchtime.
Now that would be a means to transmit Coronavirus.
1. If my wife caught this I would consider myself absolutely nailed on to get it. We do not maintain social distancing, not even in lockdown. Sometimes we get very close indeed. Spreading in families is, unsurprisingly, the most common method of transmission. Of course he considered, correctly, that there was a high probability that he would get it too.
2. Pure speculation. Are you seriously saying that the guidance should not have provided for exceptional steps being taken by a parent charged with looking after a child? I mean, really?
3. Just maybe Boris had other things to worry about. Like being ill, having a child, running the country, trying to give some sort of direction to a fairly aimless Cabinet, that sort of thing.
4. Cummings has not provided any of the guidance or moralising to the public. He will not do so in the future either. And, subject to a possible second wave, most of this is going to be relaxation measures anyway. It's not great but this is being massively oversold.
Don't get me wrong. I really don't like the one rule for them and one for us aspect of this. I don't much care for the arrogance. If he has lied or had others lie on his behalf he should probably go. But this is a twitter storm at its maddest right now. Boris has to weigh up his utility in delivering the program he wants to deliver notwithstanding the virus against the embarrassment. He should do so coolly.
I shall now return to not commenting on this.
Good to see that you're avoiding the complete omerta of your fellow Scottish Tories, if only by a smidgeon. Silence is golden, what a shower.
Best not to use the words "golden" and "shower" in such close proximity to each other, or at least not at lunchtime.
Now that would be a means to transmit Coronavirus.
1. If my wife caught this I would consider myself absolutely nailed on to get it. We do not maintain social distancing, not even in lockdown. Sometimes we get very close indeed. Spreading in families is, unsurprisingly, the most common method of transmission. Of course he considered, correctly, that there was a high probability that he would get it too.
2. Pure speculation. Are you seriously saying that the guidance should not have provided for exceptional steps being taken by a parent charged with looking after a child? I mean, really?
3. Just maybe Boris had other things to worry about. Like being ill, having a child, running the country, trying to give some sort of direction to a fairly aimless Cabinet, that sort of thing.
4. Cummings has not provided any of the guidance or moralising to the public. He will not do so in the future either. And, subject to a possible second wave, most of this is going to be relaxation measures anyway. It's not great but this is being massively oversold.
Don't get me wrong. I really don't like the one rule for them and one for us aspect of this. I don't much care for the arrogance. If he has lied or had others lie on his behalf he should probably go. But this is a twitter storm at its maddest right now. Boris has to weigh up his utility in delivering the program he wants to deliver notwithstanding the virus against the embarrassment. He should do so coolly.
I shall now return to not commenting on this.
Good to see that you're avoiding the complete omerta of your fellow Scottish Tories, if only by a smidgeon. Silence is golden, what a shower.
Best not to use the words "golden" and "shower" in such close proximity to each other, or at least not at lunchtime.
1. If my wife caught this I would consider myself absolutely nailed on to get it. We do not maintain social distancing, not even in lockdown. Sometimes we get very close indeed. Spreading in families is, unsurprisingly, the most common method of transmission. Of course he considered, correctly, that there was a high probability that he would get it too.
2. Pure speculation. Are you seriously saying that the guidance should not have provided for exceptional steps being taken by a parent charged with looking after a child? I mean, really?
3. Just maybe Boris had other things to worry about. Like being ill, having a child, running the country, trying to give some sort of direction to a fairly aimless Cabinet, that sort of thing.
4. Cummings has not provided any of the guidance or moralising to the public. He will not do so in the future either. And, subject to a possible second wave, most of this is going to be relaxation measures anyway. It's not great but this is being massively oversold.
Don't get me wrong. I really don't like the one rule for them and one for us aspect of this. I don't much care for the arrogance. If he has lied or had others lie on his behalf he should probably go. But this is a twitter storm at its maddest right now. Boris has to weigh up his utility in delivering the program he wants to deliver notwithstanding the virus against the embarrassment. He should do so coolly.
I shall now return to not commenting on this.
Good to see that you're avoiding the complete omerta of your fellow Scottish Tories, if only by a smidgeon. Silence is golden, what a shower.
Best not to use the words "golden" and "shower" in such close proximity to each other, or at least not at lunchtime.
There was a care home company over the road from where I used to work called Acqua Doria. Honest, I suppose.
I've not been following the site today. Am I reading right now that the story is that Cummings has made multiple trips?
If so he should go.
I was willing yesterday to give the benefit of the doubt if it was for the welfare of a three year old. As a father of a three year old myself their safety must always come first.
However multiple trips without reasonable reasons is simply inexcusable if true.
I hope that's clear enough.
And, in addition, despite apparently rushing to family members to secure childcare before both parents fell ill, they unaccountably kept their child with them in any case, even as Dom became completely prostrate.
Starts to smack of “excuse” rather than reason and playing the rest of us for fools: “Tell them it was for the child; any parent will fall for that”
I don't think that's an issue. Having support available doesn't mean it needs to be in the home. Putting a seat belt on doesn't mean you intend to crash but it's there in case. Plus they're saying support was offered but to the doorstep, if the situation had gotten worse I'm sure the sister or whoever could have stepped through the doorstep.
Yes I may be falling for the childcare excuse but I don't care about that and would for any parent who made it. Childcare matters. Children matter.
I'm perhaps too soft but three year olds matter more than politics!
I'm not normally one for the daft press tactics but Cummings both needs and deserves to be hounded night and day for this
Yes. It's egregious. Populists inevitably have contempt for the 'ordinary people' they claim to represent and this exposes Johnson-Cummings as no exception.
I've not been following the site today. Am I reading right now that the story is that Cummings has made multiple trips?
If so he should go.
I was willing yesterday to give the benefit of the doubt if it was for the welfare of a three year old. As a father of a three year old myself their safety must always come first.
However multiple trips without reasonable reasons is simply inexcusable if true.
I hope that's clear enough.
I dont think we are sure about multiple trips TBH.
A 2nd to Durham is being denied,
It does appear an Easter Sunday trip to Barnard Castle when we were told to stay at home for Easter happened though
I'm confused. Easter Sunday from memory was during lockdown wasn't it? So that would be two trips?
If the Easter Sunday trip was during lockdown and without a good reason then he should go. Just as he should have for the Durham trip if it was without good reason.
If all trips have a good reason (eg if he was giving essential supplies to someone shielding that's a good reason) or weren't during the lockdown he can stay. If he broke the rules without a good reason be should go. I think that's fair.
Shapps deliberately confused self-isolation and lockdown, claiming that Cummings had had the necessary 14 day self-isolation, in Durham, by Easter Sunday.
Odd to say 14 days. It should have been 7, shouldn't it?
No, if you have contact with a household member it's 14 days. It includes the incubation period and a possible asymptomatic-but-infectious period
No - the advice is quite clear that if you develop symptoms while self-isolating you need to continue only for another 7 days.
The child should have been isolated for 14 days after Cummings developed symptoms, but Cummings needed to isolate only for 7 more days.
That's according to the rather crazy official advice, anyway.
I've not been following the site today. Am I reading right now that the story is that Cummings has made multiple trips?
If so he should go.
I was willing yesterday to give the benefit of the doubt if it was for the welfare of a three year old. As a father of a three year old myself their safety must always come first.
However multiple trips without reasonable reasons is simply inexcusable if true.
I hope that's clear enough.
And, in addition, despite apparently rushing to family members to secure childcare before both parents fell ill, they unaccountably kept their child with them in any case, even as Dom became completely prostrate.
Starts to smack of “excuse” rather than reason and playing the rest of us for fools: “Tell them it was for the child; any parent will fall for that”
I don't think that's an issue. Having support available doesn't mean it needs to be in the home. Putting a seat belt on doesn't mean you intend to crash but it's there in case. Plus they're saying support was offered but to the doorstep, if the situation had gotten worse I'm sure the sister or whoever could have stepped through the doorstep.
Yes I may be falling for the childcare excuse but I don't care about that and would for any parent who made it. Childcare matters. Children matter.
I'm perhaps too soft but three year olds matter more than politics!
Trouble is that, ironically, locking the boy in a car for five hours with two infected adults was probably more dangerous.
Handy hint for any PBers thinking about giving birth to multiple personas, if your signature characteristic is being right about everything and winning EVERY argument, create at least one proxy that occasionally pops out a humble mea culpa.
I've not been following the site today. Am I reading right now that the story is that Cummings has made multiple trips?
If so he should go.
I was willing yesterday to give the benefit of the doubt if it was for the welfare of a three year old. As a father of a three year old myself their safety must always come first.
However multiple trips without reasonable reasons is simply inexcusable if true.
I hope that's clear enough.
And, in addition, despite apparently rushing to family members to secure childcare before both parents fell ill, they unaccountably kept their child with them in any case, even as Dom became completely prostrate.
Starts to smack of “excuse” rather than reason and playing the rest of us for fools: “Tell them it was for the child; any parent will fall for that”
I don't think that's an issue. Having support available doesn't mean it needs to be in the home. Putting a seat belt on doesn't mean you intend to crash but it's there in case. Plus they're saying support was offered but to the doorstep, if the situation had gotten worse I'm sure the sister or whoever could have stepped through the doorstep.
Yes I may be falling for the childcare excuse but I don't care about that and would for any parent who made it. Childcare matters. Children matter.
I'm perhaps too soft but three year olds matter more than politics!
He cared more about his own three year old than anyone else’s, including yours. Having experienced the death of a child I have a different view to you of parents who put the interests of their own children above those of other people. He exposed whole families in the NE to his London virus. And it’s a big f you to all the parents who have struggled through childcare suffering from the symptoms of this illness, of whom I know and admire many.
‘anti-elite’ chief of staff Dominic Cummings lives in a luxurious £1.6 million townhouse in the heart of Islington – and his wife’s family owns a castle.
Maybe its Barnard Castle so he was sheltering at home!
I've not been following the site today. Am I reading right now that the story is that Cummings has made multiple trips?
If so he should go.
I was willing yesterday to give the benefit of the doubt if it was for the welfare of a three year old. As a father of a three year old myself their safety must always come first.
However multiple trips without reasonable reasons is simply inexcusable if true.
I hope that's clear enough.
I dont think we are sure about multiple trips TBH.
A 2nd to Durham is being denied,
It does appear an Easter Sunday trip to Barnard Castle when we were told to stay at home for Easter happened though
I'm confused. Easter Sunday from memory was during lockdown wasn't it? So that would be two trips?
If the Easter Sunday trip was during lockdown and without a good reason then he should go. Just as he should have for the Durham trip if it was without good reason.
If all trips have a good reason (eg if he was giving essential supplies to someone shielding that's a good reason) or weren't during the lockdown he can stay. If he broke the rules without a good reason be should go. I think that's fair.
Shapps deliberately confused self-isolation and lockdown, claiming that Cummings had had the necessary 14 day self-isolation, in Durham, by Easter Sunday.
Keeping to essentials I think the current score is that there are three real distinct allegations:
1 Going to Durham and staying there (end of March onwards) 2 While there going to Barnard Castle outside the rules (breaking lockdown, not isolation rules) (Easter Day) 3 Having got back to London going back to Durham and, IIRC, admiring bluebells (19 April)
Of these (1) is admitted and explained, though not very well (2) and (3) have not been explicitly denied by Downing St though a general 'we are not going to engage' non denial denial has been issued, which rather indicates they don't want to know.
I've not been following the site today. Am I reading right now that the story is that Cummings has made multiple trips?
If so he should go.
I was willing yesterday to give the benefit of the doubt if it was for the welfare of a three year old. As a father of a three year old myself their safety must always come first.
However multiple trips without reasonable reasons is simply inexcusable if true.
I hope that's clear enough.
I dont think we are sure about multiple trips TBH.
A 2nd to Durham is being denied,
It does appear an Easter Sunday trip to Barnard Castle when we were told to stay at home for Easter happened though
I'm confused. Easter Sunday from memory was during lockdown wasn't it? So that would be two trips?
If the Easter Sunday trip was during lockdown and without a good reason then he should go. Just as he should have for the Durham trip if it was without good reason.
If all trips have a good reason (eg if he was giving essential supplies to someone shielding that's a good reason) or weren't during the lockdown he can stay. If he broke the rules without a good reason be should go. I think that's fair.
Shapps deliberately confused self-isolation and lockdown, claiming that Cummings had had the necessary 14 day self-isolation, in Durham, by Easter Sunday.
Odd to say 14 days. It should have been 7, shouldn't it?
No, if you have contact with a household member it's 14 days. It includes the incubation period and a possible asymptomatic-but-infectious period
No - the advice is quite clear that if you develop symptoms while self-isolating you need to continue only for another 7 days.
The child should have been isolated for 14 days after Cummings developed symptoms, but Cummings needed to isolate only for 7 more days.
That's according to the rather crazy official advice, anyway.
The 14 days is 7 days for symptoms to show and then another 7 days in case they are asymptomatic.
For those infected it is a minimum of 7 days depending on how long the symptoms last - if they last longer than 7 days you have to self-isolate until the symptoms end.
1. If my wife caught this I would consider myself absolutely nailed on to get it. We do not maintain social distancing, not even in lockdown. Sometimes we get very close indeed. Spreading in families is, unsurprisingly, the most common method of transmission. Of course he considered, correctly, that there was a high probability that he would get it too.
2. Pure speculation. Are you seriously saying that the guidance should not have provided for exceptional steps being taken by a parent charged with looking after a child? I mean, really?
3. Just maybe Boris had other things to worry about. Like being ill, having a child, running the country, trying to give some sort of direction to a fairly aimless Cabinet, that sort of thing.
4. Cummings has not provided any of the guidance or moralising to the public. He will not do so in the future either. And, subject to a possible second wave, most of this is going to be relaxation measures anyway. It's not great but this is being massively oversold.
Don't get me wrong. I really don't like the one rule for them and one for us aspect of this. I don't much care for the arrogance. If he has lied or had others lie on his behalf he should probably go. But this is a twitter storm at its maddest right now. Boris has to weigh up his utility in delivering the program he wants to deliver notwithstanding the virus against the embarrassment. He should do so coolly.
I shall now return to not commenting on this.
Good to see that you're avoiding the complete omerta of your fellow Scottish Tories, if only by a smidgeon. Silence is golden, what a shower.
Best not to use the words "golden" and "shower" in such close proximity to each other, or at least not at lunchtime.
Now that would be a means to transmit Coronavirus.
‘anti-elite’ chief of staff Dominic Cummings lives in a luxurious £1.6 million townhouse in the heart of Islington – and his wife’s family owns a castle.
Maybe its Barnard Castle so he was sheltering at home!
Those houses are probably knocking on £2m now...or were, before COVID.
I've not been following the site today. Am I reading right now that the story is that Cummings has made multiple trips?
If so he should go.
I was willing yesterday to give the benefit of the doubt if it was for the welfare of a three year old. As a father of a three year old myself their safety must always come first.
However multiple trips without reasonable reasons is simply inexcusable if true.
I hope that's clear enough.
That's fine. But we do need to hear a heartfelt "sorry" from you. You lost some dignity with all the nonsense yesterday. An apology would go some way to restoring it.
1. If my wife caught this I would consider myself absolutely nailed on to get it. We do not maintain social distancing, not even in lockdown. Sometimes we get very close indeed. Spreading in families is, unsurprisingly, the most common method of transmission. Of course he considered, correctly, that there was a high probability that he would get it too.
2. Pure speculation. Are you seriously saying that the guidance should not have provided for exceptional steps being taken by a parent charged with looking after a child? I mean, really?
3. Just maybe Boris had other things to worry about. Like being ill, having a child, running the country, trying to give some sort of direction to a fairly aimless Cabinet, that sort of thing.
4. Cummings has not provided any of the guidance or moralising to the public. He will not do so in the future either. And, subject to a possible second wave, most of this is going to be relaxation measures anyway. It's not great but this is being massively oversold.
Don't get me wrong. I really don't like the one rule for them and one for us aspect of this. I don't much care for the arrogance. If he has lied or had others lie on his behalf he should probably go. But this is a twitter storm at its maddest right now. Boris has to weigh up his utility in delivering the program he wants to deliver notwithstanding the virus against the embarrassment. He should do so coolly.
I shall now return to not commenting on this.
Good to see that you're avoiding the complete omerta of your fellow Scottish Tories, if only by a smidgeon. Silence is golden, what a shower.
Best not to use the words "golden" and "shower" in such close proximity to each other, or at least not at lunchtime.
There are "golden showers" right outside the loos nearest to Regent's Park rose garden!
I somehow still think sticking by Cummings helps Johnson in the medium term. As soon as Cummings falls the focus is switched to Johnson and what he knew.
Cummings also knows where all the bodies are buried.
I've not been following the site today. Am I reading right now that the story is that Cummings has made multiple trips?
If so he should go.
I was willing yesterday to give the benefit of the doubt if it was for the welfare of a three year old. As a father of a three year old myself their safety must always come first.
However multiple trips without reasonable reasons is simply inexcusable if true.
I hope that's clear enough.
I dont think we are sure about multiple trips TBH.
A 2nd to Durham is being denied,
It does appear an Easter Sunday trip to Barnard Castle when we were told to stay at home for Easter happened though
I'm confused. Easter Sunday from memory was during lockdown wasn't it? So that would be two trips?
If the Easter Sunday trip was during lockdown and without a good reason then he should go. Just as he should have for the Durham trip if it was without good reason.
If all trips have a good reason (eg if he was giving essential supplies to someone shielding that's a good reason) or weren't during the lockdown he can stay. If he broke the rules without a good reason be should go. I think that's fair.
Shapps deliberately confused self-isolation and lockdown, claiming that Cummings had had the necessary 14 day self-isolation, in Durham, by Easter Sunday.
Odd to say 14 days. It should have been 7, shouldn't it?
No, if you have contact with a household member it's 14 days. It includes the incubation period and a possible asymptomatic-but-infectious period
No - the advice is quite clear that if you develop symptoms while self-isolating you need to continue only for another 7 days.
The child should have been isolated for 14 days after Cummings developed symptoms, but Cummings needed to isolate only for 7 more days.
That's according to the rather crazy official advice, anyway.
The 14 days is 7 days for symptoms to show and then another 7 days in case they are asymptomatic.
For those infected it is a minimum of 7 days depending on how long the symptoms last - if they last longer than 7 days you have to self-isolate until the symptoms end.
Yes. So as Cummings was symptomatic there was no question of his having to self-isolate for 14 days, as Shapps seemed to think. Only for 7. Or until his symptoms ceased. But it's OK if it's only a cough ...
I somehow still think sticking by Cummings helps Johnson in the medium term. As soon as Cummings falls the focus is switched to Johnson and what he knew.
Cummings also knows where all the bodies are buried.
As noted previously, it does look like the cabinet think if Dom goes, BoZo might just go with him and bring the entire edifice crashing down on their heads.
Remember how short the odds of a hung Parliament got on 12 December 2019? I do.
And as I told you, I never bought it. Just casing opinion on here. In fact I'm eyeing up the lay at 5. Bet against the trend when the market's blood is up - this is one of my tried & trusted betting ploys.
I somehow still think sticking by Cummings helps Johnson in the medium term. As soon as Cummings falls the focus is switched to Johnson and what he knew.
Cummings also knows where all the bodies are buried.
As noted previously, it does look like the cabinet think if Dom goes, BoZo might just go with him and bring the entire edifice crashing down on their heads.
Which is nice...
Have you been drinking Eadric's Absinthe? Johnson is going nowhere.
I somehow still think sticking by Cummings helps Johnson in the medium term. As soon as Cummings falls the focus is switched to Johnson and what he knew.
Cummings also knows where all the bodies are buried.
I think Cummings is staying for now and Johnson is staying until the election.
And no resignation called for but an investigation. Which will run and run. Someone must have reported him to Durham Police by now.
Labour have played this perfectly from the start.
Unlike the Fat Crofter who demanded Johnson's resignation, then deleted the Tweet.
I don't think it's fully dawned on some Tories yet that the game has changed. Corbyn's gone, they won't get away with things like they did before. Starmer is a very different proposition.
I somehow still think sticking by Cummings helps Johnson in the medium term. As soon as Cummings falls the focus is switched to Johnson and what he knew.
Cummings also knows where all the bodies are buried.
I think Cummings is staying for now and Johnson is staying until the election.
I've not been following the site today. Am I reading right now that the story is that Cummings has made multiple trips?
If so he should go.
I was willing yesterday to give the benefit of the doubt if it was for the welfare of a three year old. As a father of a three year old myself their safety must always come first.
However multiple trips without reasonable reasons is simply inexcusable if true.
I hope that's clear enough.
I dont think we are sure about multiple trips TBH.
A 2nd to Durham is being denied,
It does appear an Easter Sunday trip to Barnard Castle when we were told to stay at home for Easter happened though
I'm confused. Easter Sunday from memory was during lockdown wasn't it? So that would be two trips?
If the Easter Sunday trip was during lockdown and without a good reason then he should go. Just as he should have for the Durham trip if it was without good reason.
If all trips have a good reason (eg if he was giving essential supplies to someone shielding that's a good reason) or weren't during the lockdown he can stay. If he broke the rules without a good reason be should go. I think that's fair.
Shapps deliberately confused self-isolation and lockdown, claiming that Cummings had had the necessary 14 day self-isolation, in Durham, by Easter Sunday.
Keeping to essentials I think the current score is that there are three real distinct allegations:
1 Going to Durham and staying there (end of March onwards) 2 While there going to Barnard Castle outside the rules (breaking lockdown, not isolation rules) (Easter Day) 3 Having got back to London going back to Durham and, IIRC, admiring bluebells (19 April)
Of these (1) is admitted and explained, though not very well (2) and (3) have not been explicitly denied by Downing St though a general 'we are not going to engage' non denial denial has been issued, which rather indicates they don't want to know.
I think (3) has been denied. (2) has not been denied and there is a witness on record so, on balance, I think (1) and (2) are true.
I somehow still think sticking by Cummings helps Johnson in the medium term. As soon as Cummings falls the focus is switched to Johnson and what he knew.
Cummings also knows where all the bodies are buried.
I think Cummings is staying for now and Johnson is staying until the election.
Going to lay 2020 exit at 5 right NOW.
You can back Cummings to stay till June at 15/8 with Paddy Power or Betfair Sportsbook.
And no resignation called for but an investigation. Which will run and run. Someone must have reported him to Durham Police by now.
Labour have played this perfectly from the start.
Unlike the Fat Crofter who demanded Johnson's resignation, then deleted the Tweet.
I don't think it's fully dawned on some Tories yet that the game has changed. Corbyn's gone, they won't get away with things like they did before. Starmer is a very different proposition.
Totally. I didn`t bother following politics when Corbyn was leader. Labour were never going to get close to power with a socialist at the helm.
1. If my wife caught this I would consider myself absolutely nailed on to get it. We do not maintain social distancing, not even in lockdown. Sometimes we get very close indeed. Spreading in families is, unsurprisingly, the most common method of transmission. Of course he considered, correctly, that there was a high probability that he would get it too.
2. Pure speculation. Are you seriously saying that the guidance should not have provided for exceptional steps being taken by a parent charged with looking after a child? I mean, really?
3. Just maybe Boris had other things to worry about. Like being ill, having a child, running the country, trying to give some sort of direction to a fairly aimless Cabinet, that sort of thing.
4. Cummings has not provided any of the guidance or moralising to the public. He will not do so in the future either. And, subject to a possible second wave, most of this is going to be relaxation measures anyway. It's not great but this is being massively oversold.
Don't get me wrong. I really don't like the one rule for them and one for us aspect of this. I don't much care for the arrogance. If he has lied or had others lie on his behalf he should probably go. But this is a twitter storm at its maddest right now. Boris has to weigh up his utility in delivering the program he wants to deliver notwithstanding the virus against the embarrassment. He should do so coolly.
I shall now return to not commenting on this.
Good to see that you're avoiding the complete omerta of your fellow Scottish Tories, if only by a smidgeon. Silence is golden, what a shower.
Best not to use the words "golden" and "shower" in such close proximity to each other, or at least not at lunchtime.
There are "golden showers" right outside the loos nearest to Regent's Park rose garden!
And no resignation called for but an investigation. Which will run and run. Someone must have reported him to Durham Police by now.
Labour have played this perfectly from the start.
Unlike the Fat Crofter who demanded Johnson's resignation, then deleted the Tweet.
I don't think it's fully dawned on some Tories yet that the game has changed. Corbyn's gone, they won't get away with things like they did before. Starmer is a very different proposition.
Totally. I didn`t bother following politics when Corbyn was leader. Labour were never going to get close to power with a socialist at the helm.
I'm not normally one for the daft press tactics but Cummings both needs and deserves to be hounded night and day for this
Good of you to disclose that when you particularly dislike someone you're prepared to set decency to one side.
Why are you defending Dom's hypocrisy?
I haven't defended his hypocrisy. I *have* criticised the slavering mob so desperate for his scalp that they send lorries into his street and are happy to see him 'hounded day and night', for, mistakenly or otherwise, doing what he felt he needed to do to protect his family. It's a political witch hunt. I don't approve of mob rule, whether that mob consists of an angry crowd or a Twitter pile on.
I somehow still think sticking by Cummings helps Johnson in the medium term. As soon as Cummings falls the focus is switched to Johnson and what he knew.
Cummings also knows where all the bodies are buried.
The focus won't be on what Boris knew, which was nothing. The spotlight will fall on where Boris and his Cabinet are living and whether they too drove 260 miles to reach their second homes. Ditto their shadows.
On 15th June, I will be made redundant from the job I still enjoy after 25 years of service. Redundancy notices are to be issued to 43,000 of my colleagues: the entire workforce. Yes, you read correctly! 31,000 "lucky" former employees will then be offered re-employement on a far inferior contract that the company has wanted to enforce since 2010. For me, this would represent a 50% pay cut.
This is to be accompanied by an increase in productivity of 25%, not to mention far inferior T&Cs and, basically, a zero-hours contract.
All of this is with a backdrop of our CEO's bonus of £3.2 million in March this year; he’s been paid £33 million over the last 9 years. For the financial year '19/'20, the company I work for made a near record-breaking operating profit of £1.9 billion. I received no bonus; not a penny.
The company I work for has the biggest cash reserves of any airline on this planet: £9 billion. During this "fight for survival", the company I work for is in the process of spending £1billion buying another airline, Air Europa. All this whilst taking cash handouts from both the UK & Spanish governments & the UK taxpayer paying 80% of the current wage bill....
Nobody is saying we shouldn't all do our bit and take a shared responsibility approach as we ride this storm. However the company I currently work for absolutely refuses to negotiate. #BAbetrayal
They obviously plan to clear the decks and come out leaner and fitter after the resumption of business. All their outstanding problems sorted in one fell swoop.
I'm not normally one for the daft press tactics but Cummings both needs and deserves to be hounded night and day for this
Good of you to disclose that when you particularly dislike someone you're prepared to set decency to one side.
Why are you defending Dom's hypocrisy?
I haven't defended his hypocrisy. I *have* criticised the slavering mob so desperate for his scalp that they send lorries into his street and are happy to see him 'hounded day and night', for, mistakenly or otherwise, doing what he felt he needed to do to protect his family. It's a political witch hunt. I don't approve of mob rule, whether that mob consists of an angry crowd or a Twitter pile on.
I somehow still think sticking by Cummings helps Johnson in the medium term. As soon as Cummings falls the focus is switched to Johnson and what he knew.
Cummings also knows where all the bodies are buried.
Re your first two sentences although I agree it will switch to what Boris knew I don't think that lasts for long. It was the doing that was the serious offence, not knowing he did it. I think Johnson can bluster through that ok.
And no resignation called for but an investigation. Which will run and run. Someone must have reported him to Durham Police by now.
Labour have played this perfectly from the start.
Unlike the Fat Crofter who demanded Johnson's resignation, then deleted the Tweet.
I don't think it's fully dawned on some Tories yet that the game has changed. Corbyn's gone, they won't get away with things like they did before. Starmer is a very different proposition.
Totally. I didn`t bother following politics when Corbyn was leader. Labour were never going to get close to power with a socialist at the helm.
They did in 2017.
That’s a good point. Although it does show what a dramatic effect the quality of your opponent has on your electoral performance and, in that respect, the game has changed yet again.
I somehow still think sticking by Cummings helps Johnson in the medium term. As soon as Cummings falls the focus is switched to Johnson and what he knew.
Cummings also knows where all the bodies are buried.
I think Cummings is staying for now and Johnson is staying until the election.
Going to lay 2020 exit at 5 right NOW.
You can back Cummings to stay till June at 15/8 with Paddy Power or Betfair Sportsbook.
Thanks. I'm banned from all bookies unfortunately. Can only do Exchange and Spreads.
And no resignation called for but an investigation. Which will run and run. Someone must have reported him to Durham Police by now.
Labour have played this perfectly from the start.
Unlike the Fat Crofter who demanded Johnson's resignation, then deleted the Tweet.
I don't think it's fully dawned on some Tories yet that the game has changed. Corbyn's gone, they won't get away with things like they did before. Starmer is a very different proposition.
Totally. I didn`t bother following politics when Corbyn was leader. Labour were never going to get close to power with a socialist at the helm.
They did in 2017.
That’s a good point. Although it does show what a dramatic effect the quality of your opponent has on your electoral performance and, in that respect, the game has changed yet again.
Who will the public think is less bad in 2024?
I suspect a repeat of 2010 but with Labour in the driving seat, is a possibility.
Comments
If the Easter Sunday trip was during lockdown and without a good reason then he should go. Just as he should have for the Durham trip if it was without good reason.
If all trips have a good reason (eg if he was giving essential supplies to someone shielding that's a good reason) or weren't during the lockdown he can stay. If he broke the rules without a good reason be should go. I think that's fair.
I guess that's Allah's way of keeping everyone inside during the Eid holidays
❤
Yup - that’s me.
https://twitter.com/krishgm/status/1264535135434801152
Trying to make an excuse for one if there's another is silly because then they all need justification.
On 15th June, I will be made redundant from the job I still enjoy after 25 years of service. Redundancy notices are to be issued to 43,000 of my colleagues: the entire workforce. Yes, you read correctly!
31,000 "lucky" former employees will then be offered re-employement on a far inferior contract that the company has wanted to enforce since 2010. For me, this would represent a 50% pay cut.
This is to be accompanied by an increase in productivity of 25%, not to mention far inferior T&Cs and, basically, a zero-hours contract.
All of this is with a backdrop of our CEO's bonus of £3.2 million in March this year; he’s been paid £33 million over the last 9 years. For the financial year '19/'20, the company I work for made a near record-breaking operating profit of £1.9 billion. I received no bonus; not a penny.
The company I work for has the biggest cash reserves of any airline on this planet: £9 billion. During this "fight for survival", the company I work for is in the process of spending £1billion buying another airline, Air Europa. All this whilst taking cash handouts from both the UK & Spanish governments & the UK taxpayer paying 80% of the current wage bill....
Nobody is saying we shouldn't all do our bit and take a shared responsibility approach as we ride this storm. However the company I currently work for absolutely refuses to negotiate.
#BAbetrayal
2020 exit has really shortened. Golly.
There are all sorts of comments - including a few here this morning - that make it clear that Cummings runs the country. He turns up at SAGE meetings, he appointed the Chancellor and fired the previous one, he tells Boris (the front man) what to do, he decides who can have which SPADs.
I am enjoying the irony of the "take back control of our sovereign govt" Tories supinely submitting to what appears to be an unelected dictator.
It is a lovely sunny day, and I have decided that I have a need to go out and do whatever the hell I like.
Later peeps!
fell ill, they unaccountably kept their child with them in any case, even as Dom became completely prostrate.
Starts to smack of “excuse” rather than reason and playing the rest of us for fools: “Tell them it was for the child; any parent will fall for that”
I don't think Boris should accept Cummings resignation even if it were offered now.
https://twitter.com/Highlandista/status/1264434816113692674?s=20
Sorry about lunch.
Yes I may be falling for the childcare excuse but I don't care about that and would for any parent who made it. Childcare matters. Children matter.
I'm perhaps too soft but three year olds matter more than politics!
Boris has been absent. This may be to shield him from Cummingsgate. Plausible deniability and all that, so Boris will not fall.
Or it might be because Boris is still under the weather, so might resign on health grounds. Or a little of A and a little of B.
Unlike the Fat Crofter who demanded Johnson's resignation, then deleted the Tweet.
The child should have been isolated for 14 days after Cummings developed symptoms, but Cummings needed to isolate only for 7 more days.
That's according to the rather crazy official advice, anyway.
Maybe its Barnard Castle so he was sheltering at home!
1 Going to Durham and staying there (end of March onwards)
2 While there going to Barnard Castle outside the rules (breaking lockdown, not isolation rules) (Easter Day)
3 Having got back to London going back to Durham and, IIRC, admiring bluebells (19 April)
Of these (1) is admitted and explained, though not very well
(2) and (3) have not been explicitly denied by Downing St though a general 'we are not going to engage' non denial denial has been issued, which rather indicates they don't want to know.
For those infected it is a minimum of 7 days depending on how long the symptoms last - if they last longer than 7 days you have to self-isolate until the symptoms end.
https://www.rhs.org.uk/plants/119717/i-Rosa-i-Golden-Showers-(Cl)/Details
I somehow still think sticking by Cummings helps Johnson in the medium term. As soon as Cummings falls the focus is switched to Johnson and what he knew.
Cummings also knows where all the bodies are buried.
Which is nice...
Going to lay 2020 exit at 5 right NOW.
Note that is continuity IDS Tweeting out Labour propaganda...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-s-wzTRwJMg
Quite a bit of backdating
I dont remember your outrage at the mob then
I don't recall any of them attacking the press for doorstepping Corbyn and his family, never leaving him alone.
"He's an anti-Semite so he deserved it", I suspect.
Well in that case, Cummings is a liar and a fraud and he deserves it.
Do you think Dom is going?
I suspect a repeat of 2010 but with Labour in the driving seat, is a possibility.