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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The Democrats move up sharply in the House majority betting af

SystemSystem Posts: 6,199
edited August 8 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The Democrats move up sharply in the House majority betting after the GOP won the Ohio special election by a margin of less than 1%

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Comments

  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 8,947
    First.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 44,245
    Curse of the new thread.

    FPT:
    Good afternoon, everyone.

    Mr. JS, there was irritation a few years ago when the EU decided that drugs and hookers should be included in GDP stats when considering the financial contribution the UK should make.
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 6,184
    edited August 8
    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 27,104
    Wales referendum 1997 - YES winning margin was only 0.6% (compare Brexit with LEAVE 3.8% margin)
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 21,222

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    Oh I don't know. I am sure he has plenty to apologise for.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 22,350

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 9,672
    To be honest I don't see why the Ohio result improves the Dems chances in gamblers' minds. They will surely fall back from that in the General mid-term so it suggests to me that less seats than I previously thought available are in play. I may cash out some of my position.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 45,381
    Sean_F said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.
    That's great polling for Boris to be honest. Consider the probable split for Conservative voters, then consider the likely split for Tory members. He'll be crushing it.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 44,245
    Mr. Slackbladder, public divided on whether the burka is acceptable in Britain, but consensus emerges that Boris is a berk? :p
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 9,672
    Pulpstar said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.
    That's great polling for Boris to be honest. Consider the probable split for Conservative voters, then consider the likely split for Tory members. He'll be crushing it.
    Yup. Looks like Boris, after being gee'd up by Bannon, is going to strike early and capitalise on the clusterfuck that October will bring.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 22,350
    Pulpstar said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.
    That's great polling for Boris to be honest. Consider the probable split for Conservative voters, then consider the likely split for Tory members. He'll be crushing it.
    I expect that Tory voters would split about 2:1 that Boris should not apologise and 3:1 in favour of banning the burka in public places.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 20,707
    Alistair said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.
    That's great polling for Boris to be honest. Consider the probable split for Conservative voters, then consider the likely split for Tory members. He'll be crushing it.
    Yup. Looks like Boris, after being gee'd up by Bannon, is going to strike early and capitalise on the clusterfuck that October will bring.
    Perhaps Boris just wants to sure up the base ready for the Great Brexit Betrayal when he'll come out for Remain and a second referendum.
  • Torby_FennelTorby_Fennel Posts: 325
    Sean_F said:



    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.

    Yes, I think it's highly offensive behaviour but I don't think it's racist - though I do rather suspect Boris intended it to be racist... but he's not even clever enough to do racism properly...
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 27,104
    Scott_P said:
    "It is said that the Queen has come to love the Commonwealth, partly because it supplies her with regular cheering crowds of flag-waving picaninnies; and one can imagine that Blair, twice victor abroad but enmired at home, is similarly seduced by foreign politeness. They say he is shortly off to the Congo. No doubt the AK47s will fall silent, and the pangas will stop their hacking of human flesh, and the tribal warriors will all break out in Watermelon smiles to see the big white chief touch down in his big white British taxpayer-funded bird."

    - Boris in The Daily Telegraph 10 January 2002
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 6,647
    Alistair said:

    To be honest I don't see why the Ohio result improves the Dems chances in gamblers' minds. They will surely fall back from that in the General mid-term so it suggests to me that less seats than I previously thought available are in play. I may cash out some of my position.

    Do gamblers calculate the result has improved Democrats' chances - or is it rather that it has prompted them to realise that the Democrats ought to have been strong favourites to take back control of the House for a while now ?
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 27,104
    My friends, as I have discovered myself, there are no disasters, only opportunities. And, indeed, opportunities for fresh disasters.

    - Boris on being sacked from the Tory front bench, in The Daily Telegraph, 2 December 2004,
  • FensterFenster Posts: 1,621
    If Boris isn't sorry then he shouldn't say sorry.

    One of the worst things about modern life is people being forced to apologise for offending someone, when they aren't sorry at all.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 22,743
    edited August 8
    Sean_F said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.
    That's great polling for Boris to be honest. Consider the probable split for Conservative voters, then consider the likely split for Tory members. He'll be crushing it.
    I expect that Tory voters would split about 2:1 that Boris should not apologise and 3:1 in favour of banning the burka in public places.
    IMO we ought to be concentrating on applying the current law on things like forced marriage and FGM rather than wasting time on a burka ban. It clearly isn't as serious as those issues.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 6,647
    The original source for Trump's crackpot ideas about California mismanagement of water resources being responsible for the difficulty in dealing with the wildfires:
    https://washingtonspectator.org/donald-trump-alex-jones/
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 27,104

    Sean_F said:



    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.

    Yes, I think it's highly offensive behaviour but I don't think it's racist - though I do rather suspect Boris intended it to be racist... but he's not even clever enough to do racism properly...
    But do Burqas have a race? Do all non-white people wear Burqas?
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 22,350
    AndyJS said:

    Sean_F said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.
    That's great polling for Boris to be honest. Consider the probable split for Conservative voters, then consider the likely split for Tory members. He'll be crushing it.
    I expect that Tory voters would split about 2:1 that Boris should not apologise and 3:1 in favour of banning the burka in public places.
    IMO we ought to be concentrating on applying the current law on things like forced marriage and FGM rather than wasting time on a burka ban. It clearly isn't as serious as those issues.
    I agree.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 8,760

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    Something can not be racist, but the person still be a twat for saying it.

    That said, this is the kind of polling that makes me wish they'd poll some placebo stories for calibration purposes, like PPP once did with a made-up deficit reduction plan.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 45,381

    Alistair said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.
    That's great polling for Boris to be honest. Consider the probable split for Conservative voters, then consider the likely split for Tory members. He'll be crushing it.
    Yup. Looks like Boris, after being gee'd up by Bannon, is going to strike early and capitalise on the clusterfuck that October will bring.
    Perhaps Boris just wants to sure up the base ready for the Great Brexit Betrayal when he'll come out for Remain and a second referendum.
    Odds against.
  • BromBrom Posts: 983
    Sean_F said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.
    Though I'm sceptical in general about sky data polls I'd be interested to know how different the results would be if the questions did not concern Boris!
  • Torby_FennelTorby_Fennel Posts: 325



    But do Burqas have a race? Do all non-white people wear Burqas?

    No, and that's my exact point! I believe Boris tried to be racist by making a statement which is demonstrably not racist.

  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 27,104
    Fenster said:

    If Boris isn't sorry then he shouldn't say sorry.

    One of the worst things about modern life is people being forced to apologise for offending someone, when they aren't sorry at all.

    I agree.
  • currystarcurrystar Posts: 958
    AndyJS said:

    Sean_F said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.
    That's great polling for Boris to be honest. Consider the probable split for Conservative voters, then consider the likely split for Tory members. He'll be crushing it.
    I expect that Tory voters would split about 2:1 that Boris should not apologise and 3:1 in favour of banning the burka in public places.
    IMO we ought to be concentrating on applying the current law on things like forced marriage and FGM rather than wasting time on a burka ban. It clearly isn't as serious as those issues.
    I think it is pretty close, imagine having to spend your entire life when you go out having to wear sheets over your head with just a slit cut for your eyes. It is horrendously oppresive and I cant believe that the vast majority of burka wearers do so out of choice.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 21,222
    Sean_F said:

    AndyJS said:

    Sean_F said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.
    That's great polling for Boris to be honest. Consider the probable split for Conservative voters, then consider the likely split for Tory members. He'll be crushing it.
    I expect that Tory voters would split about 2:1 that Boris should not apologise and 3:1 in favour of banning the burka in public places.
    IMO we ought to be concentrating on applying the current law on things like forced marriage and FGM rather than wasting time on a burka ban. It clearly isn't as serious as those issues.
    I agree.
    I also agree so far as the criminal law is concerned but I do think we have to try a lot harder to support women who decide that the Burka or indeed any other aspects of a patriarchal society are not for them and they would rather live in the way that indigenous women take for granted.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 11,980
    Is Disgraced Liam Fox reduced to punting EU trade deals as his own?

  • CharlesCharles Posts: 19,967

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    If probably be in the 12%. It’s nit racist, but it’s offensive.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 11,980
    Fenster said:

    If Boris isn't sorry then he shouldn't say sorry.

    One of the worst things about modern life is people being forced to apologise for offending someone, when they aren't sorry at all.

    Actually hypocritical twats being forced to make mealy mouthed apologies through gritted teeth is one of my favourite things.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 20,707

    Is Disgraced Liam Fox reduced to punting EU trade deals as his own?

    Reduced to? This is the pinnacle of his career.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 21,222
    O/t Stokes statement to the police is a good example why the lecture yesterday about why you should never talk to the police doesn't automatically transcribe to this side of the Atlantic. It has allowed him to put his position to the Jury without the necessity of answering awkward questions. I would be surprised if he goes to the witness box now.

    He said: "“My perception was that it was two against one” and the two were prepared to use bottles." and the two men were strangers and he “feared they could have other weapons” on them. Claims the force he used was reasonable and entirely justified given the circumstances.

    The position in the US appeared to be that exculpatory parts of the statement are not admissible but that is not the position here.

    Difficult to judge by little snippets but I think he has had a better day today.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 19,967
    currystar said:

    AndyJS said:

    Sean_F said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.
    That's great polling for Boris to be honest. Consider the probable split for Conservative voters, then consider the likely split for Tory members. He'll be crushing it.
    I expect that Tory voters would split about 2:1 that Boris should not apologise and 3:1 in favour of banning the burka in public places.
    IMO we ought to be concentrating on applying the current law on things like forced marriage and FGM rather than wasting time on a burka ban. It clearly isn't as serious as those issues.
    I think it is pretty close, imagine having to spend your entire life when you go out having to wear sheets over your head with just a slit cut for your eyes. It is horrendously oppresive and I cant believe that the vast majority of burka wearers do so out of choice.
    I think it’s a bit more complicated than being “forced” to wear the burka. The cultural environment has been created where they feel guilty/immodest for going without. Gaslighting on an epic scale
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 6,029
    Nigelb said:

    The original source for Trump's crackpot ideas about California mismanagement of water resources being responsible for the difficulty in dealing with the wildfires:
    https://washingtonspectator.org/donald-trump-alex-jones/

    Scary stuff.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 45,381
    Charles said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    If probably be in the 12%. It’s nit racist, but it’s offensive.
    It'd a stretch to call it racist given islam is ethnically a heterogenous religion. Religionist perhaps.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 27,104
    Charles said:

    currystar said:

    AndyJS said:

    Sean_F said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.
    That's great polling for Boris to be honest. Consider the probable split for Conservative voters, then consider the likely split for Tory members. He'll be crushing it.
    I expect that Tory voters would split about 2:1 that Boris should not apologise and 3:1 in favour of banning the burka in public places.
    IMO we ought to be concentrating on applying the current law on things like forced marriage and FGM rather than wasting time on a burka ban. It clearly isn't as serious as those issues.
    I think it is pretty close, imagine having to spend your entire life when you go out having to wear sheets over your head with just a slit cut for your eyes. It is horrendously oppresive and I cant believe that the vast majority of burka wearers do so out of choice.
    I think it’s a bit more complicated than being “forced” to wear the burka. The cultural environment has been created where they feel guilty/immodest for going without. Gaslighting on an epic scale
    "Know ye that it is the will of Allah (SWT) that we are all born stark raving naked!"
    - Grand Ayatollah Nudistani
  • FensterFenster Posts: 1,621

    Fenster said:

    If Boris isn't sorry then he shouldn't say sorry.

    One of the worst things about modern life is people being forced to apologise for offending someone, when they aren't sorry at all.

    Actually hypocritical twats being forced to make mealy mouthed apologies through gritted teeth is one of my favourite things.
    Ah see, now I know Boris is a clumsy idiot who can't help getting into trouble, and that he's the focus of a lot of people's snide comments (entirely fairly... and largely because the opposition fear him as much as hate him), but I'm in the camp - and I mean this with no political allegiances - where I'd like politicians to speak their minds and be as offensive as they like. Let the voters decide.

    Gordon Brown had to apologise for calling that woman a bigot in 2010. He didn't mean it. I bet he thought her a poor, uneducated council-dwelling lard-arse... and he still probably hates her.

    I know nobody who doesn't take the piss out of burkas. They are fucking ridiculous. We've just had a Saharan summer where I couldn't even go to bed bollock-naked without sweating inside out, yet I see poor young women walking round with tents over their heads. Take the religion out of it, and let's be honest, it is absolutely bananas.

    BUT, I 100% defend their right to wear a burka. Just as I'd defend the rights of that naked rambler to walk round Britain with his old boy out. It's entirely up to them.

    I would, however, like politicians to feel free to point out the utter lunacy of wearing a tent over your head in the searing sunshine, without being called to book over it. Just as I'd like politicians to point out the idiocy of drug laws, without fearing the wrath of the Daily Mail.

  • CharlesCharles Posts: 19,967
    Pulpstar said:

    Charles said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    If probably be in the 12%. It’s nit racist, but it’s offensive.
    It'd a stretch to call it racist given islam is ethnically a heterogenous religion. Religionist perhaps.
    That too but it’s such a tedious rabbit hole I didn’t make the point..
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 19,967

    Charles said:

    currystar said:

    AndyJS said:

    Sean_F said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.
    That's great polling for Boris to be honest. Consider the probable split for Conservative voters, then consider the likely split for Tory members. He'll be crushing it.
    I expect that Tory voters would split about 2:1 that Boris should not apologise and 3:1 in favour of banning the burka in public places.
    IMO we ought to be concentrating on applying the current law on things like forced marriage and FGM rather than wasting time on a burka ban. It clearly isn't as serious as those issues.
    I think it is pretty close, imagine having to spend your entire life when you go out having to wear sheets over your head with just a slit cut for your eyes. It is horrendously oppresive and I cant believe that the vast majority of burka wearers do so out of choice.
    I think it’s a bit more complicated than being “forced” to wear the burka. The cultural environment has been created where they feel guilty/immodest for going without. Gaslighting on an epic scale
    "Know ye that it is the will of Allah (SWT) that we are all born stark raving naked!"
    - Grand Ayatollah Nudistani
    You’ve posted that a dozen times in the last 48 hours. It wasn’t funny the first time.
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 3,622

    Is Disgraced Liam Fox reduced to punting EU trade deals as his own?

    We're always being told that Liam can't secure any new trade deals until we've fully left the EU. Has someone been telling porky pies?
  • Is Disgraced Liam Fox reduced to punting EU trade deals as his own?

    Please.

    It is ‘The disgraced national security risk Liam Fox’
  • surbysurby Posts: 1,027
    Charles said:

    Charles said:

    currystar said:

    AndyJS said:

    Sean_F said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.
    That's great polling for Boris to be honest. Consider the probable split for Conservative voters, then consider the likely split for Tory members. He'll be crushing it.
    I expect that Tory voters would split about 2:1 that Boris should not apologise and 3:1 in favour of banning the burka in public places.
    IMO we ought to be concentrating on applying the current law on things like forced marriage and FGM rather than wasting time on a burka ban. It clearly isn't as serious as those issues.
    I think it is pretty close, imagine having to spend your entire life when you go out having to wear sheets over your head with just a slit cut for your eyes. It is horrendously oppresive and I cant believe that the vast majority of burka wearers do so out of choice.
    I think it’s a bit more complicated than being “forced” to wear the burka. The cultural environment has been created where they feel guilty/immodest for going without. Gaslighting on an epic scale
    "Know ye that it is the will of Allah (SWT) that we are all born stark raving naked!"
    - Grand Ayatollah Nudistani
    You’ve posted that a dozen times in the last 48 hours. It wasn’t funny the first time.
    Worse. Some nutter could take serious offence from those remarks.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 11,421
    DavidL said:

    O/t Stokes statement to the police is a good example why the lecture yesterday about why you should never talk to the police doesn't automatically transcribe to this side of the Atlantic. It has allowed him to put his position to the Jury without the necessity of answering awkward questions. I would be surprised if he goes to the witness box now.

    He said: "“My perception was that it was two against one” and the two were prepared to use bottles." and the two men were strangers and he “feared they could have other weapons” on them. Claims the force he used was reasonable and entirely justified given the circumstances.

    The position in the US appeared to be that exculpatory parts of the statement are not admissible but that is not the position here.

    Difficult to judge by little snippets but I think he has had a better day today.

    Also in the US no adverse inferences can be drawn from silence. In the UK they can.
  • surbysurby Posts: 1,027
    Guys, the topic is on the November elections and not burqas.
  • El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 549
    Brilliant final line in the Evening Osborne's leader about Boris:

    "...one of those legendary inverted pyramids of piffle that Mr Johnson used to amuse us with, back when he was funny"

    https://www.standard.co.uk/comment/comment/evening-standard-comment-boris-johnson-s-lost-liberalism-is-a-test-for-tory-future-a3906506.html
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 20,675
    currystar said:

    AndyJS said:

    Sean_F said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.
    That's great polling for Boris to be honest. Consider the probable split for Conservative voters, then consider the likely split for Tory members. He'll be crushing it.
    I expect that Tory voters would split about 2:1 that Boris should not apologise and 3:1 in favour of banning the burka in public places.
    IMO we ought to be concentrating on applying the current law on things like forced marriage and FGM rather than wasting time on a burka ban. It clearly isn't as serious as those issues.
    I think it is pretty close, imagine having to spend your entire life when you go out having to wear sheets over your head with just a slit cut for your eyes. It is horrendously oppresive and I cant believe that the vast majority of burka wearers do so out of choice.
    I can't believe Catholic priests have to remain celibate.
    I can't believe Jews and some other faiths perform MGM on boys;
    I can't believe some nuns and monks seclude themselves away, and disallow themselves from speaking to outsiders.

    Many (all?) religions involve 'true' adherents to give something up to show the scale of their faith; the more they give up, the more faithful and nearer to God they are. For most Christians it is a visit to church every Sunday and on special festivals; the truly devout go two or three times a week.

    The burkha, nijab and hajib are becoming symbols of their faith. It's a visible sign of how devout they are. That's why so many Muslim women choose to wear them (and yes, some are semi- or fully- forced to).

    I think it's crazy, but then again, I find the three examples above crazy as well. But it's their choice.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 11,421
    surby said:

    Guys, the topic is on the November elections and not burqas.

    Channelling Mr Dancer, can we talk about the many berks that will be standing for election as a reasonable compromise?
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 22,743
    "Saudi Arabia sells Canadian assets as dispute escalates

    Riyadh takes action after Ottawa calls for release of women’s rights activist"

    https://www.ft.com/
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 11,421


    I can't believe Catholic priests have to remain celibate.

    You're not alone in that:
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/may/27/italian-priests-mistresses-letter-pope

    It even extends as far as some bishops:
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eamonn_Casey

    And of course a number of Popes:
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Alexander_VI
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 19,140
    Scott_P said:
    LOL, Davidson will stoop to any level to get her mush in the media. Hopefully Boris has a pair and will tell all the snowflakes and serial grovellers where to go.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 19,140

    currystar said:

    AndyJS said:

    Sean_F said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.
    That's great polling for Boris to be honest. Consider the probable split for Conservative voters, then consider the likely split for Tory members. He'll be crushing it.
    I expect that Tory voters would split about 2:1 that Boris should not apologise and 3:1 in favour of banning the burka in public places.
    IMO we ought to be concentrating on applying the current law on things like forced marriage and FGM rather than wasting time on a burka ban. It clearly isn't as serious as those issues.
    I think it is pretty close, imagine having to spend your entire life when you go out having to wear sheets over your head with just a slit cut for your eyes. It is horrendously oppresive and I cant believe that the vast majority of burka wearers do so out of choice.
    I can't believe Catholic priests have to remain celibate.
    I can't believe Jews and some other faiths perform MGM on boys;
    I can't believe some nuns and monks seclude themselves away, and disallow themselves from speaking to outsiders.

    Many (all?) religions involve 'true' adherents to give something up to show the scale of their faith; the more they give up, the more faithful and nearer to God they are. For most Christians it is a visit to church every Sunday and on special festivals; the truly devout go two or three times a week.

    The burkha, nijab and hajib are becoming symbols of their faith. It's a visible sign of how devout they are. That's why so many Muslim women choose to wear them (and yes, some are semi- or fully- forced to).

    I think it's crazy, but then again, I find the three examples above crazy as well. But it's their choice.
    No-one should be allowed to be totally covered in public, you have no idea who is under all those robes, faces should be seen as a minimum for public safety. Any law abiding citizen would realise that.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 22,743
    "London’s economy shrugs off effects of Brexit vote

    Employment in the capital is growing faster than elsewhere but the housing market is a concern"

    https://www.ft.com/content/2a812cf6-9af7-11e8-ab77-f854c65a4465
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,261
    surby said:

    Guys, the topic is on the November elections and not burqas.

    Since when has PB ever stayed on topic? :p
  • prh47bridgeprh47bridge Posts: 222
    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    O/t Stokes statement to the police is a good example why the lecture yesterday about why you should never talk to the police doesn't automatically transcribe to this side of the Atlantic. It has allowed him to put his position to the Jury without the necessity of answering awkward questions. I would be surprised if he goes to the witness box now.

    He said: "“My perception was that it was two against one” and the two were prepared to use bottles." and the two men were strangers and he “feared they could have other weapons” on them. Claims the force he used was reasonable and entirely justified given the circumstances.

    The position in the US appeared to be that exculpatory parts of the statement are not admissible but that is not the position here.

    Difficult to judge by little snippets but I think he has had a better day today.

    Also in the US no adverse inferences can be drawn from silence. In the UK they can.
    Not entirely true. Following a Supreme Court ruling in 2013, the suspect's silence can be used against him in court unless he has specifically invoked his Fifth Amendment rights.
  • grabcocquegrabcocque Posts: 1,001
    If Boris apologised that would imply that he made a mistake.

    He didn't make a mistake, he made a conscious decision to ridicule and attack a group of vulnerable and marginalised women because he thought it'd help his career.

    That's not a mistake, that's a cold hearted calculation by an amoral sociopath. He has nothing to apologise for; Indeed I find it unlikely that he's capable of feeling sorrow or remorse anyway.
  • RobD said:

    surby said:

    Guys, the topic is on the November elections and not burqas.

    Since when has PB ever stayed on topic? :p
    It will be a strange day if we did.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 10,734
    I've taken a week off for miscellanous idleness, so I decided I'd follow up a BT email saying they were going to increase my broadband fee (by a modest amount now and by 100% in a year), and if I wanted to prevent this I should give them a call to discuss it or cancel.

    ! rang the number for cancelling. It rang and rang. I got with other things, but after 25 minutes I gave up.

    I then rang the general BT helpline. This time I got someone after 15 minutes. I said I could see there was an offer which was £5 cheaper, and other loss-leading providers that were cheaper stil, so I'd decided to switch, what steps should I take?

    He said how about we make it £2 cheaper?

    I said no, that was still £3 more * 24 months. Let's just call it a day.

    He said in that case, how about £4 cheaper? Just £1/month more than the others, saves the hassle.

    I said OK. But I wanted to switch my mobile for similar reasons.

    He said ah, in that case we can reduce your landline by a further £2 so long as you don't switch the mobile.

    Thoughts:

    1. Shouldn't Ofcom look into a cancellation line that doesn't actually answer?
    2. Is it in the public interest that list prices are fictitious and the actual price is determined by how much you haggle, like a bazaar?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 21,222

    I've taken a week off for miscellanous idleness, so I decided I'd follow up a BT email saying they were going to increase my broadband fee (by a modest amount now and by 100% in a year), and if I wanted to prevent this I should give them a call to discuss it or cancel.

    ! rang the number for cancelling. It rang and rang. I got with other things, but after 25 minutes I gave up.

    I then rang the general BT helpline. This time I got someone after 15 minutes. I said I could see there was an offer which was £5 cheaper, and other loss-leading providers that were cheaper stil, so I'd decided to switch, what steps should I take?

    He said how about we make it £2 cheaper?

    I said no, that was still £3 more * 24 months. Let's just call it a day.

    He said in that case, how about £4 cheaper? Just £1/month more than the others, saves the hassle.

    I said OK. But I wanted to switch my mobile for similar reasons.

    He said ah, in that case we can reduce your landline by a further £2 so long as you don't switch the mobile.

    Thoughts:

    1. Shouldn't Ofcom look into a cancellation line that doesn't actually answer?
    2. Is it in the public interest that list prices are fictitious and the actual price is determined by how much you haggle, like a bazaar?

    One of the plagues of modern life. They take advantage of the fact that we mainly have better things to do, as you would in any other week.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,261
    Thank the Gods - PB is back :o
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 21,222
    DavidL said:

    I've taken a week off for miscellanous idleness, so I decided I'd follow up a BT email saying they were going to increase my broadband fee (by a modest amount now and by 100% in a year), and if I wanted to prevent this I should give them a call to discuss it or cancel.

    ! rang the number for cancelling. It rang and rang. I got with other things, but after 25 minutes I gave up.

    I then rang the general BT helpline. This time I got someone after 15 minutes. I said I could see there was an offer which was £5 cheaper, and other loss-leading providers that were cheaper stil, so I'd decided to switch, what steps should I take?

    He said how about we make it £2 cheaper?

    I said no, that was still £3 more * 24 months. Let's just call it a day.

    He said in that case, how about £4 cheaper? Just £1/month more than the others, saves the hassle.

    I said OK. But I wanted to switch my mobile for similar reasons.

    He said ah, in that case we can reduce your landline by a further £2 so long as you don't switch the mobile.

    Thoughts:

    1. Shouldn't Ofcom look into a cancellation line that doesn't actually answer?
    2. Is it in the public interest that list prices are fictitious and the actual price is determined by how much you haggle, like a bazaar?

    One of the plagues of modern life. They take advantage of the fact that we mainly have better things to do, as you would in any other week.
    Edit, and of course you are right about the cancellation line. That is just ridiculous.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 14,053
    DavidL said:

    O/t Stokes statement to the police is a good example why the lecture yesterday about why you should never talk to the police doesn't automatically transcribe to this side of the Atlantic. It has allowed him to put his position to the Jury without the necessity of answering awkward questions. I would be surprised if he goes to the witness box now.

    He said: "“My perception was that it was two against one” and the two were prepared to use bottles." and the two men were strangers and he “feared they could have other weapons” on them. Claims the force he used was reasonable and entirely justified given the circumstances.

    The position in the US appeared to be that exculpatory parts of the statement are not admissible but that is not the position here.

    Difficult to judge by little snippets but I think he has had a better day today.

    Yes interesting. In one of those Wasting Police Time books when the police arrived at the scene of a home invasion/burglary and the homeowner had beaten up the burglar the police gave him quite careful instructions on what to say had happened so as to not be liable for any offence.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 11,421
    edited August 8

    I've taken a week off for miscellanous idleness, so I decided I'd follow up a BT email saying they were going to increase my broadband fee (by a modest amount now and by 100% in a year), and if I wanted to prevent this I should give them a call to discuss it or cancel.

    ! rang the number for cancelling. It rang and rang. I got with other things, but after 25 minutes I gave up.

    I then rang the general BT helpline. This time I got someone after 15 minutes. I said I could see there was an offer which was £5 cheaper, and other loss-leading providers that were cheaper stil, so I'd decided to switch, what steps should I take?

    He said how about we make it £2 cheaper?

    I said no, that was still £3 more * 24 months. Let's just call it a day.

    He said in that case, how about £4 cheaper? Just £1/month more than the others, saves the hassle.

    I said OK. But I wanted to switch my mobile for similar reasons.

    He said ah, in that case we can reduce your landline by a further £2 so long as you don't switch the mobile.

    Thoughts:

    1. Shouldn't Ofcom look into a cancellation line that doesn't actually answer?
    2. Is it in the public interest that list prices are fictitious and the actual price is determined by how much you haggle, like a bazaar?

    It is a considerable advantage of having a hands free function on the phone that I just set it to that and get on with something else while I'm waiting for them to respond. It means it doesn't matter how long it takes them to answer. My record is 56 minutes.

    In the case of BT, I quit them some time ago after a very large number of problems, but it took five months of arguing before they accepted they were so far in breach of my contract that I could do so without penalty.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 44,245
    Mr. D, was PB absent?
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 14,053

    I've taken a week off for miscellanous idleness, so I decided I'd follow up a BT email saying they were going to increase my broadband fee (by a modest amount now and by 100% in a year), and if I wanted to prevent this I should give them a call to discuss it or cancel.

    ! rang the number for cancelling. It rang and rang. I got with other things, but after 25 minutes I gave up.

    I then rang the general BT helpline. This time I got someone after 15 minutes. I said I could see there was an offer which was £5 cheaper, and other loss-leading providers that were cheaper stil, so I'd decided to switch, what steps should I take?

    He said how about we make it £2 cheaper?

    I said no, that was still £3 more * 24 months. Let's just call it a day.

    He said in that case, how about £4 cheaper? Just £1/month more than the others, saves the hassle.

    I said OK. But I wanted to switch my mobile for similar reasons.

    He said ah, in that case we can reduce your landline by a further £2 so long as you don't switch the mobile.

    Thoughts:

    1. Shouldn't Ofcom look into a cancellation line that doesn't actually answer?
    2. Is it in the public interest that list prices are fictitious and the actual price is determined by how much you haggle, like a bazaar?

    Funnily enough it seemed to stop working (the haggling) with Three some time ago. Ring up to say you're cancelling? Fine, see ya they said

    That said recently they have taken to offering good deals or improvements without prompting. So maybe they're worrying about switching again.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,261

    Mr. D, was PB absent?

    Perhaps Vanilla banned my IP address fearing a DoS attack :p
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 8,760
    I think Boris should apologize for derailing this thread, our US politics discussions used to be the best we had. Maybe it'll pick up in a month or two.

    PS I don't disagree with Boris on the (admittedly flagrantly attention-seeking) letterbox comparison but I'd like to hear from women in burkhas about what they think Boris looks like.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 44,245
    Mr. D, maybe it saw your icon through bleary eyes and thought it was someone wearing a burka?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 19,090
    RobD said:

    Mr. D, was PB absent?

    Perhaps Vanilla banned my IP address fearing a DoS attack :p
    Vanilla did go AWOL for a few minutes.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 8,760
    edited August 8
    Just passing on stuff from people smarter than me on Twitter but the betting move may also be about the WA results, eg:

  • RobD said:

    Mr. D, was PB absent?

    Perhaps Vanilla banned my IP address fearing a DoS attack :p
    It went AWOL for me as well.

    It may be have been connected to AV thread I'm uploading to the PB server.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 14,053

    I think Boris should apologize for derailing this thread, our US politics discussions used to be the best we had. Maybe it'll pick up in a month or two.

    PS I don't disagree with Boris on the (admittedly flagrantly attention-seeking) letterbox comparison but I'd like to hear from women in burkhas about what they think Boris looks like.

    He is a rude bullying coward.

    But aside from that aren't letterboxes red?
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 44,245
    Mr. Topping, some are gold, for the 2012 Olympian victors.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 11,421

    RobD said:

    Mr. D, was PB absent?

    Perhaps Vanilla banned my IP address fearing a DoS attack :p
    It went AWOL for me as well.

    It may be have been connected to AV thread I'm uploading to the PB server.
    As we've told you before Mr Eagles, AV is dangerous, unnecessary and inimical to a civilised polity.

    I just didn't quite expect you to prove it by taking PB off air...
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 15,442

    I've taken a week off for miscellanous idleness, so I decided I'd follow up a BT email saying they were going to increase my broadband fee (by a modest amount now and by 100% in a year), and if I wanted to prevent this I should give them a call to discuss it or cancel.

    ! rang the number for cancelling. It rang and rang. I got with other things, but after 25 minutes I gave up.

    I then rang the general BT helpline. This time I got someone after 15 minutes. I said I could see there was an offer which was £5 cheaper, and other loss-leading providers that were cheaper stil, so I'd decided to switch, what steps should I take?

    He said how about we make it £2 cheaper?

    I said no, that was still £3 more * 24 months. Let's just call it a day.

    He said in that case, how about £4 cheaper? Just £1/month more than the others, saves the hassle.

    I said OK. But I wanted to switch my mobile for similar reasons.

    He said ah, in that case we can reduce your landline by a further £2 so long as you don't switch the mobile.

    Thoughts:

    1. Shouldn't Ofcom look into a cancellation line that doesn't actually answer?
    2. Is it in the public interest that list prices are fictitious and the actual price is determined by how much you haggle, like a bazaar?

    BT are the worst. The broadband and line rental customers are nothing but a cash cow to fund their ridiculous TV ambitions and to buy up over priced second rate sports rights. I resent that I, and the rest of the country that uses any variation of ADSL, fund their stupid TV priorities while Britain sits in the broadband slow lane. I wish Ofcom had followed through last year and demerged Openreach from BT and forced them to float it as a separate company which looks after the broadband and phone network.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 8,760
    edited August 8
    TOPPING said:

    But aside from that aren't letterboxes red?

    They have to be, to avoid being mistaken for devout Muslim ladies.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 15,442
    TOPPING said:

    I've taken a week off for miscellanous idleness, so I decided I'd follow up a BT email saying they were going to increase my broadband fee (by a modest amount now and by 100% in a year), and if I wanted to prevent this I should give them a call to discuss it or cancel.

    ! rang the number for cancelling. It rang and rang. I got with other things, but after 25 minutes I gave up.

    I then rang the general BT helpline. This time I got someone after 15 minutes. I said I could see there was an offer which was £5 cheaper, and other loss-leading providers that were cheaper stil, so I'd decided to switch, what steps should I take?

    He said how about we make it £2 cheaper?

    I said no, that was still £3 more * 24 months. Let's just call it a day.

    He said in that case, how about £4 cheaper? Just £1/month more than the others, saves the hassle.

    I said OK. But I wanted to switch my mobile for similar reasons.

    He said ah, in that case we can reduce your landline by a further £2 so long as you don't switch the mobile.

    Thoughts:

    1. Shouldn't Ofcom look into a cancellation line that doesn't actually answer?
    2. Is it in the public interest that list prices are fictitious and the actual price is determined by how much you haggle, like a bazaar?

    Funnily enough it seemed to stop working (the haggling) with Three some time ago. Ring up to say you're cancelling? Fine, see ya they said

    That said recently they have taken to offering good deals or improvements without prompting. So maybe they're worrying about switching again.
    Three know that their offering is great for people who don't have signal issues. It's cheap and gives the best overseas roaming options for those who like to travel.

    I'm informed that I'll be getting a Vodafone (no surprise there) corporate line in a few months, might switch my personal line to Three if that's the case.
  • AnazinaAnazina Posts: 1,650
    Nick, David, Topping et al

    Yes, the system is utterly ridiculous and essentially relies on people never being bothered to ring up.

    As any good sports fan knows, all you do every so often is threatened to cancel Sky Sports and BT Sport and you end up getting it for vastly cheaper than the list price.

    I'm currently in a blissful period with Virgin Media (broadband and cable TV) where it is actually cheaper for me to have all the sports channels in HD than none at all. It is utterly bonkers, but they will do anything to retain longstanding customers who threaten to cancel a service, because they fear it will lead to their switching to another supplier. I guess their stats bear that out – once a customer cancels premium sports channels (say) he is at high-risk of leaving altogether.
  • AnazinaAnazina Posts: 1,650
    MaxPB said:

    I've taken a week off for miscellanous idleness, so I decided I'd follow up a BT email saying they were going to increase my broadband fee (by a modest amount now and by 100% in a year), and if I wanted to prevent this I should give them a call to discuss it or cancel.

    ! rang the number for cancelling. It rang and rang. I got with other things, but after 25 minutes I gave up.

    I then rang the general BT helpline. This time I got someone after 15 minutes. I said I could see there was an offer which was £5 cheaper, and other loss-leading providers that were cheaper stil, so I'd decided to switch, what steps should I take?

    He said how about we make it £2 cheaper?

    I said no, that was still £3 more * 24 months. Let's just call it a day.

    He said in that case, how about £4 cheaper? Just £1/month more than the others, saves the hassle.

    I said OK. But I wanted to switch my mobile for similar reasons.

    He said ah, in that case we can reduce your landline by a further £2 so long as you don't switch the mobile.

    Thoughts:

    1. Shouldn't Ofcom look into a cancellation line that doesn't actually answer?
    2. Is it in the public interest that list prices are fictitious and the actual price is determined by how much you haggle, like a bazaar?

    BT are the worst. The broadband and line rental customers are nothing but a cash cow to fund their ridiculous TV ambitions and to buy up over priced second rate sports rights. I resent that I, and the rest of the country that uses any variation of ADSL, fund their stupid TV priorities while Britain sits in the broadband slow lane. I wish Ofcom had followed through last year and demerged Openreach from BT and forced them to float it as a separate company which looks after the broadband and phone network.
    BT have had their wings clipped on the sports too recently, losing the rights to quite a lot of material because the new CEO couldn't stomach the cost.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 14,053
    MaxPB said:

    TOPPING said:

    I've taken a week off for miscellanous idleness, so I decided I'd follow up a BT email saying they were going to increase my broadband fee (by a modest amount now and by 100% in a year), and if I wanted to prevent this I should give them a call to discuss it or cancel.

    ! rang the number for cancelling. It rang and rang. I got with other things, but after 25 minutes I gave up.

    I then rang the general BT helpline. This time I got someone after 15 minutes. I said I could see there was an offer which was £5 cheaper, and other loss-leading providers that were cheaper stil, so I'd decided to switch, what steps should I take?

    He said how about we make it £2 cheaper?

    I said no, that was still £3 more * 24 months. Let's just call it a day.

    He said in that case, how about £4 cheaper? Just £1/month more than the others, saves the hassle.

    I said OK. But I wanted to switch my mobile for similar reasons.

    He said ah, in that case we can reduce your landline by a further £2 so long as you don't switch the mobile.

    Thoughts:

    1. Shouldn't Ofcom look into a cancellation line that doesn't actually answer?
    2. Is it in the public interest that list prices are fictitious and the actual price is determined by how much you haggle, like a bazaar?

    Funnily enough it seemed to stop working (the haggling) with Three some time ago. Ring up to say you're cancelling? Fine, see ya they said

    That said recently they have taken to offering good deals or improvements without prompting. So maybe they're worrying about switching again.
    Three know that their offering is great for people who don't have signal issues. It's cheap and gives the best overseas roaming options for those who like to travel.

    I'm informed that I'll be getting a Vodafone (no surprise there) corporate line in a few months, might switch my personal line to Three if that's the case.
    Yep when I looked around a while ago there wasn't a better offer on the street than Three's.

    I've been with them quite a long time now and they offer you better deals at the drop of a hat.

    In particular the other day I got one of those text stop to this number or we'll charge you £xx per month. I called Three and they were brilliant. Scrubbed the charge and talked me through what I had to do.
  • grabcocquegrabcocque Posts: 1,001
    Woman in Burqas tell us what they think Boris Johnson looks like.

    That's a programme I'd watch
  • NemtynakhtNemtynakht Posts: 738

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    Something can not be racist, but the person still be a twat for saying it.

    That said, this is the kind of polling that makes me wish they'd poll some placebo stories for calibration purposes, like PPP once did with a made-up deficit reduction plan.
    I’ve said over the last few days that if you attribute the words of Corbyn to Johnson Corbyn’s gang would oppose them - Boris is marmite.

  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 15,442
    TOPPING said:

    MaxPB said:

    TOPPING said:

    I've taken a week off for miscellanous idleness, so I decided I'd follow up a BT email saying they were going to increase my broadband fee (by a modest amount now and by 100% in a year), and if I wanted to prevent this I should give them a call to discuss it or cancel.

    ! rang the number for cancelling. It rang and rang. I got with other things, but after 25 minutes I gave up.

    I then rang the general BT helpline. This time I got someone after 15 minutes. I said I could see there was an offer which was £5 cheaper, and other loss-leading providers that were cheaper stil, so I'd decided to switch, what steps should I take?

    He said how about we make it £2 cheaper?

    I said no, that was still £3 more * 24 months. Let's just call it a day.

    He said in that case, how about £4 cheaper? Just £1/month more than the others, saves the hassle.

    I said OK. But I wanted to switch my mobile for similar reasons.

    He said ah, in that case we can reduce your landline by a further £2 so long as you don't switch the mobile.

    Thoughts:

    1. Shouldn't Ofcom look into a cancellation line that doesn't actually answer?
    2. Is it in the public interest that list prices are fictitious and the actual price is determined by how much you haggle, like a bazaar?

    Funnily enough it seemed to stop working (the haggling) with Three some time ago. Ring up to say you're cancelling? Fine, see ya they said

    That said recently they have taken to offering good deals or improvements without prompting. So maybe they're worrying about switching again.
    Three know that their offering is great for people who don't have signal issues. It's cheap and gives the best overseas roaming options for those who like to travel.

    I'm informed that I'll be getting a Vodafone (no surprise there) corporate line in a few months, might switch my personal line to Three if that's the case.
    Yep when I looked around a while ago there wasn't a better offer on the street than Three's.

    I've been with them quite a long time now and they offer you better deals at the drop of a hat.

    In particular the other day I got one of those text stop to this number or we'll charge you £xx per month. I called Three and they were brilliant. Scrubbed the charge and talked me through what I had to do.
    Vodafone are awful on the consumer side, on the business side I'm pretty sure I could get one of the reps to come and wipe my arse if I asked them to. It's such a huge difference, not surprising though given that Vodafone have pretty much given up the UK consumer market and concentrated on lucrative enterprise deals.

    I like the Wuntu app on Three, my sister and I had a buy one get one free burger through it for lunch a few weeks back. It seems randomly useful.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 33,261
    ydoethur said:

    RobD said:

    Mr. D, was PB absent?

    Perhaps Vanilla banned my IP address fearing a DoS attack :p
    It went AWOL for me as well.

    It may be have been connected to AV thread I'm uploading to the PB server.
    As we've told you before Mr Eagles, AV is dangerous, unnecessary and inimical to a civilised polity.

    I just didn't quite expect you to prove it by taking PB off air...
    AV is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be... unnatural.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 11,421
    MaxPB said:

    I've taken a week off for miscellanous idleness, so I decided I'd follow up a BT email saying they were going to increase my broadband fee (by a modest amount now and by 100% in a year), and if I wanted to prevent this I should give them a call to discuss it or cancel.

    ! rang the number for cancelling. It rang and rang. I got with other things, but after 25 minutes I gave up.

    I then rang the general BT helpline. This time I got someone after 15 minutes. I said I could see there was an offer which was £5 cheaper, and other loss-leading providers that were cheaper stil, so I'd decided to switch, what steps should I take?

    He said how about we make it £2 cheaper?

    I said no, that was still £3 more * 24 months. Let's just call it a day.

    He said in that case, how about £4 cheaper? Just £1/month more than the others, saves the hassle.

    I said OK. But I wanted to switch my mobile for similar reasons.

    He said ah, in that case we can reduce your landline by a further £2 so long as you don't switch the mobile.

    Thoughts:

    1. Shouldn't Ofcom look into a cancellation line that doesn't actually answer?
    2. Is it in the public interest that list prices are fictitious and the actual price is determined by how much you haggle, like a bazaar?

    BT are the worst. The broadband and line rental customers are nothing but a cash cow to fund their ridiculous TV ambitions and to buy up over priced second rate sports rights. I resent that I, and the rest of the country that uses any variation of ADSL, fund their stupid TV priorities while Britain sits in the broadband slow lane. I wish Ofcom had followed through last year and demerged Openreach from BT and forced them to float it as a separate company which looks after the broadband and phone network.
    Ofcom are totally toothless. Openreach should certainly not be under the control of BT and I can't believe anyone thinks it was a good idea to do so.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 11,421
    Incidentally even after I'd switched to Vodafone BT still left me without effective broadband or phone for two weeks due to damage at the junction box. They still screw things up even when you're not paying them.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 11,421
    RobD said:

    ydoethur said:

    RobD said:

    Mr. D, was PB absent?

    Perhaps Vanilla banned my IP address fearing a DoS attack :p
    It went AWOL for me as well.

    It may be have been connected to AV thread I'm uploading to the PB server.
    As we've told you before Mr Eagles, AV is dangerous, unnecessary and inimical to a civilised polity.

    I just didn't quite expect you to prove it by taking PB off air...
    AV is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be... unnatural.
    The ability to see competence in Nick Clegg?
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 7,730
    On topic, Sean Trende is always worth reading.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 21,222

    On topic, Sean Trende is always worth reading.

    Does anyone know if special elections in the US are akin to bye elections here where you can get much bigger swings than you might expect on a night where there is a much broader band of areas voting?

    This looks to me like a good result for the Dems but not necessarily a great one.
  • As a Leonard Cohen fan this has upset me so much.

  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 19,140

    As a Leonard Cohen fan this has upset me so much.

    well said that man, should be top of the charts
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 27,104
    RobD said:

    ydoethur said:

    RobD said:

    Mr. D, was PB absent?

    Perhaps Vanilla banned my IP address fearing a DoS attack :p
    It went AWOL for me as well.

    It may be have been connected to AV thread I'm uploading to the PB server.
    As we've told you before Mr Eagles, AV is dangerous, unnecessary and inimical to a civilised polity.

    I just didn't quite expect you to prove it by taking PB off air...
    AV is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be... unnatural.
    AV was rejected by the UK electorate 68% to 32% in 2011.

    Just sayin' :)
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 27,104
    RobD said:

    ydoethur said:

    RobD said:

    Mr. D, was PB absent?

    Perhaps Vanilla banned my IP address fearing a DoS attack :p
    It went AWOL for me as well.

    It may be have been connected to AV thread I'm uploading to the PB server.
    As we've told you before Mr Eagles, AV is dangerous, unnecessary and inimical to a civilised polity.

    I just didn't quite expect you to prove it by taking PB off air...
    AV is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be... unnatural.
    The Daft Side of the Force is a pathway to many policy platforms some consider to be unelectable :lol:
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 20,587
    That "letterbox" polling should be completely unsurprising to anyone paying attention. Boris Johnson was being entirely calculating and it seems to have worked nicely for him.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 27,104

    Woman in Burqas tell us what they think Boris Johnson looks like.

    That's a programme I'd watch

    Personally, I think grabcoque would look lovely in a burqa!

    Mwah!
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 27,104
    Charles said:

    Charles said:

    currystar said:

    AndyJS said:

    Sean_F said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sky News Breaking

    A poll by @SkyData suggests 45% of people think former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson should apologise for comments he made about women wearing the burka while 48% of people think he should not say sorry

    Sky News Breaking
    ‏A poll by @SkyData suggests 33% of people believe it is racist to describe women in burkas as letter boxes and bank robbers while 60% of people think it is not

    Makes you wonder about the 12% of people which think it's not racist, but Boris should apologise anyway......

    There are probably quite a few people who think that Boris' comments aren't racist but are rude.
    That's great polling for Boris to be honest. Consider the probable split for Conservative voters, then consider the likely split for Tory members. He'll be crushing it.
    I expect that Tory voters would split about 2:1 that Boris should not apologise and 3:1 in favour of banning the burka in public places.
    IMO we ought to be concentrating on applying the current law on things like forced marriage and FGM rather than wasting time on a burka ban. It clearly isn't as serious as those issues.
    I think it is pretty close, imagine having to spend your entire life when you go out having to wear sheets over your head with just a slit cut for your eyes. It is horrendously oppresive and I cant believe that the vast majority of burka wearers do so out of choice.
    I think it’s a bit more complicated than being “forced” to wear the burka. The cultural environment has been created where they feel guilty/immodest for going without. Gaslighting on an epic scale
    "Know ye that it is the will of Allah (SWT) that we are all born stark raving naked!"
    - Grand Ayatollah Nudistani
    You’ve posted that a dozen times in the last 48 hours. It wasn’t funny the first time.
    Bro! Bro! Do you accept it was Allah's will that you were born?
    What were you wearing when you were born?
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 20,587
    On topic, we've established that the Republicans can't do it on a wet Tuesday in Ohio. But can they do it for the big match?

    I'm inclined to agree with the markets but it's not automatic that Republicans who don't care about special elections will feel equally lethargic about the midterms.
This discussion has been closed.